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July 20th – the worst by-election day for the Tories ever? – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,796
edited July 2023 in General
imageJuly 20th – the worst by-election day for the Tories ever? – politicalbetting.com

In Somerton and Froome the party is defending a general election margin of 29.6% while In Selby the Tory general election margin was 35.7%. Even in Johnson’s old seat of Uxbridge the general election majority was over 15%.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    Yes
  • Options
    MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Hawkwind
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,671

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:



    Leon said:

    Threads is shite. It essentially obliges you to migrate your Instagram account and followers to Threads. My insta account is close family and a few friends with no interest in my political views and foul mouthed memes etc. And vice versa. I don’t want to mix them. FAIL

    And they've ripped off the name of your favourite movie.
    The first iteration of Threads is bizarrely bad. So many things wrong with it

    I get the sense Meta have designed it literally in the last few weeks as they’ve seen Twitter struggle. They’ve bodged it together and stuck it out there hoping it might work somehow. And getting in early before Dorsey’s Bluesky (over which he is taking a painful amount of time, by all accounts - the opposite of Zuckerberg)

    In other words they’ve flung some random shit at the wall in the hope it will stick. Prediction: it mostly won’t stick
    It's been in the works for quite a while afaik (according to some ex-FB'ers I know). Whether it gets traction just by 'virtue' of the gravity well of instagram users - hard to say. But just needs to cut away X% of twitters revenue to do them further harm ontop of the self-inflicted wounds.
    Yes, I concur. It's shit enough that it won't remotely replace Twitter, but Meta is rich enough, and with Insta it has enough users, that it can do real damage to Twitter - stealing some twitterers - and also advertising
    The latter's key. Musk is doing everything he can to deter advertisers on Twitter, and FB *loves* advertisers. Or at least, their money.

    It's almost as though Musk didn't realise how Twitter made 90% of its money...
    People who hate Elon Musk always seem to overcompensate by insisting he’s a complete idiot who isn’t aware of the most basic things.
    He's also CEO of three different (large) companies.

    Even geniuses can let things fall through the cracks when they're trying to focus on too many different things.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,671
    I decided this was sufficiently insightful and have therefore decided to repost it:

    There is a huge incumbency "bonus" for any social media platform. There are users, and an audience, and people post there already.

    It is therefore extremely hard to replace an app with something essentially identical. I mean, what's the incentive to jump, as you lose all your followers, and you can't necessarily see all the things you used to.

    Now, that's not to say that changes don't happen: whatever happened to Friends Reunited? Or MySpace? Or Flickr?

    But they typically happen because someone else comes up with a better, different app, and people migrate because there is some feature that is missing.

    Threads fails - for now - because it doesn't really offer anything particularly new.

    That said... who on here pays for Twitter?

    Because right now, the site is caught in limbo. It has massive debts. It's struggling to make new monetisation work. It's become a hotbed of IP theft (best place to stream pirated movies!). And Musk is stuck in a mindset where he's trying to cut costs to reach profitability, and that's making his systems less reliable.

    So, what happens?

    Hard to say, but there's a reason why Twitter debt trades at 50 cents in the dollar, and Fidelity has written down the value of its stake by two thirds.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,995
    edited July 2023
    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:



    Leon said:

    Threads is shite. It essentially obliges you to migrate your Instagram account and followers to Threads. My insta account is close family and a few friends with no interest in my political views and foul mouthed memes etc. And vice versa. I don’t want to mix them. FAIL

    And they've ripped off the name of your favourite movie.
    The first iteration of Threads is bizarrely bad. So many things wrong with it

    I get the sense Meta have designed it literally in the last few weeks as they’ve seen Twitter struggle. They’ve bodged it together and stuck it out there hoping it might work somehow. And getting in early before Dorsey’s Bluesky (over which he is taking a painful amount of time, by all accounts - the opposite of Zuckerberg)

    In other words they’ve flung some random shit at the wall in the hope it will stick. Prediction: it mostly won’t stick
    It's been in the works for quite a while afaik (according to some ex-FB'ers I know). Whether it gets traction just by 'virtue' of the gravity well of instagram users - hard to say. But just needs to cut away X% of twitters revenue to do them further harm ontop of the self-inflicted wounds.
    Yes, I concur. It's shit enough that it won't remotely replace Twitter, but Meta is rich enough, and with Insta it has enough users, that it can do real damage to Twitter - stealing some twitterers - and also advertising
    The latter's key. Musk is doing everything he can to deter advertisers on Twitter, and FB *loves* advertisers. Or at least, their money.

    It's almost as though Musk didn't realise how Twitter made 90% of its money...
    People who hate Elon Musk always seem to overcompensate by insisting he’s a complete idiot who isn’t aware of the most basic things.
    He's also CEO of three different (large) companies.

    Even geniuses can let things fall through the cracks when they're trying to focus on too many different things.
    I've seen educated people on Twitter make the literal claim that Musk is mentally retarded. Not just "eccentric or "prone to errors" or "on the spectrum with various issues", but an actual cretin who can't fry an egg

    There is a Musk Derangement Syndrome, just as there is with Boris, Trump and Brexit

    I can sometimes catch a flavour of the mindset when I think about Gareth Southgate. Something about Southgate winds me up way more than it should. He's a loser and not that great a manager but he makes me angrily SEETHE like Jolyon Maugham with a Brexity fox
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,382
    On July 20th the Tories will be a like a step-mom on a well known website.

    Still think S&A will be a Tory hold.
  • Options
    At least Threads has already achieved one thing.

    Its got Leon banging on about something other than GPT3 for a while.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,382
    edited July 2023

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,005

    On July 20th the Tories will be a like a step-mom on a well known website.

    Still think S&A will be a Tory hold.

    Point of order - they aren't really step-mums, they're just actresses.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,671
    Who pays for Twitter?

    Come on, there has to be at least one person on here.
  • Options
    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,176
    Musk really messes with people's pattern-matching because he's a bullshitter who sometimes delivers.

    Like, the rockets really do fly, the satellite internet really does work, but also when he suddenly decided he was going to put his website behind a login wall and restrict the number of queries, the website really did stop.

    The best explanation I can come up with is that he's rich, curious, audacious and easily led. You can achieve an incredible amount in America with those characteristics... provided you're around the right people...
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,803

    On July 20th the Tories will be a like a step-mom on a well known website.

    Still think S&A will be a Tory hold.

    I've been convinced by HYUFD's insight into Hinduism and have put the house on the Tories increasing their majority in Johnson's old seat. Somerton & Frome was never in danger, MoonRabbit's Dutch Salute theory has convinced me. So - good ship Tory sails on!
  • Options
    agingjb2agingjb2 Posts: 94
    The loss of Friends reunited proved to me that little useful to me remains online.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 28,232
    Somerton and Frome is probably the most likely loss for the Tories.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,559
    edited July 2023
    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.
  • Options
    MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    On July 20th the Tories will be a like a step-mom on a well known website.

    Still think S&A will be a Tory hold.

    Point of order - they aren't really step-mums, they're just actresses.
    That's what they want you to think
  • Options
    londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,407
    Somerton and Frome - easy LD gain

    Selby - probably CON hold

    Uxbridge - LAB but could be surprisingly close

    End August - most people will have forgotten about these by elections
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899

    On July 20th the Tories will be a like a step-mom on a well known website.

    Still think S&A will be a Tory hold.

    Point of order - they aren't really step-mums, they're just actresses.
    AI and CGI nowadays, surely.
  • Options
    FossFoss Posts: 703

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
    Ah! Sheffield before the bomb!
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097

    Musk really messes with people's pattern-matching because he's a bullshitter who sometimes delivers.

    Like, the rockets really do fly, the satellite internet really does work, but also when he suddenly decided he was going to put his website behind a login wall and restrict the number of queries, the website really did stop.

    The best explanation I can come up with is that he's rich, curious, audacious and easily led. You can achieve an incredible amount in America with those characteristics... provided you're around the right people...

    There you go. You’ve somehow convinced yourself that he’s a stupid guy who just gets lucky

    It’s arrant fucking nonsense. Embarrassing
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899
    HYUFD said:

    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close

    If the Assyrian poodle can be crossbred with the bathyal isopods, then there will be relief in the Irish Water Spaniel Society, which is therebly assured of winning Crufts.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899
    Foss said:

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
    Ah! Sheffield before the bomb!
    That also reminds me - I had been meaning to ask @Leon how he was getting on with the diet pills, and how many times he'd had to change the bedsheets. Asking for the proverbial friend.
  • Options
    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,176
    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    I used to kind of live there? Like, most of my professional connections, lots of friends, most of my news, I got all that stuff from Twitter. The work part and the news part are still mostly there, it's still the best platform for that stuff.

    What it's not a good platform for is *arguing*, so the experience has kind of degraded as they (and this predates Musk) increasingly tried to maximize engagement by showing you more and more stuff that you'll get mad at. But even now, it still works as long as you know how to use it (you have to cultivate your own list of a range of smart people) and stay away from the For You tab.
  • Options
    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,176
    Leon said:

    Musk really messes with people's pattern-matching because he's a bullshitter who sometimes delivers.

    Like, the rockets really do fly, the satellite internet really does work, but also when he suddenly decided he was going to put his website behind a login wall and restrict the number of queries, the website really did stop.

    The best explanation I can come up with is that he's rich, curious, audacious and easily led. You can achieve an incredible amount in America with those characteristics... provided you're around the right people...

    There you go. You’ve somehow convinced yourself that he’s a stupid guy who just gets lucky

    It’s arrant fucking nonsense. Embarrassing
    Not what I said.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,005
    Why have Twitter when you can have PB?
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,803
    I’m in Boston, MA for a few days for the first time since 2019. Certainly a lot more vacant lots than before the pandemic, as everywhere, but can’t see any signs of Leon’s urban dystopia. Still a great city.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,146
    Tour De France, Murray at Wimbledon, Headingley test and British Grand Prix.

    This week is Peak sport for this year.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,635
    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter can be a tool. If you use it well - as some of my acquaintances do - it can be *really* useful. Most people don't use it like that - but for those that do, it can be invaluable.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 32,939
    Miklosvar said:

    Hawkwind

    Yes
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 13,104
    Before we get to Valkyrienacht on the 20th, of far more interest are next week's by-elections in Newham where, if I am to believe some of the Tories on here, the anti-ULEZ policy of the party will sweep all before it and we can therefore expect Conservative gains in Boleyn and Wall End.

    I don't.

    I think the Greens may well have a chance in Boleyn but my patch (Wall End) is going to remain in the Labour camp. I'm still reeling from the 40 activists Labour got out on a Sunday morning to deliver and canvass. In my days of political activity for the LDs, if I got six out for an evening's surveying and leafleting I'd consider that a good turnout.
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,982
    Twitter has been largely broken for a few months now. Yes it is still there, but it doesn't serve a news feed the way it used to do. It serves up all kinds of junk.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    Carnyx said:

    Foss said:

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
    Ah! Sheffield before the bomb!
    That also reminds me - I had been meaning to ask @Leon how he was getting on with the diet pills, and how many times he'd had to change the bedsheets. Asking for the proverbial friend.
    All fine. Bit of nausea. Lost a couple of pounds. Early days

    Perhaps more beneficially - for me - it has indeed reduced my booze intake, which is still heroic by most standards but definitely down. 👍🥂
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,671
    rcs1000 said:

    Who pays for Twitter?

    Come on, there has to be at least one person on here.

    Which is worse for Twitter: that no one will admit to paying, or that no one is actually paying?
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 34,341
    Tesla is a huge success. Musk doesn't design the cars.

    SpaceX is working. Musk doesn't design the rockets.

    Musk apparently does demand explicit Twitter features. It's a shitshow
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,559
    edited July 2023

    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter can be a tool. If you use it well - as some of my acquaintances do - it can be *really* useful. Most people don't use it like that - but for those that do, it can be invaluable.
    Yes. But a chainsaw is also a useful tool.
    They aren't used by most people.
    Nor obsessively discussed in detail daily on here.
    I'm asking why so many PBers are so invested in its progress?
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,671
    DougSeal said:

    I’m in Boston, MA for a few days for the first time since 2019. Certainly a lot more vacant lots than before the pandemic, as everywhere, but can’t see any signs of Leon’s urban dystopia. Still a great city.

    We were in Boston two weeks ago, and absolutely loved it. It was bustling and fun.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899
    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foss said:

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
    Ah! Sheffield before the bomb!
    That also reminds me - I had been meaning to ask @Leon how he was getting on with the diet pills, and how many times he'd had to change the bedsheets. Asking for the proverbial friend.
    All fine. Bit of nausea. Lost a couple of pounds. Early days

    Perhaps more beneficially - for me - it has indeed reduced my booze intake, which is still heroic by most standards but definitely down. 👍🥂
    Thanks - that's interesting.
  • Options
    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,176

    Twitter has been largely broken for a few months now. Yes it is still there, but it doesn't serve a news feed the way it used to do. It serves up all kinds of junk.

    Again, stay off For You. The other tab will serve up a feed of whoever you follow, and that still works on the 363 days out of 365 that Musk hasn't just had a bright idea that broke the website.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 32,939
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Who pays for Twitter?

    Come on, there has to be at least one person on here.

    Which is worse for Twitter: that no one will admit to paying, or that no one is actually paying?
    The latter, clearly.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097

    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter can be a tool. If you use it well - as some of my acquaintances do - it can be *really* useful. Most people don't use it like that - but for those that do, it can be invaluable.
    For a journalist it is completely indispensable. I don’t know a single successful journalist who doesn’t use it. I’m sure they exist, but they are highly rare. And probably politicians?

    I’m not sure if any other social media has so captured a profession as Twitter has done to journalists
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,671

    Twitter has been largely broken for a few months now. Yes it is still there, but it doesn't serve a news feed the way it used to do. It serves up all kinds of junk.

    Again, stay off For You. The other tab will serve up a feed of whoever you follow, and that still works on the 363 days out of 365 that Musk hasn't just had a bright idea that broke the website.
    The "Following" tab has certainly improved Twitter, and for that I am truly grateful.
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 13,104
    Pulpstar said:

    Tour De France, Murray at Wimbledon, Headingley test and British Grand Prix.

    This week is Peak sport for this year.

    I'm sorry - what's wrong with the July Festival at Newmarket, Glorious Goodwood or the Ebor meeting at York?
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899
    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter can be a tool. If you use it well - as some of my acquaintances do - it can be *really* useful. Most people don't use it like that - but for those that do, it can be invaluable.
    For a journalist it is completely indispensable. I don’t know a single successful journalist who doesn’t use it. I’m sure they exist, but they are highly rare. And probably politicians?

    I’m not sure if any other social media has so captured a profession as Twitter has done to journalists
    MEDIUM
    MEDIUM
    MEDIUM

    or

    HAVE
    HAVE
    HAVE

    *ROLLS ON FLOOR IN AGONY*
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    DougSeal said:

    I’m in Boston, MA for a few days for the first time since 2019. Certainly a lot more vacant lots than before the pandemic, as everywhere, but can’t see any signs of Leon’s urban dystopia. Still a great city.

    Of course on my odyssey I specifically said “east coast cities are doing fine”. So, yeah, Boston will be cool

    Drive inland my friend
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,671
    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foss said:

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
    Ah! Sheffield before the bomb!
    That also reminds me - I had been meaning to ask @Leon how he was getting on with the diet pills, and how many times he'd had to change the bedsheets. Asking for the proverbial friend.
    All fine. Bit of nausea. Lost a couple of pounds. Early days

    Perhaps more beneficially - for me - it has indeed reduced my booze intake, which is still heroic by most standards but definitely down. 👍🥂
    Are you on the Ozempic?
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,559
    edited July 2023
    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter can be a tool. If you use it well - as some of my acquaintances do - it can be *really* useful. Most people don't use it like that - but for those that do, it can be invaluable.
    For a journalist it is completely indispensable. I don’t know a single successful journalist who doesn’t use it. I’m sure they exist, but they are highly rare. And probably politicians?

    I’m not sure if any other social media has so captured a profession as Twitter has done to journalists
    May well be why they both are so out of the loop about what is actually happening amongst the majority of the population who have no interest in Twitter whatsoever.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,837

    Twitter has been largely broken for a few months now. Yes it is still there, but it doesn't serve a news feed the way it used to do. It serves up all kinds of junk.

    Again, stay off For You. The other tab will serve up a feed of whoever you follow, and that still works on the 363 days out of 365 that Musk hasn't just had a bright idea that broke the website.
    Better still use their lists function, then you can actually find what you are interested in.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 28,232
    DougSeal said:

    I’m in Boston, MA for a few days for the first time since 2019. Certainly a lot more vacant lots than before the pandemic, as everywhere, but can’t see any signs of Leon’s urban dystopia. Still a great city.

    Are you going elsewhere in the US apart from Boston?
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    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,116
    edited July 2023
    DougSeal said:

    On July 20th the Tories will be a like a step-mom on a well known website.

    Still think S&A will be a Tory hold.

    I've been convinced by HYUFD's insight into Hinduism and have put the house on the Tories increasing their majority in Johnson's old seat. Somerton & Frome was never in danger, MoonRabbit's Dutch Salute theory has convinced me. So - good ship Tory sails on!
    Dutch Salute theory is where it’s a Lib Dem target, but it ends up the votes they needed to get comfortably ahead of Tories go to third place Labour instead. In fact it isn’t that at all but the opposite of that, but only trying to discern this from Blue Wall and national polling - if labour drop and Lib Dem rise it suggests tactical voters knowing in advance what to do, if we don’t see Lib Dem rise at labours expense it means HY’s Flaccid Night for Opposition theory wins - where Tories hold on as LLG herd like cats and don’t lend enough votes where it matters.

    The most recent Blue Wall voting did show a drift from Labour to Lib Dem, the sight of that is the Dutch Salute.

    Dutch Salute Theory can’t predict by-elections or seats though, only give us a feeling how tactical voting is shaping ahead of the General Election, becuase surely if you want to vote tactically to get a Tory out, you know today exactly what to do, so why tell pollster something else? Perhaps Labours increase in polls indicates Starmer and his party now not really feared, which is an ingredient to attract Lib Dem votes, but in many places, like Somerton and Frome those voters can’t actually vote labour, by my fur and whiskers no, it will result in HY’s Opposition Flaccid Night, and that won’t be any fun at all for most the rest of us.

    Hope this helps.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899
    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/jul/06/northern-lights-may-be-visible-uk-thursday-night

    Solar storm and aurora forecast ove rnext two days or so - shame it's cloudy tonight.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 64,118

    On July 20th the Tories will be a like a step-mom on a well known website...

    You mean from then on, you're going to use them as a metaphor for being completely and utterly @&**ed ?
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,837
    HYUFD said:

    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close

    So, what is your position if Starmer does win Uxbridge and Selby?

    Will you then accept the writing is on the wall?
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    Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 4,974

    Somerton and Frome - easy LD gain

    Selby - probably CON hold

    Uxbridge - LAB but could be surprisingly close

    End August - most people will have forgotten about these by elections

    I'm looking at this and thinking by 21st July, the ordered list of Labour majorities / deficits will have Selby&A above Uxbridge&SR.

    I'm not at all convinced what will flip and what will not, but Selby will be redder than Uxbridge.
  • Options
    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,176
    edited July 2023
    Scott_xP said:

    Tesla is a huge success. Musk doesn't design the cars.

    SpaceX is working. Musk doesn't design the rockets.

    Musk apparently does demand explicit Twitter features. It's a shitshow

    I don't think that exactly captures the difference though. Like, Musk absolutely does announce impractical car features with his engineers standing right there on stage and they're just looking at him like WTF.

    It may be that it's just easier to make a change faster with a website, so there's less time for people to delay or distract him.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter can be a tool. If you use it well - as some of my acquaintances do - it can be *really* useful. Most people don't use it like that - but for those that do, it can be invaluable.
    For a journalist it is completely indispensable. I don’t know a single successful journalist who doesn’t use it. I’m sure they exist, but they are highly rare. And probably politicians?

    I’m not sure if any other social media has so captured a profession as Twitter has done to journalists
    May well be why they both are so out of the loop about what is actually happening amongst the majority of the population who have no interest in Twitter whatsoever.
    That’s almost certainly true
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,559
    Can't see the Tories losing all three tbh.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899
    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close

    So, what is your position if Starmer does win Uxbridge and Selby?

    Will you then accept the writing is on the wall?


    22 And thou his son, O Belshazzar, hast not humbled thine heart, though thou knewest all this;

    23 But hast lifted up thyself against the Lord of heaven; and they have brought the vessels of his house before thee, and thou, and thy lords, thy wives, and thy concubines, have drunk wine in them; and thou hast praised the gods of silver, and gold, of brass, iron, wood, and stone, which see not, nor hear, nor know: and the God in whose hand thy breath is, and whose are all thy ways, hast thou not glorified:

    24 Then was the part of the hand sent from him; and this writing was written.

    25 And this is the writing that was written, Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin.

    26 This is the interpretation of the thing: Mene; God hath numbered thy kingdom, and finished it.

    27 Tekel; Thou art weighed in the balances, and art found wanting.

    28 Peres; Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 28,232
    Tamworth Tories must be a bit silly to select a sitting MP as their candidate for the next election, knowing that a by-election was a strong possibility.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,837
    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter is a great source of niche and breaking news. Of course everything needs validating to establish if true in reality.

    Still usable, and better than the monstrosity of Meta, WhatsApp being the only bit I use.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 28,232
    Why did Wimbledon change its mind and allow coaching between points?
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,837
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:



    Leon said:

    Threads is shite. It essentially obliges you to migrate your Instagram account and followers to Threads. My insta account is close family and a few friends with no interest in my political views and foul mouthed memes etc. And vice versa. I don’t want to mix them. FAIL

    And they've ripped off the name of your favourite movie.
    The first iteration of Threads is bizarrely bad. So many things wrong with it

    I get the sense Meta have designed it literally in the last few weeks as they’ve seen Twitter struggle. They’ve bodged it together and stuck it out there hoping it might work somehow. And getting in early before Dorsey’s Bluesky (over which he is taking a painful amount of time, by all accounts - the opposite of Zuckerberg)

    In other words they’ve flung some random shit at the wall in the hope it will stick. Prediction: it mostly won’t stick
    It's been in the works for quite a while afaik (according to some ex-FB'ers I know). Whether it gets traction just by 'virtue' of the gravity well of instagram users - hard to say. But just needs to cut away X% of twitters revenue to do them further harm ontop of the self-inflicted wounds.
    Yes, I concur. It's shit enough that it won't remotely replace Twitter, but Meta is rich enough, and with Insta it has enough users, that it can do real damage to Twitter - stealing some twitterers - and also advertising
    The latter's key. Musk is doing everything he can to deter advertisers on Twitter, and FB *loves* advertisers. Or at least, their money.

    It's almost as though Musk didn't realise how Twitter made 90% of its money...
    People who hate Elon Musk always seem to overcompensate by insisting he’s a complete idiot who isn’t aware of the most basic things.
    He's also CEO of three different (large) companies.

    Even geniuses can let things fall through the cracks when they're trying to focus on too many different things.
    I've seen educated people on Twitter make the literal claim that Musk is mentally retarded. Not just "eccentric or "prone to errors" or "on the spectrum with various issues", but an actual cretin who can't fry an egg

    There is a Musk Derangement Syndrome, just as there is with Boris, Trump and Brexit

    I can sometimes catch a flavour of the mindset when I think about Gareth Southgate. Something about Southgate winds me up way more than it should. He's a loser and not that great a manager but he makes me angrily SEETHE like Jolyon Maugham with a Brexity fox
    I don't think Musk is intellectually retarded, just emotionally, socially and morally retarded.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,837
    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close

    So, what is your position if Starmer does win Uxbridge and Selby?

    Will you then accept the writing is on the wall?


    22 And thou his son, O Belshazzar, hast not humbled thine heart, though thou knewest all this;

    23 But hast lifted up thyself against the Lord of heaven; and they have brought the vessels of his house before thee, and thou, and thy lords, thy wives, and thy concubines, have drunk wine in them; and thou hast praised the gods of silver, and gold, of brass, iron, wood, and stone, which see not, nor hear, nor know: and the God in whose hand thy breath is, and whose are all thy ways, hast thou not glorified:

    24 Then was the part of the hand sent from him; and this writing was written.

    25 And this is the writing that was written, Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin.

    26 This is the interpretation of the thing: Mene; God hath numbered thy kingdom, and finished it.

    27 Tekel; Thou art weighed in the balances, and art found wanting.

    28 Peres; Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians.
    @Upharsin thinks he has got away with it...
  • Options
    kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,287
    rcs1000 said:

    I decided this was sufficiently insightful and have therefore decided to repost it:

    There is a huge incumbency "bonus" for any social media platform. There are users, and an audience, and people post there already.

    It is therefore extremely hard to replace an app with something essentially identical. I mean, what's the incentive to jump, as you lose all your followers, and you can't necessarily see all the things you used to.

    Now, that's not to say that changes don't happen: whatever happened to Friends Reunited? Or MySpace? Or Flickr?

    But they typically happen because someone else comes up with a better, different app, and people migrate because there is some feature that is missing.

    Threads fails - for now - because it doesn't really offer anything particularly new.

    That said... who on here pays for Twitter?

    Because right now, the site is caught in limbo. It has massive debts. It's struggling to make new monetisation work. It's become a hotbed of IP theft (best place to stream pirated movies!). And Musk is stuck in a mindset where he's trying to cut costs to reach profitability, and that's making his systems less reliable.

    So, what happens?

    Hard to say, but there's a reason why Twitter debt trades at 50 cents in the dollar, and Fidelity has written down the value of its stake by two thirds.

    I have given up on Twitter since it became pay to play. I have a moderate but not insignificant (four figure) number of followers, but since Musk started downgrading the visibility of anyone who hasn't paid for a blue tick, I get pretty much zero engagement.

    It's gone from being a fairly lively place to share ideas and opinions to being completely dead. Now you could argue I should just pay the eight bucks or whatever it is a month but the problem isn't just me, the problem is it's also downgrading the visibility of a lot of other people I used to follow, thus making the platform less valuable.

    Imagine if PB charged a $8 a month fee, I'd probably pay it as I enjoy the site (heck, I do donate when the paypal button goes up). But imagine if it also bunged interesting and insightful posts from some of my favourite posters down the bottom of the page because they haven't paid the $8 a month fee, and upgraded the site's shitposters jus because they have paid. That is twitter now, and that it is why it is not worth the eight bucks.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,005
    stodge said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Tour De France, Murray at Wimbledon, Headingley test and British Grand Prix.

    This week is Peak sport for this year.

    I'm sorry - what's wrong with the July Festival at Newmarket, Glorious Goodwood or the Ebor meeting at York?
    Cruelty to horses?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 64,118
    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    A genuine question.
    Why are so many on here so fascinated by Twitter?
    It's a subject I've never heard anyone raise in real life.
    I was on it for 48 hours in about 2013. Tweeted twice and then never bothered as I was overwhelmed by a veritable tsunami of banality, idiocy, anger and nonsense.
    They tend to come in gentle, soothing waves on here.

    Twitter can be a tool. If you use it well - as some of my acquaintances do - it can be *really* useful. Most people don't use it like that - but for those that do, it can be invaluable.
    Yes. But a chainsaw is also a useful tool.
    They aren't used by most people.
    Nor obsessively discussed in detail daily on here.
    I'm asking why so many PBers are so invested in its progress?
    Because we're all news junkies, and it's still (just) the best single breaking news source out there - particularly for specialist subjects.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,005
    Andy Murray wins second set against the Greek Tsitsipas!

    1-1 in sets!
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,400
    My eldest daughter turns 17 on the 20th of July and then on the 21st we head to Cornwall for two weeks by the beach so I am hoping for a nice drubbing for the Tories as the icing on the cake.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,587
    rcs1000 said:

    I decided this was sufficiently insightful and have therefore decided to repost it:

    There is a huge incumbency "bonus" for any social media platform. There are users, and an audience, and people post there already.

    It is therefore extremely hard to replace an app with something essentially identical. I mean, what's the incentive to jump, as you lose all your followers, and you can't necessarily see all the things you used to.

    Now, that's not to say that changes don't happen: whatever happened to Friends Reunited? Or MySpace? Or Flickr?

    But they typically happen because someone else comes up with a better, different app, and people migrate because there is some feature that is missing.

    Threads fails - for now - because it doesn't really offer anything particularly new...

    Um, try this. Threads appeals to people who propagate images (cats, gardens, etc). Twitter appeals to people who propagate text (arguments, documents, etc). The two may not eat each others lunch
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,116
    HYUFD said:

    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close

    Absolutely right. Governments lose seats in by elections. Coming up to the 1992 elections they lost solid con seats giving no indication of the result to come.

    All the pressure in these by-elections is on Starmer and Labour. It will only be a noteworthy and game changing night if Labour fail to take at least one.

    If Ulez is so wildly popular with voters, why is the Labour candidate in Uxbridge distancing themself from it?

    Labour have every right to be getting nervous.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,899
    Foxy said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close

    So, what is your position if Starmer does win Uxbridge and Selby?

    Will you then accept the writing is on the wall?


    22 And thou his son, O Belshazzar, hast not humbled thine heart, though thou knewest all this;

    23 But hast lifted up thyself against the Lord of heaven; and they have brought the vessels of his house before thee, and thou, and thy lords, thy wives, and thy concubines, have drunk wine in them; and thou hast praised the gods of silver, and gold, of brass, iron, wood, and stone, which see not, nor hear, nor know: and the God in whose hand thy breath is, and whose are all thy ways, hast thou not glorified:

    24 Then was the part of the hand sent from him; and this writing was written.

    25 And this is the writing that was written, Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin.

    26 This is the interpretation of the thing: Mene; God hath numbered thy kingdom, and finished it.

    27 Tekel; Thou art weighed in the balances, and art found wanting.

    28 Peres; Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians.
    @Upharsin thinks he has got away with it...
    Apparently Peres is the plural form of upharsin ...
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    Also the idea that Musk is a lucky bullshitter is disproved as soon as you listen to him. He’s socially awkward and verbally hesitant. He struggles to follow conversations at times. He has, I believe, admitted he’s on the spectrum. Which all fits

    That is the opposite of a plausible huckster

    He got where he is by having tremendous insights, a willingness to imagine, a great gift for conceptual engineering, and a formidable work ethic
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,400
    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 64,118
    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foss said:

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
    Ah! Sheffield before the bomb!
    That also reminds me - I had been meaning to ask @Leon how he was getting on with the diet pills, and how many times he'd had to change the bedsheets. Asking for the proverbial friend.
    All fine. Bit of nausea. Lost a couple of pounds. Early days

    Perhaps more beneficially - for me - it has indeed reduced my booze intake, which is still heroic by most standards but definitely down. 👍🥂
    Let us know what it's like if you ever try to come off it.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    kyf_100 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I decided this was sufficiently insightful and have therefore decided to repost it:

    There is a huge incumbency "bonus" for any social media platform. There are users, and an audience, and people post there already.

    It is therefore extremely hard to replace an app with something essentially identical. I mean, what's the incentive to jump, as you lose all your followers, and you can't necessarily see all the things you used to.

    Now, that's not to say that changes don't happen: whatever happened to Friends Reunited? Or MySpace? Or Flickr?

    But they typically happen because someone else comes up with a better, different app, and people migrate because there is some feature that is missing.

    Threads fails - for now - because it doesn't really offer anything particularly new.

    That said... who on here pays for Twitter?

    Because right now, the site is caught in limbo. It has massive debts. It's struggling to make new monetisation work. It's become a hotbed of IP theft (best place to stream pirated movies!). And Musk is stuck in a mindset where he's trying to cut costs to reach profitability, and that's making his systems less reliable.

    So, what happens?

    Hard to say, but there's a reason why Twitter debt trades at 50 cents in the dollar, and Fidelity has written down the value of its stake by two thirds.

    I have given up on Twitter since it became pay to play. I have a moderate but not insignificant (four figure) number of followers, but since Musk started downgrading the visibility of anyone who hasn't paid for a blue tick, I get pretty much zero engagement.

    It's gone from being a fairly lively place to share ideas and opinions to being completely dead. Now you could argue I should just pay the eight bucks or whatever it is a month but the problem isn't just me, the problem is it's also downgrading the visibility of a lot of other people I used to follow, thus making the platform less valuable.

    Imagine if PB charged a $8 a month fee, I'd probably pay it as I enjoy the site (heck, I do donate when the paypal button goes up). But imagine if it also bunged interesting and insightful posts from some of my favourite posters down the bottom of the page because they haven't paid the $8 a month fee, and upgraded the site's shitposters jus because they have paid. That is twitter now, and that it is why it is not worth the eight bucks.
    I’ve not noticed my engagement go down. I have no blue tick and I certainly don’t pay

    Musk has made innovations I dislike quite a lot. The cheap seat blue ticks are annoying. The 600 tweet thing was insane (and could have destroyed the site) but he backtracked

    Other than that I still find it immensely useful and entertaining. Far more than any other social media. But it does suit my mindset
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foss said:

    When I see Zuckerberg has set up Threads I just think that's got more dystopian than I ever thought imaginable.



    https://twitter.com/keithfrankish/status/1677034520590053377
    Ah! Sheffield before the bomb!
    That also reminds me - I had been meaning to ask @Leon how he was getting on with the diet pills, and how many times he'd had to change the bedsheets. Asking for the proverbial friend.
    All fine. Bit of nausea. Lost a couple of pounds. Early days

    Perhaps more beneficially - for me - it has indeed reduced my booze intake, which is still heroic by most standards but definitely down. 👍🥂
    Let us know what it's like if you ever try to come off it.
    I shall. My sister came off it by virtue of being unable to source it anymore. She loves it and this is driving her nuts. So it may have an addictive quality
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    He’s autistic and he’s confessed this. That’s the issue
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,400
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    He’s autistic and he’s confessed this. That’s the issue
    Yes presumably. I'm not one for diagnosing people and placing them "on the spectrum" but if he says he is then it would certainly fit.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,724
    edited July 2023
    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    The reaction by some, especially the media, is akin to Trump derangement syndrome since he made it obvious he doesn't agree with the liberal left defacto standard of silicon valley.

    They treat him like he is now the most dangerous man in the world by owning twitter....
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,116
    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    One of those polls that on the surface looks great for Lab and terrible for the Tories, but the low Green score means LLG is *only* 61%. Less minor party vote for Labour to squeeze than some other polls.

    That's also a reason I think Savanta are closer to reality. Lower Green and Ref scores than some others. I still think Ref is probably overstated even at 4%.
    Doesn't the @MoonRabbit patented Dutch Salute theory suggest that it will be the Lib Dems squeezing the Labour vote rather than vice versa?
    Her theory says both will squeeze each other in their respective regions, but that's already reflected in the 11% LD score. There's a separate small party squeeze angle focusing on the Greens and REFUK. 2 different phenomena.

    The Green vote is not a tactical one. It's disgruntled Labour lefties plus none of the above voters. A large chunk of it will return to Labour come the election but a large chunk of 4% isn't that much.
    As I understand it, the theory is that the Labour polling score is made up of people thinking "get the Tories out" but includes a lot of voters in LD/Tory seats who will actually vote tactically for the Lib Dems but haven't yet realised this, so it won't be reflected in the LD score.
    But also lots of voters in Lab-Con marginals who are naturally Lib Dem but will tactically vote Labour. The Dutch salute theory suggests this is already reflected in voting intention, i.e. the voters have made up their minds to vote tactically and are flashing their chests at the pollsters. Hence the LD score has already risen.
    Flashing something at the pollsters yes.

    It’s not a black and white exam answer, but William is closer. To be more confident the madness of large scale tactical voting will happen, would we not be seeing Lib Dem share of the LLG increase from here to General Election day. At LLG expense. I mean like Lib Dem’s polling 17 or 18, and Labour just about 40.

    The gap then from Lab back to Con would be a lot smaller, perhaps even single figures in many polls. But I would be extremely confident the Tories will be reduced to just 100 to 140 seats.

    Look at the Terrible Tory result local election night, look at what the vote levels were. Labour 36% Lib Dem’s 18%. The LLG really worked the Torys over that night.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    He’s autistic and he’s confessed this. That’s the issue
    Yes presumably. I'm not one for diagnosing people and placing them "on the spectrum" but if he says he is then it would certainly fit.
    I’m almost certain he’s discussed it publicly. Or openly alluded to it
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,587
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    He’s likes to think he's autistic and he’s confessed this. That’s the issue
    FTFY
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,724
    I see the British tennis player is doing quite well this evening ;-)
  • Options

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    I think it applies to all of us to a certain degree. Some of the most deluded people are, I think, those who are particularly smart or skilled in one area and mistakenly believe that this makes them similarly smart in other, unrelated areas. The wisest people know the limits of their wisdom.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,587

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    ...the liberal left defacto standard of silicon valley...
    Is this (still?) true. They were always more libertarian/anarcho-capitalist than liberal, and I think Elon's not the only one to make that obvious (via Twitter, ironically)

  • Options
    GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,475
    Foxy said:

    Carnyx said:

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    If the Tories hold Uxbridge and Selby narrowly however, which I think is possible and only lose Somerton and Frome to the LDs in the by elections then there will be relief in Camp Sunak. The pressure will be on Starmer as to why the huge Labour poll leads aren't translating into Labour gains on huge swings, even if they get close

    So, what is your position if Starmer does win Uxbridge and Selby?

    Will you then accept the writing is on the wall?


    22 And thou his son, O Belshazzar, hast not humbled thine heart, though thou knewest all this;

    23 But hast lifted up thyself against the Lord of heaven; and they have brought the vessels of his house before thee, and thou, and thy lords, thy wives, and thy concubines, have drunk wine in them; and thou hast praised the gods of silver, and gold, of brass, iron, wood, and stone, which see not, nor hear, nor know: and the God in whose hand thy breath is, and whose are all thy ways, hast thou not glorified:

    24 Then was the part of the hand sent from him; and this writing was written.

    25 And this is the writing that was written, Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin.

    26 This is the interpretation of the thing: Mene; God hath numbered thy kingdom, and finished it.

    27 Tekel; Thou art weighed in the balances, and art found wanting.

    28 Peres; Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians.
    @Upharsin thinks he has got away with it...
    One of my favourite paintings in the National Gallery too.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    He’s likes to think he's autistic and he’s confessed this. That’s the issue
    FTFY
    I know a fair few actually-diagnosed high functioning autistic people. Musk ticks all the boxes. Newton and Einstein were, it is thought, high functioning autistics

    I also wonder about Gerard Manley Hopkins. Tremendous intelligent and an incredible focused talent. Genius. Yet apparently hopelessly awkward in society and prone to saying weird things and making terrible faux pas
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    GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,475
    Leon said:

    Also the idea that Musk is a lucky bullshitter is disproved as soon as you listen to him. He’s socially awkward and verbally hesitant. He struggles to follow conversations at times. He has, I believe, admitted he’s on the spectrum. Which all fits

    That is the opposite of a plausible huckster

    He got where he is by having tremendous insights, a willingness to imagine, a great gift for conceptual engineering, and a formidable work ethic

    True. But he's made a right mess of Twitter and I'm glad to find what looks like might genuinely be a viable alternative. The ideal would be to have old Twitter back, but it's gone for good.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,724
    edited July 2023
    Ghedebrav said:

    Leon said:

    Also the idea that Musk is a lucky bullshitter is disproved as soon as you listen to him. He’s socially awkward and verbally hesitant. He struggles to follow conversations at times. He has, I believe, admitted he’s on the spectrum. Which all fits

    That is the opposite of a plausible huckster

    He got where he is by having tremendous insights, a willingness to imagine, a great gift for conceptual engineering, and a formidable work ethic

    True. But he's made a right mess of Twitter and I'm glad to find what looks like might genuinely be a viable alternative. The ideal would be to have old Twitter back, but it's gone for good.
    He made quite a mess of Tesla and SpaceX in the early days. The difference was they were startups, and obviously they have since turned around.

    One thing that is worth noting is Musk has shown to be very smart in seeing opportunities others others haven't e.g. how he has so many prime locations with Tesla charges (he basically bagged the best spots), Starlink, that looks like it will provide the internet to all planes in the near future, due to safety regs, manufacturer demands and customers...and twitter, all that data is fantastically useful for LLMs.
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    sladeslade Posts: 1,959
    Another delve into forgotten music. The 3rd piano concerto by Xaver Scharwenka is superb - but the 4th is better.
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    ClippPClippP Posts: 1,780
    dixiedean said:

    Can't see the Tories losing all three tbh.

    Whyever not, Mr Dean? The Lib Dems seem to be moblising well for Somerton & Frome, and Labour seem to be making a big effort in Uxbridge. The Lib Dem campaign in Selby seems somewhat weak in comparison, and I am sure that the Labour campaign is taking advantage of that and producing appropriate bar charts.

    Overall the public mood seems to be as it was at the time of the local elections, or perhaps even stronger. So the Tories are set for a proper drubbing - at the hands of the Lib Dems where they are strongly organised, and of Labour where they are not.

    As Mrs Thatcher once said, "Rejoice, rejoice!"
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    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    Ghedebrav said:

    Leon said:

    Also the idea that Musk is a lucky bullshitter is disproved as soon as you listen to him. He’s socially awkward and verbally hesitant. He struggles to follow conversations at times. He has, I believe, admitted he’s on the spectrum. Which all fits

    That is the opposite of a plausible huckster

    He got where he is by having tremendous insights, a willingness to imagine, a great gift for conceptual engineering, and a formidable work ethic

    True. But he's made a right mess of Twitter and I'm glad to find what looks like might genuinely be a viable alternative. The ideal would be to have old Twitter back, but it's gone for good.
    Old Twitter was ruined before Musk got there. The censorship of ANY right wing voices became insane. Of course if you aren’t on the right that was never an issue
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    MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    He’s likes to think he's autistic and he’s confessed this. That’s the issue
    FTFY
    Do one, actually. Autism is hard enough to deal with without creepy insinuations that it's a lifestyle choice. And is there anything more pathetic than that ftfy thing?
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,724
    edited July 2023
    Leon said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Leon said:

    Also the idea that Musk is a lucky bullshitter is disproved as soon as you listen to him. He’s socially awkward and verbally hesitant. He struggles to follow conversations at times. He has, I believe, admitted he’s on the spectrum. Which all fits

    That is the opposite of a plausible huckster

    He got where he is by having tremendous insights, a willingness to imagine, a great gift for conceptual engineering, and a formidable work ethic

    True. But he's made a right mess of Twitter and I'm glad to find what looks like might genuinely be a viable alternative. The ideal would be to have old Twitter back, but it's gone for good.
    Old Twitter was ruined before Musk got there. The censorship of ANY right wing voices became insane. Of course if you aren’t on the right that was never an issue
    Also it never made money....the two years it did, it was mostly accountancy trickery and was back to bleeding (before Musk) and massively overstaffed.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,724
    edited July 2023
    To say he has a metal hip and is off aging years, Murray can't half still play same tennis.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,837

    Ghedebrav said:

    Leon said:

    Also the idea that Musk is a lucky bullshitter is disproved as soon as you listen to him. He’s socially awkward and verbally hesitant. He struggles to follow conversations at times. He has, I believe, admitted he’s on the spectrum. Which all fits

    That is the opposite of a plausible huckster

    He got where he is by having tremendous insights, a willingness to imagine, a great gift for conceptual engineering, and a formidable work ethic

    True. But he's made a right mess of Twitter and I'm glad to find what looks like might genuinely be a viable alternative. The ideal would be to have old Twitter back, but it's gone for good.
    He made quite a mess of Tesla and SpaceX in the early days. The difference was they were startups, and obviously they have since turned around.

    One thing that is worth noting is Musk has shown to be very smart in seeing opportunities others others haven't e.g. how he has so many prime locations with Tesla charges (he basically bagged the best spots), Starlink, that looks like it will provide the internet to all planes in the near future, due to safety regs, manufacturer demands and customers...and twitter, all that data is fantastically useful for LLMs.
    Though the skills etc needed for a tech company is very different to a social media company. The latter requires someone who understands how people socially connect, and Musk is not that someone.

    Not that I like Meta either.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 77,724
    edited July 2023
    Foxy said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    Leon said:

    Also the idea that Musk is a lucky bullshitter is disproved as soon as you listen to him. He’s socially awkward and verbally hesitant. He struggles to follow conversations at times. He has, I believe, admitted he’s on the spectrum. Which all fits

    That is the opposite of a plausible huckster

    He got where he is by having tremendous insights, a willingness to imagine, a great gift for conceptual engineering, and a formidable work ethic

    True. But he's made a right mess of Twitter and I'm glad to find what looks like might genuinely be a viable alternative. The ideal would be to have old Twitter back, but it's gone for good.
    He made quite a mess of Tesla and SpaceX in the early days. The difference was they were startups, and obviously they have since turned around.

    One thing that is worth noting is Musk has shown to be very smart in seeing opportunities others others haven't e.g. how he has so many prime locations with Tesla charges (he basically bagged the best spots), Starlink, that looks like it will provide the internet to all planes in the near future, due to safety regs, manufacturer demands and customers...and twitter, all that data is fantastically useful for LLMs.
    Though the skills etc needed for a tech company is very different to a social media company. The latter requires someone who understands how people socially connect, and Musk is not that someone.

    Not that I like Meta either.
    Are you claiming the human-less android that is Mark Zuckerberg really understands human connection? Or is that they have amazing tech to hoover up all your personal info which they sell to everybody and anybody in a way they can tell scary amounts about people who have never even used The Facebook.

    Twitter has never had that and thus always had issues with advertisers, as unlike Facebook you can't ask to target left handed Asian cat lovers in Swindon.

    Musk has been open that he doesn't see twitter as a social media app, rather an "everything" app like WeChat.

    If I had to guess where it went wrong was he thought he would pay a lot less for twitter and that he would then have this large userbase to monetarise. Instead he is on the hook for silly money and the internal financials of twitter were a lot worse than he first thought.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 50,005

    To say he has a metal hip and is off aging years, Murray can't half still play same tennis.

    COME ON ANDY!
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 49,097
    Miklosvar said:

    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    It’s amazing how many people had no problem admitting that Elon Musk is seriously smart - until he revealed that he is quite right wing. At which point he miraculously morphed into a stuttering moron who just keeps getting lucky

    Musk strikes me as one of those super smart people who is also a bit dumb in certain respects, certainly in his dealings with people. Spending time in academia and then finance I have come across many people who fall into this category, Musk just seems one of the more extreme examples.
    He’s likes to think he's autistic and he’s confessed this. That’s the issue
    FTFY
    Do one, actually. Autism is hard enough to deal with without creepy insinuations that it's a lifestyle choice. And is there anything more pathetic than that ftfy thing?
    Absolutely right. It’s not fun and it’s something people admit easily and Musk has - as I correctly surmised - publicly discussed his autism. I salute him for that alone


This discussion has been closed.