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Wales – How to do Cynical Politics. – politicalbetting.com

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  • CookieCookie Posts: 12,830
    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I have just received a business email from a lawyer than has the signature:

    "Many blessings,
    [x]"

    Which is certainly unusual. What am I supposed to deduce from this?

    He's epically screwed up and is anxious to ingratiate himself?
    Is the fella in question *qualified* to dole out blessings?
  • ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    They didn't include the Fire Brigade.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,461
    Cookie said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I have just received a business email from a lawyer than has the signature:

    "Many blessings,
    [x]"

    Which is certainly unusual. What am I supposed to deduce from this?

    He's epically screwed up and is anxious to ingratiate himself?
    Is the fella in question *qualified* to dole out blessings?
    He'll be cross if he isn't and crossing if he is.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 12,830

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Friends_(1973_TV_series)
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    I'm still completely astonished at those red wall MP's who turned on Boris.

    Proper Darwin Award material.

    Perhaps they thought that principled behaviour involved considerations other than self-interest?

    Helpful hint, use of the expression "Darwin Award" is a pretty clear admission of not understanding very much about Darwin. There's a pretty strong argument that one's genes are likely to survive for longer in a society which tends to kick out utter shits like bojo.
  • rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    These critiques aboiut Musk..

    I don't remember half of this venom being directed at Mark Zuckerberg and Jack Dorsey, back when they were censoring the fuck out of the Leab Leak hypothesis, at the behest of the Biden Admin. Which is far far worse and more important than anything Musk has allegedly done

    The PB left are pitifiul hypocrites, with weakened brains

    I don't remember Dorsey or Zuckerberg pretending to be champions of free speech while suing people who exercised that right?
    lol! You don't think Facebook and Twitter sold themselves as "the good guys"???

    Get a grip
    With all due respect, my issue is simply this:

    Musk pretends that he gives a shit about free speech. Zuckerberg and Dorsey might or might not give a shit about free speech. But they certainly don't go out and pretend that they are - what were Musk's words - "a free speech absolutist".

    Musk then demonstrates he is only really in favor of free speech he agrees with when he starts trying to sue critics into oblivion and publicly cancels the Twitter account of someone who does nothing more than track his private jet.

    At the very least, he is absurdly thin skinned. More likely, he's a total hypocrite.
    Is it not possible to treat the freedom to express an opinion as being in a different category to the freedom to defame an individual?
    In the two cases I have highlighted, he was attempting to suppress factual information.

    In the case of the private jet tracker, it was just simple republishing of publicly available information.

    In the case of Media Matters, it was a factual description of something they had done on Twitter, and the results they obtained.

    And, for what it's worth, we have a system designed to prevent against defamation, which is the libel laws. But, of course, if no one knows who you are, then what protection does anyone have against anonymous defamation? Which is - of course - an issue that all the online platforms have.
    Your anonymity on the internet is inversely proportional to the amount you irritate/annoy/outrage others into making the effort to pull the curtain back.
    I dunno, it's pretty easy to be truly anonymous on Twitter and/or PB. All you need to do is use Tor to sign up and use a fake or throw away email address.

    Then there is effectively no way to identify you.
    AI might well be on the point of getting round that by analysing your words in various places and comparing a bit like a Graphologist.

    Using TOR to post anonymously is an interesting one. Yes possible perhaps to drop the site in it by spouting defamations or copyright breaches without TSE without TSE getting you, but if you are using TOR, in the UK at least, I would be very surprised (and disappointed) if your ISP and GCHQ have not flagged you to police Drugs and Pedo squads in short order, which possibly is more detrimental to you than annoying TSE.

    PS - forget fake email addresses. You cant post until you have received an email from Vanilla and responded.

    You can't post if you use a valid gmail address to register either, becsuse the email Vanilla send out to validate it has your (RCS) name and email address on it so gmail blocks it under their spoofing protocols because it manifestly is from?Vanilla not you at Gmail.

    Which is why I am @misterbedfordshire and @mrbedfordshire hasn't posted yet.
    Well, if you don't want the police to know you're using Tor*, then you can use a VPN, and then use Tor through the VPN. Or if you're a bit more technically sophisticated, you can get a disposable Amazon EC2 instance and then use SSH forwarding to send your traffic through there. Or you could walk to Starbucks and connect from there.

    Once you have an anonymous internet connection, then it's a pot of piss to get yourself a disposable email address you can respond with.

    It's not very difficult to be anonymous on the Internet.

    * Of course, given there are around 2 million simultaneous Tor nodes at any given moment in time, then there are going to be hundreds of thousands of Tor users in the UK in any given month. Some will be having affairs. Some will be browsing child porn. Some will be buying illegal drugs. And some will be using to defame people anonymously on the Internet.
    Fortunately you have the ban hammer to deal with those and a membership that would flag it up pretty pronto.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 58,992
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,140

    Foxy said:

    Not much mention of prisons on here - I think what's going on is interesting. The immediate prisons crisis has led to, and given a justification for, today's announcement, but also reflects a change of tone. I think Labour is switching towards a model that seeks to reduce prison numbers in the longer term and focuses more on rehabilitation and reducing recidivism. The appointment of Timpson, and the announcement that 1,000 new probation officers are to be trained up, suggest this.

    Personally I welcome this. It's a refreshing, and progressive, change from the 'lock them all up' rhetoric that both major parties have campaigned on in recent times. It's also refreshing that the government is not paying heed to the inevitable cries of being soft on crime from the tabloids.

    It comes from having a PM who actually understands Criminal Justice.

    And shows how poorly we have been served by a decade of Tabloid oriented populism.
    Do you think that current sentences for crime are too harsh? A couple of days ago someone mentioned that in a gang murder he people holding down the victim got a year. I presume the one plunging the knife into the victim got longer.
    They are all guilty of murder and should get life
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,188
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Trump's lead seems to have gone in the more recent polls. Biden now fractionally in the lead in the last 11 polls: https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811771182137401714

    Strange because it is not the narrative. Of course Trump would still win on polling like that because of the advantage he has in the EC but it is seriously close. It would appear that 51% of Americans would rather have someone senile than Trump. We need more like 53% to come to the same conclusion.

    Ummm...if they get Trump, they are getting someone senile.

    The choice is not about senility, it's about what form of it they want. Do they want an inoffensive old dodderer surrounded by mostly competent people who is not planning to rape his daughter or overthrow the Constitution, or a convicted criminal and known traitor who surrounds himself with people almost as mad as he is?

    This is why while neither of them should be running, Biden is still the likelier victor.
    I very, very much want Biden to win again. Trump is both dangerous and malevolent. It is not clear democracy would survive him. I am not sure I would put him as the likelier victor right now though. Its incredibly close and, as Robert pointed out yesterday, very few incumbents are winning anywhere.
  • No but, arguably it is part of the problem (the main parties being so closely aligned there is no real choice). Not that I would wish to see the end of such civility.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 47,969
    edited July 12

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.

    Edit: High Speed Rail in California died of pork. Made HS2 seem cheap. Reminded me rather of the death of the Supercollider in Texas.

    Note for politicians - get the project up and running before you try to feed….
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,501
    Traditionally the leaving President leaves a nice letter for the incoming President and they tend to be helpful and traditionally the President's club get on well. Even Trump left a letter, although he hasn't joined the President's club.

    It is nice they can put the politics behind them and of course on many things we all agree. The noise is over the few things we disagree on.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,218
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Trump's lead seems to have gone in the more recent polls. Biden now fractionally in the lead in the last 11 polls: https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811771182137401714

    Strange because it is not the narrative. Of course Trump would still win on polling like that because of the advantage he has in the EC but it is seriously close. It would appear that 51% of Americans would rather have someone senile than Trump. We need more like 53% to come to the same conclusion.

    Ummm...if they get Trump, they are getting someone senile.

    The choice is not about senility, it's about what form of it they want. Do they want an inoffensive old dodderer surrounded by mostly competent people who is not planning to rape his daughter or overthrow the Constitution, or a convicted criminal and known traitor who surrounds himself with people almost as mad as he is?

    This is why while neither of them should be running, Biden is still the likelier victor.
    I very, very much want Biden to win again. Trump is both dangerous and malevolent. It is not clear democracy would survive him. I am not sure I would put him as the likelier victor right now though. Its incredibly close and, as Robert pointed out yesterday, very few incumbents are winning anywhere.
    I think it’s inevitable Biden goes now - his continued candidacy is unsustainable. However, I’m far from convinced that Harris would do better. The Dems really need to think hard about who to select, and it needs to be someone who can connect with the rust belt.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 12,830
    AlsoLei said:

    Leon said:

    Quail. Roast. 15 minutes

    There. That's the comment. That's it

    Just one?

    Like, I love quail... but that's a starter, not a meal!
    While we're on about that sort of thing, I had the finest scallop I have ever eaten today. In London, of all places.
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,415
    Leon said:

    ydoethur said:

    Speaking of which Leon I visited somewhere yesterday that if you've never been to has some of your famous 'noom' in spades.

    St Agatha's Church, Easby, nr. Richmond (Yorks).

    Set in the grounds of a ruined convent, on a Saxon floor plan, with genuine surviving 12th century wall paintings.

    Cost - £1 donation requested for the car park.

    Truly amazing place.

    Ta. I keep intending to do a tour of northern England, it's actually one of the last really interesting corners of Europe I don't know so well (eg, never been to Sheffield, nor Whitby, nor the Dales). I intend to amend this in early autumn, so thanks
    Have you ever been to Belfast?

    I suspect you might find a fair amount of numinosity there, especially at this time of year. You've just missed the 11th night, but next year find somewhere to stay near Cave Hill or Craigantlet or Gilnahirk to watch the city ablaze, followed by hundreds of thousands of fleg-wavers the day after. Better than watching on GBNews, and plenty of amazing bars and restaurants, too.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 12,830
    kjh said:

    Traditionally the leaving President leaves a nice letter for the incoming President and they tend to be helpful and traditionally the President's club get on well. Even Trump left a letter, although he hasn't joined the President's club.

    It is nice they can put the politics behind them and of course on many things we all agree. The noise is over the few things we disagree on.
    When Clinton handed over to GWB, Clinton's staff helpfully removed all the Ws from the keyboards in the White House. But that is civil servants, not politicians.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,461
    Cookie said:

    kjh said:

    Traditionally the leaving President leaves a nice letter for the incoming President and they tend to be helpful and traditionally the President's club get on well. Even Trump left a letter, although he hasn't joined the President's club.

    It is nice they can put the politics behind them and of course on many things we all agree. The noise is over the few things we disagree on.
    When Clinton handed over to GWB, Clinton's staff helpfully removed all the Ws from the keyboards in the White House. But that is civil servants, not politicians.
    In America the line is much more blurred than in this country.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Trump's lead seems to have gone in the more recent polls. Biden now fractionally in the lead in the last 11 polls: https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811771182137401714

    Strange because it is not the narrative. Of course Trump would still win on polling like that because of the advantage he has in the EC but it is seriously close. It would appear that 51% of Americans would rather have someone senile than Trump. We need more like 53% to come to the same conclusion.

    Ummm...if they get Trump, they are getting someone senile.

    The choice is not about senility, it's about what form of it they want. Do they want an inoffensive old dodderer surrounded by mostly competent people who is not planning to rape his daughter or overthrow the Constitution, or a convicted criminal and known traitor who surrounds himself with people almost as mad as he is?

    This is why while neither of them should be running, Biden is still the likelier victor.
    I very, very much want Biden to win again. Trump is both dangerous and malevolent. It is not clear democracy would survive him. I am not sure I would put him as the likelier victor right now though. Its incredibly close and, as Robert pointed out yesterday, very few incumbents are winning anywhere.
    Do you mean that or do you just mean not-Trump? If the latter surely a 50 something non senile Dem is preferable?
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 21,378
    Cookie said:

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Friends_(1973_TV_series)
    I'm not that old, makes me think of this 1995 episode of The Simpsons.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaEW6KfZIM4
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,266
    Anyone know when we can expect our first post-election poll?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,208

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Trump's lead seems to have gone in the more recent polls. Biden now fractionally in the lead in the last 11 polls: https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811771182137401714

    Strange because it is not the narrative. Of course Trump would still win on polling like that because of the advantage he has in the EC but it is seriously close. It would appear that 51% of Americans would rather have someone senile than Trump. We need more like 53% to come to the same conclusion.

    Ummm...if they get Trump, they are getting someone senile.

    The choice is not about senility, it's about what form of it they want. Do they want an inoffensive old dodderer surrounded by mostly competent people who is not planning to rape his daughter or overthrow the Constitution, or a convicted criminal and known traitor who surrounds himself with people almost as mad as he is?

    This is why while neither of them should be running, Biden is still the likelier victor.
    I very, very much want Biden to win again. Trump is both dangerous and malevolent. It is not clear democracy would survive him. I am not sure I would put him as the likelier victor right now though. Its incredibly close and, as Robert pointed out yesterday, very few incumbents are winning anywhere.
    I think it’s inevitable Biden goes now - his continued candidacy is unsustainable. However, I’m far from convinced that Harris would do better. The Dems really need to think hard about who to select, and it needs to be someone who can connect with the rust belt.
    James Carville has laid out a plan. A short list selected of key national level candidates (e.g. whitmer, shapiro etc) by Clinton and Obama go head to head in an intense series of town hall debates in run up to conference and then the delegates decide.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,003
    dixiedean said:

    Anyone know when we can expect our first post-election poll?

    Not sure. But I can tell you the Tories last had a poll lead on 6th December 2021, Redfield & Wilton.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,266

    dixiedean said:

    Anyone know when we can expect our first post-election poll?

    Not sure. But I can tell you the Tories last had a poll lead on 6th December 2021, Redfield & Wilton.
    You'd be much more use if you could tell me when they'll next have one. :)
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,415
    ydoethur said:

    Cookie said:

    kjh said:

    Traditionally the leaving President leaves a nice letter for the incoming President and they tend to be helpful and traditionally the President's club get on well. Even Trump left a letter, although he hasn't joined the President's club.

    It is nice they can put the politics behind them and of course on many things we all agree. The noise is over the few things we disagree on.
    When Clinton handed over to GWB, Clinton's staff helpfully removed all the Ws from the keyboards in the White House. But that is civil servants, not politicians.
    In America the line is much more blurred than in this country.
    Compare with this story about Hunt's kids leaving "sweet and thoughtful" notes for Starmer's children when moving in to No. 11: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2507npnxqeo
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,079
    edited July 12

    Foxy said:

    Not much mention of prisons on here - I think what's going on is interesting. The immediate prisons crisis has led to, and given a justification for, today's announcement, but also reflects a change of tone. I think Labour is switching towards a model that seeks to reduce prison numbers in the longer term and focuses more on rehabilitation and reducing recidivism. The appointment of Timpson, and the announcement that 1,000 new probation officers are to be trained up, suggest this.

    Personally I welcome this. It's a refreshing, and progressive, change from the 'lock them all up' rhetoric that both major parties have campaigned on in recent times. It's also refreshing that the government is not paying heed to the inevitable cries of being soft on crime from the tabloids.

    It comes from having a PM who actually understands Criminal Justice.

    And shows how poorly we have been served by a decade of Tabloid oriented populism.
    Do you think that current sentences for crime are too harsh? A couple of days ago someone mentioned that in a gang murder he people holding down the victim got a year. I presume the one plunging the knife into the victim got longer.
    They are all guilty of murder and should get life
    It's always hard to know when one is given such little information. Is there something we don't know - like (at one extreme) did the guy who only got a year go to the police and confess, and through his actions ensure the others were all convicted? (Probably not, but it's always possible there is something one doesn't know from summaries / new stories. Just as whenever someone's immigration case *seems* like it was really unjust... it's usually just that one has only partial information.)

    It's also the case that judges have surprisingly little discretion these days in sentencing. And sometimes the guidelines don't anticipate a particular set of circumstances, resulting in by-the-book sentences that appear particularly lenient or harsh.

    And finally - of course - there are judges that step outside the lines from time to time. And those are the cases that are newsworthy, rather than typical.
  • MisterBedfordshireMisterBedfordshire Posts: 2,252
    edited July 12

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.
    I'm not sure about that one. It gave a much more comfortable ride.

    Also faster with a given technology. On the opening day of the Bristol and Exeter Railway in 1841 a train went from Exeter to London via Bristol in 4h 40mins.This included various prolonged stops to pick up dignitaries, refill the loco water and allow people to use the lavatory.

    Modern High Speed trains still take over 2 1/2 hours to do the journey that way.

    It was the transfer of goods needed at standard gauge interchanges that did for it (along with it not being possible to widen standard gauge lines).
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,218
    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Anyone know when we can expect our first post-election poll?

    Not sure. But I can tell you the Tories last had a poll lead on 6th December 2021, Redfield & Wilton.
    You'd be much more use if you could tell me when they'll next have one. :)
    A very long time indeed (and possibly never) if Braverman's the next leader.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,880
    Ridiculous - I've never seen Keir in skinny jeans.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 47,969
    rcs1000 said:

    Foxy said:

    Not much mention of prisons on here - I think what's going on is interesting. The immediate prisons crisis has led to, and given a justification for, today's announcement, but also reflects a change of tone. I think Labour is switching towards a model that seeks to reduce prison numbers in the longer term and focuses more on rehabilitation and reducing recidivism. The appointment of Timpson, and the announcement that 1,000 new probation officers are to be trained up, suggest this.

    Personally I welcome this. It's a refreshing, and progressive, change from the 'lock them all up' rhetoric that both major parties have campaigned on in recent times. It's also refreshing that the government is not paying heed to the inevitable cries of being soft on crime from the tabloids.

    It comes from having a PM who actually understands Criminal Justice.

    And shows how poorly we have been served by a decade of Tabloid oriented populism.
    Do you think that current sentences for crime are too harsh? A couple of days ago someone mentioned that in a gang murder he people holding down the victim got a year. I presume the one plunging the knife into the victim got longer.
    They are all guilty of murder and should get life
    It's always hard to know when one is given such little information. Is there something we don't know - like (at one extreme) did the guy who only got a year go to the police and confess, and through his actions ensure the others were all convicted? (Probably not, but it's always possible there is something one doesn't know from summaries / new stories. Just as whenever someone's immigration case *seems* like it was really unjust... it's usually just that one has only partial information.)

    It's also the case that judges have surprisingly little discretion these days in sentencing. And sometimes the guidelines don't anticipate a particular set of circumstances, resulting in

    And finally - of course - there are judges that step outside the lines from time to time. And those are the cases that are newsworthy, rather than typical.
    Juvenile. Not charged with murder (common cause) despite the facts not being disputed - on CCTV.

    Some years ago a friend was given life changing injuries by a couple of teenagers. Their story was that while robbing him, his fell and hit his head on curb stone.

    His wife was unhappy with the story and contacted a leading expert on brain injuries.

    At the court we (I was in the party) were confronted by the prosecutor who shouted that she had worked hard to get the juveniles off the custody track, and how her (the wife’s) stupid actions were going to derail this…

    In the end they got suspended sentences of some kind.

    Some little time later the family lawyer told us that they (the juveniles) had carried on their hobby of mugging drunk people coming home from the pub. And battered a known local thug, by mistake. Who went round with his gang and crippled them. Literally - one was left in a wheelchair….

    Funny old world, isn’t it?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,323
    edited July 12
    kjh said:

    Traditionally the leaving President leaves a nice letter for the incoming President and they tend to be helpful and traditionally the President's club get on well. Even Trump left a letter, although he hasn't joined the President's club.

    It is nice they can put the politics behind them and of course on many things we all agree. The noise is over the few things we disagree on.
    Trump left Biden a letter? What did it say "I won! It's not fair! This is a stolen election! I WON!!"?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,003

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.
    I'm not sure about that one. It gave a much more comfortable ride.

    Also faster with a given technology. On the opening day of the Bristol and Exeter Railway in 1841 a train went from Exeter to London via Bristol in 4h 40mins.This included various prolonged stops to pick up dignitaries, refill the loco water and allow people to use the lavatory.

    Modern High Speed trains still take over 2 1/2 hours to do the journey that way.

    It was the transfer of goods needed at standard gauge interchanges that did for it (along with it not being possible to widen standard gauge lines).
    Nonsense!

    India has almost exclusive 5ft 6 broad gauge trains, but hardly any high speed services.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,452
    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,222

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Trump's lead seems to have gone in the more recent polls. Biden now fractionally in the lead in the last 11 polls: https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811771182137401714

    Strange because it is not the narrative. Of course Trump would still win on polling like that because of the advantage he has in the EC but it is seriously close. It would appear that 51% of Americans would rather have someone senile than Trump. We need more like 53% to come to the same conclusion.

    Ummm...if they get Trump, they are getting someone senile.

    The choice is not about senility, it's about what form of it they want. Do they want an inoffensive old dodderer surrounded by mostly competent people who is not planning to rape his daughter or overthrow the Constitution, or a convicted criminal and known traitor who surrounds himself with people almost as mad as he is?

    This is why while neither of them should be running, Biden is still the likelier victor.
    I very, very much want Biden to win again. Trump is both dangerous and malevolent. It is not clear democracy would survive him. I am not sure I would put him as the likelier victor right now though. Its incredibly close and, as Robert pointed out yesterday, very few incumbents are winning anywhere.
    I think it’s inevitable Biden goes now - his continued candidacy is unsustainable. However, I’m far from convinced that Harris would do better. The Dems really need to think hard about who to select, and it needs to be someone who can connect with the rust belt.
    James Carville has laid out a plan. A short list selected of key national level candidates (e.g. whitmer, shapiro etc) by Clinton and Obama go head to head in an intense series of town hall debates in run up to conference and then the delegates decide.
    James Carville is a superannuated had been who's only about a year younger than Biden.

    Indulging in fantasy.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 9,938
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw0y1ezpv5xo

    Big tech has too much power. Government intervention is welcome.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 47,969
    a

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.
    I'm not sure about that one. It gave a much more comfortable ride.

    Also faster with a given technology. On the opening day of the Bristol and Exeter Railway in 1841 a train went from Exeter to London via Bristol in 4h 40mins.This included various prolonged stops to pick up dignitaries, refill the loco water and allow people to use the lavatory.

    Modern High Speed trains still take over 2 1/2 hours to do the journey that way.

    It was the transfer of goods needed at standard gauge interchanges that did for it (along with it not being possible to widen standard gauge lines).
    The ride was to do with Brunel spending a fortune on the track, rather than guage.

    Indeed, he totally stuffed up the initial locomotives. And was rescued by Daniel Gooch - who designed great locomotives. Which could equally have been done for the standard guage.

    In the modern era, some of the fastest trains ever built run on standard guage.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,188

    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Trump's lead seems to have gone in the more recent polls. Biden now fractionally in the lead in the last 11 polls: https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811771182137401714

    Strange because it is not the narrative. Of course Trump would still win on polling like that because of the advantage he has in the EC but it is seriously close. It would appear that 51% of Americans would rather have someone senile than Trump. We need more like 53% to come to the same conclusion.

    Ummm...if they get Trump, they are getting someone senile.

    The choice is not about senility, it's about what form of it they want. Do they want an inoffensive old dodderer surrounded by mostly competent people who is not planning to rape his daughter or overthrow the Constitution, or a convicted criminal and known traitor who surrounds himself with people almost as mad as he is?

    This is why while neither of them should be running, Biden is still the likelier victor.
    I very, very much want Biden to win again. Trump is both dangerous and malevolent. It is not clear democracy would survive him. I am not sure I would put him as the likelier victor right now though. Its incredibly close and, as Robert pointed out yesterday, very few incumbents are winning anywhere.
    Do you mean that or do you just mean not-Trump? If the latter surely a 50 something non senile Dem is preferable?
    I mean not Trump. A Democrat with all his marbles and some idea of what is going on in the world and who is still alive in it would be better still.
  • ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.
    I'm not sure about that one. It gave a much more comfortable ride.

    Also faster with a given technology. On the opening day of the Bristol and Exeter Railway in 1841 a train went from Exeter to London via Bristol in 4h 40mins.This included various prolonged stops to pick up dignitaries, refill the loco water and allow people to use the lavatory.

    Modern High Speed trains still take over 2 1/2 hours to do the journey that way.

    It was the transfer of goods needed at standard gauge interchanges that did for it (along with it not being possible to widen standard gauge lines).
    Nonsense!

    India has almost exclusive 5ft 6 broad gauge trains, but hardly any high speed services.
    Its got some doing 125mph.

    The new Mumbai–Ahmedabad high-speed rail corridor under construction that will operate at 200mph will be standard gauge though, this limits it's usefulness by preventing extension over "classic" lines.

    Suspect that building it to 5'6" would have pushed the costs up a lot by ruling out off the peg Shikansen trains etc (another issue GW had but not the crucial one).

    It wouldn't be dificult in pure engineering terms to convert much of Brunels billiard table to 200mph running, it would rather reduce capacity though. It was though very ahead of it's time.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,461
    DavidL said:

    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"

    I'm tempted to say somewhere between Israel, Sudan and Libya.
    I couldn't name any part of Egypt in a quiz.

    It's a Sinai need to work on my geography.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,452
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"

    I'm tempted to say somewhere between Israel, Sudan and Libya.
    I couldn't name any part of Egypt in a quiz.

    It's a Sinai need to work on my geography.
    Sharm on you.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,164

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Anyone know when we can expect our first post-election poll?

    Not sure. But I can tell you the Tories last had a poll lead on 6th December 2021, Redfield & Wilton.
    You'd be much more use if you could tell me when they'll next have one. :)
    A very long time indeed (and possibly never) if Braverman's the next leader.
    Did we do the JLP polling which, when stripping out sizable Don't Know and Wouldn't Vote, had Braverman edging out all comers with the members?

    Jenrick had ground to make up though.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,461

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"

    I'm tempted to say somewhere between Israel, Sudan and Libya.
    I couldn't name any part of Egypt in a quiz.

    It's a Sinai need to work on my geography.
    Sharm on you.
    Couldn't you do better than that?

    Perhaps my brilliance has left you sheikh-en.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,188
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"

    I'm tempted to say somewhere between Israel, Sudan and Libya.
    I couldn't name any part of Egypt in a quiz.

    It's a Sinai need to work on my geography.
    I think that there is a wet bit going down the middle and an artificial wet bit on the right as you look at it. After that, I am in denial.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,461
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"

    I'm tempted to say somewhere between Israel, Sudan and Libya.
    I couldn't name any part of Egypt in a quiz.

    It's a Sinai need to work on my geography.
    I think that there is a wet bit going down the middle and an artificial wet bit on the right as you look at it. After that, I am in denial.
    Not bad, but you were delta good hand.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,266
    edited July 12
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"

    I'm tempted to say somewhere between Israel, Sudan and Libya.
    I couldn't name any part of Egypt in a quiz.

    It's a Sinai need to work on my geography.
    Sharm on you.
    Couldn't you do better than that?

    Perhaps my brilliance has left you sheikh-en.
    Was that brilliance just pure Lux, or not?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,461
    dixiedean said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    https://x.com/metzgov/status/1811774061812347080

    Former Rep. Jane Harman (D-CA) compared efforts to push Biden aside to the 2011 overthrow of Egyptian dictator Hosni Mubarak.

    "It's easy to knock people off. We saw it in the so-called Arab Spring," she said on ABC last night. "Where is Egypt now?"

    I'm tempted to say somewhere between Israel, Sudan and Libya.
    I couldn't name any part of Egypt in a quiz.

    It's a Sinai need to work on my geography.
    Sharm on you.
    Couldn't you do better than that?

    Perhaps my brilliance has left you sheikh-en.
    Was that brilliance just pure Lux, or not?
    I thought about hooding back, but just couldn't be mersaful.

    Good night.
  • MisterBedfordshireMisterBedfordshire Posts: 2,252
    edited July 12

    a

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.
    I'm not sure about that one. It gave a much more comfortable ride.

    Also faster with a given technology. On the opening day of the Bristol and Exeter Railway in 1841 a train went from Exeter to London via Bristol in 4h 40mins.This included various prolonged stops to pick up dignitaries, refill the loco water and allow people to use the lavatory.

    Modern High Speed trains still take over 2 1/2 hours to do the journey that way.

    It was the transfer of goods needed at standard gauge interchanges that did for it (along with it not being possible to widen standard gauge lines).
    The ride was to do with Brunel spending a fortune on the track, rather than guage.

    Indeed, he totally stuffed up the initial locomotives. And was rescued by Daniel Gooch - who designed great locomotives. Which could equally have been done for the standard guage.

    In the modern era, some of the fastest trains ever built run on standard guage.
    I have to disagree there. Broad gauge allowed the loco boiler to sit low down between the wheels, both lowering the centre of gravity and enabling a proportionally longer draughting chimney, the extra width between the rails gave greater dynamic stability to the coaches. Both important with early loco designs and crude early coach suspension.

    The significantly greater width between the rails also eases the spot load on the formation by spreading the load more.

    Other than the last one, no longer an issue with modern technology but significant in 1841.

    Brunel did spend a fortune on the trackbed thuough.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,511

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    There was some interesting stuff on the Politix podcast about who Biden would listen to. Apparently in Biden's mind he could have won in 2016 but he was talked out of it by Obama and Pelosi and various pundits who thought he was too old and Hillary would win easily. He then comes out of retirement in 2020 and saves the day, and now these exact same people are telling him to step aside again and run another woman not much liked by rust-belt swing voters.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 120,806
    edited July 12
    DavidL said:

    Trump's lead seems to have gone in the more recent polls. Biden now fractionally in the lead in the last 11 polls: https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811771182137401714

    Strange because it is not the narrative. Of course Trump would still win on polling like that because of the advantage he has in the EC but it is seriously close. It would appear that 51% of Americans would rather have someone senile than Trump. We need more like 53% to come to the same conclusion.

    5h
    'With good new polling over the past few days Biden is now at 271 in the 538 election forecast model.'

    So Biden can still win the EC but it would be the closest US presidential election since 2000 when Bush also won with 271 EC votes
    https://x.com/SimonWDC/status/1811799775550841202
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 20,927
    Cookie said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I have just received a business email from a lawyer than has the signature:

    "Many blessings,
    [x]"

    Which is certainly unusual. What am I supposed to deduce from this?

    He's epically screwed up and is anxious to ingratiate himself?
    Is the fella in question *qualified* to dole out blessings?
    I am. I give many detailed explanations, often accompanied by graphs and on occasion cartoons. And at the end I ask how it went. And they say "Bless"

    😎
  • Tim_in_RuislipTim_in_Ruislip Posts: 387
    edited July 12
    dixiedean said:

    Anyone know when we can expect our first post-election poll?

    I expect Lab >40% in at least 1 poll. Potentially, many.

    Although, I expect all the pollsters are busy bodging their lab figures down by any credible means to make their polls fit the GE result.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 120,806
    edited July 12

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    There was some interesting stuff on the Politix podcast about who Biden would listen to. Apparently in Biden's mind he could have won in 2016 but he was talked out of it by Obama and Pelosi and various pundits who thought he was too old and Hillary would win easily. He then comes out of retirement in 2020 and saves the day, and now these exact same people are telling him to step aside again and run another woman not much liked by rust-belt swing voters.
    Indeed, then VP Biden almost certainly would have won the EC and Presidency in 2016 and Trump would never have been heard of politically again. He would now be ready to leave office and hand over to his VP at the Democratic convention next month having nearly completed his second term.

    So it is understandable if he doesn't give a damn what the Democrat establishment is now telling him, given they pushed him out in 2016 from the nomination and with Hillary handed the Presidency on a plate to Trump instead
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,222

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    There was some interesting stuff on the Politix podcast about who Biden would listen to. Apparently in Biden's mind he could have won in 2016 but he was talked out of it by Obama and Pelosi and various pundits who thought he was too old and Hillary would win easily. He then comes out of retirement in 2020 and saves the day, and now these exact same people are telling him to step aside again and run another woman not much liked by rust-belt swing voters.
    A view not entirely without justification.
    But it doesn’t change the fact that he’s too old, and is only going to get older.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,222
    They’re not going to get anything like this, but it would be very useful in Ukraine.

    U.S. Navy Confirms SM-6 Air Launched Configuration Is ‘Operationally Deployed’

    The SM-6 Air Launched Configuration (ALC), known by its official designation as the AIM-174, is the longest range air-to-air missile ever fielded by the U.S. Navy.
    https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2024/07/u-s-navy-confirms-sm-6-air-launched-configuration-is-operationally-deployed/

  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,150
    Nunu5 said:
    He's going down with the ship.
  • Tim_in_RuislipTim_in_Ruislip Posts: 387
    Classy finale from Kirsty Wark on Newsnight.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 21,673
    edited July 12

    Also from Wales - Snooker player Michael White gets 36 months in prison for two counts of ABH against his partner that caused injuries. Is this what you would normally expect? If I understand correctly ABH is less serious than GBH? We keep being told the prisons are full and dangerous people will have to be released early. Mr White clearly can't be regarded as 'safe' but it still seems a long time to lock him up. Woke sentencing? Or am I being unduly sensitive?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c72546evnpxo

    To me it does not look out of line.

    ABH is roughly up to broken bones - above that it is GBH. Same threshold approximately as injury / serious injury in driving offences.

    Sentencing guidelines are up to to 7 years at Crown Court.

    Various aggravating factors - vulnerable victim, repeated assaults, premeditated etc,

    https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magistrates-court/item/assault-occasioning-actual-bodily-harm-racially-or-religiously-aggravated-abh/

  • MattWMattW Posts: 21,673
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    France continues to disappoint



    Country of two 'alves innit. It's bloody dreich in Brest ce soir.
    It was luvverly when I was there, I am sorry it is dreich

    If you get any breaks in the grisaille, do try the Crozon peninsula. And Ile De Sein is probably BETTER in the rain and mist - certainly if you want Noom
    Will do. I am on someone else's boat but will try to introduce Ile de sein into itinerary wind and tide permitting.
    It's fab. Ouessant is also nice but not spiritual like Ile De Sein, and it needs good weather, or mighty storms. And as a sea-lubber you've probably been there already
    Quessant sounds like a game bird one eats for lunch.

    A quail-pheasant hybrid?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 21,673
    Leon said:

    Quail. Roast. 15 minutes

    There. That's the comment. That's it

    Tomorrow have a Quessent.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,837
    Yesterday I urged someone to join the Conservative Party

    And I was being serious.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 31,200
    From Matt Goodwin.

    https://www.mattgoodwin.org/p/exclusive-who-would-bring-ex-tories

    "Earlier this week, I polled 2,077 former Conservative Party voters, people who voted Tory in 2019 but not again in 2024.

    And I asked them which of the following leaders would make them consider voting for the Conservatives again.

    Among the sample overall, among all two thousand of them, here are the results once you exclude those who said they were unsure who they wanted.

    Nigel Farage, leader of Reform, is in first place with 25%. Boris Johnson is second, with 11%. Suella Braverman is third, on 8%. And Kemi Badenoch and David Cameron, who has since ruled himself out of a return to frontline politics, are joint fourth. Fully 13% of the entire sample say the question is irrelevant because they will never vote Tory again."
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 20,927
    Andy_JS said:

    Congratulations to Kirsty Wark on 31 years of presenting Newsnight, which ends tonight.

    I haven't kept up and the sentence is ambiguous: is it Kirsty Warks presentation or Newsnight which is ending tonight?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,208
    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Congratulations to Kirsty Wark on 31 years of presenting Newsnight, which ends tonight.

    I haven't kept up and the sentence is ambiguous: is it Kirsty Warks presentation or Newsnight which is ending tonight?
    Kirsty has gone.

    Quite an emotional programme. And plenty of clips of the times when Newsnight mattered.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,438

    a

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.
    I'm not sure about that one. It gave a much more comfortable ride.

    Also faster with a given technology. On the opening day of the Bristol and Exeter Railway in 1841 a train went from Exeter to London via Bristol in 4h 40mins.This included various prolonged stops to pick up dignitaries, refill the loco water and allow people to use the lavatory.

    Modern High Speed trains still take over 2 1/2 hours to do the journey that way.

    It was the transfer of goods needed at standard gauge interchanges that did for it (along with it not being possible to widen standard gauge lines).
    The ride was to do with Brunel spending a fortune on the track, rather than guage.

    Indeed, he totally stuffed up the initial locomotives. And was rescued by Daniel Gooch - who designed great locomotives. Which could equally have been done for the standard guage.

    In the modern era, some of the fastest trains ever built run on standard guage.
    I have to disagree there. Broad gauge allowed the loco boiler to sit low down between the wheels, both lowering the centre of gravity and enabling a proportionally longer draughting chimney, the extra width between the rails gave greater dynamic stability to the coaches. Both important with early loco designs and crude early coach suspension.

    The significantly greater width between the rails also eases the spot load on the formation by spreading the load more.

    Other than the last one, no longer an issue with modern technology but significant in 1841.

    Brunel did spend a fortune on the trackbed thuough.
    WAsn't IKB's track actually too heavily engineered and rigid, originally, to give a reasonable ride, also?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 31,200
    edited July 12
    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Congratulations to Kirsty Wark on 31 years of presenting Newsnight, which ends tonight.

    I haven't kept up and the sentence is ambiguous: is it Kirsty Warks presentation or Newsnight which is ending tonight?
    Kirsty Wark's final programme. Newsnight is continuing for now.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,016
    Omnium said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Hurtling towards disaster.



    "As President Biden insists he will stay in the presidential race, Democrats are growing increasingly alarmed that his presence on the ticket is transforming the political map, turning light-blue states into contested battlegrounds.

    Down-ballot Democrats, local elected officials and party strategists say Minnesota, New Hampshire, New Mexico and Virginia — all of which Mr. Biden won comfortably in 2020 — could be in play in November after his miserable debate performance last month."

    NY Times

    Yes, a few months ago despite worries over his age the hope was the old battleground states were going back into play. But can Biden win places like Arizona this time, which were so close last time? Doesn't look like it.
    Biden lost to Trump on the Thursday evening of that debate. It's over. Maybe I am wrong but I think - brace!!
    If he did Trump should be on 55-60% in polls now and heading for a landslide.

    He isn't, he is still polling the 45% and a bit he got in 2016 and 2020. Independents are still not yet firmly in either camp. The conventions, Trump's sentencing and VP pick and the final debate if it goes ahead and how the economy looks in the autumn all remain factors
    Biden is toast. Every appearence between now and the election will increase the realisation that he is not fit for office. Your faith in the polls is garbage as they are only valid until the next gaff.

    If Biden is the candidate in November, Trump walks it and we are all screwed.
    Trump didn't do very much in his first term, and I can't see him doing much in his second beyond trying to be president for life.

    Generally politicians not doing stuff is better than when they do in my view, but with Trump I'd prefer not to take the risk and Biden needs to go damned sharpish.
    To be honest Trump could get away with not doing much in his first term. The world is a different place now. It is no longer good enough by a very long way to simply do nothing. If the first world is to survive in its current form then he needs to do a lot. And it is all stuff he has already said he won't do.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,016
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    Hurtling towards disaster.



    "As President Biden insists he will stay in the presidential race, Democrats are growing increasingly alarmed that his presence on the ticket is transforming the political map, turning light-blue states into contested battlegrounds.

    Down-ballot Democrats, local elected officials and party strategists say Minnesota, New Hampshire, New Mexico and Virginia — all of which Mr. Biden won comfortably in 2020 — could be in play in November after his miserable debate performance last month."

    NY Times

    Yes, a few months ago despite worries over his age the hope was the old battleground states were going back into play. But can Biden win places like Arizona this time, which were so close last time? Doesn't look like it.
    Biden lost to Trump on the Thursday evening of that debate. It's over. Maybe I am wrong but I think - brace!!
    If he did Trump should be on 55-60% in polls now and heading for a landslide.

    He isn't, he is still polling the 45% and a bit he got in 2016 and 2020. Independents are still not yet firmly in either camp. The conventions, Trump's sentencing and VP pick and the final debate if it goes ahead and how the economy looks in the autumn all remain factors
    Biden is toast. Every appearence between now and the election will increase the realisation that he is not fit for office. Your faith in the polls is garbage as they are only valid until the next gaff.

    If Biden is the candidate in November, Trump walks it and we are all screwed.
    So you keep saying yet not one poll shows much difference between Biden and the other Dem candidates, indeed many show them doing worse. None show Trump over 50%.

    It remains close. Nearly half of Americans will vote for Trump even if he is in prison, nearly half of Americans will vote for Biden even if he is in a coma.
    Like I said, your faith in polls is garnage. To then come back and say 'but the polls say' as an answer is pointless. The polls are only good for today and maybe tomorrow at best. By the time we get around to the election they will be very different.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,511
    Nunu5 said:
    I don't suppose people could just do a minimum of checking of stuff they see on Twitter before they post it here?

    Ron Klain can't have just been locked out of Biden's inner circle because he wasn't in it in the first place, he left over a year ago and went to work for AirBNB.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,452

    Nunu5 said:
    I don't suppose people could just do a minimum of checking of stuff they see on Twitter before they post it here?

    Ron Klain can't have just been locked out of Biden's inner circle because he wasn't in it in the first place, he left over a year ago and went to work for AirBNB.
    The piece does refer to that:

    https://www.axios.com/2024/07/12/biden-election-inner-circle-withdrawal-criticism

    Some Biden aides have long been skeptical of Ricchetti's political instincts and organization skills, and now worry about how he's handling this critical moment.

    That skepticism is partly why some Biden aides successfully blocked Ricchetti from becoming chief of staff after Klain left last year — a move that deeply upset Ricchetti, people familiar with the matter told Axios.
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 4,310

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    I don't remember any intelligent people proposing that we should build a hyperloop.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 47,969
    Carnyx said:

    a

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    The broad guage was actually another mistake.

    Brunel has misunderstood the engineering dynamics of railways - to be fair it was all up in the air at that point.

    But 7 foot guage wasn’t needed.

    See the vast loads and incredible speeds that can be achieved on standard guage.
    I'm not sure about that one. It gave a much more comfortable ride.

    Also faster with a given technology. On the opening day of the Bristol and Exeter Railway in 1841 a train went from Exeter to London via Bristol in 4h 40mins.This included various prolonged stops to pick up dignitaries, refill the loco water and allow people to use the lavatory.

    Modern High Speed trains still take over 2 1/2 hours to do the journey that way.

    It was the transfer of goods needed at standard gauge interchanges that did for it (along with it not being possible to widen standard gauge lines).
    The ride was to do with Brunel spending a fortune on the track, rather than guage.

    Indeed, he totally stuffed up the initial locomotives. And was rescued by Daniel Gooch - who designed great locomotives. Which could equally have been done for the standard guage.

    In the modern era, some of the fastest trains ever built run on standard guage.
    I have to disagree there. Broad gauge allowed the loco boiler to sit low down between the wheels, both lowering the centre of gravity and enabling a proportionally longer draughting chimney, the extra width between the rails gave greater dynamic stability to the coaches. Both important with early loco designs and crude early coach suspension.

    The significantly greater width between the rails also eases the spot load on the formation by spreading the load more.

    Other than the last one, no longer an issue with modern technology but significant in 1841.

    Brunel did spend a fortune on the trackbed thuough.
    WAsn't IKB's track actually too heavily engineered and rigid, originally, to give a reasonable ride, also?
    Sat on piling at intervals that caused the track to sag in between.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 31,200
    "Democrats in disarray over Biden: ‘We’re totally, totally screwed’

    After the president’s disastrous debate performance, the party has been plunged into a crisis over whether to force him out"

    https://www.ft.com/content/7104f221-da21-492b-be5f-2cb3bedefe6f
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,079

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    I don't remember any intelligent people proposing that we should build a hyperloop.
    I quite like the Boring company... but I question how running Teslas in the tunnels with human drivers makes economic sense.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 20,927
    @Andy_JS , @rottenborough , thank you for the reply.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 5,850
    It didn’t get much airtime but the PM has said he supports the BBC license fee .

    The Tories have spent years trying to destroy the BBC, together with their right wing media friends there’s been attempts to bully it into submission .

  • Tim_in_RuislipTim_in_Ruislip Posts: 387
    edited July 12
    nico679 said:

    It didn’t get much airtime but the PM has said he supports the BBC license fee .

    The Tories have spent years trying to destroy the BBC, together with their right wing media friends there’s been attempts to bully it into submission .

    I did make this point, a few weeks back.

    The BBC can quite rightly celebrate the fact they survived another tory government.

    It was odds against, at times.

    Their problem is that the problem is now somewhat different to the problem of old.

    The young now increasingly opt out of the TV license.

    That is a bloody big problem.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 5,850

    nico679 said:

    It didn’t get much airtime but the PM has said he supports the BBC license fee .

    The Tories have spent years trying to destroy the BBC, together with their right wing media friends there’s been attempts to bully it into submission .

    I did make this point, a few weeks back.

    The BBC can quite rightly celebrate the fact they survived another tory government.

    It was odds against, at times.

    Their problem is that the problem is now somewhat different to the problem of old.

    The young simply opt out of the TV license...
    There does of course need to be changes to reflect that . But the BBC given the breadth of services it offers does do a very good job.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 31,200
    edited July 12
    edit
  • MuesliMuesli Posts: 195

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    Ah yes, the men man in grey tan suits.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,511
    Muesli said:

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    Ah yes, the men man in grey tan suits.
    The thing about the men in grey suits is that they're representatives of MPs who actually have the power to remove the person unless they go. Biden apparently thinks he's OK, and the polling shows him tied with Trump and beating every alternative candidate. What are these people going to say? Quit now or we'll... come back next week and ask you to quit again?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,079
    Alec Baldwin case dismissed.

    What a total waste of time that was.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,452

    Muesli said:

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    Ah yes, the men man in grey tan suits.
    The thing about the men in grey suits is that they're representatives of MPs who actually have the power to remove the person unless they go. Biden apparently thinks he's OK, and the polling shows him tied with Trump and beating every alternative candidate. What are these people going to say? Quit now or we'll... come back next week and ask you to quit again?
    The Pelosi quote is quite funny: “It’s up to the president to decide if he is going to run. We’re all encouraging him to make that decision. Because time is running short.”

    - I've made my decision.
    - Make it again, Joe.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Labour "The Culture Wars are over"

    Labour politicians are about to find out where that toxic culture war stuff was coming from now that they’re in government and being accused of genocidal child murder by leading campaigners and so-called professionals.

    https://x.com/michaelpforan/status/1811815191547433410
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 31,200
    edited July 13
    Katie Hopkins stands up for Gavin Plumb. What a joke she is.

    https://x.com/KTHopkins/status/1811855394563850645
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 2,966
    Andy_JS said:

    From Matt Goodwin.

    https://www.mattgoodwin.org/p/exclusive-who-would-bring-ex-tories

    "Earlier this week, I polled 2,077 former Conservative Party voters, people who voted Tory in 2019 but not again in 2024.

    And I asked them which of the following leaders would make them consider voting for the Conservatives again.

    Among the sample overall, among all two thousand of them, here are the results once you exclude those who said they were unsure who they wanted.

    Nigel Farage, leader of Reform, is in first place with 25%. Boris Johnson is second, with 11%. Suella Braverman is third, on 8%. And Kemi Badenoch and David Cameron, who has since ruled himself out of a return to frontline politics, are joint fourth. Fully 13% of the entire sample say the question is irrelevant because they will never vote Tory again."

    His track record is... um... how to put this?questionable.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,211

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    I don't remember any intelligent people proposing that we should build a hyperloop.
    Some posters said we should build one to replace HS2. ISTR @Sandpit said we should build one from Heathrow to Gatwick.

    So yes, intelligent people did.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 4,992
    HYUFD said:

    https://x.com/thedailybeast/status/1811750361872425123

    A House Democrat says a heavyweight group of “super friends” is being assembled to head to the White House and tell Biden it’s time to go.

    There was some interesting stuff on the Politix podcast about who Biden would listen to. Apparently in Biden's mind he could have won in 2016 but he was talked out of it by Obama and Pelosi and various pundits who thought he was too old and Hillary would win easily. He then comes out of retirement in 2020 and saves the day, and now these exact same people are telling him to step aside again and run another woman not much liked by rust-belt swing voters.
    Indeed, then VP Biden almost certainly would have won the EC and Presidency in 2016 and Trump would never have been heard of politically again. He would now be ready to leave office and hand over to his VP at the Democratic convention next month having nearly completed his second term.

    So it is understandable if he doesn't give a damn what the Democrat establishment is now telling him, given they pushed him out in 2016 from the nomination and with Hillary handed the Presidency on a plate to Trump instead
    On the other hand, Biden only did slightly better in 2020 than Clinton 2016, and that was because people wanted Trump out after he told them to inject bleach to cure Covid. Also in 2016 people wanted a change after 8 years of a Dem president. If Clinton was a terrible candidate on 2016 then so was Biden in 2020.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,237
    nico679 said:

    nico679 said:

    It didn’t get much airtime but the PM has said he supports the BBC license fee .

    The Tories have spent years trying to destroy the BBC, together with their right wing media friends there’s been attempts to bully it into submission .

    I did make this point, a few weeks back.

    The BBC can quite rightly celebrate the fact they survived another tory government.

    It was odds against, at times.

    Their problem is that the problem is now somewhat different to the problem of old.

    The young simply opt out of the TV license...
    There does of course need to be changes to reflect that . But the BBC given the breadth of services it offers does do a very good job.
    It tries to be too many things to too many people, Nico. If it stuck to what it is good at, the things that have given it an unequalled track record, it would be ok.

    It would also help if it appointed people primarily on ability, although in that respect it falls short in much the same way as a great many organisations.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,211
    nico679 said:

    nico679 said:

    It didn’t get much airtime but the PM has said he supports the BBC license fee .

    The Tories have spent years trying to destroy the BBC, together with their right wing media friends there’s been attempts to bully it into submission .

    I did make this point, a few weeks back.

    The BBC can quite rightly celebrate the fact they survived another tory government.

    It was odds against, at times.

    Their problem is that the problem is now somewhat different to the problem of old.

    The young simply opt out of the TV license...
    There does of course need to be changes to reflect that . But the BBC given the breadth of services it offers does do a very good job.
    I agree the BBC does a good job. But it's clear - for all the squealing about "The Tories want to destroy the BBC!!!" that Labour's no-change 'love' will actually destroy the BBC. The current situation is unsustainable given modern technology and viewing habits. The BBC - and Labour - would be best off addressing this sooner rather than later.

    But it's like the NHS for them - it does not matter how much the world changes - the organisation cannot.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,277

    NEW THREAD

  • rcs1000 said:

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    OOF.

    Elon Musk: "The European Commission offered 𝕏 an illegal secret deal: if we quietly censored speech without telling anyone, they would not fine us.

    The other platforms accepted that deal.

    𝕏 did not"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811783320839008381?t=3hj2mGLLj5JQ2oE8tgaHrQ&s=19

    If only Elon Musk didn't have a habit of lying, he would make a compelling witness.
    That is quite a bold statement to make about someone with pockets as deep as he has.

    Anyway we will find out more soon enough:

    "We look forward to a very public battle in court, so that the people of Europe can know the truth"

    https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1811805084981834164?t=MuJnuBka61jDheKDj54evg&s=19
    Elon Musk's habit of lying is hardly debatable, let alone actionable.

    Whereas accusing his business competitors of an "illegal deal" . . .
    Coincidentally enough, Twitter (and other places...) are quite alive today with allegations that Twitter is deleting comments linking Musk and Epstein...
    I always liked the way that Musk shut down the account of the person who used publicly available information to track his jet. A true free speech champion there.

    Or, indeed, the way he sued Media Matters over their research.

    Basically, like a lot of very rich people (of all political hues), he's turned into a bit of a bullying asshole.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Henry Ford.
    Elon Musk is 21st-century version of Isambard Kingdom Brunel.
    Builder of overpriced vehicles that stimulated development but ultimately were costly failures?

    Mad bully whose staff all loathed him?

    Those could work.

    I don't see the amazing civil engineering achievements that made up for Brunel's catastrophes in shipping and locomotives though.

    Nor do I see Musk as a good family man or a generous friend.
    I used to see Musk as a modern-day IKB, and even said so. There are numerous similarities.

    Now, sadly, he's much more like Henry Ford.

    (Having said that; though I like Brunel, he is not quite the genius-hero he is made out to be nowadays. Some of the obituaries when he died were somewhat scathing. e.g. https://www.theengineer.co.uk/content/archive/september-1859-brunels-obituary/)
    Brunel had an unfortunate tendency to let his ambition and imagination outrun both the available technology and his investors' financial resources.

    The atmospheric railway, iron hulled ships with screws, gyro compasses, shore tenders, bogie driving wheels, all could be justified and indeed in various guises all have been successful with modern materials. Just as the 7 foot gauge was in isolation a brilliant idea.

    But - they didn't work and cost a fortune.

    Now, Musk has made a success of Tesla a la the 7 foot gauge. It's bold, exciting and cool so people flock to it. And like the Great Britain, it will probably drive automotive development in ways that would not otherwise have happened.

    But - most of his other ideas don't work and cost a fortune.
    At least Brunel had reasons to think his ideas would work (even the atmospheric railway had worked in Ireland and ?Croydon?, at a smaller scale.

    The same cannot be said for some of Musk's ideas. Even ones he has had people paying millions for, like autonomous cars. Which still are not doing things he was promising for seven or more years ago.

    Thinks like Hyperloop are just a barmy idea, and the accusation is he proposed it just to kill off high-speed rail in California. (Note: some people, even intelligent people on here, said we should scrap HS2 and build a hyperloop instead.)
    I don't remember any intelligent people proposing that we should build a hyperloop.
    I quite like the Boring company... but I question how running Teslas in the tunnels with human drivers makes economic sense.
    In tunnels with no safe side egress/walkway or exit.

    The days of building conventional tube tunnels that the trains just fit inside are long over for similar safety reasons.
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,372

    viewcode said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Congratulations to Kirsty Wark on 31 years of presenting Newsnight, which ends tonight.

    I haven't kept up and the sentence is ambiguous: is it Kirsty Warks presentation or Newsnight which is ending tonight?
    Kirsty has gone.

    Quite an emotional programme. And plenty of clips of the times when Newsnight mattered.
    How many people bothered watching Newsnight prior to its transformation into its current incarnation ? Precious few I’d imagine. If it mattered people would have watched it.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 52,980
    Great try England!!!
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,376
    I don't think Biden's projected faculties a couple of years hence actually matter too much. If it comes to it Harris, Blinken, Austin and Yellen can easily run the govt
  • Sandpit said:

    Great try England!!!

    We haven't lost yet.
This discussion has been closed.