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What if the Tories don’t hold any of Thursday’s by-elections? – politicalbetting.com

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  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    ydoethur said:

    Leon said:

    Krakow must be right up there in the top 20 most beautiful cities on the planet. I think I prefer it to Prague

    True story: I was last here 20 years ago for a wedding. A couple of days before the wedding we all went for a jaunt. On the way back to krakow from the salt mines we passed auschwitz and the minibus driver said “if anyone wants to see it, well, here it is”

    Despite the horror everyone wanted to see it, as they’d not seen it before, so they all piled off. I could hardly stay on the bus (“what, don’t you care??”) so I dutifully got off to “see Auschwitz”

    Thing is I’d specifically seen it about six months before. So I spent my time hiding behind a gas chamber, basically, in case one of the staff recognised me and said “what, you came back? Did you enjoy it that much? Perhaps you should get a season ticket?”

    I love Krakow. My favourite European city of the ones I’ve seen.

    Although to be fair I’ve seen Vienna but not Prague.
    Prague is stunning. But it’s now SO touristy. Almost as bad as Venice

    Both are global top 20 most-beautiful-city contenders. From the UK I’d definitely put Bath and Cambridge in there

    Very few cities outside Europe would make the list

    New York. Hong Kong. Errr….

    There are cities outside Europe with extraordinary locations but usually the architecture rather lets them down. Sydney. Cape Town. Etc

  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,733
    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,312

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
    He’s a Corbynite and shared a platform with Corbyn after his expulsion from Labour.

    He’s supported by Nadhim Zahawi.

    He has some pretty dodgy friends.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559

    Cyclefree said:

    Just heard Nick Read from the Post Office condemning Kevan Jones for criticising the Post Office Board's Brucie bonus.

    What is it with all these horrid Labour MPs called Jones beating up on Nick?

    He has a fucking nerve criticising anyone given his own behaviour.
    I saw him and McAulay get rinsed by Darren Jones in committee. Read clearly thought Darren Jones was arrogant and deserved contempt calling out someone so important as the CEO of the Post Office. Jones was critical of the time and motion tablet that postmen were using to feedback when they stood still. It seemed quite oppressive. Read explained it wasn't a time and motion exercise. Jones didn't believe him.

    Jones also questioned Read over SD priority over standard letters. He denied the programme despite compelling evidence to the contrary. Are you allowed to mislead a Parliamentary Committee?
    Appears to be mandatory for current HMG. (Is this required by Con-jobber by-laws or some such?)
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,081
    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    Not in this film I'm talking about. It's quietly unattractive in that.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,541
    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    There are!

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,319
    ...

    So I topped on the Tories winning Uxbridge.

    Laugh at me on Friday morning.

    A good shout. We have a man on the spot who has outlined some special circumstances.

    The only one I am confident Sunak will lose is Somerton and Frome.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,470
    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    I've visited the lowest trig pillar, at half a metre below sea level.

    https://trigbagging.co.uk/2019/07/22/little-ouse-tp4449/

    There's also the fen near Peterborough where two posts (from the Great Exhibition?) were driven down into the peat. As the fens were drained, the ground shrunk, and they are now very much above ground.

    https://www.greatfen.org.uk/about-great-fen/heritage/holme-fen-posts

    I love the Fens. They're not everyone's cup of tea, and I like a good hill as much as the next nutter, but there's something elemental about them. You can almost imagine coming across a Fen Tiger.

    I bet they're also the most man-altered landscape in Britain. Except perhaps the Norfolk Broads?
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,635
    edited July 2023
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Perhaps unexpectedly you CAN get those views in bits of coastal Essex. On the estuary of the River Blackwater say. At Osea

    Or here. The Anglo Saxon chapel of Cedd. Bradwell




    Skies that go on and on. Ruskin loved them

    Part of my local flatlands used to have no human construct visible once the winding gear on the nearest pit had been taken down.

    The big skies now contain 126 (at the last count) wind turbines.

    I guess that's roughly the right ratio for energy replacement...


    Not sure what the most boring road in the UK would be. Ermine Street (the A15) north of Lincoln is pretty straight but is on a ridgeline so occasionally you get a view beyond the hedge. The traffic is a bit nuts too so there's not much chance of a snooze.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,309

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Have driven across Lincolnshire (from north to south) and thought it was great.

    Great minds thinking un-alike. Vive la difference (in a manner of speaking)!
    I've driven from Lake Tahoe to Chicago. That was pretty dull. I think we only met three people on the way.

    It wasn't a meeting of minds.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    Not in this film I'm talking about. It's quietly unattractive in that.
    I know the film. It’s great

    But Matlock is really quite pleasant as Derbyshire towns go. It ain’t Barcelona but there are many worse places

    Some selective location usage, it seems
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,325
    edited July 2023
    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    Matlock Bath, where the Heights of Abraham are. A seaside town in all but location, and Matlock itself.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,637
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    I agree. I’ve done the drive from Alice to coober pedy to Oodnadatta. On and on and on

    It’s mesmerising, even lovely, in its own boring way

    Also dangerous. You don’t fall asleep so much as drift into a weird dream state. Where you can easily and rhapsodically drive off the road into a ghost gum

    And you gotta watch out for roos and camels

    Many years ago driving with family friends ahead of us on the way from San Diego to Phoenix this pretty much happened to them.

    Ran slowly off the road a few miles from Gila Bend, nearly hit a Porsche hire car broken down on the hard shoulder (with a German tourist standing behind the boot), bypassing the German and clipping the Porsche’s right rear and then rolling into a saguaro cactus.

    We arrived about a minute later to a scene of great confusion. Somewhat later still the local cop turned up complete with hat, tight fitting uniform and shades and addressed everyone as sir and ma’am.
    I believe roadmaking people in Australia and elsewhere are now encouraged to add pointless curves and bends just to keep drivers awake?

    A dead straight road for miles and miles is an invitation to have an accident, or do 190mph
    They should have learnt from their Anglo Saxon ancestors:

    Before the Roman came to Rye or out to Severn strode,
    The rolling English drunkard made the rolling English road.
    A reeling road, a rolling road, that rambles round the shire,
    And after him the parson ran, the sexton and the squire;
    A merry road, a mazy road, and such as we did tread
    The night we went to Birmingham by way of Beachy Head...
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,309
    edited July 2023

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    I've visited the lowest trig pillar, at half a metre below sea level.

    https://trigbagging.co.uk/2019/07/22/little-ouse-tp4449/

    There's also the fen near Peterborough where two posts (from the Great Exhibition?) were driven down into the peat. As the fens were drained, the ground shrunk, and they are now very much above ground.

    https://www.greatfen.org.uk/about-great-fen/heritage/holme-fen-posts

    I love the Fens. They're not everyone's cup of tea, and I like a good hill as much as the next nutter, but there's something elemental about them. You can almost imagine coming across a Fen Tiger.

    I bet they're also the most man-altered landscape in Britain. Except perhaps the Norfolk Broads?
    You have to admit those wide open landscapes give a wonderful light.

    Been spending a lot of time in North Norfolk recently. It's surprisngly hilly. Well i was surprised anyway.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,325
    ydoethur said:

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
    He’s a Corbynite and shared a platform with Corbyn after his expulsion from Labour.

    He’s supported by Nadhim Zahawi.

    He has some pretty dodgy friends.
    It was actually Ken Loach and it was some theatre event. Loach is a rarity. He spends time and money on the North East arts scene and has made three films there.

    ‘Sharing a platform’ is such an abused term as it implies standing in solidarity with them over their views and this was nothing of the sort.

    Nadim Zahawi commented to praise Driscoll during Covid for his non partisan approach to the matter.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,312
    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
    He’s a Corbynite and shared a platform with Corbyn after his expulsion from Labour.

    He’s supported by Nadhim Zahawi.

    He has some pretty dodgy friends.
    It was actually Ken Loach and it was some theatre event. Loach is a rarity. He spends time and money on the North East arts scene and has made three films there.

    ‘Sharing a platform’ is such an abused term as it implies standing in solidarity with them over their views and this was nothing of the sort.

    Nadim Zahawi commented to praise Driscoll during Covid for his non partisan approach to the matter.
    My mistake.

    Although to be fair anyone sharing a platform with Loach whether they support his views or not should probably be ruled out for lack of judgement.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,842
    Evening all :)

    There seems an emerging "concensus" (not based on very much to be honest) Labour will unconvincingly win Uxbridge, pull of a big win in Selby & Ainsty while the LDs enjoy a comfortable but unremarkable win in Somerton & Frome.

    The question for Conservatives, IF they decide to remove Sunak from the leadership (and I consider that highly unlikely) is who is the alternative and where is the evidence that alternative would be polling any better? I've seen no evidence a Conservative Party led by a Mordaunt, Braverman, Badenoch, Wallace or Tugendhat (to name but five) would be doing any better and therein lies the problem.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,492
    If Kemi Badenoch wasn't so full of shit, she'd be all over this.

    I gave birth to my second child with the tag on.”

    Sima Misra is still waiting to be compensated for being wrongfully sacked and sentenced to 15 months in prison 2 years on from the Post Office scandal.


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1681012865308688384
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,637
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Perhaps unexpectedly you CAN get those views in bits of coastal Essex. On the estuary of the River Blackwater say. At Osea

    Or here. The Anglo Saxon chapel of Cedd. Bradwell




    Skies that go on and on. Ruskin loved them

    Flatland churches continued:

    image
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,842
    We have so far dodged the heat here in our part of the planet - I'm slightly puzzled by the excitement re: the south western United States. Summer temperatures of 47c in Las Vegas and Palm Springs aren't unusual and happen most years - were those temperatures to spike to 50c or higher I'd be concerned.

    For those with air conditioning, it's tolerable but for those without it must be akin to purgatory.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    edited July 2023
    Talking of the A15 if anyone makes it to that bit of Lincolnshire they should go to Temple Bruer. Preferably on a cold dank winter’s afternoon as the light begins to die

    One of the most haunted and terrifying places in the UK

  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Perhaps unexpectedly you CAN get those views in bits of coastal Essex. On the estuary of the River Blackwater say. At Osea

    Or here. The Anglo Saxon chapel of Cedd. Bradwell




    Skies that go on and on. Ruskin loved them

    Flatland churches continued:

    image
    One of my favourite English churches. Romney Marsh if I’m not mistaken
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,325
    edited July 2023
    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
    He’s a Corbynite and shared a platform with Corbyn after his expulsion from Labour.

    He’s supported by Nadhim Zahawi.

    He has some pretty dodgy friends.
    It was actually Ken Loach and it was some theatre event. Loach is a rarity. He spends time and money on the North East arts scene and has made three films there.

    ‘Sharing a platform’ is such an abused term as it implies standing in solidarity with them over their views and this was nothing of the sort.

    Nadim Zahawi commented to praise Driscoll during Covid for his non partisan approach to the matter.
    My mistake.

    Although to be fair anyone sharing a platform with Loach whether they support his views or not should probably be ruled out for lack of judgement.
    Ken Loach has a wonderful portfolio of Film, plays and drama serials and has been making them for over fifty years. Should he be ignored or not have his work, or his contribution to North East film, celebrated due to internal Labour Party politics ?

    Perhaps Driscoll should just use lazy anti traveller tropes and all would be okay.

    I do not see why anyone should not discuss Loach’s work. It’s very very worthy of discussion and retrospectives in the same way Mike Leigh, Alan Bennett, Alan Clark and Jack Rosenthal are.

    I’ve got a copy of his ‘at the BBC boxset’, there are some cracking dramas on there. The Spongers is well worth watching. Especially implicit at the start being the royal family are the real spongers.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    stodge said:

    We have so far dodged the heat here in our part of the planet - I'm slightly puzzled by the excitement re: the south western United States. Summer temperatures of 47c in Las Vegas and Palm Springs aren't unusual and happen most years - were those temperatures to spike to 50c or higher I'd be concerned.

    For those with air conditioning, it's tolerable but for those without it must be akin to purgatory.

    One issue with current Southwest US heat wave, is the DURATION of super-hot days.

    Here in Seattle, in my humble abode (no a/c) there is a BIG difference from having a hot day, to having a series of hot days without cool-down.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,497
    Tobias Ellwood is now singing the praises of the Taliban’s government of Afghanistan.

    https://twitter.com/tobias_ellwood/status/1680974793867415554

    Hold your breath - but this is a country transformed.

    👉 security vastly improved
    👉 corruption reduced
    👉 opium trade ended

    Shouting from afar will not improve women’s rights.

    We need to re-engage.

    We need to re-open the British Embassy.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,755
    Off-topic - but I know a few people here enjoy European noir/politics drama's. I can recommend "Actor (Herec)" (available on CH4's "Walter Presents") - I'm about halfway through but really quite well done.

    From Wikipedia :

    Herec (English: Actor) is a Czech drama television series directed by Peter Bebjak. It is set in Czechoslovakia in the 1950s.

    The title role in the series, the young actor Stanislav Láník, is played by Jan Cina. Láník finds himself in a difficult situation: State Security takes advantage of his homosexuality and uses him as bait to compromise influential figures, in exchange for help with his acting career.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    This does look quite… startling



  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,761
    edited July 2023
    Not sure if this will come out OK. Supposed to be Alnmouth taken from a speeding LNER train last Thursday.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,755

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Perhaps unexpectedly you CAN get those views in bits of coastal Essex. On the estuary of the River Blackwater say. At Osea

    Or here. The Anglo Saxon chapel of Cedd. Bradwell




    Skies that go on and on. Ruskin loved them

    Flatland churches continued:

    image
    Jonathan Meades "Absentee Landlord" is worth a watch if you like your Churches.
  • MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,651

    Tobias Ellwood is now singing the praises of the Taliban’s government of Afghanistan.

    https://twitter.com/tobias_ellwood/status/1680974793867415554

    Hold your breath - but this is a country transformed.

    👉 security vastly improved
    👉 corruption reduced
    👉 opium trade ended

    Shouting from afar will not improve women’s rights.

    We need to re-engage.

    We need to re-open the British Embassy.

    God the Afghans should despise the west. How many deaths for nothing?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,554
    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    Note also that air temperature at Key West, Florida is now 92 degrees Fahrenheit. And sea temp = 90F.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034

    Tobias Ellwood is now singing the praises of the Taliban’s government of Afghanistan.

    https://twitter.com/tobias_ellwood/status/1680974793867415554

    Hold your breath - but this is a country transformed.

    👉 security vastly improved
    👉 corruption reduced
    👉 opium trade ended

    Shouting from afar will not improve women’s rights.

    We need to re-engage.

    We need to re-open the British Embassy.

    God the Afghans should despise the west. How many deaths for nothing?
    Why? It’s not like they are averse to slaughtering each other given half the chance
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,733
    Taz said:

    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    Matlock Bath, where the Heights of Abraham are. A seaside town in all but location, and Matlock itself.
    But both quite nice, and neither flat.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,325

    Not sure if this will come out OK. Supposed to be Alnmouth taken from a speeding LNER train last Thursday.

    Is the rolling stock now all the Hitachi made/assembled trains ?
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,772

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    I've visited the lowest trig pillar, at half a metre below sea level.

    https://trigbagging.co.uk/2019/07/22/little-ouse-tp4449/

    There's also the fen near Peterborough where two posts (from the Great Exhibition?) were driven down into the peat. As the fens were drained, the ground shrunk, and they are now very much above ground.

    https://www.greatfen.org.uk/about-great-fen/heritage/holme-fen-posts

    I love the Fens. They're not everyone's cup of tea, and I like a good hill as much as the next nutter, but there's something elemental about them. You can almost imagine coming across a Fen Tiger.

    I bet they're also the most man-altered landscape in Britain. Except perhaps the Norfolk Broads?
    You have to admit those wide open landscapes give a wonderful light.

    Been spending a lot of time in North Norfolk recently. It's surprisngly hilly. Well i was surprised anyway.
    I did a cycling holiday there. It's bloody mountainous.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,325
    Cookie said:

    Taz said:

    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    Matlock Bath, where the Heights of Abraham are. A seaside town in all but location, and Matlock itself.
    But both quite nice, and neither flat.
    Indeed, it is a nice cable car up to the Heights of Abraham.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,842
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    The SSTs in the Caribbean are also anomalously high and IF any hurricane got into the Gulf of Mexico it would be super charged. However, at the moment wind shear and Saharan dust is preventing any significant cyclonic formation but there are already indications what looked like a "super" El Nino isn't going to be as powerful as predicted which should lead to reduced wind shear by September which will in turn promote conditions more suitable for hurricane development.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,437
    eek said:

    In Northern News Jamie Driscoll (North of Tyne Mayor) has resigned from the Labour party and is now fundraising to run as an independent candidate.

    Now if I lived in the area I would be supporting him as the Labour candidate is dire and the Labour party completely shafted Jamie to avoid him being their candidate.

    Fat chance of that - he's useless
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278
    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,312
    edited July 2023
    .
    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
    He’s a Corbynite and shared a platform with Corbyn after his expulsion from Labour.

    He’s supported by Nadhim Zahawi.

    He has some pretty dodgy friends.
    It was actually Ken Loach and it was some theatre event. Loach is a rarity. He spends time and money on the North East arts scene and has made three films there.

    ‘Sharing a platform’ is such an abused term as it implies standing in solidarity with them over their views and this was nothing of the sort.

    Nadim Zahawi commented to praise Driscoll during Covid for his non partisan approach to the matter.
    My mistake.

    Although to be fair anyone sharing a platform with Loach whether they support his views or not should probably be ruled out for lack of judgement.
    Ken Loach has a wonderful portfolio of Film, plays and drama serials and has been making them for over fifty years. Should he be ignored or not have his work, or his contribution to North East film, celebrated due to internal Labour Party politics ?

    Perhaps Driscoll should just use lazy anti traveller tropes and all would be okay.

    I do not see why anyone should not discuss Loach’s work. It’s very very worthy of discussion and retrospectives in the same way Mike Leigh, Alan Bennett, Alan Clark and Jack Rosenthal are.

    I’ve got a copy of his ‘at the BBC boxset’, there are some cracking dramas on there. The Spongers is well worth watching. Especially implicit at the start being the royal family are the real spongers.
    Even before he claimed that Starmer was conducting a purge under the guise of rooting out anti-semites, he had shown some rather alarming tendencies. For which he was expelled from Labour.

    He wrote a play claiming Zionists collaborated with Hitler and has said Holocaust Denial is worthy of discussion. The latter may have been clumsy phrasing. But it was still a stupid thing to say.

    Does art trump dubious views? I don’t know. I appreciate we get on to questions about J K Rowling there. Or Wagner. But I would say it shows either a massive two fingers to the party leadership or very poor judgement indeed to share a platform with such a man, whatever his artistic merits. His dropping should not have come as a surprise.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,492
    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    Long may Lincolnshire remain reviled and unvisited. It is thrilling in every way, and in an odd corner of it Stamford is the finest smallish town in England. And it is full of odd small towns. And it is gigantic. It takes a lifetime to discover. Its fields are a standing rebuke to urban types who think agriculture is less important than financial services.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    If you don’t think AI is a threat you aren’t thinking
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,733
    Taz said:

    Cookie said:

    Taz said:

    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    Matlock Bath, where the Heights of Abraham are. A seaside town in all but location, and Matlock itself.
    But both quite nice, and neither flat.
    Indeed, it is a nice cable car up to the Heights of Abraham.
    Matlock Bath is a tad odd, though, no? Have you ever been to the aquarium-and-hologram museum? Or seen the boat parade? Even the heights of Abraham is one of England's odder tourist attractions. I've never not enjoyed myself at Matlock Bath. But it's peculiar.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,492

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,554
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    If you don’t think AI is a threat you aren’t thinking
    Of course it is a threat. Sooner or later it is going to exterminate us.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    If you don’t think AI is a threat you aren’t thinking
    Of course it is a threat. Sooner or later it is going to exterminate us.
    Surely that is the daleks?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,492
    Millions of US military emails have been misdirected to Mali through a “typo leak” that has exposed highly sensitive information, including diplomatic documents, tax returns, passwords and the travel details of top officers.

    Despite repeated warnings over a decade, a steady flow of email traffic continues to the .ML domain, the country identifier for Mali, as a result of people mistyping .MIL, the suffix to all US military email addresses.

    The problem was first identified almost a decade ago by Johannes Zuurbier, a Dutch internet entrepreneur who has a contract to manage Mali’s country domain.

    Zuurbier has been collecting misdirected emails since January in an effort to persuade the US to take the issue seriously. He holds close to 117,000 misdirected messages — almost 1,000 arrived on Wednesday alone. In a letter he sent to the US in early July, Zuurbier wrote: “This risk is real and could be exploited by adversaries of the US.”


    https://www.ft.com/content/ab62af67-ed2a-42d0-87eb-c762ac163cf0
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    Increasingly, I do sort of look at the news about the extreme temperatures and feel some relief I don't have children. Who knows what the hell things are going to look like in 20 years, say.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    On a more cheerful note, the Main Square of Old Krakow is absolutely magnificent. I had forgotten exactly how magnificent it is

    Surely one of the two most beautiful town squares in the world. Only St Mark’s in Venice can match it. Hard to decide on a winner




  • MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,651
    Leon said:

    Tobias Ellwood is now singing the praises of the Taliban’s government of Afghanistan.

    https://twitter.com/tobias_ellwood/status/1680974793867415554

    Hold your breath - but this is a country transformed.

    👉 security vastly improved
    👉 corruption reduced
    👉 opium trade ended

    Shouting from afar will not improve women’s rights.

    We need to re-engage.

    We need to re-open the British Embassy.

    God the Afghans should despise the west. How many deaths for nothing?
    Why? It’s not like they are averse to slaughtering each other given half the chance
    What did we achieve for the trillions spent? Their situation is no different from 2001 and we'd have all been better of if the Americans had just air dropped the cash over the hills.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278
    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,312
    Leon said:

    On a more cheerful note, the Main Square of Old Krakow is absolutely magnificent. I had forgotten exactly how magnificent it is

    Surely one of the two most beautiful town squares in the world. Only St Mark’s in Venice can match it. Hard to decide on a winner




    I love that market too. Hope it’s still open.

    I once saw the most beautiful chess set, hand carved, there. And I could have afforded it. But - I was on hand luggage only and couldn’t fit it in my bag so I had to sadly leave it there.

  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034

    Leon said:

    Tobias Ellwood is now singing the praises of the Taliban’s government of Afghanistan.

    https://twitter.com/tobias_ellwood/status/1680974793867415554

    Hold your breath - but this is a country transformed.

    👉 security vastly improved
    👉 corruption reduced
    👉 opium trade ended

    Shouting from afar will not improve women’s rights.

    We need to re-engage.

    We need to re-open the British Embassy.

    God the Afghans should despise the west. How many deaths for nothing?
    Why? It’s not like they are averse to slaughtering each other given half the chance
    What did we achieve for the trillions spent? Their situation is no different from 2001 and we'd have all been better of if the Americans had just air dropped the cash over the hills.
    I don’t disagree. It was a tragic error by the west

    I’m just pointing out that the Afghans are as brutally violent to each other - famously so - as any invading empire
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,342

    If Kemi Badenoch wasn't so full of shit, she'd be all over this.

    I gave birth to my second child with the tag on.”

    Sima Misra is still waiting to be compensated for being wrongfully sacked and sentenced to 15 months in prison 2 years on from the Post Office scandal.


    https://twitter.com/TimesRadio/status/1681012865308688384

    She is the encyclopaedia entry for 'disappointment' - no surprise to those of us who suspected her leadership run was orchestrated by Sunak and Gove to ensure he ended up facing Truss. Which of course still didn't help.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,325
    Cookie said:

    Taz said:

    Cookie said:

    Taz said:

    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    Matlock Bath, where the Heights of Abraham are. A seaside town in all but location, and Matlock itself.
    But both quite nice, and neither flat.
    Indeed, it is a nice cable car up to the Heights of Abraham.
    Matlock Bath is a tad odd, though, no? Have you ever been to the aquarium-and-hologram museum? Or seen the boat parade? Even the heights of Abraham is one of England's odder tourist attractions. I've never not enjoyed myself at Matlock Bath. But it's peculiar.
    Yes Matlock Bath is odd, I’ve not seen either of those attractions but the shops are like going back in time. Also it’s like a seaside resort in the middle of the country. I’ve been twice, when we stayed in Belper, and enjoyed it both times. Heights of Abraham has some nice views and an old mine they take you through. Not much else. A walk along the river is nice and wherever you drive around there the views are splendid. It’s a lovely part of the country.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,034
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    If you don’t think AI is a threat you aren’t thinking
    Of course it is a threat. Sooner or later it is going to exterminate us.
    Paradoxically AI might be the one thing that can save us from climate disaster. I fear it is a problem beyond the wit of man to solve. But maybe not beyond the capabilities of a robot mega brain

    I’m quite serious
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,497

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    If it really is an existential issue, then shouldn't we be forcibly deindustrialising the world using our military? A bit like a modern version of using the British Navy to stop the slave trade.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,191

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    Yup. Whatever badness is already baked in, there's still a choice about how much badness to put on top of that.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,554
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    If you don’t think AI is a threat you aren’t thinking
    Of course it is a threat. Sooner or later it is going to exterminate us.
    Paradoxically AI might be the one thing that can save us from climate disaster. I fear it is a problem beyond the wit of man to solve. But maybe not beyond the capabilities of a robot mega brain

    I’m quite serious
    Why not both? Solve climate change by exterminating humanity? Simples.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,967


    Redfield & Wilton Strategies

    Labour leads by 17%.

    Westminster VI (16 July):

    Labour 44% (-4)
    Conservative 27% (–)
    Liberal Democrat 13% (+2)
    Reform UK 8% (+3)
    Green 4% (–)
    Scottish National Party 3% (–)
    Other 1% (–)

    Changes +/- 9 July

    LibDem surge! LibDem most seats value at 150/1! BUY! BUY! BUY!
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,005
    kjh said:

    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Well, I guess this will do for a quick sharpener




    That's bigger than @IanB2 's dog !
    Yes. It’s at a weird angle. This is more realistic. I’ll stop with the beer photos now in case @viewcode has conniptions




    That view must be one of the great urban views of Europe, come to think of it. The loveliest square in one of Europe’s loveliest cities. Ergo one of the finest urban views in the world
    It would have been considerably better if it had been in focus, but to do that would require you moving five foot forward and removing your table, your beer, and yourself from the photo. Choices.
    Sorry @viewcode I like the picture. The beer sets it off. It says to me, 'I want to be there'. I know, I have no taste.
    It's OK. I'm cursed to be right when everybody else is wrong. I shall bear my rightness with honor. Still I have the silent majority on my side.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,325
    edited July 2023
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    If you don’t think AI is a threat you aren’t thinking
    Technology is the third global superpower according to Ian Bremmer and his TedTalk. Worth a Watch.

    It’s a massive threat, but also an opportunity.
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 5,873
    edited July 2023
    Any British person who calls The Open the British Open is a bit of a dick
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    Leon said:

    Talking of the A15 if anyone makes it to that bit of Lincolnshire they should go to Temple Bruer. Preferably on a cold dank winter’s afternoon as the light begins to die

    One of the most haunted and terrifying places in the UK

    Why? From Googling it looks like a tower in the middle of a farmyard.

    I'm loving these list of hauntingly beautiful locations to visit. I don't have time to do it now but thinking of compiling a list!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,761
    Taz said:

    Not sure if this will come out OK. Supposed to be Alnmouth taken from a speeding LNER train last Thursday.

    Is the rolling stock now all the Hitachi made/assembled trains ?
    Not quite, they still have a few Mark 4 trains (Class 91 locos etc.), some even painted in a kind of retro "Inter-City" livery. My trains to Edinburgh and back were both Hitachi Azumas.
  • DumbosaurusDumbosaurus Posts: 792
    Am with those saying that Selby feels like Tory value right now.

    A value loser probably, but value nonetheless. I'm working the market slowly but surely.

    Damn shame the market's so thin (all the money is going on Labour where there is plenty more, but you lose opportunity to work out of line offers that way).
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,342
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    This does look quite… startling



    At last we have you interested in a real, albeit insidious, threat to human existence.

    One that requires uncomfortable actions.
    If you don’t think AI is a threat you aren’t thinking
    Of course it is a threat. Sooner or later it is going to exterminate us.
    Paradoxically AI might be the one thing that can save us from climate disaster. I fear it is a problem beyond the wit of man to solve. But maybe not beyond the capabilities of a robot mega brain

    I’m quite serious
    Personally I believe a lot of the corporate and governmental panic about AI is the concern that it may gain the ability to show a great many of their core messages to be utterly without foundation.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,005
    edited July 2023
    carnforth said:

    Leon said:

    I recall Matlock being quietly attractive in a gritty hilly Peak District kinda way

    The opposite of flat fenland bleakness

    Perhaps there are two Matlocks?

    There are!

    Three:

    Matlock TV Series 2023–present [trailer]

  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,967
    HYUFD said:

    On most current polls and expectations the Tories will lose all 3 by elections on Thursday. So if they hold just one that will boost Sunak before the summer recess.

    Starmer by contrast will need to win at least one of Selby or Uxbridge or Labour MPs will wonder why poll leads don't translate to ballot box success. The LDs I assume will win Somerton and Frome which will give Sir Ed Davey an enjoyable summer holiday

    We, political pundits and people in Westminster will be impressed if the Conservatives win 1 in 3. The general public will see 2 in 3 losses and be less impressed. Losing is losing.
  • DumbosaurusDumbosaurus Posts: 792

    Taz said:

    Not sure if this will come out OK. Supposed to be Alnmouth taken from a speeding LNER train last Thursday.

    Is the rolling stock now all the Hitachi made/assembled trains ?
    Not quite, they still have a few Mark 4 trains (Class 91 locos etc.), some even painted in a kind of retro "Inter-City" livery. My trains to Edinburgh and back were both Hitachi Azumas.
    The 91s are only working Leeds/York now I think sadly.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    If it really is an existential issue, then shouldn't we be forcibly deindustrialising the world using our military? A bit like a modern version of using the British Navy to stop the slave trade.
    Trouble is we can't just switch-off the lights as millions and millions (billions?) would die from regression to a pre-industrial society and you'd have mass social disorder and anarchy. Even worse.

    Mass expansion of proven nuclear, wind and solar over the next 15-20 years- worldwide- should be an immediate goal and funded accordingly.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    We have been cool and wet for the last month, catching up much of the shortfall of an exceptionally dry spring. Most the tracks around here have more muddy puddles now than they did in April.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,754

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    I've visited the lowest trig pillar, at half a metre below sea level.

    https://trigbagging.co.uk/2019/07/22/little-ouse-tp4449/

    There's also the fen near Peterborough where two posts (from the Great Exhibition?) were driven down into the peat. As the fens were drained, the ground shrunk, and they are now very much above ground.

    https://www.greatfen.org.uk/about-great-fen/heritage/holme-fen-posts

    I love the Fens. They're not everyone's cup of tea, and I like a good hill as much as the next nutter, but there's something elemental about them. You can almost imagine coming across a Fen Tiger.

    I bet they're also the most man-altered landscape in Britain. Except perhaps the Norfolk Broads?
    I find that part of England really bleak and depressing. With no hills it feels like you're living in two dimensions. And so much wind and rain. Plus it reminds me of being at university, much of which I didn't enjoy. Brings back that sinking feeling in my stomach waiting to change trains at Peterbrough after coming south.
    On the other hand, Lincolnshire is home to my favourite piece of road signage, on the A1, giving directions to the Honeypot Lane Industrial Estate.
  • MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,651
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Tobias Ellwood is now singing the praises of the Taliban’s government of Afghanistan.

    https://twitter.com/tobias_ellwood/status/1680974793867415554

    Hold your breath - but this is a country transformed.

    👉 security vastly improved
    👉 corruption reduced
    👉 opium trade ended

    Shouting from afar will not improve women’s rights.

    We need to re-engage.

    We need to re-open the British Embassy.

    God the Afghans should despise the west. How many deaths for nothing?
    Why? It’s not like they are averse to slaughtering each other given half the chance
    What did we achieve for the trillions spent? Their situation is no different from 2001 and we'd have all been better of if the Americans had just air dropped the cash over the hills.
    I don’t disagree. It was a tragic error by the west

    I’m just pointing out that the Afghans are as brutally violent to each other - famously so - as any invading empire
    This might come of a little Kipling-like but... Weren't we supposed to be better, enlightenment values and all? Why did we do that damn silly thing in such a damn silly way?
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,733
    ydoethur said:

    .

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
    He’s a Corbynite and shared a platform with Corbyn after his expulsion from Labour.

    He’s supported by Nadhim Zahawi.

    He has some pretty dodgy friends.
    It was actually Ken Loach and it was some theatre event. Loach is a rarity. He spends time and money on the North East arts scene and has made three films there.

    ‘Sharing a platform’ is such an abused term as it implies standing in solidarity with them over their views and this was nothing of the sort.

    Nadim Zahawi commented to praise Driscoll during Covid for his non partisan approach to the matter.
    My mistake.

    Although to be fair anyone sharing a platform with Loach whether they support his views or not should probably be ruled out for lack of judgement.
    Ken Loach has a wonderful portfolio of Film, plays and drama serials and has been making them for over fifty years. Should he be ignored or not have his work, or his contribution to North East film, celebrated due to internal Labour Party politics ?

    Perhaps Driscoll should just use lazy anti traveller tropes and all would be okay.

    I do not see why anyone should not discuss Loach’s work. It’s very very worthy of discussion and retrospectives in the same way Mike Leigh, Alan Bennett, Alan Clark and Jack Rosenthal are.

    I’ve got a copy of his ‘at the BBC boxset’, there are some cracking dramas on there. The Spongers is well worth watching. Especially implicit at the start being the royal family are the real spongers.
    Even before he claimed that Starmer was conducting a purge under the guise of rooting out anti-semites, he had shown some rather alarming tendencies. For which he was expelled from Labour.

    He wrote a play claiming Zionists collaborated with Hitler and has said Holocaust Denial is worthy of discussion. The latter may have been clumsy phrasing. But it was still a stupid thing to say.

    Does art trump dubious views? I don’t know. I appreciate we get on to questions about J K Rowling there. Or Wagner. But I would say it shows either a massive two fingers to the party leadership or very poor judgement indeed to share a platform with such a man, whatever his artistic merits. His dropping should not have come as a surprise.
    I think it a tad unfair to collate Rowling with Loach. Rowling's views are pretty mainstream, albeit a tad heavy on the feminism. Loach inhabits a strange rabbit hole most of the country would find quite dusturbing.
    Don't know about Wagner. Possibly his views were entirely mainstream for his day?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,958
    edited July 2023

    Any British person who calls The Open the British Open is a bit of a dick

    I thought we did this a few days ago

    In the UK it is known as the Open but in US and elsewhere it is the British Ooen hence why ticket sales are marketed worldwide in the name of the British Open

    Mind you it is only pedantry anyway

    https://www.viagogo.co.uk/Sports-Tickets/Golf/British-Open-Tickets
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    Yup. Whatever badness is already baked in, there's still a choice about how much badness to put on top of that.
    And, I think we'll basically have to engineer it out the atmosphere by mass CCUS/direct air capture.

    That's probably more realistic than ending absolutely all emissions in all their forms.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,761


    Redfield & Wilton Strategies

    Labour leads by 17%.

    Westminster VI (16 July):

    Labour 44% (-4)
    Conservative 27% (–)
    Liberal Democrat 13% (+2)
    Reform UK 8% (+3)
    Green 4% (–)
    Scottish National Party 3% (–)
    Other 1% (–)

    Changes +/- 9 July

    Broken, sleazy Labour on the slide??

  • Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    I've visited the lowest trig pillar, at half a metre below sea level.

    https://trigbagging.co.uk/2019/07/22/little-ouse-tp4449/

    There's also the fen near Peterborough where two posts (from the Great Exhibition?) were driven down into the peat. As the fens were drained, the ground shrunk, and they are now very much above ground.

    https://www.greatfen.org.uk/about-great-fen/heritage/holme-fen-posts

    I love the Fens. They're not everyone's cup of tea, and I like a good hill as much as the next nutter, but there's something elemental about them. You can almost imagine coming across a Fen Tiger.

    I bet they're also the most man-altered landscape in Britain. Except perhaps the Norfolk Broads?
    I find that part of England really bleak and depressing. With no hills it feels like you're living in two dimensions. And so much wind and rain. Plus it reminds me of being at university, much of which I didn't enjoy. Brings back that sinking feeling in my stomach waiting to change trains at Peterbrough after coming south.
    On the other hand, Lincolnshire is home to my favourite piece of road signage, on the A1, giving directions to the Honeypot Lane Industrial Estate.
    "Plus it reminds me of being at university, much of which I didn't enjoy. "

    Going to Cambridge will do that for you.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,492
    stodge said:

    Evening all :)

    There seems an emerging "concensus" (not based on very much to be honest) Labour will unconvincingly win Uxbridge, pull of a big win in Selby & Ainsty while the LDs enjoy a comfortable but unremarkable win in Somerton & Frome.

    The question for Conservatives, IF they decide to remove Sunak from the leadership (and I consider that highly unlikely) is who is the alternative and where is the evidence that alternative would be polling any better? I've seen no evidence a Conservative Party led by a Mordaunt, Braverman, Badenoch, Wallace or Tugendhat (to name but five) would be doing any better and therein lies the problem.

    There won't be a change this side of a GE, as those who calculate will decide it is better to be the next leader after the loss, not before. It isn't long to wait.

    For the question of who comes next, this cannot be parted from the question of what comes next. I have literally absolutely no idea what are the core principles of Conservatism which fulfil these categories: they must be simple, consistent, deliverable, electable and possible to communicate.

    There is another thing they must do, even more important. They must be clearly distinguishable from: extreme right, social democracy, the left generally (of course) and so on - ir all the other parties.

    At the moment each major party (outside of independence this includes the SNP) operates in a narrow frame of situational pragmatism emerging as high spending social democracy and at the same time not convincingly or competently delivered.

    A Tory leader who can do this has a chance of ending up running the country. I am not voting for them until I know who they are and what they stand for.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,342

    Any British person who calls The Open the British Open is a bit of a dick

    I thought we did this a few days ago

    In the UK it is known as the Open but in US and elsewhere it is the British Ooen hence why ticket sales are marketed worldwide in the name of the British Open

    Mind you it is only pedantry anyway

    https://www.viagogo.co.uk/Sports-Tickets/Golf/British-Open-Tickets
    Joan Collins was once uncharitably known as 'The British Open' in Hollywood.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,637
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Perhaps unexpectedly you CAN get those views in bits of coastal Essex. On the estuary of the River Blackwater say. At Osea

    Or here. The Anglo Saxon chapel of Cedd. Bradwell




    Skies that go on and on. Ruskin loved them

    Flatland churches continued:

    image
    One of my favourite English churches. Romney Marsh if I’m not mistaken
    It is indeed. St Thomas Becket Church, Fairfield. Set in a small field surrounded by dykes, which I used to fish as a teenager. Beautiful church, beautiful setting.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,312
    Cookie said:

    ydoethur said:

    .

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Taz said:

    ydoethur said:

    Onto the Jamie Driscoll thing again, the "ha, he's just raised £25k" thing is exactly like "ha, Jeremy has just raised £gazillions to defend him from libel". Fools and their money are easily parted.

    Driscoll is losing his job and is unhappy about it. I understand that. But this is politics - losing comes with the job. Some battles are internal - he is hardly the first politician to be deselected by his own party.

    Question is why he and his are so bereft of friends and allies. Forging those across a spectrum of colleagues is also a key part of politics.

    Why was Driscoll barred from Labour candidate selection (according to his wiki page)?
    He’s a Corbynite and shared a platform with Corbyn after his expulsion from Labour.

    He’s supported by Nadhim Zahawi.

    He has some pretty dodgy friends.
    It was actually Ken Loach and it was some theatre event. Loach is a rarity. He spends time and money on the North East arts scene and has made three films there.

    ‘Sharing a platform’ is such an abused term as it implies standing in solidarity with them over their views and this was nothing of the sort.

    Nadim Zahawi commented to praise Driscoll during Covid for his non partisan approach to the matter.
    My mistake.

    Although to be fair anyone sharing a platform with Loach whether they support his views or not should probably be ruled out for lack of judgement.
    Ken Loach has a wonderful portfolio of Film, plays and drama serials and has been making them for over fifty years. Should he be ignored or not have his work, or his contribution to North East film, celebrated due to internal Labour Party politics ?

    Perhaps Driscoll should just use lazy anti traveller tropes and all would be okay.

    I do not see why anyone should not discuss Loach’s work. It’s very very worthy of discussion and retrospectives in the same way Mike Leigh, Alan Bennett, Alan Clark and Jack Rosenthal are.

    I’ve got a copy of his ‘at the BBC boxset’, there are some cracking dramas on there. The Spongers is well worth watching. Especially implicit at the start being the royal family are the real spongers.
    Even before he claimed that Starmer was conducting a purge under the guise of rooting out anti-semites, he had shown some rather alarming tendencies. For which he was expelled from Labour.

    He wrote a play claiming Zionists collaborated with Hitler and has said Holocaust Denial is worthy of discussion. The latter may have been clumsy phrasing. But it was still a stupid thing to say.

    Does art trump dubious views? I don’t know. I appreciate we get on to questions about J K Rowling there. Or Wagner. But I would say it shows either a massive two fingers to the party leadership or very poor judgement indeed to share a platform with such a man, whatever his artistic merits. His dropping should not have come as a surprise.
    I think it a tad unfair to collate Rowling with Loach. Rowling's views are pretty mainstream, albeit a tad heavy on the feminism. Loach inhabits a strange rabbit hole most of the country would find quite dusturbing.
    Don't know about Wagner. Possibly his views were entirely mainstream for his day?
    That was my point!
  • Am with those saying that Selby feels like Tory value right now.

    A value loser probably, but value nonetheless. I'm working the market slowly but surely.

    Damn shame the market's so thin (all the money is going on Labour where there is plenty more, but you lose opportunity to work out of line offers that way).

    There was a piece by Toilet Maguire in the New Statesman saying that the feedback from the doorsteps to Labour canvassers was that the Labour candidate looks as though he should still be at school. A small thing perhaps but you could see that being a potential vote-turner. Agree Tories might be the value candidate.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,754

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    I've visited the lowest trig pillar, at half a metre below sea level.

    https://trigbagging.co.uk/2019/07/22/little-ouse-tp4449/

    There's also the fen near Peterborough where two posts (from the Great Exhibition?) were driven down into the peat. As the fens were drained, the ground shrunk, and they are now very much above ground.

    https://www.greatfen.org.uk/about-great-fen/heritage/holme-fen-posts

    I love the Fens. They're not everyone's cup of tea, and I like a good hill as much as the next nutter, but there's something elemental about them. You can almost imagine coming across a Fen Tiger.

    I bet they're also the most man-altered landscape in Britain. Except perhaps the Norfolk Broads?
    I find that part of England really bleak and depressing. With no hills it feels like you're living in two dimensions. And so much wind and rain. Plus it reminds me of being at university, much of which I didn't enjoy. Brings back that sinking feeling in my stomach waiting to change trains at Peterbrough after coming south.
    On the other hand, Lincolnshire is home to my favourite piece of road signage, on the A1, giving directions to the Honeypot Lane Industrial Estate.
    "Plus it reminds me of being at university, much of which I didn't enjoy. "

    Going to Cambridge will do that for you.
    Yes.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278
    DavidL said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    We have been cool and wet for the last month, catching up much of the shortfall of an exceptionally dry spring. Most the tracks around here have more muddy puddles now than they did in April.
    And?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 62,958
    It's quite amusing to see Angela Rayner tie herself up in knots

    https://twitter.com/elenicourea/status/1680995993075044357?t=3ttoXgs8VZvuCIC_R50OTA&s=19
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,492

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    Yes. All these sentiments are true. But the rapid decrease in CO2 output isn't going to occur. Even when you do (halve it for example) it is like inflation, it's still happening but slower. The end is the same. Understandably people are massively exaggerating the amount which can and will be done to avert the CO2 increase. Unless there is a global level scale up, very rapidly, of carbon capture from the air. Most people seem to think this also is not deliverable.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,342

    It's quite amusing to see Angela Rayner tie herself up in knots

    https://twitter.com/elenicourea/status/1680995993075044357?t=3ttoXgs8VZvuCIC_R50OTA&s=19

    I am not sure where I stand on this policy. I will say that 'Sir Kid Starver' is quite a clever nickname though.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,048

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    Yup. Whatever badness is already baked in, there's still a choice about how much badness to put on top of that.
    And, I think we'll basically have to engineer it out the atmosphere by mass CCUS/direct air capture.

    That's probably more realistic than ending absolutely all emissions in all their forms.
    Global emissions are 37 Billion tons of CO2 per year.

    You can do direct capture from the atmosphere, right now, for $150 per ton

    5.5 Trillion dollars is about 6% of world GDP, give or take.

    One company is looking at a process that gets it down to $20 per ton.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,342

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    Yup. Whatever badness is already baked in, there's still a choice about how much badness to put on top of that.
    And, I think we'll basically have to engineer it out the atmosphere by mass CCUS/direct air capture.

    That's probably more realistic than ending absolutely all emissions in all their forms.
    Global emissions are 37 Billion tons of CO2 per year.

    You can do direct capture from the atmosphere, right now, for $150 per ton

    5.5 Trillion dollars is about 6% of world GDP, give or take.

    One company is looking at a process that gets it down to $20 per ton.
    Do they fire it into space?

    It seems a bit concerning.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755

    It's quite amusing to see Angela Rayner tie herself up in knots

    https://twitter.com/elenicourea/status/1680995993075044357?t=3ttoXgs8VZvuCIC_R50OTA&s=19

    If the Tories had not made such an F****** mess of nearly everything this lot would have been so beatable. SKS is smart but his team is bordering on pitiful.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,470

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    The Polish countryside is REALLY dull. It’s a whole load of nothing. Apart from various sites of appalling atrocity and genocide

    It’s like you’re driving through the most boring part of Lincolnshire and it’s nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-oh-two-million-people-were-murdered-there-nothing-nothing-nothing-nothing-look-there’s-a-place that sells biscuits nothing nothing nothing nothing-nothing-SITE-OF-SATANIC-EVIL-nothing-nothing-Skegness

    I may need a beer after this 19 hour train journey

    Being perpetually bored is so . . . boring.
    The relentnessless of large open spaces is a scenery of its own. I have felt that driving inland between Victoria and Queens land, with a stop in an Aussie dairy every couple of hours to break the monotony of dessicated gum trees. It's an acquired taste, but beautiful.
    Had roughly similar experience many years ago, taking the Great Northern railroad line (now part of BNSF) across the northern Great Plains of USA. Took full day and then some from Glacier National Park to Minneapolis.

    Distinctly remember when the train was briefly stopped at Havre, Montana. Was looking out the window, and there was a real-live cowboy, or close enough, likely a rancher. I gave him a wave . . . and he tipped his Stetson.
    The sort of flat landscape you get in the north European plain, or Lincolnshire for that matter, is different and worse than anything in the prairies or the steppe.

    It’s cluttered flatness. There are buildings, road signage, rows of trees, electricity pylons all preventing any really long distance views. So you don’t really get the big sky effect or the sense of emptiness.
    Yes, I get that. There is a bleakness to the Fens when I drive east to Norfolk. Not least the weird sex shop in a lay-by near Thorney Toll. The sort of place that serial killers shop, I suppose.

    I rather like the Fens. They feel weird and other wordly. I like that you can scramble up a drainage ditch and be the highest person for miles around. But I only pass through them once every few years. Maybe I'd feel differently if I passed through them regularly.
    I bought my favourite ever pair of trousers on Boston market in February 1994.
    I've visited the lowest trig pillar, at half a metre below sea level.

    https://trigbagging.co.uk/2019/07/22/little-ouse-tp4449/

    There's also the fen near Peterborough where two posts (from the Great Exhibition?) were driven down into the peat. As the fens were drained, the ground shrunk, and they are now very much above ground.

    https://www.greatfen.org.uk/about-great-fen/heritage/holme-fen-posts

    I love the Fens. They're not everyone's cup of tea, and I like a good hill as much as the next nutter, but there's something elemental about them. You can almost imagine coming across a Fen Tiger.

    I bet they're also the most man-altered landscape in Britain. Except perhaps the Norfolk Broads?
    I find that part of England really bleak and depressing. With no hills it feels like you're living in two dimensions. And so much wind and rain. Plus it reminds me of being at university, much of which I didn't enjoy. Brings back that sinking feeling in my stomach waiting to change trains at Peterbrough after coming south.
    On the other hand, Lincolnshire is home to my favourite piece of road signage, on the A1, giving directions to the Honeypot Lane Industrial Estate.
    Each to their own. :)
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,492
    edited July 2023

    Am with those saying that Selby feels like Tory value right now.

    A value loser probably, but value nonetheless. I'm working the market slowly but surely.

    Damn shame the market's so thin (all the money is going on Labour where there is plenty more, but you lose opportunity to work out of line offers that way).

    Agree. Modest toe dipped in the water for Tory to hold Selby. My imagination suggests that the constituency has about 20,000 Geoffrey Boycotts among the voters. And Selby is a place that has more gunsmiths than knit your own muesli shops. (And the abbey is a must visit by the way. All the more splendid for its quotidien setting).
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278
    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    The future may be uncertain to us, but it is already baked in. CO2 emissions are not stoppable now or in the next few years.
    No, but we can stop increasing them and accelerating the transition.
    Yes. All these sentiments are true. But the rapid decrease in CO2 output isn't going to occur. Even when you do (halve it for example) it is like inflation, it's still happening but slower. The end is the same. Understandably people are massively exaggerating the amount which can and will be done to avert the CO2 increase. Unless there is a global level scale up, very rapidly, of carbon capture from the air. Most people seem to think this also is not deliverable.
    I don't share your pessimism. The UK has already cut its CO2 emissions massively from 1990 levels and is on course to achieve net zero in energy generation and transmission within the next 20 years.

    That should absolutely be the ambition for all other nations and would make a significant difference. A global level scale up is exactly what I'm asking for, and of CCUS.

    Don't forget also how the price of PV cells and wind turbines has collapsed over the last 10 years: technology and its economics can shift the dial very quickly.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755

    DavidL said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    We have been cool and wet for the last month, catching up much of the shortfall of an exceptionally dry spring. Most the tracks around here have more muddy puddles now than they did in April.
    And?
    It is important to remember that weather is local and climate is international. I am not suggesting for a moment that the world is not heating up but local records can be misleading.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The only positive I can see from the insane weather this month (which, let's not forget, is happening at 1.2C) is that it might drive some more immediate sense into energy generation policy.

    Like, no more coal. Like, NOW.

    We have been cool and wet for the last month, catching up much of the shortfall of an exceptionally dry spring. Most the tracks around here have more muddy puddles now than they did in April.
    And?
    It is important to remember that weather is local and climate is international. I am not suggesting for a moment that the world is not heating up but local records can be misleading.
    OK, but that's a non sequitur.

    I wasn't referring to local British records in the last few weeks. And don't forget the crazy June we just had and how mad the elevated North Sea temperatures were.
This discussion has been closed.