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Ratings blow for Sunak from R&W – politicalbetting.com

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Comments

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,943
    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,483

    If this was American PB.com, everywhere here would live in Omaha, Nebraska or Raleigh, North Carolina, in 4000 sq ft houses with neighbours who say “Howdy!” and bake cookies for the school lacrosse team.

    It’s really three or four different countries.

    London, UK, population 8.9 million; homicides in 2022: 109

    Omaha, Nebraska, population 487,000; homicides in 2022: 31

    Hmm

    That said I do take your point. Lots of Americans in the nicer small towns and richer suburbs have enviably lovely lives, entirely untroubled by violence and decay

    Trouble is an awful lot of Americans live in the great cities, and nearly all of them have these increasingly menacing issues

    Rome in the 4th century was like this. The cities decayed but the rich retreated to small towns and villas and, for them, life remained great
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,483

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    A lot (all?) of the ranting about other countries is a form of copium espoused by Brexiters who can’t bear to think of their country being unflatteringly compared to others.

    Someone - probably SeanF - will be along soon to claim that the UK must be the best country in the world given the number of immigrants it receives.

    Most of these posters have never left Rochdale (or the equivalent), so perhaps can be excused the passive aggressive parochialism.

    I’m not sure what Leon’s excuse is, although I note that he never actually seems to be in the UK, and nor does he actually have the kind of job that exposes much you to everyday reality. As he never ceases to tell us.

    I’m not ranting. I’ve admitted several times that Britain has significant problems, from debt to inflation to our shambolic public services

    However, I’m also pointing out that I travel extremely widely around the world (and within the UK, even if you don’t believe me) and that gives me a perspective that maybe others here don’t get. I just see more and I can compare

    Many nations are troubled, just like the UK. The globe has recently gone through a calamitous plague, so it’s not surprising. Quite a few have problems which make ours look relatively minor

    Brexit is neither here nor there in this wider scheme
    This is exactly what i have been saying. We had serious problems in the EU: a horrendous trade deficit, excessive consumption and poor productivity. Funnily enough these problems persist but now they are being blamed on Brexit. It is absurd. What is disappointing is how small the steps that have been taken to address any of these. Covid and Ukraine have undoubtedly made this more difficult but I would like a better sense of purpose and direction.
    Yes, the really dismaying thing about the UK is the pitiful inertia of our politicians. Our problems are difficult but not intractable. We also have good things going for us. Someone please get a grip
    You have to explain why there appears to be nobody who can. Something structural. Blob-like, even,
    Dunno. It is pathetic. Starmer v Sunak is a truly dispiriting choice. But it is still better than Biden v Trump
  • Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html

    Is it that funny? I mean, he's wrong, but it's not like Aylesbury is a fishing village.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,984
    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html

    Is it that funny? I mean, he's wrong, but it's not like Aylesbury is a fishing village.
    Andy_JS has a very odd sense of humour.
    Is he a serial killer? I wouldn’t be surprised.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,516
    edited May 2023

    A lot (all?) of the ranting about other countries is a form of copium espoused by Brexiters who can’t bear to think of their country being unflatteringly compared to others.

    Someone - probably SeanF - will be along soon to claim that the UK must be the best country in the world given the number of immigrants it receives.

    Most of these posters have never left Rochdale (or the equivalent), so perhaps can be excused the passive aggressive parochialism.

    I’m not sure what Leon’s excuse is, although I note that he never actually seems to be in the UK, and nor does he actually have the kind of job that exposes much you to everyday reality. As he never ceases to tell us.

    I can't recall saying any such thing.

    You do , on the whole, come over much like Montague Withnail mourning his lost youth, when lamenting the state of Britiain after the end of New Labour.

  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,483
    stodge said:

    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.

    Actually, the poverty in somewhere like rural Mississippi is absolutely shocking. Not just relatively startling

    But I’m bored of bashing America now. It still makes bloody great TV for a start. And on that note I’m going to watch Succession

    Later
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,805

    The UCU stuff is a part of what Sir Keir was implicitly supporting whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet

    He's been impressively consistent in his support of Ukraine since

    But who knows how Slalom Sir Keir will respond next?

    Er... SKS can travel in time?

    If not, how did he express any opinion about the Russian invasion of Ukraine whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet?
    He remained a member after Salisbury
    Ah, so he can't travel time but you can move goalposts. I see.
  • Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html

    Is it that funny? I mean, he's wrong, but it's not like Aylesbury is a fishing village.
    Andy_JS has a very odd sense of humour.
    Is he a serial killer? I wouldn’t be surprised.

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html

    Is it that funny? I mean, he's wrong, but it's not like Aylesbury is a fishing village.
    Andy_JS has a very odd sense of humour.
    Is he a serial killer? I wouldn’t be surprised.
    Perhaps he can help me with the question that's bugging me... which point in the UK is furthest from an abandoned quarry where a body would never be found?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,004
    I was running about an hour behind on the IPL. What a match, what a final over. What a final 2 balls. Just incredible sport. I do feel that GT would have had a better chance over the full 20 overs but wow.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,805

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html

    Is it that funny? I mean, he's wrong, but it's not like Aylesbury is a fishing village.
    https://randomtechthoughts.blog/2020/08/22/how-far-is-it-to-the-coast/
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,516
    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.

    Actually, the poverty in somewhere like rural Mississippi is absolutely shocking. Not just relatively startling

    But I’m bored of bashing America now. It still makes bloody great TV for a start. And on that note I’m going to watch Succession

    Later
    It may be a feature, not a bug.

    The US is designed to make poverty very unpleasant. So, avoid it.
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 2,000
    The comment above re What3words set me searching. Weirdly, the seat where I watch Heart of Midlothian FC play home games appears to be ///slowly.link.plays!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,109
    Dura_Ace said:

    The UCU stuff is a part of what Sir Keir was implicitly supporting whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet

    He's been impressively consistent in his support of Ukraine since

    But who knows how Slalom Sir Keir will respond next?

    Er... SKS can travel in time?

    If not, how did he express any opinion about the Russian invasion of Ukraine whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet?
    Not being a Ukraine Ultra is a crime that is so grave that even innocence itself is no defence.
    Massive irony being, of course, that the total area illegally occupied by Russia (including territory of Georgia and Moldova, not just Ukraine!) is far in excess of the area illegally occupied by Israel!
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,074
    A
    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.

    Actually, the poverty in somewhere like rural Mississippi is absolutely shocking. Not just relatively startling

    But I’m bored of bashing America now. It still makes bloody great TV for a start. And on that note I’m going to watch Succession

    Later
    My theory on America is that it is actually a montage of countries, ranging from third world, to somewhere in the late 22nd century.

    The American Dream is moving from the one to the other.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,066
    Farooq said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:
    Did you visit San Francisco in the 1990s? I'd be interested to know what it was like at that time compared to now.
    Or New York in the Seventies, Los Angeles or Chicago in the Eighties. There has always been a dark side to American cities.
    Even New York during the crack epidemic was not as bad as Fentanyl is now - in multiple cities

    I get the sense you haven’t been to urban America recently. I have. This shit is new and bad
    Some of us actually live in the US.
    It is not quite the hell-scape you pretend it is.

    I’ve spent several months of the last two years traveling around America. And I’m back again next week

    I’ve been to the West Coast, the desert states, Florida, the Deep South and the Rockies, etc

    It is fucked in a way I have not seen before. There is still phenomenal wealth and power - but the urban problems are palpable. New Orleans is the 8th most murderous city on the planet, the first 7 are all Mexican cities sunk in the drug wars
    America has such a disparity in income that you get astonishing scenes of deprivation.

    Britain is next in the income disparity stakes.
    You should do two months in your own country. There’s no New Orleans, but there’s also a kind of entrenched post-industrial squalor that is hard to find in other places too.
    There's nowhere in the UK I would be afraid to walk around in the middle of the night. That's how safe it is. London has had just 4 gun deaths this year, with a population of more than 9 million.
    Nowhere? You sure about that?
    https://what3words.com/discouraged.names.rules
    https://what3words.com/political.betting.comb

    Damn it, so close.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,074

    Dura_Ace said:

    The UCU stuff is a part of what Sir Keir was implicitly supporting whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet

    He's been impressively consistent in his support of Ukraine since

    But who knows how Slalom Sir Keir will respond next?

    Er... SKS can travel in time?

    If not, how did he express any opinion about the Russian invasion of Ukraine whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet?
    Not being a Ukraine Ultra is a crime that is so grave that even innocence itself is no defence.
    Massive irony being, of course, that the total area illegally occupied by Russia (including territory of Georgia and Moldova, not just Ukraine!) is far in excess of the area illegally occupied by Israel!
    Zelensky is a Jew. Since Jews Don't Count.....
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,575
    Dura_Ace said:

    The UCU stuff is a part of what Sir Keir was implicitly supporting whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet

    He's been impressively consistent in his support of Ukraine since

    But who knows how Slalom Sir Keir will respond next?

    Er... SKS can travel in time?

    If not, how did he express any opinion about the Russian invasion of Ukraine whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet?
    Not being a Ukraine Ultra is a crime that is so grave that even innocence itself is no defence.
    Perhaps if 'not being a Ukraine Ultra' is performatively expressed as a type of martyrdom, pretending it means anyone who doesn't uncritically buy into every piece of pro-Ukrainian propaganda online.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,074
    edited May 2023
    kle4 said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    The UCU stuff is a part of what Sir Keir was implicitly supporting whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet

    He's been impressively consistent in his support of Ukraine since

    But who knows how Slalom Sir Keir will respond next?

    Er... SKS can travel in time?

    If not, how did he express any opinion about the Russian invasion of Ukraine whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet?
    Not being a Ukraine Ultra is a crime that is so grave that even innocence itself is no defence.
    Perhaps if 'not being a Ukraine Ultra' is performatively expressed as a type of martyrdom, pretending it means anyone who doesn't uncritically buy into every piece of pro-Ukrainian propaganda online.
    When I here people upset about support for Ukraine vs the Manly Stonkiness Of Russia, I think of this -


    .....And he was much too good a journalist to spoil his contrast by remarking that the half-dozen comparatively slender young men in blue pajamas who were standing about their victorious land ironclad, drinking coffee and eating biscuits, had also in their eyes and carriage something not altogether degraded below the level of a man.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,575
    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    A lot (all?) of the ranting about other countries is a form of copium espoused by Brexiters who can’t bear to think of their country being unflatteringly compared to others.

    Someone - probably SeanF - will be along soon to claim that the UK must be the best country in the world given the number of immigrants it receives.

    Most of these posters have never left Rochdale (or the equivalent), so perhaps can be excused the passive aggressive parochialism.

    I’m not sure what Leon’s excuse is, although I note that he never actually seems to be in the UK, and nor does he actually have the kind of job that exposes much you to everyday reality. As he never ceases to tell us.

    I’m not ranting. I’ve admitted several times that Britain has significant problems, from debt to inflation to our shambolic public services

    However, I’m also pointing out that I travel extremely widely around the world (and within the UK, even if you don’t believe me) and that gives me a perspective that maybe others here don’t get. I just see more and I can compare

    Many nations are troubled, just like the UK. The globe has recently gone through a calamitous plague, so it’s not surprising. Quite a few have problems which make ours look relatively minor

    Brexit is neither here nor there in this wider scheme
    This is exactly what i have been saying. We had serious problems in the EU: a horrendous trade deficit, excessive consumption and poor productivity. Funnily enough these problems persist but now they are being blamed on Brexit. It is absurd. What is disappointing is how small the steps that have been taken to address any of these. Covid and Ukraine have undoubtedly made this more difficult but I would like a better sense of purpose and direction.
    Yes, the really dismaying thing about the UK is the pitiful inertia of our politicians. Our problems are difficult but not intractable. We also have good things going for us. Someone please get a grip
    In part this is the oft noted point that we get the politicians we deserve - we rarely reward politicians offering radical solutions due to both reasonable caution toward radical solutions (which are often proposed by rabid ideologues with no care for reality), and a stubborn resistance to accepting there might be actual costs to solutions.

    However, our leaders do not get off the hook entirely. Great leaders can shape opinion not just follow it, and have long presented the solution to everything as incredibly simple - vote them in, and the problem will be fixed, nay, improved, whilst also probably being cheaper, and no don't ask for details - or careen about between different radical solutions without much assessment of if it is a good idea.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645

    . .
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,575

    kle4 said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    The UCU stuff is a part of what Sir Keir was implicitly supporting whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet

    He's been impressively consistent in his support of Ukraine since

    But who knows how Slalom Sir Keir will respond next?

    Er... SKS can travel in time?

    If not, how did he express any opinion about the Russian invasion of Ukraine whilst a member of Corbyn's Shadow Cabinet?
    Not being a Ukraine Ultra is a crime that is so grave that even innocence itself is no defence.
    Perhaps if 'not being a Ukraine Ultra' is performatively expressed as a type of martyrdom, pretending it means anyone who doesn't uncritically buy into every piece of pro-Ukrainian propaganda online.
    When I here people upset about support for Ukraine vs the Manly Stonkiness Of Russia, I think of this -


    .....And he was much too good a journalist to spoil his contrast by remarking that the half-dozen comparatively slender young men in blue pajamas who were standing about their victorious land ironclad, drinking coffee and eating biscuits, had also in their eyes and carriage something not altogether degraded below the level of a man.
    I'm put in mind of a variation of this quote when people try to make themselves free thinking martyrs against an unforgiving mob of online Ukrainian automatons.

    Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,575


    . .

    The sheep seems up for it.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,575

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html

    Is it that funny? I mean, he's wrong, but it's not like Aylesbury is a fishing village.
    Andy_JS has a very odd sense of humour.
    Is he a serial killer? I wouldn’t be surprised.
    As the old joke goes, I think the odds of there being two serial killers on here are pretty low, so I'm confident he probably isn't.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,109


    . .

    Wascally Wabbit!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,705


    . .

    That's not a very respectful way to refer to Dean Foresters.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,705
    Of course, 'Welsh' is actually a corruption of 'Walisc,' which is the Saxon for 'alien'...
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645
    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,864
    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.

    Actually, the poverty in somewhere like rural Mississippi is absolutely shocking. Not just relatively startling

    But I’m bored of bashing America now. It still makes bloody great TV for a start. And on that note I’m going to watch Succession

    Later
    It may be a feature, not a bug.

    The US is designed to make poverty very unpleasant. So, avoid it.
    Yes, the US is a great place to be rich, an OK place to be average but an awful place to be poor
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,256
    ydoethur said:

    Of course, 'Welsh' is actually a corruption of 'Walisc,' which is the Saxon for 'alien'...

    These alien abduction stories suddenly make more sense.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,705

    ydoethur said:

    Of course, 'Welsh' is actually a corruption of 'Walisc,' which is the Saxon for 'alien'...

    These alien abduction stories suddenly make more sense.
    There was a time when we were snow donder with those stories.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,575

    ydoethur said:

    Farooq said:

    ydoethur said:

    Farooq said:

    I've just been having a look through some UCU and their local affiliates' twitter accounts

    They're in the middle of a huge pay dispute with their employers, but they're mostly going on about Palestine and Trans

    And they've just passed a motion condemning our support of Ukraine

    Why the fuck aren't aren't they focussed on education?

    What precisely is this Ukraine motion?
    A heap of shit?
    Is that the full text of the motion?

    My question was genuine.
    Congress notes:

    one year after the brutal invasion, Ukraine has become a battleground for Russian and US imperialism
    it is estimated that 150,000 Ukrainian soldiers and civilians and 200,000 Russian soldiers have died since invasion
    Putin has threatened the use of nuclear weapons and unleashed war crimes
    the 2022 NATO summit committed to a US military base in Poland, a brigade in Romania, air missile systems in Italy and Germany and two additional F-35 squadrons in Britain
    Volodymyr Zelensky says he wants Ukraine to become a 'big Israel'—an armed, illiberal outpost of US imperialism.
    Congress believes:

    wars are fought by the poor and unemployed of one country killing and maiming the poor and unemployed of another
    we should say, 'Russian troops out, no to NATO escalation and expansion'
    we should stand in solidarity with ordinary Ukrainians and demand an immediate withdrawal of Russian troops
    NATO is not a progressive force: escalation risks widening war in the region
    only through a peaceful resolution can lives be saved.
    Resolves:

    UCU to call upon Russian to withdraw its troops and for government to stop arming Ukraine
    UCU to call for a peaceful resolution to the war
    Congress resolves to support protests called by Stop The War, CND and other anti-war organisations.

    But I think 'a heap of shit' was pithier, and summed up the general thrust of it.

    Here's a full list of resolutions.

    https://www.ucu.org.uk/article/12945/Business-of-the-strategy-and-finance-committee-open-session

    On a serious note, the UCU is anxious to avoid talking about employment matters because they would have to admit (a) they spend much of their time making cosy deals with the management and (b) they don't give a fuck about their members and never have since it was formed back in I think 2006.

    It's been an utter disaster for universities and their staff, vice chancellors apart, that the AUT and NATFHE merged. Although it has benefitted the Union bosses, most of whom make McCluskey look honest, to an enormous degree.

    Long may NASUWT hold out against the Nutters forcing something similar in school education.
    Student politics. With bald patches. At UCL, every now and then the nutters would pass a resolution voting to give money to the IRA or something.

    And then several hundred students would turn up and vote all their crap out. While they snivelled about it not being fair.
    What is it about these organisations that so enthralls a certain type of 'activist' to hijack them to bang on about things that are completely irrelevant, to pursue their personal hobby horse? Doesn't seem to matter all that much what the professional field is, though I presume some are worse for it than others.

    I found it very hard to vote in a recent union election because a) for the most part everyone agreed on the basic points b) a large proportion still felt the need to get explicitly party political in a way which seemed to me to be pointless other than to compete in displays of fervour, and c) there was clearly factioning going on with candidates asking for specific others to receive votes on different slates, but very little reference to what connected them, or even no reference at all, making me wonder what the heck was going on.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,742


    . .

    The "proud to love animals" tag-line still doesn't look any better in that context.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,575
    ydoethur said:

    Of course, 'Welsh' is actually a corruption of 'Walisc,' which is the Saxon for 'alien'...

    Making people foreigners in their own country, you can't say the Saxons couldn't do propaganda. Ok, backed up by the sword admittedly.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,682
    edited May 2023

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. First that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and second that, in spite of all that, he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,640
    Good job we Brexited to rid ourselves of all that pesky red tape that was strangling trade.

    Oh.


  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,896
    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.

    Actually, the poverty in somewhere like rural Mississippi is absolutely shocking. Not just relatively startling

    But I’m bored of bashing America now. It still makes bloody great TV for a start. And on that note I’m going to watch Succession

    Later
    The last episode was perfect.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Weren’t the donations made before he started supporting Just Stop Oil.

    In which case what’s the problem. The DM needs to STFU over the outage given the Tories were awash with Russian money .
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,682
    Farooq said:

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. Fist that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and two that in spite of all that he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    Oh. Are we about to go back to calling people "beta cucks"? I really miss that aspect of 2016.
    Don't even know what the phrase means (sheltered upbringing I guess). But if it means Major is a useless twat who doesn't know when he is being bent over a table and shafted like a junior minister from South Derbyshire then it seems apt.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298
    Farooq said:

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. Fist that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and two that in spite of all that he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    Oh. Are we about to go back to calling people "beta cucks"? I really miss that aspect of 2016.
    It is not clear which timeline Tyndall inhabits. He seems to think the UK was hampered by social chapter regulation whereas in the real world it had (has) one of the most deregulated labour markets in the world.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,682

    Farooq said:

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. Fist that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and two that in spite of all that he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    Oh. Are we about to go back to calling people "beta cucks"? I really miss that aspect of 2016.
    It is not clear which timeline Tyndall inhabits. He seems to think the UK was hampered by social chapter regulation whereas in the real world it had (has) one of the most deregulated labour markets in the world.
    It was not me that was complaining about the Social Chapter, it was Major himself, sobbing about betrayal and being deceived in his own letters to the Commission President. Dumb fuck (Major, not you).
  • WillGWillG Posts: 2,366

    Good job we Brexited to rid ourselves of all that pesky red tape that was strangling trade.

    Oh.


    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy). EU red tape affected 100% of the economy.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298
    edited May 2023
    WillG said:

    Good job we Brexited to rid ourselves of all that pesky red tape that was strangling trade.

    Oh.


    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy). EU red tape affected 100% of the economy.
    Another one of those “1+1=bananas” statements.
  • WillGWillG Posts: 2,366
    Farooq said:

    ydoethur said:

    Of course, 'Welsh' is actually a corruption of 'Walisc,' which is the Saxon for 'alien'...

    Foreigner. Stranger.
    The Saxons arrived, and called the people already here foreigners.

    Of course, things have changed a lot since then, and the boot is now on the other foot. These days, if you say you're English, you're be arrested and thrown in jail.
    To be fair, the Saxons called people back on the continent foreigners too.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallachians
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walloons
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,256

    Good job we Brexited to rid ourselves of all that pesky red tape that was strangling trade.

    Oh.


    The French may be being overly officious, but if the packaging is that specialised that it needs to be couriered I would have thought it's obvious that it has a value.
  • WillGWillG Posts: 2,366
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    A lot (all?) of the ranting about other countries is a form of copium espoused by Brexiters who can’t bear to think of their country being unflatteringly compared to others.

    Someone - probably SeanF - will be along soon to claim that the UK must be the best country in the world given the number of immigrants it receives.

    Most of these posters have never left Rochdale (or the equivalent), so perhaps can be excused the passive aggressive parochialism.

    I’m not sure what Leon’s excuse is, although I note that he never actually seems to be in the UK, and nor does he actually have the kind of job that exposes much you to everyday reality. As he never ceases to tell us.

    I’m not ranting. I’ve admitted several times that Britain has significant problems, from debt to inflation to our shambolic public services

    However, I’m also pointing out that I travel extremely widely around the world (and within the UK, even if you don’t believe me) and that gives me a perspective that maybe others here don’t get. I just see more and I can compare

    Many nations are troubled, just like the UK. The globe has recently gone through a calamitous plague, so it’s not surprising. Quite a few have problems which make ours look relatively minor

    Brexit is neither here nor there in this wider scheme
    This is exactly what i have been saying. We had serious problems in the EU: a horrendous trade deficit, excessive consumption and poor productivity. Funnily enough these problems persist but now they are being blamed on Brexit. It is absurd. What is disappointing is how small the steps that have been taken to address any of these. Covid and Ukraine have undoubtedly made this more difficult but I would like a better sense of purpose and direction.
    Yes, the really dismaying thing about the UK is the pitiful inertia of our politicians. Our problems are difficult but not intractable. We also have good things going for us. Someone please get a grip
    In part this is the oft noted point that we get the politicians we deserve - we rarely reward politicians offering radical solutions due to both reasonable caution toward radical solutions (which are often proposed by rabid ideologues with no care for reality), and a stubborn resistance to accepting there might be actual costs to solutions.

    However, our leaders do not get off the hook entirely. Great leaders can shape opinion not just follow it, and have long presented the solution to everything as incredibly simple - vote them in, and the problem will be fixed, nay, improved, whilst also probably being cheaper, and no don't ask for details - or careen about between different radical solutions without much assessment of if it is a good idea.
    Britain's deep rooted scepticism of big bold ideas has been a source of strength, as it had made us resistant to the temptations of fascism and communism. One of the main reasons we haven't had a revolution since Cromwell. But it is also a source of weakness. Trying to rewire a British company to work differently is incredibly hard compared to doing the same thing in the US.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645
    edited May 2023
    nico679 said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Weren’t the donations made before he started supporting Just Stop Oil.

    In which case what’s the problem. The DM needs to STFU over the outage given the Tories were awash with Russian money .
    You trying to spin it that Dale Vince money is somehow more acceptable as money from Putin’s regime? Good luck with that spin. Dale Vince is underwriting all the over the top eco activism out there. He’s at war with all of us sensible balanced people.

    It’s transparent what you are doing, going on attack as you don’t have a defence on this one.

    They who pay the Piper, play the tune Nico. No energy security for UK under Labour as they are dancing to Vince Dales funding.
  • WillGWillG Posts: 2,366
    HYUFD said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.

    Actually, the poverty in somewhere like rural Mississippi is absolutely shocking. Not just relatively startling

    But I’m bored of bashing America now. It still makes bloody great TV for a start. And on that note I’m going to watch Succession

    Later
    It may be a feature, not a bug.

    The US is designed to make poverty very unpleasant. So, avoid it.
    Yes, the US is a great place to be rich, an OK place to be average but an awful place to be poor
    Which is not a feature at all. Making poverty awful doesn't increase the chance you will get out of it. It makes it harder to escape.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,099
    WillG said:

    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy).

    Bollocks.

    Try buying from suppliers in Europe now.

    It's a fucking shitshow.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,256
    Scott_xP said:

    WillG said:

    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy).

    Bollocks.

    Try buying from suppliers in Europe now.

    It's a fucking shitshow.
    So domestic suppliers now have a competitive advantage? It will be interesting to see the medium-term effects of that.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,896

    WillG said:

    Good job we Brexited to rid ourselves of all that pesky red tape that was strangling trade.

    Oh.


    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy). EU red tape affected 100% of the economy.
    Another one of those “1+1=bananas” statements.
    Straight bananas at that.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,166
    Word of warning, the Koreans seem to have landed on the optimal alcohol concentration to get trolleyed without effort.
    Soju, at 20% alcohol, is bland enough to neck rapidly in large quantities, but potent enough to render you senseless remarkably quickly.

    On that note, I bid you all goodnight.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,779

    Good job we Brexited to rid ourselves of all that pesky red tape that was strangling trade.

    Oh.


    Thanks for the warning.

    I'll be off to Asda again tomorrow to stock up on £4 wine while I still can.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,471
    Farooq said:

    ydoethur said:

    Of course, 'Welsh' is actually a corruption of 'Walisc,' which is the Saxon for 'alien'...

    Foreigner. Stranger.
    The Saxons arrived, and called the people already here foreigners.

    Of course, things have changed a lot since then, and the boot is now on the other foot. These days, if you say you're English, you're be arrested and thrown in jail.
    Bloody Beaker People.
    Coming over here with their ceramic technology.
    What was wrong with cupping your hands to drink?
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,896

    Scott_xP said:

    WillG said:

    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy).

    Bollocks.

    Try buying from suppliers in Europe now.

    It's a fucking shitshow.
    So domestic suppliers now have a competitive advantage? It will be interesting to see the medium-term effects of that.
    Prosperity through autarky! The Pyongyang School of Economics has another graduate.
  • WillGWillG Posts: 2,366
    Leon said:

    If this was American PB.com, everywhere here would live in Omaha, Nebraska or Raleigh, North Carolina, in 4000 sq ft houses with neighbours who say “Howdy!” and bake cookies for the school lacrosse team.

    It’s really three or four different countries.

    London, UK, population 8.9 million; homicides in 2022: 109

    Omaha, Nebraska, population 487,000; homicides in 2022: 31

    Hmm

    That said I do take your point. Lots of Americans in the nicer small towns and richer suburbs have enviably lovely lives, entirely untroubled by violence and decay

    Trouble is an awful lot of Americans live in the great cities, and nearly all of them have these increasingly menacing issues

    Rome in the 4th century was like this. The cities decayed but the rich retreated to small towns and villas and, for them, life remained great
    A huge chunk, perhaps the majority, of the population of the "great American cities" live in leafy green suburbs. And crime in the downturn cores is nowhere near what it was in the late 80s. Plus in most cities it is dropping from COVID highs.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645
    Nigelb said:

    Word of warning, the Koreans seem to have landed on the optimal alcohol concentration to get trolleyed without effort.
    Soju, at 20% alcohol, is bland enough to neck rapidly in large quantities, but potent enough to render you senseless remarkably quickly.

    On that note, I bid you all goodnight.

    Enjoy your sojourn in bed :)
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,256

    Scott_xP said:

    WillG said:

    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy).

    Bollocks.

    Try buying from suppliers in Europe now.

    It's a fucking shitshow.
    So domestic suppliers now have a competitive advantage? It will be interesting to see the medium-term effects of that.
    Prosperity through autarky! The Pyongyang School of Economics has another graduate.
    It's hardly autarky when the UK has one of the most open economies in the world.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,828

    Scott_xP said:

    WillG said:

    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy).

    Bollocks.

    Try buying from suppliers in Europe now.

    It's a fucking shitshow.
    So domestic suppliers now have a competitive advantage? It will be interesting to see the medium-term effects of that.
    Prosperity through autarky! The Pyongyang School of Economics has another graduate.
    This is probably an easy undergraduate question, so forgive me. But how does the world economy generate prosperity, absent trade with other planets?
  • WillGWillG Posts: 2,366
    I looked it up. The greatest American city, New York, is primarily suburban, with 58% of the population living in suburbs.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,779

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. First that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and second that, in spite of all that, he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    It should be remembered that Major increased interest rates more in a day than has happened during the last 18 months.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,943

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Dale who?
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,708

    Farooq said:

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. Fist that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and two that in spite of all that he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    Oh. Are we about to go back to calling people "beta cucks"? I really miss that aspect of 2016.
    It is not clear which timeline Tyndall inhabits. He seems to think the UK was hampered by social chapter regulation whereas in the real world it had (has) one of the most deregulated labour markets in the world.
    It was not me that was complaining about the Social Chapter, it was Major himself, sobbing about betrayal and being deceived in his own letters to the Commission President. Dumb fuck (Major, not you).
    Major's antipathy towards the Social Chapter clearly didn't last: Labour soon signed up to it anyway, the sky didn't fall in, and Major wanted us to stay in the EU. So that really is the mootest of moot points.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,443
    WillG said:

    Good job we Brexited to rid ourselves of all that pesky red tape that was strangling trade.

    Oh.


    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy). EU red tape affected 100% of the economy.
    Plus it is self evident that unused packaging has a value. The guy messed up
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,779
    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    I've not been to America for a few years (certainly since the pandemic) but even before that I found San Francisco an intimidating city and the poverty was never far from the surface (literally) in Las Vegas.

    It is the most powerful nation and yet the levels of relative poverty (not absolute - even the poorest in America do better than many on the planet) are stark and enlightening.

    Is it a failure of personal and collective responsibility or is it a failure of a system of economy and government which offers so much in reward yet incarcerates so many as a proportion.

    Unfortunately, rather than seeing homelessness and drug addiction as a national problem requiring all sides to get involved, too many seek to make cheap political advantage.

    Actually, the poverty in somewhere like rural Mississippi is absolutely shocking. Not just relatively startling

    But I’m bored of bashing America now. It still makes bloody great TV for a start. And on that note I’m going to watch Succession

    Later
    It may be a feature, not a bug.

    The US is designed to make poverty very unpleasant. So, avoid it.
    I wonder if that could be a legacy of the settler versus indentured workers / slaves split.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645
    Andy_JS said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Dale who?
    Dangerous extremist.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,943

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Can't stop laughing at the fact that someone from Aylesbury thought Aylesbury was the furthest point from the sea in the UK.

    "Where, exactly, is the furthest point in Britain from the sea?
    Edward Lock, Harpenden, UK
    I was always led to believe it was Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire, but it seems it would be Church Flatts farm, near Coton in the Elms in Derbyshire. Latitude: 52' 43.6'N. Longitude: 1' 37.2'W
    James Oaten, Aylesbury, England"

    https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-63924,00.html

    Is it that funny? I mean, he's wrong, but it's not like Aylesbury is a fishing village.
    Andy_JS has a very odd sense of humour.
    Is he a serial killer? I wouldn’t be surprised.
    I also find these Little Britain sketches amusing.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMboDekgvz0
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    To illustrate the rampant anglophilia of PBS (Public Broadcasting Service) in the USA, the network is now broadcasting "The Queen at War" as part of its Memorial Day programming.

    Do NOT expect any revelations re: involvement of then-Princess Elizabeth in the debacle of Dieppe!
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,980
    Leon said:

    If this was American PB.com, everywhere here would live in Omaha, Nebraska or Raleigh, North Carolina, in 4000 sq ft houses with neighbours who say “Howdy!” and bake cookies for the school lacrosse team.

    It’s really three or four different countries.

    London, UK, population 8.9 million; homicides in 2022: 109

    Omaha, Nebraska, population 487,000; homicides in 2022: 31

    Hmm

    That said I do take your point. Lots of Americans in the nicer small towns and richer suburbs have enviably lovely lives, entirely untroubled by violence and decay

    Trouble is an awful lot of Americans live in the great cities, and nearly all of them have these increasingly menacing issues

    Rome in the 4th century was like this. The cities decayed but the rich retreated to small towns and villas and, for them, life remained great
    I was getting a train back from a rather enjoyable beer festival with a historian a few years ago. As the rampant weeds brushed against the windows he remarked "You know, it was the roads. It was the roads the Romans all spoke about during the decline."

  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,277

    nico679 said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Weren’t the donations made before he started supporting Just Stop Oil.

    In which case what’s the problem. The DM needs to STFU over the outage given the Tories were awash with Russian money .
    You trying to spin it that Dale Vince money is somehow more acceptable as money from Putin’s regime? Good luck with that spin. Dale Vince is underwriting all the over the top eco activism out there. He’s at war with all of us sensible balanced people.

    It’s transparent what you are doing, going on attack as you don’t have a defence on this one.

    They who pay the Piper, play the tune Nico. No energy security for UK under Labour as they are dancing to Vince Dales funding.
    What’s worse trying to save the planet or taking Russian money ? The DM is a hate filled piece of trash. Vince has also donated to Greenpeace. I’m not defending all the actions of Just Stop Oil but making the point that the DM needs to STFU with the outrage given its wholehearted support for the Tories when they were rolling in Russian money . I look forward to the DM asking the Tories to return their Russian blood money !
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,109

    Andy_JS said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Dale who?
    Dangerous extremist.
    Climate Change is far more dangerous...
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645
    Farooq said:

    ydoethur said:

    Of course, 'Welsh' is actually a corruption of 'Walisc,' which is the Saxon for 'alien'...

    Foreigner. Stranger.
    The Saxons arrived, and called the people already here foreigners.

    Of course, things have changed a lot since then, and the boot is now on the other foot. These days, if you say you're English, you're be arrested and thrown in jail.
    Quite a lot of Viking woven into the Scottish fabric.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scandinavian_Scotland
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,372
    dixiedean said:

    ...Bloody Beaker People. Coming over here...

    I preferred Kermit

  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,760
    carnforth said:

    Scott_xP said:

    WillG said:

    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy).

    Bollocks.

    Try buying from suppliers in Europe now.

    It's a fucking shitshow.
    So domestic suppliers now have a competitive advantage? It will be interesting to see the medium-term effects of that.
    Prosperity through autarky! The Pyongyang School of Economics has another graduate.
    This is probably an easy undergraduate question, so forgive me. But how does the world economy generate prosperity, absent trade with other planets?
    Surely the question is whether there would be greater prosperity if we were in SM/CU with other worlds. Pork markets on Mars.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645

    Andy_JS said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Dale who?
    Dangerous extremist.
    Climate Change is far more dangerous...
    Tackle it rationally then, not irrationally.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,864

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. First that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and second that, in spite of all that, he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    It should be remembered that Major increased interest rates more in a day than has happened during the last 18 months.
    Major left an inflation rate of 3%, it was 9% in 1990 when he came in, 4.6% in 2010 when Brown left office and is now 9%
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,864

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. First that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and second that, in spite of all that, he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    Majors's opt out from the Euro certainly meant something
  • WestieWestie Posts: 426
    edited May 2023
    Immanentisation of the eschaton alert:
    Guardian: "Suspected Russia-trained spy whale reappears off Sweden’s coast".
    The time is so ripe for a son of crop circles or son of UFOs hoax.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,980
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. First that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and second that, in spite of all that, he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    It should be remembered that Major increased interest rates more in a day than has happened during the last 18 months.
    Major left an inflation rate of 3%, it was 9% in 1990 when he came in, 4.6% in 2010 when Brown left office and is now 9%
    Damn Nigel Lawson and his inflationary ways.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,779
    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    If this was American PB.com, everywhere here would live in Omaha, Nebraska or Raleigh, North Carolina, in 4000 sq ft houses with neighbours who say “Howdy!” and bake cookies for the school lacrosse team.

    It’s really three or four different countries.

    London, UK, population 8.9 million; homicides in 2022: 109

    Omaha, Nebraska, population 487,000; homicides in 2022: 31

    Hmm

    That said I do take your point. Lots of Americans in the nicer small towns and richer suburbs have enviably lovely lives, entirely untroubled by violence and decay

    Trouble is an awful lot of Americans live in the great cities, and nearly all of them have these increasingly menacing issues

    Rome in the 4th century was like this. The cities decayed but the rich retreated to small towns and villas and, for them, life remained great
    I was getting a train back from a rather enjoyable beer festival with a historian a few years ago. As the rampant weeds brushed against the windows he remarked "You know, it was the roads. It was the roads the Romans all spoke about during the decline."

    Weeds = wild flowers = good for the environment.

    Who wants the world to look as manicured as a cemetery ?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,372
    carnforth said:

    But how does the world economy generate prosperity, absent trade with other planets?

    Wealth is created by trade and creating things - the movement of things from low-value uses to high-value uses. A tree and a seam of iron becomes an axe, which is traded to somebody who needs an axe. The faster and more often people trade, the faster and more often people create things, the more wealthier we are.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,779
    ohnotnow said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Heathener said:

    Rishi is pretty awful. An extremely wealthy nonentity who is out of his depth. He comes across as a schoolboy.

    In the last week we have seen more chaotic manoeuvring from Suella, an absolute shambles on immigration, and a quite extraordinary announcement about price capping, and there's a disturbing undercurrent in the mortgage / lending market. They are managing the singularly impressive feat of appealing to nobody.

    The tories are toast. Everybody knows it. I doubt whether opinion polls will change much right up to the day of the General Election.

    Rishi is fine. He's just not good enough to undo 13 years of failure
    He’s crap.
    He’s sub-Major, let’s be honest.

    It’s only in comparison with the deranged Truss and the flamboyant larceny of Johnson that he seems “fine”.
    John Major seems to come out better with every year that passes after his humiliating defeat in 1997.

    In fact 26 years since he left office, Major is still the longest serving Conservative PM since Thatcher and still won the most votes for any PM in history in his surprise 1992 re election victory. He left a growing economy and balanced budget for New Labour and low inflation, secured an opt out from the Euro while keeping the UK in the EU, won the Gulf War with Bush 41 and set the way for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Very interesting talk and Q and A by Sir John at the Oxford Union in March here

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W3vKLMtRgQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nutpaMhsfKE
    I would say this, but I think Major rather spoiled his capacity to be a respected uniter in the party as he has veered ever further into angry europhilia. He is of course entitled to his opinion, and should be free to express it, but he speaks about European issues with the same dull-witted sarcastic barbs (fondly self-imagined to be the height of wit) as all angry remainers do. It makes me question how fiercely really he negotiated Maastricht on our behalf.
    I am always amused by the sense of hurt and betrayal he managed to get into the letter he wrote to the European Commission President after he was stitched up over the Social Chapter just before he was ousted. It shows two things clearly. First that he was dumb enough to believe the opt outs he thought he had secured actually meant anything and second that, in spite of all that, he still couldn't break his love affair with the EC. He behaved like a betrayed spouse still not quite believing the marriage has gone wrong.
    It should be remembered that Major increased interest rates more in a day than has happened during the last 18 months.
    Major left an inflation rate of 3%, it was 9% in 1990 when he came in, 4.6% in 2010 when Brown left office and is now 9%
    Damn Nigel Lawson and his inflationary ways.
    Shadowing the DM and cutting interest rates during a genuine economic boom to do so.

    Followed by the 'oil shock' of 1990.
  • WestieWestie Posts: 426
    edited May 2023

    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    If this was American PB.com, everywhere here would live in Omaha, Nebraska or Raleigh, North Carolina, in 4000 sq ft houses with neighbours who say “Howdy!” and bake cookies for the school lacrosse team.

    It’s really three or four different countries.

    London, UK, population 8.9 million; homicides in 2022: 109

    Omaha, Nebraska, population 487,000; homicides in 2022: 31

    Hmm

    That said I do take your point. Lots of Americans in the nicer small towns and richer suburbs have enviably lovely lives, entirely untroubled by violence and decay

    Trouble is an awful lot of Americans live in the great cities, and nearly all of them have these increasingly menacing issues

    Rome in the 4th century was like this. The cities decayed but the rich retreated to small towns and villas and, for them, life remained great
    I was getting a train back from a rather enjoyable beer festival with a historian a few years ago. As the rampant weeds brushed against the windows he remarked "You know, it was the roads. It was the roads the Romans all spoke about during the decline."

    Weeds = wild flowers = good for the environment.

    Who wants the world to look as manicured as a cemetery ?
    I hope you're trolling. But a fun place to visit is what used to be the hoverport at Pegwell Bay near Ramsgate, which is well on its way back to nature:

    image
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,779
    viewcode said:

    carnforth said:

    But how does the world economy generate prosperity, absent trade with other planets?

    Wealth is created by trade and creating things - the movement of things from low-value uses to high-value uses. A tree and a seam of iron becomes an axe, which is traded to somebody who needs an axe. The faster and more often people trade, the faster and more often people create things, the more wealthier we are.
    Plus doing the same things more effectively or cheaper or quicker.

    The axes B&Q sell will have been made a lot easier than those a neolithic trader sold.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,372

    viewcode said:

    carnforth said:

    But how does the world economy generate prosperity, absent trade with other planets?

    Wealth is created by trade and creating things - the movement of things from low-value uses to high-value uses. A tree and a seam of iron becomes an axe, which is traded to somebody who needs an axe. The faster and more often people trade, the faster and more often people create things, the more wealthier we are.
    Plus doing the same things more effectively or cheaper or quicker.

    The axes B&Q sell will have been made a lot easier than those a neolithic trader sold.
    Indeed.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,372
    All is happy now: Geoff Marshall has posted from RGB https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4Q3JrdMdGs
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645
    edited May 2023
    nico679 said:

    nico679 said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Weren’t the donations made before he started supporting Just Stop Oil.

    In which case what’s the problem. The DM needs to STFU over the outage given the Tories were awash with Russian money .
    You trying to spin it that Dale Vince money is somehow more acceptable as money from Putin’s regime? Good luck with that spin. Dale Vince is underwriting all the over the top eco activism out there. He’s at war with all of us sensible balanced people.

    It’s transparent what you are doing, going on attack as you don’t have a defence on this one.

    They who pay the Piper, play the tune Nico. No energy security for UK under Labour as they are dancing to Vince Dales funding.
    What’s worse trying to save the planet or taking Russian money ? The DM is a hate filled piece of trash. Vince has also donated to Greenpeace. I’m not defending all the actions of Just Stop Oil but making the point that the DM needs to STFU with the outrage given its wholehearted support for the Tories when they were rolling in Russian money . I look forward to the DM asking the Tories to return their Russian blood money !
    I bought the Sunday Telegraph yesterday. Every other page is an angle on Trans, like nothing else going on in the world. Bit boring and a tad unhinged to go over the top on one issue like that.

    I also thought the Telegraphs coverage of the current economic situation rather clueless. Anyone who wants to argue or use the headline it’s the bank of of Englands fault, and I’m up for a proper tear up and knocking some sense into these heads so we can hear their two brain cells, neither in use, rattle about. The BoE have remit on inflation, they have a 2% target, in my view utterly arbitrary and meaningless as it was set when in an untypical era of historically lower inflation. The bank have some levers to pull in the fight against inflation, but the governments generous hand out schemes, spraying money around like confetti, quite thoroughly undermined the inflation busting monetary tightening efforts at the banks disposal. RCS pointed us to a Truss era leaflet where the Tories were boasting about spending on the way up to 10% of GDP, bucking the UKs energy market.

    A couple of sentences around BoE and Government failing to read the tea leaves, and have not acted in a joined up way - bank building a sandcastle, government washing it away - would have been far superior to the pages of drivel the Telegraph published on this.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645
    Westie said:

    Immanentisation of the eschaton alert:
    Guardian: "Suspected Russia-trained spy whale reappears off Sweden’s coast".
    The time is so ripe for a son of crop circles or son of UFOs hoax.

    It could be a double agent.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,109

    Westie said:

    Immanentisation of the eschaton alert:
    Guardian: "Suspected Russia-trained spy whale reappears off Sweden’s coast".
    The time is so ripe for a son of crop circles or son of UFOs hoax.

    It could be a double agent.
    Blubber agent
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,109

    Andy_JS said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Dale who?
    Dangerous extremist.
    Climate Change is far more dangerous...
    Tackle it rationally then, not irrationally.
    Reading the Daily Mail is NOT rational.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,645

    Westie said:

    Immanentisation of the eschaton alert:
    Guardian: "Suspected Russia-trained spy whale reappears off Sweden’s coast".
    The time is so ripe for a son of crop circles or son of UFOs hoax.

    It could be a double agent.
    Blubber agent
    I was thinking it could keep everyone guessing which tide it’s on.

    Puns? Might as whale.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,372
    Importance of the Anglo-Portugese alliance during WWII

    https://mastodon.me.uk/@garius/110339945582921150
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,125

    nico679 said:

    nico679 said:

    It’s Official. Starmer’s Labour are complete idiots.

    They accepted money from Dale Vince.

    Weren’t the donations made before he started supporting Just Stop Oil.

    In which case what’s the problem. The DM needs to STFU over the outage given the Tories were awash with Russian money .
    You trying to spin it that Dale Vince money is somehow more acceptable as money from Putin’s regime? Good luck with that spin. Dale Vince is underwriting all the over the top eco activism out there. He’s at war with all of us sensible balanced people.

    It’s transparent what you are doing, going on attack as you don’t have a defence on this one.

    They who pay the Piper, play the tune Nico. No energy security for UK under Labour as they are dancing to Vince Dales funding.
    What’s worse trying to save the planet or taking Russian money ? The DM is a hate filled piece of trash. Vince has also donated to Greenpeace. I’m not defending all the actions of Just Stop Oil but making the point that the DM needs to STFU with the outrage given its wholehearted support for the Tories when they were rolling in Russian money . I look forward to the DM asking the Tories to return their Russian blood money !
    I bought the Sunday Telegraph yesterday. Every other page is an angle on Trans, like nothing else going on in the world. Bit boring and a tad unhinged to go over the top on one issue like that.

    I also thought the Telegraphs coverage of the current economic situation rather clueless. Anyone who wants to argue or use the headline it’s the bank of of Englands fault, and I’m up for a proper tear up and knocking some sense into these heads so we can hear their two brain cells, neither in use, rattle about. The BoE have remit on inflation, they have a 2% target, in my view utterly arbitrary and meaningless as it was set when in an untypical era of historically lower inflation. The bank have some levers to pull in the fight against inflation, but the governments generous hand out schemes, spraying money around like confetti, quite thoroughly undermined the inflation busting monetary tightening efforts at the banks disposal. RCS pointed us to a Truss era leaflet where the Tories were boasting about spending on the way up to 10% of GDP, bucking the UKs energy market.

    A couple of sentences around BoE and Government failing to read the tea leaves, and have not acted in a joined up way - bank building a sandcastle, government washing it away - would have been far superior to the pages of drivel the Telegraph published on this.
    The 2% inflation target, though better than what came before, is heavily flawed for two main reasons:

    - it does not distinguish between demand and input cost inflation, which need radically different answers. The former needs jumping on immediately, but if you do so with the latter after, say, a spike in global food prices, you risk plunging the economy into an unnecessary recession.
    - the measure of inflation we target is a very narrow measure of the cost of living, and it does not include asset prices, even though many people's biggest expense is their home. This means that the Bank (and the Fed and the ECB) become in effect serial bubble blowers, because manufactured goods and most commodities have been relatively cheap over the last generation, so interest rates have been kept too low, which has been one of the major factors in blowing asset price bubble after bubble - not just houses, also fine art, cryptocurrencies, tech stocks, etc. etc. Now, there is a danger of a correction the other way - a big price spike in commodities causing unnecessary asset price crashes.

    Given these issues, it is surprising it worked as well as it did for as long as it did. But we should rethink the framework.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,125
    carnforth said:

    Scott_xP said:

    WillG said:

    New red tape only affects UK exports to Europe (14% of the economy).

    Bollocks.

    Try buying from suppliers in Europe now.

    It's a fucking shitshow.
    So domestic suppliers now have a competitive advantage? It will be interesting to see the medium-term effects of that.
    Prosperity through autarky! The Pyongyang School of Economics has another graduate.
    This is probably an easy undergraduate question, so forgive me. But how does the world economy generate prosperity, absent trade with other planets?
    - technological change
    - productive investment that increases the capital stock
    - improved human capital

    Also structural reforms like reducing corruption, protecting property rights, etc., which Western economists have historically underestimated because we take property rights and reasonably effective government for granted.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,166
    edited May 2023
    Labour plans to allow local authorities to buy land cheaply for development
    Exclusive: If elected next year, party would allow officials to buy up land at fraction of potential cost as part of ‘pro-building’ agenda
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/may/29/labour-allow-local-authorities-buy-land-cheaply-for-development
    ...An analysis by the Centre for Progressive Policy in 2018 found that planning permission inflated the price of agricultural land by 275 times, pushing it up from £22,520 per hectare to £6.2m per hectare...

    Coupled with their intentions towards planning law, that would be radical change indeed.

    Starmer no policies ?

    HS2 would have been massively cheaper, too.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,166
    So much for the enquiry.
    How much of this is about Boris, and how much the PPE contracts ?

    Cabinet Office may take legal action to deny Covid inquiry Boris Johnson material
    Such a challenge over Lady Hallett’s request for unredacted diaries and messages would be seen as unprecedented
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/may/29/cabinet-office-may-take-legal-action-to-deny-covid-inquiry-lady-hallett-boris-johnson-material
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,125
    Nigelb said:

    Labour plans to allow local authorities to buy land cheaply for development
    Exclusive: If elected next year, party would allow officials to buy up land at fraction of potential cost as part of ‘pro-building’ agenda
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/may/29/labour-allow-local-authorities-buy-land-cheaply-for-development
    ...An analysis by the Centre for Progressive Policy in 2018 found that planning permission inflated the price of agricultural land by 275 times, pushing it up from £22,520 per hectare to £6.2m per hectare...

    Coupled with their intentions towards planning law, that would be radical change indeed.

    Starmer no policies ?

    HS2 would have been massively cheaper, too.

    Believe it when it happens.

    Or, more likely, at the first NIMBY revolt, the gutless coward Starmer will drop it even faster than he dropped all the policies he was elected Labour leader on.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,112
    edited May 2023
    Fishing said:

    Nigelb said:

    Labour plans to allow local authorities to buy land cheaply for development
    Exclusive: If elected next year, party would allow officials to buy up land at fraction of potential cost as part of ‘pro-building’ agenda
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/may/29/labour-allow-local-authorities-buy-land-cheaply-for-development
    ...An analysis by the Centre for Progressive Policy in 2018 found that planning permission inflated the price of agricultural land by 275 times, pushing it up from £22,520 per hectare to £6.2m per hectare...

    Coupled with their intentions towards planning law, that would be radical change indeed.

    Starmer no policies ?

    HS2 would have been massively cheaper, too.

    Believe it when it happens.

    Or, more likely, at the first NIMBY revolt, the gutless coward Starmer will drop it even faster than he dropped all the policies he was elected Labour leader on.
    That's part of the genius of it. Labour have few rural constituencies at present, and not many targeted rural ones, so it is a policy well fitted to their electorate. Neither Con or LD could do the same.
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