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Oh Mandy – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,158
edited July 4 in General
Oh Mandy – politicalbetting.com

"I don't believe the polls for one moment"Former cabinet minister Lord Mandelson says opinion polls can be "dangerous" ahead of elections and says it's not "all in the bag" for Labour#BBCLauraK https://t.co/JIr7IBfz4z pic.twitter.com/73SmZR1s4o

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Comments

  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 3,647
    Good morning, Vietnam!
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,722
    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,601
    edited June 23
    Yes, I am aware that I am criticising somebody else for a lack of subtlety.
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 3,647
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Yes, I am aware that I am accusing somebody else for a lack of subtlety.

    An appalling lack of tripe.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,114
    edited June 23
    Taking the Fifth ,,, AGAIN.

    Back to 4 dimensional chess from Lord Mandelbrot. Just like old times.

    Does @BatteryCorrectHorse eat tripe? If so, can we have a recipe?

    (My @ menu offered me 4 different options for CHB, and none of them are the correct one.)
  • PedestrianRockPedestrianRock Posts: 580
    Afternoon all!

    Sunak vs Starmer on 26 June in head to head format.

    We all assume that pretty much nothing can save the Tories from defeat now - the question is the scale of it.

    Do we think that Sunak might go for the ‘stop the supermajority’ angle?

    We’ve seen cabinet members do it but seeing Sunak do it in a head to head would be quite something, so I doubt it?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,601
    FPT
    Sandpit said:

    Random question. Does anyone know why the Spanish national anthem is an instrumental piece, with no words?


    It is one of four national anthems that doesn't have any lyrics.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcha_Real
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479
    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    Reminding people of New Labour is not exactly a win, I would suggest.

    Next, Blair will pop up, saying we have to be prepared for an Iraqi attack in 45 minutes....
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    Curse of the New Thread
    mickydroy said:

    I have no real wish to see Sunak lose his seat, I feel he was dealt a poor hand, and the blame lies squarely at the door of Truss and Johnson, if as anticipated they get trounced at the election

    As Richi's time in Government (and Parliament and politics) winds down to its ignominious end, I wonder just how badly he has queered the pitch for future leaders of the party and Country

    Will they ever select another;

    Billionaire?

    Party? Yes.
    Country? Not if they can help it. Even at school he didn't want to mix with the Hoi polloi but the inability to relate to the common man is a definite negative.

    Tech-bro?

    Party? No. They need a politician, with a common touch. Not another spreadsheet geek. They didn't want him first time round, and gifting him the gig worked out badly.
    Country? Maybe

    Person of Colour?

    Party? Yes
    Country? Yes, although that may depend how many RefUK 'teal shirts' are marching

    Non-Christian?

    Party? Yes
    Country? Yes, although the exact flavour and fervour may be a factor

    Short-arse with shorter trousers

    Party? If they have to
    Country? Not if they can help it
  • No_Offence_AlanNo_Offence_Alan Posts: 4,513
    PedestrianRock said:

    Afternoon all!

    Sunak vs Starmer on 26 June in head to head format.

    We all assume that pretty much nothing can save the Tories from defeat now - the question is the scale of it.

    Do we think that Sunak might go for the ‘stop the supermajority’ angle?

    We’ve seen cabinet members do it but seeing Sunak do it in a head to head would be quite something, so I doubt it?

    The only thing that could save Sunak would be Starmer saying he will euthanise Larry The Cat if he gets into number 10.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,577
    Anabobazina said:

    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
    He is a fighter, not a quitter.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,846
    Anabobazina said:

    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
    1992. Labour ahead in the polls. Soap box. Sheffield. Tory victory. That's why Mandelson is cautious, and also why I do not believe Mandelson is an electoral wunderkind.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    Anabobazina said:

    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
    Is he though? He only had to beat a broken John Major.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,601
    MarqueeMark said:

    Anabobazina said:

    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
    Is he though? He only had to beat a broken John Major.
    He was the architect of Labour's 1987 general election campaign.

    Thatcher won a landslide.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,568
    "Romanian village set to become Nato's biggest airbase in Europe"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c977wggg4pgo
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895
    PedestrianRock said:

    Afternoon all!

    Sunak vs Starmer on 26 June in head to head format.

    We all assume that pretty much nothing can save the Tories from defeat now - the question is the scale of it.

    Do we think that Sunak might go for the ‘stop the supermajority’ angle?

    We’ve seen cabinet members do it but seeing Sunak do it in a head to head would be quite something, so I doubt it?

    "I have lost this election. You want me out. That's fine. I will resign the leadership on 5th July. So this isn't about me. Its about you. Do you want to give this man [points] a blank cheque? The ability to do all the things he wants to do but doesn't dare tell you about?"
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 3,647
    williamglenn said:

    Anabobazina said:

    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
    He is a fighter, not a quitter.
    Yeah, unlike William Glenn. I mean, the other William Glenn.
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 3,647
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    Anabobazina said:

    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
    1992. Labour ahead in the polls. Soap box. Sheffield. Tory victory. That's why Mandelson is cautious, and also why I do not believe Mandelson is an electoral wunderkind.
    Kinnock never thought Labour would win in 1992.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,782
    edited June 23
    Eabhal said:

    No_Offence_Alan said:

    PedestrianRock said:

    Afternoon all!

    Sunak vs Starmer on 26 June in head to head format.

    We all assume that pretty much nothing can save the Tories from defeat now - the question is the scale of it.

    Do we think that Sunak might go for the ‘stop the supermajority’ angle?

    We’ve seen cabinet members do it but seeing Sunak do it in a head to head would be quite something, so I doubt it?

    The only thing that could save Sunak would be Starmer saying he will euthanise Larry The Cat if he gets into number 10.
    Larry's the only Downing Street employee who didn't have a bet on 4th July.
    How do you know? I hear he will only eat salmon now.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,983
    MarqueeMark said:

    Reminding people of New Labour is not exactly a win, I would suggest.

    Next, Blair will pop up, saying we have to be prepared for an Iraqi attack in 45 minutes....

    Memories of New Labour have, I would suggest, become progressively rosier as the memories of the last 14 years have darkened.

    Outside the radical left and Tory loyalists I sense the “Blair = Iraq” equation is much less powerful than it was even 5 years ago.

    Things can only get better etc
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 3,647
    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,638
    kjh said:

    Eabhal said:

    No_Offence_Alan said:

    PedestrianRock said:

    Afternoon all!

    Sunak vs Starmer on 26 June in head to head format.

    We all assume that pretty much nothing can save the Tories from defeat now - the question is the scale of it.

    Do we think that Sunak might go for the ‘stop the supermajority’ angle?

    We’ve seen cabinet members do it but seeing Sunak do it in a head to head would be quite something, so I doubt it?

    The only thing that could save Sunak would be Starmer saying he will euthanise Larry The Cat if he gets into number 10.
    Larry's the only Downing Street employee who didn't have a bet on 4th July.
    How do you know? I hear he will only eat salmon now.
    You're supposed to place the bet in your wife's name, not the ****ing cat!

    Malcolm Tucker in the TTOI Christmas special
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,046
    Overconfidence is a legitimate concern, but you can go too far to protect against it, then it just looks silly.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,577
    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,615
    Interesting that Sunak is a spread bettor. I wonder what he got on Tory seats.

    https://x.com/carolvorders/status/1804622827884069318?t=-9qJbxZdt1B5GkuWzyol_g&s=19
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,228
    Is @TimS around? I have a question for @TimS

    Paris aside, on each of my recent visits to France - and I’ve been all over - Brittany, Normandy, Picardy, the Cevennes, Provence, Languedoc - I’ve been struck by the high quality of life. It’s not just the nicer weather - they have good health care, beautiful cities, agreeable food, excellent infrastructure, lots of holidays

    They must have one of the highest “qualities of life” in the world. And I’m not just comparing them with fucked up old Britain. They seem to have a superior quality of life to almost anyone in europe (or the world?)

    Yes they have problems - migration, crime, but still. Other countries have all that as well and often far worse

    Yet the French are so discontented they are voting in their millions for a woman who says France is on
    the brink of ruin and forget about my Nazi dad only I can save you

    WHY?
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 3,647
    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    The box isn't yet ticked.

    She could still have drawn a cock and balls...
  • PedestrianRockPedestrianRock Posts: 580
    RochdalePioneers said:

    PedestrianRock said:

    Afternoon all!

    Sunak vs Starmer on 26 June in head to head format.

    We all assume that pretty much nothing can save the Tories from defeat now - the question is the scale of it.

    Do we think that Sunak might go for the ‘stop the supermajority’ angle?

    We’ve seen cabinet members do it but seeing Sunak do it in a head to head would be quite something, so I doubt it?

    "I have lost this election. You want me out. That's fine. I will resign the leadership on 5th July. So this isn't about me. Its about you. Do you want to give this man [points] a blank cheque? The ability to do all the things he wants to do but doesn't dare tell you about?"
    It is perhaps a better strategy than whatever they are doing now. Though, maybe not outright conceding defeat - but talking about the long term political landscape.

  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,577
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    Labour were famous for manipulating the stats with things like preventing people from booking appointments in advance.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    Leon said:

    Is @TimS around? I have a question for @TimS

    Paris aside, on each of my recent visits to France - and I’ve been all over - Brittany, Normandy, Picardy, the Cevennes, Provence, Languedoc - I’ve been struck by the high quality of life. It’s not just the nicer weather - they have good health care, beautiful cities, agreeable food, excellent infrastructure, lots of holidays

    They must have one of the highest “qualities of life” in the world. And I’m not just comparing them with fucked up old Britain. They seem to have a superior quality of life to almost anyone in europe (or the world?)

    Yes they have problems - migration, crime, but still. Other countries have all that as well and often far worse

    Yet the French are so discontented they are voting in their millions for a woman who says France is on
    the brink of ruin and forget about my Nazi dad only I can save you

    WHY?

    And they have the Gaul to talk about "perfidious Albion".

    Puh!
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    Anabobazina said:

    squareroot2 said:

    There is always a stench when Mandleson is involved in anything.

    Mandelson is a class act. One of the finest political brains of the modern era.
    He is a fighter, not a quitter.
    Yeah, unlike William Glenn. I mean, the other William Glenn.
    Wrong. You are confusing William Glenn with William Glenn. Easily mistaken for William Glenn. Be careful out there.
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 3,647
    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    If the Tories had been in power, we'd have invaded Iraq too. Indeed, they voted for it in Parliament.

    Did you oppose the war at the time?
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,009
    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    Referring to his wife as "the wife" is not a good look.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,228
    Is it because the French know they’ve got it good and they are acting now to pre-empt stuff that might fuck it up?

    Is it just their revolutionary temperament?

    Is it that national morosity?

    Some hangover from napoleon?

    Too much cheese?
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,568
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    If the Tories had been in power, we'd have invaded Iraq too. Indeed, they voted for it in Parliament.

    Did you oppose the war at the time?
    "They voted for it" isn't good enough, since it was sold on a false prospectus. But yes, I suspect we'd have invaded under the tories.
  • DumbosaurusDumbosaurus Posts: 794
    Foxy said:

    Interesting that Sunak is a spread bettor. I wonder what he got on Tory seats.

    https://x.com/carolvorders/status/1804622827884069318?t=-9qJbxZdt1B5GkuWzyol_g&s=19

    Gotta be more than £30 a seat given he starts a grand down to Piers Morgan...
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    OMG! We have two days this week without football! And no Wimbledon to turn to either.

    Will we have to talk, you know - politics? Urgh...
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    If the Tories had been in power, we'd have invaded Iraq too. Indeed, they voted for it in Parliament.

    Did you oppose the war at the time?
    Yes. I was with Ken Clark.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,568
    MarqueeMark said:

    OMG! We have two days this week without football! And no Wimbledon to turn to either.

    Will we have to talk, you know - politics? Urgh...

    Queen's tennis final is on BBC right now.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    Foxy said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    The Tories supported the Iraq War.

    It was the LibDems who opposed it.
    IDS supported it.

    Ken Clark did not.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,542
    Anyway, it has stopped drizzling and I can return to delivering leaflets, rather than a handful of mush.

    Laters.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,577
    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    Referring to his wife as "the wife" is not a good look.
    He's liable to get it wrong if he goes for a more precise descriptor. She's lucky he didn't call her his husband.
  • Nunu5Nunu5 Posts: 964
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    That graph doesn't look too bad for the Tories.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,207
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    FPT

    Sandpit said:

    Random question. Does anyone know why the Spanish national anthem is an instrumental piece, with no words?


    It is one of four national anthems that doesn't have any lyrics.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcha_Real
    During the mad pendulum years that led to Franco, it kept having new fash/non fash lyrics with each regime change.

    Going wordless after 1978 was also very on-brand; "pact of forgetting" and all that.

    More recently, there have been attempts and competitions to find lyrics, but they've been awful. It's not easy for democracies to choose national symbols democratically; it's too self-referential.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,274
    RochdalePioneers said:

    PedestrianRock said:

    Afternoon all!

    Sunak vs Starmer on 26 June in head to head format.

    We all assume that pretty much nothing can save the Tories from defeat now - the question is the scale of it.

    Do we think that Sunak might go for the ‘stop the supermajority’ angle?

    We’ve seen cabinet members do it but seeing Sunak do it in a head to head would be quite something, so I doubt it?

    "I have lost this election. You want me out. That's fine. I will resign the leadership on 5th July. So this isn't about me. Its about you. Do you want to give this man [points] a blank cheque? The ability to do all the things he wants to do but doesn't dare tell you about?"
    If he says that I’d expect the Tories to get even less seats . Admitting you’ve lost already and then delivering that desperate attempt to look like he’s so worried about the poor British public will be met with derision.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    MarqueeMark said:

    Anyway, it has stopped drizzling and I can return to delivering leaflets, rather than a handful of mush.

    Laters.

    Drizzling? There isn't a cloud in the sky, and the sun beats down...
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 6,036
    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    Referring to his wife as "the wife" is not a good look.
    Oh come on, that’s tongue in cheek. The bit I would question is photographing a vote.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,678
    MarqueeMark said:

    Foxy said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    The Tories supported the Iraq War.

    It was the LibDems who opposed it.
    IDS supported it.

    Ken Clark did not.
    The Tories' problem is that they let IDS run things when it came to Brexit. Tricky to proclaim the bloke an idiot on one major issue but a seer on another.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,767
    Stark_Dawning said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foxy said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    The Tories supported the Iraq War.

    It was the LibDems who opposed it.
    IDS supported it.

    Ken Clark did not.
    The Tories' problem is that they let IDS run things when it came to Brexit. Tricky to proclaim the bloke an idiot on one major issue but a seer on another.
    It is, however, true of many people who are good on one subject that they are absolute blithering idiots on many others.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,601
    edited June 23
    Cookie said:

    Stark_Dawning said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foxy said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    The Tories supported the Iraq War.

    It was the LibDems who opposed it.
    IDS supported it.

    Ken Clark did not.
    The Tories' problem is that they let IDS run things when it came to Brexit. Tricky to proclaim the bloke an idiot on one major issue but a seer on another.
    It is, however, true of many people who are good on one subject that they are absolute blithering idiots on many others.
    See Lord Sumption as the perfect example.

    Superb jurist but terrible epidemiologist.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,678
    Cookie said:

    Stark_Dawning said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foxy said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    The Tories supported the Iraq War.

    It was the LibDems who opposed it.
    IDS supported it.

    Ken Clark did not.
    The Tories' problem is that they let IDS run things when it came to Brexit. Tricky to proclaim the bloke an idiot on one major issue but a seer on another.
    It is, however, true of many people who are good on one subject that they are absolute blithering idiots on many others.
    True, but I'd go with IDS being a blithering idiot over both Iraq and Brexit. That feels about right.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,808
    Cookie said:

    Stark_Dawning said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Foxy said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    Tell that to the hundreds of thousand dead and maimed Iraqis we helped cause.

    Whatever else you can lay at the door of this Government, nothing - and I mean NOTHING - will ever come close to that obscenity from your "greatest government".
    The Tories supported the Iraq War.

    It was the LibDems who opposed it.
    IDS supported it.

    Ken Clark did not.
    The Tories' problem is that they let IDS run things when it came to Brexit. Tricky to proclaim the bloke an idiot on one major issue but a seer on another.
    It is, however, true of many people who are good on one subject that they are absolute blithering idiots on many others.
    Its hardly surprising. You wouldn't take a surgeoun and put him in charge of designing aircraft or vice versa without any training or time to adjust. Yet we move minister from post to post almost on an annual basis somehow hoping they know it all.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    MarqueeMark said:

    Anyway, it has stopped drizzling and I can return to delivering leaflets, rather than a handful of mush.

    Laters.

    Don't worry about the soggy leaflets, no harm done. Nobody reads them anyway.

    I had an "Abolish the Senedd" party campaign leaflet. There was a nice picture of a red MK2 Jag on it. I didn't read it.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,615
    A bit of election Anecdata. Lots of cars and people helping Vaz out at his offices on Humberstone Rd, Webbes office looks deserted again.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,399
    Ugh. Mandelson.

    It's like he never left.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,361
    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    Well to the Tories credit they stopped and started to reverse that trend.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,585
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    How about number of NHS employees ?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    @BethRigby
    Betting scandal crisis deepens: Many more people than Tories already identified being investigated by gambling regulator re bets on election date. Watchdog widened inquiries to investigate whether people with inside knowledge may have asked third party to place bet

    https://x.com/BethRigby/status/1804870949063286791
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,361
    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    Labour were famous for manipulating the stats with things like preventing people from booking appointments in advance.
    That is just managing the metric. It’s not a good thing to do but you can understand why they did it. Probably because it’s a duff metric but the public wanted it. All businesses do it as well.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,808
    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Fake news, if they are talking about betting rather than their own wacky plans it is reducing the rate at which they plunge in the polls.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,926
    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    That’s not yet another person, that’s the chief data officer that was reported on yesterday or earlier today.
  • No_Offence_AlanNo_Offence_Alan Posts: 4,513
    Taz said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    Labour were famous for manipulating the stats with things like preventing people from booking appointments in advance.
    That is just managing the metric. It’s not a good thing to do but you can understand why they did it. Probably because it’s a duff metric but the public wanted it. All businesses do it as well.
    "Once a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure".
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,585
    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    Mr Brown said: "I will not allow house prices to get out of control and put at risk the sustainability of the future." He said he was determined that the UK should not return to the "instability, speculation and negative equity" of the 1980s and 1990s.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/special/politics97/budget97/live/housing.shtml

    Well we didn't have banks going bankrupt in the 1980s and 1990s.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,926
    Scott_xP said:

    @BethRigby
    Betting scandal crisis deepens: Many more people than Tories already identified being investigated by gambling regulator re bets on election date. Watchdog widened inquiries to investigate whether people with inside knowledge may have asked third party to place bet

    https://x.com/BethRigby/status/1804870949063286791

    Let me guess, they’ll leak a name a day until election day?
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,638
    edited June 23
    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    I'll visit you in prison. Make it Saughton, easier for me.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    No_Offence_Alan said:

    Taz said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    Labour were famous for manipulating the stats with things like preventing people from booking appointments in advance.
    That is just managing the metric. It’s not a good thing to do but you can understand why they did it. Probably because it’s a duff metric but the public wanted it. All businesses do it as well.
    "Once a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure".
    Absolutely. The classic example being the Soviet hospital targeted to reduce the number of patients dying on the wards, who took their patients out on trolleys into the street when the end looked near.

    There is almost always a proper way and an easier way to achieve any given target.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,096
    No_Offence_Alan said:

    Taz said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    Labour were famous for manipulating the stats with things like preventing people from booking appointments in advance.
    That is just managing the metric. It’s not a good thing to do but you can understand why they did it. Probably because it’s a duff metric but the public wanted it. All businesses do it as well.
    "Once a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure".
    Targets belong to archery imo.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,601
    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    I am expecting to be contacted.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,977
    RobD said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    That’s not yet another person, that’s the chief data officer that was reported on yesterday or earlier today.
    :)

    https://x.com/mocent0/status/1804877149075107894
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,114
    edited June 23
    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    Referring to his wife as "the wife" is not a good look.
    That seems a peculiar comment.

    It's just a normal expression.
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,456
    Foxy said:

    Interesting that Sunak is a spread bettor. I wonder what he got on Tory seats.

    https://x.com/carolvorders/status/1804622827884069318?t=-9qJbxZdt1B5GkuWzyol_g&s=19

    Maybe it's because of this, maybe it's the £1,000 wager with Piers Morgan, but I've heard lots of people talking about the possibility of Rishi having bet on the election date.

    There's no way he'd have been that stupid, but if it turns out that he's had any bets on finance or politics during his time at the Treasury or as PM, then it's going to look unbelievably bad for him.

    It seems unlikely, but then I'd have said the same about the three (or is it now four?) members of the Tory campaign team who've been caught betting on things that they were in a position to influence.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    I am expecting to be contacted.
    With your Tory connections, you are quite obviously guilty.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,577
    Scott_xP said:

    RobD said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    That’s not yet another person, that’s the chief data officer that was reported on yesterday or earlier today.
    :)

    https://x.com/mocent0/status/1804877149075107894
    They should have introduced corporate sponsorship to government:

    - The Border Agency - sponsored by RyanAir
    - The Electoral Commission - sponsored by PaddyPower
  • Nunu5Nunu5 Posts: 964
    No, there will not be a historic swing rightwards for trump with young people

    https://x.com/Taniel/status/1804876523444347350
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,601
    IanB2 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    I am expecting to be contacted.
    With your Tory connections, you are quite obviously guilty.
    A few members of the current members of the cabinet follow me on Twitter and I have the phone number of at least one member of the current cabinet.

    My defence will be I backed a July election going back to March and my bets on May 21st were following the news.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,651
    edited June 23
    MattW said:

    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    Referring to his wife as "the wife" is not a good look.
    That seems a peculiar comment.

    It's just a normal expression.
    No, it really isn't; it's derogatory, demeaning and very dated.

    Edit: In the context of the tweet, it's clearly meant to be humorous. I don't think he's got a career ahead of him as stand-up comic though.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,399
    Ugh. Mandelson.

    It's like he never left.
    Scott_xP said:

    @BethRigby
    Betting scandal crisis deepens: Many more people than Tories already identified being investigated by gambling regulator re bets on election date. Watchdog widened inquiries to investigate whether people with inside knowledge may have asked third party to place bet

    https://x.com/BethRigby/status/1804870949063286791

    Well, it's definitely not me as I had a flaming red next to June/July/August on the markets, and laid it more when the rumours were flying.

    I took Sunak at his word and assumed he wouldn't be psychotic enough to call an early election.
  • Nunu5Nunu5 Posts: 964
    RobD said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    That’s not yet another person, that’s the chief data officer that was reported on yesterday or earlier today.
    Yes, but he's no small fry.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,926
    Nunu5 said:

    RobD said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    That’s not yet another person, that’s the chief data officer that was reported on yesterday or earlier today.
    Yes, but he's no small fry.
    Indeed, i.e. should have known better.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,846
    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    I too like graphs. Shall we do waiting lists?
    Labour were famous for manipulating the stats with things like preventing people from booking appointments in advance.
    Cock-up, not conspiracy. Labour had not realised that sometimes people want appointments a long way in advance (eg stitches out; babies out) when it implemented its programme to have patients seen in two days. You will remember the programme where the audience tries to explain it to Tony Blair.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,577
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    I am expecting to be contacted.
    As an expert witness?
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,456
    biggles said:

    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    Referring to his wife as "the wife" is not a good look.
    Oh come on, that’s tongue in cheek. The bit I would question is photographing a vote.
    Does the 2d barcode at the bottom left encode the serial number? If so, her vote should surely be invalidated...
  • MisterBedfordshireMisterBedfordshire Posts: 2,252
    Not often that Peter's Mandelson and Hitchens agree on something.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,046
    I was reading the lastest short book by the person behind the Darth Putin account, and its interesting how in writing it he apparently had to approach things from a different direction.

    'How to Tankie' was written by an unreliable narrator from the viewpoint of someone from the far left. Individuals like that on Darth's timeline are often smug, arrogant, self-righteous know-it-all-know-nothing hypocrites whose views lead them into moral blackholes, but few of them seem to want to be Putin - they just want to let others be ruled or murdered by him.

    To write this book [the Darth Putin Guide to Master Strategy] I had instead to put myself into the shoes of a far right/alt-right type, as they seem to not only like Putin, but they also want to be like him.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,361
    Someone has used AI to create a Country and Western song about Hawk Tuah girl.

    https://x.com/tarabull808/status/1804270697218552267?s=61
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,046
    Casino_Royale said:

    Ugh. Mandelson.

    It's like he never left.

    There are not many people from the pre-2010 days still around and meaningfully active at a senior level to try to get back into relevance under a Starmer government, so the few that are will be heard from a lot.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,846
    another_richard said:

    williamglenn said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    The Labour Government of 1997 to 2010 is the greatest government this country has had since WW2.

    This graph says otherwise. Look at the dates.

    image
    Mr Brown said: "I will not allow house prices to get out of control and put at risk the sustainability of the future." He said he was determined that the UK should not return to the "instability, speculation and negative equity" of the 1980s and 1990s.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/special/politics97/budget97/live/housing.shtml

    Well we didn't have banks going bankrupt in the 1980s and 1990s.
    Nick Leeson just texted me and sayed it wasn't him who brought down BCCI or caused the small banks crisis.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,615
    edited June 23
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    IanB2 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    I am expecting to be contacted.
    With your Tory connections, you are quite obviously guilty.
    A few members of the current members of the cabinet follow me on Twitter and I have the phone number of at least one member of the current cabinet.

    My defence will be I backed a July election going back to March and my bets on May 21st were following the news.
    I am green on July, but only because I put a fair bit on Q3 expecting a September election, so in the right place for the wrong reason.
  • DumbosaurusDumbosaurus Posts: 794
    Casino_Royale said:

    Ugh. Mandelson.

    It's like he never left.

    Scott_xP said:

    @BethRigby
    Betting scandal crisis deepens: Many more people than Tories already identified being investigated by gambling regulator re bets on election date. Watchdog widened inquiries to investigate whether people with inside knowledge may have asked third party to place bet

    https://x.com/BethRigby/status/1804870949063286791

    Well, it's definitely not me as I had a flaming red next to June/July/August on the markets, and laid it more when the rumours were flying.

    I took Sunak at his word and assumed he wouldn't be psychotic enough to call an early election.
    He stuck to his word. 4th July is second half of the year :wink:

    I've no idea if I'll be investigated or not, I had bets on but they were placed on the 5th and 6th of October. If I am contacted, being squeaky clean and disliking the Gambling Commision, I will either ignore it or troll them.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,651
    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    Those who bet before 21st May will probably be fine; those who bet on 21st will probably face a fine:

    image
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,601
    williamglenn said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @PippaCrerar

    Senior Tory official becomes FOURTH party figure subject to gambling watchdog investigation…

    With reports of “many more” cases being looked at (though unclear yet if they have Tory links) election betting scandal now undermining party’s campaign…

    https://x.com/PippaCrerar/status/1804860626742690095

    Somewhere there will be a few innocent punters who just happened to put a few quid on July that same day, who will now get dragged into being suspects in this growing investigation!
    I am expecting to be contacted.
    As an expert witness?
    Undoubtedly.

    Although when asked I may blame it all on Lord Finklestein.

    There is one certainty in life, I would not do well in prison.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,808
    MattW said:

    SandyRentool said:

    williamglenn said:

    Very bizarre tweet from Jeremy Hunt:

    https://x.com/jeremy_hunt/status/1804849296799420592

    Referring to his wife as "the wife" is not a good look.
    That seems a peculiar comment.

    It's just a normal expression.
    Might be regional. Is normalish lots of places but generally a bit Partridge in my experience.
This discussion has been closed.