I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
Sorry, I stopped reading after the second sentence.
Try not to fart out your basest emotions if you want to be taken seriously on here.
I have to ask how many decades you have lived in red wall towns to tell me from your own lived experience that people like my uncle don't think what I posted?
There is a huge amount of baseline bigotry in places like Rochdale. That "bigoted woman" is normal for Rochdale. They absolutely think their town has been taken over by "the pakis" - a descriptor used for any British Asian community regardless of their heritage.
These are the people that 20p prey on - usually someone from elsewhere with more life experience and intelligence who is gas-lighting them for votes, but now with Lee Anderson they get the real deal. The moron's moron.
I grew up in Rochdale and have family there. I spent another decade and a half on Teesside. Don't presume to tell me what the red wall is like.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
I just don't agree with you - I think most people will know. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the idea of a music uncanny valley (much like the animation uncanny valley) will exist and be quite clear. Maybe like electro, synth music, or orchestral music without voices might become more AI dominated, but even then I doubt it, because the way that songs and such get mixed can be very spur of the moment, with DJs reacting to the club at the time and such, and I think that lots of classical orchestral music has extremely experiential roots. I've seen the hyper realistic videos and such, and in some I've not been able to tell that they're primarily AI, but they still too fall into an uncanny valley. Same with the hyper-realistic photos of people - the vast majority of them do have the uncanny valley vibe. Again, maybe I'm being anthrocentric, but I do kind of think this sort of thing won't fly with the vast majority of people.
You are comically and risibly wrong. TBF most people are like you. They just don't understand. They think - even tho most would deny it - that humans have some unique thing that makes human art unique, so it will never be equalled and will always be superior
It is quasi-religious, and yet you often see it trotted out by convinced atheists (like you, perhaps). Add in a large dash of fear and loathing, and top it off with the cherry of denial, and you get a dismal cocktail of circular logic like yours
Interesting that you mention animation. This is ALREADY being automated. Machines do it better than humans, and do it for free
Jeffery Katzenberg is the ex head of Disney. I suspect he knows more about animation than you
"Jeffrey Katzenberg Says A.I. Will Eliminate 90 Percent of Artist Jobs on Animated Films"
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
@Leon seeing as you have looked into this a lot and look out for what is wrong in AI pictures/film (eg the film of the dog typing was a good example) can you explain what to look for in a picture of someone (head and shoulders only no hands). So here is the example:
The pressure group I am involved in is building a web site. The pictures of the committee are currently filled with dummy pictures. Every picture shouts out to me that it is not a real human, but created artificially. But I don't know why. It just does.
So the uncanny valley is the space in which people look at hyper realistic fake humans and just know something is off (we think that this is a by-product of an evolutionary pressure to know what a corpse looks like, as a method of being risk averse to areas / things that may be deadly). There has been a lot of research with suggestions of how to minimise the effect, although if you're using generated photos rather than creating them from scratch I don't know exactly how much you can do that.
20% of voters ie almost the current Tory poll rating and a plurality of Conservative and Leave voters thinking the party was wrong to suspend Anderson is significant even if a plurality of voters over all back his suspension. It shows the Tories cannot afford to expel or deselect Anderson without even further leakage to Reform, maybe even leading to them level pegging with Reform.
Habib is probably right but the average Reform voters is closer to Anderson than him I suspect
That is a well argued post @HYUFD, but as a Tory what do you suggest as a solution, or do you think there isn't one this side of the election and that they have to muddle through and reset afterwards?
Stick with the suspension of Anderson but don't expel him or remove him from the candidates list, given he has now not ruled out defecting to Reform as a last resort https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68400775
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
The music industry finances got there some time ago. No-one, not even Taylor Swift, is making millions from Spotify streams.
The money is in live music, and the internet is simply how they advertise the live concerts to the fans. The response after the pandemic has been astonishing, with every entertainer (musician, actor, comedian, and many more) all now permanently on tour, with halls, theatres and arenas everywhere selling out. A new act doesn’t play small venues in big cities hoping to be ‘spotted’ by someone from ‘industry’ to ‘sign’ them; they go out and find their audience online, then sell tickets for gigs around the country, and even further afield.
Swift even made a movie of her concert and put it in cinemas, because there were so many fans who couldn’t get tickets for the live show.
To think it was little more than a decade ago that the money was in little shiny disks, and that a few weeks in the studio could make you enough money to never have to work again. Spotify launched in the US in 2011, at which time streaming was 3% of the global music market. https://www.billboard.com/pro/spotify-us-launch-apple-music-future/
Yes, basically the music industry turned on its head. It used to be that tours were loss leaders to sell albums.
ETA scooped by kjh!
Richard Osman now has a podcast and one of the questions last week was how many musicians make money.
His brother (in Suede so knows the industry) reckons that nowadays only 5% of the bands you’ve heard of make any money and everyone and everything tries to chip away bits of it
There was a time not that long ago when touring was a loss-leader for album sales which actually made the money. Now we are back to the situation pre-80s when touring is the only way for artists to make any money at all, and even then it is marginal. Hence the enormous outcry when Br**it made that even harder.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
It is interesting how live music has changed for the better. In the 70s groups only toured to promote their new album so you sat through that until the encore so as to hear the stuff you really wanted to hear. Also it was far too loud and distorted. Now live concerts are a pleasure. All the old stuff, sensible volumes and real money earners for the bands.
In large part due to tribute bands who gave the fans exactly what they wanted, the greatest hits played exactly the same as on the records. Then bands got back together to become their own tribute acts playing their greatest hits...
Ha yes. The bands started ignoring their old stuff and playing new stuff no-one was interested in, while a tribute band would play more accessible concerts and mostly do a damn good job of the Greatest Hits. Obviously that band isn’t selling any music, just the experience.
At the other end of the scale, there’s also covers bands such as Postmodern Jukebox, an internet-famous jazz collective re-interpreting modern pop songs in classic styles. They’re playing 20 theatres in the UK in late spring. https://postmodernjukebox.com/shows/ Before the internet, these guys would be playing NY jazz clubs and maybe a few weddings, but they’re massively talented and have found a worldwide audience for their shows.
I'm going to be seeing Puddles when he's over here in a few weeks - have been looking forward to that for ages. One thing that I do think is due a renaissance is jazz music - if we're going to replay the 20s and 30s of the 20th century at least let us have jazz again.
For some reason I only went down the modern jazz YouTube rabbithole a few weeks ago, even though so much of it has been online for a decade. Now I have a several hours long playlist of PMJ and friends, and can’t stop singing along.
It’s difficult not to smile at a jazz version of Eminem, or Green Day, or making something really crap from the current era like Nicki Minaj actually listenable and fun. Watch for the backing vocalist playing the dog on the last of those links!
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
20% of voters ie almost the current Tory poll rating and a plurality of Conservative and Leave voters thinking the party was wrong to suspend Anderson is significant even if a plurality of voters over all back his suspension. It shows the Tories cannot afford to expel or deselect Anderson without even further leakage to Reform, maybe even leading to them level pegging with Reform.
Habib is probably right but the average Reform voters is closer to Anderson than him I suspect
That is a well argued post @HYUFD, but as a Tory what do you suggest as a solution, or do you think there isn't one this side of the election and that they have to muddle through and reset afterwards?
Stick with the suspension of Anderson but don't expel him or remove him from the candidates list, given he has now not ruled out defecting to Reform as a last resort https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68400775
Do Labour deny the policy changes they plan? After we finally limit the flow of immigration with Sunak's new limits, is Starmer going to open the flood gates again?
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
I just don't agree with you - I think most people will know. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the idea of a music uncanny valley (much like the animation uncanny valley) will exist and be quite clear. Maybe like electro, synth music, or orchestral music without voices might become more AI dominated, but even then I doubt it, because the way that songs and such get mixed can be very spur of the moment, with DJs reacting to the club at the time and such, and I think that lots of classical orchestral music has extremely experiential roots. I've seen the hyper realistic videos and such, and in some I've not been able to tell that they're primarily AI, but they still too fall into an uncanny valley. Same with the hyper-realistic photos of people - the vast majority of them do have the uncanny valley vibe. Again, maybe I'm being anthrocentric, but I do kind of think this sort of thing won't fly with the vast majority of people.
You are comically and risibly wrong. TBF most people are like you. They just don't understand. They think - even tho most would deny it - that humans have some unique thing that makes human art unique, so it will never be equalled and will always be superior
It is quasi-religious, and yet you often see it trotted out by convinced atheists (like you, perhaps). Add in a large dash of fear and loathing, and top it off with the cherry of denial, and you get a dismal cocktail of circular logic like yours
Interesting that you mention animation. This is ALREADY being automated. Machines do it better than humans, and do it for free
Jeffery Katzenberg is the ex head of Disney. I suspect he knows more about animation than you
"Jeffrey Katzenberg Says A.I. Will Eliminate 90 Percent of Artist Jobs on Animated Films"
He said that three months ago BEFORE we got the astonishing revelation of Sora, and sublime text-to-video
You are wrong, and you should prepare yourself for a very nasty surprise, if you continue in this wrongthink
I mean I don't know much about the actual art of animation, true, but I do know a lot about the history of Disney - so I'll take Katzenberg's warnings with a pinch of salt. Indeed, for most animation companies they have always been wrong about what was going to be the "big hit" - Disney was sure Pocahontas was going to be the big thing and Lion King (despite having an amazing cast) was always considered the secondary project; and at Dreamworks Prince of Egypt was going to be the big rival to Disney Blockbusters and people were demoted to Shrek if they annoyed people. And animation companies have still failed to "solve" the uncanny valley, and typically work around it by employing it on purpose (AI the film) or by cartooning up their character style (Shrek, Incredibles, etc)
"Sublime text to video"? What sublime text to video? I've seen a few things people have made - puppy dogs playing whilst also popping in and out of existence - is that what people are supposed to see as real?
It's not that I think human art is superior - I am sure automated art will be able to surpass human techniques in terms of mechanics of creating things very easily. I just don't think humans will be very interested in it - because it will clearly not be human made. I typically accept the hypothesis that things like art - be it singing, painting, dancing etc. - are evolved forms of mating displays; that humans (with our greatest evolutionary advantage being our brains and ability to learn) typically cared for social performances and ability in partners and not raw strength. So, if those kinds of works are copied by a machine, I expect they will be technically astounding. I just don't think they will reach people in the same way, because the intent doesn't exist. A machine cannot be creative - it can only be iterative. We will have facsimiles of fakes, echoes of shadows.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
I just don't agree with you - I think most people will know. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the idea of a music uncanny valley (much like the animation uncanny valley) will exist and be quite clear. Maybe like electro, synth music, or orchestral music without voices might become more AI dominated, but even then I doubt it, because the way that songs and such get mixed can be very spur of the moment, with DJs reacting to the club at the time and such, and I think that lots of classical orchestral music has extremely experiential roots. I've seen the hyper realistic videos and such, and in some I've not been able to tell that they're primarily AI, but they still too fall into an uncanny valley. Same with the hyper-realistic photos of people - the vast majority of them do have the uncanny valley vibe. Again, maybe I'm being anthrocentric, but I do kind of think this sort of thing won't fly with the vast majority of people.
You are comically and risibly wrong. TBF most people are like you. They just don't understand. They think - even tho most would deny it - that humans have some unique thing that makes human art unique, so it will never be equalled and will always be superior
It is quasi-religious, and yet you often see it trotted out by convinced atheists (like you, perhaps). Add in a large dash of fear and loathing, and top it off with the cherry of denial, and you get a dismal cocktail of circular logic like yours
Interesting that you mention animation. This is ALREADY being automated. Machines do it better than humans, and do it for free
Jeffery Katzenberg is the ex head of Disney. I suspect he knows more about animation than you
"Jeffrey Katzenberg Says A.I. Will Eliminate 90 Percent of Artist Jobs on Animated Films"
He said that three months ago BEFORE we got the astonishing revelation of Sora, and sublime text-to-video
You are wrong, and you should prepare yourself for a very nasty surprise, if you continue in this wrongthink
In the time-honoured PB fashion - you are wrong.
You are acting as though music from now on will be made by 50-something men in suits who program their bots to throw out crowd pleasers a la Down in the Tube Station at Midnight for the unquestioning masses.
You are out of touch and bringing your own late middle-aged desperate biases to the issue.
Take a look at https://www.lccm.org.uk/ for example. One of many such places. Chock full of 18-30yr old students making contemporary music with all the latest tools at their disposal. Do you think they are unaware of AI and its capabilities. Really?
Music (and art and literature) will continue to be made and appreciated by humans. Just that the tools will change.
20% of voters ie almost the current Tory poll rating and a plurality of Conservative and Leave voters thinking the party was wrong to suspend Anderson is significant even if a plurality of voters over all back his suspension. It shows the Tories cannot afford to expel or deselect Anderson without even further leakage to Reform, maybe even leading to them level pegging with Reform.
Habib is probably right but the average Reform voters is closer to Anderson than him I suspect
That is a well argued post @HYUFD, but as a Tory what do you suggest as a solution, or do you think there isn't one this side of the election and that they have to muddle through and reset afterwards?
Stick with the suspension of Anderson but don't expel him or remove him from the candidates list, given he has now not ruled out defecting to Reform as a last resort https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68400775
How does he get the Tory whip back ?
He’s made it clear he won’t apologize.
Once his suspension ends
How does the suspension end without an apology ?
Good morning
With a fudge !!!!
And I think that is the problem I was asking @hyufd about. I think with all this stuff there really isn't a way out. I do think (although this might be stating the bleeding obvious) the Tories have to keep muddling their way through until the GE and reset afterwards. It is too late and too difficult to have a major reset now without completely imploding (further).
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
@Leon seeing as you have looked into this a lot and look out for what is wrong in AI pictures/film (eg the film of the dog typing was a good example) can you explain what to look for in a picture of someone (head and shoulders only no hands). So here is the example:
The pressure group I am involved in is building a web site. The pictures of the committee are currently filled with dummy pictures. Every picture shouts out to me that it is not a real human, but created artificially. But I don't know why. It just does.
So the uncanny valley is the space in which people look at hyper realistic fake humans and just know something is off (we think that this is a by-product of an evolutionary pressure to know what a corpse looks like, as a method of being risk averse to areas / things that may be deadly). There has been a lot of research with suggestions of how to minimise the effect, although if you're using generated photos rather than creating them from scratch I don't know exactly how much you can do that.
The result? Most people cannot tell the difference between AI and real photos of humans, not any more. Even weirder, there was a bias in the findings such that people tend to believe the AI photos are more likely to be real than real humans. We seem to prefer AI reality, to reality
That's how far over the Uncanny Valley this has now gone. That's why @148grss isn't just wrong and outdated in her opinions, she is ludicrously wrong
20% of voters ie almost the current Tory poll rating and a plurality of Conservative and Leave voters thinking the party was wrong to suspend Anderson is significant even if a plurality of voters over all back his suspension. It shows the Tories cannot afford to expel or deselect Anderson without even further leakage to Reform, maybe even leading to them level pegging with Reform.
Habib is probably right but the average Reform voters is closer to Anderson than him I suspect
That is a well argued post @HYUFD, but as a Tory what do you suggest as a solution, or do you think there isn't one this side of the election and that they have to muddle through and reset afterwards?
Stick with the suspension of Anderson but don't expel him or remove him from the candidates list, given he has now not ruled out defecting to Reform as a last resort https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68400775
How does he get the Tory whip back ?
He’s made it clear he won’t apologize.
The piece of shit will probably be tory leader and LotO by Christmas so he can give the whip back to himself.
Could be worse. At least he's not the sort of wanker that is an apologist for Putin's war of rape and child abduction in Ukraine.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
I just don't agree with you - I think most people will know. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the idea of a music uncanny valley (much like the animation uncanny valley) will exist and be quite clear. Maybe like electro, synth music, or orchestral music without voices might become more AI dominated, but even then I doubt it, because the way that songs and such get mixed can be very spur of the moment, with DJs reacting to the club at the time and such, and I think that lots of classical orchestral music has extremely experiential roots. I've seen the hyper realistic videos and such, and in some I've not been able to tell that they're primarily AI, but they still too fall into an uncanny valley. Same with the hyper-realistic photos of people - the vast majority of them do have the uncanny valley vibe. Again, maybe I'm being anthrocentric, but I do kind of think this sort of thing won't fly with the vast majority of people.
You are comically and risibly wrong. TBF most people are like you. They just don't understand. They think - even tho most would deny it - that humans have some unique thing that makes human art unique, so it will never be equalled and will always be superior
It is quasi-religious, and yet you often see it trotted out by convinced atheists (like you, perhaps). Add in a large dash of fear and loathing, and top it off with the cherry of denial, and you get a dismal cocktail of circular logic like yours
Interesting that you mention animation. This is ALREADY being automated. Machines do it better than humans, and do it for free
Jeffery Katzenberg is the ex head of Disney. I suspect he knows more about animation than you
"Jeffrey Katzenberg Says A.I. Will Eliminate 90 Percent of Artist Jobs on Animated Films"
He said that three months ago BEFORE we got the astonishing revelation of Sora, and sublime text-to-video
You are wrong, and you should prepare yourself for a very nasty surprise, if you continue in this wrongthink
It's easy to say "AI will never be good enough to replace Humans at whatever" but the last hundred years proves that viewpoint is bollocks. Whatever you say can't be done, gets done. Then the next thing, then the next thing. Just look at any SciFi film from the 70s/80s and the mundane stuff is already here. The big stuff like FTL space travel and nuclear fusion are taking a bit longer... I can't yet see the limits of AI. It's just computer nerd stuff, and humans seem to be really good at that up to the point of doing themselves out of a living! It's getting difficult for the average human eye to distinguish reality from AI and the human ear isn't going to fare any better...but the experience of seeing a live show always seemed a safer bet, but ABBA have fired the starting gun and my lad went to the Vegas Sphere before Christmas and he said that was a hell of a show. Slowly, very slowly, humans are making themselves redundant.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
It is interesting how live music has changed for the better. In the 70s groups only toured to promote their new album so you sat through that until the encore so as to hear the stuff you really wanted to hear. Also it was far too loud and distorted. Now live concerts are a pleasure. All the old stuff, sensible volumes and real money earners for the bands.
In large part due to tribute bands who gave the fans exactly what they wanted, the greatest hits played exactly the same as on the records. Then bands got back together to become their own tribute acts playing their greatest hits...
Ha yes. The bands started ignoring their old stuff and playing new stuff no-one was interested in, while a tribute band would play more accessible concerts and mostly do a damn good job of the Greatest Hits. Obviously that band isn’t selling any music, just the experience.
At the other end of the scale, there’s also covers bands such as Postmodern Jukebox, an internet-famous jazz collective re-interpreting modern pop songs in classic styles. They’re playing 20 theatres in the UK in late spring. https://postmodernjukebox.com/shows/ Before the internet, these guys would be playing NY jazz clubs and maybe a few weddings, but they’re massively talented and have found a worldwide audience for their shows.
I'm going to be seeing Puddles when he's over here in a few weeks - have been looking forward to that for ages. One thing that I do think is due a renaissance is jazz music - if we're going to replay the 20s and 30s of the 20th century at least let us have jazz again.
For some reason I only went down the modern jazz YouTube rabbithole a few weeks ago, even though so much of it has been online for a decade. Now I have a several hours long playlist of PMJ and friends, and can’t stop singing along.
It’s difficult not to smile at a jazz version of Eminem, or Green Day, or making something really crap from the current era like Nicki Minaj actually listenable and fun. Watch for the backing vocalist playing the dog on the last of those links!
Smooth.
Has anything AI related actually headed into the UK or US top 100 yet (A lower bar than actually being any good). I'd have thought the artist whose lunch it might probably eat would be someone like Tiesto. I doubt he's worried tbh. So far I believe it's only generated kitsch covers and jingles that will probably be good for ooh I don't know avoiding royalties with adverts.
Music for adverts, that's what I predict AI's forte will be. Leon's dream - a jingle for Roger.
Do Labour deny the policy changes they plan? After we finally limit the flow of immigration with Sunak's new limits, is Starmer going to open the flood gates again?
The really smart thing for Labour would be a Nixon goes to China moment where Starmer delivers better control over numbers by renegotiating bilaterals and/or modifying/editing or qualifying the UN refugee convention, with the legal due process to go with it.
If he did Labour could be in power a very long time.
Labour is ahead of the Tories in London among all age groups including those 65 and over, by 34% to 31% for the latter. For Londoners aged 18-to-24 the respective split is 65% to 13%, 25-to 49 it is 58% to 12%, and 50 to 64 it is 49% to 18%
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
@Leon seeing as you have looked into this a lot and look out for what is wrong in AI pictures/film (eg the film of the dog typing was a good example) can you explain what to look for in a picture of someone (head and shoulders only no hands). So here is the example:
The pressure group I am involved in is building a web site. The pictures of the committee are currently filled with dummy pictures. Every picture shouts out to me that it is not a real human, but created artificially. But I don't know why. It just does.
So the uncanny valley is the space in which people look at hyper realistic fake humans and just know something is off (we think that this is a by-product of an evolutionary pressure to know what a corpse looks like, as a method of being risk averse to areas / things that may be deadly). There has been a lot of research with suggestions of how to minimise the effect, although if you're using generated photos rather than creating them from scratch I don't know exactly how much you can do that.
The result? Most people cannot tell the difference between AI and real photos of humans, not any more. Even weirder, there was a bias in the findings such that people tend to believe the AI photos are more likely to be real than real humans. We seem to prefer AI reality, to reality
That's how far over the Uncanny Valley this has now gone. That's why @148grss isn't just wrong and outdated in her opinions, she is ludicrously wrong
Have you heard of the Orion's Arm project? It is a hard science fiction setting where many authors contribute to envisioning civilization 10,000 years from now. Most of the galaxy is ruled by God-like AIs of various flavours.
20% of voters ie almost the current Tory poll rating and a plurality of Conservative and Leave voters thinking the party was wrong to suspend Anderson is significant even if a plurality of voters over all back his suspension. It shows the Tories cannot afford to expel or deselect Anderson without even further leakage to Reform, maybe even leading to them level pegging with Reform.
Habib is probably right but the average Reform voters is closer to Anderson than him I suspect
That is a well argued post @HYUFD, but as a Tory what do you suggest as a solution, or do you think there isn't one this side of the election and that they have to muddle through and reset afterwards?
Stick with the suspension of Anderson but don't expel him or remove him from the candidates list, given he has now not ruled out defecting to Reform as a last resort https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68400775
How does he get the Tory whip back ?
He’s made it clear he won’t apologize.
Once his suspension ends
How does the suspension end without an apology ?
Good morning
With a fudge !!!!
And I think that is the problem I was asking @hyufd about. I think with all this stuff there really isn't a way out. I do think (although this might be stating the bleeding obvious) the Tories have to keep muddling their way through until the GE and reset afterwards. It is too late and too difficult to have a major reset now without completely imploding (further).
I agree but I would not be surprised to see Anderson reinstated and be the conservative candidate at the GE
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
For all our sakes it would be great if the tory party of @TSE were, indeed, the tory party.
Alas, it’s not the case. There are plenty on the vocal right for whom Lager Lee is totemic:
'Grassroots Conservative supporters have called Rishi Sunak a “snake” over Lee Anderson’s suspension as MPs on the Tory right said he should be given a route back in.
In leaked WhatsApp messages obtained by the Guardian, members of the Conservative Democratic Organisation (CDO), which was founded by disgruntled Tories after Boris Johnson and then Liz Truss were ousted, attacked the prime minister for kicking Anderson out of the parliamentary party.
Several of the activists endorsed Anderson’s comments and some went further in decrying “the threat of Islam”.’
I was chatting with a tory friend yesterday about all of this. She thinks the whole lot of them (Badenoch, Braverman, Anderson etc. etc.) should be booted out of the party so they can join Reform. But we then got talking about when it all started and who is responsible.
A lot of this goes back to Boris who deliberately stoked the right wing rabble with its ‘anti-woke’ hatred, but I suggested that Boris is too dilettantish to devise such a thing.
At which point we both settled on Dominic Cummings.
What you're arguing for is a Conservative Party that more liberals and centre-left can feel comfortable with.
There's certainly a small (and very voluble) audience for that but it's not one that would come close to winning an election: non-Tories might be slightly more comfortable with the Tories being in office but it would win over very few of their votes.
Two points. It is still very unclear what a right wing Tory government would do different, WRT migration, employment, borrowing, spending, pensions, taxing, benefits, debt and deficit.
Secondly, at the moment polling shows under 40% support for the right+centre right, and 60+% support for the centre and centre left and left. This suggests that the next election, like most, will be won from the centre, which is where the next Tory GE win will come from in a few years' time.
The Conservatives biggest problem is they haven't delivered.
In fact, in one area where I think they largely have - checking identity politics - they get reams of criticism, much of which we've seen on this board this morning.
Have they checked it - or have they just weaponised their own form of it ?
What you appear to mean is that they've checked the form of it you don't like.
No, there was a lot of heat in the aftermath of BLM about pulling down statues, renaming buildings, infrastructure and institutions - left, right and centre - calls for reparations, a pretty much compulsory identity politics reading list, and formal programmes of unconscious bias and white privilege throughout the professions and public services. A big jump in EDI employment and deployment. All, essentially, imported from America.
Whilst we got a little bit of that in the first few months Oliver Dowden successfully checked it, including with legislation, and organisations like Stonewall have since been challenged on their agenda. Whilst it's still around in the background it's definitely gone off the boil a bit over the last 18-24 months. We haven't quite yet, in my view, calmed down entirely on British history and identity but it's better than it was.
We don't have anything like the divisions in the USA over it - except that the word "Woke" can trigger people into apoplexy on both sides - and far too many Liberals (not all) deny there was ever an issue, despite opposing each and every single one of the challenges all the way down the line.
Do you think that there is a reasonable argument to be made that people who live in this country may not want statues or plaques, for example, to people who made their money off of the slave trade hailing them as good men and such? Or, in your view, is there absolutely no argument to be made for that kind of thing?
I think I can guess your position, as someone who wishes to defend Chazza with his fists, but still - trying to figure out what is so egregious here.
It happened hundreds of years ago , sad tossers need to get over it and get on with their lives now. No place for any of that pathetic crap of going back centuries and rewriting history, it is for sad losers on the make.
20% of voters ie almost the current Tory poll rating and a plurality of Conservative and Leave voters thinking the party was wrong to suspend Anderson is significant even if a plurality of voters over all back his suspension. It shows the Tories cannot afford to expel or deselect Anderson without even further leakage to Reform, maybe even leading to them level pegging with Reform.
Habib is probably right but the average Reform voters is closer to Anderson than him I suspect
That is a well argued post @HYUFD, but as a Tory what do you suggest as a solution, or do you think there isn't one this side of the election and that they have to muddle through and reset afterwards?
Stick with the suspension of Anderson but don't expel him or remove him from the candidates list, given he has now not ruled out defecting to Reform as a last resort https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68400775
How does he get the Tory whip back ?
He’s made it clear he won’t apologize.
The piece of shit will probably be tory leader and LotO by Christmas so he can give the whip back to himself.
Could be worse. At least he's not the sort of wanker that is an apologist for Putin's war of rape and child abduction in Ukraine.
What's his view on Trump and Steve Bannon?
Is he up for a lovefest with alt-right like ex-Liberal Truss?
Do Labour deny the policy changes they plan? After we finally limit the flow of immigration with Sunak's new limits, is Starmer going to open the flood gates again?
The really smart thing for Labour would be a Nixon goes to China moment where Starmer delivers better control over numbers by renegotiating bilaterals and/or modifying/editing or qualifying the UN refugee convention, with the legal due process to go with it.
If he did Labour could be in power a very long time.
Lol, this wouldn't happen because the right wing and the media would do the same thing that they did to Obama and are doing to Biden now - lie. Obama deported more immigrants than Bush, but he was "soft on the border". Biden is deporting more than Trump, but he's "left the border wide open". For the political sphere this isn't a material issue, it's a metaphysical one. As long as people think that the norms of the country are no longer being dominated by the desires of white men, the issue of immigration will loom large because that is a way to stoke the concerns.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
It is interesting how live music has changed for the better. In the 70s groups only toured to promote their new album so you sat through that until the encore so as to hear the stuff you really wanted to hear. Also it was far too loud and distorted. Now live concerts are a pleasure. All the old stuff, sensible volumes and real money earners for the bands.
In large part due to tribute bands who gave the fans exactly what they wanted, the greatest hits played exactly the same as on the records. Then bands got back together to become their own tribute acts playing their greatest hits...
Ha yes. The bands started ignoring their old stuff and playing new stuff no-one was interested in, while a tribute band would play more accessible concerts and mostly do a damn good job of the Greatest Hits. Obviously that band isn’t selling any music, just the experience.
At the other end of the scale, there’s also covers bands such as Postmodern Jukebox, an internet-famous jazz collective re-interpreting modern pop songs in classic styles. They’re playing 20 theatres in the UK in late spring. https://postmodernjukebox.com/shows/ Before the internet, these guys would be playing NY jazz clubs and maybe a few weddings, but they’re massively talented and have found a worldwide audience for their shows.
I'm going to be seeing Puddles when he's over here in a few weeks - have been looking forward to that for ages. One thing that I do think is due a renaissance is jazz music - if we're going to replay the 20s and 30s of the 20th century at least let us have jazz again.
For some reason I only went down the modern jazz YouTube rabbithole a few weeks ago, even though so much of it has been online for a decade. Now I have a several hours long playlist of PMJ and friends, and can’t stop singing along.
It’s difficult not to smile at a jazz version of Eminem, or Green Day, or making something really crap from the current era like Nicki Minaj actually listenable and fun. Watch for the backing vocalist playing the dog on the last of those links!
Smooth.
Has anything AI related actually headed into the UK or US top 100 yet (A lower bar than actually being any good). I'd have thought the artist whose lunch it might probably eat would be someone like Tiesto. I doubt he's worried tbh. So far I believe it's only generated kitsch covers and jingles that will probably be good for ooh I don't know avoiding royalties with adverts.
Music for adverts, that's what I predict AI's forte will be. Leon's dream - a jingle for Roger.
Lol yes, adverts and elevator music. I also imagine that there will be radio stations full of AI music, that’s inoffensive enough for a car journey, with ads sold around it but with no royalties to pay to artists.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
Sure. I accept that - if you never know you'll never know. Why on earth our species is pursuing this path to AI is extremely worrying to me.
I think that for some people they think that this, like other things I could mention but won't, is progressive. In doing so they confuse change and the avant-garde with progress. It might be, but it is not necessarily so.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
If people like the music, will they care?
Similar things were said about album covers, LPs (and later CDs) and downloads.
Labour is ahead of the Tories in London among all age groups including those 65 and over, by 34% to 31% for the latter. For Londoners aged 18-to-24 the respective split is 65% to 13%, 25-to 49 it is 58% to 12%, and 50 to 64 it is 49% to 18%
A difference of only 4% between inner and outer London ?!?
I'm finding that difficult to believe tbh. Conservatives are much stronger in outer London.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
It is interesting how live music has changed for the better. In the 70s groups only toured to promote their new album so you sat through that until the encore so as to hear the stuff you really wanted to hear. Also it was far too loud and distorted. Now live concerts are a pleasure. All the old stuff, sensible volumes and real money earners for the bands.
In large part due to tribute bands who gave the fans exactly what they wanted, the greatest hits played exactly the same as on the records. Then bands got back together to become their own tribute acts playing their greatest hits...
Ha yes. The bands started ignoring their old stuff and playing new stuff no-one was interested in, while a tribute band would play more accessible concerts and mostly do a damn good job of the Greatest Hits. Obviously that band isn’t selling any music, just the experience.
At the other end of the scale, there’s also covers bands such as Postmodern Jukebox, an internet-famous jazz collective re-interpreting modern pop songs in classic styles. They’re playing 20 theatres in the UK in late spring. https://postmodernjukebox.com/shows/ Before the internet, these guys would be playing NY jazz clubs and maybe a few weddings, but they’re massively talented and have found a worldwide audience for their shows.
I've a friend (yep I really do!) who is the same age as me. He won't go to concerts because his memory is of the 70s and damaged ears. I'm trying to convince him it has changed.
I have tickets booked for Santana in Las Vegas and and Eric Clapton at the Albert Hall, both in May. They both better be good as I have forked out over £1000 for them (2 tickets each) whereas the Classic Rock show a few weeks ago was fantastic and cost just over £100 for 2 and I will have been a damn sight closer to the stage. The skill level is awesome. The two leads played Freebird while walking around the audience.
I have tickets for Springsteen in Sunderland in May, looking forward to it.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
It is interesting how live music has changed for the better. In the 70s groups only toured to promote their new album so you sat through that until the encore so as to hear the stuff you really wanted to hear. Also it was far too loud and distorted. Now live concerts are a pleasure. All the old stuff, sensible volumes and real money earners for the bands.
In large part due to tribute bands who gave the fans exactly what they wanted, the greatest hits played exactly the same as on the records. Then bands got back together to become their own tribute acts playing their greatest hits...
Ha yes. The bands started ignoring their old stuff and playing new stuff no-one was interested in, while a tribute band would play more accessible concerts and mostly do a damn good job of the Greatest Hits. Obviously that band isn’t selling any music, just the experience.
At the other end of the scale, there’s also covers bands such as Postmodern Jukebox, an internet-famous jazz collective re-interpreting modern pop songs in classic styles. They’re playing 20 theatres in the UK in late spring. https://postmodernjukebox.com/shows/ Before the internet, these guys would be playing NY jazz clubs and maybe a few weddings, but they’re massively talented and have found a worldwide audience for their shows.
I've a friend (yep I really do!) who is the same age as me. He won't go to concerts because his memory is of the 70s and damaged ears. I'm trying to convince him it has changed.
I have tickets booked for Santana in Las Vegas and and Eric Clapton at the Albert Hall, both in May. They both better be good as I have forked out over £1000 for them (2 tickets each) whereas the Classic Rock show a few weeks ago was fantastic and cost just over £100 for 2 and I will have been a damn sight closer to the stage. The skill level is awesome. The two leads played Freebird while walking around the audience.
I have tickets for Springsteen in Sunderland in May, looking forward to it.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
Big business never misses a chance to make more profit for little investment. Before long, there will be a totally AI solo star or band with the accompanying online series and merch. Think The Monkees but for the digital age.
Macron has done precious little for Ukraine , apart from odd times trying to get self publicity.
France was the largest arms exporter to Ukraine between 2014 and 2020, and it was Macron who put the most effort into attempting to avert the war by diplomacy.
Yes happy when making money out of them and desperate not to see his lolly getting stopped. Done sweet FA recently but has at least stopped butt licking Putin.
Watching the Jeremy Vine show and they’re discussing Scarlet Blake. The sheer lunacy of how we are expecting to dance around the transgender self ID astounds me
In this article, Blake is referred to as a woman throughout, then at the end
“The Ministry of Justice confirmed Blake was being held at a male prison.”
Because, when it comes down to it, Blake is a man. Honestly, this is absolute madness. Show it to a ‘progressive’ ten years ago and they’d think you were taking the piss
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
How many people have seen BTS live?
I've no doubt right now there are coders in Korea creating perfect new all girl and all boy bands, entirely artificial, giving them back stories, and personalities, and voices, except these musicians won't need paying and won't do drugs and won't kill themselves (because they are just code and pixels) unless the record company decides they should, for the publicity
No one will ever know the difference. And if they ever go on tour it will be like ABBA Voyage, as @TOPPING rightly notes
That LBC clip with the illegal immigration minister is comedy gold and a total car crash at the same time .
Nope. You are wrong on this one. The line the Conservatives are sticking to is brilliant and disciplined politics from them.
killing the damaging nature story off so the narrative moves on. The story needs more oxygen, and the Tory’s are brilliantly starving it of Oxygen.
If you answer the question, what was wrong, it will give the story oxygen. It’s important to note firstly Anderson does not have significant support amongst Tories, that idea is just bigged up by very transparent media spin, a lot “apparently” complaining to their MPs (just what mates he has MPs) not even Tories in their life.
More importantly conceding Anderson’s comment was racist will open Suella Braverman up to the same charge and suspension as the racist conspiracy theory Braverman pushed against Starmer is IDENTICAL to Anderson’s on Khan. And how on earth you suspend Braverman without it properly kicking off. And if they concede it is islamabophic in any way the media latch on to the bigger picture just conceded about about Islamophobia in the Conservative party, which Sunak has to avoid as he’s calling a General Election in two weeks time.
What you saw as comedy gold, is actually fantastic politics by tge government, shutting a far more electorally damaging narrative down by depriving it of oxygen.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
Sure. I accept that - if you never know you'll never know. Why on earth our species is pursuing this path to AI is extremely worrying to me.
I think that for some people they think that this, like other things I could mention but won't, is progressive. In doing so they confuse change and the avant-garde with progress. It might be, but it is not necessarily so.
@Leon at his over-excited best as ever. AI is a tool of growing power and utility. And as with previous revolutions some jobs will go and new opportunities will arise.
At some point we may start to reach the idea of working a bit less, but thats been the predicted future for ever and doesn't seem to be getting much closer...
For all our sakes it would be great if the tory party of @TSE were, indeed, the tory party.
Alas, it’s not the case. There are plenty on the vocal right for whom Lager Lee is totemic:
'Grassroots Conservative supporters have called Rishi Sunak a “snake” over Lee Anderson’s suspension as MPs on the Tory right said he should be given a route back in.
In leaked WhatsApp messages obtained by the Guardian, members of the Conservative Democratic Organisation (CDO), which was founded by disgruntled Tories after Boris Johnson and then Liz Truss were ousted, attacked the prime minister for kicking Anderson out of the parliamentary party.
Several of the activists endorsed Anderson’s comments and some went further in decrying “the threat of Islam”.’
I was chatting with a tory friend yesterday about all of this. She thinks the whole lot of them (Badenoch, Braverman, Anderson etc. etc.) should be booted out of the party so they can join Reform. But we then got talking about when it all started and who is responsible.
A lot of this goes back to Boris who deliberately stoked the right wing rabble with its ‘anti-woke’ hatred, but I suggested that Boris is too dilettantish to devise such a thing.
At which point we both settled on Dominic Cummings.
What you're arguing for is a Conservative Party that more liberals and centre-left can feel comfortable with.
There's certainly a small (and very voluble) audience for that but it's not one that would come close to winning an election: non-Tories might be slightly more comfortable with the Tories being in office but it would win over very few of their votes.
Two points. It is still very unclear what a right wing Tory government would do different, WRT migration, employment, borrowing, spending, pensions, taxing, benefits, debt and deficit.
Secondly, at the moment polling shows under 40% support for the right+centre right, and 60+% support for the centre and centre left and left. This suggests that the next election, like most, will be won from the centre, which is where the next Tory GE win will come from in a few years' time.
The Conservatives biggest problem is they haven't delivered.
In fact, in one area where I think they largely have - checking identity politics - they get reams of criticism, much of which we've seen on this board this morning.
Have they checked it - or have they just weaponised their own form of it ?
What you appear to mean is that they've checked the form of it you don't like.
No, there was a lot of heat in the aftermath of BLM about pulling down statues, renaming buildings, infrastructure and institutions - left, right and centre - calls for reparations, a pretty much compulsory identity politics reading list, and formal programmes of unconscious bias and white privilege throughout the professions and public services. A big jump in EDI employment and deployment. All, essentially, imported from America.
Whilst we got a little bit of that in the first few months Oliver Dowden successfully checked it, including with legislation, and organisations like Stonewall have since been challenged on their agenda. Whilst it's still around in the background it's definitely gone off the boil a bit over the last 18-24 months. We haven't quite yet, in my view, calmed down entirely on British history and identity but it's better than it was.
We don't have anything like the divisions in the USA over it - except that the word "Woke" can trigger people into apoplexy on both sides - and far too many Liberals (not all) deny there was ever an issue, despite opposing each and every single one of the challenges all the way down the line.
Do you think that there is a reasonable argument to be made that people who live in this country may not want statues or plaques, for example, to people who made their money off of the slave trade hailing them as good men and such? Or, in your view, is there absolutely no argument to be made for that kind of thing?
I think I can guess your position, as someone who wishes to defend Chazza with his fists, but still - trying to figure out what is so egregious here.
It happened hundreds of years ago , sad tossers need to get over it and get on with their lives now. No place for any of that pathetic crap of going back centuries and rewriting history, it is for sad losers on the make.
Why is removing a statue "rewriting history"? And why is "rewriting history" wrong if the original written history was massively biased in favour of things that we now know more about and can see are wrong? You could remove a statue of a slaver, for example, and put a statue about slavery, and even mention the same slaver, just not valorise him. And I use the word valorise quite purposefully because, when it comes to statues, form is feeling - the entire point of larger than life statues literally put on pedestals is to make the figures they depict grandiose.
Also - history moves. If your position is "who cares, it happened a hundred years ago" is that not an argument in favour of taking down these statues? Should we expect to never get rid of any of these statues, never update the people who adorn these plinths? Should we always be stuck memorialising a specific point in the past - never be given a chance to move forward?
There is a reason that no one in Germany argues that tearing down statues of Hitler would have erased the history of the Nazis, and why people were happy when they saw statues of Saddam Hussein torn down during the Iraq war - because you know that a statue isn't some neutral form of giving a history lesson - it is a proclamation of importance. If people no longer like the statues in their city, or social norms have changed so a man who was once considered a hero is now considered a villain - that's how history works. It's all the people who want to keep the clock stopped at a time when the British Empire was lauded, where no one questioned if it was good or not, who want to force their idea of what was good on the rest of us who are the people who need to move on and are trying to keep history static, frozen in ice.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
@Leon seeing as you have looked into this a lot and look out for what is wrong in AI pictures/film (eg the film of the dog typing was a good example) can you explain what to look for in a picture of someone (head and shoulders only no hands). So here is the example:
The pressure group I am involved in is building a web site. The pictures of the committee are currently filled with dummy pictures. Every picture shouts out to me that it is not a real human, but created artificially. But I don't know why. It just does.
So the uncanny valley is the space in which people look at hyper realistic fake humans and just know something is off (we think that this is a by-product of an evolutionary pressure to know what a corpse looks like, as a method of being risk averse to areas / things that may be deadly). There has been a lot of research with suggestions of how to minimise the effect, although if you're using generated photos rather than creating them from scratch I don't know exactly how much you can do that.
The result? Most people cannot tell the difference between AI and real photos of humans, not any more. Even weirder, there was a bias in the findings such that people tend to believe the AI photos are more likely to be real than real humans. We seem to prefer AI reality, to reality
That's how far over the Uncanny Valley this has now gone. That's why @148grss isn't just wrong and outdated in her opinions, she is ludicrously wrong
Now that is interesting because if I had to say anything about the photos they looked too perfect, but again I don't know why because they aren't, but that is the emotion they give me.
The pictures are of course just stock stuff for the building of the draft site so won't be the latest AI so presumably they are easy to spot as not real, but I just can't see anything wrong with them, but my gut says they aren't real, but they are appealing, but not obviously attractive.
Watching the Jeremy Vine show and they’re discussing Scarlet Blake. The sheer lunacy of how we are expecting to dance around the transgender self ID astounds me
In this article, Blake is referred to as a woman throughout, then at the end
“The Ministry of Justice confirmed Blake was being held at a male prison.”
Because, when it comes down to it, Blake is a man. Honestly, this is absolute madness. Show it to a ‘progressive’ ten years ago and they’d think you were taking the piss
It such a denial of reality that is feels that we have alien life forms among us or something.
Douglas Adams:
“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.
There is another theory which states that this has already happened.”
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
If people like the music, will they care?
Similar things were said about album covers, LPs (and later CDs) and downloads.
There’s an interview with Noel Gallagher where he tells of his daughter being totally baffled by him saying he was going to spend a day or two having a photoshoot for his album cover. As in ‘what’s the point?’
Don’t know whether it’s just me getting older, but the idea of ‘pop stars’, as they used to be called, posing for moody photos just seems utterly ridiculous to me now.
That LBC clip with the illegal immigration minister is comedy gold and a total car crash at the same time .
1. The line to take is profoundly stupid 2. The minister saying it is profoundly stupid 3. In sending out stupid to say stupid things, the Tories ensure this story still has legs. Which is profoundly stupid.
They did the sometimes hard bit very quickly - sack him. The problem is they can't say why they sacked him as (a) they'd have to sack Cruella as well, and (b) their remaining voters think petty racism is a Good Thing.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
That said, Abba Voyage is fucking incredible.
It is, but it’s based on existing IP, a band everyone already knows and loves.
Trying to selll tickets to a new, manufactured band, that’s actually just an industry back office nerd and his computer with no discernible talent, is an altogether more difficult prospect.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
I just don't agree with you - I think most people will know. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the idea of a music uncanny valley (much like the animation uncanny valley) will exist and be quite clear. Maybe like electro, synth music, or orchestral music without voices might become more AI dominated, but even then I doubt it, because the way that songs and such get mixed can be very spur of the moment, with DJs reacting to the club at the time and such, and I think that lots of classical orchestral music has extremely experiential roots. I've seen the hyper realistic videos and such, and in some I've not been able to tell that they're primarily AI, but they still too fall into an uncanny valley. Same with the hyper-realistic photos of people - the vast majority of them do have the uncanny valley vibe. Again, maybe I'm being anthrocentric, but I do kind of think this sort of thing won't fly with the vast majority of people.
You are comically and risibly wrong. TBF most people are like you. They just don't understand. They think - even tho most would deny it - that humans have some unique thing that makes human art unique, so it will never be equalled and will always be superior
It is quasi-religious, and yet you often see it trotted out by convinced atheists (like you, perhaps). Add in a large dash of fear and loathing, and top it off with the cherry of denial, and you get a dismal cocktail of circular logic like yours
Interesting that you mention animation. This is ALREADY being automated. Machines do it better than humans, and do it for free
Jeffery Katzenberg is the ex head of Disney. I suspect he knows more about animation than you
"Jeffrey Katzenberg Says A.I. Will Eliminate 90 Percent of Artist Jobs on Animated Films"
He said that three months ago BEFORE we got the astonishing revelation of Sora, and sublime text-to-video
You are wrong, and you should prepare yourself for a very nasty surprise, if you continue in this wrongthink
In the time-honoured PB fashion - you are wrong.
You are acting as though music from now on will be made by 50-something men in suits who program their bots to throw out crowd pleasers a la Down in the Tube Station at Midnight for the unquestioning masses.
You are out of touch and bringing your own late middle-aged desperate biases to the issue.
Take a look at https://www.lccm.org.uk/ for example. One of many such places. Chock full of 18-30yr old students making contemporary music with all the latest tools at their disposal. Do you think they are unaware of AI and its capabilities. Really?
Music (and art and literature) will continue to be made and appreciated by humans. Just that the tools will change.
You are showing your age here, I'm afraid.
Again, I AM a professional artist, and you are not. I'm right. I understand creativity because I do it for a living, and I can see exactly where this new creativity is heading - the machines will take over
There will, I predict, always be room for the human product. It will be niche, artisanal, highly prized, the same way hand made ceramics are expensive but 99% of pottery is made in a factory
The difference this time is that the machine made stuff might actually be objectively superior, by all metrics. But we will still crave a bit of humankind, now and again
That LBC clip with the illegal immigration minister is comedy gold and a total car crash at the same time .
Nope. You are wrong on this one. The line the Conservatives are sticking to is brilliant and disciplined politics from them.
killing the damaging nature story off so the narrative moves on. The story needs more oxygen, and the Tory’s are brilliantly starving it of Oxygen.
If you answer the question, what was wrong, it will give the story oxygen. It’s important to note firstly Anderson does not have significant support amongst Tories, that idea is just bigged up by very transparent media spin, a lot “apparently” complaining to their MPs (just what mates he has MPs) not even Tories in their life.
More importantly conceding Anderson’s comment was racist will open Suella Braverman up to the same charge and suspension as the racist conspiracy theory Braverman pushed against Starmer is IDENTICAL to Anderson’s on Khan. And how on earth you suspend Braverman without it properly kicking off. And if they concede it is islamabophic in any way the media latch on to the bigger picture just conceded about about Islamophobia in the Conservative party, which Sunak has to avoid as he’s calling a General Election in two weeks time.
What you saw as comedy gold, is actually fantastic politics by tge government, shutting a far more electorally damaging narrative down by depriving it of oxygen.
The joy of politics is that you and I can see the same thing and genuinely reach the completely opposite conclusion.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
Yes, that's perfectly possible. And they wouldn't say if it was.
It got to "doctors are concerned for the Queen's health" on the day HMQ passed away, which we all secretly knew in our gut was code for "she's dying", which they couldn't really say.
For all our sakes it would be great if the tory party of @TSE were, indeed, the tory party.
Alas, it’s not the case. There are plenty on the vocal right for whom Lager Lee is totemic:
'Grassroots Conservative supporters have called Rishi Sunak a “snake” over Lee Anderson’s suspension as MPs on the Tory right said he should be given a route back in.
In leaked WhatsApp messages obtained by the Guardian, members of the Conservative Democratic Organisation (CDO), which was founded by disgruntled Tories after Boris Johnson and then Liz Truss were ousted, attacked the prime minister for kicking Anderson out of the parliamentary party.
Several of the activists endorsed Anderson’s comments and some went further in decrying “the threat of Islam”.’
I was chatting with a tory friend yesterday about all of this. She thinks the whole lot of them (Badenoch, Braverman, Anderson etc. etc.) should be booted out of the party so they can join Reform. But we then got talking about when it all started and who is responsible.
A lot of this goes back to Boris who deliberately stoked the right wing rabble with its ‘anti-woke’ hatred, but I suggested that Boris is too dilettantish to devise such a thing.
At which point we both settled on Dominic Cummings.
What you're arguing for is a Conservative Party that more liberals and centre-left can feel comfortable with.
There's certainly a small (and very voluble) audience for that but it's not one that would come close to winning an election: non-Tories might be slightly more comfortable with the Tories being in office but it would win over very few of their votes.
Two points. It is still very unclear what a right wing Tory government would do different, WRT migration, employment, borrowing, spending, pensions, taxing, benefits, debt and deficit.
Secondly, at the moment polling shows under 40% support for the right+centre right, and 60+% support for the centre and centre left and left. This suggests that the next election, like most, will be won from the centre, which is where the next Tory GE win will come from in a few years' time.
The Conservatives biggest problem is they haven't delivered.
In fact, in one area where I think they largely have - checking identity politics - they get reams of criticism, much of which we've seen on this board this morning.
Have they checked it - or have they just weaponised their own form of it ?
What you appear to mean is that they've checked the form of it you don't like.
No, there was a lot of heat in the aftermath of BLM about pulling down statues, renaming buildings, infrastructure and institutions - left, right and centre - calls for reparations, a pretty much compulsory identity politics reading list, and formal programmes of unconscious bias and white privilege throughout the professions and public services. A big jump in EDI employment and deployment. All, essentially, imported from America.
Whilst we got a little bit of that in the first few months Oliver Dowden successfully checked it, including with legislation, and organisations like Stonewall have since been challenged on their agenda. Whilst it's still around in the background it's definitely gone off the boil a bit over the last 18-24 months. We haven't quite yet, in my view, calmed down entirely on British history and identity but it's better than it was.
We don't have anything like the divisions in the USA over it - except that the word "Woke" can trigger people into apoplexy on both sides - and far too many Liberals (not all) deny there was ever an issue, despite opposing each and every single one of the challenges all the way down the line.
Do you think that there is a reasonable argument to be made that people who live in this country may not want statues or plaques, for example, to people who made their money off of the slave trade hailing them as good men and such? Or, in your view, is there absolutely no argument to be made for that kind of thing?
I think I can guess your position, as someone who wishes to defend Chazza with his fists, but still - trying to figure out what is so egregious here.
It happened hundreds of years ago , sad tossers need to get over it and get on with their lives now. No place for any of that pathetic crap of going back centuries and rewriting history, it is for sad losers on the make.
Why is removing a statue "rewriting history"? And why is "rewriting history" wrong if the original written history was massively biased in favour of things that we now know more about and can see are wrong? You could remove a statue of a slaver, for example, and put a statue about slavery, and even mention the same slaver, just not valorise him. And I use the word valorise quite purposefully because, when it comes to statues, form is feeling - the entire point of larger than life statues literally put on pedestals is to make the figures they depict grandiose.
Also - history moves. If your position is "who cares, it happened a hundred years ago" is that not an argument in favour of taking down these statues? Should we expect to never get rid of any of these statues, never update the people who adorn these plinths? Should we always be stuck memorialising a specific point in the past - never be given a chance to move forward?
There is a reason that no one in Germany argues that tearing down statues of Hitler would have erased the history of the Nazis, and why people were happy when they saw statues of Saddam Hussein torn down during the Iraq war - because you know that a statue isn't some neutral form of giving a history lesson - it is a proclamation of importance. If people no longer like the statues in their city, or social norms have changed so a man who was once considered a hero is now considered a villain - that's how history works. It's all the people who want to keep the clock stopped at a time when the British Empire was lauded, where no one questioned if it was good or not, who want to force their idea of what was good on the rest of us who are the people who need to move on and are trying to keep history static, frozen in ice.
Take the Colston example in Bristol. I think it would have been better to retain the statue but with much better contextualisation. A decent sign explaining the pro's and con's of the man. Like it or not he made huge fortunes from slavery, but also spent some of that money to improve Bristol. Life is rarely just black and white.
And yes we should continuously re-examine history, although we ought to be careful with out modern prejudices when we look at historical figures. Just as children growing up under the Nazi's were raised with a hateful view of Jews and other untermensch, so folk back in history had their own ingrained prejudices.
Watching the Jeremy Vine show and they’re discussing Scarlet Blake. The sheer lunacy of how we are expecting to dance around the transgender self ID astounds me
In this article, Blake is referred to as a woman throughout, then at the end
“The Ministry of Justice confirmed Blake was being held at a male prison.”
Because, when it comes down to it, Blake is a man. Honestly, this is absolute madness. Show it to a ‘progressive’ ten years ago and they’d think you were taking the piss
It such a denial of reality that is feels that we have alien life forms among us or something.
Douglas Adams:
“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.
There is another theory which states that this has already happened.”
I genuinely feel like it could be some kind of joke/bad dream and that soon everyone will say ‘we were only kidding, as if!”
But, more scarily, I worry we are being softened up to accept absolutely anything as true, even when we know it’s false. High court judges are calling men ‘she/her’ as they send them to male prisons for murder, and media report it as fact. It’s completely crazy
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
Yes, that's perfectly possible. And they wouldn't say if it was.
It got to "doctors are concerned for the Queen's health" on the day HMQ passed away, which we all secretly knew in our gut was code for "she's dying", which they couldn't really say.
I'm afraid to say I took it that she had already passed and they were waiting for the family to coalesce.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
That said, Abba Voyage is fucking incredible.
It is, but it’s based on existing IP, a band everyone already knows and loves.
Trying to selll tickets to a new, manufactured band, that’s actually just an industry back office nerd and his computer with no discernible talent, is an altogether more difficult prospect.
Absolutely - it is a tool but you need the person pulling the strings.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
@Leon seeing as you have looked into this a lot and look out for what is wrong in AI pictures/film (eg the film of the dog typing was a good example) can you explain what to look for in a picture of someone (head and shoulders only no hands). So here is the example:
The pressure group I am involved in is building a web site. The pictures of the committee are currently filled with dummy pictures. Every picture shouts out to me that it is not a real human, but created artificially. But I don't know why. It just does.
So the uncanny valley is the space in which people look at hyper realistic fake humans and just know something is off (we think that this is a by-product of an evolutionary pressure to know what a corpse looks like, as a method of being risk averse to areas / things that may be deadly). There has been a lot of research with suggestions of how to minimise the effect, although if you're using generated photos rather than creating them from scratch I don't know exactly how much you can do that.
The result? Most people cannot tell the difference between AI and real photos of humans, not any more. Even weirder, there was a bias in the findings such that people tend to believe the AI photos are more likely to be real than real humans. We seem to prefer AI reality, to reality
That's how far over the Uncanny Valley this has now gone. That's why @148grss isn't just wrong and outdated in her opinions, she is ludicrously wrong
Now that is interesting because if I had to say anything about the photos they looked too perfect, but again I don't know why because they aren't, but that is the emotion they give me.
The pictures are of course just stock stuff for the building of the draft site so won't be the latest AI so presumably they are easy to spot as not real, but I just can't see anything wrong with them, but my gut says they aren't real, but they are appealing, but not obviously attractive.
"Uncanny Valley" was definitely a thing, for sure. And it was persistent, so you are probably using image-creation software that is a bit old and still suffers from it
The best new image-generators are completely believable, indeed TOO believable, as that unnerving NYT article proves
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
Sorry, I stopped reading after the second sentence.
Try not to fart out your basest emotions if you want to be taken seriously on here.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Watching the Jeremy Vine show and they’re discussing Scarlet Blake. The sheer lunacy of how we are expecting to dance around the transgender self ID astounds me
In this article, Blake is referred to as a woman throughout, then at the end
“The Ministry of Justice confirmed Blake was being held at a male prison.”
Because, when it comes down to it, Blake is a man. Honestly, this is absolute madness. Show it to a ‘progressive’ ten years ago and they’d think you were taking the piss
It such a denial of reality that is feels that we have alien life forms among us or something.
Douglas Adams:
“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.
There is another theory which states that this has already happened.”
The history of transgender people goes back literally thousands of years across multiple cultures - whether it's Scythian priestesses who drank herbs and pregnant cow milk to hormonally feminise themselves (and supposedly had the power to literally emasculate people who wronged them), the two-spirit people of certain Native American cultures, the Indigenous people of Australia have always had transgender people (now known as "sistergirls" and "brotherboys") and we even have records of a Roman Empress who told people to refer to her as such and said she would shower with gold any doctor who could perform surgery on her to give her what we would now call gender affirming care.
People ignoring this history, much like the people who ignored the history of gay and lesbian people, are the ones ignoring reality - not transpeople or the people who accept their existence.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
@Leon seeing as you have looked into this a lot and look out for what is wrong in AI pictures/film (eg the film of the dog typing was a good example) can you explain what to look for in a picture of someone (head and shoulders only no hands). So here is the example:
The pressure group I am involved in is building a web site. The pictures of the committee are currently filled with dummy pictures. Every picture shouts out to me that it is not a real human, but created artificially. But I don't know why. It just does.
So the uncanny valley is the space in which people look at hyper realistic fake humans and just know something is off (we think that this is a by-product of an evolutionary pressure to know what a corpse looks like, as a method of being risk averse to areas / things that may be deadly). There has been a lot of research with suggestions of how to minimise the effect, although if you're using generated photos rather than creating them from scratch I don't know exactly how much you can do that.
The result? Most people cannot tell the difference between AI and real photos of humans, not any more. Even weirder, there was a bias in the findings such that people tend to believe the AI photos are more likely to be real than real humans. We seem to prefer AI reality, to reality
That's how far over the Uncanny Valley this has now gone. That's why @148grss isn't just wrong and outdated in her opinions, she is ludicrously wrong
Now that is interesting because if I had to say anything about the photos they looked too perfect, but again I don't know why because they aren't, but that is the emotion they give me.
The pictures are of course just stock stuff for the building of the draft site so won't be the latest AI so presumably they are easy to spot as not real, but I just can't see anything wrong with them, but my gut says they aren't real, but they are appealing, but not obviously attractive.
Yes, the it/person looks too good is not a bad guide in these quizzes. The AI generally doesn't make people that look very unsymmetric, probably because most people are. Of course then you get all the 'perfect' real people wrong
There are still some AI snafus, such as https://static01.nytimes.com/newsgraphics/2023-11-30-disinfo-ai-faces/28c36f34-35c8-4fa5-b12f-b4447c72fe6a/_assets/ai-3.jpg where the background doesn't seem to make any sense - at first glance blurred sea, where the horizon should be level. It could be rock or something with a sudden drop behind the subject, but it looks off. You do see this sometimes, but can probably be easily fixed by a multiple stage process where the AI draws a background, blurs it (if desired) and then pops the head on top.
But basic point: yes, these are getting really good. Hard to spot when you're looking for them and absolutely good enough to replace models in most print ads/stock photography for example. The 'real' images in that area are so touched up that they're often pretty fake anyway!
ETA: The BBC have a fairly regular quiz, often with famous people in real or AI images. I generally get the vast majority of those, but often it's more the context, I think, than the image per se.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
How many people have seen BTS live?
I've no doubt right now there are coders in Korea creating perfect new all girl and all boy bands, entirely artificial, giving them back stories, and personalities, and voices, except these musicians won't need paying and won't do drugs and won't kill themselves (because they are just code and pixels) unless the record company decides they should, for the publicity
No one will ever know the difference. And if they ever go on tour it will be like ABBA Voyage, as @TOPPING rightly notes
Reality will become Artificial
I hate to break it to you, but most new music has been made this way since the mid 2000s, long before AI. South Park did a pretty good parody of it a decade ago:
Most new music is now so computer aided that making it entirely AI generated won't change much.
Spotify has been filling its catalog with music created in bulk, mostly in ambient and chill "piano in the background" type music for years, because it's so easy and quick to produce.
That will become easier and easier for more genres with AI tech.
I find most new music from the last decade or so impossible to listen to simply because I know my way around a copy of Logic and it all sounds like shit to me...
Let's face it our army is not fit to go into battle in Ukraine. They don't have nearly enough drones. They don't have nearly enough protection from drones. They don't know what tactics are required to survive on such a battlefield. War has evolved well beyond their current capacity.
I think this is a bit unfair. The British Army is NEVER going to Ukraine while the conflict is hot but if they did then they would very good at some aspects of warfare (squad level infantry actions) and fucking appalling at others (catering). The British armed forces are not universally shit, despite the best efforts of the tories, and neither are they universally brilliant.
I'd imagine we've learnt a lot from the Ukrainians over the last couple of years and, if the decision was made to send the Army in, there would be a bit of a crash course in getting hold of extra drone equipment and training on it.
The main problem would be in finding the extra recruits to replace casualties.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
This isn't a Republican rant, I have genuine sympathy for him and his family on a personal level, but we have an abundance of replacements for any serving monarch. That's how the system is set up.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
I just don't agree with you - I think most people will know. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the idea of a music uncanny valley (much like the animation uncanny valley) will exist and be quite clear. Maybe like electro, synth music, or orchestral music without voices might become more AI dominated, but even then I doubt it, because the way that songs and such get mixed can be very spur of the moment, with DJs reacting to the club at the time and such, and I think that lots of classical orchestral music has extremely experiential roots. I've seen the hyper realistic videos and such, and in some I've not been able to tell that they're primarily AI, but they still too fall into an uncanny valley. Same with the hyper-realistic photos of people - the vast majority of them do have the uncanny valley vibe. Again, maybe I'm being anthrocentric, but I do kind of think this sort of thing won't fly with the vast majority of people.
You are comically and risibly wrong. TBF most people are like you. They just don't understand. They think - even tho most would deny it - that humans have some unique thing that makes human art unique, so it will never be equalled and will always be superior
It is quasi-religious, and yet you often see it trotted out by convinced atheists (like you, perhaps). Add in a large dash of fear and loathing, and top it off with the cherry of denial, and you get a dismal cocktail of circular logic like yours
Interesting that you mention animation. This is ALREADY being automated. Machines do it better than humans, and do it for free
Jeffery Katzenberg is the ex head of Disney. I suspect he knows more about animation than you
"Jeffrey Katzenberg Says A.I. Will Eliminate 90 Percent of Artist Jobs on Animated Films"
He said that three months ago BEFORE we got the astonishing revelation of Sora, and sublime text-to-video
You are wrong, and you should prepare yourself for a very nasty surprise, if you continue in this wrongthink
In the time-honoured PB fashion - you are wrong.
You are acting as though music from now on will be made by 50-something men in suits who program their bots to throw out crowd pleasers a la Down in the Tube Station at Midnight for the unquestioning masses.
You are out of touch and bringing your own late middle-aged desperate biases to the issue.
Take a look at https://www.lccm.org.uk/ for example. One of many such places. Chock full of 18-30yr old students making contemporary music with all the latest tools at their disposal. Do you think they are unaware of AI and its capabilities. Really?
Music (and art and literature) will continue to be made and appreciated by humans. Just that the tools will change.
You are showing your age here, I'm afraid.
Again, I AM a professional artist, and you are not. I'm right. I understand creativity because I do it for a living, and I can see exactly where this new creativity is heading - the machines will take over
There will, I predict, always be room for the human product. It will be niche, artisanal, highly prized, the same way hand made ceramics are expensive but 99% of pottery is made in a factory
The difference this time is that the machine made stuff might actually be objectively superior, by all metrics. But we will still crave a bit of humankind, now and again
AI is a tool. A potentially great one or a potentially banal one. But a tool nevertheless, and, more importantly, a tool wielded by human artists. You can't have an AI machine crawl ashore for the very first time and produce the St. Matthew Passion. You need someone to set it on its journey.
Did the Roland drum machine presage the end of live drummers? The 50 cent Staying Alive remix nevertheless needed Staying Alive to start with.
You do a lot of shouting about your great meta-analysis credentials whereas anyone who knows any artist anywhere knows that that isn't what artists care about. They produce art.
Watching the Jeremy Vine show and they’re discussing Scarlet Blake. The sheer lunacy of how we are expecting to dance around the transgender self ID astounds me
In this article, Blake is referred to as a woman throughout, then at the end
“The Ministry of Justice confirmed Blake was being held at a male prison.”
Because, when it comes down to it, Blake is a man. Honestly, this is absolute madness. Show it to a ‘progressive’ ten years ago and they’d think you were taking the piss
It such a denial of reality that is feels that we have alien life forms among us or something.
Douglas Adams:
“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.
There is another theory which states that this has already happened.”
I genuinely feel like it could be some kind of joke/bad dream and that soon everyone will say ‘we were only kidding, as if!”
But, more scarily, I worry we are being softened up to accept absolutely anything as true, even when we know it’s false. High court judges are calling men ‘she/her’ as they send them to male prisons for murder, and media report it as fact. It’s completely crazy
I used to be active in the skeptical movement (science meets philosophy) and we would royally take down and take the piss out of all sorts of snake-oil: homeopathy was a favourite. Some of the stuff we are expected and bullied into accepting these days are more wacky than that. Ear-candling even.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I've only just listened to this and had to stop after about 20 seconds due to spitting out tea and struggling to control myself in the office.
Absolutely brilliant.
Thanks. I am quite proud, even if the software made the music
I did take time choosing the most ridiculous comment that would be the funniest, and which - in length - would fit the format of Suno AI
There's quite a choice. @Dura_Ace posts might make a half-interesting sonnet, if you pieced them together sensibly and removed all the get-my-glossary jargon.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Same, he’s a husband, father, grandfather, brother, uncle etc.
20% of voters ie almost the current Tory poll rating and a plurality of Conservative and Leave voters thinking the party was wrong to suspend Anderson is significant even if a plurality of voters over all back his suspension. It shows the Tories cannot afford to expel or deselect Anderson without even further leakage to Reform, maybe even leading to them level pegging with Reform.
Habib is probably right but the average Reform voters is closer to Anderson than him I suspect
That is a well argued post @HYUFD, but as a Tory what do you suggest as a solution, or do you think there isn't one this side of the election and that they have to muddle through and reset afterwards?
Stick with the suspension of Anderson but don't expel him or remove him from the candidates list, given he has now not ruled out defecting to Reform as a last resort https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68400775
How does he get the Tory whip back ?
He’s made it clear he won’t apologize.
The passage of time. Wait until everyone's forgotten about it and then just give him the whip back. As often happens.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I've only just listened to this and had to stop after about 20 seconds due to spitting out tea and struggling to control myself in the office.
Absolutely brilliant.
Thanks. I am quite proud, even if the software made the music
I did take time choosing the most ridiculous comment that would be the funniest, and which - in length - would fit the format of Suno AI
People think that sounds real? I mean, it's funny, but it clearly doesn't know how to write a song. It is taking the "lyrics" provided and putting it over a melody that doesn't fit the lyrics, and has the wrong emphasis on the wrong words and syllables. This is what is supposed to be inextricable from person made music?
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I've only just listened to this and had to stop after about 20 seconds due to spitting out tea and struggling to control myself in the office.
Absolutely brilliant.
Thanks. I am quite proud, even if the software made the music
I did take time choosing the most ridiculous comment that would be the funniest, and which - in length - would fit the format of Suno AI
There's quite a choice. @Dura_Ace posts might make a half-interesting sonnet, if you pieced them together sensibly and removed all the get-my-glossary jargon.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
It is interesting how live music has changed for the better. In the 70s groups only toured to promote their new album so you sat through that until the encore so as to hear the stuff you really wanted to hear. Also it was far too loud and distorted. Now live concerts are a pleasure. All the old stuff, sensible volumes and real money earners for the bands.
In large part due to tribute bands who gave the fans exactly what they wanted, the greatest hits played exactly the same as on the records. Then bands got back together to become their own tribute acts playing their greatest hits...
Ha yes. The bands started ignoring their old stuff and playing new stuff no-one was interested in, while a tribute band would play more accessible concerts and mostly do a damn good job of the Greatest Hits. Obviously that band isn’t selling any music, just the experience.
At the other end of the scale, there’s also covers bands such as Postmodern Jukebox, an internet-famous jazz collective re-interpreting modern pop songs in classic styles. They’re playing 20 theatres in the UK in late spring. https://postmodernjukebox.com/shows/ Before the internet, these guys would be playing NY jazz clubs and maybe a few weddings, but they’re massively talented and have found a worldwide audience for their shows.
I'm going to be seeing Puddles when he's over here in a few weeks - have been looking forward to that for ages. One thing that I do think is due a renaissance is jazz music - if we're going to replay the 20s and 30s of the 20th century at least let us have jazz again.
For some reason I only went down the modern jazz YouTube rabbithole a few weeks ago, even though so much of it has been online for a decade. Now I have a several hours long playlist of PMJ and friends, and can’t stop singing along.
It’s difficult not to smile at a jazz version of Eminem, or Green Day, or making something really crap from the current era like Nicki Minaj actually listenable and fun. Watch for the backing vocalist playing the dog on the last of those links!
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
How many people have seen BTS live?
I've no doubt right now there are coders in Korea creating perfect new all girl and all boy bands, entirely artificial, giving them back stories, and personalities, and voices, except these musicians won't need paying and won't do drugs and won't kill themselves (because they are just code and pixels) unless the record company decides they should, for the publicity
No one will ever know the difference. And if they ever go on tour it will be like ABBA Voyage, as @TOPPING rightly notes
Reality will become Artificial
I hate to break it to you, but most new music has been made this way since the mid 2000s, long before AI. South Park did a pretty good parody of it a decade ago:
Most new music is now so computer aided that making it entirely AI generated won't change much.
Spotify has been filling its catalog with music created in bulk, mostly in ambient and chill "piano in the background" type music for years, because it's so easy and quick to produce.
That will become easier and easier for more genres with AI tech.
I find most new music from the last decade or so impossible to listen to simply because I know my way around a copy of Logic and it all sounds like shit to me...
I'm actually the opposite. Music IS now so palpably and provably shit... partly for the reasons you say...
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Same, he’s a husband, father, grandfather, brother, uncle etc.
Whose had enormous wealth and privilege his whole life - I don't know him neither do I particularly need to care what kind of bum cancer he does or doesn't have that will shuffle him off this mortal coil like everyone else.
I find it funny that the whole "well you have to remember they're a human being" argument gets trotted out when people with immense wealth or power are dying and some people aren't arse licking on their way out, but when people are homeless or are fleeing a country and just trying to survive or are being bombed to death that is met by a mere shrug. People crossing the channel are husbands, fathers, mothers, daughters etc. but on any day here you can probably find someone who would cheer their boat sinking and demand them to be flogged if they did make it to our soil.
Here's hoping something is seriously wrong with Chaz and Wills, so we enter the funniest timeline of King George and Prince Regent Harry or Prince Regent Andrew.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I've only just listened to this and had to stop after about 20 seconds due to spitting out tea and struggling to control myself in the office.
Absolutely brilliant.
Thanks. I am quite proud, even if the software made the music
I did take time choosing the most ridiculous comment that would be the funniest, and which - in length - would fit the format of Suno AI
There's quite a choice. @Dura_Ace posts might make a half-interesting sonnet, if you pieced them together sensibly and removed all the get-my-glossary jargon.
Client asked for some ideas about editing down a block of product descriptions for back of pack on a new brand. I looked at the text, thought "too long and repetitive" and fed it into ChatGPT. The AI edit is now the working version of the text...
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
As do I.
Quite. There are two separate things going on - the personal, human travails, and then the wider impact.
On a personal level, I wish them all the very best with their health in what must be very difficult circumstances (especially given the intrusive public scrutiny).
On the other hand, the transition from QE2 to C3 showed (I think) that the identity of the person occupying the Royal Hot Seat is of little-to-no practical consequence these days, except in terms of the media clickbait.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Worth no more than your ordinary punter going through the same time and they don't have the sycophants wailing and gnashing their teeth constantly about them. Sad but of no interest to me , I don't know him or even like him or his personna / privileges in any way. Royals should be dropped in my opinion and save country a fortune.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Same, he’s a husband, father, grandfather, brother, uncle etc.
Whose had enormous wealth and privilege his whole life - I don't know him neither do I particularly need to care what kind of bum cancer he does or doesn't have that will shuffle him off this mortal coil like everyone else.
I find it funny that the whole "well you have to remember they're a human being" argument gets trotted out when people with immense wealth or power are dying and some people aren't arse licking on their way out, but when people are homeless or are fleeing a country and just trying to survive or are being bombed to death that is met by a mere shrug. People crossing the channel are husbands, fathers, mothers, daughters etc. but on any day here you can probably find someone who would cheer their boat sinking and demand them to be flogged if they did make it to our soil.
Here's hoping something is seriously wrong with Chaz and Wills, so we enter the funniest timeline of King George and Prince Regent Harry or Prince Regent Andrew.
That’s so needy it could have been written by Correct Horse Ninja
Do Labour deny the policy changes they plan? After we finally limit the flow of immigration with Sunak's new limits, is Starmer going to open the flood gates again?
We've not seen the flow of immigration limited yet. The Tories frequently promise things on immigration that don't happen. The flood gates are at a record level of openness under the Tories.
I will be surprised if immigration in 2025 under a new Labour government isn't lower than 2023's figure.
Labour is ahead of the Tories in London among all age groups including those 65 and over, by 34% to 31% for the latter. For Londoners aged 18-to-24 the respective split is 65% to 13%, 25-to 49 it is 58% to 12%, and 50 to 64 it is 49% to 18%
A difference of only 4% between inner and outer London ?!?
I'm finding that difficult to believe tbh. Conservatives are much stronger in outer London.
They were. Demographics mean inner Londoners are moving outwards and pensioners in outer London are fleeing due to housing costs or just dying off.
Watching the Jeremy Vine show and they’re discussing Scarlet Blake. The sheer lunacy of how we are expecting to dance around the transgender self ID astounds me
In this article, Blake is referred to as a woman throughout, then at the end
“The Ministry of Justice confirmed Blake was being held at a male prison.”
Because, when it comes down to it, Blake is a man. Honestly, this is absolute madness. Show it to a ‘progressive’ ten years ago and they’d think you were taking the piss
It such a denial of reality that is feels that we have alien life forms among us or something.
Douglas Adams:
“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.
There is another theory which states that this has already happened.”
The history of transgender people goes back literally thousands of years across multiple cultures - whether it's Scythian priestesses who drank herbs and pregnant cow milk to hormonally feminise themselves (and supposedly had the power to literally emasculate people who wronged them), the two-spirit people of certain Native American cultures, the Indigenous people of Australia have always had transgender people (now known as "sistergirls" and "brotherboys") and we even have records of a Roman Empress who told people to refer to her as such and said she would shower with gold any doctor who could perform surgery on her to give her what we would now call gender affirming care.
People ignoring this history, much like the people who ignored the history of gay and lesbian people, are the ones ignoring reality - not transpeople or the people who accept their existence.
Not back to this again, get on with your life and stop attention seeking.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Same, he’s a husband, father, grandfather, brother, uncle etc.
Whose had enormous wealth and privilege his whole life - I don't know him neither do I particularly need to care what kind of bum cancer he does or doesn't have that will shuffle him off this mortal coil like everyone else.
I find it funny that the whole "well you have to remember they're a human being" argument gets trotted out when people with immense wealth or power are dying and some people aren't arse licking on their way out, but when people are homeless or are fleeing a country and just trying to survive or are being bombed to death that is met by a mere shrug. People crossing the channel are husbands, fathers, mothers, daughters etc. but on any day here you can probably find someone who would cheer their boat sinking and demand them to be flogged if they did make it to our soil.
Here's hoping something is seriously wrong with Chaz and Wills, so we enter the funniest timeline of King George and Prince Regent Harry or Prince Regent Andrew.
You are wishing serious ill-health and death on fairly blameless human beings. Chas and Wills are not Vlad Putin
That crosses a line and you should apologise and withdraw, before you get moderated
Labour is ahead of the Tories in London among all age groups including those 65 and over, by 34% to 31% for the latter. For Londoners aged 18-to-24 the respective split is 65% to 13%, 25-to 49 it is 58% to 12%, and 50 to 64 it is 49% to 18%
A difference of only 4% between inner and outer London ?!?
I'm finding that difficult to believe tbh. Conservatives are much stronger in outer London.
True, but... Maybe that should "were much stronger"?
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
I've only just listened to this and had to stop after about 20 seconds due to spitting out tea and struggling to control myself in the office.
Absolutely brilliant.
Thanks. I am quite proud, even if the software made the music
I did take time choosing the most ridiculous comment that would be the funniest, and which - in length - would fit the format of Suno AI
There's quite a choice. @Dura_Ace posts might make a half-interesting sonnet, if you pieced them together sensibly and removed all the get-my-glossary jargon.
Client asked for some ideas about editing down a block of product descriptions for back of pack on a new brand. I looked at the text, thought "too long and repetitive" and fed it into ChatGPT. The AI edit is now the working version of the text...
Every time you list something on ebay it asks if you want the AI description. Now they are not as I might write them, plus they are on average longer than a @148grss post ( ) but they certainly do the job.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Same, he’s a husband, father, grandfather, brother, uncle etc.
Whose had enormous wealth and privilege his whole life - I don't know him neither do I particularly need to care what kind of bum cancer he does or doesn't have that will shuffle him off this mortal coil like everyone else.
I find it funny that the whole "well you have to remember they're a human being" argument gets trotted out when people with immense wealth or power are dying and some people aren't arse licking on their way out, but when people are homeless or are fleeing a country and just trying to survive or are being bombed to death that is met by a mere shrug. People crossing the channel are husbands, fathers, mothers, daughters etc. but on any day here you can probably find someone who would cheer their boat sinking and demand them to be flogged if they did make it to our soil.
Here's hoping something is seriously wrong with Chaz and Wills, so we enter the funniest timeline of King George and Prince Regent Harry or Prince Regent Andrew.
"you can probably find someone who would cheer their boat sinking and demand them to be flogged if they did make it to our soil."
I don't think that's true. What you will find is people who question the genuine nature of their refugee claim, when they are fleeing that hell hole of Northern France. I don't wish to go over again the arguments (no expectation to claim asylum in the first safe country etc, other nations take more than we do etc, but its this element that winds people up. There is a suspicion that games are being played. Papers burned, passports lost, fake religious conversions being deployed.
And all of these narratives are almost certainly for most of the refugees. But as the bilateral work with Albania showed there have been plenty willing to try to exploit the system.
I see Lee Anderson is trotting out a free speech defence. He said on GBNews that we have free speech and he should be free to say what he thinks. Of course, he is free to say what he thinks. It’s just that what he said was (a) wrong, and (b) racist. Other people used their free speech to point this out.
When will the right stop bleating about free speech, when what they want is consequence-free speech?
I think Lee Anderson thought he was "licenced" to speak freely as a Tory to the Red Wall base in language they'd understand, and to some extent he was.
The trouble was that what he said about Khan was slanderous: if he'd just said he thought Khan was far too tolerant of the Gaza protests and not doing enough, because he had some sympathy with them, then there'd have still been some howls of outrage but he wouldn't have been suspended.
Both parts are true. They sent him off as the thickie to talk to the northern thickies. The ones with cloth caps and ferrets in their trousers. And when you live up north you think London is another country. There are plenty of northern towns that the WWC still think have been "taken over" by muslims and "Londonistan" is worse.
Of course what 25p said was defamatory. So they had to suspend him. But the reported avalanche of "15p is right" messages received by doomed MPs shows that an awful lot of WWC voters think it wasn't defamatory and "someone had to say it".
Free speech? Too many parochial bigots think they should be allowed to openly say the racist stupid defamatory stuff because its true innit? Its the loony left and woke remoaners who should be forced to shut up, not them.
That’s powerfully put
So powerful someone has ALREADY set it to the tune of an epic rock ballad. That’s incredible
Genuinely brilliant! Its Milli Vanilli I feel sorry for.
Isn’t it incredible? AI music is here
It’s roughly where AI art was about 18 months ago. It will follow the same exponential trajectory
It is the death of most human music
But you will be able to create songs just for yourself, friends, birthdays, weddings, as cruel jokes, etc. So it’s not all bad
Yes but that is half the point. Is AI an existential threat to the music industry or is it merely democratising it? You have twice [edit: 3x] had new songs created on this thread but how often did you phone Elton John to commission an original tune?
Elton John will be fine. He’s about 100 years old and he’s made a billion quid
It’s all the young people with genuine musical talent - musicians, singers, composers, arrangers - plus all the people surrounding that industry - who are now completely fucked
Sure, a few might go on and become Taylor Swifts (if they are really good looking and have the charisma to play live and captivate a crowd) - but for the rest, it’s over
Live music will be the last redoubt. Recorded music will be dominated by AI music - because it can be made for nothing. It will swamp Spotify
Also some of it will be really good. Just not made by humans
Music, art, etc. is not just some formula or maths puzzle that you can replicate - it is something personal and human. I listen to a song or see some art and I can see how a person tried to express themselves - and try to engage with that as another person. AI music may be able to make pretty patterns but (in my mind) it comes below even the wonder of beauty in nature, which is created without intent, because AI is so clearly a facsimile. No one will want to go to an AI concert, or put on AI music to feel a specific emotion, because AI music will not be able to produce that in the way a person can - not because of some innate magicness of humanity, but because part of what makes art art is experience. It would be like saying a parrot who can perfectly mimic the sounds of a great diva will one day perform operas on stage; no one would care. It will have a small following, for sure, but it will never supplant human made art.
You won’t know the difference - unless it’s live and in front of your eyes
A song will stream on your device and you’ll think “that’s good” and it will be composed and performed by AI and you’ll never know. Clever music companies may actually lie and pretend a human did it; again you won’t know
You have to be really quite dim not to get this
But at the point at which you DO know, the music completely loses appeal - because you now realise it is not authentic.
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
OMG the stupidity here
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
And when they never go on tour, or never make a public appearance, I'm sure no one will question why... especially not the tabloids or the entire entertainment media business that exists to specifically report on that stuff.
How many people have seen BTS live?
I've no doubt right now there are coders in Korea creating perfect new all girl and all boy bands, entirely artificial, giving them back stories, and personalities, and voices, except these musicians won't need paying and won't do drugs and won't kill themselves (because they are just code and pixels) unless the record company decides they should, for the publicity
No one will ever know the difference. And if they ever go on tour it will be like ABBA Voyage, as @TOPPING rightly notes
Reality will become Artificial
I hate to break it to you, but most new music has been made this way since the mid 2000s, long before AI. South Park did a pretty good parody of it a decade ago:
Most new music is now so computer aided that making it entirely AI generated won't change much.
Spotify has been filling its catalog with music created in bulk, mostly in ambient and chill "piano in the background" type music for years, because it's so easy and quick to produce.
That will become easier and easier for more genres with AI tech.
I find most new music from the last decade or so impossible to listen to simply because I know my way around a copy of Logic and it all sounds like shit to me...
I'm actually the opposite. Music IS now so palpably and provably shit... partly for the reasons you say...
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
I'm not convinced that the King's cancer is trivial - I think it might be rather serious. No evidence, just a gut feel.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
I fear you could be right
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
I've never liked the chap. He's always struck me as profoundly thick, and I've had a story related from a colleague who knew one of his tutors who said the same. But he had to wait an age for his 'turn', and only got it with loss of his mother, and may well be about to go too, so he has my sympathies.
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
Well, there are a few people I don't particularly like, but I wouldn't shrug off the news that they had a horrible form of terminal cancer. It's a terrible fate for them and devastating for their families.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Same, he’s a husband, father, grandfather, brother, uncle etc.
Whose had enormous wealth and privilege his whole life - I don't know him neither do I particularly need to care what kind of bum cancer he does or doesn't have that will shuffle him off this mortal coil like everyone else.
I find it funny that the whole "well you have to remember they're a human being" argument gets trotted out when people with immense wealth or power are dying and some people aren't arse licking on their way out, but when people are homeless or are fleeing a country and just trying to survive or are being bombed to death that is met by a mere shrug. People crossing the channel are husbands, fathers, mothers, daughters etc. but on any day here you can probably find someone who would cheer their boat sinking and demand them to be flogged if they did make it to our soil.
Here's hoping something is seriously wrong with Chaz and Wills, so we enter the funniest timeline of King George and Prince Regent Harry or Prince Regent Andrew.
To be honest, I don't like it when either side do that.
Comments
Another dire morning for Sunak and it is only 10:30am.
It is quasi-religious, and yet you often see it trotted out by convinced atheists (like you, perhaps). Add in a large dash of fear and loathing, and top it off with the cherry of denial, and you get a dismal cocktail of circular logic like yours
Interesting that you mention animation. This is ALREADY being automated. Machines do it better than humans, and do it for free
Jeffery Katzenberg is the ex head of Disney. I suspect he knows more about animation than you
"Jeffrey Katzenberg Says A.I. Will Eliminate 90 Percent of Artist Jobs on Animated Films"
https://www.indiewire.com/news/business/jeffrey-katzenberg-ai-will-take-90-percent-animation-jobs-1234924809/
He said that three months ago BEFORE we got the astonishing revelation of Sora, and sublime text-to-video
You are wrong, and you should prepare yourself for a very nasty surprise, if you continue in this wrongthink
https://science.howstuffworks.com/science-vs-myth/unexplained-phenomena/uncanny-valley.htm
It’s difficult not to smile at a jazz version of Eminem, or Green Day, or making something really crap from the current era like Nicki Minaj actually listenable and fun. Watch for the backing vocalist playing the dog on the last of those links!
I'm reminded of a thought experiment in philosophy.
Imagine the place which is most special to you. Let's say it's a particular forest with a stream, wild flowers and undulations. This is your special place. Now imaging that a quarrying company buys the land and bulldozers it. Then, after extracting what it wants, the company restores your special place to EXACTLY as it was before, right down to every riffle of the stream, twigs on the trees and undulations. If you had visited this place before and after you would not notice any difference whatsoever.
The question is : is this place still special to you?
For me, and I would imagine, and hope, most people, the answer would be a resounding NO as you know it is no longer authentic.
With a fudge !!!!
https://www.gbnews.com/politics/migrant-crisis-starmer-labour-policy
Do Labour deny the policy changes they plan? After we finally limit the flow of immigration with Sunak's new limits, is Starmer going to open the flood gates again?
"Sublime text to video"? What sublime text to video? I've seen a few things people have made - puppy dogs playing whilst also popping in and out of existence - is that what people are supposed to see as real?
It's not that I think human art is superior - I am sure automated art will be able to surpass human techniques in terms of mechanics of creating things very easily. I just don't think humans will be very interested in it - because it will clearly not be human made. I typically accept the hypothesis that things like art - be it singing, painting, dancing etc. - are evolved forms of mating displays; that humans (with our greatest evolutionary advantage being our brains and ability to learn) typically cared for social performances and ability in partners and not raw strength. So, if those kinds of works are copied by a machine, I expect they will be technically astounding. I just don't think they will reach people in the same way, because the intent doesn't exist. A machine cannot be creative - it can only be iterative. We will have facsimiles of fakes, echoes of shadows.
You are acting as though music from now on will be made by 50-something men in suits who program their bots to throw out crowd pleasers a la Down in the Tube Station at Midnight for the unquestioning masses.
You are out of touch and bringing your own late middle-aged desperate biases to the issue.
Take a look at https://www.lccm.org.uk/ for example. One of many such places. Chock full of 18-30yr old students making contemporary music with all the latest tools at their disposal. Do you think they are unaware of AI and its capabilities. Really?
Music (and art and literature) will continue to be made and appreciated by humans. Just that the tools will change.
You are showing your age here, I'm afraid.
The New York Times did a test on this, here it is:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/01/19/technology/artificial-intelligence-image-generators-faces-quiz.html
The result? Most people cannot tell the difference between AI and real photos of humans, not any more. Even weirder, there was a bias in the findings such that people tend to believe the AI photos are more likely to be real than real humans. We seem to prefer AI reality, to reality
That's how far over the Uncanny Valley this has now gone. That's why @148grss isn't just wrong and outdated in her opinions, she is ludicrously wrong
Just look at any SciFi film from the 70s/80s and the mundane stuff is already here.
The big stuff like FTL space travel and nuclear fusion are taking a bit longer...
I can't yet see the limits of AI. It's just computer nerd stuff, and humans seem to be really good at that up to the point of doing themselves out of a living!
It's getting difficult for the average human eye to distinguish reality from AI and the human ear isn't going to fare any better...but the experience of seeing a live show always seemed a safer bet, but ABBA have fired the starting gun and my lad went to the Vegas Sphere before Christmas and he said that was a hell of a show.
Slowly, very slowly, humans are making themselves redundant.
Has anything AI related actually headed into the UK or US top 100 yet (A lower bar than actually being any good). I'd have thought the artist whose lunch it might probably eat would be someone like Tiesto. I doubt he's worried tbh. So far I believe it's only generated kitsch covers and jingles that will probably be good for ooh I don't know avoiding royalties with adverts.
Music for adverts, that's what I predict AI's forte will be. Leon's dream - a jingle for Roger.
If he did Labour could be in power a very long time.
The Prince of Wales has pulled out of a memorial service due to a personal matter, Kensington Palace has said.
William had been due to attend a memorial service for the late King Constantine of Greece at Windsor Castle.
Kensington Palace would not elaborate further but said the Princess of Wales, who is recovering from abdominal surgery, continues to be doing well.
The Prince of Wales called the Greek royal family who are attending the service to let them know he was unable to attend.
The late King Constantine of Greece, who died in January last year, was William's godfather.
Support for Tories in London hits just 17% with Labour ahead even among pensioners, exclusive new @YouGov poll for @MileEndInst @QMUL in @EveningStandard
In Outer London, the Tories are on 19 per cent.
Labour is ahead of the Tories in London among all age groups including those 65 and over, by 34% to 31% for the latter.
For Londoners aged 18-to-24 the respective split is 65% to 13%, 25-to 49 it is 58% to 12%, and 50 to 64 it is 49% to 18%
What if the record company just doesn't tell you if it is AI or not? What then? if they get reactions like yours, they will just lie, and make up fake humans, they can do that too, with Midjourney and Sora, it will all be lies, they wil have packaged life stories told through a screen, and you will buy it BECAUSE YOU WON'T KNOW ANY BETTER
This is basic extrapolation GCSE, yet apparently beyond the mental capabilities of 80% of PB
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orion's_Arm
Is he up for a lovefest with alt-right like ex-Liberal Truss?
I think that for some people they think that this, like other things I could mention but won't, is progressive. In doing so they confuse change and the avant-garde with progress. It might be, but it is not necessarily so.
Similar things were said about album covers, LPs (and later CDs) and downloads.
I'm finding that difficult to believe tbh. Conservatives are much stronger in outer London.
Scarily, I only needed two or three goes at that, to get that rock ballad version of Rochdale's 30p Lament, and it nailed it
That didn't take hours of takes and then cherry picking. The software produces songs in seconds, and I chose the best of 3
Five minutes total to make that
Now extrapolate where it will be within 2 years, given how shit it was two years ago
What happened to facial photos (they are now entirely believable and people cannot tell the difference between human and AI) will happen to music
Before long, there will be a totally AI solo star or band with the accompanying online series and merch. Think The Monkees but for the digital age.
No idea of what was wrong with Catherine (hysterectomy would be likely?) but its concerning that her recovery seems a bit slow.
In this article, Blake is referred to as a woman throughout, then at the end
“The Ministry of Justice confirmed Blake was being held at a male prison.”
https://www.bracknellnews.co.uk/news/national/24145459.cat-killer-scarlet-blake-revelled-murder-jailed-life/
Because, when it comes down to it, Blake is a man. Honestly, this is absolute madness. Show it to a ‘progressive’ ten years ago and they’d think you were taking the piss
I've no doubt right now there are coders in Korea creating perfect new all girl and all boy bands, entirely artificial, giving them back stories, and personalities, and voices, except these musicians won't need paying and won't do drugs and won't kill themselves (because they are just code and pixels) unless the record company decides they should, for the publicity
No one will ever know the difference. And if they ever go on tour it will be like ABBA Voyage, as @TOPPING rightly notes
Reality will become Artificial
killing the damaging nature story off so the narrative moves on. The story needs more oxygen, and the Tory’s are brilliantly starving it of Oxygen.
If you answer the question, what was wrong, it will give the story oxygen. It’s important to note firstly Anderson does not have significant support amongst Tories, that idea is just bigged up by very transparent media spin, a lot “apparently” complaining to their MPs (just what mates he has MPs) not even Tories in their life.
More importantly conceding Anderson’s comment was racist will open Suella Braverman up to the same charge and suspension as the racist conspiracy theory Braverman pushed against Starmer is IDENTICAL to Anderson’s on Khan. And how on earth you suspend Braverman without it properly kicking off. And if they concede it is islamabophic in any way the media latch on to the bigger picture just conceded about about Islamophobia in the Conservative party, which Sunak has to avoid as he’s calling a General Election in two weeks time.
What you saw as comedy gold, is actually fantastic politics by tge government, shutting a far more electorally damaging narrative down by depriving it of oxygen.
At some point we may start to reach the idea of working a bit less, but thats been the predicted future for ever and doesn't seem to be getting much closer...
Also - history moves. If your position is "who cares, it happened a hundred years ago" is that not an argument in favour of taking down these statues? Should we expect to never get rid of any of these statues, never update the people who adorn these plinths? Should we always be stuck memorialising a specific point in the past - never be given a chance to move forward?
There is a reason that no one in Germany argues that tearing down statues of Hitler would have erased the history of the Nazis, and why people were happy when they saw statues of Saddam Hussein torn down during the Iraq war - because you know that a statue isn't some neutral form of giving a history lesson - it is a proclamation of importance. If people no longer like the statues in their city, or social norms have changed so a man who was once considered a hero is now considered a villain - that's how history works. It's all the people who want to keep the clock stopped at a time when the British Empire was lauded, where no one questioned if it was good or not, who want to force their idea of what was good on the rest of us who are the people who need to move on and are trying to keep history static, frozen in ice.
The pictures are of course just stock stuff for the building of the draft site so won't be the latest AI so presumably they are easy to spot as not real, but I just can't see anything wrong with them, but my gut says they aren't real, but they are appealing, but not obviously attractive.
Douglas Adams:
“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.
There is another theory which states that this has already happened.”
Don’t know whether it’s just me getting older, but the idea of ‘pop stars’, as they used to be called, posing for moody photos just seems utterly ridiculous to me now.
2. The minister saying it is profoundly stupid
3. In sending out stupid to say stupid things, the Tories ensure this story still has legs. Which is profoundly stupid.
They did the sometimes hard bit very quickly - sack him. The problem is they can't say why they sacked him as (a) they'd have to sack Cruella as well, and (b) their remaining voters think petty racism is a Good Thing.
Trying to selll tickets to a new, manufactured band, that’s actually just an industry back office nerd and his computer with no discernible talent, is an altogether more difficult prospect.
There will, I predict, always be room for the human product. It will be niche, artisanal, highly prized, the same way hand made ceramics are expensive but 99% of pottery is made in a factory
The difference this time is that the machine made stuff might actually be objectively superior, by all metrics. But we will still crave a bit of humankind, now and again
It got to "doctors are concerned for the Queen's health" on the day HMQ passed away, which we all secretly knew in our gut was code for "she's dying", which they couldn't really say.
And yes we should continuously re-examine history, although we ought to be careful with out modern prejudices when we look at historical figures. Just as children growing up under the Nazi's were raised with a hateful view of Jews and other untermensch, so folk back in history had their own ingrained prejudices.
The fact he was reported as weeping at the "get well" letters is concerning. We can't afford to lose more royals. Eeek
But, more scarily, I worry we are being softened up to accept absolutely anything as true, even when we know it’s false. High court judges are calling men ‘she/her’ as they send them to male prisons for murder, and media report it as fact. It’s completely crazy
Absolutely brilliant.
The best new image-generators are completely believable, indeed TOO believable, as that unnerving NYT article proves
I did take time choosing the most ridiculous comment that would be the funniest, and which - in length - would fit the format of Suno AI
But you know, there are plenty more Royals. Wills and Kat knocked out an heir and two spares, and there is always Andrew...
People ignoring this history, much like the people who ignored the history of gay and lesbian people, are the ones ignoring reality - not transpeople or the people who accept their existence.
There are still some AI snafus, such as https://static01.nytimes.com/newsgraphics/2023-11-30-disinfo-ai-faces/28c36f34-35c8-4fa5-b12f-b4447c72fe6a/_assets/ai-3.jpg where the background doesn't seem to make any sense - at first glance blurred sea, where the horizon should be level. It could be rock or something with a sudden drop behind the subject, but it looks off. You do see this sometimes, but can probably be easily fixed by a multiple stage process where the AI draws a background, blurs it (if desired) and then pops the head on top.
But basic point: yes, these are getting really good. Hard to spot when you're looking for them and absolutely good enough to replace models in most print ads/stock photography for example. The 'real' images in that area are so touched up that they're often pretty fake anyway!
ETA: The BBC have a fairly regular quiz, often with famous people in real or AI images. I generally get the vast majority of those, but often it's more the context, I think, than the image per se.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-oHYTQyTEk
Most new music is now so computer aided that making it entirely AI generated won't change much.
Spotify has been filling its catalog with music created in bulk, mostly in ambient and chill "piano in the background" type music for years, because it's so easy and quick to produce.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jul/10/spotify-denies-filling-popular-playlists-with-fake-artists
That will become easier and easier for more genres with AI tech.
I find most new music from the last decade or so impossible to listen to simply because I know my way around a copy of Logic and it all sounds like shit to me...
The main problem would be in finding the extra recruits to replace casualties.
No-one deserves that. Not your worst enemy.
I wish him a full recovery.
Did the Roland drum machine presage the end of live drummers? The 50 cent Staying Alive remix nevertheless needed Staying Alive to start with.
You do a lot of shouting about your great meta-analysis credentials whereas anyone who knows any artist anywhere knows that that isn't what artists care about. They produce art.
It's not as funny as Rochdale's Lament but it shows the versatility of the medium
"At Least I’m Not Talking ‘Bout Brexit"
https://app.suno.ai/song/0ba9b285-999a-4c1a-8ba4-cf6e31ed1b9d/
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/its-official-modern-music-is-bad/
... I am therefore hoping that this total takeover by AI, replacing us entirely, might actually make it BETTER
I find it funny that the whole "well you have to remember they're a human being" argument gets trotted out when people with immense wealth or power are dying and some people aren't arse licking on their way out, but when people are homeless or are fleeing a country and just trying to survive or are being bombed to death that is met by a mere shrug. People crossing the channel are husbands, fathers, mothers, daughters etc. but on any day here you can probably find someone who would cheer their boat sinking and demand them to be flogged if they did make it to our soil.
Here's hoping something is seriously wrong with Chaz and Wills, so we enter the funniest timeline of King George and Prince Regent Harry or Prince Regent Andrew.
On a personal level, I wish them all the very best with their health in what must be very difficult circumstances (especially given the intrusive public scrutiny).
On the other hand, the transition from QE2 to C3 showed (I think) that the identity of the person occupying the Royal Hot Seat is of little-to-no practical consequence these days, except in terms of the media clickbait.
Sad but of no interest to me , I don't know him or even like him or his personna / privileges in any way. Royals should be dropped in my opinion and save country a fortune.
I will be surprised if immigration in 2025 under a new Labour government isn't lower than 2023's figure.
https://twitter.com/ElectionMapsUK/status/1762434842313036217?t=yXAbf0fO2Ce48I94QBYFPw&s=19
That crosses a line and you should apologise and withdraw, before you get moderated
I don't think that's true. What you will find is people who question the genuine nature of their refugee claim, when they are fleeing that hell hole of Northern France. I don't wish to go over again the arguments (no expectation to claim asylum in the first safe country etc, other nations take more than we do etc, but its this element that winds people up. There is a suspicion that games are being played. Papers burned, passports lost, fake religious conversions being deployed.
And all of these narratives are almost certainly for most of the refugees. But as the bilateral work with Albania showed there have been plenty willing to try to exploit the system.