Ballot Box Scotland @BallotBoxScot Projecting YouGov 26-29 Apr into seats (changes vs 25 Mar - 2 Apr / vs 2021):
SNP ~ 47 (+3 / -17) Labour ~ 39 (-3 / +17) Conservative ~ 23 (+1 / -8) Green ~ 10 (nc / +2) Lib Dem ~ 10 (nc / +6) Reform UK ~ 0 (-1 / nc)
A horribly fragmented parliament on those YouGov numbers. If the Greens decided to support the SNP, Sarwar would need the SCONS to vote for him to become FM. I'm not really sure UK Labour or Starmer would want a Holyrood election before the GE if you ended up with Holyrood like this.
@TheScreamingEagles, you are certainly educating us with respect to Shakespeare...
Phew, somebody spotted my two subtle Macbeth references.
I plan to do other threads with headlines from other Shakespeare plays.
I love Shakespeare.
All things considered, Macbeth is my favourite Shakespeare play.
With the possible exception of Hamlet. And Romeo and Juliet of course...
Hamlet for me.
Othello is bloody good. Midsummer Night’s Dream is enchanting. Romeo and Juliet is a ridiculously strong story. Henry V is genuinely stirring. Richard III is stuffed with great moments
Hamlet and Macbeth are titanic
The only time I’ve cried at a Shakespeare play was Nicol Williamson playing Hamlet at the Roundhouse. It was a famous production in 1969 - I didn’t see it THERE. I was a tiny tot
I have seen Macbeth in the open air under the walls of Cawdor castle. Micro production with 3 or 4 actors doing all parts. What sticks in my mind is the witches scenes where 3 of them sat round the cauldron and the 4th was concealed by the stage except for his hands in orange washing up gloves which he wiggled under the cauldron, as flames.
Literally the first time I ever saw Macbeth was live at the Globe - where it would have been first enacted back in Shakespeare’s day. I had no idea it was that good. It is that good. So many superb lines. Genius
Incidentally I am reading (and listening to, as I drive) a brilliant biography of Napoleon by Adam Zamoyski. Much better than the hagiographic snooze fest by Andrew Roberts
I’ve learned that Napoleon was accused of incestuously coupling with his sisters (with some evidence…)
Also that his name for Josephine’s noo-noo was “your little rascal”
And also that he was mildly obsessed with British poetry. Especially Ossian - he was insane for Ossian - and also Othello. He could quote large chunks of Othello (presumably in French)
My first MacBeth was a school trip. Albert Finney. My abiding memory is of some of the lads lobbing pork pies from the gallery into the stalls during lights out.
Best ever film version - Kurosawa's Throne of Blood. Toshiro Mifune (Macbeth character) in the film looks a bit like H Useless.
I would be amazed if he ran for leader rather than took it on as temporary caretaker. The only motive for the former would be to take the hit for electoral defeat and leave a cleanish sheet for his successor, and I don't think even he's that selfless.
Contra Unionist sneering he's quite popular in the party and seen as honourable so would work as a calming caretaker. I believe his wife has MS so I guess he would be doing a lot of consulting with her before taking on all the shite that goes with being even a temporary leader.
Ballot Box Scotland @BallotBoxScot Projecting YouGov 26-29 Apr into seats (changes vs 25 Mar - 2 Apr / vs 2021):
SNP ~ 47 (+3 / -17) Labour ~ 39 (-3 / +17) Conservative ~ 23 (+1 / -8) Green ~ 10 (nc / +2) Lib Dem ~ 10 (nc / +6) Reform UK ~ 0 (-1 / nc)
A horribly fragmented parliament on those YouGov numbers. If the Greens decided to support the SNP, Sarwar would need the SCONS to vote for him to become FM. I'm not really sure UK Labour or Starmer would want a Holyrood election before the GE if you ended up with Holyrood like this.
A fag end SNP minority government propped up by the SCons who would also block indyref2 would probably suit SLab and Starmer fine
@TheScreamingEagles, you are certainly educating us with respect to Shakespeare...
Phew, somebody spotted my two subtle Macbeth references.
I plan to do other threads with headlines from other Shakespeare plays.
I love Shakespeare.
All things considered, Macbeth is my favourite Shakespeare play.
With the possible exception of Hamlet. And Romeo and Juliet of course...
Hamlet for me.
May Tempests rage about you.
"Cry havoc, and let slip the dogs of war!"
Democratic slogan (one anyway) for 2024 IF Donald Trump selects Kristi Noem as VP running mate.
Though it's true since WW2, it's often been role for side-kick on POTUS ticket, to be the political-partisan attack dog, allowing presidential candidate to appear (at least by contrast) more "presidential'.
Richard Nixon did this for Dwight Eisenhower in 1952 & 1956; Spiro Agnew did same for RN in 1968 & 1972. After Watergate, in 1976 unelected incumbent Pres. Gerald Ford named Bob Dole as HIS (prospective) VP attack dog (instead of his actual also unelected VP Nelson Rockefeller who was anathema to hard-core GOPers of that era). In 1988 & 1992, Dan Quayle attempted the role for George Bush the Elder, but with limited success due to DQ's permanent status as a national joke.
Rather ironically, when Bob Dole (NOT a joke) ran for POTUS versus Bill Clinton in 1996, his VP pick, Jack Kemp, proved to be a friendly puppy by comparison, who beyond reasonably progressive record on race relations if not civil rights per se, combined with hard-conservative views for that day, added little to the ticket.
Similar situation with Tim Kaine as VP with Hillary Clinton in 2016. Not exactly sure what he brought to the party, but he was definitely NOT gnawing away Trump/Pence's ankles or underbelly.
Democratic POTSUS candidates have tended NOT to unleash their VPs as dogs of war. More typically they are ticket balancers and/or regional-demographic appealers. For example
> John Sparkman 1952, Estes Kefauver 1956, Lyndon Johnson 1960, Lloyd Bentsen 1988 were Southerners and (except for Kefauver) considered more conservative than the Northerner top of the ticket;
> Though Lloyd Bentsen DID puncture Dan Quayles balloon permanently, when he noted that "I knew Jack Kennedy, and served with Jack Kennedy - sir, you are no Jack Kennedy". One of THE Great Burns of US political history;
> In 1976 & 1980 Jimmy Carter reversed the regional-ideological dynamic, by picking Walter Mondale, a Northern liberal to balance HIS ticket: "Grits & Fritz"; Al Gore tried to do something similar by selecting Northerner Joe Liebeman for VP, who as first Jewish major-party candidate added that luster to the ticket.
Other various example of other POTUS-VP ticket dynamics but have to get to my day job!
I would be amazed if he ran for leader rather than took it on as temporary caretaker. The only motive for the former would be to take the hit for electoral defeat and leave a cleanish sheet for his successor, and I don't think even he's that selfless.
Contra Unionist sneering he's quite popular in the party and seen as honourable so would work as a calming caretaker. I believe his wife has MS so I guess he would be doing a lot of consulting with her before taking on all the shite that goes with being even a temporary leader.
You can get medication for that premature thing
Scott_xP Posts: 33,024 8:40AM And he's gone... Flag Quote · Like
Not sure what the point of Yousaf resigning is, unless his successor can restart a coalition government with the Greens or do a deal with Alba he still can't govern. Swinney may be the safest pair of hands but his last stint as SNP leader was hardly glorious
Given that she's the One Who Lost To Hamza Yousaf, wouldn't the omens for her ascension be pretty poor?
Not a fan, as I oppose her central, independence, policy, but I think she has colossal potential to be a very good leader. She only just lost to Yousef (52/48) which, given the flak she gets for her unfashionable views on 'personal conscience' matters, was pretty good.
Ask the question: Who do the Labour and Conservative parties want and not want? I think they both don't want Forbes.
Ask the question: Who would you have if you want a really broad cross section of Scots to take independence seriously? For that I think she is in the frame.
I would be amazed if he ran for leader rather than took it on as temporary caretaker. The only motive for the former would be to take the hit for electoral defeat and leave a cleanish sheet for his successor, and I don't think even he's that selfless.
Contra Unionist sneering he's quite popular in the party and seen as honourable so would work as a calming caretaker. I believe his wife has MS so I guess he would be doing a lot of consulting with her before taking on all the shite that goes with being even a temporary leader.
You can get medication for that premature thing
Scott_xP Posts: 33,024 8:40AM And he's gone... Flag Quote · Like
You think he wasn't gone at 8:40 this morning?
Fuck, you really are out of touch.
They'll be asking you to hand in your flag next...
"When in July 2000 Alex Salmond made the surprise announcement that he was stepping down as the SNP's leader after a decade in the job, heavy betting pointed to Swinney as his preferred successor. At the Inverness SNP conference that September, he was elected leader by 67% of the votes to fundamentalist Alex Neil's 33%, and in his victory speech said: "I stand here as the first leader in the history of the SNP who has a hard headed opportunity to lead our party into government and our country on to independence.""
@TheScreamingEagles, you are certainly educating us with respect to Shakespeare...
Phew, somebody spotted my two subtle Macbeth references.
I plan to do other threads with headlines from other Shakespeare plays.
I love Shakespeare.
All things considered, Macbeth is my favourite Shakespeare play.
With the possible exception of Hamlet. And Romeo and Juliet of course...
Hamlet for me.
Othello is bloody good. Midsummer Night’s Dream is enchanting. Romeo and Juliet is a ridiculously strong story. Henry V is genuinely stirring. Richard III is stuffed with great moments
Hamlet and Macbeth are titanic
The only time I’ve cried at a Shakespeare play was Nicol Williamson playing Hamlet at the Roundhouse. It was a famous production in 1969 - I didn’t see it THERE. I was a tiny tot
I have seen Macbeth in the open air under the walls of Cawdor castle. Micro production with 3 or 4 actors doing all parts. What sticks in my mind is the witches scenes where 3 of them sat round the cauldron and the 4th was concealed by the stage except for his hands in orange washing up gloves which he wiggled under the cauldron, as flames.
Literally the first time I ever saw Macbeth was live at the Globe - where it would have been first enacted back in Shakespeare’s day. I had no idea it was that good. It is that good. So many superb lines. Genius
Incidentally I am reading (and listening to, as I drive) a brilliant biography of Napoleon by Adam Zamoyski. Much better than the hagiographic snooze fest by Andrew Roberts
I’ve learned that Napoleon was accused of incestuously coupling with his sisters (with some evidence…)
Also that his name for Josephine’s noo-noo was “your little rascal”
And also that he was mildly obsessed with British poetry. Especially Ossian - he was insane for Ossian - and also Othello. He could quote large chunks of Othello (presumably in French)
My first MacBeth was a school trip. Albert Finney. My abiding memory is of some of the lads lobbing pork pies from the gallery into the stalls during lights out.
Best ever film version - Kurosawa's Throne of Blood. Toshiro Mifune (Macbeth character) in the film looks a bit like H Useless.
Yougov poll suggests there is a world in which Tories could hold *both* West Midlands and Tees Valley mayoralties - but it is very, very tight
Houchen is narrowly ahead in Tees Valley
Street is only just ahead in West Mids but Yougov says it's within margin of error too close to call
Tees Valley (poll of 924 voters)
Ben Houchen, Tory - 51 Chris McEwan, Labour - 44 Simon Thorley, Lib Dem - 5
West Midlands (poll of 1495 voters) Andy Street, Tory - 41 Richard Parker, Labour - 39 Sunny Virk, Lib Dem - 2
For the avoidance of doubt, the LibDem figures are not in percentage points, they are the number of people who said they would be voting that way.
No chance of a joke at the Lib Dems' expense should be wasted, natch.
But.
If their vote is that willing to be squeezed in no-hope areas...
The Conservatives are in for some terrible nights this year.
But the Mayoral results for the Tories in both Teeside and West Midlands may turn out better than 2017!!
This week’s results are going to more than usually fascinating. I am expecting the Tories to outperform (admittedly extremely low) expectations, because of the putative Reform voters arriving at the polling station and realising they don’t have a candidate.
Also expecting Lib Dem and Green to outperform, as per usual, and Labour to appear to have disappointing night because of poor expectation management.
I would be amazed if he ran for leader rather than took it on as temporary caretaker. The only motive for the former would be to take the hit for electoral defeat and leave a cleanish sheet for his successor, and I don't think even he's that selfless.
Contra Unionist sneering he's quite popular in the party and seen as honourable so would work as a calming caretaker. I believe his wife has MS so I guess he would be doing a lot of consulting with her before taking on all the shite that goes with being even a temporary leader.
You can get medication for that premature thing
Scott_xP Posts: 33,024 8:40AM And he's gone... Flag Quote · Like
You think he wasn't gone at 8:40 this morning?
Fuck, you really are out of touch.
They'll be asking you to hand in your flag next...
Ah, you were just making a general point, albeit in your excitable 'I've just read a tweet!' way?
You read a tweet which you misunderstood and you..er..spurted.
You could always try 'this has never happened to me before'.
I want to thank @boulay for pointing me to Dinan. What a magical place
And unlike many insta-perfect French towns, not overrun with tourists
On a perfect spring evening - cloudless skies - I just walked down the Rue de Jerzual, which might be one of the prettiest streets in the world. All 15th century half timbered houses and medieval gates. For about 5 minutes I was entirely alone. The only person on that road. And all I could hear was luscious birdsong
Given that she's the One Who Lost To Hamza Yousaf, wouldn't the omens for her ascension be pretty poor?
Not a fan, as I oppose her central, independence, policy, but I think she has colossal potential to be a very good leader. She only just lost to Yousef (52/48) which, given the flak she gets for her unfashionable views on 'personal conscience' matters, was pretty good.
Ask the question: Who do the Labour and Conservative parties want and not want? I think they both don't want Forbes.
Ask the question: Who would you have if you want a really broad cross section of Scots to take independence seriously? For that I think she is in the frame.
She didn't lose to Yousaf, she lost to Nicola and her husband and their iron grip on the party at that time. That grip is now gone.
Like you I fundamentally oppose the independence policy but I still rate her highly. She seems competent in a sort of old fashioned way that we haven't seen for a while. I'd like to try competence, after all we have tried everything else.
Her problem is that she has made it crystal clear that she has absolutely no time for the Greens and it is mutual. What these last few days have shown is that in this Parliament at least you cannot have a stable government without them. Unless you can get one of the Unionist parties to play and I don't see how she sells that to her party. The Greens at least pretend to be for independence.
Her problem is that she has made it crystal clear that she has absolutely no time for the Greens and it is mutual. What these last few days have shown is that in this Parliament at least you cannot have a stable government without them.
I want to thank @boulay for pointing me to Dinan. What a magical place
And unlike many insta-perfect French towns, not overrun with tourists
On a perfect spring evening - cloudless skies - I just walked down the Rue de Jerzual, which might be one of the prettiest streets in the world. All 15th century half timbered houses and medieval gates. For about 5 minutes I was entirely alone. The only person on that road. And all I could hear was luscious birdsong
Glad you are enjoying it. It’s great on warm summer evenings too and never felt too full of tourists. The rue de la Cordonnerie is a cobbled street with plenty of bars down it and suitably lively on August evenings. It’s jokingly called “la rue de la soif” which is effectively “the road of thirst” for obvious reasons.
I want to thank @boulay for pointing me to Dinan. What a magical place
And unlike many insta-perfect French towns, not overrun with tourists
On a perfect spring evening - cloudless skies - I just walked down the Rue de Jerzual, which might be one of the prettiest streets in the world. All 15th century half timbered houses and medieval gates. For about 5 minutes I was entirely alone. The only person on that road. And all I could hear was luscious birdsong
Another lovely place I walked to and stayed in last year
Are you, really slowly, stalking me?!
I bet that Tom Knox fella isn't far behind either..
I would be amazed if he ran for leader rather than took it on as temporary caretaker. The only motive for the former would be to take the hit for electoral defeat and leave a cleanish sheet for his successor, and I don't think even he's that selfless.
Contra Unionist sneering he's quite popular in the party and seen as honourable so would work as a calming caretaker. I believe his wife has MS so I guess he would be doing a lot of consulting with her before taking on all the shite that goes with being even a temporary leader.
You can get medication for that premature thing
Scott_xP Posts: 33,024 8:40AM And he's gone... Flag Quote · Like
You think he wasn't gone at 8:40 this morning?
Fuck, you really are out of touch.
They'll be asking you to hand in your flag next...
I read your post at 8.40 and listened to Sky and the BBC saying it was expected and a news conference was due at 12noon
It was frankly a misleading post at the time you made it
And the greatest of the great Shakespeare plays are the Henry IV duo.
"Let us sit upon the ground and tell sad stories of the death of kings."
That reminds me of seeing Alan Howard perform Richard II, and Richard III, on the same day at the RSC. He was best in the first role (though great in both); David Suchet was Bolingbroke.
I want to thank @boulay for pointing me to Dinan. What a magical place
And unlike many insta-perfect French towns, not overrun with tourists
On a perfect spring evening - cloudless skies - I just walked down the Rue de Jerzual, which might be one of the prettiest streets in the world. All 15th century half timbered houses and medieval gates. For about 5 minutes I was entirely alone. The only person on that road. And all I could hear was luscious birdsong
Another lovely place I walked to and stayed in last year
Are you, really slowly, stalking me?!
I bet that Tom Knox fella isn't far behind either..
@TheScreamingEagles, you are certainly educating us with respect to Shakespeare...
Phew, somebody spotted my two subtle Macbeth references.
I plan to do other threads with headlines from other Shakespeare plays.
I love Shakespeare.
Come, you spirits that tend on mortal thoughts, unsex me here and fill me from the crown to the toe top-full of direst cruelty!
Adding my own subtle Lady Macbeth gender critical reference. Which is entirely on topic because apparently the SNP is in the mess it is because of its woke gender whatever.
Devolution might not have done much for ordinary Scots but it’s been a dripping roast for Scotland’s political elite. Take Humza Yousaf. He was First Minister for 13 months on an annual salary of almost £177,000 — more than the Prime Minister — of which £104,500 was for being FM (the balance was his MSP salary). He is now entitled to half his FM salary — £52,000 a year — FOR LIFE. Plus his MSP salary. Talk about snouts in the trough …"
Given that she's the One Who Lost To Hamza Yousaf, wouldn't the omens for her ascension be pretty poor?
Not a fan, as I oppose her central, independence, policy, but I think she has colossal potential to be a very good leader. She only just lost to Yousef (52/48) which, given the flak she gets for her unfashionable views on 'personal conscience' matters, was pretty good.
Ask the question: Who do the Labour and Conservative parties want and not want? I think they both don't want Forbes.
Ask the question: Who would you have if you want a really broad cross section of Scots to take independence seriously? For that I think she is in the frame.
She didn't lose to Yousaf, she lost to Nicola and her husband and their iron grip on the party at that time. That grip is now gone.
Like you I fundamentally oppose the independence policy but I still rate her highly. She seems competent in a sort of old fashioned way that we haven't seen for a while. I'd like to try competence, after all we have tried everything else.
Her problem is that she has made it crystal clear that she has absolutely no time for the Greens and it is mutual. What these last few days have shown is that in this Parliament at least you cannot have a stable government without them. Unless you can get one of the Unionist parties to play and I don't see how she sells that to her party. The Greens at least pretend to be for independence.
Crystal clear? Have things changed in the last couple of days?
'She wrote: "Let us get away from the language of who is and who is not acceptable to work with. For example, well before and during the Bute House Agreement, Patrick Harvie and I worked together – that is no secret. The question therefore isn’t whether my world is big enough to embrace the Greens – it is. The question is whether their world is big enough to embrace me. I hope and believe it is."'
Ballot Box Scotland @BallotBoxScot Projecting YouGov 26-29 Apr into seats (changes vs 25 Mar - 2 Apr / vs 2021):
SNP ~ 47 (+3 / -17) Labour ~ 39 (-3 / +17) Conservative ~ 23 (+1 / -8) Green ~ 10 (nc / +2) Lib Dem ~ 10 (nc / +6) Reform UK ~ 0 (-1 / nc)
A horribly fragmented parliament on those YouGov numbers. If the Greens decided to support the SNP, Sarwar would need the SCONS to vote for him to become FM. I'm not really sure UK Labour or Starmer would want a Holyrood election before the GE if you ended up with Holyrood like this.
Tory majority nailed on (Red plus Blue plus Forbes Caucus)
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
I want to thank @boulay for pointing me to Dinan. What a magical place
And unlike many insta-perfect French towns, not overrun with tourists
On a perfect spring evening - cloudless skies - I just walked down the Rue de Jerzual, which might be one of the prettiest streets in the world. All 15th century half timbered houses and medieval gates. For about 5 minutes I was entirely alone. The only person on that road. And all I could hear was luscious birdsong
Another lovely place I walked to and stayed in last year
Are you, really slowly, stalking me?!
I bet that Tom Knox fella isn't far behind either..
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
Given that she's the One Who Lost To Hamza Yousaf, wouldn't the omens for her ascension be pretty poor?
Not a fan, as I oppose her central, independence, policy, but I think she has colossal potential to be a very good leader. She only just lost to Yousef (52/48) which, given the flak she gets for her unfashionable views on 'personal conscience' matters, was pretty good.
Ask the question: Who do the Labour and Conservative parties want and not want? I think they both don't want Forbes.
Ask the question: Who would you have if you want a really broad cross section of Scots to take independence seriously? For that I think she is in the frame.
She didn't lose to Yousaf, she lost to Nicola and her husband and their iron grip on the party at that time. That grip is now gone.
Like you I fundamentally oppose the independence policy but I still rate her highly. She seems competent in a sort of old fashioned way that we haven't seen for a while. I'd like to try competence, after all we have tried everything else.
Her problem is that she has made it crystal clear that she has absolutely no time for the Greens and it is mutual. What these last few days have shown is that in this Parliament at least you cannot have a stable government without them. Unless you can get one of the Unionist parties to play and I don't see how she sells that to her party. The Greens at least pretend to be for independence.
Forbes and the Greens will come to an understanding if both decide they need each other.
If Forbes is as smart as you say she is she won't repeat precisely the same unforced error that brought Yousaf down literally hours ago. The Greens are in a powerful position and can name their price. That looks like a basis for a deal.
@TheScreamingEagles, you are certainly educating us with respect to Shakespeare...
Phew, somebody spotted my two subtle Macbeth references.
I plan to do other threads with headlines from other Shakespeare plays.
I love Shakespeare.
All things considered, Macbeth is my favourite Shakespeare play.
With the possible exception of Hamlet. And Romeo and Juliet of course...
Hamlet for me.
Othello is bloody good. Midsummer Night’s Dream is enchanting. Romeo and Juliet is a ridiculously strong story. Henry V is genuinely stirring. Richard III is stuffed with great moments
Hamlet and Macbeth are titanic
The only time I’ve cried at a Shakespeare play was Nicol Williamson playing Hamlet at the Roundhouse. It was a famous production in 1969 - I didn’t see it THERE. I was a tiny tot
I have seen Macbeth in the open air under the walls of Cawdor castle. Micro production with 3 or 4 actors doing all parts. What sticks in my mind is the witches scenes where 3 of them sat round the cauldron and the 4th was concealed by the stage except for his hands in orange washing up gloves which he wiggled under the cauldron, as flames.
Literally the first time I ever saw Macbeth was live at the Globe - where it would have been first enacted back in Shakespeare’s day. I had no idea it was that good. It is that good. So many superb lines. Genius
Incidentally I am reading (and listening to, as I drive) a brilliant biography of Napoleon by Adam Zamoyski. Much better than the hagiographic snooze fest by Andrew Roberts
I’ve learned that Napoleon was accused of incestuously coupling with his sisters (with some evidence…)
Also that his name for Josephine’s noo-noo was “your little rascal”
And also that he was mildly obsessed with British poetry. Especially Ossian - he was insane for Ossian - and also Othello. He could quote large chunks of Othello (presumably in French)
I've read that biography. Certainly came across as a more nuanced take on Napoleon that we often get.
He’s either a warrior hero or a proto-Hitler. This seems to be an attempt to judge him in the round. It’s also full of salacious gossip, which was sadly lacking from Roberts’ effort - which I abandoned half way through. Also endless detailed discourse about battles and enfilades and flanking movements gets old very fast.
I also got bored of Andrew Robert's Napolean and failed to finish it.
Of memorable Shakespeare performances I will give a shout to the Handlebards (https://www.handlebards.com) who tour the country every summer on bicycles giving four person outdoor performances of the classics. Their comedic slant on Hamlet from a few years ago was outrageously good.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
@TheScreamingEagles, you are certainly educating us with respect to Shakespeare...
Phew, somebody spotted my two subtle Macbeth references.
I plan to do other threads with headlines from other Shakespeare plays.
I love Shakespeare.
All things considered, Macbeth is my favourite Shakespeare play.
With the possible exception of Hamlet. And Romeo and Juliet of course...
Hamlet for me.
Othello is bloody good. Midsummer Night’s Dream is enchanting. Romeo and Juliet is a ridiculously strong story. Henry V is genuinely stirring. Richard III is stuffed with great moments
Hamlet and Macbeth are titanic
The only time I’ve cried at a Shakespeare play was Nicol Williamson playing Hamlet at the Roundhouse. It was a famous production in 1969 - I didn’t see it THERE. I was a tiny tot
I have seen Macbeth in the open air under the walls of Cawdor castle. Micro production with 3 or 4 actors doing all parts. What sticks in my mind is the witches scenes where 3 of them sat round the cauldron and the 4th was concealed by the stage except for his hands in orange washing up gloves which he wiggled under the cauldron, as flames.
Literally the first time I ever saw Macbeth was live at the Globe - where it would have been first enacted back in Shakespeare’s day. I had no idea it was that good. It is that good. So many superb lines. Genius
Incidentally I am reading (and listening to, as I drive) a brilliant biography of Napoleon by Adam Zamoyski. Much better than the hagiographic snooze fest by Andrew Roberts
I’ve learned that Napoleon was accused of incestuously coupling with his sisters (with some evidence…)
Also that his name for Josephine’s noo-noo was “your little rascal”
And also that he was mildly obsessed with British poetry. Especially Ossian - he was insane for Ossian - and also Othello. He could quote large chunks of Othello (presumably in French)
I've read that biography. Certainly came across as a more nuanced take on Napoleon that we often get.
He’s either a warrior hero or a proto-Hitler. This seems to be an attempt to judge him in the round. It’s also full of salacious gossip, which was sadly lacking from Roberts’ effort - which I abandoned half way through. Also endless detailed discourse about battles and enfilades and flanking movements gets old very fast.
I also got bored of Andrew Robert's Napolean and failed to finish it.
I don't know why Roberts decided to die in ditch over trying to make him out to be a great man. His George III was much better and much more convincing.
Maybe he liked the way Napoleon laid the smack down. Or maybe he just wanted to differentiate himself in the English language market.
Sir Graham Brady has said Tory members should be stripped of their ability to pick the next leader when the party is in government
A leaked recording reveals the 1922 chairman said last week that the current setup is “crazy”.
He’s got a point. Same applies to Labour. The basis of the constitution rests on the PM having the confidence of the House. Not the confidence of those who stump up however much it costs to join the relevant party.
Sir Graham Brady has said Tory members should be stripped of their ability to pick the next leader when the party is in government
A leaked recording reveals the 1922 chairman said last week that the current setup is “crazy”.
I think he is absolutely right, both in the idea that the vote should remain with the MPs and that he will never get that change through because of the members' power
Off topic, but you may like this detail about Doug Burgum: "He attended North Dakota State University (NDSU) to earn his undergraduate degree in 1978. During his senior year at NDSU, he applied to the Stanford Graduate School of Business. He also started a chimney-sweeping business. "The newspaper wrote a story about me as a chimney sweep", he later recalled; it "ran a photo of me sitting on top of an icy chimney in below-freezing weather in Fargo. The story made the AP wire service. I was later told it caused quite a stir in the Stanford admissions office: 'Hey, there's a chimney sweep from North Dakota who's applied." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Burgum
He went on to become a very successful businessman and Microsoft executive, before becoming North Dakota governor.:
Sir Graham Brady has said Tory members should be stripped of their ability to pick the next leader when the party is in government
A leaked recording reveals the 1922 chairman said last week that the current setup is “crazy”.
This is the Tory’s “Clause 4”. Fixing this disastrous set up (thank you, William Hague) is a pre-requisite for letting them back into power, maybe some time in the 2030s.
Given that she's the One Who Lost To Hamza Yousaf, wouldn't the omens for her ascension be pretty poor?
No- as soon as the vacancy arose, the SNP hierarchy (P Murrell) tore up the rule book, restricted the campaign spending to pocket money and curtailed hustings to his self selected acolytes to ensure HY won. Even then it was a close run thing.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
@TheScreamingEagles, you are certainly educating us with respect to Shakespeare...
Phew, somebody spotted my two subtle Macbeth references.
I plan to do other threads with headlines from other Shakespeare plays.
I love Shakespeare.
All things considered, Macbeth is my favourite Shakespeare play.
With the possible exception of Hamlet. And Romeo and Juliet of course...
Hamlet for me.
Othello is bloody good. Midsummer Night’s Dream is enchanting. Romeo and Juliet is a ridiculously strong story. Henry V is genuinely stirring. Richard III is stuffed with great moments
Hamlet and Macbeth are titanic
The only time I’ve cried at a Shakespeare play was Nicol Williamson playing Hamlet at the Roundhouse. It was a famous production in 1969 - I didn’t see it THERE. I was a tiny tot
I have seen Macbeth in the open air under the walls of Cawdor castle. Micro production with 3 or 4 actors doing all parts. What sticks in my mind is the witches scenes where 3 of them sat round the cauldron and the 4th was concealed by the stage except for his hands in orange washing up gloves which he wiggled under the cauldron, as flames.
Literally the first time I ever saw Macbeth was live at the Globe - where it would have been first enacted back in Shakespeare’s day. I had no idea it was that good. It is that good. So many superb lines. Genius
Incidentally I am reading (and listening to, as I drive) a brilliant biography of Napoleon by Adam Zamoyski. Much better than the hagiographic snooze fest by Andrew Roberts
I’ve learned that Napoleon was accused of incestuously coupling with his sisters (with some evidence…)
Also that his name for Josephine’s noo-noo was “your little rascal”
And also that he was mildly obsessed with British poetry. Especially Ossian - he was insane for Ossian - and also Othello. He could quote large chunks of Othello (presumably in French)
I've read that biography. Certainly came across as a more nuanced take on Napoleon that we often get.
He’s either a warrior hero or a proto-Hitler. This seems to be an attempt to judge him in the round. It’s also full of salacious gossip, which was sadly lacking from Roberts’ effort - which I abandoned half way through. Also endless detailed discourse about battles and enfilades and flanking movements gets old very fast.
I also got bored of Andrew Robert's Napolean and failed to finish it.
I don't know why Roberts decided to die in ditch over trying to make him out to be a great man. His George III was much better and much more convincing.
Maybe he liked the way Napoleon laid the smack down. Or maybe he just wanted to differentiate himself in the English language market.
There's plenty of hagiographies of Napoleon in English. In fact the rarest thing seems to be a full blooded condemnation. And there is plenty to condemn.
The recent film was rubbish and weird - what was going on there?
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a policy designed to “stop the boats”. That’s a bit different to scaring those who’ve already got here to leave for Ireland. Which is what it might have done thus far. In doing so to cause a diplomatic bust up with our neighbours - but I guess that’s also a positive in Tory eyes, even though quite how it helps anyone resolve the issue I have no idea. Doubtless Tories think those Frogs and Paddies will see sense soon and change policy to suit us.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
Devolution might not have done much for ordinary Scots but it’s been a dripping roast for Scotland’s political elite. Take Humza Yousaf. He was First Minister for 13 months on an annual salary of almost £177,000 — more than the Prime Minister — of which £104,500 was for being FM (the balance was his MSP salary). He is now entitled to half his FM salary — £52,000 a year — FOR LIFE. Plus his MSP salary. Talk about snouts in the trough …"
Off topic, but you may like this detail about Doug Burgum: "He attended North Dakota State University (NDSU) to earn his undergraduate degree in 1978. During his senior year at NDSU, he applied to the Stanford Graduate School of Business. He also started a chimney-sweeping business. "The newspaper wrote a story about me as a chimney sweep", he later recalled; it "ran a photo of me sitting on top of an icy chimney in below-freezing weather in Fargo. The story made the AP wire service. I was later told it caused quite a stir in the Stanford admissions office: 'Hey, there's a chimney sweep from North Dakota who's applied." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Burgum
He went on to become a very successful businessman and Microsoft executive, before becoming North Dakota governor.:
What's is Gov Doug Burgum's position on supporting, aiding and abetting efforts by the President and henchpeople, to overthrow the government and Constitution of the United States, in order to overturn the results of a presidential election, past OR future?
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
Why do we need to fly them to Rwanda when we can just bus them to the Irish border? I would even accept Parliament declaring Ireland a safe country.... possibly. We should have this as the basic policy. We could get rid of thousands at a fraction of the cost.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a classic example of trying to move a problem without resolving it. Presumably said migrants can enter Ireland from France so we might end up having refugee camps on the Irish border instead of Calais which will presuambly mean we'll have to waste time and resources strengthening that border as migrants use that as another option.
Perhaps we'll need naval patrols in the Irish Sea to deter those trying to cross from Ireland.
What is the "plan"? Deterrence presumably but if we get hundreds coming in during the summer from France AND Ireland along with those already here how many are we realistically going to be able to send to Kigali?
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a policy designed to “stop the boats”. That’s a bit different to scaring those who’ve already got here to leave for Ireland. Which is what it might have done thus far. In doing so to cause a diplomatic bust up with our neighbours - but I guess that’s also a positive in Tory eyes, even though quite how it helps anyone resolve the issue I have no idea. Doubtless Tories think those Frogs and Paddies will see sense soon and change policy to suit us.
There was a meeting with the Irish and UK governments today when the UK rejected the idea of accepting returning asylum seekers without a similar agreement with France
This is not going away, and it is likely to be discussed at EU and French levels and maybe we could see a united attempt by all parties to stop the boats and address the wider issue of asylum seekers and Europe's own border problems
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a policy designed to “stop the boats”. That’s a bit different to scaring those who’ve already got here to leave for Ireland. Which is what it might have done thus far. In doing so to cause a diplomatic bust up with our neighbours - but I guess that’s also a positive in Tory eyes, even though quite how it helps anyone resolve the issue I have no idea. Doubtless Tories think those Frogs and Paddies will see sense soon and change policy to suit us.
There was a meeting with the Irish and UK governments today when the UK rejected the idea of accepting returning asylum seekers without a similar agreement with France
This is not going away, and it is likely to be discussed at EU and French levels and maybe we could see a united attempt by all parties to stop the boats and address the wider issue of asylum seekers and Europe's own border problems
Am I alone in finding it morbidly funny that those who shout loudest about sending immigrants back to that "safe country" France are also the most indignant that the Irish might want their immigrants to come back here?
Given that she's the One Who Lost To Hamza Yousaf, wouldn't the omens for her ascension be pretty poor?
Not a fan, as I oppose her central, independence, policy, but I think she has colossal potential to be a very good leader. She only just lost to Yousef (52/48) which, given the flak she gets for her unfashionable views on 'personal conscience' matters, was pretty good.
Ask the question: Who do the Labour and Conservative parties want and not want? I think they both don't want Forbes.
Ask the question: Who would you have if you want a really broad cross section of Scots to take independence seriously? For that I think she is in the frame.
She didn't lose to Yousaf, she lost to Nicola and her husband and their iron grip on the party at that time. That grip is now gone.
Like you I fundamentally oppose the independence policy but I still rate her highly. She seems competent in a sort of old fashioned way that we haven't seen for a while. I'd like to try competence, after all we have tried everything else.
Her problem is that she has made it crystal clear that she has absolutely no time for the Greens and it is mutual. What these last few days have shown is that in this Parliament at least you cannot have a stable government without them. Unless you can get one of the Unionist parties to play and I don't see how she sells that to her party. The Greens at least pretend to be for independence.
Crystal clear? Have things changed in the last couple of days?
'She wrote: "Let us get away from the language of who is and who is not acceptable to work with. For example, well before and during the Bute House Agreement, Patrick Harvie and I worked together – that is no secret. The question therefore isn’t whether my world is big enough to embrace the Greens – it is. The question is whether their world is big enough to embrace me. I hope and believe it is."'
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
It doesn't seem a credible argument that asylum seekers are so afraid of Rwanda that they are desperate to get to Ireland, yet 500 more are so unbothered by the threat to arrive by small boat over the last weekend, and record arrivals for the first 4 months of 2024 despite the foul weather.
It doesn't add up.
Leicester 1 nil up. Looks like we are going up as Champions.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a classic example of trying to move a problem without resolving it. Presumably said migrants can enter Ireland from France so we might end up having refugee camps on the Irish border instead of Calais which will presuambly mean we'll have to waste time and resources strengthening that border as migrants use that as another option.
Perhaps we'll need naval patrols in the Irish Sea to deter those trying to cross from Ireland.
What is the "plan"? Deterrence presumably but if we get hundreds coming in during the summer from France AND Ireland along with those already here how many are we realistically going to be able to send to Kigali?
The plan is to wait until we can all point and laugh at Starmer. And say, 'ohh, if only you had kept going with our plan...'
(There's a bit of selection bias going on here as well. That people moving from the UK to Ireland are pointing out Rwanda fear is probably true and certainly rational. But just because that subset of migrants are mentioning it doesn't tell us about the totality of migrants crossing the channel. (To put it in terms PBers will relate to, it would be like doing an opinion poll based solely on parents picking up children from school.))
Meanwhile, since the 'Rwanda Is Safe, Whatever You Think' Law passed, 500 migrants have been detected entering the UK, and the weather was pretty grim last week.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a policy designed to “stop the boats”. That’s a bit different to scaring those who’ve already got here to leave for Ireland. Which is what it might have done thus far. In doing so to cause a diplomatic bust up with our neighbours - but I guess that’s also a positive in Tory eyes, even though quite how it helps anyone resolve the issue I have no idea. Doubtless Tories think those Frogs and Paddies will see sense soon and change policy to suit us.
There was a meeting with the Irish and UK governments today when the UK rejected the idea of accepting returning asylum seekers without a similar agreement with France
This is not going away, and it is likely to be discussed at EU and French levels and maybe we could see a united attempt by all parties to stop the boats and address the wider issue of asylum seekers and Europe's own border problems
Yes. I know what was discussed today and nothing came of it save gloating by the usual suspects in blue and no indication that anyone has any constructive solutions. Given the view of the Tories towards any sort of deal with Europe, “the only think the EU understands is pain”, the idea of cooperation from this Government on this is laughable. Sunak wants the Reform votes and cooperation with Johnny Foreigner isn’t on the menu.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a policy designed to “stop the boats”. That’s a bit different to scaring those who’ve already got here to leave for Ireland. Which is what it might have done thus far. In doing so to cause a diplomatic bust up with our neighbours - but I guess that’s also a positive in Tory eyes, even though quite how it helps anyone resolve the issue I have no idea. Doubtless Tories think those Frogs and Paddies will see sense soon and change policy to suit us.
There was a meeting with the Irish and UK governments today when the UK rejected the idea of accepting returning asylum seekers without a similar agreement with France
This is not going away, and it is likely to be discussed at EU and French levels and maybe we could see a united attempt by all parties to stop the boats and address the wider issue of asylum seekers and Europe's own border problems
Am I alone in finding it morbidly funny that those who shout loudest about sending immigrants back to that "safe country" France are also the most indignant that the Irish might want their immigrants to come back here?
If you've got the right sense of humour, there's plenty of it on both sides.
I'm seeing people on Twatter, Reddit etc arguing that declaring countries safe by fiat of the executive is Good For Us, Bad for You. On both sides. Also, shovelling spare refugees around is awesome when it's done by People I Like. Also bigotry against refugees is just terrible. Apart from the odd bit of protesting of hostels etc by My Side.
I suspect that O'Leary will be flying Rwanda flights. From Dublin.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a policy designed to “stop the boats”. That’s a bit different to scaring those who’ve already got here to leave for Ireland. Which is what it might have done thus far. In doing so to cause a diplomatic bust up with our neighbours - but I guess that’s also a positive in Tory eyes, even though quite how it helps anyone resolve the issue I have no idea. Doubtless Tories think those Frogs and Paddies will see sense soon and change policy to suit us.
There was a meeting with the Irish and UK governments today when the UK rejected the idea of accepting returning asylum seekers without a similar agreement with France
This is not going away, and it is likely to be discussed at EU and French levels and maybe we could see a united attempt by all parties to stop the boats and address the wider issue of asylum seekers and Europe's own border problems
Am I alone in finding it morbidly funny that those who shout loudest about sending immigrants back to that "safe country" France are also the most indignant that the Irish might want their immigrants to come back here?
It's reasonable if we want the principle of "sending the migrants back from where they've come", that should apply to any illegal immigrant seeking to enter Ireland from Britain as it would any illegal immigrant seeking to enter Britain from either France or Ireland.
Expanding this issue to the island of Ireland isn't going to make it go away and indeed sets up more expense and trouble for us (and the Irish).
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a classic example of trying to move a problem without resolving it. Presumably said migrants can enter Ireland from France so we might end up having refugee camps on the Irish border instead of Calais which will presuambly mean we'll have to waste time and resources strengthening that border as migrants use that as another option.
Perhaps we'll need naval patrols in the Irish Sea to deter those trying to cross from Ireland.
What is the "plan"? Deterrence presumably but if we get hundreds coming in during the summer from France AND Ireland along with those already here how many are we realistically going to be able to send to Kigali?
Migrants in France can't get to Ireland by sea, and as Ireland is not in Shengen, their best route has always been via UK.
Given that she's the One Who Lost To Hamza Yousaf, wouldn't the omens for her ascension be pretty poor?
Not a fan, as I oppose her central, independence, policy, but I think she has colossal potential to be a very good leader. She only just lost to Yousef (52/48) which, given the flak she gets for her unfashionable views on 'personal conscience' matters, was pretty good.
Ask the question: Who do the Labour and Conservative parties want and not want? I think they both don't want Forbes.
Ask the question: Who would you have if you want a really broad cross section of Scots to take independence seriously? For that I think she is in the frame.
She didn't lose to Yousaf, she lost to Nicola and her husband and their iron grip on the party at that time. That grip is now gone.
Like you I fundamentally oppose the independence policy but I still rate her highly. She seems competent in a sort of old fashioned way that we haven't seen for a while. I'd like to try competence, after all we have tried everything else.
Her problem is that she has made it crystal clear that she has absolutely no time for the Greens and it is mutual. What these last few days have shown is that in this Parliament at least you cannot have a stable government without them. Unless you can get one of the Unionist parties to play and I don't see how she sells that to her party. The Greens at least pretend to be for independence.
Crystal clear? Have things changed in the last couple of days?
'She wrote: "Let us get away from the language of who is and who is not acceptable to work with. For example, well before and during the Bute House Agreement, Patrick Harvie and I worked together – that is no secret. The question therefore isn’t whether my world is big enough to embrace the Greens – it is. The question is whether their world is big enough to embrace me. I hope and believe it is."'
Kate Forbes problem may not be the Greens, but large chunks of the SNP.
I would be quite surprised if she could form a cabinet just now if she did go for it. She's young enough and competent enough to bide her time though - if there is a whiff of the SNP shifting even a few steps to the right she could take her chance.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a classic example of trying to move a problem without resolving it. Presumably said migrants can enter Ireland from France so we might end up having refugee camps on the Irish border instead of Calais which will presuambly mean we'll have to waste time and resources strengthening that border as migrants use that as another option.
Perhaps we'll need naval patrols in the Irish Sea to deter those trying to cross from Ireland.
What is the "plan"? Deterrence presumably but if we get hundreds coming in during the summer from France AND Ireland along with those already here how many are we realistically going to be able to send to Kigali?
They can't get from France to Ireland, except by going through the UK - you're not going to get a RIB that far.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
This is a classic example of trying to move a problem without resolving it. Presumably said migrants can enter Ireland from France so we might end up having refugee camps on the Irish border instead of Calais which will presuambly mean we'll have to waste time and resources strengthening that border as migrants use that as another option.
Perhaps we'll need naval patrols in the Irish Sea to deter those trying to cross from Ireland.
What is the "plan"? Deterrence presumably but if we get hundreds coming in during the summer from France AND Ireland along with those already here how many are we realistically going to be able to send to Kigali?
Migrants in France can't get to Ireland by sea, and as Ireland is not in Shengen, their best route has always been via UK.
Then Ireland should put pressure on France to 'stop the boats'.
Something like the Rwanda scheme could well end up as an EU-wide policy, and all the people who are calling it unconscionable will suddenly decide that it's sensible and the right thing to do.
"The war of words has intensified between the UK and Irish governments over the possible effects of the Rwanda policy.
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
ITV news tonight interviewed asylum seekers in Ireland and they were unanimous about their fear of Rwanda
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
It doesn't seem a credible argument that asylum seekers are so afraid of Rwanda that they are desperate to get to Ireland, yet 500 more are so unbothered by the threat to arrive by small boat over the last weekend, and record arrivals for the first 4 months of 2024 despite the foul weather.
It doesn't add up.
Leicester 1 nil up. Looks like we are going up as Champions.
Depends on the awareness of Rwanda (among other things) in the refugee camps around Calais. Plus you are there and desperate.
Comments
But.
If their vote is that willing to be squeezed in no-hope areas...
The Conservatives are in for some terrible nights this year.
@BallotBoxScot
Projecting YouGov 26-29 Apr into seats (changes vs 25 Mar - 2 Apr / vs 2021):
SNP ~ 47 (+3 / -17)
Labour ~ 39 (-3 / +17)
Conservative ~ 23 (+1 / -8)
Green ~ 10 (nc / +2)
Lib Dem ~ 10 (nc / +6)
Reform UK ~ 0 (-1 / nc)
A horribly fragmented parliament on those YouGov numbers. If the Greens decided to support the SNP, Sarwar would need the SCONS to vote for him to become FM.
I'm not really sure UK Labour or Starmer would want a Holyrood election before the GE if you ended up with Holyrood like this.
Best ever film version - Kurosawa's Throne of Blood. Toshiro Mifune (Macbeth character) in the film looks a bit like H Useless.
Though it's true since WW2, it's often been role for side-kick on POTUS ticket, to be the political-partisan attack dog, allowing presidential candidate to appear (at least by contrast) more "presidential'.
Richard Nixon did this for Dwight Eisenhower in 1952 & 1956; Spiro Agnew did same for RN in 1968 & 1972. After Watergate, in 1976 unelected incumbent Pres. Gerald Ford named Bob Dole as HIS (prospective) VP attack dog (instead of his actual also unelected VP Nelson Rockefeller who was anathema to hard-core GOPers of that era). In 1988 & 1992, Dan Quayle attempted the role for George Bush the Elder, but with limited success due to DQ's permanent status as a national joke.
Rather ironically, when Bob Dole (NOT a joke) ran for POTUS versus Bill Clinton in 1996, his VP pick, Jack Kemp, proved to be a friendly puppy by comparison, who beyond reasonably progressive record on race relations if not civil rights per se, combined with hard-conservative views for that day, added little to the ticket.
Similar situation with Tim Kaine as VP with Hillary Clinton in 2016. Not exactly sure what he brought to the party, but he was definitely NOT gnawing away Trump/Pence's ankles or underbelly.
Democratic POTSUS candidates have tended NOT to unleash their VPs as dogs of war. More typically they are ticket balancers and/or regional-demographic appealers. For example
> John Sparkman 1952, Estes Kefauver 1956, Lyndon Johnson 1960, Lloyd Bentsen 1988 were Southerners and (except for Kefauver) considered more conservative than the Northerner top of the ticket;
> Though Lloyd Bentsen DID puncture Dan Quayles balloon permanently, when he noted that "I knew Jack Kennedy, and served with Jack Kennedy - sir, you are no Jack Kennedy". One of THE Great Burns of US political history;
> In 1976 & 1980 Jimmy Carter reversed the regional-ideological dynamic, by picking Walter Mondale, a Northern liberal to balance HIS ticket: "Grits & Fritz"; Al Gore tried to do something similar by selecting Northerner Joe Liebeman for VP, who as first Jewish major-party candidate added that luster to the ticket.
Other various example of other POTUS-VP ticket dynamics but have to get to my day job!
Scott_xP Posts: 33,024
8:40AM
And he's gone...
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Ask the question: Who do the Labour and Conservative parties want and not want? I think they both don't want Forbes.
Ask the question: Who would you have if you want a really broad cross section of Scots to take independence seriously? For that I think she is in the frame.
Fuck, you really are out of touch.
They'll be asking you to hand in your flag next...
https://thecritic.co.uk/the-roaring-boy-macbeth/
Contrary to the linked article, Peter did not do the soliloquies “brilliantly”. I remember being deeply embarrassed on his behalf.
Also expecting Lib Dem and Green to outperform, as per usual, and Labour to appear to have disappointing night because of poor expectation management.
You read a tweet which you misunderstood and you..er..spurted.
You could always try 'this has never happened to me before'.
Which part of that are you struggling with?
And unlike many insta-perfect French towns, not overrun with tourists
On a perfect spring evening - cloudless skies - I just walked down the Rue de Jerzual, which might be one of the prettiest streets in the world. All 15th century half timbered houses and medieval gates. For about 5 minutes I was entirely alone. The only person on that road. And all I could hear was luscious birdsong
Like you I fundamentally oppose the independence policy but I still rate her highly. She seems competent in a sort of old fashioned way that we haven't seen for a while. I'd like to try competence, after all we have tried everything else.
Her problem is that she has made it crystal clear that she has absolutely no time for the Greens and it is mutual. What these last few days have shown is that in this Parliament at least you cannot have a stable government without them. Unless you can get one of the Unionist parties to play and I don't see how she sells that to her party. The Greens at least pretend to be for independence.
Are you, really slowly, stalking me?!
I bet that Tom Knox fella isn't far behind either..
It was frankly a misleading post at the time you made it
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/snooker/live/c72pjl980ryt
He was best in the first role (though great in both); David Suchet was Bolingbroke.
Adding my own subtle Lady Macbeth gender critical reference. Which is entirely on topic because apparently the SNP is in the mess it is because of its woke gender whatever.
https://twitter.com/Parody_PM/status/1785021239192347127
@afneil
Devolution might not have done much for ordinary Scots but it’s been a dripping roast for Scotland’s political elite. Take Humza Yousaf. He was First Minister for 13 months on an annual salary of almost £177,000 — more than the Prime Minister — of which £104,500 was for being FM (the balance was his MSP salary). He is now entitled to half his FM salary — £52,000 a year — FOR LIFE. Plus his MSP salary. Talk about snouts in the trough …"
https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1785020332186714367
Wow, nearly as out of touch as @Theuniondivvie
'She wrote: "Let us get away from the language of who is and who is not acceptable to work with. For example, well before and during the Bute House Agreement, Patrick Harvie and I worked together – that is no secret. The question therefore isn’t whether my world is big enough to embrace the Greens – it is. The question is whether their world is big enough to embrace me. I hope and believe it is."'
https://tinyurl.com/2s3yyprj
Ireland’s deputy prime minister said people are crossing the border from Northern Ireland as they are afraid of being sent to Rwanda.
The Irish government is preparing emergency legislation that will allow people to be sent back to the UK.
But Rishi Sunak said he was “not interested” in any sort of returns deal if the European Union did not allow the UK to send back asylum seekers who had arrived from France."
https://www.channel4.com/news/how-is-the-uks-rwanda-asylum-plan-impacting-ireland
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hollow_Crown_(TV_series)
The TV series was a bit pants. Simon Russell Beale (a fine actor) just didn’t work as Falstaff nor Hiddleston as Hal, I think.
Shh 2017 is not allowed to be talked about
Is he developing policy, points of view, putting out press releases, lobbying journalists and studios, and just being ignored?
Or he is not even bothering?
We need to ignore him and rise above it, we few, we happy few, we band of brothers.
He wasn't exactly a ray of sunshine even when he just had Miliband and Salmond to go at, even though I basically agreed with him.
Pasting is so Rachel Reeves
Brilliant, in fact, on so many levels.
Ha.
If Forbes is as smart as you say she is she won't repeat precisely the same unforced error that brought Yousaf down literally hours ago. The Greens are in a powerful position and can name their price. That looks like a basis for a deal.
Hot potato, orchestra stalls, Puck will make amends!
Exclusive
Sir Graham Brady has said Tory members should be stripped of their ability to pick the next leader when the party is in government
A leaked recording reveals the 1922 chairman said last week that the current setup is “crazy”.
ITV also said a Labour party spokesperson confirmed they would scrap the scheme on election notwithstanding this developments
Maybe he liked the way Napoleon laid the smack down. Or maybe he just wanted to differentiate himself in the English language market.
"He attended North Dakota State University (NDSU) to earn his undergraduate degree in 1978. During his senior year at NDSU, he applied to the Stanford Graduate School of Business. He also started a chimney-sweeping business. "The newspaper wrote a story about me as a chimney sweep", he later recalled; it "ran a photo of me sitting on top of an icy chimney in below-freezing weather in Fargo. The story made the AP wire service. I was later told it caused quite a stir in the Stanford admissions office: 'Hey, there's a chimney sweep from North Dakota who's applied."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Burgum
He went on to become a very successful businessman and Microsoft executive, before becoming North Dakota governor.:
Fixing this disastrous set up (thank you, William Hague) is a pre-requisite for letting them back into power, maybe some time in the 2030s.
If they have done that, it seems far more cost effective than the Rwanda plan itself
The recent film was rubbish and weird - what was going on there?
https://x.com/ryandilks1/status/1784889778980163785?s=61
(I am of course joking, he says rapidly)
Perhaps we'll need naval patrols in the Irish Sea to deter those trying to cross from Ireland.
What is the "plan"? Deterrence presumably but if we get hundreds coming in during the summer from France AND Ireland along with those already here how many are we realistically going to be able to send to Kigali?
And yes, I have broken my own rule not to make personal comments.
This is not going away, and it is likely to be discussed at EU and French levels and maybe we could see a united attempt by all parties to stop the boats and address the wider issue of asylum seekers and Europe's own border problems
It doesn't add up.
Leicester 1 nil up. Looks like we are going up as Champions.
(There's a bit of selection bias going on here as well. That people moving from the UK to Ireland are pointing out Rwanda fear is probably true and certainly rational. But just because that subset of migrants are mentioning it doesn't tell us about the totality of migrants crossing the channel. (To put it in terms PBers will relate to, it would be like doing an opinion poll based solely on parents picking up children from school.))
Meanwhile, since the 'Rwanda Is Safe, Whatever You Think' Law passed, 500 migrants have been detected entering the UK, and the weather was pretty grim last week.
I'm seeing people on Twatter, Reddit etc arguing that declaring countries safe by fiat of the executive is Good For Us, Bad for You. On both sides. Also, shovelling spare refugees around is awesome when it's done by People I Like. Also bigotry against refugees is just terrible. Apart from the odd bit of protesting of hostels etc by My Side.
I suspect that O'Leary will be flying Rwanda flights. From Dublin.
Anyone up for my idea to stop the boats?
Expanding this issue to the island of Ireland isn't going to make it go away and indeed sets up more expense and trouble for us (and the Irish).
Something like the Rwanda scheme could well end up as an EU-wide policy, and all the people who are calling it unconscionable will suddenly decide that it's sensible and the right thing to do.