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What if the Tories don’t hold any of Thursday’s by-elections? – politicalbetting.com

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  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,552
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:



    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Politics of “too many young people going to university” a bit surprising. Our Loyal National (more Red Wall) segment among most likely to say too few/right numbers going whereas Established Liberal (Cameronite/Blue Wall) among mos be

    Presumably a similar mechanism to grammar schools- those who are confident that their children/grandchildren will still get to go like the idea of selective academic education.

    No
    Leon said:

    ydoethur said:

    Leon said:

    Krakow must be right up there in the top 20 most beautiful cities on the planet. I think I prefer it to Prague

    True story: I was last here 20 years ago for a wedding. A couple of days before the wedding we all went for a jaunt. On the way back to krakow from the salt mines we passed auschwitz and the minibus driver said “if anyone wants to see it, well, here it is”

    Despite the horror everyone wanted to see it, as they’d not seen it before, so they all piled off. I could hardly stay on the bus (“what, don’t you care??”) so I dutifully got off to “see Auschwitz”

    Thing is I’d specifically seen it about six months before. So I spent my time hiding behind a gas chamber, basically, in case one of the staff recognised me and said “what, you came back? Did you enjoy it that much? Perhaps you should get a season ticket?”

    I love Krakow. My favourite European city of the ones I’ve seen.

    Although to be fair I’ve seen Vienna but not Prague.
    Prague is stunning. But it’s now SO touristy. Almost as bad as Venice

    Both are global top 20 most-beautiful-city contenders. From the UK I’d definitely put Bath and Cambridge in there

    Very few cities outside Europe would make the list

    New York. Hong Kong. Errr….

    There are cities outside Europe with extraordinary locations but usually the architecture rather lets them down. Sydney. Cape Town. Etc

    The most beautiful city in Europe, and indeed the world, is Bergen.

    I have no association with the city, nor any desire to live there. It just is. Here's a picture.




    But all of coastal Norway looks like that.
    To some extent yes. To be pedantic the rest of coastal Norway isn't a city. Bergen is a genuinely beautiful city - what you can see of it through the rain - when almost no other city is. It has the mediaeval buildings in the centre, and the modern buildings are also quite nice, in a stupendous natural setting.



    On my walk through it from the railway station to the yacht harbour, these are the two photos I stopped to take. It may be I don't have a very good eye, but really they aren't all that are they?
    Yeah, no, that ain’t Krakow
    Indeed not. This is the walk from the station in Krakow. Although I believe it's an architecturally significant building.


    Schindler's Enamel factory?
    You can visit his actual factory in Krakow. The one with the stairs

    What makes it especially haunting is that Spielberg used the real location, to shoot the factory scenes

    So when you look at it you are simultaneously thinking of that immensely powerful movie, but ALSO the far more profound and horribly real events that took place right there

    It is disturbing
    A massive branch of European civilisation was destroyed in the holocaust and exodus to Israel. Everywhere in Eastern Europe is haunted by the absence of that vibrant Jewish culture. Not much remains but it is worth seeking out. So much more important to remember how these people's lived rather than how they died.

  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,649

    Guardian front page on deep splits in Labour on child benefit cap

    https://twitter.com/TmorrowsPapers/status/1681046145563230214?t=bg2EDbVooiSyX7mOM-IArQ&s=19

    Think the U Turn on the U Turn might still be a problem he probably has to try and ride out the storm they say

    Sir Kid Starver has a massive problem of his own making
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Slight cross purpose though; street trees can do a lot to provide seasonal shade (the leaves vanish in winter! It's genius!) and transpired water. But they don't work at the scale to meaningfully reduce atmospheric carbon dioxide.
    No I agree. But they do that as well. The idea they have 'nothing to offer' is just wrong
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    Tobias Ellwood is now singing the praises of the Taliban’s government of Afghanistan.

    https://twitter.com/tobias_ellwood/status/1680974793867415554

    Hold your breath - but this is a country transformed.

    👉 security vastly improved
    👉 corruption reduced
    👉 opium trade ended

    Shouting from afar will not improve women’s rights.

    We need to re-engage.

    We need to re-open the British Embassy.

    Bit early to be shilling for a job as head of Taliban PR, isn't it?

    I wonder if there is any other aspect of transformation he might have picked up on?
    My understanding is that he's correct as far as it goes (though the opium crop has only been eliminated in Helmand and one other province). Obviously security is partly improved because the Taliban are no longer trying to plant bombs.

    It's possible for a regime to be vile in some areas and do positive things in others. What we do about that - reengage, even when they're being vile? - is a tricky question. But I wouldn't be against reopening the Embassy if we were allowed to operate freely (e.g. employing local female staff).
    I don't think anyone is particularly surprised the security or opium situation is improved with the Taliban fully in charge. If we're that blown away by it we really should have just left them to it.

    Obviously the reality of the world involves dealing with vile regimes in some manner, but is there really anything to be gained from him not just promoting reengagement, but doing so in a slimy, servile way?
    Opium is surely an historical irrelevance? Fentanyl is synthetic.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,518

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    PP is basically the Tories, Vox is UKIP on steroids. But Felix can explain better!
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,719
    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382

    A

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Sadly, photosynthesis is rather inefficient.

    Carbon capture would need to be better.
    CCS has a lot of basic problems they are still trying to overcome. One of the most basic is the Joule–Thomson effect of rapid cooling as the CO2 expands as it enters to reservoir. This results in the formation of ice in the pore spaces which inhibits or prevents further injection.
    The capture bit has been sorted by us process bods. It's the bloody geologists who need to get their shit together with the storage.
    Don't blame us. It's the bloody physicists with their laws who are to blame :)
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,003

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    • PP: People's Party. Right to centre right by UK standards. Christian Democrats
    • Vox: National conservative (the European version, not the US one). It's never been big in the UK as a separate party and is usually swallowed by the right wing of the Conservative party. Think Kinder, Küche, Kirche (children, church, kitchen). Best UK analogy is whatever Lozza Fox's party is.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Party_(Spain)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vox_(political_party)
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,604

    Guardian front page on deep splits in Labour on child benefit cap

    https://twitter.com/TmorrowsPapers/status/1681046145563230214?t=bg2EDbVooiSyX7mOM-IArQ&s=19

    Think the U Turn on the U Turn might still be a problem he probably has to try and ride out the storm they say

    Sir Kid Starver has a massive problem of his own making
    Plus, with a small majority, he's not going to be able to make these things stick against so much opposition in the party.

    Any welfare bill will get an amendment on the 2 child limit.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,958

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    PP is basically the Tories, Vox is UKIP on steroids. But Felix can explain better!
    Thanks Nick
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,958
    viewcode said:

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    • PP: People's Party. Right to centre right by UK standards. Christian Democrats
    • Vox: National conservative (the European version, not the US one). It's never been big in the UK as a separate party and is usually swallowed by the right wing of the Conservative party. Think Kinder, Küche, Kirche (children, church, kitchen). Best UK analogy is whatever Lozza Fox's party is.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Party_(Spain)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vox_(political_party)
    Thank you
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    FF43 said:

    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:



    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Politics of “too many young people going to university” a bit surprising. Our Loyal National (more Red Wall) segment among most likely to say too few/right numbers going whereas Established Liberal (Cameronite/Blue Wall) among mos be

    Presumably a similar mechanism to grammar schools- those who are confident that their children/grandchildren will still get to go like the idea of selective academic education.

    No
    Leon said:

    ydoethur said:

    Leon said:

    Krakow must be right up there in the top 20 most beautiful cities on the planet. I think I prefer it to Prague

    True story: I was last here 20 years ago for a wedding. A couple of days before the wedding we all went for a jaunt. On the way back to krakow from the salt mines we passed auschwitz and the minibus driver said “if anyone wants to see it, well, here it is”

    Despite the horror everyone wanted to see it, as they’d not seen it before, so they all piled off. I could hardly stay on the bus (“what, don’t you care??”) so I dutifully got off to “see Auschwitz”

    Thing is I’d specifically seen it about six months before. So I spent my time hiding behind a gas chamber, basically, in case one of the staff recognised me and said “what, you came back? Did you enjoy it that much? Perhaps you should get a season ticket?”

    I love Krakow. My favourite European city of the ones I’ve seen.

    Although to be fair I’ve seen Vienna but not Prague.
    Prague is stunning. But it’s now SO touristy. Almost as bad as Venice

    Both are global top 20 most-beautiful-city contenders. From the UK I’d definitely put Bath and Cambridge in there

    Very few cities outside Europe would make the list

    New York. Hong Kong. Errr….

    There are cities outside Europe with extraordinary locations but usually the architecture rather lets them down. Sydney. Cape Town. Etc

    The most beautiful city in Europe, and indeed the world, is Bergen.

    I have no association with the city, nor any desire to live there. It just is. Here's a picture.




    But all of coastal Norway looks like that.
    To some extent yes. To be pedantic the rest of coastal Norway isn't a city. Bergen is a genuinely beautiful city - what you can see of it through the rain - when almost no other city is. It has the mediaeval buildings in the centre, and the modern buildings are also quite nice, in a stupendous natural setting.



    On my walk through it from the railway station to the yacht harbour, these are the two photos I stopped to take. It may be I don't have a very good eye, but really they aren't all that are they?
    Yeah, no, that ain’t Krakow
    Indeed not. This is the walk from the station in Krakow. Although I believe it's an architecturally significant building.


    Schindler's Enamel factory?
    You can visit his actual factory in Krakow. The one with the stairs

    What makes it especially haunting is that Spielberg used the real location, to shoot the factory scenes

    So when you look at it you are simultaneously thinking of that immensely powerful movie, but ALSO the far more profound and horribly real events that took place right there

    It is disturbing
    A massive branch of European civilisation was destroyed in the holocaust and exodus to Israel. Everywhere in Eastern Europe is haunted by the absence of that vibrant Jewish culture. Not much remains but it is worth seeking out. So much more important to remember how these people's lived rather than how they died.

    There is a massive attraction for me for the Mittle-Europe of the first decades of the twentieth century. I know it is perhaps illogical but I am truly saddened by the loss of that culture, knowledge and people just in the same way I am saddened by the burning of the library at Alexandria.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,755
    Carnyx said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
    Having just watched ('endured'?) S0201 of 'Foundation' I'd happily rewatch "The Starlost" at this point. So I'll give it a go.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,191
    viewcode said:

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    • PP: People's Party. Right to centre right by UK standards. Christian Democrats
    • Vox: National conservative (the European version, not the US one). It's never been big in the UK as a separate party and is usually swallowed by the right wing of the Conservative party. Think Kinder, Küche, Kirche (children, church, kitchen). Best UK analogy is whatever Lozza Fox's party is.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Party_(Spain)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vox_(political_party)
    One other thing to add. At the previous election, there was a significant centrist party called Citizens (orange bookish Lib Dems if you want a UK analogy). For various reasons, they have vanished in a puff of smoke and most of their voters have landed with the PP.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,964

    It's one of the biggest mistakes of the Right that they've allowed the radical Left to own and dominate the climate debate in the last 30 years, thus making it ultra political.

    It should be no more so than any other form of infrastructure.

    The Right chose to demonise their political opponents, using phrases like “the radical Left”, which then makes it hard to admit there are any points of agreement. Maybe if the Right weaned themselves off the rhetoric, some common sense could come through.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    PP are the Conservatives. Vox somewhat to the right. The left equivalents are PSOE and Sumar.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,496

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    We have been cool and wet for the last month, catching up much of the shortfall of an exceptionally dry spring. Most the tracks around here have more muddy puddles now than they did in April.
    And?
    It is important to remember that weather is local and climate is international. I am not suggesting for a moment that the world is not heating up but local records can be misleading.
    OK, but that's a non sequitur.

    I wasn't referring to local British records in the last few weeks. And don't forget the crazy June we just had and how mad the elevated North Sea temperatures were.
    In years to come we may be thankful for mild, damp, changeable British weather. Personally I find that very hard to believe. But no longer impossible
    It will drive mass immigration to the UK off the charts. Which could result in a fascist government here - like, a proper one.

    We have record high immigration now and the party leading in the polls is Labour.
    The SPD were leading in the polls a few years before the actual Nazis came to power.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,964

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    We have been cool and wet for the last month, catching up much of the shortfall of an exceptionally dry spring. Most the tracks around here have more muddy puddles now than they did in April.
    And?
    It is important to remember that weather is local and climate is international. I am not suggesting for a moment that the world is not heating up but local records can be misleading.
    OK, but that's a non sequitur.

    I wasn't referring to local British records in the last few weeks. And don't forget the crazy June we just had and how mad the elevated North Sea temperatures were.
    In years to come we may be thankful for mild, damp, changeable British weather. Personally I find that very hard to believe. But no longer impossible
    It will drive mass immigration to the UK off the charts. Which could result in a fascist government here - like, a proper one.

    We have record high immigration now and the party leading in the polls is Labour.
    The SPD were leading in the polls a few years before the actual Nazis came to power.
    … but the rise of the Nazis wasn’t the result of mass immigration to Germany.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163

    viewcode said:

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    • PP: People's Party. Right to centre right by UK standards. Christian Democrats
    • Vox: National conservative (the European version, not the US one). It's never been big in the UK as a separate party and is usually swallowed by the right wing of the Conservative party. Think Kinder, Küche, Kirche (children, church, kitchen). Best UK analogy is whatever Lozza Fox's party is.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Party_(Spain)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vox_(political_party)
    One other thing to add. At the previous election, there was a significant centrist party called Citizens (orange bookish Lib Dems if you want a UK analogy). For various reasons, they have vanished in a puff of smoke and most of their voters have landed with the PP.
    Correct. They were Spain's Liberal democrats. Chortle!
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    We demand a shrubbery.
    We formerly said Ni.

    My point is, Planting A Wood Because We Love Ents, including shoving a lot of 5p whips in and surrounding each one of them with £5 worth of stakes and tree guards, absolutely sucks vs just letting stuff happen and then thinning the trees which naturally occur there. People think that Oooh, that lovely thick trunk sequesters sooooo much carbon, but it's very unsequestrable by a bloke with a chainsaw and a log burner. whereas you can't burn rushes and mud.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,755
    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    You might enjoy "The Collapse" https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11248266/ . French show - mostly single-take stand-alone episodes about an unexplained 'end of the world' situation.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163

    It's one of the biggest mistakes of the Right that they've allowed the radical Left to own and dominate the climate debate in the last 30 years, thus making it ultra political.

    It should be no more so than any other form of infrastructure.

    The Right chose to demonise their political opponents, using phrases like “the radical Left”, which then makes it hard to admit there are any points of agreement. Maybe if the Right weaned themselves off the rhetoric, some common sense could come through.
    While the left refer to the 'extreme right' or 'ultra derecha'. Maybe if the Left weaned themselves off the rhetoric.....
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,003
    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
    Having just watched ('endured'?) S0201 of 'Foundation' I'd happily rewatch "The Starlost" at this point. So I'll give it a go.
    I hate to ask. Is S02E01 as bad as I feared?
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,755
    viewcode said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
    Having just watched ('endured'?) S0201 of 'Foundation' I'd happily rewatch "The Starlost" at this point. So I'll give it a go.
    I hate to ask. Is S02E01 as bad as I feared?
    Goodness. Yes. I gave it a shot just as a "will I be as vaguely annoyed as I was by S01?". But... it's way, way beyond that.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163
    I went shopping in Lorca today - medium size town on Murcia, inland 34 degrees typical July figures. Zero sign of anyone panicking or 'bracing' (Sky News) in the midst of the climate crisis! First sign though that there's a GE in 5 days. Lots of PP posters on the main roads. No sign of any others. Bizarre.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,755
    ohnotnow said:

    viewcode said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
    Having just watched ('endured'?) S0201 of 'Foundation' I'd happily rewatch "The Starlost" at this point. So I'll give it a go.
    I hate to ask. Is S02E01 as bad as I feared?
    Goodness. Yes. I gave it a shot just as a "will I be as vaguely annoyed as I was by S01?". But... it's way, way beyond that.
    I'm about to copy the BBC Radio version of Foundation just to remind myself of the ... actual story, https://archive.org/details/foundation-trilogy_bbc-radio_1973_complete
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,964
    felix said:

    viewcode said:

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    • PP: People's Party. Right to centre right by UK standards. Christian Democrats
    • Vox: National conservative (the European version, not the US one). It's never been big in the UK as a separate party and is usually swallowed by the right wing of the Conservative party. Think Kinder, Küche, Kirche (children, church, kitchen). Best UK analogy is whatever Lozza Fox's party is.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Party_(Spain)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vox_(political_party)
    One other thing to add. At the previous election, there was a significant centrist party called Citizens (orange bookish Lib Dems if you want a UK analogy). For various reasons, they have vanished in a puff of smoke and most of their voters have landed with the PP.
    Correct. They were Spain's Liberal democrats. Chortle!
    With the twist that, unlike the LibDems, they were very anti-federalism. Wasn’t their raison d’être opposition to greater autonomy for Catalonia etc.?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,003
    ohnotnow said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    You might enjoy "The Collapse" https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11248266/ . French show - mostly single-take stand-alone episodes about an unexplained 'end of the world' situation.
    Thank you for that - I'm oddly touched - but although I can do foreign language films, non-Anglophone SF is difficult for me, and there have been good un's. I tried to do "Into The Night", which is partly Anglophone, but it slipped away from me.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    ohnotnow said:

    viewcode said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
    Having just watched ('endured'?) S0201 of 'Foundation' I'd happily rewatch "The Starlost" at this point. So I'll give it a go.
    I hate to ask. Is S02E01 as bad as I feared?
    Goodness. Yes. I gave it a shot just as a "will I be as vaguely annoyed as I was by S01?". But... it's way, way beyond that.
    Sounds almost worth it for the hatewatching value.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,964
    felix said:

    It's one of the biggest mistakes of the Right that they've allowed the radical Left to own and dominate the climate debate in the last 30 years, thus making it ultra political.

    It should be no more so than any other form of infrastructure.

    The Right chose to demonise their political opponents, using phrases like “the radical Left”, which then makes it hard to admit there are any points of agreement. Maybe if the Right weaned themselves off the rhetoric, some common sense could come through.
    While the left refer to the 'extreme right' or 'ultra derecha'. Maybe if the Left weaned themselves off the rhetoric.....
    I don’t think I’ve seen either of those phrases used on PB.com today. I have seen Casino Royale talk about the “radical Left”. Like there, in the post I replied to.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,003
    ohnotnow said:

    viewcode said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
    Having just watched ('endured'?) S0201 of 'Foundation' I'd happily rewatch "The Starlost" at this point. So I'll give it a go.
    I hate to ask. Is S02E01 as bad as I feared?
    Goodness. Yes. I gave it a shot just as a "will I be as vaguely annoyed as I was by S01?". But... it's way, way beyond that.
    All they had to do was film the book(s). That was it. But oh, no. that would be too easy.

    :(:(
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,964
    viewcode said:

    ohnotnow said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    You might enjoy "The Collapse" https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11248266/ . French show - mostly single-take stand-alone episodes about an unexplained 'end of the world' situation.
    Thank you for that - I'm oddly touched - but although I can do foreign language films, non-Anglophone SF is difficult for me, and there have been good un's. I tried to do "Into The Night", which is partly Anglophone, but it slipped away from me.
    Best recent non-Anglophone SF TV is maybe… https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beforeigners
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,003
    ohnotnow said:

    ohnotnow said:

    viewcode said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Carnyx said:

    viewcode said:

    The trailer for "The Creator" is out. A non-franchise original SF film with excellent effects and not afflicted with the endless post-processing and color-correction that makes high-budget films look like a fuzzy mess, it's budget is $88million. As a rough rule of thumb you have to do over two, preferably three times your budget worldwide to do a solid profit, and it might do it.

    It's released Sept 29. The trailer is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex3C1-5Dhb8

    Distinctly odd nuke explosion, though: no prompt flash or thermal effects.
    Having just watched ('endured'?) S0201 of 'Foundation' I'd happily rewatch "The Starlost" at this point. So I'll give it a go.
    I hate to ask. Is S02E01 as bad as I feared?
    Goodness. Yes. I gave it a shot just as a "will I be as vaguely annoyed as I was by S01?". But... it's way, way beyond that.
    I'm about to copy the BBC Radio version of Foundation just to remind myself of the ... actual story, https://archive.org/details/foundation-trilogy_bbc-radio_1973_complete
    It's on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnrUq2om1KU
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163

    felix said:

    viewcode said:

    felix said:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_Spanish_general_election

    Four new polls tonight with a lot of stability and the PP/Vox majority remains the likeliest result. Both of the extreme left and right parties are being squeezed by the big 2. Just 4 days of campaign before Saturday 's day of reflection and rest.

    For the of us who are not clued up on Spanish politics who are PP and Vox
    • PP: People's Party. Right to centre right by UK standards. Christian Democrats
    • Vox: National conservative (the European version, not the US one). It's never been big in the UK as a separate party and is usually swallowed by the right wing of the Conservative party. Think Kinder, Küche, Kirche (children, church, kitchen). Best UK analogy is whatever Lozza Fox's party is.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People's_Party_(Spain)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vox_(political_party)
    One other thing to add. At the previous election, there was a significant centrist party called Citizens (orange bookish Lib Dems if you want a UK analogy). For various reasons, they have vanished in a puff of smoke and most of their voters have landed with the PP.
    Correct. They were Spain's Liberal democrats. Chortle!
    With the twist that, unlike the LibDems, they were very anti-federalism. Wasn’t their raison d’être opposition to greater autonomy for Catalonia etc.?
    Yes. They want Spain to remain as it is. Remember we have Autonomous Communities with considerable powers already. That is hardly anti federalist.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163

    felix said:

    It's one of the biggest mistakes of the Right that they've allowed the radical Left to own and dominate the climate debate in the last 30 years, thus making it ultra political.

    It should be no more so than any other form of infrastructure.

    The Right chose to demonise their political opponents, using phrases like “the radical Left”, which then makes it hard to admit there are any points of agreement. Maybe if the Right weaned themselves off the rhetoric, some common sense could come through.
    While the left refer to the 'extreme right' or 'ultra derecha'. Maybe if the Left weaned themselves off the rhetoric.....
    I don’t think I’ve seen either of those phrases used on PB.com today. I have seen Casino Royale talk about the “radical Left”. Like there, in the post I replied to.
    Omg I hear there's a whole world outside PB with politics and everything!
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,003
    felix said:

    felix said:

    It's one of the biggest mistakes of the Right that they've allowed the radical Left to own and dominate the climate debate in the last 30 years, thus making it ultra political.

    It should be no more so than any other form of infrastructure.

    The Right chose to demonise their political opponents, using phrases like “the radical Left”, which then makes it hard to admit there are any points of agreement. Maybe if the Right weaned themselves off the rhetoric, some common sense could come through.
    While the left refer to the 'extreme right' or 'ultra derecha'. Maybe if the Left weaned themselves off the rhetoric.....
    I don’t think I’ve seen either of those phrases used on PB.com today. I have seen Casino Royale talk about the “radical Left”. Like there, in the post I replied to.
    Omg I hear there's a whole world outside PB with politics and everything!
    Heretic! :)
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,518

    Guardian front page on deep splits in Labour on child benefit cap

    https://twitter.com/TmorrowsPapers/status/1681046145563230214?t=bg2EDbVooiSyX7mOM-IArQ&s=19

    Think the U Turn on the U Turn might still be a problem he probably has to try and ride out the storm they say

    Sir Kid Starver has a massive problem of his own making
    I wonder if all this determined un-leftism (barges for refugees, no benefits for third children) will have an impact on the by-elections (positive or negative)? My guess is that it'll be pretty marginal, but it might depress Labour turnout a bit. I don't really get it - surely even the most absent-minded of floating voters has worked out that Starmer is not Corbyn by now?
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163
    viewcode said:

    felix said:

    felix said:

    It's one of the biggest mistakes of the Right that they've allowed the radical Left to own and dominate the climate debate in the last 30 years, thus making it ultra political.

    It should be no more so than any other form of infrastructure.

    The Right chose to demonise their political opponents, using phrases like “the radical Left”, which then makes it hard to admit there are any points of agreement. Maybe if the Right weaned themselves off the rhetoric, some common sense could come through.
    While the left refer to the 'extreme right' or 'ultra derecha'. Maybe if the Left weaned themselves off the rhetoric.....
    I don’t think I’ve seen either of those phrases used on PB.com today. I have seen Casino Royale talk about the “radical Left”. Like there, in the post I replied to.
    Omg I hear there's a whole world outside PB with politics and everything!
    Heretic! :)
    Jjjj - Spanish for lol!
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,479
    felix said:

    I went shopping in Lorca today - medium size town on Murcia, inland 34 degrees typical July figures. Zero sign of anyone panicking or 'bracing' (Sky News) in the midst of the climate crisis! First sign though that there's a GE in 5 days. Lots of PP posters on the main roads. No sign of any others. Bizarre.

    Normal Spanish temperatures.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Andy_JS said:

    felix said:

    I went shopping in Lorca today - medium size town on Murcia, inland 34 degrees typical July figures. Zero sign of anyone panicking or 'bracing' (Sky News) in the midst of the climate crisis! First sign though that there's a GE in 5 days. Lots of PP posters on the main roads. No sign of any others. Bizarre.

    Normal Spanish temperatures.
    If I thought you lived in Spain I would merely think you sounded like a complete dick. If as I strongly suspect you are English and have never been to Spain...
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,854
    The case of the Sun Versus the BBC. Cant hypocricy and downright lies by some very unpleasnt people. Rod Liddle being just the best example. A good watch

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fg6w1sP3wY
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,163
    Miklosvar said:

    Andy_JS said:

    felix said:

    I went shopping in Lorca today - medium size town on Murcia, inland 34 degrees typical July figures. Zero sign of anyone panicking or 'bracing' (Sky News) in the midst of the climate crisis! First sign though that there's a GE in 5 days. Lots of PP posters on the main roads. No sign of any others. Bizarre.

    Normal Spanish temperatures.
    If I thought you lived in Spain I would merely think you sounded like a complete dick. If as I strongly suspect you are English and have never been to Spain...
    Except he is correct.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
    Dear me. Cancer has been around for over 3 million years. And malaria. And scorpions. This "evolution is loverlee" nonsense was, we all hoped, knocked on the head by The Selfish Gene.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    So courtesy of my great Dutch friend Frits, this evening we have mostly been drinking 1957 Armagnac. It genuinely is as good as one might have hoped. In fact it might be the finest brandy I have ever tasted.


  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,318

    Guardian front page on deep splits in Labour on child benefit cap

    https://twitter.com/TmorrowsPapers/status/1681046145563230214?t=bg2EDbVooiSyX7mOM-IArQ&s=19

    Quite right too BigG. It is an absolute and wicked disgrace. Either Starmer wasn't thinking straight or he gets off on seeing starving children.

    But don't be too smug. It was Osborne's brainchild.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,297
    Can I just make clear that while I like people to take some care over their appearance I do not think it Sus nothing

    Cyclefree said:

    Just heard Nick Read from the Post Office condemning Kevan Jones for criticising the Post Office Board's Brucie bonus.

    What is it with all these horrid Labour MPs called Jones beating up on Nick?

    He has a fucking nerve criticising anyone given his own behaviour.
    On a different matter, have you noticed that Sarah Jane Baker (of "punch TERFS in the face" fame) has now been charged with a public order offence and is in prison (man's prison) for breaching the terms of their licence? I recall you were quick to criticise the Mayor for an apparent lack of condemnation, and I think you assumed the Met would take no action. Anyway, the speech inciting to violence has indeed had consequences.
    Yes, I did notice. Good. The Mayor's response was weaselly. The Met took action because women's groups advised by lawyers wrote to them explaining the law and challenging their initial decision to do nothing.

    Quite why the Met officer at Charing X station who initially dismissed the complaints was so woefully ill-informed about the law is another matter.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
    Dear me. Cancer has been around for over 3 million years. And malaria. And scorpions. This "evolution is loverlee" nonsense was, we all hoped, knocked on the head by The Selfish Gene.
    Ah that accounts for it. You think Dawkins actually has all the answers. How quaint.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    felix said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Andy_JS said:

    felix said:

    I went shopping in Lorca today - medium size town on Murcia, inland 34 degrees typical July figures. Zero sign of anyone panicking or 'bracing' (Sky News) in the midst of the climate crisis! First sign though that there's a GE in 5 days. Lots of PP posters on the main roads. No sign of any others. Bizarre.

    Normal Spanish temperatures.
    If I thought you lived in Spain I would merely think you sounded like a complete dick. If as I strongly suspect you are English and have never been to Spain...
    Except he is correct.
    "Normal Spanish temperatures" because Santiago and Granada are much of a muchness?

    Let's let him answer for himself as to where in Spain at what time of year he has actually been?
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
    Dear me. Cancer has been around for over 3 million years. And malaria. And scorpions. This "evolution is loverlee" nonsense was, we all hoped, knocked on the head by The Selfish Gene.
    Ah that accounts for it. You think Dawkins actually has all the answers. How quaint.
    You advanced the argument that an ability evolved by trees is necessarily good for humans. It looks ridiculous when expressly stated like that, but that is the implication of your claim. So you really need to tell us why.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,295
    Scary thread.
    From a neo-con think tank, but worth a read:

    Why (and how) China is preparing for war.

    https://twitter.com/ianellisjones/status/1680620431668027393?s=46&t=L9g_woCIqbo1MTuBFCK0xg

  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,023
    The old Jewish Eastern Europe is exquisitely captured in Patrick Leigh Fermor’s pre-war travel books, in the movie Grand Budapest Hotel, and in the marvellous autobiographical novel Memoirs of an Anti-Semite, by Gregor von Rezzori (and his other works)

    https://www.dw.com/en/gregor-von-rezzori-memoirs-of-an-anti-semite/a-45087837

    Kafka is pretty good, as well


  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    edited July 2023
    Leon said:

    The old Jewish Eastern Europe is exquisitely captured in Patrick Leigh Fermor’s pre-war travel books, in the movie Grand Budapest Hotel, and in the marvellous autobiographical novel Memoirs of an Anti-Semite, by Gregor von Rezzori (and his other works)

    https://www.dw.com/en/gregor-von-rezzori-memoirs-of-an-anti-semite/a-45087837

    Kafka is pretty good, as well


    I would also strongly recommend the works of Stefan Zweig. Fabulous writer and you get a real sense of what was lost from his works. Sadly he and his wife committed suicide in Brazil in 1942 in despair at what had happened in Europe.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,382
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
    Dear me. Cancer has been around for over 3 million years. And malaria. And scorpions. This "evolution is loverlee" nonsense was, we all hoped, knocked on the head by The Selfish Gene.
    Ah that accounts for it. You think Dawkins actually has all the answers. How quaint.
    You advanced the argument that an ability evolved by trees is necessarily good for humans. It looks ridiculous when expressly stated like that, but that is the implication of your claim. So you really need to tell us why.
    Nope. That is you simply not understanding what I wrote. Or more likely just looking for an argument which seems to be your raison d'etre on here much of the time.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,023

    Leon said:

    The old Jewish Eastern Europe is exquisitely captured in Patrick Leigh Fermor’s pre-war travel books, in the movie Grand Budapest Hotel, and in the marvellous autobiographical novel Memoirs of an Anti-Semite, by Gregor von Rezzori (and his other works)

    https://www.dw.com/en/gregor-von-rezzori-memoirs-of-an-anti-semite/a-45087837

    Kafka is pretty good, as well


    I would also strogly recommend the works of Stefan Zweig. Fabulous writer and you get a real sense of what was lost from his works. Sadly he and his wife committed suicide in Brazil in 1942 in despair at what had happened in Europe.
    I’ve never read Zweig, I must

    Imagine what Europe might be now, if all those Jews had survived. All that incredible richness of culture, creativity and ambition

    Desolating, what was destroyed. Lying here in bed in Krakow i am half a mile from the ghetto
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,295
    Zweig stayed in Bath for a few months before decamping to Brazil.

    There’s a dusty plaque to him in a forgotten corner of the Mendips.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
    Dear me. Cancer has been around for over 3 million years. And malaria. And scorpions. This "evolution is loverlee" nonsense was, we all hoped, knocked on the head by The Selfish Gene.
    Ah that accounts for it. You think Dawkins actually has all the answers. How quaint.
    You advanced the argument that an ability evolved by trees is necessarily good for humans. It looks ridiculous when expressly stated like that, but that is the implication of your claim. So you really need to tell us why.
    Nope. That is you simply not understanding what I wrote. Or more likely just looking for an argument which seems to be your raison d'etre on here much of the time.
    "Looking for an argument" is surely what intellectual debate is about? If not, what is it about? And what is this website for?


    "Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then." is what you said. That's implicitly making a case that Nature is inherently good either A. Absolutely and/or B. With reference to human beings.

    So is it A or B? And why?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,295
    edited July 2023
    The Radetsky March by Joseph Roth is superb.

    People rave about The Man Without Qualities by Robert Musil, but I haven’t read it yet.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
    Dear me. Cancer has been around for over 3 million years. And malaria. And scorpions. This "evolution is loverlee" nonsense was, we all hoped, knocked on the head by The Selfish Gene.
    Ah that accounts for it. You think Dawkins actually has all the answers. How quaint.
    You advanced the argument that an ability evolved by trees is necessarily good for humans. It looks ridiculous when expressly stated like that, but that is the implication of your claim. So you really need to tell us why.
    Nope. That is you simply not understanding what I wrote. Or more likely just looking for an argument which seems to be your raison d'etre on here much of the time.
    "Looking for an argument" is surely what intellectual debate is about? If not, what is it about? And what is this website for?


    "Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then." is what you said. That's implicitly making a case that Nature is inherently good either A. Absolutely and/or B. With reference to human beings.

    So is it A or B? And why?
    Funny how if you leave it all to nature, green mould ends up covering the whole cheese.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Reforestation is amateur hour. Trees are the ridiculous result of a beggar-my-neighbour arms race and have nothing to offer over and above ground level vegetation. Except huggability.
    Not true. They also have a massive part to play in reducing temperatures at ground level. So much so that these days this is a basic part of town and city planning.
    Yes, sure, because by a spooky coincidence the arms race pays off in towns and cities where humans, for their own reasons, want ground level to be tarmac rather than a bog or a shrubbery. In countryside which is going to be countryside anyway, trees are pointless.
    Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then. :)
    Yes. You just said that they have a part to play in town and city planning. So which is it?
    Erm both. They are not mutually exclusive.
    If you look at frinstance elephant seals, you will find that an alpha male has a harem of approx 50 females, leaving fuck all for the other 49 males (ignoring the statistically negligible birth-rate differential between m and f). Which clearly sucks for elephant seals, and probably isn't great for the planet in general. So why do you think that what muvva nature dictates is a good thing? What specific benefit are you arguing for, for trees vs other forms of photosynthetic life?
    And yet Elephant seals have been around for over 3 million years so they must be doing something right.
    Dear me. Cancer has been around for over 3 million years. And malaria. And scorpions. This "evolution is loverlee" nonsense was, we all hoped, knocked on the head by The Selfish Gene.
    Ah that accounts for it. You think Dawkins actually has all the answers. How quaint.
    You advanced the argument that an ability evolved by trees is necessarily good for humans. It looks ridiculous when expressly stated like that, but that is the implication of your claim. So you really need to tell us why.
    Nope. That is you simply not understanding what I wrote. Or more likely just looking for an argument which seems to be your raison d'etre on here much of the time.
    "Looking for an argument" is surely what intellectual debate is about? If not, what is it about? And what is this website for?


    "Funny how, if you leave it all to nature, they end up covering the whole place then." is what you said. That's implicitly making a case that Nature is inherently good either A. Absolutely and/or B. With reference to human beings.

    So is it A or B? And why?
    Funny how if you leave it all to nature, green mould ends up covering the whole cheese.
    Funny how if you leave it all to nature, gangrene ends up covering the whole leg.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    The Radetsky March by Joseph Roth is superb.

    People rave about The Man Without Qualities by Robert Musil, but I haven’t read it yet.

    One of the signs of decay and decadence (also visa versa) of Austro-Hungarian Empire, was that they crassly copied their most famous anthem off of the "Lonely Goat Herd" song from "The Sound of Music'.

    Similar to how UKers are still belting out a knock-off of "My Country 'Tis of Thee" as YOUR national anthem.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    Zweig stayed in Bath for a few months before decamping to Brazil.

    There’s a dusty plaque to him in a forgotten corner of the Mendips.

    Why the heck didn't you dust it when you had the chance?

    BUT maybe the old boy would appreciate that the dust of Old Europe still lingers where he bid his farewell.

  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,003

    The Radetsky March by Joseph Roth is superb.

    People rave about The Man Without Qualities by Robert Musil, but I haven’t read it yet.

    One of the signs of decay and decadence (also visa versa) of Austro-Hungarian Empire, was that they crassly copied their most famous anthem off of the "Lonely Goat Herd" song from "The Sound of Music'.

    Similar to how UKers are still belting out a knock-off of "My Country 'Tis of Thee" as YOUR national anthem.
    Indeed. However since we had to adopt time travel in order to do so, I think we can be forgiven... :)
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,745
    New thread.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,509

    A

    Reforestation. Restoration of peat bogs. This is the sort of action we need to take CO2 from the atmosphere.

    Direct air capture. It's what plants do.

    I like this post so much that a mere 'like' is not enough
    Sadly, photosynthesis is rather inefficient.

    Carbon capture would need to be better.
    CCS has a lot of basic problems they are still trying to overcome. One of the most basic is the Joule–Thomson effect of rapid cooling as the CO2 expands as it enters to reservoir. This results in the formation of ice in the pore spaces which inhibits or prevents further injection.
    The capture bit has been sorted by us process bods. It's the bloody geologists who need to get their shit together with the storage.
    Don't blame us. It's the bloody physicists with their laws who are to blame :)
    Well then someone needs to put repealing of those laws in their manifesto ;)
This discussion has been closed.