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As the polls open in Gorton & Denton here’s the latest betting – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,970
edited 7:50AM in General
As the polls open in Gorton & Denton here’s the latest betting – politicalbetting.com

My bold prediction for today is that turnout will be reported as brisk.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 134,327
    It really is a three way by election, I don't think I can remember a by election before where any of 3 parties could win it.

    Turnout will be key and who had the best postal vote operation and Labour and the Greens will be battling to present themselves as the main alternative to Reform and Reform could still win if the left of centre vote is near split down the middle
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 35,280
    edited 7:59AM
    Ed Miliband was the latest senior minister on the ground. More attacks on Reform than the Greens, perhaps.


    ‘Matt Goodwin is the WORST of Britain!’ | Labour swoop on Gorton and Denton 24 hours before polling
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqJlADNs2B8
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,144
    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    No, that is the b risk.

    The a risk is that nobody can be arsed to vote for any of them.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907
    HYUFD said:

    It really is a three way by election, I don't think I can remember a by election before where any of 3 parties could win it.

    Turnout will be key and who had the best postal vote operation and Labour and the Greens will be battling to present themselves as the main alternative to Reform and Reform could still win if the left of centre vote is near split down the middle

    Mid befordshire was the last closish one 3 way
  • RogerRoger Posts: 22,251

    Ed Miliband was the latest senior minister on the ground. More attacks on Reform than the Greens, perhaps.


    ‘Matt Goodwin is the WORST of Britain!’ | Labour swoop on Gorton and Denton 24 hours before polling
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqJlADNs2B8

    A much more sensible tactic that criticising the Green's drug policies. If you are fighting for the 'heart of Britain' best to concentrate on the big picture
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 35,280
    Many of Victoria Starmer’s Polish family were killed by the Nazis. Their fate has shaped her life
    By taking her children to her grandparents’ village at the weekend, the PM’s wife is keeping the memory of her Jewish ancestors alive
    ...
    Lady Starmer’s father, Bernard Alexander, was born in Britain in 1929 to Jewish parents who are both believed to have migrated to England from Budzisław Stary in the 1920s. The rest of the family stayed behind in Koło, a small town two hours to the west of Warsaw by road. It is understood that none survived the Holocaust.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/02/25/victoria-starmers-polish-family-were-killed-by-the-nazis/ (£££)
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,297
    Green win by a fairly clear margin, Reform in third is my hunch, based on little more than Foxy's patent guessing stick.
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 7,605

    HYUFD said:

    It really is a three way by election, I don't think I can remember a by election before where any of 3 parties could win it.

    Turnout will be key and who had the best postal vote operation and Labour and the Greens will be battling to present themselves as the main alternative to Reform and Reform could still win if the left of centre vote is near split down the middle

    Mid befordshire was the last closish one 3 way
    Didn’t they hold that erection in Switzerland?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,520
    edited 8:13AM
    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    How come when I bagsy a first people relentlessly post about insider posting but when Robert does it, it's tumbleweeds?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,125

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    That’s because tanks are now almost extinct as a species, and IFVs have been totally replaced with mopeds and golf buggies!
  • FishingFishing Posts: 6,089
    Excellent commentary from Sir John C, pretty much the only psephological commentator who's always worth listening to:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSVhnk2Az9M
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,520
    Sandpit said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    That’s because tanks are now almost extinct as a species, and IFVs have been totally replaced with mopeds and golf buggies!
    Don't forget the donkeys.




    https://united24media.com/latest-news/ukraine-unleashes-robotic-donkey-while-russia-sends-real-ones-to-the-front-8120
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,297

    Many of Victoria Starmer’s Polish family were killed by the Nazis. Their fate has shaped her life
    By taking her children to her grandparents’ village at the weekend, the PM’s wife is keeping the memory of her Jewish ancestors alive
    ...
    Lady Starmer’s father, Bernard Alexander, was born in Britain in 1929 to Jewish parents who are both believed to have migrated to England from Budzisław Stary in the 1920s. The rest of the family stayed behind in Koło, a small town two hours to the west of Warsaw by road. It is understood that none survived the Holocaust.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/02/25/victoria-starmers-polish-family-were-killed-by-the-nazis/ (£££)

    Just as well that her grandparents weren't subject to "remigration" as desired by many on the right.

    When I toured eastern europe a decade ago there was a ghostly absence of that complex and varied centuries old Jewish culture of Poland, Hungary and Czechia.

    I read this book on my travels, a book on a culture about to go extinct.

    https://amzn.eu/d/06oDdPzt
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 24,545
    A Green win would be the worst result for Labour.

    Fighting a war on two fronts makes things much more difficult.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,437

    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    How come when I bagsy a first people relentlessly post about insider posting but when Robert does it, it's tumbleweeds?
    He's not a lawyer.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 55,297

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    The grinding down of Ukraine is also pretty grim.

    I am surprised that Ukraine has weatherd the 4th year of the war as well as it has despite the loss of most US support.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,437
    HYUFD said:

    It really is a three way by election, I don't think I can remember a by election before where any of 3 parties could win it.

    Turnout will be key and who had the best postal vote operation and Labour and the Greens will be battling to present themselves as the main alternative to Reform and Reform could still win if the left of centre vote is near split down the middle

    Yes, it's genuinely a three horse race, Hyufd, which is very rare. If I were a voter there I might be tempted to ignore all the chatter about tactical voting and simply vote for the mob I liked most.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,125

    Sandpit said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    That’s because tanks are now almost extinct as a species, and IFVs have been totally replaced with mopeds and golf buggies!
    Don't forget the donkeys.

    https://united24media.com/latest-news/ukraine-unleashes-robotic-donkey-while-russia-sends-real-ones-to-the-front-8120
    Oh yes, plenty of animals too. Donkeys, dogs, horses, and even a couple of camels have been spotted working for the Russians.

    Quite where they found the camels I have no idea, Mariupol zoo?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 134,327
    Foxy said:

    Green win by a fairly clear margin, Reform in third is my hunch, based on little more than Foxy's patent guessing stick.

    Assuming Reform win white working class Denton hard to see them come third, even if Labour or the Greens win by winning Gorton
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 134,327

    HYUFD said:

    It really is a three way by election, I don't think I can remember a by election before where any of 3 parties could win it.

    Turnout will be key and who had the best postal vote operation and Labour and the Greens will be battling to present themselves as the main alternative to Reform and Reform could still win if the left of centre vote is near split down the middle

    Mid befordshire was the last closish one 3 way
    Though even Mid Bedfordshire saw the winning Labour candidate a clear 11% ahead of the 3rd placed LDs and 3% ahead of the second placed Tories. I expect a much closer result tonight
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Mid_Bedfordshire_by-election
  • RogerRoger Posts: 22,251
    HYUFD said:

    It really is a three way by election, I don't think I can remember a by election before where any of 3 parties could win it.

    Turnout will be key and who had the best postal vote operation and Labour and the Greens will be battling to present themselves as the main alternative to Reform and Reform could still win if the left of centre vote is near split down the middle

    I sense a bad smell is starting to attach to Farage. A significant loss for him would be the best result for everyone. I can see advantages in a victory for both Green and Labour. Perhaps Green in that it may give Starmer a little more courage
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 12,706

    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    How come when I bagsy a first people relentlessly post about insider posting but when Robert does it, it's tumbleweeds?
    Reputation
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,272

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    Covert Cabal was reporting that apart from those in active service, T-80s are done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZY3A2Lb6EM
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,125
    MattW said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    Covert Cabal was reporting that apart from those in active service, T-80s are done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZY3A2Lb6EM
    Yep, and it’s not just the T-80s either.

    They can make a couple of dozen new T-90s per month, pretty much all of the older stuff (T-72, T-64 etc) is basically scrap metal now. Everything that can be refurbished has been.

    The Ukranians say they’ve hit 11,000 tanks during the war. Now some of those might have been repaired and hit again, but that’s around half the world’s extant tanks destroyed in the last four years!
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,276

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    There is a Lab leaflet saying an independent tactical voting organisation backs a vote for Lab to stop Reform apparently.
    All 3 independendent Tacticsl vote organisations say vote Green to stop Reform.

    Lying scumbags
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 21,494

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    There is a Lab leaflet saying an independent tactical voting organisation backs a vote for Lab to stop Reform apparently.
    All 3 independendent Tacticsl vote organisations say vote Green to stop Reform.

    Lying scumbags
    “Independent tactical voting organisations” sound like utter woke nonsense
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,520
    I remember the last time I was in Paris,  I tried to climb this really tall tower...

    But Eiffel off!

    I did Rue the day.
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 2,373
    In football news, David Dein trashing his reputation by praising Gianni Infantino on Today
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 22,064

    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    How come when I bagsy a first people relentlessly post about insider posting but when Robert does it, it's tumbleweeds?
    Freqquency
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,272

    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    How come when I bagsy a first people relentlessly post about insider posting but when Robert does it, it's tumbleweeds?
    Miaow.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 21,494
    The Ford is out of port and heading East…
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 57,722
    edited 8:36AM
    Sandpit said:

    MattW said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    Covert Cabal was reporting that apart from those in active service, T-80s are done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZY3A2Lb6EM
    Yep, and it’s not just the T-80s either.

    They can make a couple of dozen new T-90s per month, pretty much all of the older stuff (T-72, T-64 etc) is basically scrap metal now. Everything that can be refurbished has been.

    The Ukranians say they’ve hit 11,000 tanks during the war. Now some of those might have been repaired and hit again, but that’s around half the world’s extant tanks destroyed in the last four years!
    The day of the tank, from 1917 to 2011 or so (end Gulf war 2), is over unless those that you are seeking to destroy, such as the people of Gaza,, who are basically unarmed, is over. Lighter, more agile vehicles such as the Bradleys still have some sort of a chance but a conventional tank is simply an option to be burned alive.

    No doubt the MoD will come to the same conclusion in 50 years or so.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 7,031

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    The anti vote can be just as strong as the pro vote . The problem is as a voter there which party to vote for against Reform.

    There’s clearly a bigger pool of left leaning voters in the constituency who didn’t vote at the GE .The low turnout in 2024 a symptom of Labours huge lead in the opinion polls and they didn’t have the fear of Reform winning then .

    I think a higher turnout would finish off Reforms chances .
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,272

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    I've withdrawn from this market.

    I'm sure someone, perhaps not Mr "I Just Put Another Ton on the Greens" though it may be a good call - what do I know, will make hundreds. But I lost £2 and I'm happy to have capped it.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 21,494
    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    MattW said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    Covert Cabal was reporting that apart from those in active service, T-80s are done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZY3A2Lb6EM
    Yep, and it’s not just the T-80s either.

    They can make a couple of dozen new T-90s per month, pretty much all of the older stuff (T-72, T-64 etc) is basically scrap metal now. Everything that can be refurbished has been.

    The Ukranians say they’ve hit 11,000 tanks during the war. Now some of those might have been repaired and hit again, but that’s around half the world’s extant tanks destroyed in the last four years!
    The day of the tank, from 1917 to 2011 or so (end Gulf war 2), is over unless those that you are seeking to destroy, such as the people of Gaza,, who are basically unarmed, is over. Lighter, more agile vehicles such as the Bradleys still have some sort of a chance but a conventional tank is simply an option to be burned alive.

    No doubt the MoD will come to the same conclusion in 50 years or so.
    People like to shit on the MoD but we have DragonFire and a very close relationship it seems with the AFU so do not seem naive to the realities of drone warfare
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 7,952
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    That’s because tanks are now almost extinct as a species, and IFVs have been totally replaced with mopeds and golf buggies!
    Don't forget the donkeys.

    https://united24media.com/latest-news/ukraine-unleashes-robotic-donkey-while-russia-sends-real-ones-to-the-front-8120
    Oh yes, plenty of animals too. Donkeys, dogs, horses, and even a couple of camels have been spotted working for the Russians.

    Quite where they found the camels I have no idea, Mariupol zoo?
    Bactrian camels are native to Russia
  • wembleytorwembleytor Posts: 29
    A friend messaged me last night with a shocking by-election revelation. He'd just passed a house with a Lib Dem board outside.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907

    A friend messaged me last night with a shocking by-election revelation. He'd just passed a house with a Lib Dem board outside.

    During the 2019 euro elections i passed a Change UK poster board in Norwich
    Rarest of beasts
  • RogerRoger Posts: 22,251
    edited 8:45AM

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    The answer is in the email. If keeping Reform out isn't a positive enough reason to vote Labour then I can't think of anything that could be. What are you looking for? It sounds like one of those "How Green were the Nazis"
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 7,952
    DavidL said:

    You know I am quite glad I don't live in Gorton & Denton and not just for the obvious reasons. What on earth would you do?

    Greens, total nutters, economically illiterate, bossy, nannying, patronising.

    Labour, making a right mess of the country, incompetent, unable to see the consequences of their policies, all over the place.

    Reform, bunch of quasi fascists, bigoted, racist, just vile.

    Everyone else: absolutely nowhere.

    I think I would be edging towards Labour. No matter how bad they are the alternatives are even worse.

    In the past, you coukd have a free hit at the Government assuming that the party you vote for won't actually have a chance in being involved in Government after the next General Election.

    Now, if you vote Green or Reform you are possibly contributing to the momentum that could lead to them at least being part of the Government after the election. The LibDems are nowhere.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 57,722

    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    MattW said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    Covert Cabal was reporting that apart from those in active service, T-80s are done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZY3A2Lb6EM
    Yep, and it’s not just the T-80s either.

    They can make a couple of dozen new T-90s per month, pretty much all of the older stuff (T-72, T-64 etc) is basically scrap metal now. Everything that can be refurbished has been.

    The Ukranians say they’ve hit 11,000 tanks during the war. Now some of those might have been repaired and hit again, but that’s around half the world’s extant tanks destroyed in the last four years!
    The day of the tank, from 1917 to 2011 or so (end Gulf war 2), is over unless those that you are seeking to destroy, such as the people of Gaza,, who are basically unarmed, is over. Lighter, more agile vehicles such as the Bradleys still have some sort of a chance but a conventional tank is simply an option to be burned alive.

    No doubt the MoD will come to the same conclusion in 50 years or so.
    People like to shit on the MoD but we have DragonFire and a very close relationship it seems with the AFU so do not seem naive to the realities of drone warfare
    Still spending a lot of money on Challenger 3. I agree that the links with the AFU are hopeful. It's a bit scary how rapidly things are changing.
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 4,834
    I hope that's right and there's a high turnout.

    Good morning, everybody.
  • TazTaz Posts: 25,410

    I remember the last time I was in Paris,  I tried to climb this really tall tower...

    But Eiffel off!

    I did Rue the day.

    You are Franz Reichelt and I claim my cinq euro.
  • TazTaz Posts: 25,410
    MattW said:

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    I've withdrawn from this market.

    I'm sure someone, perhaps not Mr "I Just Put Another Ton on the Greens" though it may be a good call - what do I know, will make hundreds. But I lost £2 and I'm happy to have capped it.
    I’m up if the greens win

    Evens if Labour win

    Down if Reform win
  • TazTaz Posts: 25,410
    Roger said:

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    The answer is in the email. If keeping Reform out isn't a positive enough reason to vote Labour then I can't think of anything that could be. What are you looking for? It sounds like one of those "How Green were the Nazis"
    The one positive of a Reform win for me is it winds up sooo many here.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 6,089
    edited 8:54AM

    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    How come when I bagsy a first people relentlessly post about insider posting but when Robert does it, it's tumbleweeds?
    People know all lawyers are dodgy so make the obvious assumption.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,144
    One one level, a Labour win would be encouraging that both Reform and the Greens can be seen through by the voters.

    Not sure it is going to happen though.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 66,701
    They say there’s nothing left to be discovered, no more of the world to be explored, no sense of wonder left to the young

    Well for just proven that’s total nonsense. After centuries of dispute, when even the brightest scientists have decided the question must be unanswerable, I have just definitively shown that No, you cannot ride an e-bike into the Pacific Ocean
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,573

    A Green win would be the worst result for Labour.

    Fighting a war on two fronts makes things much more difficult.

    The second-worst result for Labour is a Reform win with the Greens second.

    Labour absolutely have to finish above the Greens. That's way more important to Labour than whether Reborn elect another MP.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 21,494

    A Green win would be the worst result for Labour.

    Fighting a war on two fronts makes things much more difficult.

    The second-worst result for Labour is a Reform win with the Greens second.

    Labour absolutely have to finish above the Greens. That's way more important to Labour than whether Reborn elect another MP.
    I think they’ll be disappointed
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 35,280
    Roger said:

    I've received an email from Labour this morning saying:

    "it’s going right down to the wire between Labour and Reform"

    Also:

    "we’ve built a team of over 1,000 volunteers, delivered nearly half a million leaflets, and spoken to 30,000 voters"

    As I noted on the last thread, all that's missing is a positive reason to vote Labour.

    The answer is in the email. If keeping Reform out isn't a positive enough reason to vote Labour then I can't think of anything that could be. What are you looking for? It sounds like one of those "How Green were the Nazis"
    Note there is nothing about the Greens who are odds-on favourites to take the seat. So either Labour is telling us the betting is all wrong and we should back Reform and Labour based on internal polling and canvass returns, or this is the last knockings of Morgan McSweeney's obsession with Farage.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,001
    Leon said:

    They say there’s nothing left to be discovered, no more of the world to be explored, no sense of wonder left to the young

    Well for just proven that’s total nonsense. After centuries of dispute, when even the brightest scientists have decided the question must be unanswerable, I have just definitively shown that No, you cannot ride an e-bike into the Pacific Ocean

    Electrifying!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,001

    A Green win would be the worst result for Labour.

    Fighting a war on two fronts makes things much more difficult.

    The second-worst result for Labour is a Reform win with the Greens second.

    Labour absolutely have to finish above the Greens. That's way more important to Labour than whether Reborn elect another MP.
    I think they’ll be disappointed
    I think it'll be Green, Labour, Reform. Famous last words!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,001
    Apologies if I missed it, but did we discuss the Daily Mail accusation that the Greens plan a so-called "Migrant Amnesty", with free accommodation and allowance?
  • RogerRoger Posts: 22,251

    I remember the last time I was in Paris,  I tried to climb this really tall tower...

    But Eiffel off!

    I did Rue the day.

    Doc, I can't stop singing "the green, green, grass of home.

    That sounds like Tom Jones syndrome.

    Is it common?

    It's not unusual!
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,573
    DavidL said:

    Sandpit said:

    MattW said:

    Another 1360 Russian troops not reporting for duty today. But only 4 tanks and no infantry fighting vehicles. (That may just be that Ukraine can't find the last one that still exits.)

    How is that strategy of grinding down Ukraine until it can no longer defend itself, Russia?

    Covert Cabal was reporting that apart from those in active service, T-80s are done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZY3A2Lb6EM
    Yep, and it’s not just the T-80s either.

    They can make a couple of dozen new T-90s per month, pretty much all of the older stuff (T-72, T-64 etc) is basically scrap metal now. Everything that can be refurbished has been.

    The Ukranians say they’ve hit 11,000 tanks during the war. Now some of those might have been repaired and hit again, but that’s around half the world’s extant tanks destroyed in the last four years!
    The day of the tank, from 1917 to 2011 or so (end Gulf war 2), is over unless those that you are seeking to destroy, such as the people of Gaza,, who are basically unarmed, is over. Lighter, more agile vehicles such as the Bradleys still have some sort of a chance but a conventional tank is simply an option to be burned alive.

    No doubt the MoD will come to the same conclusion in 50 years or so.
    I don't think this is right.

    The battlefield is definitely more hostile with the addition of ubiquitous drones, but in order to advance you still need to provide your soldiers with a combination of manoeuvrability, protection and firepower and that's the tank.

    People concentrate on drones in this war, but almost as consequential is that neither side has achieved air superiority. My uninformed guess is that tanks become a lot more useful when supported with airpower, and when the battlefield is more mobile.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,144

    A friend messaged me last night with a shocking by-election revelation. He'd just passed a house with a Lib Dem board outside.

    During the 2019 euro elections i passed a Change UK poster board in Norwich
    Rarest of beasts
    There was a Change UK poster near here on a barn. For years.
  • MustaphaMondeoMustaphaMondeo Posts: 499

    HYUFD said:

    It really is a three way by election, I don't think I can remember a by election before where any of 3 parties could win it.

    Turnout will be key and who had the best postal vote operation and Labour and the Greens will be battling to present themselves as the main alternative to Reform and Reform could still win if the left of centre vote is near split down the middle

    Yes, it's genuinely a three horse race, Hyufd, which is very rare. If I were a voter there I might be tempted to ignore all the chatter about tactical voting and simply vote for the mob I liked most.
    I’ve voted tactically and it’s unsatisfying.

    When first past the post gives us a totally idiotic result that will be our choice. And I will glory in the the fate of politicians that over the years supported FPTP wailing and tearing their ties off in horror.

    Bring it on.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,437

    A friend messaged me last night with a shocking by-election revelation. He'd just passed a house with a Lib Dem board outside.

    During the 2019 euro elections i passed a Change UK poster board in Norwich
    Rarest of beasts
    There was a Change UK poster near here on a barn. For years.
    It's nice to hear of such successes with protected species.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907
    edited 9:15AM

    A friend messaged me last night with a shocking by-election revelation. He'd just passed a house with a Lib Dem board outside.

    During the 2019 euro elections i passed a Change UK poster board in Norwich
    Rarest of beasts
    There was a Change UK poster near here on a barn. For years.
    Soubry-Gapes Barn.

    Good job it wasnt on a Rosie Barnes to add to the confusion
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,437

    Apologies if I missed it, but did we discuss the Daily Mail accusation that the Greens plan a so-called "Migrant Amnesty", with free accommodation and allowance?

    Tell us more. I may apply.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,272
    edited 9:16AM

    Apologies if I missed it, but did we discuss the Daily Mail accusation that the Greens plan a so-called "Migrant Amnesty", with free accommodation and allowance?

    GBN was having kittens about it when I was listening in the car yesterday evening.

    They had a chap from one of their "independent" "thinktanks" ("Centre for Migration control", founded by a Reform UK activist), and did some out-of-the-arse calculations about the cost (eg Greens would give 800k people a Basic Income of 19k per annum) plus £4 billiojn of NHS costs abracadabra costing £120bn per annum.

    They had a Green person on who pointed out that it was BS.

    I'm not sure what the appropriate conclusion should be.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,698
    DavidL said:

    You know I am quite glad I don't live in Gorton & Denton and not just for the obvious reasons. What on earth would you do?

    Greens, total nutters, economically illiterate, bossy, nannying, patronising.

    Labour, making a right mess of the country, incompetent, unable to see the consequences of their policies, all over the place.

    Reform, bunch of quasi fascists, bigoted, racist, just vile.

    Everyone else: absolutely nowhere.

    I think I would be edging towards Labour. No matter how bad they are the alternatives are even worse.

    Yes. It needs a flow diagram I suppose. The strange answer seems to be Labour:

    1) Do you want to vote for Scottish, Welsh or British nationalism? No
    2) Do you want to vote for centrism? Yes
    3) Do you think the Tories might sustain a Reform government? Yes, they might.

    Answer: In most seats, Labour. In about 100 seats, LD.

    If you added a fourth question:

    4) Will you only vote for a party reasonably good at politics and communication, set policies out clearly and are capable of running everything the state runs very well while making incremental improvements

    Then you stay at home.

  • isamisam Posts: 43,710
    A bit odd for a Labour MP to be doubling down on the ‘Tactical Choice’ leaflet

    Politics is about compromise, tactical voting doesn't always favour the party you're fanboying for, but its the right thing to do - vote Labour and keep Reform out, I'm glad Tactical Choice agree 👍🏻

    https://x.com/oliverryanuk/status/2026782518565912849?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 70,011
    Good morning

    On Gorton and Denton the best result for the country would be a labour hold

    I see little difference between Reform and the Greens in their divisive and dangerous policies

    If I had a vote I would vote conservative
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,272
    MattW said:

    Apologies if I missed it, but did we discuss the Daily Mail accusation that the Greens plan a so-called "Migrant Amnesty", with free accommodation and allowance?

    GBN was having kittens about it when I was listening in the car yesterday evening.

    They had a chap from one of their "independent" "thinktanks" ("Centre for Migration control", founded by a Reform UK activist), and did some out-of-the-arse calculations about the cost (eg Greens would give 800k people a Basic Income of 19k per annum) plus £4 billiojn of NHS costs abracadabra costing £120bn per annum.

    They had a Green person on who pointed out that it was BS.

    I'm not sure what the appropriate conclusion should be.
    Typo - £20bn not £120bn.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 86,655

    rcs1000 said:

    I hear turnout is brisk.

    How come when I bagsy a first people relentlessly post about insider posting but when Robert does it, it's tumbleweeds?
    Clearly Robert is feared ?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 46,731

    Good morning

    On Gorton and Denton the best result for the country would be a labour hold

    I see little difference between Reform and the Greens in their divisive and dangerous policies

    If I had a vote I would vote conservative

    Sod the tactical voting then.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,520
    Sky News are reporting that the Govt will not give any extra time to the Assisted Dying Bill so it is almost certain to not become law.
  • Sweeney74Sweeney74 Posts: 139

    Sky News are reporting that the Govt will not give any extra time to the Assisted Dying Bill so it is almost certain to not become law.

    fingers crossed
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 70,011

    Good morning

    On Gorton and Denton the best result for the country would be a labour hold

    I see little difference between Reform and the Greens in their divisive and dangerous policies

    If I had a vote I would vote conservative

    Sod the tactical voting then.
    Yes
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,520

    Sky News are reporting that the Govt will not give any extra time to the Assisted Dying Bill so it is almost certain to not become law.

    The government will not be giving the landmark assisted dying legislation more time in the House of Lords, which means it almost certainly will fall, Sky News's deputy political correspondent Sam Coates understands

    https://news.sky.com/story/politics-latest-mandelson-starmer-labour-farage-badenoch-12593360
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907

    Sky News are reporting that the Govt will not give any extra time to the Assisted Dying Bill so it is almost certain to not become law.

    Excellent news.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 86,655
    Leon said:

    They say there’s nothing left to be discovered, no more of the world to be explored, no sense of wonder left to the young

    Well for just proven that’s total nonsense. After centuries of dispute, when even the brightest scientists have decided the question must be unanswerable, I have just definitively shown that No, you cannot ride an e-bike into the Pacific Ocean

    Why not ?
    It sounds pretty easy to me, if slightly inadvisable.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 27,769
    Fishing said:

    Excellent commentary from Sir John C, pretty much the only psephological commentator who's always worth listening to:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSVhnk2Az9M

    Other good people include the folks at YouGov (Patrick English, Anthony Wells), Deltapoll, the British Election Study, Will Jennings.
  • Sweeney74Sweeney74 Posts: 139
    Any thoughts on turnout today?
    I suspect it will be towards the historically low end of the scale.

    A pox on ALL your houses
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 86,655

    Leon said:

    They say there’s nothing left to be discovered, no more of the world to be explored, no sense of wonder left to the young

    Well for just proven that’s total nonsense. After centuries of dispute, when even the brightest scientists have decided the question must be unanswerable, I have just definitively shown that No, you cannot ride an e-bike into the Pacific Ocean

    Electrifying!
    Guaranteed to terrify the sharks.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,698
    Cyclefree said:

    Foxy said:

    Many of Victoria Starmer’s Polish family were killed by the Nazis. Their fate has shaped her life
    By taking her children to her grandparents’ village at the weekend, the PM’s wife is keeping the memory of her Jewish ancestors alive
    ...
    Lady Starmer’s father, Bernard Alexander, was born in Britain in 1929 to Jewish parents who are both believed to have migrated to England from Budzisław Stary in the 1920s. The rest of the family stayed behind in Koło, a small town two hours to the west of Warsaw by road. It is understood that none survived the Holocaust.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/02/25/victoria-starmers-polish-family-were-killed-by-the-nazis/ (£££)

    Just as well that her grandparents weren't subject to "remigration" as desired by many on the right.

    When I toured eastern europe a decade ago there was a ghostly absence of that complex and varied centuries old Jewish culture of Poland, Hungary and Czechia.

    I read this book on my travels, a book on a culture about to go extinct.

    https://amzn.eu/d/06oDdPzt
    A great pity that not more attention is paid, including on here, to how the Jewish community feels, about whether it feels it has a future in Britain. The threat to it does not come solely from Reform or the right.

    See, for instance, the sentencing remarks of Mr Justice Wall to the three men convicted last December of a plot to slaughter Jews in Manchester - https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2026/02/Sentencing-Remarks-Saadaoui-and-others-final.pdf. The details of the plot are horrific. Those men did not come out of nowhere. There has been a steady increase in attacks on Jews in this country in recent years and too little has been done to counter this or to criticise those doing it and far too much has been done to justify it or explain it away or to blame Jews for the attacks on them.

    If you were interested in the Wasserstein book you should also read "Uprooted" by Lyn Julius - about 3000 years of Jewish history and civilisation in the Middle East and how it too vanished as a result of the wrongdoing of others. When ignorant tossers shout "Go back to where you came from" to Jews, the Middle East is where they come from and where they have every right to be. "Last Days in Babylon" by Marina Benjamin is also worth reading.

    I think it was you who recommended "Crooked Cross" by Sally Carson, which I read and enjoyed (if "enjoy" is the right word). There was a reading of it on BBC Sounds, though the episodes are no longer available, infuriatingly. It is on Audible though.
    I was brought up in a Jewish part of London, and am massively pro the Jewish community. I live in the actual world and pay attention. I don't really recognise the bit I have put in bold as being how any element of mainstream society, politics or media acts or thinks. Maybe I need to get out more?

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 37,596

    One one level, a Labour win would be encouraging that both Reform and the Greens can be seen through by the voters.

    Not sure it is going to happen though.

    On the other hand if the Greens win, the BBC might become Polanski rather than Farage obsessed.

    I think there is a fair to middling chance that the Green Communists and the Red Tories cancel each other out and Goodwin takes the glittering prize.

    Although with Tiny Tom as the new Whitehouse favourite fascist this might be Reform's last hurrah.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907
    edited 9:28AM
    Sweeney74 said:

    Any thoughts on turnout today?
    I suspect it will be towards the historically low end of the scale.

    A pox on ALL your houses

    Low turnout, Reform well back or in third place would make for some furious reconsideration of the 2029 result likelihood
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,629

    A Green win would be the worst result for Labour.

    Fighting a war on two fronts makes things much more difficult.

    The second-worst result for Labour is a Reform win with the Greens second.

    Labour absolutely have to finish above the Greens. That's way more important to Labour than whether Reborn elect another MP.
    I think I heard one of the talking heads on Sky say that losing to the Greens would be better than losing to Reform, but I agree with Sandy that the last thing Labour needs is the Greens finishing above them.

    The only thing I would say is that the Greens winning would give them a big boost in terms of publicity. Reform can always say that the seat was challenging and that realistically their only hope was a split Labour-Green vote.
  • So basically Sir Keir has dumped the entirety of the last year of government.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907

    So basically Sir Keir has dumped the entirety of the last year of government.

    Proper reset. Turn it off and turn something else on again
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 15,437
    viewcode said:

    Fishing said:

    Excellent commentary from Sir John C, pretty much the only psephological commentator who's always worth listening to:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSVhnk2Az9M

    Other good people include the folks at YouGov (Patrick English, Anthony Wells), Deltapoll, the British Election Study, Will Jennings.
    Wells used to be a regular poster here but haven't noticed him here for ages. Unless he uses a pseudonym?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 37,596

    Sky News are reporting that the Govt will not give any extra time to the Assisted Dying Bill so it is almost certain to not become law.

    Excellent news.
    Nor really.
  • Sweeney74Sweeney74 Posts: 139

    Sweeney74 said:

    Any thoughts on turnout today?
    I suspect it will be towards the historically low end of the scale.

    A pox on ALL your houses

    Low turnout, Reform well bavk or in third place would make for some furious reconsideration of the 2029 result likelihood
    I suspect this is a likely result.
    Much wailing and gnashing of teeth.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,272
    edited 9:30AM
    Idiosyncratic Canadians.

    My online friend Tod Maffin (Canadian influencer, who was a national radio personality for 2-3 decades) is repeating his "Americans, come and visit Nanaimo (on Vancouver Island)" again this April. Last year 500 came.

    And it seems they have recruited 40 Healthcare Workers from the USA over the last year to come to his city.

    Short news report: "The Nanaimo Infusion - We're Doing It Again!"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8no3Bscpno

    He's now writing and producing an online series not unlike Lake Wobegone Days, called "Mirror Falls".
    https://www.mirrorfalls.com/
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907
    Sweeney74 said:

    Sweeney74 said:

    Any thoughts on turnout today?
    I suspect it will be towards the historically low end of the scale.

    A pox on ALL your houses

    Low turnout, Reform well bavk or in third place would make for some furious reconsideration of the 2029 result likelihood
    I suspect this is a likely result.
    Much wailing and gnashing of teeth.
    Hence Nigel doing the minimum campaigning at the eleventh hour.
    Whats the opposite of he's running?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,907

    Sky News are reporting that the Govt will not give any extra time to the Assisted Dying Bill so it is almost certain to not become law.

    Excellent news.
    Nor really.
    It is for those of us strongly opposed to the bill
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,001
    MattW said:

    Apologies if I missed it, but did we discuss the Daily Mail accusation that the Greens plan a so-called "Migrant Amnesty", with free accommodation and allowance?

    GBN was having kittens about it when I was listening in the car yesterday evening.

    They had a chap from one of their "independent" "thinktanks" ("Centre for Migration control", founded by a Reform UK activist), and did some out-of-the-arse calculations about the cost (eg Greens would give 800k people a Basic Income of 19k per annum) plus £4 billiojn of NHS costs abracadabra costing £120bn per annum.

    They had a Green person on who pointed out that it was BS.

    I'm not sure what the appropriate conclusion should be.
    As you know, I only watch GB News for, shall we say, "research" purposes, but they quoted a Green spokesperson who defended them and said it was a "popular policy"!
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 37,596

    So basically Sir Keir has dumped the entirety of the last year of government.

    It is almost two wasted years. I can't put into words the disappointment.

    Rachel Reeves and Starmer are both hubristic and very poor at politics.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,144

    Sky News are reporting that the Govt will not give any extra time to the Assisted Dying Bill so it is almost certain to not become law.

    So, rich people can avoid pain by going to Switzerland.

    The rest of you? Suck it up.
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