Ooft. I've made my prediction now, and I'm sticking to it, but the last few polls have been awful for the Tories.
There have been eight polls since the YouGov crossover poll. Labour have been up in three, down in three, unchanged in two. The Tories have been down in six and unchanged in two.
Yes and big drops with some pollsters. They need some 'improving' polling or I think sub 20% is becoming likely. I think 25% looks realistically best expectation if the pollsters are getting turnout right
Focaldata are like Deltapoll - only recording falls in Tory support during the campaign. 26, 25, 24 and now 21.
At this stage it looks like only Theresa May stands between Rishi Sunak and the worst election campaign in history.
I think we need @Anabobazina's view on this banking hub policy announcement. Lab's one builds on one from the Cons earlier in the year. Are we really saying that "bankless towns" is an issue out there?
Yes especially for people who are 55+ and so not used to doing complex things online.
The awkward bit is that many things will still be impossible because (for example) a big BACS transaction will require a secondary authorization that may not be possible in branch
You what? What age do you suppose a large chunk of the PB demographic is (clue: 55+). Are you really saying that such a vital part of PB's contributing force is unable to transfer money or, indeed, buy a Tesco's Meal Deal using the latest technology?
Perhaps 80+ and even then my 94-yr old mother has two banking apps on her phone and hasn't needed to go to a branch in years.
Some people like to interact with actual people rather than doing everything on computers/phones.
This is true. Eg I'll usually choose a manned checkout if the queue isn't too long. Little chinwag with the operative. It brightens their day.
Tories still 5% ahead of Reform and a clear second though. I agree however that the final Starmer v Sunak debate next week at 9pm on BBC1 is crucial for Rishi to close the gap with Labour before polling day
HYUFD: Tories are clear second, still time to close the gap with Labour.
Everybody else: Tories are fucked.
Brilliant HYUFD, truly indefatigable.
The run of polls since a like for like Tory increase is now at 42, that's way way beyond a statistical anomaly, it suggests a complete implosion of the campaign, the support, anyone coming back, anything. From 'can they get back to 30' they look shy of 20. I've never seen such a dreadful campaign, such a dearth of desire to help them out. They simply have nothing left to offer. They are laid bare and its an horrific sight.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Also TSE is normally sensible but in this post he's surely in the wrong?
if the Tories and Reform remain fractured and trying to outdo each other on an extreme right wing agenda then Labour will easily win a second term.
Not on a second term, Labour will almost definitely easily win a second term either way, but on the implication of it being bad for the Tories for there to be a fracture between Tories and Reform.
Worst possible news is if that "fracture" is "healed" and the Tories and Reform merge. Best news is if Reform-leading extremists bugger off and leave the Tories and the Tories can focus on regaining the centre-ground and becoming a big tent once more.
Just as the Corbynites fracturing and heading to the Greens was good news for Labour.
Afternoon, Bart. Have you decided how you are voting?
Lending my vote to the Labour Party.
Only party pledging more housing and reform of our planning system. Though they're not remotely going far enough for me, they at least are grasping what the problem is.
Still don't like Labour economics and I expect the party will do many things I dislike, but so does what I still consider to be own party in the Tories so I'm not voting for them this year.
You are thus in big trouble with HY. Do you really want to be accused of being an apologist for socialism over the next 27 years?
Bart also voted for New Labour in 2001 when Tory loyalists like me were campaigning for Hague as I am now campaigning still for Sunak's Tories, voting Labour is not an entirely new thing for him
HYUFD voted Remain, which itself makes his Toryness highly suspect!
Ooft. I've made my prediction now, and I'm sticking to it, but the last few polls have been awful for the Tories.
There have been eight polls since the YouGov crossover poll. Labour have been up in three, down in three, unchanged in two. The Tories have been down in six and unchanged in two.
Yes and big drops with some pollsters. They need some 'improving' polling or I think sub 20% is becoming likely. I think 25% looks realistically best expectation if the pollsters are getting turnout right
Focaldata are like Deltapoll - only recording falls in Tory support during the campaign. 26, 25, 24 and now 21.
At this stage it looks like only Theresa May stands between Rishi Sunak and the worst election campaign in history.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Er... that's 'and' not 'or'. Logic 101 fail there TSE (and the Torygraph obvs).
Bring it on - those like me who do not work for a living currently pay a lower proportion of their income in taxes than those who earn the same amount working. That cannot be right.
Whatever way you cut it though it looks like a Thrift Tax - those who've 'saved for a rainy day' get clobbered while the feckless get protected. Rishi's speech writes itself:
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Er... that's 'and' not 'or'. Logic 101 fail there TSE (and the Torygraph obvs).
Bring it on - those like me who do not work for a living currently pay a lower proportion of their income in taxes than those who earn the same amount working. That cannot be right.
Whatever way you cut it though it looks like a Thrift Tax - those who've 'saved for a rainy day' get clobbered while the feckless get protected. Rishi's speech writes itself:
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
How many people max out their ISA allowances? How many would notice if the maximum were halved to 10k a year, for example?
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Every once in a while the mask slips and I don't really like what I see. Its certainly not something Blair or Mandelson said or thought.
I was raised by parents who believed that debt (other than a mortgage) was the eighth deadliest sin, I cannot help be a saver.
Isn't there a story about an old newspaper proprietor not knowing what a mortgage was, and being horrified to discover most of his staff were heavily in debt?
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Er... that's 'and' not 'or'. Logic 101 fail there TSE (and the Torygraph obvs).
Bring it on - those like me who do not work for a living currently pay a lower proportion of their income in taxes than those who earn the same amount working. That cannot be right.
Whatever way you cut it though it looks like a Thrift Tax - those who've 'saved for a rainy day' get clobbered while the feckless get protected. Rishi's speech writes itself:
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
How many people max out their ISA allowances? How many would notice if the maximum were halved to 10k a year, for example?
The top ISA allowance is a funny one. If it is just a bone thrown to the idle rich, cut it. But if it is genuinely intended to encourage saving over expenditure then it has to be pitched at that sort of level to grab the well-paid middle classes who have paid off the mortgage and would otherwise spend £10,000 or more on an exotic holiday or new car.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Er... that's 'and' not 'or'. Logic 101 fail there TSE (and the Torygraph obvs).
Bring it on - those like me who do not work for a living currently pay a lower proportion of their income in taxes than those who earn the same amount working. That cannot be right.
Whatever way you cut it though it looks like a Thrift Tax - those who've 'saved for a rainy day' get clobbered while the feckless get protected. Rishi's speech writes itself:
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
How many people max out their ISA allowances? How many would notice if the maximum were halved to 10k a year, for example?
Too late. The time to phase out ISAs was when cash ISAs were paying 0.2% gross.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Er... that's 'and' not 'or'. Logic 101 fail there TSE (and the Torygraph obvs).
Bring it on - those like me who do not work for a living currently pay a lower proportion of their income in taxes than those who earn the same amount working. That cannot be right.
Whatever way you cut it though it looks like a Thrift Tax - those who've 'saved for a rainy day' get clobbered while the feckless get protected. Rishi's speech writes itself:
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
How many people max out their ISA allowances? How many would notice if the maximum were halved to 10k a year, for example?
The top ISA allowance is a funny one. If it is just a bone thrown to the idle rich, cut it. But if it is genuinely intended to encourage saving over expenditure then it has to be pitched at that sort of level to grab the well-paid middle classes who have paid off the mortgage and would otherwise spend £10,000 or more on an exotic holiday or new car.
If Starmer plans to raise taxes for rich idlers rather than working people, that sounds fine by me.
I find it strange how everybody bar none says "Labour will have to raise taxes" but then shouts "not those taxes", whatever they may be.
I'm not an idler.
Well technically I am at the moment whilst I recover from surgery but normally I am not an idler.
So he won't raise taxes on your work, as you're a worker, not an idler. You're allowed a bit of sick leave. But don't take the piss.
I'm on full salary whilst I idle, during the Euros, T20 world cup, and the general election campaign, life is AWESOME, I hope Sir Keir doesn't ruin it for me.
Also TSE is normally sensible but in this post he's surely in the wrong?
if the Tories and Reform remain fractured and trying to outdo each other on an extreme right wing agenda then Labour will easily win a second term.
Not on a second term, Labour will almost definitely easily win a second term either way, but on the implication of it being bad for the Tories for there to be a fracture between Tories and Reform.
Worst possible news is if that "fracture" is "healed" and the Tories and Reform merge. Best news is if Reform-leading extremists bugger off and leave the Tories and the Tories can focus on regaining the centre-ground and becoming a big tent once more.
Just as the Corbynites fracturing and heading to the Greens was good news for Labour.
Afternoon, Bart. Have you decided how you are voting?
Lending my vote to the Labour Party.
Only party pledging more housing and reform of our planning system. Though they're not remotely going far enough for me, they at least are grasping what the problem is.
Still don't like Labour economics and I expect the party will do many things I dislike, but so does what I still consider to be own party in the Tories so I'm not voting for them this year.
What's this "lending" business? You can't have it back, you know.
Of course I can, at the next election I get it back to vote for whomever I choose to vote for next time.
Well everyone is 'lending' their vote in that sense. I thought you might be planning to ask for it back the next day.
If Starmer plans to raise taxes for rich idlers rather than working people, that sounds fine by me.
I find it strange how everybody bar none says "Labour will have to raise taxes" but then shouts "not those taxes", whatever they may be.
I'm not an idler.
Well technically I am at the moment whilst I recover from surgery but normally I am not an idler.
So he won't raise taxes on your work, as you're a worker, not an idler. You're allowed a bit of sick leave. But don't take the piss.
I'm on full salary whilst I idle, during the Euros, T20 world cup, and the general election campaign, life is AWESOME, I hope Sir Keir doesn't ruin it for me.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
As reported by that unbiased beacon of TRUTH … The Daily Telegraph
Given its apparent lying and insi9nuating about satellites in Wales, I don't hold much more faith in the insinuations of this new story, though others evidently have infinitely more faith than I do.
I think we need @Anabobazina's view on this banking hub policy announcement. Lab's one builds on one from the Cons earlier in the year. Are we really saying that "bankless towns" is an issue out there?
Yes especially for people who are 55+ and so not used to doing complex things online.
The awkward bit is that many things will still be impossible because (for example) a big BACS transaction will require a secondary authorization that may not be possible in branch
You what? What age do you suppose a large chunk of the PB demographic is (clue: 55+). Are you really saying that such a vital part of PB's contributing force is unable to transfer money or, indeed, buy a Tesco's Meal Deal using the latest technology?
Perhaps 80+ and even then my 94-yr old mother has two banking apps on her phone and hasn't needed to go to a branch in years.
Some people like to interact with actual people rather than doing everything on computers/phones.
This is true. Eg I'll usually choose a manned checkout
If Starmer plans to raise taxes for rich idlers rather than working people, that sounds fine by me.
I find it strange how everybody bar none says "Labour will have to raise taxes" but then shouts "not those taxes", whatever they may be.
I'm not an idler.
Well technically I am at the moment whilst I recover from surgery but normally I am not an idler.
So he won't raise taxes on your work, as you're a worker, not an idler. You're allowed a bit of sick leave. But don't take the piss.
I'm on full salary whilst I idle, during the Euros, T20 world cup, and the general election campaign, life is AWESOME, I hope Sir Keir doesn't ruin it for me.
The best is being put on gardening leave. Have had one where I was made to work three months of my notice and then booted out for three months fully paid and two six month periods all covering the summer.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
As reported by that unbiased beacon of TRUTH … The Daily Telegraph
Given its apparent lying about drones in Wales, I don't hold much more faith in the insinuations of this new story, though others evidently have infinitely more faith than I do.
How about the Guardian?
Starmer declines to commit to council tax not going up under Labour Starmer refuses to say council tax will not go up under Labour.
But he says none of Labour’s plans require tax rises, above those announced.
Ferrari says he has ruled out putting up taxes like income tax and VAT. So, if he is not ruling out council tax going up, people will assume it is.
He asks what Starmer means by a working person, when he says he does not want to put up taxes for working people. Is Simon Cowell a working person?
Starmer says he is thinking of people who cannot afford just to write a cheque when they have an unexpected cost, and who rely on public services.
The person I have in my mind when I say working people is people who earn their living, rely on our services, and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Er... that's 'and' not 'or'. Logic 101 fail there TSE (and the Torygraph obvs).
Bring it on - those like me who do not work for a living currently pay a lower proportion of their income in taxes than those who earn the same amount working. That cannot be right.
Whatever way you cut it though it looks like a Thrift Tax - those who've 'saved for a rainy day' get clobbered while the feckless get protected. Rishi's speech writes itself:
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
How many people max out their ISA allowances? How many would notice if the maximum were halved to 10k a year, for example?
Sort of thing thta happens when one gets a windfall and doesn't want to spend it all - inheritance, redundancy, a downsizing house sale, and so on. Perhaps commonest is retirement. But other reasons include legal compensation.
One can easily envisage someone in that position needing several years to shift savings to an ISA.
Ooft. I've made my prediction now, and I'm sticking to it, but the last few polls have been awful for the Tories.
There have been eight polls since the YouGov crossover poll. Labour have been up in three, down in three, unchanged in two. The Tories have been down in six and unchanged in two.
Yes and big drops with some pollsters. They need some 'improving' polling or I think sub 20% is becoming likely. I think 25% looks realistically best expectation if the pollsters are getting turnout right
Focaldata are like Deltapoll - only recording falls in Tory support during the campaign. 26, 25, 24 and now 21.
At this stage it looks like only Theresa May stands between Rishi Sunak and the worst election campaign in history.
Ooft. I've made my prediction now, and I'm sticking to it, but the last few polls have been awful for the Tories.
There have been eight polls since the YouGov crossover poll. Labour have been up in three, down in three, unchanged in two. The Tories have been down in six and unchanged in two.
Yes and big drops with some pollsters. They need some 'improving' polling or I think sub 20% is becoming likely. I think 25% looks realistically best expectation if the pollsters are getting turnout right
Focaldata are like Deltapoll - only recording falls in Tory support during the campaign. 26, 25, 24 and now 21.
At this stage it looks like only Theresa May stands between Rishi Sunak and the worst election campaign in history.
Also TSE is normally sensible but in this post he's surely in the wrong?
if the Tories and Reform remain fractured and trying to outdo each other on an extreme right wing agenda then Labour will easily win a second term.
Not on a second term, Labour will almost definitely easily win a second term either way, but on the implication of it being bad for the Tories for there to be a fracture between Tories and Reform.
Worst possible news is if that "fracture" is "healed" and the Tories and Reform merge. Best news is if Reform-leading extremists bugger off and leave the Tories and the Tories can focus on regaining the centre-ground and becoming a big tent once more.
Just as the Corbynites fracturing and heading to the Greens was good news for Labour.
Afternoon, Bart. Have you decided how you are voting?
Lending my vote to the Labour Party.
Only party pledging more housing and reform of our planning system. Though they're not remotely going far enough for me, they at least are grasping what the problem is.
Still don't like Labour economics and I expect the party will do many things I dislike, but so does what I still consider to be own party in the Tories so I'm not voting for them this year.
What's this "lending" business? You can't have it back, you know.
Hang on, we get it back after (at most) five years, don't we?
Although without interest and somewhat devalued given population inflation
No, that's a different one. This one you will never see again. If it's Labour it stays that way for all eternity. I just wanted to make sure Bart realized this*. I'm a Red through and through but we don't want to be getting votes under false pretences.
* Edit: I've seen his reply now and it appears he does.
Oh! How do I 'change' my vote then, if it's a brand spanking new one at each election and the old one is set forever?
Exactly. You can't. It's irrevocable. This, btw, is why I'm so concerned about Leon's malicious threats to vote Labour. If he were to do that it sits there forever, spoiling everything.
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
As reported by that unbiased beacon of TRUTH … The Daily Telegraph
Given its apparent lying about drones in Wales, I don't hold much more faith in the insinuations of this new story, though others evidently have infinitely more faith than I do.
How about the Guardian?
Starmer declines to commit to council tax not going up under Labour Starmer refuses to say council tax will not go up under Labour.
But he says none of Labour’s plans require tax rises, above those announced.
Ferrari says he has ruled out putting up taxes like income tax and VAT. So, if he is not ruling out council tax going up, people will assume it is.
He asks what Starmer means by a working person, when he says he does not want to put up taxes for working people. Is Simon Cowell a working person?
Starmer says he is thinking of people who cannot afford just to write a cheque when they have an unexpected cost, and who rely on public services.
The person I have in my mind when I say working people is people who earn their living, rely on our services, and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Only for racist fascists. Farage is just an egotistical twat, like his friend Trump, and co-defendant for destroyer of the Conservative Party, Boris Buffoon Johnson. There will be gullible muppets who fall for his nonsense, but they are generally fools who believe in aliens and conspiracy theories about AI (the latter of which they do not understand)
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
Er... that's 'and' not 'or'. Logic 101 fail there TSE (and the Torygraph obvs).
Bring it on - those like me who do not work for a living currently pay a lower proportion of their income in taxes than those who earn the same amount working. That cannot be right.
Whatever way you cut it though it looks like a Thrift Tax - those who've 'saved for a rainy day' get clobbered while the feckless get protected. Rishi's speech writes itself:
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
We really are not.
Everybody knows taxes will rise whoever forms the next government. The Tories pledges on taxes are hollower than a balloon, given their record.
If Starmer plans to raise taxes for rich idlers rather than working people, that sounds fine by me.
I find it strange how everybody bar none says "Labour will have to raise taxes" but then shouts "not those taxes", whatever they may be.
I'm not an idler.
Well technically I am at the moment whilst I recover from surgery but normally I am not an idler.
So he won't raise taxes on your work, as you're a worker, not an idler. You're allowed a bit of sick leave. But don't take the piss.
I'm on full salary whilst I idle, during the Euros, T20 world cup, and the general election campaign, life is AWESOME, I hope Sir Keir doesn't ruin it for me.
The best is being put on gardening leave. Have had one where I was made to work three months of my notice and then booted out for three months fully paid and two six month periods all covering the summer.
Also TSE is normally sensible but in this post he's surely in the wrong?
if the Tories and Reform remain fractured and trying to outdo each other on an extreme right wing agenda then Labour will easily win a second term.
Not on a second term, Labour will almost definitely easily win a second term either way, but on the implication of it being bad for the Tories for there to be a fracture between Tories and Reform.
Worst possible news is if that "fracture" is "healed" and the Tories and Reform merge. Best news is if Reform-leading extremists bugger off and leave the Tories and the Tories can focus on regaining the centre-ground and becoming a big tent once more.
Just as the Corbynites fracturing and heading to the Greens was good news for Labour.
Afternoon, Bart. Have you decided how you are voting?
Lending my vote to the Labour Party.
Only party pledging more housing and reform of our planning system. Though they're not remotely going far enough for me, they at least are grasping what the problem is.
Still don't like Labour economics and I expect the party will do many things I dislike, but so does what I still consider to be own party in the Tories so I'm not voting for them this year.
What's this "lending" business? You can't have it back, you know.
Hang on, we get it back after (at most) five years, don't we?
Although without interest and somewhat devalued given population inflation
No, that's a different one. This one you will never see again. If it's Labour it stays that way for all eternity. I just wanted to make sure Bart realized this*. I'm a Red through and through but we don't want to be getting votes under false pretences.
* Edit: I've seen his reply now and it appears he does.
Wait, so you are saying @HYUFD isn't getting his Plaid vote back.
I am. He is Plaid, just as Bart is BXP. Those votes live on.
I don't believe for one second that a significant number of Tory MPs will join Reform after the election.
For the first thing, that would require there to be a significant number of Tory MPs after the election.
Well played.
In all seriousness I don't think it the most likely scenario, but I think it's possible.
I think it more likely that if the Tories are sub 100 seats that a leadership candidate advocating merger with Reform could emerge, off the threat of MPs jumping ship.
I think this is true, and was the point of my header the other day, that that's why the Conservative brand has to be Ratnered in the election, so Farage or Tory-Farage can't build off it.
The more it is Ratnered the more Farage can take over as leader of the right of centre in this country
Sir Keir Starmer has opened the door to tax rises for millions of Britons by defining a working person as someone who relies on public services and doesn’t have savings.
The Labour leader has repeatedly ruled out putting up taxes on what he calls “working people” who he says have borne the brunt of the cost of living crisis.
Asked what he meant by the term, he said it refers to “people who earn their living, rely on our services and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble”.
His definition means millions of Britons including pensioners, savers, and those who use private services like healthcare may not be covered by his tax rise pledge.
As reported by that unbiased beacon of TRUTH … The Daily Telegraph
Are you saying that Starmer did not classify "working people" in this way?
I must say I was intrigued by the lawyerly usage of "working people" as a regularly used phrase. I thought it might be a dog whistle to class obsessed socialists on the left. Now we know that it is the electoral equivalent of "I did not have sexual relations...."
I don't believe for one second that a significant number of Tory MPs will join Reform after the election.
For the first thing, that would require there to be a significant number of Tory MPs after the election.
Well played.
In all seriousness I don't think it the most likely scenario, but I think it's possible.
I think it more likely that if the Tories are sub 100 seats that a leadership candidate advocating merger with Reform could emerge, off the threat of MPs jumping ship.
I think this is true, and was the point of my header the other day, that that's why the Conservative brand has to be Ratnered in the election, so Farage or Tory-Farage can't build off it.
The more it is Ratnered the more Farage can take over as leader of the right of centre in this country
Are you happy for a fascist to take over a party that you are committed to?
Also TSE is normally sensible but in this post he's surely in the wrong?
if the Tories and Reform remain fractured and trying to outdo each other on an extreme right wing agenda then Labour will easily win a second term.
Not on a second term, Labour will almost definitely easily win a second term either way, but on the implication of it being bad for the Tories for there to be a fracture between Tories and Reform.
Worst possible news is if that "fracture" is "healed" and the Tories and Reform merge. Best news is if Reform-leading extremists bugger off and leave the Tories and the Tories can focus on regaining the centre-ground and becoming a big tent once more.
Just as the Corbynites fracturing and heading to the Greens was good news for Labour.
Afternoon, Bart. Have you decided how you are voting?
Lending my vote to the Labour Party.
Only party pledging more housing and reform of our planning system. Though they're not remotely going far enough for me, they at least are grasping what the problem is.
Still don't like Labour economics and I expect the party will do many things I dislike, but so does what I still consider to be own party in the Tories so I'm not voting for them this year.
What's this "lending" business? You can't have it back, you know.
Hang on, we get it back after (at most) five years, don't we?
Although without interest and somewhat devalued given population inflation
No, that's a different one. This one you will never see again. If it's Labour it stays that way for all eternity. I just wanted to make sure Bart realized this*. I'm a Red through and through but we don't want to be getting votes under false pretences.
* Edit: I've seen his reply now and it appears he does.
Wait, so you are saying @HYUFD isn't getting his Plaid vote back.
I am. He is Plaid, just as Bart is BXP. Those votes live on.
He's not getting his Brexit vote back either, poor chap. At least not for a year or three.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Only for racist fascists. Farage is just an egotistical twat, like his friend Trump, and co-defendant for destroyer of the Conservative Party, Boris Buffoon Johnson. There will be gullible muppets who fall for his nonsense, but they are generally fools who believe in aliens and conspiracy theories about AI (the latter of which they do not understand)
i don't actually want Farage to run the country, I think he is a divisive and often unsavoury character, albeit one gifted with charisma and great political cunning. I am also certain he'd be a dreadful PM. I am merely making a prediction. The Tories, by moving so far to the Left - highest taxes since the war, highest migration in history - have opened up an enormous gap in British politics. We can see from Europe and America that these gaps get filled, politics abhors a vacuum, and the hard right is in the ascendant everywhere
Labour are likely to fail, because their recipe will be more wokeness, more taxes, more migration, and it's not gonna be popular (after an initial honeymoon)
The populist right will then benefit. It might not be Farage that personally leads this, he is knocking on already and will be 65 at the next GE. But someone will come along
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
I don't believe for one second that a significant number of Tory MPs will join Reform after the election.
For the first thing, that would require there to be a significant number of Tory MPs after the election.
Well played.
In all seriousness I don't think it the most likely scenario, but I think it's possible.
I think it more likely that if the Tories are sub 100 seats that a leadership candidate advocating merger with Reform could emerge, off the threat of MPs jumping ship.
I think this is true, and was the point of my header the other day, that that's why the Conservative brand has to be Ratnered in the election, so Farage or Tory-Farage can't build off it.
The more it is Ratnered the more Farage can take over as leader of the right of centre in this country
Are you happy for a fascist to take over a party that you are committed to?
He's not a Fascist, this is ludicrous hyperbole. Farage may well be a twat and something of a demagogue, but a fascist? Please
In living memory Europe suffered from actual fascists, you insult those memories with this piffle
I don't believe for one second that a significant number of Tory MPs will join Reform after the election.
For the first thing, that would require there to be a significant number of Tory MPs after the election.
Well played.
In all seriousness I don't think it the most likely scenario, but I think it's possible.
I think it more likely that if the Tories are sub 100 seats that a leadership candidate advocating merger with Reform could emerge, off the threat of MPs jumping ship.
I think this is true, and was the point of my header the other day, that that's why the Conservative brand has to be Ratnered in the election, so Farage or Tory-Farage can't build off it.
The more it is Ratnered the more Farage can take over as leader of the right of centre in this country
He can be leader - if it's Ratnered, no one will vote for it, just like no one shopped in Ratner's and it had to be shut down. The centre right can come back with a new name - just like Ratner's did.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Only for racist fascists. Farage is just an egotistical twat, like his friend Trump, and co-defendant for destroyer of the Conservative Party, Boris Buffoon Johnson. There will be gullible muppets who fall for his nonsense, but they are generally fools who believe in aliens and conspiracy theories about AI (the latter of which they do not understand)
i don't actually want Farage to run the country, I think he is a divisive and often unsavoury character, albeit one gifted with charisma and great political cunning. I am also certain he'd be a dreadful PM. I am merely making a prediction. The Tories, by moving so far to the Left - highest taxes since the war, highest migration in history - have opened up an enormous gap in British politics. We can see from Europe and America that these gaps get filled, politics abhors a vacuum, and the hard right is in the ascendant everywhere
Labour are likely to fail, because their recipe will be more wokeness, more taxes, more migration, and it's not gonna be popular (after an initial honeymoon)
The populist right will then benefit. It might not be Farage that personally leads this, he is knocking on already and will be 65 at the next GE. But someone will come along
You, and the rest of the country seem to have forgotten that the taxes that are currently so high are in large part due to the expenditure of the pandemic combined with the stupidity of Brexit. I don't know whether you argued against the former but you certainly endorsed the latter. To suggest Rishi Sunak is of the left is ludicrous.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
It is obviously going to be easier if you could let us know whose opinion of you you do care about then you don't have to spell it out each time to each poster.
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
You cared enough to respond, which is at least detectable. Unlike a scintilla of an iota of a pico whatever-it-was.
I think we need @Anabobazina's view on this banking hub policy announcement. Lab's one builds on one from the Cons earlier in the year. Are we really saying that "bankless towns" is an issue out there?
Yes especially for people who are 55+ and so not used to doing complex things online.
The awkward bit is that many things will still be impossible because (for example) a big BACS transaction will require a secondary authorization that may not be possible in branch
You what? What age do you suppose a large chunk of the PB demographic is (clue: 55+). Are you really saying that such a vital part of PB's contributing force is unable to transfer money or, indeed, buy a Tesco's Meal Deal using the latest technology?
Perhaps 80+ and even then my 94-yr old mother has two banking apps on her phone and hasn't needed to go to a branch in years.
Some people like to interact with actual people rather than doing everything on computers/phones.
This is true. Eg I'll usually choose a manned checkout
staffed
Womaned, in fact, usually. But not always. I'd say 80/20 at our big Tesco.
If the polling doesn't start to turn, yes. It's one way traffic for 2 weeks solid
No it isn't. Opinion polls have shown a gentle narrowing of the Lab lead. When Electoral calculus first started the expected majority was 308. It is now 272 (14 June) and the recent More in Common poll baxtered would put Lab's majority at 204.
No one's doubting a Lab landslide but the direction of travel isn't one of a growing landslide.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
Hmmm...far from strengthening your assertion, these intensifiers actually weaken it, partly because they smack of bluster and desperation, but also because they suggest, quite wrongly I'm sure, that your denial of fuck-giving is relative rather than absolute.
I don't believe for one second that a significant number of Tory MPs will join Reform after the election.
For the first thing, that would require there to be a significant number of Tory MPs after the election.
Well played.
In all seriousness I don't think it the most likely scenario, but I think it's possible.
I think it more likely that if the Tories are sub 100 seats that a leadership candidate advocating merger with Reform could emerge, off the threat of MPs jumping ship.
I think this is true, and was the point of my header the other day, that that's why the Conservative brand has to be Ratnered in the election, so Farage or Tory-Farage can't build off it.
The more it is Ratnered the more Farage can take over as leader of the right of centre in this country
Are you happy for a fascist to take over a party that you are committed to?
He's not a Fascist, this is ludicrous hyperbole. Farage may well be a twat and something of a demagogue, but a fascist? Please
In living memory Europe suffered from actual fascists, you insult those memories with this piffle
Nonsense, it is a very accurate description. You also seem to confuse Spanish and Italian fascism with Naziism, the former of which are similar to the small brain nationalism that Farage espouses .You are probably so far off to the right that you don't consider him extreme. He has endorsed Trump. He admires Putin. Alan Sked founder of UKIP has described his racism and even as a schoolboy his housemaster of his independent school described him as a fascist. He is a modern day fascist. No hyperbole, just informed judgement. Just because he wears a tweed jacket instead of a blackshirt doesn't let him off the hook.
- YouGov polls seem to cut through more than other polls. National newspapers publish them front page, Sky News has published them, they often get a lot of retweets, etc. - YouGov’s last poll was on June 13th. - But YouGov’s last MRP projection is dated ‘May 24 to June 1’ https://yougov.co.uk/elections/uk/2024 - The previous MRP came before D-Day gate, before Farage comeback, before the debates… and it shows LAB 422 CON 140 LD 48 and REFUK 0 - We are surely overdue another YouGov MRP. When it comes out, the cut through will make a lot more people aware of what seismic result may be coming - even if, for example, YouGov may be too bullish on Reform. - This could also have some strange effects, e.g. more Tory MPs openly saying “We will lose but keep us in opposition please” like Shapps hinted at, or openly calling for a REFUK merger post election like Suella did. Who knows what the snowball effect could do to seat totals?
Peak capacity (or indeed peak demand) isn't really an issue if we go 100% renewables, with sufficient storage. And batteries are getting closer to the level of being price competitive for bulk storage, without subsidy.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
It is obviously going to be easier if you could let us know whose opinion of you you do care about then you don't have to spell it out each time to each poster.
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
That;s actually an interesting question. Whose opinion matters to me. It would have to be PB-ers whose intellect I respect, and/or who can ban me
He was asked in that infamous press conference if there was anyone else involved who we didn't know about, and didn't answer it, so it's always been clear that someone else other than the three we know about got away with it.
If the polling doesn't start to turn, yes. It's one way traffic for 2 weeks solid
No it isn't. Opinion polls have shown a gentle narrowing of the Lab lead. When Electoral calculus first started the expected majority was 308. It is now 272 (14 June) and the recent More in Common poll baxtered would put Lab's majority at 204.
No one's doubting a Lab landslide but the direction of travel isn't one of a growing landslide.
But it is of a declining Tory vote share. Down to levels making holding seats very difficult due to 'numbers'
If the polling doesn't start to turn, yes. It's one way traffic for 2 weeks solid
No it isn't. Opinion polls have shown a gentle narrowing of the Lab lead. When Electoral calculus first started the expected majority was 308. It is now 272 (14 June) and the recent More in Common poll baxtered would put Lab's majority at 204.
No one's doubting a Lab landslide but the direction of travel isn't one of a growing landslide.
That's not a convincing analysis. The latest More in Common has a 16 point Labour lead, identical to their last poll before the election was called. But it has LAB and CON both -2, with LDM +2 and RFM +3. You'd expect those poll changes to result in fewer Tory seats, with more LDM gains.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
It is obviously going to be easier if you could let us know whose opinion of you you do care about then you don't have to spell it out each time to each poster.
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
That;s actually an interesting question. Whose opinion matters to me. It would have to be PB-ers whose intellect I respect, and/or who can ban me
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
It is obviously going to be easier if you could let us know whose opinion of you you do care about then you don't have to spell it out each time to each poster.
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
That;s actually an interesting question. Whose opinion matters to me. It would have to be PB-ers whose intellect I respect, and/or who can ban me
And @Peter_the_Punter because I've met him and he's a genuinely nice guy
I see you missed me off your love list. Is it because I write more elegantly than you and your ego can not admit it, or is just that I so often highlight your intellectual inadequacies around matters relating to science and general logic?
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
Hmmm...far from strengthening your assertion, these intensifiers actually weaken it, partly because they smack of bluster and desperation, but also because they suggest, quite wrongly I'm sure, that your denial of fuck-giving is relative rather than absolute.
I'll try one more time. This is not a coping mechanism. I genuinely fear- and fear is the right word - that Labour are gonna fuck up badly - and then we are headed for Le Pen-land. I may not spend much time in Britain these days, but I have fam and friends here permanently, and I'd rather this didn't happen. But the Tories have so monumentally wasted their 14 years in power, and the worldwide trend is what it is, and that's my prediction. Let's hope it's more at the What3Words end of the accuracy spectrum than lab leak, Covid, Nordstream and The Necklace
And now, I must hie me to M&S to buy me some noodles. Manana
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Lol
Sounds like you've got a choice
Either continue living in your make believe Or face reality
If you choose the former just don't expect anyone to take you seriously on here, if they do anyway. But I bet you can find a more sympathetic community online somewhere. Based in Texas perhaps? Or Moscow? Or failing that you can always masturbate over an AI generated doll.
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
It is obviously going to be easier if you could let us know whose opinion of you you do care about then you don't have to spell it out each time to each poster.
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
That;s actually an interesting question. Whose opinion matters to me. It would have to be PB-ers whose intellect I respect, and/or who can ban me
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
It is obviously going to be easier if you could let us know whose opinion of you you do care about then you don't have to spell it out each time to each poster.
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
That;s actually an interesting question. Whose opinion matters to me. It would have to be PB-ers whose intellect I respect, and/or who can ban me
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Only for racist fascists. Farage is just an egotistical twat, like his friend Trump, and co-defendant for destroyer of the Conservative Party, Boris Buffoon Johnson. There will be gullible muppets who fall for his nonsense, but they are generally fools who believe in aliens and conspiracy theories about AI (the latter of which they do not understand)
i don't actually want Farage to run the country, I think he is a divisive and often unsavoury character, albeit one gifted with charisma and great political cunning. I am also certain he'd be a dreadful PM. I am merely making a prediction. The Tories, by moving so far to the Left - highest taxes since the war, highest migration in history - have opened up an enormous gap in British politics. We can see from Europe and America that these gaps get filled, politics abhors a vacuum, and the hard right is in the ascendant everywhere
Labour are likely to fail, because their recipe will be more wokeness, more taxes, more migration, and it's not gonna be popular (after an initial honeymoon)
The populist right will then benefit. It might not be Farage that personally leads this, he is knocking on already and will be 65 at the next GE. But someone will come along
You, and the rest of the country seem to have forgotten that the taxes that are currently so high are in large part due to the expenditure of the pandemic combined with the stupidity of Brexit. I don't know whether you argued against the former but you certainly endorsed the latter. To suggest Rishi Sunak is of the left is ludicrous.
Yes, this 'Tories are left wing because taxes are up' really is a bucket of nonsense. The pandemic required huge spending and soon as that went away big energy subsidies were needed because of Putin. We couldn't borrow all of that so taxes had to rise.
I don't believe for one second that a significant number of Tory MPs will join Reform after the election.
For the first thing, that would require there to be a significant number of Tory MPs after the election.
Well played.
In all seriousness I don't think it the most likely scenario, but I think it's possible.
I think it more likely that if the Tories are sub 100 seats that a leadership candidate advocating merger with Reform could emerge, off the threat of MPs jumping ship.
I think this is true, and was the point of my header the other day, that that's why the Conservative brand has to be Ratnered in the election, so Farage or Tory-Farage can't build off it.
The more it is Ratnered the more Farage can take over as leader of the right of centre in this country
He can be leader - if it's Ratnered, no one will vote for it, just like no one shopped in Ratner's and it had to be shut down. The centre right can come back with a new name - just like Ratner's did.
Even today's Focaldata has 37% voting for the Tories and ReformUK combined, just 6% behind Labour on 43% and miles ahead of the LDs on 10% and Greens on 5% and SNP on 2%.
Once Starmer likely becomes PM voters will want a choice not an echo from the LDs and if the Tories can't provide it as a functioning main opposition then Farage will ensure he will
There's no need for confusion on the tax question. Labour will raise ALL taxes, they won't have any choice
Everyone knows that, the size of their majority depends upon which ones they admit they are planning to raise.
Labour are gonna end up hated, really quite quickly
After that, Farage beckons
Ah so this is an interesting (!) self-help strategy to cope with the prospect of a landslide Labour government - convince yourself it will lead to the triumph of the Hard Right.
You can read it as you wish, I don't give a tiny scintilla of an iota of a soupcon of an atomic nano-fuck how you perceive me
It is obviously going to be easier if you could let us know whose opinion of you you do care about then you don't have to spell it out each time to each poster.
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
That;s actually an interesting question. Whose opinion matters to me. It would have to be PB-ers whose intellect I respect, and/or who can ban me
He was asked in that infamous press conference if there was anyone else involved who we didn't know about, and didn't answer it, so it's always been clear that someone else other than the three we know about got away with it.
My presumption they all knew and it was at the behest of the bowlers. Same as when Pakistan were ball tampering, I highly doubt it was one or two rogue players to get the ball into a state to reverse swing. And obviously Atherton just accidentally had his pockets weighed down with dirt like he was in Great Escape and nobody else noticed.
Comments
At this stage it looks like only Theresa May stands between Rishi Sunak and the worst election campaign in history.
I find it strange how everybody bar none says "Labour will have to raise taxes" but then shouts "not those taxes", whatever they may be.
I warn you not to have savings. I warn you not get a mortgage. I warn you not to have a pension, an ISA or a cheque book.
Sir Keir needs to clarify this and sharpish. We're in Theresa's 'Dementia Tax' territory here.
Well technically I am at the moment whilst I recover from surgery but normally I am not an idler.
I don’t know what percentile I belong to income and wealth wise, but I do know I am unlikely ever to need to check what the CGT rate is.
Ok, all is clear now.
Raise the rates
Align with income tax (so that's raised the rates)
Extend the scope. Limit/eliminate any reliefs
Reduce the allowance
Lots of ideas for Rachel and her team to work on through the summer ready for Special Financial Statement Sept 2024
After that, Farage beckons
Starmer declines to commit to council tax not going up under Labour
Starmer refuses to say council tax will not go up under Labour.
But he says none of Labour’s plans require tax rises, above those announced.
Ferrari says he has ruled out putting up taxes like income tax and VAT. So, if he is not ruling out council tax going up, people will assume it is.
He asks what Starmer means by a working person, when he says he does not want to put up taxes for working people. Is Simon Cowell a working person?
Starmer says he is thinking of people who cannot afford just to write a cheque when they have an unexpected cost, and who rely on public services.
The person I have in my mind when I say working people is people who earn their living, rely on our services, and don’t really have the ability to write a cheque when they get into trouble.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2024/jun/18/labour-conservatives-tories-general-election-keir-starmer-rishi-sunak-politics-live?page=with:block-667131558f08b9304b8399f9&filterKeyEvents=false#liveblog-navigation
One can easily envisage someone in that position needing several years to shift savings to an ISA.
Over to you, Rishi
Not so much damage limitation as desperation
Love this guy's YouTube videos on language.
"'Time' in Different Cultures
Simon Roper"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BoblZjqqjgk
I am only player to take 'flak' for ball-tampering - Warner
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/articles/c3gg0q8w0wwo
Everybody knows taxes will rise whoever forms the next government. The Tories pledges on taxes are hollower than a balloon, given their record.
I must say I was intrigued by the lawyerly usage of "working people" as a regularly used phrase. I thought it might be a dog whistle to class obsessed socialists on the left. Now we know that it is the electoral equivalent of "I did not have sexual relations...."
Labour are likely to fail, because their recipe will be more wokeness, more taxes, more migration, and it's not gonna be popular (after an initial honeymoon)
The populist right will then benefit. It might not be Farage that personally leads this, he is knocking on already and will be 65 at the next GE. But someone will come along
In living memory Europe suffered from actual fascists, you insult those memories with this piffle
I'll help you to get the process going.
You really, really care what I think of you and a strenuous denial will simply be proof that you are super affected by my opinion of you.
Understand: The UK Election: 7. What can polling predict? 14 mins, see https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m00208ct
Unlike a scintilla of an iota of a pico whatever-it-was.
No one's doubting a Lab landslide but the direction of travel isn't one of a growing landslide.
- YouGov polls seem to cut through more than other polls. National newspapers publish them front page, Sky News has published them, they often get a lot of retweets, etc.
- YouGov’s last poll was on June 13th.
- But YouGov’s last MRP projection is dated ‘May 24 to June 1’ https://yougov.co.uk/elections/uk/2024
- The previous MRP came before D-Day gate, before Farage comeback, before the debates… and it shows LAB 422 CON 140 LD 48 and REFUK 0
- We are surely overdue another YouGov MRP. When it comes out, the cut through will make a lot more people aware of what seismic result may be coming - even if, for example, YouGov may be too bullish on Reform.
- This could also have some strange effects, e.g. more Tory MPs openly saying “We will lose but keep us in opposition please” like Shapps hinted at, or openly calling for a REFUK merger post election like Suella did. Who knows what the snowball effect could do to seat totals?
Dirt Cheap Batteries Enable Megawatt-Scale Charging Without Big Grid Upgrades Right Away
https://cleantechnica.com/2024/05/19/dirt-cheap-batteries-enable-megawatt-scale-charging-without-big-grid-upgrades-right-away/
Peak capacity (or indeed peak demand) isn't really an issue if we go 100% renewables, with sufficient storage.
And batteries are getting closer to the level of being price competitive for bulk storage, without subsidy.
I forecast a resurrection of one nation Tories before Nigel LePen becomes Prime Minister.
This is England after all, not some Western European banana republic.
So that's RCS and TSE
After that
@Richard_Nabavi
@IshmaelZ
(now sadly gone)
Sometimes @Gardenwalker and @FrancisUrquhart and a couple of others (I'll spare their blushes)
And @Peter_the_Punter because I've met him and he's a genuinely nice guy
And now, I must hie me to M&S to buy me some noodles. Manana
Sounds like you've got a choice
Either continue living in your make believe
Or
face reality
If you choose the former just don't expect anyone to take you seriously on here, if they do anyway. But I bet you can find a more sympathetic community online somewhere. Based in Texas perhaps? Or Moscow? Or failing that you can always masturbate over an AI generated doll.
@Nigel_Farage
Reform paid a vetting company £144k to carry out candidate checks. Not a single piece of work was delivered.
Colin Bloom has links to the Tory party & has very serious questions to answer.
Lawyers have been instructed. We do not rule out police action."
https://x.com/Nigel_Farage/status/1803023561939882366
He doesn’t have the depth or the warmth to be one.
Once Starmer likely becomes PM voters will want a choice not an echo from the LDs and if the Tories can't provide it as a functioning main opposition then Farage will ensure he will
Trump’s Conviction Was Supposed to Boost His Popularity. It Hasn’t.
https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/trump-conviction-polls/