On topic, if he weren't in the Lords you'd say the best answer to their problems might be, errr...David Cameron.
Bear with me, as I can't stand him either - he ultimately helped create this mess by trying to be too politically clever by half during his time as PM rather than doing what's right for the country.
But at this point the Tories' best option might be a Howard-like appointment as elder statesman who can mend a few fences, calm things down, is probably most like the Home Counties voters who could turning a shoeing into a catastrophe if they decide they want to punish their old party, and will obviously toddle off again after defeat, so even the factions who can't stand him might as well put up with it for a bit.
Of course the manoeuvres to make it happen would be to elaborate - if only politicians stayed in parliament these days.
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
I am not entirely convinced that even Diane Abbott is Diane Abbott anymore. Which, if I am right, makes this abuse of process to make some political point really quite cruel.
Not going to lie but La Marseillaise is the best national anthem in the world.
I cannot tell you how much it pains me to say that.
Even my loins girded there.
You mean the words about thicko revolutionaries marching on the next town to chop everyone up with scythes? The Marseillaise is gibberish, one of the worst national anthems out there as it doesn’t represent a nation at all if it’s not repressing the life, love and philosophies are those all chopped up by scythes when all they were doing was out shopping for onions.
The USA has the best anthem ever.
I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul. Hearing La Marseillaise makes me wish I were French, and that’s even without the cheese, the wine, the sensible attitude to lunch and the healthy disregard for their “betters”.
“I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul.‘
For an anthem, especially National anthem, words matter far more than tune. It’s as simple as that.
Both Jerusalem and Land of Hope and Glory don’t count either, as both are fake and hideous. One was words, poetic and largely without meaning to you unless you shared the meaning with the poet, later set to music. The second was a conceptual piece of music utterly bastardised and vandalised by those who didn’t have a clue about the artists concept, and put pompous words to it ignorant of capturing the Yang to the ying circumstance.
I never suspected you to be an idiot, but if you disagree with my reply you certainly are, and one devoid of understanding what makes a good anthem.
Neither Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory are national anthems, although Land of Hope and Glory would be a better English national anthem than the current dirge to an irrelevant bunch of parasites.
Much as I would like to disagree with you, you are right. The English and UK anthem is basically the royal anthem, it says nothing about England or the UK at all, it is all about wishing our monarch long life and a long reign.
It is ridiculous it is still the English anthem when the King is also King of Wales, Scotland and NI too and not to mention Canada, NZ and Australia. So whenever we play those nations at rugby or football or cricket we are effectively singing a song that could just as well apply to their head of state too!
It is long since past time England sporting teams had Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory as their anthem, which they now do only in the Commonwealth games. Leave GSTK as the UK anthem for the Olympics, F1, Davis Cup etc and for any sporting, cultural or commemorative event a member of the royal family is in attendance at. Or even just for the latter and compose a new UK anthem too
We changed our national anthem in 2022. Changing it again so soon would be unseemly.
We didn't actually, given GSTK was composed originally for George II at the time of the Jacobite rebellion, we have now just restored the original lyrics
On topic, if he weren't in the Lords you'd say the best answer to their problems might be, errr...David Cameron.
Bear with me, as I can't stand him either - he ultimately helped create this mess by trying to be too politically clever by half during his time as PM rather than doing what's right for the country.
But at this point the Tories' best option might be a Howard-like appointment as elder statesman who can mend a few fences, calm things down, is probably most like the Home Counties voters who could turning a shoeing into a catastrophe if they decide they want to punish their old party, and will obviously toddle off again after defeat, so even the factions who can't stand him might as well put up with it for a bit.
Of course the manoeuvres to make it happen would be to elaborate - if only politicians stayed in parliament these days.
If you want to enrage Reform and potential Reform voters even more, making Cameron Tory leader again would be the way to do it.
He also won't win back any of the Remainers who voted for him in 2010 and 2015 but now are voting Starmer Labour or LD unless he said he would reverse Brexit, which really would guarantee a Farage return and Reform overtake the Tories.
Cameron is intelligent enough to realise the above and has no interest in doing the role again, he is happy as an elder statesman as Foreign Secretary now in a largely non party political role in the Lords with a higher class of debate than the Commons normally has and better restaurant and bar too and Chevening and Carlton Gardens and lots of foreign travel to sunnier climes. He has no interest going on the campaign trail in the late autumn in marginal seats in the likes of Stoke, Nuneaton, Bolton, Margate and Plymouth and Rhyl and getting eggs thrown at him
The haunting death place of the great Liberator of Latin America: Bolivar The oldest European building in the Americas (allegedly) A collection of gold and ceramics made by a people that wanted to be vampires bats, who would literally live in darkened caves and take drugs until they felt like bats: the Tayrona The oldest cathedral in the Americas (almost certainly) Lots of massive iguanas just wandering about
And most of it was quite lame, except when it was brilliant, and that’s all fine
This is why I love travel. Even the lame things are brilliant and the brilliant things are super brilliant
Are you going to do the Lost City Trek? It's about 4-5 days walking there and back but we'll worth it.
Fuck. I was thinking of it but I don’t have time, unless I change my return date - and I have basically been away 3 months so I am somewhat pushing it
Is it REALLY worth 4-5 days’ trekking? How?? How is anywhere worth all that effort? Sincere question
I am deffo going to Tayrona Park tho, it looks incredible, My last three days in Colombia. Bow out on a high
I can see why people fall in love with Latin American traveling. There is so much to see and so much is barely touched by tourism
If only they would sort out the FOOD and the DANGER
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
I assume parties can adopt whatever rulebook they want, which might include whatever hurdles or discretionary acts they want. In this case you suggest the rule book itself is possibly not being adhered to (I have no idea, but I'd believe it), which presumably could form the basis of some kind of claim, but I guess it is the case that parties can just make things up, but it depends on them including sufficient wiggle room/discretion, within the rules to allow them to do so. But if they lack that in this case and Abbot is not willing to challenge it officially (for understandable reasons), what does it benefit her or her faction? A quiet retirement beckons, or rebellion and actual expulsion.
I do recall there was a whole lot of blather when Corbyn was excluded from being a candidate for instance, yet a quick peruse of the rulebook suggested the NEC did have the authority to do it, notwithstanding all the complaints it did not.
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
Clubs can throw out any member, for any reason, at any time. The rule book is never overly relevant.
Not sure I would agree with that: Brown-v-Executive Committee of the Labour Party 1995 SLT 985. The courts will intervene in the same way as they would do with a Union member who was being unfairly treated. The constitution of a club is a form of contract with the member which the club can be held to within its rules.
Jacob Rees-Mogg still does not believe Boris Johnson did anything wrong during Partygate. Goodness gracious me.
Please God let JRM be the Portillo moment at the General Election.
We will have plenty of options to choose such a moment from.
If JRM loses his seat will he reinvent himself travelling the world by Sedan Chair?
That might actually be cool to see, so probably won't happen. Instead we'll get him bloviating on GB news about how Starmer is a communist or something.
It would. If he could lean in fully to self parody I’d watch it.
JRM doesn't take himself too seriously and does quite a good line in self parody. I liked his Tweet when canvassing with his son, seeing a Tattoo Parlour with 'Tories out' or something similar in the window, saying 'We'll be taking our business elsewhere'.
I think he can be quite personable and even amusing when he is not going on about serious matters. When he does that, with a typical politician's flexible approach to facts, it makes his tone more condescending than I think he intends. I think he would have worked quite well as an eccentric but influential backbencher, maybe a committee chair.
For those (me among them) who were thinking Rishi could just call a GE is threatened for the Tory leadership, there's this:
The monarch, by convention, is informed by and acts upon the advice of the Prime Minister so long as the government appears to have the confidence of the House, and the Prime Minister maintains support as the leader of that government.
Penny Mordaunt is surely not the person to stem a 25 point deficit. So she’s sacrificing her own future prospects. Why would she do it, it just doesn’t make sense.
It's her last chance to be PM. She will be using a zimmer next time the Tories form a government.
People were saying the Labour Party was doomed three years ago. Politics moves fast these days.
Who's the Starmer character that's going to fix the Tories by a shift to the centre?
I will vote Conservative - as a personal vote for my MP, who is the sort of sane, balanced person the Conservative Party's future fortunes will depend upon.
Penny Mordaunt is surely not the person to stem a 25 point deficit. So she’s sacrificing her own future prospects. Why would she do it, it just doesn’t make sense.
It's her last chance to be PM. She will be using a zimmer next time the Tories form a government.
People were saying the Labour Party was doomed three years ago. Politics moves fast these days.
Who's the Starmer character that's going to fix the Tories by a shift to the centre?
There isn't one.
They need to suffer the pain of a serious defeat first.
Penny Mordaunt is surely not the person to stem a 25 point deficit. So she’s sacrificing her own future prospects. Why would she do it, it just doesn’t make sense.
It's her last chance to be PM. She will be using a zimmer next time the Tories form a government.
People were saying the Labour Party was doomed three years ago. Politics moves fast these days.
Who's the Starmer character that's going to fix the Tories by a shift to the centre?
There isn't one.
We are currently only in early 2010 in Labour terms, if Sunak is Brown we haven't even got to the Conservative Ed Miliband or Corbyn yet, it took Labour a decade from there to get to Starmer. Hold your horses!! Indeed on that timeline given Brown was more centrist than the 2 Labour leaders who followed him, the next 2 Conservative leaders will make Sunak look like a dripping wet Heathite.
That is assuming Labour don't wreck the economy in government either, which could see even a hard rightwinger win
Not going to lie but La Marseillaise is the best national anthem in the world.
I cannot tell you how much it pains me to say that.
Even my loins girded there.
You mean the words about thicko revolutionaries marching on the next town to chop everyone up with scythes? The Marseillaise is gibberish, one of the worst national anthems out there as it doesn’t represent a nation at all if it’s not repressing the life, love and philosophies are those all chopped up by scythes when all they were doing was out shopping for onions.
The USA has the best anthem ever.
I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul. Hearing La Marseillaise makes me wish I were French, and that’s even without the cheese, the wine, the sensible attitude to lunch and the healthy disregard for their “betters”.
“I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul.‘
For an anthem, especially National anthem, words matter far more than tune. It’s as simple as that.
Both Jerusalem and Land of Hope and Glory don’t count either, as both are fake and hideous. One was words, poetic and largely without meaning to you unless you shared the meaning with the poet, later set to music. The second was a conceptual piece of music utterly bastardised and vandalised by those who didn’t have a clue about the artists concept, and put pompous words to it ignorant of capturing the Yang to the ying circumstance.
I never suspected you to be an idiot, but if you disagree with my reply you certainly are, and one devoid of understanding what makes a good anthem.
Neither Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory are national anthems, although Land of Hope and Glory would be a better English national anthem than the current dirge to an irrelevant bunch of parasites.
Much as I would like to disagree with you, you are right. The English and UK anthem is basically the royal anthem, it says nothing about England or the UK at all, it is all about wishing our monarch long life and a long reign.
It is ridiculous it is still the English anthem when the King is also King of Wales, Scotland and NI too and not to mention Canada, NZ and Australia. So whenever we play those nations at rugby or football or cricket we are effectively singing a song that could just as well apply to their head of state too!
It is long since past time England sporting teams had Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory as their anthem, which they now do only in the Commonwealth games. Leave GSTK as the UK anthem for the Olympics, F1, Davis Cup etc and for any sporting, cultural or commemorative event a member of the royal family is in attendance at. Or even just for the latter and compose a new UK anthem too
We changed our national anthem in 2022. Changing it again so soon would be unseemly.
We didn't actually, given GSTK was composed originally for George II at the time of the Jacobite rebellion, we have now just restored the original lyrics
GSTK is much too maligned. It’s not the best anthem but it is far from the worst
It is short and memorable and easy to sing: anyone can bang it out, and it has quite a rousing crescendo - SEND. HIM. VICTORIOUS
I reckon it is better than Star Spangled Banner, and way better than that stupid Italian crap. And obviously better than the weirdly depressing Flower of Scotland which basically says “we’re going to lose, and lose again, but that’s OK, it’s what we do”
The Marseillaise is an epically and oddly bouncy tune, especially the intro, but it is quite hard to sing. The Welsh anthem is moving and stirring, and deserves to be the hymn for a better country. The Russians have the best one of all
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
Suddenly understanding something that had previously been a mystery to you is pretty good feeling.
Creating something that you can feel proud of is good too. Often more satisfying than merely consuming someone else's creation, even if the someone else's creation is technically more proficient.
The haunting death place of the great Liberator of Latin America: Bolivar The oldest European building in the Americas (allegedly) A collection of gold and ceramics made by a people that wanted to be vampires bats, who would literally live in darkened caves and take drugs until they felt like bats: the Tayrona The oldest cathedral in the Americas (almost certainly) Lots of massive iguanas just wandering about
And most of it was quite lame, except when it was brilliant, and that’s all fine
This is why I love travel. Even the lame things are brilliant and the brilliant things are super brilliant
Are you going to do the Lost City Trek? It's about 4-5 days walking there and back but we'll worth it.
Fuck. I was thinking of it but I don’t have time, unless I change my return date - and I have basically been away 3 months so I am somewhat pushing it
Is it REALLY worth 4-5 days’ trekking? How?? How is anywhere worth all that effort? Sincere question
I am deffo going to Tayrona Park tho, it looks incredible, My last three days in Colombia. Bow out on a high
I can see why people fall in love with Latin American traveling. There is so much to see and so much is barely touched by tourism
If only they would sort out the FOOD and the DANGER
You are right about the serendipity of travel. My favourite travel times have been those days I was somewhere about which I had few preconceptions, and at breakfast or the night before I thought “I know, I’ll give that place a try” and it turned out to be brilliant, or weird, or hauntingly poignant about some historical event or tragedy I’d not really even clocked before.
Not going to lie but La Marseillaise is the best national anthem in the world.
I cannot tell you how much it pains me to say that.
Even my loins girded there.
You mean the words about thicko revolutionaries marching on the next town to chop everyone up with scythes? The Marseillaise is gibberish, one of the worst national anthems out there as it doesn’t represent a nation at all if it’s not repressing the life, love and philosophies are those all chopped up by scythes when all they were doing was out shopping for onions.
The USA has the best anthem ever.
I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul. Hearing La Marseillaise makes me wish I were French, and that’s even without the cheese, the wine, the sensible attitude to lunch and the healthy disregard for their “betters”.
“I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul.‘
For an anthem, especially National anthem, words matter far more than tune. It’s as simple as that.
Both Jerusalem and Land of Hope and Glory don’t count either, as both are fake and hideous. One was words, poetic and largely without meaning to you unless you shared the meaning with the poet, later set to music. The second was a conceptual piece of music utterly bastardised and vandalised by those who didn’t have a clue about the artists concept, and put pompous words to it ignorant of capturing the Yang to the ying circumstance.
I never suspected you to be an idiot, but if you disagree with my reply you certainly are, and one devoid of understanding what makes a good anthem.
Neither Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory are national anthems, although Land of Hope and Glory would be a better English national anthem than the current dirge to an irrelevant bunch of parasites.
Much as I would like to disagree with you, you are right. The English and UK anthem is basically the royal anthem, it says nothing about England or the UK at all, it is all about wishing our monarch long life and a long reign.
It is ridiculous it is still the English anthem when the King is also King of Wales, Scotland and NI too and not to mention Canada, NZ and Australia. So whenever we play those nations at rugby or football or cricket we are effectively singing a song that could just as well apply to their head of state too!
It is long since past time England sporting teams had Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory as their anthem, which they now do only in the Commonwealth games. Leave GSTK as the UK anthem for the Olympics, F1, Davis Cup etc and for any sporting, cultural or commemorative event a member of the royal family is in attendance at. Or even just for the latter and compose a new UK anthem too
We changed our national anthem in 2022. Changing it again so soon would be unseemly.
We didn't actually, given GSTK was composed originally for George II at the time of the Jacobite rebellion, we have now just restored the original lyrics
GSTK is much too maligned. It’s not the best anthem but it is far from the worst
It is short and memorable and easy to sing: anyone can bang it out, and it has quite a rousing crescendo - SEND. HIM. VICTORIOUS
I reckon it is better than Star Spangled Banner, and way better than that stupid Italian crap. And obviously better than the weirdly depressing Flower of Scotland which basically says “we’re going to lose, and lose again, but that’s OK, it’s what we do”
The Marseillaise is an epically and oddly bouncy tune, especially the intro, but it is quite hard to sing. The Welsh anthem is moving and stirring, and deserves to be the hymn for a better country. The Russians have the best one of all
I am not anti the anthem, it is reasonable but not as good as the French and Welsh anthem.
The issue is the lyrics have sod all to do with England, it could just as well be the anthem for Canada or New Zealand or Scotland given the King is also their King too.
It should be left as the royal and maybe UK anthem and England should have its own anthem with lyrics like Jerusalem which actually mention the nation the anthem is supposed to be for!
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
You missed music. The right music with each of those activities makes them better. The 1 hour version of justify my love with sex, voyage voyage by desireless with travel, anything by the orb with drugs and a bit of nine inch nails with wanking. Walking into a nicely furnished room is clearly some harpsichord music.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
Observing the remarkable variety of the fauna and flora we share our planet with is very high on my list of joys.
Oooh, nice one, yes
There is a profound pleasure to be had in observing wildlife. I’ve no idea why: but there is. Quite right. Add it to the list
Some of my lifetime highs have been seeing wildlife: a pride of lions walk past me in Zambia (I had no gun, they could easily have taken me and killed me), the same pride then making a kill! - a whale seen off Madagascar, which we ran out to play with, a bear crossing a road in Colorado, a pod of orcas in Antarctica, a trio of platypus in Oz, a cassowary in Oz, a drop bear in Oz, my first ever cheetah! A desert elephant trying to charge me in Namibia…. A caracal at dawn in Namibia in the far desert
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
Clubs can throw out any member, for any reason, at any time. The rule book is never overly relevant.
Not sure I would agree with that: Brown-v-Executive Committee of the Labour Party 1995 SLT 985. The courts will intervene in the same way as they would do with a Union member who was being unfairly treated. The constitution of a club is a form of contract with the member which the club can be held to within its rules.
These rulebooks are pretty broad a lot of the time, I suppose it depends what precise process Abbott is under as to whether she could theoretically challenge it.
For example the opening of the section on disciplinary rules states 'The NEC shall take such disciplinary measures it deems necessary to ensure that all party members and officers conform to the constitution, rules and standing orders of the party. Such powers shall include etc etc' with a whole bunch of specific rules about investigation and reports etc. But in relation to clubs and the like do courts interpret a 'such measures as deemed necessary' as very enabling of essentially going off script?
I don't think that applies in this case as I think the process she is under is different, but it's all very confusing. There is reference to standing orders of the Parliamentary Labour Party, so I assume those rules are slightly distinct from the overall constitution so long as it adheres to basic rules of that constitution. But the constitution does say any dispute over the meaning and interpetation of the constitution, standing orders, and rules of the party, are to be determined by the NEC, which is Starmerite at the moment.
I feel like its pretty likely Abbott is being a bit screwed over by the party machinery due to being on the outs with Starmer, but absent a willingness to formally challenge, which is presumably career suicide within the party, avoiding the mitigation being offered as a pretextual reason for not restoring the whip doesn't seem to benefit her much.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
No the greatest pleasure is a meaningful life.
Everybody needs a reason to get up in the morning.
Hedonism is legitimately meaningful life for many. Others may not agree it would be truly meaningful for them (and doubt it as so for others), but each to their own.
Penny Mordaunt is surely not the person to stem a 25 point deficit. So she’s sacrificing her own future prospects. Why would she do it, it just doesn’t make sense.
It's her last chance to be PM. She will be using a zimmer next time the Tories form a government.
People were saying the Labour Party was doomed three years ago. Politics moves fast these days.
Who's the Starmer character that's going to fix the Tories by a shift to the centre?
There isn't one.
We are currently only in early 2010 in Labour terms, if Sunak is Brown we haven't even got to the Conservative Ed Miliband or Corbyn yet, it took Labour a decade from there to get to Starmer. Hold your horses!! Indeed on that timeline given Brown was more centrist than the 2 Labour leaders who followed him, the next 2 Conservative leaders will make Sunak look like a dripping wet Heathite.
That is assuming Labour don't wreck the economy in government either, which could see even a hard rightwinger win
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
You missed music. The right music with each of those activities makes them better. The 1 hour version of justify my love with sex, voyage voyage by desireless with travel, anything by the orb with drugs and a bit of nine inch nails with wanking. Walking into a nicely furnished room is clearly some harpsichord music.
Music comes under “fine arts”, tho maybe not Nine Inch Nails
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
No the greatest pleasure is a meaningful life.
Everybody needs a reason to get up in the morning.
I agree, which is one of the reasons I am not particularly looking forward to retirement. I like my current job because it is meaningful and you can make a difference to vulnerable peoples lives.
Its one of the scariest things about AI that @Leon goes on about. What will the purpose of life be without work? Yes, there can be the ephemeral pleasures that have been mentioned, but where is the purpose?
In the Culture Novels there is no work as such but everyone wants to be in Special Circumstances because that in fact gives meaning to the existence.
Penny Mordaunt is surely not the person to stem a 25 point deficit. So she’s sacrificing her own future prospects. Why would she do it, it just doesn’t make sense.
It's her last chance to be PM. She will be using a zimmer next time the Tories form a government.
People were saying the Labour Party was doomed three years ago. Politics moves fast these days.
Who's the Starmer character that's going to fix the Tories by a shift to the centre?
There isn't one.
We are currently only in early 2010 in Labour terms, if Sunak is Brown we haven't even got to the Conservative Ed Miliband or Corbyn yet, it took Labour a decade from there to get to Starmer. Hold your horses!! Indeed on that timeline given Brown was more centrist than the 2 Labour leaders who followed him, the next 2 Conservative leaders will make Sunak look like a dripping wet Heathite.
That is assuming Labour don't wreck the economy in government either, which could see even a hard rightwinger win
The economy can be wrecked?
Sure. At the moment we're arguing if it is stagnate or moribund, conceivably they could influence it in the negative.
Not going to lie but La Marseillaise is the best national anthem in the world.
I cannot tell you how much it pains me to say that.
Even my loins girded there.
You mean the words about thicko revolutionaries marching on the next town to chop everyone up with scythes? The Marseillaise is gibberish, one of the worst national anthems out there as it doesn’t represent a nation at all if it’s not repressing the life, love and philosophies are those all chopped up by scythes when all they were doing was out shopping for onions.
The USA has the best anthem ever.
I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul. Hearing La Marseillaise makes me wish I were French, and that’s even without the cheese, the wine, the sensible attitude to lunch and the healthy disregard for their “betters”.
“I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul.‘
For an anthem, especially National anthem, words matter far more than tune. It’s as simple as that.
Both Jerusalem and Land of Hope and Glory don’t count either, as both are fake and hideous. One was words, poetic and largely without meaning to you unless you shared the meaning with the poet, later set to music. The second was a conceptual piece of music utterly bastardised and vandalised by those who didn’t have a clue about the artists concept, and put pompous words to it ignorant of capturing the Yang to the ying circumstance.
I never suspected you to be an idiot, but if you disagree with my reply you certainly are, and one devoid of understanding what makes a good anthem.
Neither Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory are national anthems, although Land of Hope and Glory would be a better English national anthem than the current dirge to an irrelevant bunch of parasites.
Much as I would like to disagree with you, you are right. The English and UK anthem is basically the royal anthem, it says nothing about England or the UK at all, it is all about wishing our monarch long life and a long reign.
It is ridiculous it is still the English anthem when the King is also King of Wales, Scotland and NI too and not to mention Canada, NZ and Australia. So whenever we play those nations at rugby or football or cricket we are effectively singing a song that could just as well apply to their head of state too!
It is long since past time England sporting teams had Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory as their anthem, which they now do only in the Commonwealth games. Leave GSTK as the UK anthem for the Olympics, F1, Davis Cup etc and for any sporting, cultural or commemorative event a member of the royal family is in attendance at. Or even just for the latter and compose a new UK anthem too
We changed our national anthem in 2022. Changing it again so soon would be unseemly.
We didn't actually, given GSTK was composed originally for George II at the time of the Jacobite rebellion, we have now just restored the original lyrics
GSTK is much too maligned. It’s not the best anthem but it is far from the worst
It is short and memorable and easy to sing: anyone can bang it out, and it has quite a rousing crescendo - SEND. HIM. VICTORIOUS
I reckon it is better than Star Spangled Banner, and way better than that stupid Italian crap. And obviously better than the weirdly depressing Flower of Scotland which basically says “we’re going to lose, and lose again, but that’s OK, it’s what we do”
The Marseillaise is an epically and oddly bouncy tune, especially the intro, but it is quite hard to sing. The Welsh anthem is moving and stirring, and deserves to be the hymn for a better country. The Russians have the best one of all
I am not anti the anthem, it is reasonable but not as good as the French and Welsh anthem.
The issue is the lyrics have sod all to do with England, it could just as well be the anthem for Canada or New Zealand or Scotland given the King is also their King too.
It should be left as the royal and maybe UK anthem and England should have its own anthem with lyrics like Jerusalem which actually mention the nation the anthem is supposed to be for!
True, and also a reason why the Russian anthem, good tune though it is, shouldn’t be in the top 5 because it’s the anthem of the Marxist-Leninist international, not the country (colonial empire) of Russia.
Whereas land of my fathers couldn’t be more Welsh.
I think @MarqueeMark has posed the most interesting question
Why do we derive so much pleasure from looking at birds and animals, and nature in general?
i am not quite sure, I can come up with various complex ev psych explanations, but it is fascinatingly intricate. People pay tens of thousands of pounds to go on great safaris. And, having been on some great safaris, I can vouch for the fact that they are fucking brilliant at their best, and worth it, if you can afford it
Seeing a lion make a kill is a spellbinding thing, which you never forget, and gives you a strange warmth of memory when you look back
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
No the greatest pleasure is a meaningful life.
Everybody needs a reason to get up in the morning.
I agree, which is one of the reasons I am not particularly looking forward to retirement. I like my current job because it is meaningful and you can make a difference to vulnerable peoples lives.
Its one of the scariest things about AI that @Leon goes on about. What will the purpose of life be without work? Yes, there can be the ephemeral pleasures that have been mentioned, but where is the purpose?
In the Culture Novels there is no work as such but everyone wants to be in Special Circumstances because that in fact gives meaning to the existence.
It's come up before, but the Culture really does come off as a horrifying dystopia to me, most people are just overstuffed with entertainment and blizzed out on artificial hormones to be openly unhappy about it.
People can find purpose in many other things of course, but if health permits and people are not being obliged to do so, I think continuing to work well past retirement age is a good thing (perhaps not economically, but I don't understand economics anyway).
No one seems to bregrudge Warren Buffett or the like working on very late in their lives. Though they do begrudge it of Joe Biden I suppose.
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
Clubs can throw out any member, for any reason, at any time. The rule book is never overly relevant.
Not sure I would agree with that: Brown-v-Executive Committee of the Labour Party 1995 SLT 985. The courts will intervene in the same way as they would do with a Union member who was being unfairly treated. The constitution of a club is a form of contract with the member which the club can be held to within its rules.
Not familiar with that one, but I have always been told to assume the courts will generally avoid getting dragged into the workings of a club. Is that not correct? As @kle4 notes, the other point is that every club I have ever been a member of has a vague “you will get chucked out if you act in a way we disapprove of” clause.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
You missed music. The right music with each of those activities makes them better. The 1 hour version of justify my love with sex, voyage voyage by desireless with travel, anything by the orb with drugs and a bit of nine inch nails with wanking. Walking into a nicely furnished room is clearly some harpsichord music.
Music comes under “fine arts”, tho maybe not Nine Inch Nails
I have no idea if nine inch nails are fine arts or good for wanking to but it sounded like a good accompaniment to a frenzied hand shandy or some sad bit of cranking (combo of crying whilst wanking for the uninitiated). I personally like a bit of Sade. Smooth Masturbator.
I think @MarqueeMark has posed the most interesting question
Why do we derive so much pleasure from looking at birds and animals, and nature in general?
i am not quite sure, I can come up with various complex ev psych explanations, but it is fascinatingly intricate. People pay tens of thousands of pounds to go on great safaris. And, having been on some great safaris, I can vouch for the fact that they are fucking brilliant at their best, and worth it, if you can afford it
Seeing a lion make a kill is a spellbinding thing, which you never forget, and gives you a strange warmth of memory when you look back
Same as how we feel viewing a quiet sunset on a dusty plain or seeing smoke columns rise above a festival encampment. We’re gazing back into our deep past I think. Reconnecting with the world in which our brains evolved.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
No the greatest pleasure is a meaningful life.
Everybody needs a reason to get up in the morning.
Hedonism is legitimately meaningful life for many. Others may not agree it would be truly meaningful for them (and doubt it as so for others), but each to their own.
My close friend who just died was entirely without spirituality, or any purposeful career, and was a total hedonist. He had no kids, he had no real job, he lived for pleasure, in the early days it was travel and sex and drugs and booze, later it became boozing and story telling and smoking cigs. He died, unsurprisingly, of liver failure leading to total organ failure. At the age of 61. His funeral is in two weeks
To me (and maybe to others) his life was arguably quite empty. Yet I cannot say he was unhappy. He wasn’t. He was generally happy - certainly chirpy and joking - until the last few years, when I didn’t;t see him simply because our lives diverged so much, But I am told by those who did continue to see him that he remained equally cheerful and boozy until the final weeks
So he is an example of a pretty pure hedonist. His life had no meaning or purpose and he freely admitted it, he just wanted to have fun, and a laugh, and that’s what he did, that was his meaning. Fair play and RIP
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
I assume parties can adopt whatever rulebook they want, which might include whatever hurdles or discretionary acts they want. In this case you suggest the rule book itself is possibly not being adhered to (I have no idea, but I'd believe it), which presumably could form the basis of some kind of claim, but I guess it is the case that parties can just make things up, but it depends on them including sufficient wiggle room/discretion, within the rules to allow them to do so. But if they lack that in this case and Abbot is not willing to challenge it officially (for understandable reasons), what does it benefit her or her faction? A quiet retirement beckons, or rebellion and actual expulsion.
I do recall there was a whole lot of blather when Corbyn was excluded from being a candidate for instance, yet a quick peruse of the rulebook suggested the NEC did have the authority to do it, notwithstanding all the complaints it did not.
I would go further than that in my suspicion the Labour Party knows it doesn't have a leg to stand on. The face saving way out is for its benefit, not Abbott's. Otherwise it either has to drop the proceedings or progress to expulsion and a likely legal case it will lose. On a very high profile ex member who gets a lot of sympathy not least due to the appalling racist and misogynist abuse she has been subjected to.
You're right none of this benefits Abbott herself, but I wouldn't hold it against her to have principles that in this case appear to be justified.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
Observing the remarkable variety of the fauna and flora we share our planet with is very high on my list of joys.
Oooh, nice one, yes
There is a profound pleasure to be had in observing wildlife. I’ve no idea why: but there is. Quite right. Add it to the list
Some of my lifetime highs have been seeing wildlife: a pride of lions walk past me in Zambia (I had no gun, they could easily have taken me and killed me), the same pride then making a kill! - a whale seen off Madagascar, which we ran out to play with, a bear crossing a road in Colorado, a pod of orcas in Antarctica, a trio of platypus in Oz, a cassowary in Oz, a drop bear in Oz, my first ever cheetah! A desert elephant trying to charge me in Namibia…. A caracal at dawn in Namibia in the far desert
YES, you are right
Seeing my first jaguar in the Pantanale, standing on a river bank above me at dusk, illuminated by fireflies.
A thousand dolphins crossing the equator like a tsunami, chasing after a bait-ball.
Seeing an Egyptian Plover pass inches by the side of the dugout canoe I was in on the Congo.
Finding my first Striped Hawkmoth in my garden moth trap (it was making so much noise I thought a rat had got in...)
The spout of a blue whale, like the Jet d'Eau in Geneva.
In a remarkably Gothic moment, sitting in the dark outside a Brazilian monastery, bats and moths zipping around as the monks sang their vesper rites. And then, padding up the steps, came a wild wolf...
Penny Mordaunt is surely not the person to stem a 25 point deficit. So she’s sacrificing her own future prospects. Why would she do it, it just doesn’t make sense.
It's her last chance to be PM. She will be using a zimmer next time the Tories form a government.
People were saying the Labour Party was doomed three years ago. Politics moves fast these days.
Who's the Starmer character that's going to fix the Tories by a shift to the centre?
There isn't one.
I don’t think the next Tory PM will be a centrist or of the type I (and I assume 90% on here) would approve of. I think they’ll be Boris mkII. A chunk of the public is restless and Brexit/GE2019 is the model for winning them over. They want “their” country back.
Of course it’s rather hard to deliver on that prospectus so we might be in for a rather cyclical couple of parliaments until someone can channel Blair and find a way to evangelise for a centrist vision (which is much harder than demagoguery).
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
Clubs can throw out any member, for any reason, at any time. The rule book is never overly relevant.
Not sure I would agree with that: Brown-v-Executive Committee of the Labour Party 1995 SLT 985. The courts will intervene in the same way as they would do with a Union member who was being unfairly treated. The constitution of a club is a form of contract with the member which the club can be held to within its rules.
These rulebooks are pretty broad a lot of the time, I suppose it depends what precise process Abbott is under as to whether she could theoretically challenge it.
For example the opening of the section on disciplinary rules states 'The NEC shall take such disciplinary measures it deems necessary to ensure that all party members and officers conform to the constitution, rules and standing orders of the party. Such powers shall include etc etc' with a whole bunch of specific rules about investigation and reports etc. But in relation to clubs and the like do courts interpret a 'such measures as deemed necessary' as very enabling of essentially going off script?
I don't think that applies in this case as I think the process she is under is different, but it's all very confusing. There is reference to standing orders of the Parliamentary Labour Party, so I assume those rules are slightly distinct from the overall constitution so long as it adheres to basic rules of that constitution. But the constitution does say any dispute over the meaning and interpetation of the constitution, standing orders, and rules of the party, are to be determined by the NEC, which is Starmerite at the moment.
I feel like its pretty likely Abbott is being a bit screwed over by the party machinery due to being on the outs with Starmer, but absent a willingness to formally challenge, which is presumably career suicide within the party, avoiding the mitigation being offered as a pretextual reason for not restoring the whip doesn't seem to benefit her much.
I suspect that she feels that her point that people with differently coloured skin are more obviously affected by racisim than those who can assimilate more readily had merit and should have been acknowledged as such, even if there are many other kinds of racism. .I also suspect that she has a loyalty to her old lover Corbyn and is reluctant to make peace with the party whilst it has not made peace with him.
Starmer's Labour party is a lot less tolerant than Blair's was. A lot of that is down to the consequences of Corbyn's leadership, of course.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
No the greatest pleasure is a meaningful life.
Everybody needs a reason to get up in the morning.
I agree, which is one of the reasons I am not particularly looking forward to retirement. I like my current job because it is meaningful and you can make a difference to vulnerable peoples lives.
Its one of the scariest things about AI that @Leon goes on about. What will the purpose of life be without work? Yes, there can be the ephemeral pleasures that have been mentioned, but where is the purpose?
In the Culture Novels there is no work as such but everyone wants to be in Special Circumstances because that in fact gives meaning to the existence.
It's perhaps my Presbyterian ancestry, but I agree.
Today I have not done much. I had a lie in and argued with people on PB while drinking tea, while Mrs Foxy baked brownies for a friends coffee morning. I walked my dog in the spring sunshine, stopping to chat with others out walking. I drank more tea. I cut the lawn for the first time this year, and had just finished when the first rain fell, so felt smug about the timing.
Then Fox Jr2 arrived with a few of his mates, and we chatted for a bit about films, and ate a takeaway veg curry. They are fine young people, each on the cusp of really interesting and challenging lives.
After they left for a friend's party, Mrs Foxy and I watched Poirot reruns from the sofa, until she turned in, and I watched a fairly lame Eighties teen flick.
A day of simple pleasures all round, and all the better for it.
I'm probably forgiving of a life of aimlessness as I read a couple of Jeeves books today, and Wooster seems to have no thought in his head other than bumbling through life as amiably as can be managed.
Though I did like this from the preface by the author to one of them: In these days when everybody hates everybody else, anyone who is not snarling at something - or at everything - is an anachronism.
Not going to lie but La Marseillaise is the best national anthem in the world.
I cannot tell you how much it pains me to say that.
Even my loins girded there.
You mean the words about thicko revolutionaries marching on the next town to chop everyone up with scythes? The Marseillaise is gibberish, one of the worst national anthems out there as it doesn’t represent a nation at all if it’s not repressing the life, love and philosophies are those all chopped up by scythes when all they were doing was out shopping for onions.
The USA has the best anthem ever.
I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul. Hearing La Marseillaise makes me wish I were French, and that’s even without the cheese, the wine, the sensible attitude to lunch and the healthy disregard for their “betters”.
“I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul.‘
For an anthem, especially National anthem, words matter far more than tune. It’s as simple as that.
Both Jerusalem and Land of Hope and Glory don’t count either, as both are fake and hideous. One was words, poetic and largely without meaning to you unless you shared the meaning with the poet, later set to music. The second was a conceptual piece of music utterly bastardised and vandalised by those who didn’t have a clue about the artists concept, and put pompous words to it ignorant of capturing the Yang to the ying circumstance.
I never suspected you to be an idiot, but if you disagree with my reply you certainly are, and one devoid of understanding what makes a good anthem.
Neither Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory are national anthems, although Land of Hope and Glory would be a better English national anthem than the current dirge to an irrelevant bunch of parasites.
Much as I would like to disagree with you, you are right. The English and UK anthem is basically the royal anthem, it says nothing about England or the UK at all, it is all about wishing our monarch long life and a long reign.
It is ridiculous it is still the English anthem when the King is also King of Wales, Scotland and NI too and not to mention Canada, NZ and Australia. So whenever we play those nations at rugby or football or cricket we are effectively singing a song that could just as well apply to their head of state too!
It is long since past time England sporting teams had Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory as their anthem, which they now do only in the Commonwealth games. Leave GSTK as the UK anthem for the Olympics, F1, Davis Cup etc and for any sporting, cultural or commemorative event a member of the royal family is in attendance at. Or even just for the latter and compose a new UK anthem too
We changed our national anthem in 2022. Changing it again so soon would be unseemly.
We didn't actually, given GSTK was composed originally for George II at the time of the Jacobite rebellion, we have now just restored the original lyrics
GSTK is much too maligned. It’s not the best anthem but it is far from the worst
It is short and memorable and easy to sing: anyone can bang it out, and it has quite a rousing crescendo - SEND. HIM. VICTORIOUS
I reckon it is better than Star Spangled Banner, and way better than that stupid Italian crap. And obviously better than the weirdly depressing Flower of Scotland which basically says “we’re going to lose, and lose again, but that’s OK, it’s what we do”
The Marseillaise is an epically and oddly bouncy tune, especially the intro, but it is quite hard to sing. The Welsh anthem is moving and stirring, and deserves to be the hymn for a better country. The Russians have the best one of all
SSB is epic; way better than GSTK (aka “My Country, ‘‘tis of thee”).
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
Observing the remarkable variety of the fauna and flora we share our planet with is very high on my list of joys.
Oooh, nice one, yes
There is a profound pleasure to be had in observing wildlife. I’ve no idea why: but there is. Quite right. Add it to the list
Some of my lifetime highs have been seeing wildlife: a pride of lions walk past me in Zambia (I had no gun, they could easily have taken me and killed me), the same pride then making a kill! - a whale seen off Madagascar, which we ran out to play with, a bear crossing a road in Colorado, a pod of orcas in Antarctica, a trio of platypus in Oz, a cassowary in Oz, a drop bear in Oz, my first ever cheetah! A desert elephant trying to charge me in Namibia…. A caracal at dawn in Namibia in the far desert
YES, you are right
Seeing my first jaguar in the Pantanale, standing on a river bank above me at dusk, illuminated by fireflies.
A thousand dolphins crossing the equator like a tsunami, chasing after a bait-ball.
Seeing an Egyptian Plover pass inches by the side of the dugout canoe I was in on the Congo.
Finding my first Striped Hawkmoth in my garden moth trap (it was making so much noise I thought a rat had got in...)
The spout of a blue whale, like the Jet d'Eau in Geneva.
In a remarkably Gothic moment, sitting in the dark outside a Brazilian monastery, bats and moths zipping around as the monks sang their vesper rites. And then, padding up the steps, came a wild wolf...
Nice. Enviable. You describe it well, these are spine tingling moments, aren’t they? The fact we all remember them, and you can pin them down so articulately, proves that
i suspect @TimS is on to something: it’s the animal in us, the half evolved hominid in Africa, reconnecting with our lost past as part of Creation. Before the Fall
It is the same reason cave art is so obsessively focussed on animals and game and prey and, sometimes, simple animal beauty
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
Clubs can throw out any member, for any reason, at any time. The rule book is never overly relevant.
Not sure I would agree with that: Brown-v-Executive Committee of the Labour Party 1995 SLT 985. The courts will intervene in the same way as they would do with a Union member who was being unfairly treated. The constitution of a club is a form of contract with the member which the club can be held to within its rules.
Not familiar with that one, but I have always been told to assume the courts will generally avoid getting dragged into the workings of a club. Is that not correct? As @kle4 notes, the other point is that every club I have ever been a member of has a vague “you will get chucked out if you act in a way we disapprove of” clause.
I did a run of cases quite a few years ago now challenging expulsions from golf clubs. They were generally successful although more than one client then bemoaned the fact that no one in the club would then speak to them!
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
Clubs can throw out any member, for any reason, at any time. The rule book is never overly relevant.
Not sure I would agree with that: Brown-v-Executive Committee of the Labour Party 1995 SLT 985. The courts will intervene in the same way as they would do with a Union member who was being unfairly treated. The constitution of a club is a form of contract with the member which the club can be held to within its rules.
Not familiar with that one, but I have always been told to assume the courts will generally avoid getting dragged into the workings of a club. Is that not correct? As @kle4 notes, the other point is that every club I have ever been a member of has a vague “you will get chucked out if you act in a way we disapprove of” clause.
I did a run of cases quite a few years ago now challenging expulsions from golf clubs. They were generally successful although more than one client then bemoaned the fact that no one in the club would then speak to them!
Ah, the splendid variety of a legal career!
In a way its very handy that some very petty things have been challenged at times, sometimes all the way to the highest courts in the land, as it helps establish some basic rules about things like parish polls or membership or golf clubs.
Dianne Abbott was reportedly offered the Whip back if she went on an anti-Semitism course.
She refused.
It is rather surprising to me that she has not gotten the whip back by now, same with Corbyn to an extent, but it's not clear to me that they really want it back anyway - the official reason both have not they could simply resolve, and as both have been MPs for decades perhaps they are looking for a way to go out as martyrs rather than being accused even among their fans of sticking around way too long.
My suspicion this investigation is taking so long because the Labour Party don't have a watertight case to expel Diane Abbott. If they are offering anti-semitism courses as a face saving way out, that would also fit.
Like Jezza, all she has to do is an unequivocal condemnation of anti-semitism, but that's beyond where she is willing to go.
If she hasn't broken any Labour Party rule, and a quick look at the Labour Party rule book suggests she's correct about that, why should she submit to disciplinary action to prevent an expulsion the Party has no legal cause to make? Political parties can't just make this stuff up. They have to follow due process and provide natural justice by the law.
Personally I probably would go through with the charade, as I would see it in those circumstances, but I'm not Diane Abbott.
Clubs can throw out any member, for any reason, at any time. The rule book is never overly relevant.
Not sure I would agree with that: Brown-v-Executive Committee of the Labour Party 1995 SLT 985. The courts will intervene in the same way as they would do with a Union member who was being unfairly treated. The constitution of a club is a form of contract with the member which the club can be held to within its rules.
Not familiar with that one, but I have always been told to assume the courts will generally avoid getting dragged into the workings of a club. Is that not correct? As @kle4 notes, the other point is that every club I have ever been a member of has a vague “you will get chucked out if you act in a way we disapprove of” clause.
I did a run of cases quite a few years ago now challenging expulsions from golf clubs. They were generally successful although more than one client then bemoaned the fact that no one in the club would then speak to them!
A good test of the Groucho Marx “I wouldn’t join any club that would have me as a member” theory.
Not going to lie but La Marseillaise is the best national anthem in the world.
I cannot tell you how much it pains me to say that.
Even my loins girded there.
You mean the words about thicko revolutionaries marching on the next town to chop everyone up with scythes? The Marseillaise is gibberish, one of the worst national anthems out there as it doesn’t represent a nation at all if it’s not repressing the life, love and philosophies are those all chopped up by scythes when all they were doing was out shopping for onions.
The USA has the best anthem ever.
I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul. Hearing La Marseillaise makes me wish I were French, and that’s even without the cheese, the wine, the sensible attitude to lunch and the healthy disregard for their “betters”.
“I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul.‘
For an anthem, especially National anthem, words matter far more than tune. It’s as simple as that.
Both Jerusalem and Land of Hope and Glory don’t count either, as both are fake and hideous. One was words, poetic and largely without meaning to you unless you shared the meaning with the poet, later set to music. The second was a conceptual piece of music utterly bastardised and vandalised by those who didn’t have a clue about the artists concept, and put pompous words to it ignorant of capturing the Yang to the ying circumstance.
I never suspected you to be an idiot, but if you disagree with my reply you certainly are, and one devoid of understanding what makes a good anthem.
Neither Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory are national anthems, although Land of Hope and Glory would be a better English national anthem than the current dirge to an irrelevant bunch of parasites.
Much as I would like to disagree with you, you are right. The English and UK anthem is basically the royal anthem, it says nothing about England or the UK at all, it is all about wishing our monarch long life and a long reign.
It is ridiculous it is still the English anthem when the King is also King of Wales, Scotland and NI too and not to mention Canada, NZ and Australia. So whenever we play those nations at rugby or football or cricket we are effectively singing a song that could just as well apply to their head of state too!
It is long since past time England sporting teams had Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory as their anthem, which they now do only in the Commonwealth games. Leave GSTK as the UK anthem for the Olympics, F1, Davis Cup etc and for any sporting, cultural or commemorative event a member of the royal family is in attendance at. Or even just for the latter and compose a new UK anthem too
We changed our national anthem in 2022. Changing it again so soon would be unseemly.
We didn't actually, given GSTK was composed originally for George II at the time of the Jacobite rebellion, we have now just restored the original lyrics
GSTK is much too maligned. It’s not the best anthem but it is far from the worst
It is short and memorable and easy to sing: anyone can bang it out, and it has quite a rousing crescendo - SEND. HIM. VICTORIOUS
I reckon it is better than Star Spangled Banner, and way better than that stupid Italian crap. And obviously better than the weirdly depressing Flower of Scotland which basically says “we’re going to lose, and lose again, but that’s OK, it’s what we do”
The Marseillaise is an epically and oddly bouncy tune, especially the intro, but it is quite hard to sing. The Welsh anthem is moving and stirring, and deserves to be the hymn for a better country. The Russians have the best one of all
SSB is epic; way better than GSTK (aka “My Country, ‘‘tis of thee”).
Maybe my appreciation of SSB has been shagged by too many half assed lady singers overdoing it and ruining it: it now seems histrionic and tedious, to me
Very few anthems are memorable AND identifiable. There are very few where the average human can hear a few chords and they can name the country. GSTK is one of those, so is SSB, so is the Russian, the French, and then at that point most people would struggle, around the world - I can identify the Welsh, Scots and Irish merely because I follow rugby
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
Observing the remarkable variety of the fauna and flora we share our planet with is very high on my list of joys.
Oooh, nice one, yes
There is a profound pleasure to be had in observing wildlife. I’ve no idea why: but there is. Quite right. Add it to the list
Some of my lifetime highs have been seeing wildlife: a pride of lions walk past me in Zambia (I had no gun, they could easily have taken me and killed me), the same pride then making a kill! - a whale seen off Madagascar, which we ran out to play with, a bear crossing a road in Colorado, a pod of orcas in Antarctica, a trio of platypus in Oz, a cassowary in Oz, a drop bear in Oz, my first ever cheetah! A desert elephant trying to charge me in Namibia…. A caracal at dawn in Namibia in the far desert
YES, you are right
Seeing my first jaguar in the Pantanale, standing on a river bank above me at dusk, illuminated by fireflies.
A thousand dolphins crossing the equator like a tsunami, chasing after a bait-ball.
Seeing an Egyptian Plover pass inches by the side of the dugout canoe I was in on the Congo.
Finding my first Striped Hawkmoth in my garden moth trap (it was making so much noise I thought a rat had got in...)
The spout of a blue whale, like the Jet d'Eau in Geneva.
In a remarkably Gothic moment, sitting in the dark outside a Brazilian monastery, bats and moths zipping around as the monks sang their vesper rites. And then, padding up the steps, came a wild wolf...
Nice. Enviable. You describe it well, these are spine tingling moments, aren’t they? The fact we all remember them, and you can pin them down so articulately, proves that
i suspect @TimS is on to something: it’s the animal in us, the half evolved hominid in Africa, reconnecting with our lost past as part of Creation. Before the Fall
It is the same reason cave art is so obsessively focussed on animals and game and prey and, sometimes, simple animal beauty
There's certainly something in it.
I still have a vivid memory of a bat colony, emerging at dusk, one by one, from the tiled roof of a Gascony farmhouse. Must be a couple of decades back.
Not going to lie but La Marseillaise is the best national anthem in the world.
I cannot tell you how much it pains me to say that.
Even my loins girded there.
You mean the words about thicko revolutionaries marching on the next town to chop everyone up with scythes? The Marseillaise is gibberish, one of the worst national anthems out there as it doesn’t represent a nation at all if it’s not repressing the life, love and philosophies are those all chopped up by scythes when all they were doing was out shopping for onions.
The USA has the best anthem ever.
I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul. Hearing La Marseillaise makes me wish I were French, and that’s even without the cheese, the wine, the sensible attitude to lunch and the healthy disregard for their “betters”.
“I always suspected you were an idiot. Now I know that you are an idiot without soul.‘
For an anthem, especially National anthem, words matter far more than tune. It’s as simple as that.
Both Jerusalem and Land of Hope and Glory don’t count either, as both are fake and hideous. One was words, poetic and largely without meaning to you unless you shared the meaning with the poet, later set to music. The second was a conceptual piece of music utterly bastardised and vandalised by those who didn’t have a clue about the artists concept, and put pompous words to it ignorant of capturing the Yang to the ying circumstance.
I never suspected you to be an idiot, but if you disagree with my reply you certainly are, and one devoid of understanding what makes a good anthem.
Neither Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory are national anthems, although Land of Hope and Glory would be a better English national anthem than the current dirge to an irrelevant bunch of parasites.
Much as I would like to disagree with you, you are right. The English and UK anthem is basically the royal anthem, it says nothing about England or the UK at all, it is all about wishing our monarch long life and a long reign.
It is ridiculous it is still the English anthem when the King is also King of Wales, Scotland and NI too and not to mention Canada, NZ and Australia. So whenever we play those nations at rugby or football or cricket we are effectively singing a song that could just as well apply to their head of state too!
It is long since past time England sporting teams had Jerusalem or Land of Hope and Glory as their anthem, which they now do only in the Commonwealth games. Leave GSTK as the UK anthem for the Olympics, F1, Davis Cup etc and for any sporting, cultural or commemorative event a member of the royal family is in attendance at. Or even just for the latter and compose a new UK anthem too
We changed our national anthem in 2022. Changing it again so soon would be unseemly.
We didn't actually, given GSTK was composed originally for George II at the time of the Jacobite rebellion, we have now just restored the original lyrics
GSTK is much too maligned. It’s not the best anthem but it is far from the worst
It is short and memorable and easy to sing: anyone can bang it out, and it has quite a rousing crescendo - SEND. HIM. VICTORIOUS
I reckon it is better than Star Spangled Banner, and way better than that stupid Italian crap. And obviously better than the weirdly depressing Flower of Scotland which basically says “we’re going to lose, and lose again, but that’s OK, it’s what we do”
The Marseillaise is an epically and oddly bouncy tune, especially the intro, but it is quite hard to sing. The Welsh anthem is moving and stirring, and deserves to be the hymn for a better country. The Russians have the best one of all
SSB is epic; way better than GSTK (aka “My Country, ‘‘tis of thee”).
Maybe my appreciation of SSB has been shagged by too many half assed lady singers overdoing it and ruining it: it now seems histrionic and tedious, to me..
I can't deny it gets sung badly on a regular basis. But that's partly, I think, because it just gets sung more often than most. And it is a challenge for the casual singer.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
No the greatest pleasure is a meaningful life.
Everybody needs a reason to get up in the morning.
Hedonism is legitimately meaningful life for many. Others may not agree it would be truly meaningful for them (and doubt it as so for others), but each to their own.
My close friend who just died was entirely without spirituality, or any purposeful career, and was a total hedonist. He had no kids, he had no real job, he lived for pleasure, in the early days it was travel and sex and drugs and booze, later it became boozing and story telling and smoking cigs. He died, unsurprisingly, of liver failure leading to total organ failure. At the age of 61. His funeral is in two weeks
To me (and maybe to others) his life was arguably quite empty. Yet I cannot say he was unhappy. He wasn’t. He was generally happy - certainly chirpy and joking - until the last few years, when I didn’t;t see him simply because our lives diverged so much, But I am told by those who did continue to see him that he remained equally cheerful and boozy until the final weeks
So he is an example of a pretty pure hedonist. His life had no meaning or purpose and he freely admitted it, he just wanted to have fun, and a laugh, and that’s what he did, that was his meaning. Fair play and RIP
Better 60 years of fun than 80 of tedium.
Of course, if you can manage 80 (or more) of fun, all the better.
"Gott straffe England" > guaranteed hit in Wales & Scotland (and much of England?) > thus will help unite the fractured (or is it ruptured?) United Kingdom.
Alternative nomination:
"(Can't Get No) Satisfaction" > words & lyrics by native Brits > echoes enduring theme throughout British history, culture, economics, etc. etc.
Travel and Sex are the greatest pleasures in human life: discuss
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
Observing the remarkable variety of the fauna and flora we share our planet with is very high on my list of joys.
Oooh, nice one, yes
There is a profound pleasure to be had in observing wildlife. I’ve no idea why: but there is. Quite right. Add it to the list
Some of my lifetime highs have been seeing wildlife: a pride of lions walk past me in Zambia (I had no gun, they could easily have taken me and killed me), the same pride then making a kill! - a whale seen off Madagascar, which we ran out to play with, a bear crossing a road in Colorado, a pod of orcas in Antarctica, a trio of platypus in Oz, a cassowary in Oz, a drop bear in Oz, my first ever cheetah! A desert elephant trying to charge me in Namibia…. A caracal at dawn in Namibia in the far desert
YES, you are right
Seeing my first jaguar in the Pantanale, standing on a river bank above me at dusk, illuminated by fireflies.
A thousand dolphins crossing the equator like a tsunami, chasing after a bait-ball.
Seeing an Egyptian Plover pass inches by the side of the dugout canoe I was in on the Congo.
Finding my first Striped Hawkmoth in my garden moth trap (it was making so much noise I thought a rat had got in...)
The spout of a blue whale, like the Jet d'Eau in Geneva.
In a remarkably Gothic moment, sitting in the dark outside a Brazilian monastery, bats and moths zipping around as the monks sang their vesper rites. And then, padding up the steps, came a wild wolf...
Nice. Enviable. You describe it well, these are spine tingling moments, aren’t they? The fact we all remember them, and you can pin them down so articulately, proves that
i suspect @TimS is on to something: it’s the animal in us, the half evolved hominid in Africa, reconnecting with our lost past as part of Creation. Before the Fall
It is the same reason cave art is so obsessively focussed on animals and game and prey and, sometimes, simple animal beauty
There's certainly something in it.
I still have a vivid memory of a bat colony, emerging at dusk, one by one, from the tiled roof of a Gascony farmhouse. Must be a couple of decades back.
Authenticity is something to do with it. Animals are themselves, they generally don’t perform, not for us, and if they do it is weird and sometimes repulsive (circus animals, etc). Animal behaviour is what it is, and for a profound if opaque reason. It’s the difference between discovering an actual castle full of witches and going to Disneyland, which one would you remember and cherish?
But there are other things at play. Humans adore watching animals. Which makes our disgusting destruction of Nature even sadder
Indeed I saw this today.
After my visit to Bolivar’s tomb and the museum of the vampire bat people I had to wait in Parque Bolivar for the Catedral to open. I noticed there was more mahoosive iguanas plodding about - size of dogs. To me that was really strange but by this point I was thinking, Well, maybe there are fat iguanas everywhere, and it’s normal, no one else is taking photos
But then this cycling Colombian Deliveroo kid came sailing by, blithely, and he saw one of the iguanas and his face was all WTF, what is that, and he basically stopped -mid delivery - to stare at the lizard. For a full minute. Then he shook his head and smiled and cycled on
So,
1. Most Colombian towns don’t have big iguanas in their main squares? Dunno
But certainly
2. A Colombian teenage boy, full of vigour and urgency, will be so engaged and delighted by a massive lizard he will stop and look at it, with pleasurable concentration, for a proper minute
Apparently the Tory internal polling which two weeks ago was showing SKS as useless now shows him as winning a 250 seat majority. Does anyone think they’re just making it up as they go along?
They play the Star Spangled Banner before football (as in soccer) games. Twenty two foreign players standing there, confused, while some B list celeb belts out the SSB. Badly.
It's awful. It's insane.
This isn't international football. There aren't any - or at least many - Americans playing. Heck, half the crowd are British expats, and the other half is thirteen year old girls from La Jolla.
Why?
Why play some weird song about bombs bursting overhead?
Apparently the Tory internal polling which two weeks ago was showing SKS as useless now shows him as winning a 250 seat majority. Does anyone think they’re just making it up as they go along?
Why can't it be both, in the public polling, the latest YouGov figures has -12% net approval for SKS at the same time as showing a massive polling lead for Labour. The public seems to think that SKS is useless but still better than the Tory front bench.
They play the Star Spangled Banner before football (as in soccer) games. Twenty two foreign players standing there, confused, while some B list celeb belts out the SSB. Badly.
It's awful. It's insane.
This isn't international football. There aren't any - or at least many - Americans playing. Heck, half the crowd are British expats, and the other half is thirteen year old girls from La Jolla.
Why?
Why play some weird song about bombs bursting overhead?
Because the US has the mentality of a young country, born of rebellion, where questions of loyalty are of vital import. Followed later by a civil war, and with a history of large amounts of immigration where the new migrants would need to be moulded into loyal citizens. Plus also I've always viewed some aspects of US culture as being somewhat fascist, helping to explain why the union movement was kept much weaker in the US than in Europe. The aggressive nationalism of playing the anthem at sporting events, and the pledge of alliegance in schools, is all part of that.
They play the Star Spangled Banner before football (as in soccer) games. Twenty two foreign players standing there, confused, while some B list celeb belts out the SSB. Badly.
It's awful. It's insane.
This isn't international football. There aren't any - or at least many - Americans playing. Heck, half the crowd are British expats, and the other half is thirteen year old girls from La Jolla.
Why?
Why play some weird song about bombs bursting overhead?
Because the US has the mentality of a young country....
This may be part of US self-mythology, but the Declaration of Independence was nearly 250 years ago. There are plenty of countries younger than that.
They play the Star Spangled Banner before football (as in soccer) games. Twenty two foreign players standing there, confused, while some B list celeb belts out the SSB. Badly.
It's awful. It's insane.
This isn't international football. There aren't any - or at least many - Americans playing. Heck, half the crowd are British expats, and the other half is thirteen year old girls from La Jolla.
Why?
Why play some weird song about bombs bursting overhead?
Because the US has the mentality of a young country....
This may be part of US self-mythology, but the Declaration of Independence was nearly 250 years ago. There are plenty of countries younger than that.
It's a mentality. People's ideas about their own country are all the stuff of myth-making, with only a tenuous connection to the reality that lies behind it.
And also the newness of the US is a function of the large amount of immigration it has experienced. Compare population growth between the UK and the US over the 20th century. The UK population went from a bit more than 40 million to a bit less than 60 million - an increase of a bit less than 50%. The US population went from ~75 million to ~280 million an increase of ~270%. That difference makes the US a much younger country in the minds of its people.
They play the Star Spangled Banner before football (as in soccer) games. Twenty two foreign players standing there, confused, while some B list celeb belts out the SSB. Badly.
It's awful. It's insane.
This isn't international football. There aren't any - or at least many - Americans playing. Heck, half the crowd are British expats, and the other half is thirteen year old girls from La Jolla.
Why?
Why play some weird song about bombs bursting overhead?
I'm probably forgiving of a life of aimlessness as I read a couple of Jeeves books today, and Wooster seems to have no thought in his head other than bumbling through life as amiably as can be managed.
Though I did like this from the preface by the author to one of them: In these days when everybody hates everybody else, anyone who is not snarling at something - or at everything - is an anachronism.
Wodehouse foresaw British Gas Customer Service Department?
They play the Star Spangled Banner before football (as in soccer) games. Twenty two foreign players standing there, confused, while some B list celeb belts out the SSB. Badly.
It's awful. It's insane.
This isn't international football. There aren't any - or at least many - Americans playing. Heck, half the crowd are British expats, and the other half is thirteen year old girls from La Jolla.
Why?
Why play some weird song about bombs bursting overhead?
I'm probably forgiving of a life of aimlessness as I read a couple of Jeeves books today, and Wooster seems to have no thought in his head other than bumbling through life as amiably as can be managed.
Though I did like this from the preface by the author to one of them: In these days when everybody hates everybody else, anyone who is not snarling at something - or at everything - is an anachronism.
Wodehouse foresaw British Gas Customer Service Department?
No, but Douglas Adams did. "Sirius Cybernetics" was a late edit for legal reasons.
Comments
Bear with me, as I can't stand him either - he ultimately helped create this mess by trying to be too politically clever by half during his time as PM rather than doing what's right for the country.
But at this point the Tories' best option might be a Howard-like appointment as elder statesman who can mend a few fences, calm things down, is probably most like the Home Counties voters who could turning a shoeing into a catastrophe if they decide they want to punish their old party, and will obviously toddle off again after defeat, so even the factions who can't stand him might as well put up with it for a bit.
Of course the manoeuvres to make it happen would be to elaborate - if only politicians stayed in parliament these days.
He also won't win back any of the Remainers who voted for him in 2010 and 2015 but now are voting Starmer Labour or LD unless he said he would reverse Brexit, which really would guarantee a Farage return and Reform overtake the Tories.
Cameron is intelligent enough to realise the above and has no interest in doing the role again, he is happy as an elder statesman as Foreign Secretary now in a largely non party political role in the Lords with a higher class of debate than the Commons normally has and better restaurant and bar too and Chevening and Carlton Gardens and lots of foreign travel to sunnier climes. He has no interest going on the campaign trail in the late autumn in marginal seats in the likes of Stoke, Nuneaton, Bolton, Margate and Plymouth and Rhyl and getting eggs thrown at him
Is it REALLY worth 4-5 days’ trekking? How?? How is anywhere worth all that effort? Sincere question
I am deffo going to Tayrona Park tho, it looks incredible, My last three days in Colombia. Bow out on a high
I can see why people fall in love with Latin American traveling. There is so much to see and so much is barely touched by tourism
If only they would sort out the FOOD and the DANGER
I do recall there was a whole lot of blather when Corbyn was excluded from being a candidate for instance, yet a quick peruse of the rulebook suggested the NEC did have the authority to do it, notwithstanding all the complaints it did not.
Closely followed by Food and Drugs
Then the fine arts then the cheap arts, also sports
After that it’s “a nice sit down”, “wanking”, “spa days”, “walking into a nicely furnished room” etc
The monarch, by convention, is informed by and acts upon the advice of the Prime Minister so long as the government appears to have the confidence of the House, and the Prime Minister maintains support as the leader of that government.
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld5802/ldselect/ldconst/100/10005.htm
There isn't one.
That is assuming Labour don't wreck the economy in government either, which could see even a hard rightwinger win
It is short and memorable and easy to sing: anyone can bang it out, and it has quite a rousing crescendo - SEND. HIM. VICTORIOUS
I reckon it is better than Star Spangled Banner, and way better than that stupid Italian crap. And obviously better than the weirdly depressing Flower of Scotland which basically says “we’re going to lose, and lose again, but that’s OK, it’s what we do”
The Marseillaise is an epically and oddly bouncy tune, especially the intro, but it is quite hard to sing. The Welsh anthem is moving and stirring, and deserves to be the hymn for a better country. The Russians have the best one of all
Everybody needs a reason to get up in the morning.
Creating something that you can feel proud of is good too. Often more satisfying than merely consuming someone else's creation, even if the someone else's creation is technically more proficient.
I also take pleasure from pleasing others.
So what then? This is when the list of pleasures comes into play
The issue is the lyrics have sod all to do with England, it could just as well be the anthem for Canada or New Zealand or Scotland given the King is also their King too.
It should be left as the royal and maybe UK anthem and England should have its own anthem with lyrics like Jerusalem which actually mention the nation the anthem is supposed to be for!
There is a profound pleasure to be had in observing wildlife. I’ve no idea why: but there is. Quite right. Add it to the list
Some of my lifetime highs have been seeing wildlife: a pride of lions walk past me in Zambia (I had no gun, they could easily have taken me and killed me), the same pride then making a kill! - a whale seen off Madagascar, which we ran out to play with, a bear crossing a road in Colorado, a pod of orcas in Antarctica, a trio of platypus in Oz, a cassowary in Oz, a drop bear in Oz, my first ever cheetah! A desert elephant trying to charge me in Namibia…. A caracal at dawn in Namibia in the far desert
YES, you are right
For example the opening of the section on disciplinary rules states 'The NEC shall take such disciplinary measures it deems necessary to ensure that all party members and officers conform to the constitution, rules and standing orders of the party. Such powers shall include etc etc' with a whole bunch of specific rules about investigation and reports etc. But in relation to clubs and the like do courts interpret a 'such measures as deemed necessary' as very enabling of essentially going off script?
I don't think that applies in this case as I think the process she is under is different, but it's all very confusing. There is reference to standing orders of the Parliamentary Labour Party, so I assume those rules are slightly distinct from the overall constitution so long as it adheres to basic rules of that constitution. But the constitution does say any dispute over the meaning and interpetation of the constitution, standing orders, and rules of the party, are to be determined by the NEC, which is Starmerite at the moment.
I feel like its pretty likely Abbott is being a bit screwed over by the party machinery due to being on the outs with Starmer, but absent a willingness to formally challenge, which is presumably career suicide within the party, avoiding the mitigation being offered as a pretextual reason for not restoring the whip doesn't seem to benefit her much.
https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Rule-Book-2022-a.pdf
I think if you take intoxicants as a whole they slightly edge out food for third place, if you see what I mean
Its one of the scariest things about AI that @Leon goes on about. What will the purpose of life be without work? Yes, there can be the ephemeral pleasures that have been mentioned, but where is the purpose?
In the Culture Novels there is no work as such but everyone wants to be in Special Circumstances because that in fact gives meaning to the existence.
Whereas land of my fathers couldn’t be more Welsh.
Why do we derive so much pleasure from looking at birds and animals, and nature in general?
i am not quite sure, I can come up with various complex ev psych explanations, but it is fascinatingly intricate. People pay tens of thousands of pounds to go on great safaris. And, having been on some great safaris, I can vouch for the fact that they are fucking brilliant at their best, and worth it, if you can afford it
Seeing a lion make a kill is a spellbinding thing, which you never forget, and gives you a strange warmth of memory when you look back
People can find purpose in many other things of course, but if health permits and people are not being obliged to do so, I think continuing to work well past retirement age is a good thing (perhaps not economically, but I don't understand economics anyway).
No one seems to bregrudge Warren Buffett or the like working on very late in their lives. Though they do begrudge it of Joe Biden I suppose.
Mtsvane then Saperavi tonight with my homemade khinkali and kachapuri. Saperapi is an epic grape. The Mtsvane was a bit disappointing.
To me (and maybe to others) his life was arguably quite empty. Yet I cannot say he was unhappy. He wasn’t. He was generally happy - certainly chirpy and joking - until the last few years, when I didn’t;t see him simply because our lives diverged so much, But I am told by those who did continue to see him that he remained equally cheerful and boozy until the final weeks
So he is an example of a pretty pure hedonist. His life had no meaning or purpose and he freely admitted it, he just wanted to have fun, and a laugh, and that’s what he did, that was his meaning. Fair play and RIP
You're right none of this benefits Abbott herself, but I wouldn't hold it against her to have principles that in this case appear to be justified.
A thousand dolphins crossing the equator like a tsunami, chasing after a bait-ball.
Seeing an Egyptian Plover pass inches by the side of the dugout canoe I was in on the Congo.
Finding my first Striped Hawkmoth in my garden moth trap (it was making so much noise I thought a rat had got in...)
The spout of a blue whale, like the Jet d'Eau in Geneva.
In a remarkably Gothic moment, sitting in the dark outside a Brazilian monastery, bats and moths zipping around as the monks sang their vesper rites. And then, padding up the steps, came a wild wolf...
Of course it’s rather hard to deliver on that prospectus so we might be in for a rather cyclical couple of parliaments until someone can channel Blair and find a way to evangelise for a centrist vision (which is much harder than demagoguery).
Starmer's Labour party is a lot less tolerant than Blair's was. A lot of that is down to the consequences of Corbyn's leadership, of course.
Today I have not done much. I had a lie in and argued with people on PB while drinking tea, while Mrs Foxy baked brownies for a friends coffee morning. I walked my dog in the spring sunshine, stopping to chat with others out walking. I drank more tea. I cut the lawn for the first time this year, and had just finished when the first rain fell, so felt smug about the timing.
Then Fox Jr2 arrived with a few of his mates, and we chatted for a bit about films, and ate a takeaway veg curry. They are fine young people, each on the cusp of really interesting and challenging lives.
After they left for a friend's party, Mrs Foxy and I watched Poirot reruns from the sofa, until she turned in, and I watched a fairly lame Eighties teen flick.
A day of simple pleasures all round, and all the better for it.
Though I did like this from the preface by the author to one of them:
In these days when everybody hates everybody else, anyone who is not snarling at something - or at everything - is an anachronism.
i suspect @TimS is on to something: it’s the animal in us, the half evolved hominid in Africa, reconnecting with our lost past as part of Creation. Before the Fall
It is the same reason cave art is so obsessively focussed on animals and game and prey and, sometimes, simple animal beauty
In a way its very handy that some very petty things have been challenged at times, sometimes all the way to the highest courts in the land, as it helps establish some basic rules about things like parish polls or membership or golf clubs.
Very few anthems are memorable AND identifiable. There are very few where the average human can hear a few chords and they can name the country. GSTK is one of those, so is SSB, so is the Russian, the French, and then at that point most people would struggle, around the world - I can identify the Welsh, Scots and Irish merely because I follow rugby
pause
what????
I'm...not quite sure you can do that with NIN, at least not without injury. Here's a challenging example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBBVuje_cL4
I still have a vivid memory of a bat colony, emerging at dusk, one by one, from the tiled roof of a Gascony farmhouse.
Must be a couple of decades back.
And it is a challenge for the casual singer.
But that's just part of its appeal.
Of course, if you can manage 80 (or more) of fun, all the better.
"Gott straffe England"
> guaranteed hit in Wales & Scotland (and much of England?)
> thus will help unite the fractured (or is it ruptured?) United Kingdom.
Alternative nomination:
"(Can't Get No) Satisfaction"
> words & lyrics by native Brits
> echoes enduring theme throughout British history, culture, economics, etc. etc.
But there are other things at play. Humans adore watching animals. Which makes our disgusting destruction of Nature even sadder
Indeed I saw this today.
After my visit to Bolivar’s tomb and the museum of the vampire bat people I had to wait in Parque Bolivar for the Catedral to open. I noticed there was more mahoosive iguanas plodding about - size of dogs. To me that was really strange but by this point I was thinking, Well, maybe there are fat iguanas everywhere, and it’s normal, no one else is taking photos
But then this cycling Colombian Deliveroo kid came sailing by, blithely, and he saw one of the iguanas and his face was all WTF, what is that, and he basically stopped -mid delivery - to stare at the lizard. For a full minute. Then he shook his head and smiled and cycled on
So,
1. Most Colombian towns don’t have big iguanas in their main squares? Dunno
But certainly
2. A Colombian teenage boy, full of vigour and urgency, will be so engaged and delighted by a massive lizard he will stop and look at it, with pleasurable concentration, for a proper minute
We LIKE animals
It's awful. It's insane.
This isn't international football. There aren't any - or at least many - Americans playing. Heck, half the crowd are British expats, and the other half is thirteen year old girls from La Jolla.
Why?
Why play some weird song about bombs bursting overhead?
And also the newness of the US is a function of the large amount of immigration it has experienced. Compare population growth between the UK and the US over the 20th century. The UK population went from a bit more than 40 million to a bit less than 60 million - an increase of a bit less than 50%. The US population went from ~75 million to ~280 million an increase of ~270%. That difference makes the US a much younger country in the minds of its people.
decided it is no longer PM.
Which PM it isn't, I'll leave up to you.