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Betting on a LAB majority reaches a new high – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,217
edited July 2023 in General
imageBetting on a LAB majority reaches a new high – politicalbetting.com

I have said this before but I think this betting market offers very good value for those wanting to risk their cash on LAB not getting an overall majority. The way the market is defined Starmer’s party would need to win 326 seats which is exactly 122 more than they got at the last general election.

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Comments

  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    I think lab maj is most likely, but 1.5 is way too short.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,215
    The most fun markets I think will be LD seat count and SNP seat count. Less binary than Labour majority or not, and a wide range of possible outcomes. LDs have underperformed expectations on seats in all general elections from 2010 onwards (arguably they underperformed some excessive expectations in 2005 too). The SNP surprised on the upside in 2015, downside in 2017 and then performed largely within expectations in 2019. The interaction between the two of course then determines 3rd party in Westminster.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,975
    SKS fans please explain.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,215

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    One of those polls that on the surface looks great for Lab and terrible for the Tories, but the low Green score means LLG is *only* 61%. Less minor party vote for Labour to squeeze than some other polls.

    That's also a reason I think Savanta are closer to reality. Lower Green and Ref scores than some others. I still think Ref is probably overstated even at 4%.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    It’s a long way from where they are now, to an absolute majority. Given that polling is likely to tighten between now and the election, that 1.52 is a lay. I think it should be between 2 and 3.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,149

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    BJO fans please explain!
  • twistedfirestopper3twistedfirestopper3 Posts: 2,453
    edited July 2023
    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

  • eekeek Posts: 28,592
    Sandpit said:

    It’s a long way from where they are now, to an absolute majority. Given that polling is likely to tighten between now and the election, that 1.52 is a lay. I think it should be between 2 and 3.

    I think it's right

    Scotland is likely to give Labour between 20-30 seats compared to the last election.
    The red wall will return to Labour

    Those 2 items between them make 100 gains likely. Add a few other seats trendy labour and they will be over 326...
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 4,155
    I've said before and I'll say again; I think a lot of the Tory DKs are actually active Tory abstainers, and it would be useful for pollsters to try and poll people who usually vote, but are likely abstaining. Labour wins have always required significant numbers of Tory abstainers and if polls continue to count them only as DKs then there will always be an assumption that these people will "go home".
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    edited July 2023
    Sandpit said:

    It’s a long way from where they are now, to an absolute majority. Given that polling is likely to tighten between now and the election, that 1.52 is a lay. I think it should be between 2 and 3.

    Things are bad and getting worse. It seems about right to me. Even if eeks estimates are a little off re Scotland say, there's a lot of very likely gains, and extra ones needed become manageable.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Make sure that his lawyer, to the satisfaction of your lawyer, can explain the origins of the bag of cash, and that such paperwork is sent to your bank and to the company that will collect the money.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148
    Book of Bonds, Chapter I

    1 Thou shalt be cognisant of the rate of return that is free of risk.
    2 Thou shalt be cognisant of the risk of thy Chosen Bond.
    3 The heretic and the infidel who hide investment that is unwise are legion. And are Naughty in My Sight.
    4 Therefore thy due diligence must be keener than the sight of the eagle.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    Pinchers defence must have been tricky to craft as the news says he cannot remember the events of the evening in question.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,136
    FPT
    Miklosvar said:

    Fishing said:

    Everybody who had a chimney swept or used coal in the 19th century benefited from unfree labourers. If you read about the conditions faced by child chimney sweepers or coal miners in that era they are just as horrific to our modern sensibilities as those faced by slaves on sugar or coffee plantations, and they had about as much choice.

    Let's just cancel everybody born before about 1940. It would do nothing to make any victim's life better, but would at least allow us to wallow in our smug moral superiority.

    Or, more constructively, let's take away from this the message that things which are unacceptable can appear entirely acceptable to contemporaries, and examine our own world in that light.

    That would, of course, be the sensible, empathetic and sophisticated course of action.

    However, it would require some historical knowledge and understanding; undermine the grievance industry, far left Twittermobs and go against the apparently insatiable modern urge to label people as "good" or "bad", so there's about as much chance of it happening at the moment as there is of getting sensible, pro-growth economic policies in this country.

    I.e. none.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    That would be a good way to get your bank account chopped on the grounds that you are a risk.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,256

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not ask your bank before you turn up ?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,302
    TimS said:

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    One of those polls that on the surface looks great for Lab and terrible for the Tories, but the low Green score means LLG is *only* 61%. Less minor party vote for Labour to squeeze than some other polls.

    That's also a reason I think Savanta are closer to reality. Lower Green and Ref scores than some others. I still think Ref is probably overstated even at 4%.
    Doesn't the @MoonRabbit patented Dutch Salute theory suggest that it will be the Lib Dems squeezing the Labour vote rather than vice versa?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    edited July 2023
    eek said:

    Sandpit said:

    It’s a long way from where they are now, to an absolute majority. Given that polling is likely to tighten between now and the election, that 1.52 is a lay. I think it should be between 2 and 3.

    I think it's right

    Scotland is likely to give Labour between 20-30 seats compared to the last election.
    The red wall will return to Labour

    Those 2 items between them make 100 gains likely. Add a few other seats trendy labour and they will be over 326...
    I agree that Scotland is key to the majority, and can easily see 100 Lab gains as well, which I’d put at 50/50. Whether or not I can see 125 gains, is more up in the air. The 2010 result was in the middle of those (with the major parties reversed)
  • eekeek Posts: 28,592
    Sandpit said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Make sure that his lawyer, to the satisfaction of your lawyer, can explain the origins of the bag of cash, and that such paperwork is sent to your bank and to the company that will collect the money.
    This - you really will need to know where that money came from because believe me - a bank may accept it but only under duress...
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,215
    This upcoming cascade of byelections is going to have a big impact on betting markets I expect. It's potentially quite helpful for the Tories that there are so many. They only have to retain one to be able to claim they've turned the corner. Remember when Labour held Batley and Spen?

    So even if the overall swing in the byelections is dire for the Tories, if they hang on to Selby or even - if HYUFD is to believed - the seethingly anti-ULEZ Hindu dominated Tory stronghold of Uxbridge, they potentially get the better of the narrative.

    It also helps them that most contests are against Labour not the byelection specialist Lib Dems.
  • Nigelb said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not ask your bank before you turn up ?
    If it does come to fruition, and I can't convince him to use conventional methods, I'd definitely ask them first. It's just too good an offer to turn down, at the higher end of what we were told by the auction valuation, with no fees apart from a bit of conveyancing. When it was up with an estate agent, we were getting crap offers, so I don't want to put him off!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,975
    edited July 2023

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,975
    Right Ashes time.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,215

    TimS said:

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    One of those polls that on the surface looks great for Lab and terrible for the Tories, but the low Green score means LLG is *only* 61%. Less minor party vote for Labour to squeeze than some other polls.

    That's also a reason I think Savanta are closer to reality. Lower Green and Ref scores than some others. I still think Ref is probably overstated even at 4%.
    Doesn't the @MoonRabbit patented Dutch Salute theory suggest that it will be the Lib Dems squeezing the Labour vote rather than vice versa?
    Her theory says both will squeeze each other in their respective regions, but that's already reflected in the 11% LD score. There's a separate small party squeeze angle focusing on the Greens and REFUK. 2 different phenomena.

    The Green vote is not a tactical one. It's disgruntled Labour lefties plus none of the above voters. A large chunk of it will return to Labour come the election but a large chunk of 4% isn't that much.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,972
    If your bank won't accept 6 figure plus sums in non-sequential notes then you are banking with the wrong bank. Who do the landed gentry and oligarchs bank with? Who do (did) the SNP bank with?
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Extreme caution advised

    If I google uk bank maximum cash deposit it autocompletes after uk bank max, never a good sign, and that throws up the FCA saying "Deposit limits: banks to reduce cash deposit limits, subject to their customer arrangements, to below the existing £20,000 per transaction." Not clear whether this reduction has happened, nor to what.

    I am also, the more I think about, the more suspicious about the "old school gentleman" shtick. He could be getting 4 or 5% on that money in two fscs guaranteed accounts. In my experience farmers (if that is what he is) are astute businessmen and early adopters of technology. I bet his suppliers don't take cash and his DEFRA payments come electronically, or not at all.
  • Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    I knew it was risky, but thought I'd ask. I'll have to convince the crazy old fella to use a bank.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,234

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    3rd toss running! We’ll be bowling again.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    No, and no, and 1000 times no. You’ll never be able to open a bank account, instruct a solicitor or do anything else that requires an AML check again. You’ll be red flagged from here to kingdom come.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    edited July 2023
    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Let him pay the cash into the account of his solicitor! Have his own brief be so happy as to send the Securicor van himself.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,302
    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    One of those polls that on the surface looks great for Lab and terrible for the Tories, but the low Green score means LLG is *only* 61%. Less minor party vote for Labour to squeeze than some other polls.

    That's also a reason I think Savanta are closer to reality. Lower Green and Ref scores than some others. I still think Ref is probably overstated even at 4%.
    Doesn't the @MoonRabbit patented Dutch Salute theory suggest that it will be the Lib Dems squeezing the Labour vote rather than vice versa?
    Her theory says both will squeeze each other in their respective regions, but that's already reflected in the 11% LD score. There's a separate small party squeeze angle focusing on the Greens and REFUK. 2 different phenomena.

    The Green vote is not a tactical one. It's disgruntled Labour lefties plus none of the above voters. A large chunk of it will return to Labour come the election but a large chunk of 4% isn't that much.
    As I understand it, the theory is that the Labour polling score is made up of people thinking "get the Tories out" but includes a lot of voters in LD/Tory seats who will actually vote tactically for the Lib Dems but haven't yet realised this, so it won't be reflected in the LD score.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Not if the solicitor has the remotest modicum of sense. They are subject to AML rules too.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148
    A

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.
    Some years ago, the Customs boys stopped a van at Dover. Full of cash, shrink wrapped onto pallets.

    They thought they had caught a big drug dealer. They had, in fact, caught a cash in hand builder taking his money home. Apparently they take pounds sterling, and use change offices in their own country to change it, a few thousand at a time.

    Working in Canary Wharf, one interesting comedy was the Friday bank run. A chap would go to the bank to withdraw the cash to pay his builders. Often he would get a couple of the ‘roid ‘n weights* types from the trading floor to go with him as DIY security.

    A relative in the building trade suggested to a senior civil servant that if you marched large bank withdrawals to people with planning permission and on-site builders, fun might ensue. The answer (this was under Blair, IIRC) was that this was an appalling idea since it would catch too many of the wrong people.

    *a curious subset of trading culture. You see them doing arm curls while on the phone etc…
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    That'll either be 3,000 £50 notes or 7,500 £20s. Which is a lot to ensure there's no counterfeit even if you just hold onto the cash in your attic. I think for that value of transaction it has to be a CHAPS between your solicitors.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,302
    DougSeal said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    No, and no, and 1000 times no. You’ll never be able to open a bank account, instruct a solicitor or do anything else that requires an AML check again. You’ll be red flagged from here to kingdom come.
    What you need to do is open a sweet shop or barbers...
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,411

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Possibly not. I'll leave it to others to explain why, but money laundering regs since 2001 make this difficult to handle large sums of cash without triggering alarms. I forget what the threshold is for "large".
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,144

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    Cons on 129, with Lab Majority of 485. Con on 103 and Lab Majority of 300 with modest Tactical Vote assumptions on Electoral Calculus.

    The current last few months trend is not the Con's friend, and there would have to be massive campaign swingback to prevent a Lab Majority. I wouldn't lay it at current prices.

  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,557
    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Would be better to get the buyer to pay it into his own solicitor’s account - if buyer’s solicitor is ok to accept it and his bank are ok to accept it with any required documentation then they shouldn’t have a problem and then can send it to your bank direct from solicitor’s account.

    This way if it raises any flags then it’s on the buyer and his solicitor so your bank doesn’t need to be involved and you don’t get tarred if anything amiss or suspicious.

    If the buyer’s solicitor won’t accept it, or the buyer won’t do this, then that raises enough flags that you definitely shouldn’t.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,234

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    At what point does it become an issue? What of you sold a car for £50k cash?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,987
    edited July 2023
    I suspect Labour will now get a narrow UK wide majority, helped especially by gains from the SNP in Scotland.

    However while Tory losses will likely ensure even a hung parliament in England I would not be sure of a Labour majority in England. Not least as some of those Tory losses in England will be to the LDs not Labour
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,215

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    One of those polls that on the surface looks great for Lab and terrible for the Tories, but the low Green score means LLG is *only* 61%. Less minor party vote for Labour to squeeze than some other polls.

    That's also a reason I think Savanta are closer to reality. Lower Green and Ref scores than some others. I still think Ref is probably overstated even at 4%.
    Doesn't the @MoonRabbit patented Dutch Salute theory suggest that it will be the Lib Dems squeezing the Labour vote rather than vice versa?
    Her theory says both will squeeze each other in their respective regions, but that's already reflected in the 11% LD score. There's a separate small party squeeze angle focusing on the Greens and REFUK. 2 different phenomena.

    The Green vote is not a tactical one. It's disgruntled Labour lefties plus none of the above voters. A large chunk of it will return to Labour come the election but a large chunk of 4% isn't that much.
    As I understand it, the theory is that the Labour polling score is made up of people thinking "get the Tories out" but includes a lot of voters in LD/Tory seats who will actually vote tactically for the Lib Dems but haven't yet realised this, so it won't be reflected in the LD score.
    But also lots of voters in Lab-Con marginals who are naturally Lib Dem but will tactically vote Labour. The Dutch salute theory suggests this is already reflected in voting intention, i.e. the voters have made up their minds to vote tactically and are flashing their chests at the pollsters. Hence the LD score has already risen.
  • Nigelb said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not ask your bank before you turn up ?
    If it does come to fruition, and I can't convince him to use conventional methods, I'd definitely ask them first. It's just too good an offer to turn down, at the higher end of what we were told by the auction valuation, with no fees apart from a bit of conveyancing. When it was up with an estate agent, we were getting crap offers, so I don't want to put him off!
    The fact that the offer is so generous should be setting even more alarm bells ringing!
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Pulpstar said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    That'll either be 3,000 £50 notes or 7,500 £20s. Which is a lot to ensure there's no counterfeit even if you just hold onto the cash in your attic. I think for that value of transaction it has to be a CHAPS between your solicitors.
    You may be a bit buggered depending what your contract says because if it doesn't stipulate payment by transfer between solicitors (it should) there are probably some tedious rules about legal tender/defence of tender which say that handing over the lot in 20s fulfills his side if the deal.

    Is there a contract and what does it say?
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    I have a contact, a Nigerian prince, who specialises in this kind of deal. Mail the cash to him via Western Union, and he will ensure it all comes through properly into your bank account.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,215
    The nightmare scenario for the Tory party - the death knell or the turning point perhaps - would be a narrow Labour majority in 2024 and then an increased Labour majority in the following election in 2028/9. That's when the despondency really sets in. Similar to 2015 and 1983 for Labour.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,234
    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Oh. None at all?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,411

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman drug dealer, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    FTFY

  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,228
    I agree with OGH.

    The GE will be much tighter than current opinion polls are showing, and I don't think Labour will get over the line.

    I'll be delighted if I am wrong.
  • Nigelb said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not ask your bank before you turn up ?
    If it does come to fruition, and I can't convince him to use conventional methods, I'd definitely ask them first. It's just too good an offer to turn down, at the higher end of what we were told by the auction valuation, with no fees apart from a bit of conveyancing. When it was up with an estate agent, we were getting crap offers, so I don't want to put him off!
    The fact that the offer is so generous should be setting even more alarm bells ringing!
    We've actually known him years, in fact he was a good friend of my late father in law. He owns a fair bit of property around here, and is well respected. He knows what the land is worth to him, he owns other fields on 2 sides of ours. He's just an old school cash type of fella. I'll be seeing him later, so we'll have the no cash discussion.
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,951
    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    At what point does it become an issue? What of you sold a car for £50k cash?
    Anything over 10k cash is auto KYC/AML (know your customer, anti money laundering) red flag.

    Do not go there, even with the proper paperwork, you will be tied up for months, and likely have the cash rejected by banks etc anyway.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,302
    TimS said:

    The nightmare scenario for the Tory party - the death knell or the turning point perhaps - would be a narrow Labour majority in 2024 and then an increased Labour majority in the following election in 2028/9. That's when the despondency really sets in. Similar to 2015 and 1983 for Labour.

    When you look at the inexorable decline of the Labour vote from 1997 to 2010, the Tories should have been a lot less despondent than they were over that period. The shadow that Blair cast over them was far too big.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,975
    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    At what point does it become an issue? What of you sold a car for £50k cash?
    To be honest anything over £10k triggers flags.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,780
    TimS said:

    Last weeks outlier reversed

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 46% (+3)
    CON: 28% (-3)
    LDEM: 11% (+1)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    GRN: 4% (+1)

    via @Savanta_UK

    One of those polls that on the surface looks great for Lab and terrible for the Tories, but the low Green score means LLG is *only* 61%. Less minor party vote for Labour to squeeze than some other polls.

    That's also a reason I think Savanta are closer to reality. Lower Green and Ref scores than some others. I still think Ref is probably overstated even at 4%.
    At the same time, Con + Ref is only 32%. So LLG still 29% ahead of the combined right wing vote, compared to only 22% in the previous Savanta poll. So I think it's still another terrible poll for the Tories even when you dig below the surface.

    On the subject of Reform, in the guise of the Brexit Party they got 2% in 2019 even though they stood down to help the Conservatives in Conservative-held seats. They averaged about 4% in the seats they did contest. Those remaining seats still mattered in terms of the need for a Conservative majority to deliver Brexit and so the Brexit Party still suffered from a tactical squeeze. The Conservatives were also genuinely popular amongst Brexit supporters. None of those factors will apply in 2024 and Reform's intention is to contest every seat if they can. I think Reform will easily achieve 4%.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,592
    kyf_100 said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    At what point does it become an issue? What of you sold a car for £50k cash?
    Anything over 10k cash is auto KYC/AML (know your customer, anti money laundering) red flag.

    Do not go there, even with the proper paperwork, you will be tied up for months, and likely have the cash rejected by banks etc anyway.
    Can be less than that - where I am £5k would trigger it and it may be £3k...
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    Nigelb said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not ask your bank before you turn up ?
    If it does come to fruition, and I can't convince him to use conventional methods, I'd definitely ask them first. It's just too good an offer to turn down, at the higher end of what we were told by the auction valuation, with no fees apart from a bit of conveyancing. When it was up with an estate agent, we were getting crap offers, so I don't want to put him off!
    The fact that the offer is so generous should be setting even more alarm bells ringing!
    We've actually known him years, in fact he was a good friend of my late father in law. He owns a fair bit of property around here, and is well respected. He knows what the land is worth to him, he owns other fields on 2 sides of ours. He's just an old school cash type of fella. I'll be seeing him later, so we'll have the no cash discussion.
    Could your solicitors agree some sort of ‘rent-to-own’ contract, that sees him pay you £1500 a month in cash, for 100 months, with the title deed in escrow? PB Lawyers?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Law society disagrees.

    https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/contact-or-visit-us/helplines/practice-advice-service/q-and-as/can-i-accept-my-clients-20000-cash-deposit#:~:text=Cash in itself is legal,to support any statement provided.

    Solicitors choose not to accept cash because its hassle is probably more accurate.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,546
    FPT, the historical discussion, I think we must be extremely grateful that the Industrial Revolution took place. In the end, it floated all boats. Without it, slave trading, rule by autocrats and aristocratic cliques, and absolutely grinding poverty for 90% of the World's population, would remain normative.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,411
    edited July 2023
    @twistedfirestopper3

    If your friend is kosher and just happens to have £150K in cash hanging around and isn't a villain and really wants to pay you in cash, get him to pay you in gold coins. This'll cover it.

    https://www.royalmint.com/invest/bullion/bullion-coins/gold-coins/britannia-2023-1-oz-gold-one-hundred-bullion-coin-box-king-charles-iii/

    Then whenever you are short of cash, take it to a gold coin dealer and convert it to cash. Or you can take it to Switzerland (can we still do this post-Brexit?) and convert the cash to a bank account.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,144

    I agree with OGH.

    The GE will be much tighter than current opinion polls are showing, and I don't think Labour will get over the line.

    I'll be delighted if I am wrong.

    It comes to a point, with maybe 16 months to the GE where we ought to believe the polls and anticipate a @Heathener style battering for the Tories.

    I suspect that the value bets will be like Scotland in 2015 on constituencies that seemed rock solid, when the constituency markets open.

    With Tamworth now looking like a byelection, and formerly a safe seat, and 4 byelections in a fortnight, we may well see some confirmation soon.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    An idea - £150k is about the value of, say , 20 grams of black market Tritium stolen from Russian nuclear warheads.

    So he could buy the Tritium from Russian gangsters and sell it to MI6 or the CIA.

    I’m sure that a cheque from MI6 would be cashed at Coutts, no problems….
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,393
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not ask your bank before you turn up ?
    If it does come to fruition, and I can't convince him to use conventional methods, I'd definitely ask them first. It's just too good an offer to turn down, at the higher end of what we were told by the auction valuation, with no fees apart from a bit of conveyancing. When it was up with an estate agent, we were getting crap offers, so I don't want to put him off!
    The fact that the offer is so generous should be setting even more alarm bells ringing!
    We've actually known him years, in fact he was a good friend of my late father in law. He owns a fair bit of property around here, and is well respected. He knows what the land is worth to him, he owns other fields on 2 sides of ours. He's just an old school cash type of fella. I'll be seeing him later, so we'll have the no cash discussion.
    Could your solicitors agree some sort of ‘rent-to-own’ contract, that sees him pay you £1500 a month in cash, for 100 months, with the title deed in escrow? PB Lawyers?
    Inflation ...
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,546

    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Law society disagrees.

    https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/contact-or-visit-us/helplines/practice-advice-service/q-and-as/can-i-accept-my-clients-20000-cash-deposit#:~:text=Cash in itself is legal,to support any statement provided.

    Solicitors choose not to accept cash because its hassle is probably more accurate.
    One would be extremely unwise to accept large cash deposits, given the AML rules. Accepting small cash sums, ie up to £1,000, is not likely to be much of a problem.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,260
    edited July 2023

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    I would use a Waitrose bag for that amount of cash.
    A certified PB classic here, n'est-ce pas.
  • sladeslade Posts: 2,081
    Just 2 local by-elections today: a LD defence in Kent and an SNP defence in South Lanarkshire.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,411
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not ask your bank before you turn up ?
    If it does come to fruition, and I can't convince him to use conventional methods, I'd definitely ask them first. It's just too good an offer to turn down, at the higher end of what we were told by the auction valuation, with no fees apart from a bit of conveyancing. When it was up with an estate agent, we were getting crap offers, so I don't want to put him off!
    The fact that the offer is so generous should be setting even more alarm bells ringing!
    We've actually known him years, in fact he was a good friend of my late father in law. He owns a fair bit of property around here, and is well respected. He knows what the land is worth to him, he owns other fields on 2 sides of ours. He's just an old school cash type of fella. I'll be seeing him later, so we'll have the no cash discussion.
    Could your solicitors agree some sort of ‘rent-to-own’ contract, that sees him pay you £1500 a month in cash, for 100 months, with the title deed in escrow? PB Lawyers?
    Do you want to pay solicitor's fees for 8yrs and 4mths? :)
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,256
    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Which is why I like the suggestion of asking him to pay it into his solicitor's bank account. That is the person best placed to explain to him - assuming he's not actually a crook - why it's not possible.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,215

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    An idea - £150k is about the value of, say , 20 grams of black market Tritium stolen from Russian nuclear warheads.

    So he could buy the Tritium from Russian gangsters and sell it to MI6 or the CIA.

    I’m sure that a cheque from MI6 would be cashed at Coutts, no problems….
    Only if your balance is over a million. Otherwise they may cancel the account.
  • Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    I would use a Waitrose bag for that amount of cash.
    I was thinking a tesco bag might be more discreet. Don't want to draw attention to myself in Loughborough.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,437

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    I would use a Waitrose bag for that amount of cash.
    Good point. Tesco plastic bags are biodegradable so might easily fall to pieces halfway down the high street.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148

    DougSeal said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    No, and no, and 1000 times no. You’ll never be able to open a bank account, instruct a solicitor or do anything else that requires an AML check again. You’ll be red flagged from here to kingdom come.
    What you need to do is open a sweet shop or barbers...
    A scrap yard is traditional.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,165
    viewcode said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman drug dealer, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    FTFY

    I read here that old school gentlemen whose great, great, great grandpa made their money in the drug trade retain old school gentlemen status so all is good.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,393

    DougSeal said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    No, and no, and 1000 times no. You’ll never be able to open a bank account, instruct a solicitor or do anything else that requires an AML check again. You’ll be red flagged from here to kingdom come.
    What you need to do is open a sweet shop or barbers...
    A scrap yard is traditional.
    Ice cream van?
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 4,155
    Before resident anti trans individuals try to post this with their spin; Mermaids failed on standing to get LGB Alliance's charity status revoked, on the merits, the judges seemed to be split - with one agreeing that LGBA shouldn't have charity status, and one disagreeing.

    https://mermaidsuk.org.uk/news/statement-on-the-ruling-in-mermaids-v-charity-commission-and-lgb-alliance/

    So, whilst many will crow that this is a good thing for LGBA, I would suggest that what it really means is in the case someone who has standing can bring this to trial again, or if on an appeal Mermaids are found to have standing, there seems to be enough of an argument for it to go either way.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,144

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    I would use a Waitrose bag for that amount of cash.
    I was thinking a tesco bag might be more discreet. Don't want to draw attention to myself in Loughborough.
    Why not embrace the cash, and spend it all on drugs, and an ice cream van?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,393
    Nigelb said:

    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Which is why I like the suggestion of asking him to pay it into his solicitor's bank account. That is the person best placed to explain to him - assuming he's not actually a crook - why it's not possible.
    Also they must have been through this before. One hopes.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148

    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Law society disagrees.

    https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/contact-or-visit-us/helplines/practice-advice-service/q-and-as/can-i-accept-my-clients-20000-cash-deposit#:~:text=Cash in itself is legal,to support any statement provided.

    Solicitors choose not to accept cash because its hassle is probably more accurate.
    Because it just pushes the compliance into them. The solicitor then risks being flagged by the banks as a risk - which would put them out of business rather neatly.
  • mickydroymickydroy Posts: 316
    I agree with Mike Smithson on this, Labour have a huge task on their hands, albeit made easier if they make a comeback in Scotland, 6/1 is available on the Tories to win most seats, that is starting to look like value, considering it's been a long time since they didn't win most seats. I can certainly see the GE being a mixed bag, I can see morons like 30p Lee hanging on, but Tories losing seats with a large majority, in the south, but overall taking Labour on, seems the best bet for now
  • It's problematic, isn't it? Drug dealers, terrorists and criminals ruining it for old school gentlemen. Bloody cashless society!
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,256
    https://twitter.com/implausibleblog/status/1676876033268543488
    Left: Chris Pincher found guilty of abuse of power after groping claims

    Right: Boris Johnson starts snoring when asked why he ignored allegations against Chris Pincher
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    Well done the crowd!
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Law society disagrees.

    https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/contact-or-visit-us/helplines/practice-advice-service/q-and-as/can-i-accept-my-clients-20000-cash-deposit#:~:text=Cash in itself is legal,to support any statement provided.

    Solicitors choose not to accept cash because its hassle is probably more accurate.
    Because it just pushes the compliance into them. The solicitor then risks being flagged by the banks as a risk - which would put them out of business rather neatly.
    How effective is AML? My guess is not very as the big criminals know exactly how to get around it, but also fairly onerous on business and society, as creates fear, admin, stress and confusion.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    An idea - £150k is about the value of, say , 20 grams of black market Tritium stolen from Russian nuclear warheads.

    So he could buy the Tritium from Russian gangsters and sell it to MI6 or the CIA.

    I’m sure that a cheque from MI6 would be cashed at Coutts, no problems….
    The rational thing to do of course is to take it to a drug dealer, who can handle the cash and will sell you high grade class As at wholesale prices, guaranteeing a 300% ROI. An unintended consequence of making it hard for hitherto honest folk to deal in cash.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,044
    edited July 2023
    Andy_JS said:

    This new narrative that cash is dodgy is disagreeable in the extreme in my opinion. Far more fraud probably takes place thanks to electronic payments than cash.

    It’s hardly new, but the narrative isn’t all cash is dodgy, just 150-grand-in-the-bag levels of cash.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    Miklosvar said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    An idea - £150k is about the value of, say , 20 grams of black market Tritium stolen from Russian nuclear warheads.

    So he could buy the Tritium from Russian gangsters and sell it to MI6 or the CIA.

    I’m sure that a cheque from MI6 would be cashed at Coutts, no problems….
    The rational thing to do of course is to take it to a drug dealer, who can handle the cash and will sell you high grade class As at wholesale prices, guaranteeing a 300% ROI. An unintended consequence of making it hard for hitherto honest folk to deal in cash.
    Next step what do you do with 600k cash......
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,165
    Sorry lads, cricket has fallen.


  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,780
    edited July 2023
    It looks very much like we're going to get a by-election in Tamworth either sooner or later.

    What's intriguing about this is that the sitting Walsall North MP has already jumped ship and has been selected to contest Tamworth for the Conservatives at the next general election. But he won't be able to stand in the by-election unless he resigns as MP for Walsall North first. No doubt he'll hang on for now in Walsall and be rooting for a Labour win in the by-election against a different Conservative candidate.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    At what point does it become an issue? What of you sold a car for £50k cash?
    Most car dealers (in the UK), won’t deal with more than £10k in cash. If it’s a private sale, then it’s your problem as the seller to deal with 50 bags of sand, because the bank won’t want it.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,778
    viewcode said:

    @twistedfirestopper3

    If your friend is kosher and just happens to have £150K in cash hanging around and isn't a villain and really wants to pay you in cash, get him to pay you in gold coins. This'll cover it.

    https://www.royalmint.com/invest/bullion/bullion-coins/gold-coins/britannia-2023-1-oz-gold-one-hundred-bullion-coin-box-king-charles-iii/

    Then whenever you are short of cash, take it to a gold coin dealer and convert it to cash. Or you can take it to Switzerland (can we still do this post-Brexit?) and convert the cash to a bank account.

    You can buy and sell gold (and diamonds) over the counter, no questions, asked in Antwerp. Me and my father did it when we sold my grandfather's farm in the Western Cape and I smuggled the funds out of South Africa.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,865
    148grss said:

    Before resident anti trans individuals try to post this with their spin; Mermaids failed on standing to get LGB Alliance's charity status revoked, on the merits, the judges seemed to be split - with one agreeing that LGBA shouldn't have charity status, and one disagreeing.

    https://mermaidsuk.org.uk/news/statement-on-the-ruling-in-mermaids-v-charity-commission-and-lgb-alliance/

    So, whilst many will crow that this is a good thing for LGBA, I would suggest that what it really means is in the case someone who has standing can bring this to trial again, or if on an appeal Mermaids are found to have standing, there seems to be enough of an argument for it to go either way.

    I would imagine the court's threshold for overruling the decision of the Charity Commission that a charity should be allowed to be registered would be pretty high, in any event.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,900

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    I knew it was risky, but thought I'd ask. I'll have to convince the crazy old fella to use a bank.
    This guy really sounds nuts. If he is known to have large amounts of cash on hand, and lives in a rural location far from law enforcement, isn't he risking a nasty robbery scenario? And not trusting the banks really comes down to not trusting the government, which regulates the banks, and cash is a liability of the government, so...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,437

    DougSeal said:

    Stocky said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Why not pay the cash into the bank account of your solicitor. Then the solicitor transfer to your bank account. Would that work?
    Only if the solicitor was happy to be struck off. We can’t accept any cash.
    Law society disagrees.

    https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/contact-or-visit-us/helplines/practice-advice-service/q-and-as/can-i-accept-my-clients-20000-cash-deposit#:~:text=Cash in itself is legal,to support any statement provided.

    Solicitors choose not to accept cash because its hassle is probably more accurate.
    Because it just pushes the compliance into them. The solicitor then risks being flagged by the banks as a risk - which would put them out of business rather neatly.
    How effective is AML? My guess is not very as the big criminals know exactly how to get around it, but also fairly onerous on business and society, as creates fear, admin, stress and confusion.
    AML thresholds are far too low if ordinary horseracing punters get caught up, but otoh this land sale does sound like textbook money laundering, probably of untaxed income rather than the proceeds of crime. There did used to be a lot of cash flowing round the countryside. This transaction turns cash into land.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,044

    Miklosvar said:

    Right, straight off topic. I've got a serious question about cash. We've sold a plot of land we own to a neighbouring land owner. He's an old school gentleman, doesn't trust banks and wants to pay us in actual cash. I'm fine with that, it'll all be done legally. My issue is, can I just stroll into the bank with a tesco bag with 150 grand in it without alarms ringing and being surrounded by armed rozzers and income tax inspectors?

    Don’t, even with solicitor letters.

    This is my day job.

    You’ll trigger all sorts of red flags on your account which is likely to lead to account closures and CIFAS markers which last for six years.

    Only terrorists, criminals/drug dealers use cash at that amount according to systems.

    It is an AML issue as well.
    An idea - £150k is about the value of, say , 20 grams of black market Tritium stolen from Russian nuclear warheads.

    So he could buy the Tritium from Russian gangsters and sell it to MI6 or the CIA.

    I’m sure that a cheque from MI6 would be cashed at Coutts, no problems….
    The rational thing to do of course is to take it to a drug dealer, who can handle the cash and will sell you high grade class As at wholesale prices, guaranteeing a 300% ROI. An unintended consequence of making it hard for hitherto honest folk to deal in cash.
    Next step what do you do with 600k cash......
    Open 600 bank accounts?
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    BROAD
This discussion has been closed.