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The Eurovision open thread – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,733
edited May 11 in General
imageThe Eurovision open thread – politicalbetting.com

Since the voting system changed I haven’t bet heavily on Eurovision other than to occasionally lay Le Royaume-Uni. I cannot see any value on current prices but I will enjoy the annual bit of European unity and cultural enrichment.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,766
    On the eve of her husband’s criminal trial for sex offences in July 2020, Natalie Elphicke arrived at the parliamentary office of Robert Buckland, who as lord chancellor and justice secretary was responsible for upholding the rule of law.

    Elphicke had secured the meeting through Sir Mark Spencer, the Conservative Party chief whip. She assured him she did not wish to discuss the plight of her partner, Charlie, whom she had recently succeeded as MP for Dover and whose innocence she had spent years publicly protesting even as several women made claims of sexual assault to the police. She wished to discuss only some general concerns about the justice system.

    The opposite was true.

    Immediately after entering Buckland’s room on the ministerial corridor, she turned to the topic of her husband: the man who, in a newspaper article three years earlier, she had described as a victim of “injustice heaped upon injustice” having been “thrown to the wolves”.

    To the shock of those present, Elphicke, 53, lobbied Buckland to interfere in the upcoming hearing of the case. She told him she felt it was unfair that his case was the first to be heard at Southwark crown court after lockdown and that was being overseen by Lady Justice Whipple, who, as presiding judge of the southeastern circuit, was one of the most senior judges in the land.

    Her comments were interpreted by one person in the room as an attempt to have the case moved to a lower-profile court to spare her husband public scrutiny. Another saw it as an effort to replace Whipple, who Elphicke apparently felt would be overly-strict. It is claimed that she spoke with an air of entitlement and as though Buckland should intervene to stop him being “singled out”.

    Buckland immediately objected, insisting the conversation could go no further, and declined to help. He feared it would be “outrageous” for him to interfere with the administration of justice by helping a fellow Conservative MP or her husband, also a former colleague. A key constitutional doctrine is that there should be a separation of powers between the principal institutions of state — including parliament and the judiciary.

    The MP for South Swindon said today: “She was told in no uncertain terms that it would have been completely inappropriate to speak to the judge about the trial at all.”

    A Labour Party spokesman said: “Natalie Elphicke totally rejects that characterisation of the meeting. If Robert Buckland had any genuine concerns about the meeting, then he should have raised them at the time, rather than making claims to the newspapers now Natalie has chosen to join the Labour Party.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natalie-elphicke-lobbied-lord-chancellor-husband-charlie-kv68bvd7f
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857
    Watching this is the closest I'll get to going on a Gay Pride march without actually going on a Gay Pride march.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,700
    I'm not particularly interested in it.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,766

    Watching this is the closest I'll get to going on a Gay Pride march without actually going on a Gay Pride march.

    You should go on gay pride marches, you'd love it.

    I've been going to them since I was 19, the music is awesome, the dancing even better. The booze is cheap.

    I even ended up with my own fag hags as I was seen as an ally of the LGBT community.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857
    Can someone please explain the new voting system to me?
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,889
    Vote early, vote often:

    https://eurovision.tv/app
  • Options
    WillGWillG Posts: 2,179

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,472

    I'm not particularly interested in it.

    Good evening

    I would rather watch paint dry
  • Options
    WillGWillG Posts: 2,179

    I'm not particularly interested in it.

    Good evening

    I would rather watch paint dry
    I want a real Brexit where we no longer have to be involved.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,766
    edited May 11
    Anyhoo, I am not joking, but I have been told the genuine reason why Natalie Elphicke defected.

    She's trying to get planning permission to convert a garage into flats that she owns in her constituency but locals have objected to her plans.

    The Labour run council can overrule the local objections so defecting to Labour she thinks they will support one of their own.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    Watching this is the closest I'll get to going on a Gay Pride march without actually going on a Gay Pride march.

    You should go on gay pride marches, you'd love it.

    I've been going to them since I was 19, the music is awesome, the dancing even better. The booze is cheap.

    I even ended up with my own fag hags as I was seen as an ally of the LGBT community.
    I once went to a gay club for the music, and had my bottom-pinched all night.

    I had a difficult job explaining all-night I wasn't gay, and the vibe was a bit off as a result.
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,460

    I'm not particularly interested in it.

    Thanks. One likes to be kept abreast of these developments.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    Can someone please explain the new voting system to me?

    It's not as good as the alternative vote system.
    I walked into that one, didn't I.
  • Options
    megasaurmegasaur Posts: 272

    On the eve of her husband’s criminal trial for sex offences in July 2020, Natalie Elphicke arrived at the parliamentary office of Robert Buckland, who as lord chancellor and justice secretary was responsible for upholding the rule of law.

    Elphicke had secured the meeting through Sir Mark Spencer, the Conservative Party chief whip. She assured him she did not wish to discuss the plight of her partner, Charlie, whom she had recently succeeded as MP for Dover and whose innocence she had spent years publicly protesting even as several women made claims of sexual assault to the police. She wished to discuss only some general concerns about the justice system.

    The opposite was true.

    Immediately after entering Buckland’s room on the ministerial corridor, she turned to the topic of her husband: the man who, in a newspaper article three years earlier, she had described as a victim of “injustice heaped upon injustice” having been “thrown to the wolves”.

    To the shock of those present, Elphicke, 53, lobbied Buckland to interfere in the upcoming hearing of the case. She told him she felt it was unfair that his case was the first to be heard at Southwark crown court after lockdown and that was being overseen by Lady Justice Whipple, who, as presiding judge of the southeastern circuit, was one of the most senior judges in the land.

    Her comments were interpreted by one person in the room as an attempt to have the case moved to a lower-profile court to spare her husband public scrutiny. Another saw it as an effort to replace Whipple, who Elphicke apparently felt would be overly-strict. It is claimed that she spoke with an air of entitlement and as though Buckland should intervene to stop him being “singled out”.

    Buckland immediately objected, insisting the conversation could go no further, and declined to help. He feared it would be “outrageous” for him to interfere with the administration of justice by helping a fellow Conservative MP or her husband, also a former colleague. A key constitutional doctrine is that there should be a separation of powers between the principal institutions of state — including parliament and the judiciary.

    The MP for South Swindon said today: “She was told in no uncertain terms that it would have been completely inappropriate to speak to the judge about the trial at all.”

    A Labour Party spokesman said: “Natalie Elphicke totally rejects that characterisation of the meeting. If Robert Buckland had any genuine concerns about the meeting, then he should have raised them at the time, rather than making claims to the newspapers now Natalie has chosen to join the Labour Party.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natalie-elphicke-lobbied-lord-chancellor-husband-charlie-kv68bvd7f

    A Lady Justice Whipple who is overly strict sounds like all my BDSM Christmases come at once
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636
    Loving the 0.5m cube of solid beige that is the PC on the stage there doing some background stuff or other.

    Good times!!
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 7,593
    Can I just say to all of you watching Eurovision this evening or attending a party........
    Maaaaaaaaate
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636

    Anyhoo, I am not joking, but I have been told the genuine reason why Natalie Elphicke defected.

    She's trying to get planning permission to convert a garage into flats that she owns in her constituency but locals have objected to her plans.

    The Labour run council can overrule the local objections so defecting to Labour she thinks they will support one of their own.

    I have said from the minute this happened that this was a really shit idea from Starmer.

    WTF was he thinking?

    Mail are claiming it is all down to Sue Gray but I can't read the paywalled detail of that story.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636
    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857
    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,472
    edited May 11

    Anyhoo, I am not joking, but I have been told the genuine reason why Natalie Elphicke defected.

    She's trying to get planning permission to convert a garage into flats that she owns in her constituency but locals have objected to her plans.

    The Labour run council can overrule the local objections so defecting to Labour she thinks they will support one of their own.

    I have said from the minute this happened that this was a really shit idea from Starmer.

    WTF was he thinking?

    Mail are claiming it is all down to Sue Gray but I can't read the paywalled detail of that story.
    I would suggest Labour are very welcome to her, especially if this becomes the story
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636

    Watching this is the closest I'll get to going on a Gay Pride march without actually going on a Gay Pride march.

    You should go on gay pride marches, you'd love it.

    I've been going to them since I was 19, the music is awesome, the dancing even better. The booze is cheap.

    I even ended up with my own fag hags as I was seen as an ally of the LGBT community.
    How come the booze is cheap?
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,766

    Watching this is the closest I'll get to going on a Gay Pride march without actually going on a Gay Pride march.

    You should go on gay pride marches, you'd love it.

    I've been going to them since I was 19, the music is awesome, the dancing even better. The booze is cheap.

    I even ended up with my own fag hags as I was seen as an ally of the LGBT community.
    How come the booze is cheap?
    They have pride offers, every hour is happy hour.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,544
    edited May 11
    Don't forget to vote for your favourite nation. Don't worry about the song.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636
    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 27,219

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    Obviously a Prof Thrasher fan.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636

    Watching this is the closest I'll get to going on a Gay Pride march without actually going on a Gay Pride march.

    You should go on gay pride marches, you'd love it.

    I've been going to them since I was 19, the music is awesome, the dancing even better. The booze is cheap.

    I even ended up with my own fag hags as I was seen as an ally of the LGBT community.
    How come the booze is cheap?
    They have pride offers, every hour is happy hour.
    "It's happy hour again, and again, and again"
  • Options
    FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 3,931

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646
    Everyone knows the UK's finest entry is Scooch (2007):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT6yOIC6ihI
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,732

    Anyhoo, I am not joking, but I have been told the genuine reason why Natalie Elphicke defected.

    She's trying to get planning permission to convert a garage into flats that she owns in her constituency but locals have objected to her plans.

    The Labour run council can overrule the local objections so defecting to Labour she thinks they will support one of their own.

    I have said from the minute this happened that this was a really shit idea from Starmer.

    WTF was he thinking?

    Mail are claiming it is all down to Sue Gray but I can't read the paywalled detail of that story.
    I would suggest Labour are very welcome to her, especially if this becomes the story
    How many of the last ten anti-Labour stories the Mail has run have turned into actual stories?
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646

    Can someone please explain the new voting system to me?

    It's not as good as the alternative vote system.
    The same AV that was rejected by UK voters by 68% to 32%? That AV?
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 27,219

    Don't forget to vote for your favourite nation. Don't worry about the song.

    Does that mean the UK was a popular country in 1976, 1981 and 1997
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646
    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Celine Dion.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,985

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    To counter - Brotherhood of Man.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1Lp3QFFvJE
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646
    I am ready, man! Ready to get it on!
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636

    Can I just say to all of you watching Eurovision this evening or attending a party........
    Maaaaaaaaate

    Moderator.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,954

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Celine Dion.
    Thank you for proving the point with an example.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,733

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Israel is drawn 5 and generally the early slots do badly as by the end, after people have listened to all of them in order to make a voting decision, they have forgotten the early songs. The new early voting might help here.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,227
    MattW said:

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    To counter - Brotherhood of Man.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1Lp3QFFvJE
    I'm noit entirely sure that's a counter-example, tbh
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Celine Dion.
    Thank you for proving the point with an example.
    Sir Cliff.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636
    Going well so far.

    LOL
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646

    Going well so far.

    LOL

    Fixed the sound - so far!
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 7,593

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,227
    viewcode said:

    MattW said:

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    To counter - Brotherhood of Man.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1Lp3QFFvJE
    I'm noit entirely sure that's a counter-example, tbh
    This, however, would be a counter-counter-example

    https://youtu.be/hRDQmsfHpEI?si=eWWqgjbkYPVhEEOE&t=24
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,535
    Outstanding start. Bjorn Skiffs - can't believe I haven't heard of him.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 7,593

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Celine Dion.
    She knows that the heart does go on. The wise old Canuck
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have a feeling that the UK was always their biggest sales market. I could be wrong. LOL
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636
    I am on Serbia for £2.

    DYOR.

  • Options
    megasaurmegasaur Posts: 272

    I am ready, man! Ready to get it on!

    It won't make any difference
  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,740
    edited May 11

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    I don't suppose it will but the Elphicke mistake could stay being a story for a bit, and the longer it is around, the bigger this completely unforced error becomes. It is very surprising really. The two million Tory voters he needs are not voting Tory because of people like Elphicke.

    10 more mistakes like that, a bit of bad luck, stick Burgon on the front bench, SNP recover a bit, Tories release a few choice stories and some media rally round Sunak. It could all change to the point where Labour only win an extra 100 seats.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 7,593

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have a feeling that the UK was always their biggest sales market. I could be wrong. LOL
    We normally get to the party late and say we'd been there since the first canapés
  • Options
    WillGWillG Posts: 2,179

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    Ditzy kitch eurotrash.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,544
    Andy_JS said:

    Don't forget to vote for your favourite nation. Don't worry about the song.

    Does that mean the UK was a popular country in 1976, 1981 and 1997
    No it's a modern phenomenon except for when Franco stole the win from Cliff. Congratulations General!

    Love Shine a Light was the greatest winning song since Waterloo! Kimberley Rew is a vastly underrated songwriter.
  • Options
    megasaurmegasaur Posts: 272

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have always thought that Rasputin by Boney M left Waterloo in the dust when it came to preposterously silly history based songs.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have a feeling that the UK was always their biggest sales market. I could be wrong. LOL
    We normally get to the party late and say we'd been there since the first canapés
    Hold on - ABBA won when the UK hosted the competition.

  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,636
    algarkirk said:

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    I don't suppose it will but the Elphicke mistake could stay being a story for a bit, and the longer it is around, the bigger this completely unforced error becomes. It is very surprising really. The two million Tory voters he needs are not voting Tory because of people like Elphicke.

    10 more mistakes like that, a bit of bad luck, stick Burgon on the front bench, SNP recover a bit, Tories release a few choice stories and some media rally round Sunak. It could all change to the point where Labour only win an extra 100 seats.
    IMHO it is by far Starmer's biggest unforced error.

    I guess it all sounded fantastic in a sweaty room with shit coffee late in the evening talking it all through.

    But it is a crap decision.

    There is no gain imho whatsoever.

  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 7,593

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have a feeling that the UK was always their biggest sales market. I could be wrong. LOL
    We normally get to the party late and say we'd been there since the first canapés
    Hold on - ABBA won when the UK hosted the competition.

    This is a truthful statement, yes
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    Why wouldn't they coalesce around Croatia as the favourite?
  • Options
    Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 31,058

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    She's right of course. It could. But it won't, no matter how much she might wish for it.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,118

    On the eve of her husband’s criminal trial for sex offences in July 2020, Natalie Elphicke arrived at the parliamentary office of Robert Buckland, who as lord chancellor and justice secretary was responsible for upholding the rule of law.

    Elphicke had secured the meeting through Sir Mark Spencer, the Conservative Party chief whip. She assured him she did not wish to discuss the plight of her partner, Charlie, whom she had recently succeeded as MP for Dover and whose innocence she had spent years publicly protesting even as several women made claims of sexual assault to the police. She wished to discuss only some general concerns about the justice system.

    The opposite was true.

    Immediately after entering Buckland’s room on the ministerial corridor, she turned to the topic of her husband: the man who, in a newspaper article three years earlier, she had described as a victim of “injustice heaped upon injustice” having been “thrown to the wolves”.

    To the shock of those present, Elphicke, 53, lobbied Buckland to interfere in the upcoming hearing of the case. She told him she felt it was unfair that his case was the first to be heard at Southwark crown court after lockdown and that was being overseen by Lady Justice Whipple, who, as presiding judge of the southeastern circuit, was one of the most senior judges in the land.

    Her comments were interpreted by one person in the room as an attempt to have the case moved to a lower-profile court to spare her husband public scrutiny. Another saw it as an effort to replace Whipple, who Elphicke apparently felt would be overly-strict. It is claimed that she spoke with an air of entitlement and as though Buckland should intervene to stop him being “singled out”.

    Buckland immediately objected, insisting the conversation could go no further, and declined to help. He feared it would be “outrageous” for him to interfere with the administration of justice by helping a fellow Conservative MP or her husband, also a former colleague. A key constitutional doctrine is that there should be a separation of powers between the principal institutions of state — including parliament and the judiciary.

    The MP for South Swindon said today: “She was told in no uncertain terms that it would have been completely inappropriate to speak to the judge about the trial at all.”

    A Labour Party spokesman said: “Natalie Elphicke totally rejects that characterisation of the meeting. If Robert Buckland had any genuine concerns about the meeting, then he should have raised them at the time, rather than making claims to the newspapers now Natalie has chosen to join the Labour Party.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natalie-elphicke-lobbied-lord-chancellor-husband-charlie-kv68bvd7f

    Seems a bit petty, and too nakedly self interested of the Tories to only leak this story now
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    algarkirk said:

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    I don't suppose it will but the Elphicke mistake could stay being a story for a bit, and the longer it is around, the bigger this completely unforced error becomes. It is very surprising really. The two million Tory voters he needs are not voting Tory because of people like Elphicke.

    10 more mistakes like that, a bit of bad luck, stick Burgon on the front bench, SNP recover a bit, Tories release a few choice stories and some media rally round Sunak. It could all change to the point where Labour only win an extra 100 seats.
    IMHO it is by far Starmer's biggest unforced error.

    I guess it all sounded fantastic in a sweaty room with shit coffee late in the evening talking it all through.

    But it is a crap decision.

    There is no gain imho whatsoever.

    Maybe it takes a Tory to spot what a brilliant move it is.

    I think it's his best yet. He's entirely disingenuous of course but also ruthless.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 7,593

    algarkirk said:

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    I don't suppose it will but the Elphicke mistake could stay being a story for a bit, and the longer it is around, the bigger this completely unforced error becomes. It is very surprising really. The two million Tory voters he needs are not voting Tory because of people like Elphicke.

    10 more mistakes like that, a bit of bad luck, stick Burgon on the front bench, SNP recover a bit, Tories release a few choice stories and some media rally round Sunak. It could all change to the point where Labour only win an extra 100 seats.
    IMHO it is by far Starmer's biggest unforced error.

    I guess it all sounded fantastic in a sweaty room with shit coffee late in the evening talking it all through.

    But it is a crap decision.

    There is no gain imho whatsoever.

    Strict no returns policy needs enforcing
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,733
    algarkirk said:

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    I don't suppose it will but the Elphicke mistake could stay being a story for a bit, and the longer it is around, the bigger this completely unforced error becomes. It is very surprising really. The two million Tory voters he needs are not voting Tory because of people like Elphicke.

    10 more mistakes like that, a bit of bad luck, stick Burgon on the front bench, SNP recover a bit, Tories release a few choice stories and some media rally round Sunak. It could all change to the point where Labour only win an extra 100 seats.
    Elphicke is reminiscent of Gordon Brown inviting Mrs Thatcher for tea. An unforced error probably inspired by Lord Mandelson. It alienates Labour supporters and does not attract, as you say, moderate Tories.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,889
    The tide continues to turn:

    The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) has rewritten advice suggesting misgendering your partner or refusing them money for gender surgery constitutes domestic abuse.

    The CPS has ditched and redrafted the advice for prosecutors after criticism from women’s campaigners who claimed it was “detrimental to women’s trust and confidence” in the service.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/05/10/misgendering-your-partner-is-not-domestic-abuse-says-cps/
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    gettingbettergettingbetter Posts: 484

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

    Me too. I'm stopping now as I have done 4k and the wife will be stressed if she finds out I stand to lose 16k.
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,544

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    She's right of course. It could. But it won't, no matter how much she might wish for it.
    We've finally got a partisan editorial stance from the BBC. It was inevitable after CeeGeebies have been allowed to shill for a political party/ cause without real sanction.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

    Me too. I'm stopping now as I have done 4k and the wife will be stressed if she finds out I stand to lose 16k.
    Jesus. I only play with my pecker, not the bank.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,047
    Lots of vote ramping on the net so anything could happen. I have Italy for top 5 eq it has been very popular on streaming platforms.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,472

    Anyhoo, I am not joking, but I have been told the genuine reason why Natalie Elphicke defected.

    She's trying to get planning permission to convert a garage into flats that she owns in her constituency but locals have objected to her plans.

    The Labour run council can overrule the local objections so defecting to Labour she thinks they will support one of their own.

    I have said from the minute this happened that this was a really shit idea from Starmer.

    WTF was he thinking?

    Mail are claiming it is all down to Sue Gray but I can't read the paywalled detail of that story.
    I would suggest Labour are very welcome to her, especially if this becomes the story
    How many of the last ten anti-Labour stories the Mail has run have turned into actual stories?
    I didn't see it in the mail to be fair
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,544

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

    Me too. I'm stopping now as I have done 4k and the wife will be stressed if she finds out I stand to lose 16k.
    That's hardcore for something as subjective as Eurovision, particularly as form and quality don't count for ****.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

    Me too. I'm stopping now as I have done 4k and the wife will be stressed if she finds out I stand to lose 16k.
    That's hardcore for something as subjective as Eurovision, particularly as form and quality don't count for ****.
    It's stressing me out and I'm not even part of his family.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,227

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

    Me too. I'm stopping now as I have done 4k and the wife will be stressed if she finds out I stand to lose 16k.
    Well, good luck. Quick check: can you cover the loss?
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,684
    £3 for 20 votes for Israel. I've spent £3 on a lot worse stuff... I think it's 60 votes from this household, two UK numbers and one Swiss phone number.
  • Options
    The_WoodpeckerThe_Woodpecker Posts: 405

    algarkirk said:

    Give it rest Laura...


    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    What could go wrong for Keir Starmer? A lot! Last week’s success in the local elections doesn’t mean it’s a done deal 👇🏼

    I don't suppose it will but the Elphicke mistake could stay being a story for a bit, and the longer it is around, the bigger this completely unforced error becomes. It is very surprising really. The two million Tory voters he needs are not voting Tory because of people like Elphicke.

    10 more mistakes like that, a bit of bad luck, stick Burgon on the front bench, SNP recover a bit, Tories release a few choice stories and some media rally round Sunak. It could all change to the point where Labour only win an extra 100 seats.
    Elphicke is reminiscent of Gordon Brown inviting Mrs Thatcher for tea. An unforced error probably inspired by Lord Mandelson. It alienates Labour supporters and does not attract, as you say, moderate Tories.
    I agree it alienates Labour supporters BUT it undercuts Rishi's small boats policy too.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646
    megasaur said:

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have always thought that Rasputin by Boney M left Waterloo in the dust when it came to preposterously silly history based songs.
    OH, those Russians!
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857
    Luxembourg not awful. Particularly since it's not Juncker on stage tonight.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,646
    Israel!
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,635
    edited May 11

    megasaur said:

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have always thought that Rasputin by Boney M left Waterloo in the dust when it came to preposterously silly history based songs.
    OH, those Russians!
    Shame the Russians didn't have Freddie Mercury's band.

    Then their fans would be 'lover of Russian Queen.'
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,535

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    That's why I'm on them. I wish I'd done the 66 though. By the time I thought about it they were 5.
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    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,732
    isam said:

    On the eve of her husband’s criminal trial for sex offences in July 2020, Natalie Elphicke arrived at the parliamentary office of Robert Buckland, who as lord chancellor and justice secretary was responsible for upholding the rule of law.

    Elphicke had secured the meeting through Sir Mark Spencer, the Conservative Party chief whip. She assured him she did not wish to discuss the plight of her partner, Charlie, whom she had recently succeeded as MP for Dover and whose innocence she had spent years publicly protesting even as several women made claims of sexual assault to the police. She wished to discuss only some general concerns about the justice system.

    The opposite was true.

    Immediately after entering Buckland’s room on the ministerial corridor, she turned to the topic of her husband: the man who, in a newspaper article three years earlier, she had described as a victim of “injustice heaped upon injustice” having been “thrown to the wolves”.

    To the shock of those present, Elphicke, 53, lobbied Buckland to interfere in the upcoming hearing of the case. She told him she felt it was unfair that his case was the first to be heard at Southwark crown court after lockdown and that was being overseen by Lady Justice Whipple, who, as presiding judge of the southeastern circuit, was one of the most senior judges in the land.

    Her comments were interpreted by one person in the room as an attempt to have the case moved to a lower-profile court to spare her husband public scrutiny. Another saw it as an effort to replace Whipple, who Elphicke apparently felt would be overly-strict. It is claimed that she spoke with an air of entitlement and as though Buckland should intervene to stop him being “singled out”.

    Buckland immediately objected, insisting the conversation could go no further, and declined to help. He feared it would be “outrageous” for him to interfere with the administration of justice by helping a fellow Conservative MP or her husband, also a former colleague. A key constitutional doctrine is that there should be a separation of powers between the principal institutions of state — including parliament and the judiciary.

    The MP for South Swindon said today: “She was told in no uncertain terms that it would have been completely inappropriate to speak to the judge about the trial at all.”

    A Labour Party spokesman said: “Natalie Elphicke totally rejects that characterisation of the meeting. If Robert Buckland had any genuine concerns about the meeting, then he should have raised them at the time, rather than making claims to the newspapers now Natalie has chosen to join the Labour Party.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natalie-elphicke-lobbied-lord-chancellor-husband-charlie-kv68bvd7f

    Seems a bit petty, and too nakedly self interested of the Tories to only leak this story now
    On one hand, the whips had no choice. Threatening to dish the dirt on errant MPs is one of the tools in their armoury, and you have to be prepared to carry out threats you make, or you lose credibility for the next encounter.

    On the other, the Elphicke farago shows the limits of the Whips' Black Book. If her behaviour was really that awful, why did the Conservative party do nothing about it before Wednesday lunchtime?

    And whilst it's unlikely that NE has brought many voters across from Conservative to Labour with her, depressing the Conservative vote (to either Reform or seeing what's on telly) is the next best thing for Team Keir.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,682
    I might have been a bit quick to dismiss the merits of the opening act given the ones that have followed.
  • Options
    DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 723
    edited May 11
    It seems the USA has already built a pier on the Gaza coast, at one end of the Netzarim corridor dividing the north and south that's already been taken over by the Israeli military. (And the Israelis are attacking in both north and south right now.) This map is from Al-Jazeera:

    image

    I wonder where on the island of Cyprus the detention camp will be located.
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    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,227

    I might have been a bit quick to dismiss the merits of the opening act given the ones that have followed.

    I'm not sure Eurovision is judged on musical merit, tbh... :(
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,985
    viewcode said:

    MattW said:

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    To counter - Brotherhood of Man.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1Lp3QFFvJE
    I'm noit entirely sure that's a counter-example, tbh
    I question your judgement :smile:
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,337

    Luxembourg not awful. Particularly since it's not Juncker on stage tonight.

    They’re going for douze points from France.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,535

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

    Me too. I'm stopping now as I have done 4k and the wife will be stressed if she finds out I stand to lose 16k.
    Jeez. I hope I don't win my £5 to £25 then.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,733
    viewcode said:

    I might have been a bit quick to dismiss the merits of the opening act given the ones that have followed.

    I'm not sure Eurovision is judged on musical merit, tbh... :(
    That's the thing. It is. Well, sort of. Remember half the verdict comes from the Technical Jury, and half the public vote.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    Luxembourg not awful. Particularly since it's not Juncker on stage tonight.

    They’re going for douze points from France.
    It's available at 1,000/1 - so I presume someone knows they've already lost, this isn't a clean fight - but I've still dropped £2 on it in case public voting surprises and they come in.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,682
    edited May 11
    viewcode said:

    I might have been a bit quick to dismiss the merits of the opening act given the ones that have followed.

    I'm not sure Eurovision is judged on musical merit, tbh... :(
    Eurovision has its own scale of merit which I try to get into the spirit of. I at least have some good beer for the evening.

    Lithuania I think are above par.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,733

    viewcode said:

    I might have been a bit quick to dismiss the merits of the opening act given the ones that have followed.

    I'm not sure Eurovision is judged on musical merit, tbh... :(
    That's the thing. It is. Well, sort of. Remember half the verdict comes from the Technical Jury, and half the public vote.
    Btw the jury votes are already decided on the basis of the rehearsal yesterday so will not be affected by audience reaction tonight.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,337
    viewcode said:

    I might have been a bit quick to dismiss the merits of the opening act given the ones that have followed.

    I'm not sure Eurovision is judged on musical merit, tbh... :(
    We need Dominic Cummings to organise the UK entry, with targeted Facebook ads across Europe.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,227
    edited May 11
    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    MattW said:

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    To counter - Brotherhood of Man.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1Lp3QFFvJE
    I'm noit entirely sure that's a counter-example, tbh
    I question your judgement :smile:
    I've just sat thru two episodes of the new Doctor Who and I'm now looking at a political betting website with people waging £16k on a song. If I retaliate with "well I question your questioning, hah!" and flounce off, we may enter a camp event horizon so dense that even glitter could not escape its grasp...

    😀😀😀
  • Options
    ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,004
    ydoethur said:

    megasaur said:

    WillG said:

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    Because its a joke contest that serious musicians don't enter.
    Abba.
    We nil pointed them iirc, because we Brits know our oats
    I have always thought that Rasputin by Boney M left Waterloo in the dust when it came to preposterously silly history based songs.
    OH, those Russians!
    Shame the Russians didn't have Freddie Mercury's band.

    Then their fans would be 'lover of Russian Queen.'
    That reminds me of a random Youtube recommendation I had recently :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maFlRR-zt4g

    "Dschinghis Khan - Dschinghis Khan (Disco 26.03.1979)"

    Think "Ra! Ra! Rasputin!", but much worse.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,733

    Luxembourg not awful. Particularly since it's not Juncker on stage tonight.

    They’re going for douze points from France.
    It's available at 1,000/1 - so I presume someone knows they've already lost, this isn't a clean fight - but I've still dropped £2 on it in case public voting surprises and they come in.
    You do know there is betting on who comes last? It is a very thin market on Betfair though. Luxembourg are 6/1.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 27,219

    The UK chose a terrible song and a terrible performer. Get rid.

    That description could have been used on quite a few occasions over the last 20 years.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,857

    viewcode said:

    I might have been a bit quick to dismiss the merits of the opening act given the ones that have followed.

    I'm not sure Eurovision is judged on musical merit, tbh... :(
    We need Dominic Cummings to organise the UK entry, with targeted Facebook ads across Europe.
    Has Cummings wargamed this?
  • Options
    gettingbettergettingbetter Posts: 484
    viewcode said:

    On topic, I've laid Israel.

    Might be a good song but my guess is anti-Semitism or anti-Zionism (take your pick) wins out in much of the viewers voting and maybe, subjectively, the judges too.

    I think the change to the voting system to allow voters around the world to vote 24 hours in advance can only but hurt them too; it's not big in the US but the Middle East will hugely downvote them.

    Surely though that is outweighed by the fact that there is no Palestinian entry, so anti-Israel votes have nowhere to coalesce. If everyone were to vote politically re Gaza, then Israel would still win even if only 1 in 20 votes were for Israel and the rest were evenly distributed among the other countries.
    FWIW, I have laid Israel as well.

    Me too. I'm stopping now as I have done 4k and the wife will be stressed if she finds out I stand to lose 16k.
    Well, good luck. Quick check: can you cover the loss?
    Yes I suppose so. I enjoy betting on these sort of things but I havent really enjoyed the Uk songs in recent years. As I child I loved Sandy Shaw's Puppet on a String.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited May 11

    isam said:

    On the eve of her husband’s criminal trial for sex offences in July 2020, Natalie Elphicke arrived at the parliamentary office of Robert Buckland, who as lord chancellor and justice secretary was responsible for upholding the rule of law.

    Elphicke had secured the meeting through Sir Mark Spencer, the Conservative Party chief whip. She assured him she did not wish to discuss the plight of her partner, Charlie, whom she had recently succeeded as MP for Dover and whose innocence she had spent years publicly protesting even as several women made claims of sexual assault to the police. She wished to discuss only some general concerns about the justice system.

    The opposite was true.

    Immediately after entering Buckland’s room on the ministerial corridor, she turned to the topic of her husband: the man who, in a newspaper article three years earlier, she had described as a victim of “injustice heaped upon injustice” having been “thrown to the wolves”.

    To the shock of those present, Elphicke, 53, lobbied Buckland to interfere in the upcoming hearing of the case. She told him she felt it was unfair that his case was the first to be heard at Southwark crown court after lockdown and that was being overseen by Lady Justice Whipple, who, as presiding judge of the southeastern circuit, was one of the most senior judges in the land.

    Her comments were interpreted by one person in the room as an attempt to have the case moved to a lower-profile court to spare her husband public scrutiny. Another saw it as an effort to replace Whipple, who Elphicke apparently felt would be overly-strict. It is claimed that she spoke with an air of entitlement and as though Buckland should intervene to stop him being “singled out”.

    Buckland immediately objected, insisting the conversation could go no further, and declined to help. He feared it would be “outrageous” for him to interfere with the administration of justice by helping a fellow Conservative MP or her husband, also a former colleague. A key constitutional doctrine is that there should be a separation of powers between the principal institutions of state — including parliament and the judiciary.

    The MP for South Swindon said today: “She was told in no uncertain terms that it would have been completely inappropriate to speak to the judge about the trial at all.”

    A Labour Party spokesman said: “Natalie Elphicke totally rejects that characterisation of the meeting. If Robert Buckland had any genuine concerns about the meeting, then he should have raised them at the time, rather than making claims to the newspapers now Natalie has chosen to join the Labour Party.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/natalie-elphicke-lobbied-lord-chancellor-husband-charlie-kv68bvd7f

    Seems a bit petty, and too nakedly self interested of the Tories to only leak this story now
    On one hand, the whips had no choice. Threatening to dish the dirt on errant MPs is one of the tools in their armoury, and you have to be prepared to carry out threats you make, or you lose credibility for the next encounter.

    On the other, the Elphicke farago shows the limits of the Whips' Black Book. If her behaviour was really that awful, why did the Conservative party do nothing about it before Wednesday lunchtime?

    And whilst it's unlikely that NE has brought many voters across from Conservative to Labour with her, depressing the Conservative vote (to either Reform or seeing what's on telly) is the next best thing for Team Keir.
    I laid Labour again upon seeing Sir Keir’s interview this morning about Elphicke; he is so stiff & awkward that it’s not a 6/1 shot he messes up the campaign a la Theresa May
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