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About that inevitable Labour landslide – politicalbetting.com

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  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,812

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,058
    BBC reporter on Radio 4 PM show said that while they think the London result will be closer than the polls suggest, nobody in Labour or the Tories thinks Khan won't win. Make of that what you will.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 643
    edited May 3
    kamski said:

    IanB2 said:

    kamski said:

    TimS said:

    Stephen Bush basically calling the London mayor race for Hall:

    https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/1786434620856136097

    I think he's right.

    If she manages that the Tories are going to forget the thrashing they just had, and indulge in several weeks of cheery complacency. They'll also decide that the way to win the election is to major on all those winning Susan Hall policies. Maybe Sunak will even be tempted to capitalise on his stunning mayoral success (not just London, Teesside too remember) and call a summer General Election.
    Possibly if Hall narrowly wins (I'm not predicting anything), Labour might blame voter ID rules, and there'll be a push from some in the next Labour government to try and 'balance' things up by putting their thumb on the scales in the other direction.
    Votes at 16 incoming….
    Boundaries decided by population rather than electoral register...

    I'm not against votes at 16, but I think this kind of change to voting should be done by consensus as far as possible, rather than whoever is in power making whatever changes they think will give them an advantage.
    And bus passes no longer accepted. Only ID available to all age groups should be used.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    Which is why we should hope he does lose, that would be a valuable service.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    CatMan said:

    BBC reporter on Radio 4 PM show said that while they think the London result will be closer than the polls suggest, nobody in Labour or the Tories thinks Khan won't win. Make of that what you will.

    I make of it where we started 24 hours ago - Khan is so far ahead in polling that it is very very easy for things to be closer than that, whilst still winning relatively comfortably.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,950
    DougSeal said:

    kamski said:

    Three reasons why it would benefit Starmer for Hall to defeat Khan

    1. Puts the fear of God into non-arse voters. You actually do have to vote, and you can't faff about with peripheral nit-picking or you get the Tories
    2. Hall is frootloop and will show the very worst of the Tories who will ramp her lunacy along with the "we must head off Farage" narrative
    3. Khan is a player. Take him out and he's no longer a player

    4. The inevitable fulsome and obnoxious congratulations she'll get from Trump
    Sir Keir is ready for anything.


    David Lammy is meeting Republicans and Democrats in the US. Isn’t that what politicians do? Is there anything else? This is hardly the crime of the century- like looking at someone’s LinkedIn profile for example.
    ‘It’s all about ME!’
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,407
    Andy_JS said:

    I told you all to back Hall at 35/1 yesterday. Now 3/1.

    Indeed you did. Instead some preferred to accuse such posters of ramping, myopia, desperately grasping at straws, and failing to read the mood.

    I hope you're looking forward to their apology as much as I am.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,212
    viewcode said:

    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    My romantic dinner starts shorly, so unless Rishi Sunak hires a hitman to shoot Sir Keir Starmer I won't be on PB.

    Enjoy! ❤

    It's The Phantom Menace (alone) for me tonight! :D
    It's not a great movie. But it is more entertaining than people remember.
    Far superior to so-called "sequel" trilogy 2015-19!
    The sequels suffered from a lack of consistent vision. The prequels had different problems.
    They could have been awesome

    image
    Meesa finding that...oddly convincing :)
    Star Wars with actual script writing - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3RCme2zZRY&t=9s
  • PJHPJH Posts: 643
    ClippP said:

    IanB2 said:

    MikeL said:

    Interesting contrast:

    LD has won more councillors than Con today.

    But PCCs - 33 contests in England - generally each is basically a county. 21 declared so far:

    Con 12
    Lab 9
    LD 0

    FPTP gets more unfair, the larger the seats
    Were the Lib Dems really motivated to fight hard in the PCC elections? I suspect not.
    On that, I see a relatively high LD vote in Northamptonshire - 25%. This isn't an area of historic or current LD strength. Any idea why?
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 1,129
    ClippP said:

    IanB2 said:

    MikeL said:

    Interesting contrast:

    LD has won more councillors than Con today.

    But PCCs - 33 contests in England - generally each is basically a county. 21 declared so far:

    Con 12
    Lab 9
    LD 0

    FPTP gets more unfair, the larger the seats
    Were the Lib Dems really motivated to fight hard in the PCC elections? I suspect not.
    Perhaps not, but it's hard to look at the results of the Cambridgeshire PCC vote (Con 37.4%, Lab 35.3%, LD 25.4%) and not suspect the outcome would have been different under the previous system...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,407
    FWIW, in the interests of balance, the YouGov poll for Tees Valley mayoral proved fairly accurate, and only very slightly undercooked the Tories/overcooked Labour.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,814
    edited May 3

    viewcode said:

    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    My romantic dinner starts shorly, so unless Rishi Sunak hires a hitman to shoot Sir Keir Starmer I won't be on PB.

    Enjoy! ❤

    It's The Phantom Menace (alone) for me tonight! :D
    It's not a great movie. But it is more entertaining than people remember.
    Far superior to so-called "sequel" trilogy 2015-19!
    The sequels suffered from a lack of consistent vision. The prequels had different problems.
    They could have been awesome

    image
    Meesa finding that...oddly convincing :)
    Star Wars with actual script writing - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3RCme2zZRY&t=9s
    Star War The Third Gathers: Backstroke of the West
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,814
    PJH said:

    kamski said:

    IanB2 said:

    kamski said:

    TimS said:

    Stephen Bush basically calling the London mayor race for Hall:

    https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/1786434620856136097

    I think he's right.

    If she manages that the Tories are going to forget the thrashing they just had, and indulge in several weeks of cheery complacency. They'll also decide that the way to win the election is to major on all those winning Susan Hall policies. Maybe Sunak will even be tempted to capitalise on his stunning mayoral success (not just London, Teesside too remember) and call a summer General Election.
    Possibly if Hall narrowly wins (I'm not predicting anything), Labour might blame voter ID rules, and there'll be a push from some in the next Labour government to try and 'balance' things up by putting their thumb on the scales in the other direction.
    Votes at 16 incoming….
    Boundaries decided by population rather than electoral register...

    I'm not against votes at 16, but I think this kind of change to voting should be done by consensus as far as possible, rather than whoever is in power making whatever changes they think will give them an advantage.
    And bus passes no longer accepted. Only ID available to all age groups should be used.
    Not logical to ban bus passes and accept driving licences, though.

    Not getting at you - just shows how trick y this is.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,212

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,906
    TimS said:

    Stephen Bush basically calling the London mayor race for Hall:

    https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/1786434620856136097

    I think he's right.

    If she manages that the Tories are going to forget the thrashing they just had, and indulge in several weeks of cheery complacency. They'll also decide that the way to win the election is to major on all those winning Susan Hall policies. Maybe Sunak will even be tempted to capitalise on his stunning mayoral success (not just London, Teesside too remember) and call a summer General Election.
    Thing is if Hall did beat Khan it would be such an upset to the narrative and the expectation of pundits that you would have to wonder if there really was a way for the Tories to win a general election from their current position.
  • DM_AndyDM_Andy Posts: 1,127
    nico679 said:

    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    It would be a perfect storm . Low turnout in inner London , change of voting system . The Lib Dems and Greens by not splitting their votes and can’t be bothered Labour voters will learn a harsh lesson . They were possibly handmaidens to a Trump climate change denier.
    Khan's not entitled to anyone's vote and it's completely fair for people that Starmer and co have actively discouraged from voting Labour not to vote for Labour.

    In fact it'll be fun to see where this magic money tree Hall is that will fund her manifesto.

  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,275
    CatMan said:

    BBC reporter on Radio 4 PM show said that while they think the London result will be closer than the polls suggest, nobody in Labour or the Tories thinks Khan won't win. Make of that what you will.

    The only way Sunak wins is if Reform poll at minimum 5% and some Libs and Greens tactically vote. The turnout figures aren’t good for Sunak .
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,695
    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    1h
    It’s incredible that some people are looking at the projected national vote share for the local elections and saying “this shows Labour is only 9% ahead. Much worse than the polls. The Tories can bridge that in a general election”. They’re not remotely comparable figures.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,238
    edited May 3
    This feels like bullshit to me. From a guy with 2.7k followers … hmmm

    However it’s entertaining bullshit so:


    🚨NEW: I am told that Starmer is set to blame Wes Streeting if Sadiq Khan loses the mayoral election. Starmer said to be furious about his tweet calling Tories 'white supremacists' and thinks it helped get Susan Hall's vote out.

    https://x.com/doctoriaindarcy/status/1786438533072253278?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    Edit to add: that was indeed a stupid stupid remark from Streeting
  • CleitophonCleitophon Posts: 480
    Denial, anger, negotiation, depression, acceptance. This denial stage is taking long for the tories to get through .... the results today, actual results, say that the tories are dog meat no matter what this headline chaser says ....

    https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/tees-valley-rishi-sunak-local-elections-tories-b2539172.html
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    I find the stories that Tory Members would prefer Farage to be a little odd. Not that the members would not want to be more Faragey in general, at various points that's been clearly true. But it is kind of the opposite of the issue Corbyn had, where lots of non-Labour people backed him (Labour people did too, at the start, but clearly not as passionately), whereas Tory Members seem very keen on someone who has not been a Tory in decades, which goes beyond just liking his policies more.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    edited May 3

    DougSeal said:

    kamski said:

    Three reasons why it would benefit Starmer for Hall to defeat Khan

    1. Puts the fear of God into non-arse voters. You actually do have to vote, and you can't faff about with peripheral nit-picking or you get the Tories
    2. Hall is frootloop and will show the very worst of the Tories who will ramp her lunacy along with the "we must head off Farage" narrative
    3. Khan is a player. Take him out and he's no longer a player

    4. The inevitable fulsome and obnoxious congratulations she'll get from Trump
    Sir Keir is ready for anything.


    David Lammy is meeting Republicans and Democrats in the US. Isn’t that what politicians do? Is there anything else? This is hardly the crime of the century- like looking at someone’s LinkedIn profile for example.
    ‘It’s all about ME!’
    No - this site is really all about Leon. The pathetic "gotchas" you seem to think you excel in won't displace that much as you would like.

    Say hi to the Paranoid Anglophobe Tourguide for me
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    Leon said:

    This feels like bullshit to me. From a guy with 2.7k followers … hmmm

    However it’s entertaining bullshit so:


    🚨NEW: I am told that Starmer is set to blame Wes Streeting if Sadiq Khan loses the mayoral election. Starmer said to be furious about his tweet calling Tories 'white supremacists' and thinks it helped get Susan Hall's vote out.

    https://x.com/doctoriaindarcy/status/1786438533072253278?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The idea any tweet would have such a major impact even in this day and age is just silly.

    'I am told', but by whom?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,407
    Leon said:

    This feels like bullshit to me. From a guy with 2.7k followers … hmmm

    However it’s entertaining bullshit so:


    🚨NEW: I am told that Starmer is set to blame Wes Streeting if Sadiq Khan loses the mayoral election. Starmer said to be furious about his tweet calling Tories 'white supremacists' and thinks it helped get Susan Hall's vote out.

    https://x.com/doctoriaindarcy/status/1786438533072253278?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    Edit to add: that was indeed a stupid stupid remark from Streeting

    You'd have thought they'd have learned from Hillary Clinton.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,812

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Much more could also have been done to create a smoother transition and reduce both the impact and associated fear.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,814
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    This feels like bullshit to me. From a guy with 2.7k followers … hmmm

    However it’s entertaining bullshit so:


    🚨NEW: I am told that Starmer is set to blame Wes Streeting if Sadiq Khan loses the mayoral election. Starmer said to be furious about his tweet calling Tories 'white supremacists' and thinks it helped get Susan Hall's vote out.

    https://x.com/doctoriaindarcy/status/1786438533072253278?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The idea any tweet would have such a major impact even in this day and age is just silly.

    'I am told', but by whom?
    "Some people say"...
  • PJHPJH Posts: 643
    Carnyx said:

    PJH said:

    kamski said:

    IanB2 said:

    kamski said:

    TimS said:

    Stephen Bush basically calling the London mayor race for Hall:

    https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/1786434620856136097

    I think he's right.

    If she manages that the Tories are going to forget the thrashing they just had, and indulge in several weeks of cheery complacency. They'll also decide that the way to win the election is to major on all those winning Susan Hall policies. Maybe Sunak will even be tempted to capitalise on his stunning mayoral success (not just London, Teesside too remember) and call a summer General Election.
    Possibly if Hall narrowly wins (I'm not predicting anything), Labour might blame voter ID rules, and there'll be a push from some in the next Labour government to try and 'balance' things up by putting their thumb on the scales in the other direction.
    Votes at 16 incoming….
    Boundaries decided by population rather than electoral register...

    I'm not against votes at 16, but I think this kind of change to voting should be done by consensus as far as possible, rather than whoever is in power making whatever changes they think will give them an advantage.
    And bus passes no longer accepted. Only ID available to all age groups should be used.
    Not logical to ban bus passes and accept driving licences, though.

    Not getting at you - just shows how trick y this is.
    Oh indeed - but there is no age limit on driving licence at either end (unless voting reduced to 16). I was only suggesting it as a way to tilt the balance. Though actually thinking about it perhaps I am in favour of the principle that only valid ID that is available to all should be used.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,652
    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    Maybe I am not serious, but I have thought it for months. Stephen Bush at the FT - who knows Labour and London as well as anyone - did too.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,212

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Much more could also have been done to create a smoother transition and reduce both the impact and associated fear.
    I would have designed a taxation system that takes into account weight *and* emissions. So people in 0.9L hatchbacks get a thumbs up.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    Double crossback crossover alert, Tories back ahead of Libs
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,238
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    This feels like bullshit to me. From a guy with 2.7k followers … hmmm

    However it’s entertaining bullshit so:


    🚨NEW: I am told that Starmer is set to blame Wes Streeting if Sadiq Khan loses the mayoral election. Starmer said to be furious about his tweet calling Tories 'white supremacists' and thinks it helped get Susan Hall's vote out.

    https://x.com/doctoriaindarcy/status/1786438533072253278?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The idea any tweet would have such a major impact even in this day and age is just silly.

    'I am told', but by whom?
    Yes I’m not buying it in this case

    But tweets can matter. Ask Emily Thornberry
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    edited May 3
    Truss v Streeting from a couple of days ago.

    https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/1785754127647027636

    "Liz Truss
    @trussliz
    This is disgusting from @wesstreetin. If this is the future of the Labour Party, they are in deep trouble.
    Quote
    Wes Streeting MP
    @wesstreeting
    ·
    May 1
    A win for Susan Hall and the Conservatives is a win for racists, white supremacists and Islamophobes the world over. Susan Hall’s campaign has been fought from the gutter with dangerous and divisive politics. "

  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,058
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    This feels like bullshit to me. From a guy with 2.7k followers … hmmm

    However it’s entertaining bullshit so:


    🚨NEW: I am told that Starmer is set to blame Wes Streeting if Sadiq Khan loses the mayoral election. Starmer said to be furious about his tweet calling Tories 'white supremacists' and thinks it helped get Susan Hall's vote out.

    https://x.com/doctoriaindarcy/status/1786438533072253278?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The idea any tweet would have such a major impact even in this day and age is just silly.

    'I am told', but by whom?
    Well quite. How many Londoners would even have been aware of the tweet? And of the few that did, to change their vote from Khan to Hall?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,950
    edited May 3
    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    kamski said:

    Three reasons why it would benefit Starmer for Hall to defeat Khan

    1. Puts the fear of God into non-arse voters. You actually do have to vote, and you can't faff about with peripheral nit-picking or you get the Tories
    2. Hall is frootloop and will show the very worst of the Tories who will ramp her lunacy along with the "we must head off Farage" narrative
    3. Khan is a player. Take him out and he's no longer a player

    4. The inevitable fulsome and obnoxious congratulations she'll get from Trump
    Sir Keir is ready for anything.


    David Lammy is meeting Republicans and Democrats in the US. Isn’t that what politicians do? Is there anything else? This is hardly the crime of the century- like looking at someone’s LinkedIn profile for example.
    ‘It’s all about ME!’
    No - this site is really all about Leon. The pathetic "gotchas" you seem to think you excel in won't displace that much as you would like.

    Say high to the Paranoid Anglophobe Tourguide for me
    Hey, I think looking at a stranger’s Linkedin profile for pathetic "gotchas" is weird, and the fact you rather than I keeps referring to it is great for added weirdness.

    I see you're one of those sensitive PB types that has adopted a private profile. Undestandable if you're a bit stalky yourself that you might be paranoid.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,906

    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.

    Free parking in some boroughs and free charging at work if your employer likes the green credentials of paying out for that perk. Which is great if you can afford an EV.

    There are lots of environmental policies that come with rebates and grants that are in practice highly regressive. I understand the idea of priming the pump, but they invariably look and act like handouts to the already well off.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,362
    murali_s said:

    Khan out to 1.35

    Just piled in at 1.34. Real value in my opinion.
    I suspect you’re right and for 24 hours or so that is a great return on your cash.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,812

    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    Maybe I am not serious, but I have thought it for months. Stephen Bush at the FT - who knows Labour and London as well as anyone - did too.

    I initially got involved as a potential Corbyn run would have made it very hard for Sadiq, so seemed like a free angle. I kinda gave up after the 22 point poll lead but thought it back in play with the more recent slightly closer poll.

    Think people outside London or even those exclusively in naice and central London misunderstand the dynamics here and especially the impact in a low turnout election where tens of thousands matter.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,812

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Much more could also have been done to create a smoother transition and reduce both the impact and associated fear.
    I would have designed a taxation system that takes into account weight *and* emissions. So people in 0.9L hatchbacks get a thumbs up.
    Is this measured before or after I get in......
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,212
    glw said:

    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.

    Free parking in some boroughs and free charging at work if your employer likes the green credentials of paying out for that perk. Which is great if you can afford an EV.

    There are lots of environmental policies that come with rebates and grants that are in practice highly regressive. I understand the idea of priming the pump, but they invariably look and act like handouts to the already well off.
    Also "free parking" at charging spots through out London.

    Pump priming yes. But it needs to move with the flow. There is no need for any subsidy for £50k+ EVs any more - that market is rolling.

    Target cheaper cars.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,812

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Much more could also have been done to create a smoother transition and reduce both the impact and associated fear.
    I would have designed a taxation system that takes into account weight *and* emissions. So people in 0.9L hatchbacks get a thumbs up.
    Such cars for locals used to get exemptions from congestion charge ten years ago.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,238
    Looking back, the fact Streeting wrote and posted that desperate and ugly tweet implies that even a few days ago Labour sensed trouble in London, despite the polls

    That’s a risky tweet designed to shore up the BME vote, especially Muslims disenchanted by Gaza
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    edited May 3
    Looks like Reform have got one on the board somewhere

    Edit- in Havant
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,275

    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    Maybe I am not serious, but I have thought it for months. Stephen Bush at the FT - who knows Labour and London as well as anyone - did too.

    I initially got involved as a potential Corbyn run would have made it very hard for Sadiq, so seemed like a free angle. I kinda gave up after the 22 point poll lead but thought it back in play with the more recent slightly closer poll.

    Think people outside London or even those exclusively in naice and central London misunderstand the dynamics here and especially the impact in a low turnout election where tens of thousands matter.
    On just turnout Hall could win . It really depends now what happened to the Lib Dem and Green votes . Khan needs some tactical voting from them and Reform to do okay .
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,062

    viewcode said:

    boulay said:

    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    FPT re the Thrasher model

    I very, very much doubt that. It seems to me that the Labour gains from the Tories are being heavily understated because they are losing quite a lot of council seats to their left, specifically in Muslim areas. Their net gains are therefore less than they might be. Some, such as Sky, are suggesting that the Tories are losing a lot to "others" but I think this is wrong. It is Labour who are losing to others and then gaining big time from the Tories.

    The bad news for the Tories is that this means that Labour gains in areas where there are competitive seats are much greater than it appears and there is a real risk that there is a significant increase in the efficiency of the Labour vote with them doing much less well in ultra safe seats but still winning.

    If the war is over before the GE then many of the Hamas-curious should return to Labour.
    lol, Hamas-curious. Do they turn up to Israeli festivals with water pistols and get to see if they like it and can take the next step? Or do they make one of their gay friends stand blindfolded on the edge of a building and push him off without him realising he’s just a floor above a big crash-mat to get the feels.

    Sandy's IDF-curious.
    When I was 10 my father and a couple of his friends went to Israel for a jolly and they bought us (their sons who were all friends as well) mini IDF uniforms. They were absolutely perfect IdF uniforms for kids with the badges, sew on patches etc. it’s like getting a football strip as a kid and following that team for the rest of your life.
    We can only be glad that they did not buy you the Waffen-SS Action Man then... :)
    I think even in the days of gollywogs and Love Thy Neighbour an SS action man would have been a step too far, just honest Landsers who would never be involved in atrocities, oh no, definitely not.
    https://www.actionmanhq.co.uk/figures/panzer-captain/index.php
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,814

    viewcode said:

    boulay said:

    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    FPT re the Thrasher model

    I very, very much doubt that. It seems to me that the Labour gains from the Tories are being heavily understated because they are losing quite a lot of council seats to their left, specifically in Muslim areas. Their net gains are therefore less than they might be. Some, such as Sky, are suggesting that the Tories are losing a lot to "others" but I think this is wrong. It is Labour who are losing to others and then gaining big time from the Tories.

    The bad news for the Tories is that this means that Labour gains in areas where there are competitive seats are much greater than it appears and there is a real risk that there is a significant increase in the efficiency of the Labour vote with them doing much less well in ultra safe seats but still winning.

    If the war is over before the GE then many of the Hamas-curious should return to Labour.
    lol, Hamas-curious. Do they turn up to Israeli festivals with water pistols and get to see if they like it and can take the next step? Or do they make one of their gay friends stand blindfolded on the edge of a building and push him off without him realising he’s just a floor above a big crash-mat to get the feels.

    Sandy's IDF-curious.
    When I was 10 my father and a couple of his friends went to Israel for a jolly and they bought us (their sons who were all friends as well) mini IDF uniforms. They were absolutely perfect IdF uniforms for kids with the badges, sew on patches etc. it’s like getting a football strip as a kid and following that team for the rest of your life.
    We can only be glad that they did not buy you the Waffen-SS Action Man then... :)
    I think even in the days of gollywogs and Love Thy Neighbour an SS action man would have been a step too far, just honest Landsers who would never be involved in atrocities, oh no, definitely not.
    I came across this the other day when seeing what the Tank Museum had for sale, so can say that the range isn't what it used to be in our younger days. ISTR pickelhaube-clad Huns from the Great War, and so forth, never mind your actual chap with the eagle and swastika badge on the chest.

    Mind, some of even the modern range would suit some of us to a T - especially the officer cadet and action pilot.


    https://tankmuseumshop.org/search?q=action&type=article,product&options[prefix]=last&sort_by=relevance&filter.p.product_type=Collectables
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    Uxbridge was the warning Labour in London should have heeded.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,788
    Leon said:

    This feels like bullshit to me. From a guy with 2.7k followers … hmmm

    However it’s entertaining bullshit so:


    🚨NEW: I am told that Starmer is set to blame Wes Streeting if Sadiq Khan loses the mayoral election. Starmer said to be furious about his tweet calling Tories 'white supremacists' and thinks it helped get Susan Hall's vote out.

    https://x.com/doctoriaindarcy/status/1786438533072253278?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    Edit to add: that was indeed a stupid stupid remark from Streeting

    Nah that sounds like bullshit, only the terminally online saw that stuff. Normal people don't even know who Wes Streeting is, I barely know and I follow politics to some degree (though have disengaged for my own mental state for the past year).
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,293

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    1h
    It’s incredible that some people are looking at the projected national vote share for the local elections and saying “this shows Labour is only 9% ahead. Much worse than the polls. The Tories can bridge that in a general election”. They’re not remotely comparable figures.

    This was reassuring until I saw it was from Dan Hodges...
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    edited May 3
    "((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges

    Then Sky News has lost its marbles.

    Quote
    Politics UK
    @PolitlcsUK
    🚨 BREAKING: Sky News predicts Labour will fall short of a majority by 32 seats at the next general election"

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1786448865215869122
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,695

    Stephen Bush
    @stephenkb
    ·
    1h
    Turnout figures from the London mayoralty: I think Susan Hall really could do it, you know: https://londonelects.org.uk/im-voter/election-progress/verification-and-turnout-data

    https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/1786434620856136097
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    edited May 3

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    kamski said:

    Three reasons why it would benefit Starmer for Hall to defeat Khan

    1. Puts the fear of God into non-arse voters. You actually do have to vote, and you can't faff about with peripheral nit-picking or you get the Tories
    2. Hall is frootloop and will show the very worst of the Tories who will ramp her lunacy along with the "we must head off Farage" narrative
    3. Khan is a player. Take him out and he's no longer a player

    4. The inevitable fulsome and obnoxious congratulations she'll get from Trump
    Sir Keir is ready for anything.


    David Lammy is meeting Republicans and Democrats in the US. Isn’t that what politicians do? Is there anything else? This is hardly the crime of the century- like looking at someone’s LinkedIn profile for example.
    ‘It’s all about ME!’
    No - this site is really all about Leon. The pathetic "gotchas" you seem to think you excel in won't displace that much as you would like.

    Say high to the Paranoid Anglophobe Tourguide for me
    Hey, I think looking at a stranger’s Linkedin profile for pathetic "gotchas" is weird, and the fact you rather than I keeps referring to it is great for added weirdness.

    I see your one of those sensitive PB types that has adopted a private profile. Undestandable if you're a bit stalky yourself that you might be paranoid.
    FFS. On the contrary. It's was public LinkedIn profile you moron. That's how the fuckwit in Gothenburg to tell I looked at it. If I gave a fuck I would have set it to private so he couldn't see I had looked at. Or logged out and looked at it anonymously. That's how it works. People can tell who looked at your profile so you can network with them. Which is why generally sane people are happy if you do so. Except Disco Stu who has this weird idea that a LinkedIn profile is supposed to be anonymous or invisible to English people.

    It's not the fact I looked at his profile and he knows. I knew that would happen. Its the fact you use the words "stalky" and "research" as if I was inquiring deeply into his background by underhand means by doing something so drearily commonplace. I knew he could see I looked, which is why I worked out instantly what your dumb reference to "research" was. I have seen many on here have looked at my profile, I've more than left enough breadcrumbs on here to work out who I am.

    I call you out on it because accusing someone of being a stalker is a pretty big deal, don't you think?
  • glwglw Posts: 9,906

    Also "free parking" at charging spots through out London.

    Pump priming yes. But it needs to move with the flow. There is no need for any subsidy for £50k+ EVs any more - that market is rolling.

    Target cheaper cars.

    Exactly. It is nuts to subsidise buying luxury vehicles. You could get £5,000 knocked off a BMW i8 at one point.
  • NickyBreakspearNickyBreakspear Posts: 774
    pm215 said:

    ClippP said:

    IanB2 said:

    MikeL said:

    Interesting contrast:

    LD has won more councillors than Con today.

    But PCCs - 33 contests in England - generally each is basically a county. 21 declared so far:

    Con 12
    Lab 9
    LD 0

    FPTP gets more unfair, the larger the seats
    Were the Lib Dems really motivated to fight hard in the PCC elections? I suspect not.
    Perhaps not, but it's hard to look at the results of the Cambridgeshire PCC vote (Con 37.4%, Lab 35.3%, LD 25.4%) and not suspect the outcome would have been different under the previous system...
    The LibDems may have a chance in the Hertfordshire PCC election. Counting tomorrow.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    That's not true. Moon and Andy_JS have been confidently predicting (or confidently implying they are predicting) a Hall victory for ages.

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,695
    James Ball
    @jamesrbuk
    ·
    1h
    I am extremely sceptical of that Sky News projection as it looks like a PNS-type variable plugged into a seat calculator. Maybe there’s something much cleverer under the hood, but these results do not otherwise suggest a hung parliament.

    https://twitter.com/jamesrbuk/status/1786434188230504926
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071


    Stephen Bush
    @stephenkb
    ·
    1h
    Turnout figures from the London mayoralty: I think Susan Hall really could do it, you know: https://londonelects.org.uk/im-voter/election-progress/verification-and-turnout-data

    https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/1786434620856136097

    Looks pretty similar to previous turnouts

    London Mayor Turnout

    2000 - 34.43% - Ind win
    2004 - 36.95% - Lab win
    2008 - 45.30% - Con win
    2012 - 38.1% - Con win
    2016 - 45.3% - Lab win
    2021 - 42.2% - Lab win
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,950
    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    kamski said:

    Three reasons why it would benefit Starmer for Hall to defeat Khan

    1. Puts the fear of God into non-arse voters. You actually do have to vote, and you can't faff about with peripheral nit-picking or you get the Tories
    2. Hall is frootloop and will show the very worst of the Tories who will ramp her lunacy along with the "we must head off Farage" narrative
    3. Khan is a player. Take him out and he's no longer a player

    4. The inevitable fulsome and obnoxious congratulations she'll get from Trump
    Sir Keir is ready for anything.


    David Lammy is meeting Republicans and Democrats in the US. Isn’t that what politicians do? Is there anything else? This is hardly the crime of the century- like looking at someone’s LinkedIn profile for example.
    ‘It’s all about ME!’
    No - this site is really all about Leon. The pathetic "gotchas" you seem to think you excel in won't displace that much as you would like.

    Say high to the Paranoid Anglophobe Tourguide for me
    Hey, I think looking at a stranger’s Linkedin profile for pathetic "gotchas" is weird, and the fact you rather than I keeps referring to it is great for added weirdness.

    I see your one of those sensitive PB types that has adopted a private profile. Undestandable if you're a bit stalky yourself that you might be paranoid.
    FFS. On the contrary. It's was public LinkedIn profile you moron. That's how the fuckwit in Gothenburg to tell I looked at it. If I gave a fuck I would have set it to private so he couldn't see I had looked at. Or logged out and looked at it anonymously. That's how it works. People can tell who looked at your profile so you can network with them. Which is why generally sane people are happy if you do so. Except Disco Stu who has this weird idea that a LinkedIn profile is supposed to be anonymous or invisible to English people.

    It's not the fact I looked at his profile and he knows. I knew that would happen. Its the fact you use the words "stalky" and "research" as if I was inquiring deeply into his background by underhand means by doing something so drearily commonplace. I knew he could see I looked, which is why I worked out instantly what your dumb reference to "research" was. I have seen many on here have looked at my profile, I've more than left enough breadcrumbs on here to work out who I am.

    I call you out on it because accusing someone of being a stalker is a pretty big deal, don't you think?
    Golly, a full on diatribe! You're on the verge of appearing a bit unstable.
    Stop jumping on my posts and jog on would be for the best I feel.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,695
    DougSeal said:

    MikeL said:

    Khan traded as low as 1.02.

    And the vast majority of money on Khan was traded at between 1.03 and 1.06.

    If Khan loses, nobody should ever say again that anything is certain in politics.

    Literally nobody seriously thought Khan could lose before the last 24 hours.

    That's not true. Moon and Andy_JS have been confidently predicting (or confidently implying they are predicting) a Hall victory for ages.

    In put £ on Hall but only because I thought the odds were getting silly.

    Now I'm starting to think I may win.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Leon said:

    Looking back, the fact Streeting wrote and posted that desperate and ugly tweet implies that even a few days ago Labour sensed trouble in London, despite the polls

    That’s a risky tweet designed to shore up the BME vote, especially Muslims disenchanted by Gaza

    Streeting tweeted that he was having cancer treatment whilst the Tories partied in No10 during lockdown... but he got the years mixed up and was therefore completely wrong The tweets still up, though, despite him knowing full well it is lies.

    But he is the future apparently
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    kamski said:

    Three reasons why it would benefit Starmer for Hall to defeat Khan

    1. Puts the fear of God into non-arse voters. You actually do have to vote, and you can't faff about with peripheral nit-picking or you get the Tories
    2. Hall is frootloop and will show the very worst of the Tories who will ramp her lunacy along with the "we must head off Farage" narrative
    3. Khan is a player. Take him out and he's no longer a player

    4. The inevitable fulsome and obnoxious congratulations she'll get from Trump
    Sir Keir is ready for anything.


    David Lammy is meeting Republicans and Democrats in the US. Isn’t that what politicians do? Is there anything else? This is hardly the crime of the century- like looking at someone’s LinkedIn profile for example.
    ‘It’s all about ME!’
    No - this site is really all about Leon. The pathetic "gotchas" you seem to think you excel in won't displace that much as you would like.

    Say high to the Paranoid Anglophobe Tourguide for me
    Hey, I think looking at a stranger’s Linkedin profile for pathetic "gotchas" is weird, and the fact you rather than I keeps referring to it is great for added weirdness.

    I see your one of those sensitive PB types that has adopted a private profile. Undestandable if you're a bit stalky yourself that you might be paranoid.
    FFS. On the contrary. It's was public LinkedIn profile you moron. That's how the fuckwit in Gothenburg to tell I looked at it. If I gave a fuck I would have set it to private so he couldn't see I had looked at. Or logged out and looked at it anonymously. That's how it works. People can tell who looked at your profile so you can network with them. Which is why generally sane people are happy if you do so. Except Disco Stu who has this weird idea that a LinkedIn profile is supposed to be anonymous or invisible to English people.

    It's not the fact I looked at his profile and he knows. I knew that would happen. Its the fact you use the words "stalky" and "research" as if I was inquiring deeply into his background by underhand means by doing something so drearily commonplace. I knew he could see I looked, which is why I worked out instantly what your dumb reference to "research" was. I have seen many on here have looked at my profile, I've more than left enough breadcrumbs on here to work out who I am.

    I call you out on it because accusing someone of being a stalker is a pretty big deal, don't you think?
    Golly, a full on diatribe! You're on the verge of appearing a bit unstable.
    Stop jumping on my posts and jog on would be for the best I feel.
    I very rarely comment on your posts. Your weird obsession with me and your assumptions as to my habits makes you think I do. There's a difference. Seek help.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    "Reform have won a seat on Havant BC."

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/thread/17304/havant
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    For those who want a piece of Hall she's drifted out a smidge on BF. She was verging on 4 for a while but out to 5.4 now.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,275
    Reform polled about 6.5% in the by-election in Bromley . Khan needs Reform to poll minimum 5% across London .
  • ManchesterKurtManchesterKurt Posts: 921
    Lib Dems have over taken the Tories on councillors
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    These post office lawyers and managers really do overstretch the 'I'm incompetent, not a liar' defence I see.

    Former senior Post Office lawyer Jarnail Singh has denied that he knew about bugs in the Horizon system while sub-postmaster prosecutions continued for three years.

    However, lead counsel for the Horizon inquiry Jason Beer accused Mr Singh of telling a "big fat lie".

    Mr Singh was forwarded an email on the eve of the 2010 trial of Seema Misra, a sub-postmistress who was sent to jail while pregnant.

    It identified bugs in the Horizon system that should have been disclosed in Mrs Misra's trial.

    Mr Singh denied having read the email, despite being presented with evidence that he saved a copy to his hard drive and printed it off...

    When asked whether it was saved on the hard drive of his computer, Mr Singh said: "I don't even know what you're talking about.

    "I don't know how these things worked."

    "You don't know how to save a document?" Mr Beer asked.

    "I didn't know how to do it," Mr Singh responded, saying he wouldn't have had the technical knowledge either to do that or to understand the document itself.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1d4j5m3l08o
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895
    We are in the period of the phoney war. War has been declared, a massive barrage of shelling with the red scourge conquering new places. But the big battle lies ahead, and the armchair generals are poking a stick at the ashes and looking through their tinted/blinkered specs looking for guidance.

    I think the Sunak presser in Sheffield Teesside is the moment of the most shark-jumping for the blues. A win which - combined with results elsewhere - demonstrates that they will be obliterated once the fighting starts properly. And yet for now, the mood in team Sunak is WE'RE ALRIGHT! WE'RE ALRIGHT!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    edited May 3

    Lib Dems have over taken the Tories on councillors

    That's good news for the Tories...in the 2028 elections.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,950
    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    kamski said:

    Three reasons why it would benefit Starmer for Hall to defeat Khan

    1. Puts the fear of God into non-arse voters. You actually do have to vote, and you can't faff about with peripheral nit-picking or you get the Tories
    2. Hall is frootloop and will show the very worst of the Tories who will ramp her lunacy along with the "we must head off Farage" narrative
    3. Khan is a player. Take him out and he's no longer a player

    4. The inevitable fulsome and obnoxious congratulations she'll get from Trump
    Sir Keir is ready for anything.


    David Lammy is meeting Republicans and Democrats in the US. Isn’t that what politicians do? Is there anything else? This is hardly the crime of the century- like looking at someone’s LinkedIn profile for example.
    ‘It’s all about ME!’
    No - this site is really all about Leon. The pathetic "gotchas" you seem to think you excel in won't displace that much as you would like.

    Say high to the Paranoid Anglophobe Tourguide for me
    Hey, I think looking at a stranger’s Linkedin profile for pathetic "gotchas" is weird, and the fact you rather than I keeps referring to it is great for added weirdness.

    I see your one of those sensitive PB types that has adopted a private profile. Undestandable if you're a bit stalky yourself that you might be paranoid.
    FFS. On the contrary. It's was public LinkedIn profile you moron. That's how the fuckwit in Gothenburg to tell I looked at it. If I gave a fuck I would have set it to private so he couldn't see I had looked at. Or logged out and looked at it anonymously. That's how it works. People can tell who looked at your profile so you can network with them. Which is why generally sane people are happy if you do so. Except Disco Stu who has this weird idea that a LinkedIn profile is supposed to be anonymous or invisible to English people.

    It's not the fact I looked at his profile and he knows. I knew that would happen. Its the fact you use the words "stalky" and "research" as if I was inquiring deeply into his background by underhand means by doing something so drearily commonplace. I knew he could see I looked, which is why I worked out instantly what your dumb reference to "research" was. I have seen many on here have looked at my profile, I've more than left enough breadcrumbs on here to work out who I am.

    I call you out on it because accusing someone of being a stalker is a pretty big deal, don't you think?
    Golly, a full on diatribe! You're on the verge of appearing a bit unstable.
    Stop jumping on my posts and jog on would be for the best I feel.
    I very rarely comment on your posts. Your weird obsession with me and your assumptions as to my habits makes you think I do. There's a difference. Seek help.
    You reply out of the blue to my posts that are not adressed to you, recently with your crap Linkedin patter. I think I know where the weird obsession is.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,411

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Quite. It has also been stated that car tyres produce vastly more particulates than exhaust emissions, especially heavy cars:

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/jun/03/car-tyres-produce-more-particle-pollution-than-exhausts-tests-show

    So possibly driving around a posh EV SUV isn't helping anyone's respiratory problems.
  • CJtheOptimistCJtheOptimist Posts: 295
    kle4 said:

    These post office lawyers and managers really do overstretch the 'I'm incompetent, not a liar' defence I see.

    Former senior Post Office lawyer Jarnail Singh has denied that he knew about bugs in the Horizon system while sub-postmaster prosecutions continued for three years.

    However, lead counsel for the Horizon inquiry Jason Beer accused Mr Singh of telling a "big fat lie".

    Mr Singh was forwarded an email on the eve of the 2010 trial of Seema Misra, a sub-postmistress who was sent to jail while pregnant.

    It identified bugs in the Horizon system that should have been disclosed in Mrs Misra's trial.

    Mr Singh denied having read the email, despite being presented with evidence that he saved a copy to his hard drive and printed it off...

    When asked whether it was saved on the hard drive of his computer, Mr Singh said: "I don't even know what you're talking about.

    "I don't know how these things worked."

    "You don't know how to save a document?" Mr Beer asked.

    "I didn't know how to do it," Mr Singh responded, saying he wouldn't have had the technical knowledge either to do that or to understand the document itself.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1d4j5m3l08o

    What ever happened to honesty and integrity. And he's a lawyer, for goodness sake.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,486
    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Looking back, the fact Streeting wrote and posted that desperate and ugly tweet implies that even a few days ago Labour sensed trouble in London, despite the polls

    That’s a risky tweet designed to shore up the BME vote, especially Muslims disenchanted by Gaza

    Streeting tweeted that he was having cancer treatment whilst the Tories partied in No10 during lockdown... but he got the years mixed up and was therefore completely wrong The tweets still up, though, despite him knowing full well it is lies.

    But he is the future apparently
    He’s probably got as many enemies in his own party as in other parties and when he makes a giant hubris-filled fuck up and is waiting for support it will be tumbleweed.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    nico679 said:

    Reform polled about 6.5% in the by-election in Bromley . Khan needs Reform to poll minimum 5% across London .

    I don't think they'll get more than 3%.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,238
    Remember the pandemic? That weird virus from Asia? Most of us have forgotten, thank God

    But quietly, in recent weeks, yet more evidence has emerged that it came from the lab, which anyone with a brain knew anyway. Here is arguably THE expert on Covid. Ralph Baric

    🧵Fascinating origin-of-Covid testimony from renowned coronavirus expert Ralph Baric. “The single biggest issue to jump from the pages of Baric’s testimony is his persistent concern over unsafe research practices at the WIV,” writes @katherineeban

    Baric recounts what he says were the responses to his efforts to flag troublingly lax laboratory safety at the Wuhan lab + Chinese coronavirus labs generally, including how they were waved away by the WIV's US funder.“

    https://x.com/alisonannyoung/status/1785662709863793104?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,493
    edited May 3
    nico679 said:

    Reform polled about 6.5% in the by-election in Bromley . Khan needs Reform to poll minimum 5% across London .

    Calm down luv.

    I’m still calling it a double digit win for Khan. The Savanta around 10% is probably the winning score, with a bit of MOE.

    Outer London has higher turn out than inner London? So what? That doesn’t disprove the 22% lead in Yougov, as outer London is still packed with intelligent people to be polled, who understood what they would be getting with Hall as the total unelectable wingnut she is.

    Even if Tories had put up a stronger candidate than Hall, I still think they would have lost to Khan. When it gets tight, incumbency brings a special bonus to these mayoralty contests.

    It’s likely becuase so many voters still know diddly squat about Hall and what she stands for, that’s she’s over performed here and only loses by about 10 - like a paper candidate magnet for Khan dissatisfaction, but only for those who haven’t been paying proper attention what they’re actually voting for.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,275
    Andy_JS said:

    nico679 said:

    Reform polled about 6.5% in the by-election in Bromley . Khan needs Reform to poll minimum 5% across London .

    I don't think they'll get more than 3%.
    The much talked about Savanta poll had them on just 2% . YouGov on 6%.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,695
    Cons lose Police Commissioner for Notts.

    It's goodbye to the local MP's wife.

  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,652

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Quite. It has also been stated that car tyres produce vastly more particulates than exhaust emissions, especially heavy cars:

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/jun/03/car-tyres-produce-more-particle-pollution-than-exhausts-tests-show

    So possibly driving around a posh EV SUV isn't helping anyone's respiratory problems.
    Let's be clear about this one: the mass of particulates is larger, but tyre rubber breakdown does not contribute to global warming.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    edited May 3
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    edited May 3

    kle4 said:

    These post office lawyers and managers really do overstretch the 'I'm incompetent, not a liar' defence I see.

    Former senior Post Office lawyer Jarnail Singh has denied that he knew about bugs in the Horizon system while sub-postmaster prosecutions continued for three years.

    However, lead counsel for the Horizon inquiry Jason Beer accused Mr Singh of telling a "big fat lie".

    Mr Singh was forwarded an email on the eve of the 2010 trial of Seema Misra, a sub-postmistress who was sent to jail while pregnant.

    It identified bugs in the Horizon system that should have been disclosed in Mrs Misra's trial.

    Mr Singh denied having read the email, despite being presented with evidence that he saved a copy to his hard drive and printed it off...

    When asked whether it was saved on the hard drive of his computer, Mr Singh said: "I don't even know what you're talking about.

    "I don't know how these things worked."

    "You don't know how to save a document?" Mr Beer asked.

    "I didn't know how to do it," Mr Singh responded, saying he wouldn't have had the technical knowledge either to do that or to understand the document itself.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1d4j5m3l08o

    What ever happened to honesty and integrity. And he's a lawyer, for goodness sake.
    No one likes admitting they cocked up for reasons other than honest incompetence, but when there's evidence as overwhelming you will have a lot more credibility by having a damascene conversion about how you see actions than stubbornly insisting black is white and you are just an goofball. Especially when they are high powered individuals who probably have spent careers insisting how brilliant they are.

    It's more dignified for a start.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,174
    From Get Surrey's feed:

    In Canalside, Woking, Faisal Mumtaz has been elected, representing the Liberal Democrats. This is a gain [from Labour] for the Lib Dems here in Canalside.

    The result in the ward (three-member, elected every three out of four years) in 2023 was:

    Labour - 1,112
    Lib Dem - 542
    Conservative - 448

    This year:

    Labour - 1,195
    Lib Dem - 1,224
    Conservative - 402

    For the Lib Dems to gain Woking, they could do with being able to squeeze the Labour vote in Sheerwater. An impressive gain for the Lib Dems, but it looks like they did it by adding 8pp or so to the turnout. Whether they can repeat the trick at the General Election, I don't know. It's hard to know what turnout is like in Sheerwater for the GE.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,411
    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Looking back, the fact Streeting wrote and posted that desperate and ugly tweet implies that even a few days ago Labour sensed trouble in London, despite the polls

    That’s a risky tweet designed to shore up the BME vote, especially Muslims disenchanted by Gaza

    Streeting tweeted that he was having cancer treatment whilst the Tories partied in No10 during lockdown... but he got the years mixed up and was therefore completely wrong The tweets still up, though, despite him knowing full well it is lies.

    But he is the future apparently
    Labour's desperate slavering to get into power and get a piece of the action is distasteful.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Quite. It has also been stated that car tyres produce vastly more particulates than exhaust emissions, especially heavy cars:

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/jun/03/car-tyres-produce-more-particle-pollution-than-exhausts-tests-show

    So possibly driving around a posh EV SUV isn't helping anyone's respiratory problems.
    The heaviest cars remain the biggest cars - Range Rover, Q7, X7 etc. None of which are EVs. I only changed the tyres on my Model Y on 31k miles because I didn't rotate them. Had I done so I would have got another 5k out of them easily, perhaps out to 40k.

    That is not a usage profile of a vehicle shedding chunks of rubber under its massive weight...
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,275

    nico679 said:

    Reform polled about 6.5% in the by-election in Bromley . Khan needs Reform to poll minimum 5% across London .

    Calm down luv.

    I’m still calling it a double digit win for Khan. The Survation around 10% is probably the winning score, with a bit of MOE.

    Outer London has higher turn out than inner London? So what? That doesn’t disprove the 22% lead in Yougov, as outer London is still packed with intelligent people to be polled, who understood what they would be getting with Hall as the total unelectable wingnut she is.

    Even if Tories had put up a stronger candidate than Hall, I still think they would have lost to Khan. When it gets tight, incumbency brings a special bonus to these mayoralty contests.

    It’s likely becuase so many voters still know diddly squat about Hall and what she stands for, that’s she’s over performed here and only loses by about 10 - like a paper candidate magnet for Khan dissatisfaction, but only for those who haven’t been paying proper attention what they’re actually voting for.
    We’re going in different directions! I’m much less certain of a Khan win now !
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    edited May 3
    kle4 said:

    These post office lawyers and managers really do overstretch the 'I'm incompetent, not a liar' defence I see.

    Former senior Post Office lawyer Jarnail Singh has denied that he knew about bugs in the Horizon system while sub-postmaster prosecutions continued for three years.

    However, lead counsel for the Horizon inquiry Jason Beer accused Mr Singh of telling a "big fat lie".

    Mr Singh was forwarded an email on the eve of the 2010 trial of Seema Misra, a sub-postmistress who was sent to jail while pregnant.

    It identified bugs in the Horizon system that should have been disclosed in Mrs Misra's trial.

    Mr Singh denied having read the email, despite being presented with evidence that he saved a copy to his hard drive and printed it off...

    When asked whether it was saved on the hard drive of his computer, Mr Singh said: "I don't even know what you're talking about.

    "I don't know how these things worked."

    "You don't know how to save a document?" Mr Beer asked.

    "I didn't know how to do it," Mr Singh responded, saying he wouldn't have had the technical knowledge either to do that or to understand the document itself.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1d4j5m3l08o

    Don't forget about the Japanese technology minister who didn't know how to use a computer because he always got his secretaries to do everything for him. People like that do exist, believe it or not.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/nov/15/japan-cyber-security-ministernever-used-computer-yoshitaka-sakurada
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Looking back, the fact Streeting wrote and posted that desperate and ugly tweet implies that even a few days ago Labour sensed trouble in London, despite the polls

    That’s a risky tweet designed to shore up the BME vote, especially Muslims disenchanted by Gaza

    Streeting tweeted that he was having cancer treatment whilst the Tories partied in No10 during lockdown... but he got the years mixed up and was therefore completely wrong The tweets still up, though, despite him knowing full well it is lies.

    But he is the future apparently
    Labour's desperate slavering to get into power and get a piece of the action is distasteful.
    If they didn't care about getting into power they'd have joined the LDs, so ambition is going to lead some astray from time to time.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368

    We are in the period of the phoney war. War has been declared, a massive barrage of shelling with the red scourge conquering new places. But the big battle lies ahead, and the armchair generals are poking a stick at the ashes and looking through their tinted/blinkered specs looking for guidance.

    I think the Sunak presser in Sheffield Teesside is the moment of the most shark-jumping for the blues. A win which - combined with results elsewhere - demonstrates that they will be obliterated once the fighting starts properly. And yet for now, the mood in team Sunak is WE'RE ALRIGHT! WE'RE ALRIGHT!

    If the Hall win is just a confection from CCHQ it has been quite clever as the Blackpool by election the Metro Mayors and the X00 lost Councillors has been lost in the fog of Khan's assumed defeat.

    Rabbit and AndyJS have done their bit on here too.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    Andy_JS said:

    kle4 said:

    These post office lawyers and managers really do overstretch the 'I'm incompetent, not a liar' defence I see.

    Former senior Post Office lawyer Jarnail Singh has denied that he knew about bugs in the Horizon system while sub-postmaster prosecutions continued for three years.

    However, lead counsel for the Horizon inquiry Jason Beer accused Mr Singh of telling a "big fat lie".

    Mr Singh was forwarded an email on the eve of the 2010 trial of Seema Misra, a sub-postmistress who was sent to jail while pregnant.

    It identified bugs in the Horizon system that should have been disclosed in Mrs Misra's trial.

    Mr Singh denied having read the email, despite being presented with evidence that he saved a copy to his hard drive and printed it off...

    When asked whether it was saved on the hard drive of his computer, Mr Singh said: "I don't even know what you're talking about.

    "I don't know how these things worked."

    "You don't know how to save a document?" Mr Beer asked.

    "I didn't know how to do it," Mr Singh responded, saying he wouldn't have had the technical knowledge either to do that or to understand the document itself.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1d4j5m3l08o

    Don't forget about the Japanese technology minister who didn't know how to use a computer because he always got his secretaries to do everything for him.
    Ah yes, Junichiro Rees-Moggasaki I believe it was.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,486

    We are in the period of the phoney war. War has been declared, a massive barrage of shelling with the red scourge conquering new places. But the big battle lies ahead, and the armchair generals are poking a stick at the ashes and looking through their tinted/blinkered specs looking for guidance.

    I think the Sunak presser in Sheffield Teesside is the moment of the most shark-jumping for the blues. A win which - combined with results elsewhere - demonstrates that they will be obliterated once the fighting starts properly. And yet for now, the mood in team Sunak is WE'RE ALRIGHT! WE'RE ALRIGHT!

    You are right in essence however there is always the important of “the big mo”. Remember there is still a lot of favourable media for the Tories, I noticed a bit of a sea change re Rwanda and immigration the last week and if the papers were flooded with a positive (although bs) spin for the blues, especially if Hall wins by some miracle, news, a few flights get off to Rwanda, the economy is looking better (again , in the press), and they can get a really good campaign on Starmer being “Sir Two-face”.

    think a time magazine type cover split with him smiling with a quote on one side and the other him frowning with his flip flop and the sub-header of “which lie are you believing?” Then there is potentially a lot to play for. Not a Tory win but an uncomfortable close win for Labour where they are led by the man who lost a huge huge lead.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,493
    edited May 3
    nico679 said:

    nico679 said:

    Reform polled about 6.5% in the by-election in Bromley . Khan needs Reform to poll minimum 5% across London .

    Calm down luv.

    I’m still calling it a double digit win for Khan. The Survation around 10% is probably the winning score, with a bit of MOE.

    Outer London has higher turn out than inner London? So what? That doesn’t disprove the 22% lead in Yougov, as outer London is still packed with intelligent people to be polled, who understood what they would be getting with Hall as the total unelectable wingnut she is.

    Even if Tories had put up a stronger candidate than Hall, I still think they would have lost to Khan. When it gets tight, incumbency brings a special bonus to these mayoralty contests.

    It’s likely becuase so many voters still know diddly squat about Hall and what she stands for, that’s she’s over performed here and only loses by about 10 - like a paper candidate magnet for Khan dissatisfaction, but only for those who haven’t been paying proper attention what they’re actually voting for.
    We’re going in different directions! I’m much less certain of a Khan win now !
    We’re not going in different directions, I clearly predicted a gap in the teens last night and earlier today.
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,457

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Quite. It has also been stated that car tyres produce vastly more particulates than exhaust emissions, especially heavy cars:

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/jun/03/car-tyres-produce-more-particle-pollution-than-exhausts-tests-show

    So possibly driving around a posh EV SUV isn't helping anyone's respiratory problems.
    That's deeply misleading - the vast bulk of particles from car tyres are large enough to fall straight on to the road surface. It's an issue for storm water runoff, not air quality.

    It's PM2.5 and NOx that are the immediate problem for human health - and in urban areas, they mostly come from ICE exhaust rather than tyres (or brakes, for that matter).
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,984

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Quite. It has also been stated that car tyres produce vastly more particulates than exhaust emissions, especially heavy cars:

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/jun/03/car-tyres-produce-more-particle-pollution-than-exhausts-tests-show

    So possibly driving around a posh EV SUV isn't helping anyone's respiratory problems.
    It’s time for much much tougher regulation on tyres than has erstwhile been the case. Virtually no progress on this for decades because regulators haven’t focused on it.

    The EU is (partially) on the case https://ecostandard.org/news_events/tyre-wear-an-underestimated-source-of-air-pollution-that-needs-to-be-tackled-in-the-eu/
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,516
    edited May 3
    Final turnout table for London Mayoral with increases or decreases.


  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,098

    James Ball
    @jamesrbuk
    ·
    1h
    I am extremely sceptical of that Sky News projection as it looks like a PNS-type variable plugged into a seat calculator. Maybe there’s something much cleverer under the hood, but these results do not otherwise suggest a hung parliament.

    https://twitter.com/jamesrbuk/status/1786434188230504926

    It's absolute bollox.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,984

    I was repeatedly assured on here that ULEZ was an extremely popular policy.

    ULEZ is an interesting one. It has majority support, not massively so, but clear majority. But electorally it was always risky as the support is not evenly weighted.

    The majority who benefit, benefit marginally, whereas the smaller groups of people who either had to pay extra, have stopped driving into certain areas or feared further anti-car changes (parking permits, 20mph, no car zones, confusing signage all part of it) see it as central to their politics.

    I suspect it has cost Khan the election, even though it does have majority support.

    For a lesson for the GE, VAT on private schools is a similar issue, it has majority support, is a good policy, but bad politics.
    The issue with ULEZ is that it is part of a stack of policies that are actually quite regressive in nature. If you are driving a 100K SUV EV round London, it's freebies all the way. If you are driving a small ICE hatchback, not so much.
    Quite. It has also been stated that car tyres produce vastly more particulates than exhaust emissions, especially heavy cars:

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/jun/03/car-tyres-produce-more-particle-pollution-than-exhausts-tests-show

    So possibly driving around a posh EV SUV isn't helping anyone's respiratory problems.
    The heaviest cars remain the biggest cars - Range Rover, Q7, X7 etc. None of which are EVs. I only changed the tyres on my Model Y on 31k miles because I didn't rotate them. Had I done so I would have got another 5k out of them easily, perhaps out to 40k.

    That is not a usage profile of a vehicle shedding chunks of rubber under its massive weight...
    My Zoe isn’t the heaviest out there either.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544
    edited May 3
    Staffordshire police election

    Con 73,500
    Lab 70,128
    LD 17,666

    Con hold

    https://twitter.com/journoontheedge/status/1786424173457199381/photo/1
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    Andy_JS said:

    Staffordshire police election

    Con 73,500
    Lab 70,128
    LD 17,666

    Con hold

    https://twitter.com/journoontheedge/status/1786424173457199381/photo/1

    FPTP switch saving a couple of PCCs is probably not worth the hassle its been.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,407

    We are in the period of the phoney war. War has been declared, a massive barrage of shelling with the red scourge conquering new places. But the big battle lies ahead, and the armchair generals are poking a stick at the ashes and looking through their tinted/blinkered specs looking for guidance.

    I think the Sunak presser in Sheffield Teesside is the moment of the most shark-jumping for the blues. A win which - combined with results elsewhere - demonstrates that they will be obliterated once the fighting starts properly. And yet for now, the mood in team Sunak is WE'RE ALRIGHT! WE'RE ALRIGHT!

    If the Hall win is just a confection from CCHQ it has been quite clever as the Blackpool by election the Metro Mayors and the X00 lost Councillors has been lost in the fog of Khan's assumed defeat.

    Rabbit and AndyJS have done their bit on here too.
    Can we not attack other posters integrity please?

    Rabbit and AndyJS were seeking value as punter, just like everyone else.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,695

    Joe Locker
    @JoeLocker96


    🗣"People aren't expecting miracles. They know our country is broken. They know local government is broken. Across the region, we have massive challenges, but they wanted somebody who could start to turn that around," says
    @ClaireWard4EM
    .

    https://twitter.com/JoeLocker96
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,544

    Final turnout table for London Mayoral with increases or decreases.


    Lambeth & Southwark is a shocker for Labour.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071

    Final turnout table for London Mayoral with increases or decreases.


    Those of us not in the know, which are the nore Tory friendly areas?
This discussion has been closed.