Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

Hopefully, we’ll see some Lineker polling this weekend – politicalbetting.com

1456810

Comments

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,781
    edited March 2023
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    RobD said:

    New @Survation poll of Scottish voters:

    SNP: 40% (-3)
    Labour: 32% (+2)
    Conservatives: 18% (+1)
    Lib Dems: 6% (-)
    Greens: 2%
    Alba: 1%
    Others: 2%

    8-10 March, changes with 15-17

    Dare I say that we’ve witnessed peak SNP? Klaxon on standby.
    A thread tomorrow does discuss that.

    It contains two very subtle puns and a not very incendiary comparison of the SNP to the IRA in the first draft.
    Oh, not mentioning Meibion Glyndŵr then?
    I do plan to mention them in an upcoming thread.

    In short is the Royal Family's failure to carry out an investiture for the new Prince of Wales an acceptance that foisting a Prince of Wales on the Welsh stokes Welsh nationalism and violence.

    Further proof that the monarchy isn't as popular as its supporters think it is.
    I think it’s time for a ceremony to invest the new Duke of Edinburgh.
    Possibly in Glasgow.
    Edinburgh is very royalist, see the queues to see the Queen lying in state there.

    There has not been and I doubt ever will be a Duke of Glasgow however, albeit there is an Earl of Glasgow who is a LD peer
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Boyle,_10th_Earl_of_Glasgow
    Ever heard of things called 'trains' and 'buses' and 'cars'? We do have them in Scotland, so people came from all over. Not particularly local.
    Voters in Lothians want to retain the monarchy by a 9% margin compared to only a 3% margin in Glasgow

    Lothian voters would also keep the monarchy by a 2% margin if Scotland went independent, Glasgow voters would go for a republic by a 12% margin if Scotland went independent however
    https://docs.cdn.yougov.com/hswqd1wxs5/TheTimes_Scot_VI_221004_.pdf (p32)
    As usual, you are carefuilly omitting the very large DK and "neither good nor bad" values there. I;d be shitting bricks if I were a Royal advisor with those values.
    What utter rubbish. Given 45% of Scots voted for independence in 2014, for monarchists in Scotland to still have a 16% lead is a terrible result for Scottish republicans
    Typical ignorance from you. Republicanism is a different question from independence. The two are only linked because Torty politicians like you keep dragging the Royals into politics.

    Look at those tables again. They are full of 30 and 40 in favour - not the 80 and 90 which your cringing royalism requires.,
    They are somewhat interlinked. Most nations which got independence from the British Empire or UK, including Ireland, now have their own heads of state.

    A win is a win, even if only 1% for monarchists in a hypothetical independent Scotland but the 16% headline lead for monarchists in Scotland is even bigger than the 10% lead for No to independence in 2014. Hence Unionists should make light of the fact that maintaining the Union keeps the monarchy, especially when the likes of Yousaf and Regan say they want Scotland to be independent and then to ditch the King
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,973
    Tres said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Serious thinkers know that Brexit has set this country back decades.
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    https://twitter.com/TLDRNewsUK/status/1634636143177129985

    🔴 NEW: The Illegal Migration Bill will allow for the detention and deportation of families with children and unaccompanied children if their country of origin is safe, @ObserverUK reports.

    The move marks an effective reversal of a previous David Cameron ban on child detention.

    Would anyone like to give a bash at defending this inhumanity?

    The “inhumanity” is the series of hoops that genuine immigrants, many of whom have useful skills or are married to British citizens, face when trying to do things the correct way.
    A widespread feature in UK life is how those who follow the rules lose out to those who don't.

    Seems to apply from top to bottom.
    I can’t move back to the UK with my wife, as I haven’t earned £26,000 in the UK for the past two years. Because I live abroad. With my wife. Becuase why wouldn’t I want to live with my wife?

    The system is set up to deal with basically Commonweath countries and arranged marriages, fall outside that and you’re screwed.

    She’s Ukranian, but I can’t sponsor her as a refugee becuase she hasn’t been living in Ukraine.

    Perhaps I should leave my wife in Calais, and give a couple of bags of sand to some Albanian with a small boat?
    Am sorry to hear of your circumstances, for you & yours.

    Have you tried contacting your MP?

    This is the kind of thing, where sometimes they may be able to help. (Emphasis on conditional, but something.)
    Don’t worry, we’re quite happy living somewhere where it’s currently 80ºF at midnight, rather than 30ºF and snowing.

    Oh, and I’d have to pay income tax at 40% in the UK, which I don’t have to when living in Dubai.

    If we really wanted to move to the UK we could, but there would be about £5k in legal fees and she wouldn’t be able to work for two years while the paperwork got sorted.

    But someone who arrives on a boat gets a free lawyer who can make unlimited appeals, free accommodation in an hotel, and seemingly an inability to ever actually be deported.
    Either way Sandpit, it is an absurdly dysfunctional system. If it were up to me you would have every right to come and go as you please with your spouse, without petty interference from jobsworth officials.
    I recall Sandpit discussing this some time back, and making similar comments.
    The hoops to jump through for spouses have multiplied under successive governments (though largely of one persuasion).

    I’m very grateful that my wife (who has been resident since the 80s) applied for citizenship just before it became impossibly bureaucratic. For decades it wasn’t even something to worry about.
    It's not new news. My wife is pretty lefty on most things but still refuses to vote Labour as Jacqui Smith was the home secretary when she was going through the indefinite leave to remain process.
    She started following me on Twitter this week. Not sure to what I owe the honour. I have a decidedly random selection of political followers.
  • Klopp backs Lineker.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
  • Something for the antiwoke to lose their shit over.

    A head of risk assessment at the beleaguered Silicon Valley Bank has been accused of prioritizing pro-diversity initiatives over her actual role after the firm imploded on Friday.

    Jay Ersapah - who describes herself as a 'queer person of color from a working-class background' - organized a host of LGBTQ initiatives including a month-long Pride campaign and implemented 'safe space' catch-ups for staff.

    In a corporate video published just nine months ago, she said she 'could not be prouder' to work for SVB serving 'underrepresented entrepreneurs.'


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11848705/Woke-head-risk-assessment-Silicon-Valley-Bank-accused-prioritizing-diversity-issues.html
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,973

    Klopp backs Lineker.

    Time for the goalies next. Which way round is it: Southall the lefty and Shilton the righty?
  • TimS said:

    Klopp backs Lineker.

    Time for the goalies next. Which way round is it: Southall the lefty and Shilton the righty?
    Yes.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,650
    edited March 2023
    Sandpit said:

    tlg86 said:

    I think it’s really hard to say what the reaction to the SVB news right now, but it looks like a lot of tech companies on both sides of the Atlantic are badly exposed, and a number are basically insolvent now. I worry the markets have been waiting for a reason to go into meltdown. This could be it.

    What’s the deal with this bank? Surely a bank is a bank is a bank? Why are these particular companies with this bank?
    They were a very specialist bank, working with VC and tech startups. They have very few normal retail customers.
    Where do W3W keep their money?

    Just askin...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,340
    I mean, I'm ashamed to say it but surely the real Match Of The Day was the England v. France rugby game?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,394
    Frank Lampard is a Tory out of a job.
    Just saying.
    Will help everyone get an early night for the Nation's general health.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    I mean, I'm ashamed to say it but surely the real Match Of The Day was the England v. France rugby game?

    Nope. It was Bolton v Ipswich
  • By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    GIN1138 said:

    Foxy said:

    50% favourable vs 30% unfavourable for GL on Yougov Daily.

    53% vs 27% think BBC wrong to suspend GL

    51% to 28% support other presenters in their solidarity.

    Hmm. On those numbers there will be something of a reverse ferret.
    What the BBC should have done is... nothing. Until summer... Then they should have quietly "revamped" MOTD and announced the new look version would be without the Sainted Gary. They should have thanked him so much for his contribution, wished him all the best etc etc. And quietly shoved him out of the back door.

    But they are where they are. At this point I can't see how they can take him back. The moment the producers start allowing the "talent" to call the shots their finished... As literally every loudmouth at the BBC will think they have carte blanche to say whatever they want and they will be untouchable.

    For better or worse they've taken a stand against Lineker and they have to stick by that now and wait for the media storm to roll on to the next "crisis"
    My guess is Lineker will refuse to make any apology or future commitment. The BBC will then issue a statement along the lines of, we have concluded our investigation and discussed our findings with Gary. We reiterated to him the importance of all our personnel maintaining strict neutrality on political issues. No further action will be taken.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,967

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Just looked in my old work email account. I’ve had invites to five law firm briefings about the SVB collapse sent today. That’s not a great sign!

    Tempted to sell my financials when they open. They could drop sharply when the USA opens.
    I wouldn't. I've heard no panic at all amongst my contacts.

    If there is one I will be buying on Monday.
    I think the market quite toppy at the moment. A lot of companies will be squeezed by the cost of borrowing. I moved last week to a more defensive position with more in cash. I am inclined to make that more defensive still on Monday.
    I refer the honourable gentleman to the comments I made yesterday about SVB.

    Don't panic, I'm working on it [The SVB fallout]

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330951/#Comment_4330951

    Honestly if it wasn't for insider trading rules the fact Caesar's wife must be above suspicion I'd be buying lots of bank shares right now.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330959/#Comment_4330959

    It’s true, though, that banks in the US are sitting on some very hefty unrealised losses on their HTM bonds. That’s not a problem if they have strong balance sheets, but I’d guess there are a number of regional banks anxious about their corporate depositors deciding their cash would be safer in govt bonds.

    Other runs might not be impossible ?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,539

    Something for the antiwoke to lose their shit over.

    A head of risk assessment at the beleaguered Silicon Valley Bank has been accused of prioritizing pro-diversity initiatives over her actual role after the firm imploded on Friday.

    Jay Ersapah - who describes herself as a 'queer person of color from a working-class background' - organized a host of LGBTQ initiatives including a month-long Pride campaign and implemented 'safe space' catch-ups for staff.

    In a corporate video published just nine months ago, she said she 'could not be prouder' to work for SVB serving 'underrepresented entrepreneurs.'


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11848705/Woke-head-risk-assessment-Silicon-Valley-Bank-accused-prioritizing-diversity-issues.html

    Oh well, this racist, sexist and homophonic bankruptcy will be leaving a lot of “queer entrepreneurs of color” looking for money next week.
  • I mean, I'm ashamed to say it but surely the real Match Of The Day was the England v. France rugby game?

    No - Bournemouth v Liverpool
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,340

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    The polling of public opinion seems to be that they support the Government on small boats, think Lineker's comments were out of order, but they still like Lineker and think he should be presenting MOTD and not taken off air.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,792

    I mean, I'm ashamed to say it but surely the real Match Of The Day was the England v. France rugby game?

    France = Labour
    England = Tories

    :)
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,251
    Barnesian said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Foxy said:

    50% favourable vs 30% unfavourable for GL on Yougov Daily.

    53% vs 27% think BBC wrong to suspend GL

    51% to 28% support other presenters in their solidarity.

    Hmm. On those numbers there will be something of a reverse ferret.
    What the BBC should have done is... nothing. Until summer... Then they should have quietly "revamped" MOTD and announced the new look version would be without the Sainted Gary. They should have thanked him so much for his contribution, wished him all the best etc etc. And quietly shoved him out of the back door.

    But they are where they are. At this point I can't see how they can take him back. The moment the producers start allowing the "talent" to call the shots their finished... As literally every loudmouth at the BBC will think they have carte blanche to say whatever they want and they will be untouchable.

    For better or worse they've taken a stand against Lineker and they have to stick by that now and wait for the media storm to roll on to the next "crisis"
    I don't think the DG, Tim Davie, agrees with you. He's backpeddling like mad.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-64928582
    I dare say they are. But they're just setting themselves up for more problems down the track IMO.

    We shall see.
  • By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That's an old poll.

    There's a much newer poll on the subject of Lineker.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That’s okay because it was the Government’s words, not actions, Lineker was so comparing. Which is why the public support him on this issue against the Tories, whose rhetoric has also been described as Nazi-like by Holocaust survivors. Who they also tried to ban as a result.
  • FF43 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Foxy said:

    50% favourable vs 30% unfavourable for GL on Yougov Daily.

    53% vs 27% think BBC wrong to suspend GL

    51% to 28% support other presenters in their solidarity.

    Hmm. On those numbers there will be something of a reverse ferret.
    What the BBC should have done is... nothing. Until summer... Then they should have quietly "revamped" MOTD and announced the new look version would be without the Sainted Gary. They should have thanked him so much for his contribution, wished him all the best etc etc. And quietly shoved him out of the back door.

    But they are where they are. At this point I can't see how they can take him back. The moment the producers start allowing the "talent" to call the shots their finished... As literally every loudmouth at the BBC will think they have carte blanche to say whatever they want and they will be untouchable.

    For better or worse they've taken a stand against Lineker and they have to stick by that now and wait for the media storm to roll on to the next "crisis"
    My guess is Lineker will refuse to make any apology or future commitment. The BBC will then issue a statement along the lines of, we have concluded our investigation and discussed our findings with Gary. We reiterated to him the importance of all our personnel maintaining strict neutrality on political issues. No further action will be taken.
    Most probably
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,539

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    https://twitter.com/TLDRNewsUK/status/1634636143177129985

    🔴 NEW: The Illegal Migration Bill will allow for the detention and deportation of families with children and unaccompanied children if their country of origin is safe, @ObserverUK reports.

    The move marks an effective reversal of a previous David Cameron ban on child detention.

    Would anyone like to give a bash at defending this inhumanity?

    The “inhumanity” is the series of hoops that genuine immigrants, many of whom have useful skills or are married to British citizens, face when trying to do things the correct way.
    A widespread feature in UK life is how those who follow the rules lose out to those who don't.

    Seems to apply from top to bottom.
    I can’t move back to the UK with my wife, as I haven’t earned £26,000 in the UK for the past two years. Because I live abroad. With my wife. Becuase why wouldn’t I want to live with my wife?

    The system is set up to deal with basically Commonweath countries and arranged marriages, fall outside that and you’re screwed.

    She’s Ukranian, but I can’t sponsor her as a refugee becuase she hasn’t been living in Ukraine.

    Perhaps I should leave my wife in Calais, and give a couple of bags of sand to some Albanian with a small boat?
    Am sorry to hear of your circumstances, for you & yours.

    Have you tried contacting your MP?

    This is the kind of thing, where sometimes they may be able to help. (Emphasis on conditional, but something.)
    Don’t worry, we’re quite happy living somewhere where it’s currently 80ºF at midnight, rather than 30ºF and snowing.

    Oh, and I’d have to pay income tax at 40% in the UK, which I don’t have to when living in Dubai.

    If we really wanted to move to the UK we could, but there would be about £5k in legal fees and she wouldn’t be able to work for two years while the paperwork got sorted.

    But someone who arrives on a boat gets a free lawyer who can make unlimited appeals, free accommodation in an hotel, and seemingly an inability to ever actually be deported.
    Either way Sandpit, it is an absurdly dysfunctional system. If it were up to me you would have every right to come and go as you please with your spouse, without petty interference from jobsworth officials.
    Thanks. The main issue is that the situation that falls through the cracks, is much more common these days. Work abroad, meet woman and get married.

    There’s also the complication that we live somewhere where will never be citizens, so it’s not like people moving to the US.

    The underlying problem, as far as the UK is concerned, is that there were a lot of abuses from certain sub-continental communities, involving arranged marriages of very young and not always willing women. It’s difficult to write a law that outlaws that, whilst also not covering my own case.

    There needs to be a clause in immigration law, that covers people returning home with a wife they met whilst working abroad.

    As it happens, Mrs Sandpit could easily make the salary requirement to apply for a visa in her own right. She’s a qualified English teacher and translator of Russian and Ukranian.
    The irony is that post Brexit the abuses you suggest are probably more prevalent now than they used to be. I hope sanity prevails. Good wishes.
    I was in favour of the UK leaving the EU, in part because of the immigration system that made it almost impossible for a non-EU immigrant who wasn’t making a fortune to get a visa.

    Now if Ukraine joins the EU, which I think might take quite a while, I may be proven wrong on this.

    The current system, as expected, makes it easier for a non-EU immigrant to apply for a visa in their own right.

    None of the above changes my view, that I should be able to live in my own country of citizenship with my wife, without a load of expensive and time-consuming bureaucracy.
    Hope you get it all sorted.
    Thankfully there’s nothing to get sorted. We are happy living where we are living, for the next decade anyway.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,999
    edited March 2023
    GIN1138 said:

    Barnesian said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Foxy said:

    50% favourable vs 30% unfavourable for GL on Yougov Daily.

    53% vs 27% think BBC wrong to suspend GL

    51% to 28% support other presenters in their solidarity.

    Hmm. On those numbers there will be something of a reverse ferret.
    What the BBC should have done is... nothing. Until summer... Then they should have quietly "revamped" MOTD and announced the new look version would be without the Sainted Gary. They should have thanked him so much for his contribution, wished him all the best etc etc. And quietly shoved him out of the back door.

    But they are where they are. At this point I can't see how they can take him back. The moment the producers start allowing the "talent" to call the shots their finished... As literally every loudmouth at the BBC will think they have carte blanche to say whatever they want and they will be untouchable.

    For better or worse they've taken a stand against Lineker and they have to stick by that now and wait for the media storm to roll on to the next "crisis"
    I don't think the DG, Tim Davie, agrees with you. He's backpeddling like mad.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-64928582
    I dare say they are. But they're just setting themselves up for more problems down the track IMO.

    We shall see.
    The solution is pretty obvious. Yes, talent running the show is bad for organisational discipline, but the ship has sailed, so getting ahead of it to limit the damage and at least keep the news reporters on message is probably the best they can do. The public don't care about the rest being partial (or even news, if we're honest, people like slanted news), and politicians sure don't, except on a case by case basis if they agree with the person in question.
  • By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That's an old poll.

    There's a much newer poll on the subject of Lineker.
    To be fair you can back free speech for Lineker but also consider it inappropriate to refer or imply actions by Nazis
  • Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Just looked in my old work email account. I’ve had invites to five law firm briefings about the SVB collapse sent today. That’s not a great sign!

    Tempted to sell my financials when they open. They could drop sharply when the USA opens.
    I wouldn't. I've heard no panic at all amongst my contacts.

    If there is one I will be buying on Monday.
    I think the market quite toppy at the moment. A lot of companies will be squeezed by the cost of borrowing. I moved last week to a more defensive position with more in cash. I am inclined to make that more defensive still on Monday.
    I refer the honourable gentleman to the comments I made yesterday about SVB.

    Don't panic, I'm working on it [The SVB fallout]

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330951/#Comment_4330951

    Honestly if it wasn't for insider trading rules the fact Caesar's wife must be above suspicion I'd be buying lots of bank shares right now.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330959/#Comment_4330959

    It’s true, though, that banks in the US are sitting on some very hefty unrealised losses on their HTM bonds. That’s not a problem if they have strong balance sheets, but I’d guess there are a number of regional banks anxious about their corporate depositors deciding their cash would be safer in govt bonds.

    Other runs might not be impossible ?
    I think most of you know my job involves stress testing the financial institution I work for (and the wider industry.)

    As worst case scenarios go this isn't in the top 20 and we can survive most of the scenarios.

    I think a nuclear exchange in Ukraine and/or a Chinese invasion of Taiwan is what might bugger things up.
  • By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    The polling of public opinion seems to be that they support the Government on small boats, think Lineker's comments were out of order, but they still like Lineker and think he should be presenting MOTD and not taken off air.
    Seems that is a fair assessment
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Interesting fact. None of the teams that have lost 9-0 in the Premier League lost their subsequent league game agains the same opponent.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,394
    edited March 2023
    FF43 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Foxy said:

    50% favourable vs 30% unfavourable for GL on Yougov Daily.

    53% vs 27% think BBC wrong to suspend GL

    51% to 28% support other presenters in their solidarity.

    Hmm. On those numbers there will be something of a reverse ferret.
    What the BBC should have done is... nothing. Until summer... Then they should have quietly "revamped" MOTD and announced the new look version would be without the Sainted Gary. They should have thanked him so much for his contribution, wished him all the best etc etc. And quietly shoved him out of the back door.

    But they are where they are. At this point I can't see how they can take him back. The moment the producers start allowing the "talent" to call the shots their finished... As literally every loudmouth at the BBC will think they have carte blanche to say whatever they want and they will be untouchable.

    For better or worse they've taken a stand against Lineker and they have to stick by that now and wait for the media storm to roll on to the next "crisis"
    My guess is Lineker will refuse to make any apology or future commitment. The BBC will then issue a statement along the lines of, we have concluded our investigation and discussed our findings with Gary. We reiterated to him the importance of all our personnel maintaining strict neutrality on political issues. No further action will be taken.
    He's not their "personnel'.
    Contracted employees put on football commentary today.
    Why should he maintain strict neutrality?
    Before you answer that, ask yourself how you would feel if that was made a condition of contracting you.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,781
    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
    And by 39 on average they will be on the housing ladder and open to voting Conservative
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,999

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    The polling of public opinion seems to be that they support the Government on small boats, think Lineker's comments were out of order, but they still like Lineker and think he should be presenting MOTD and not taken off air.
    In fairness a decently nuanced position for a public poll for once. The outraged snowflakeson one side and the over egging free speech martyrs on the other are definitely milking things a bit far in comparison.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,999
    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
    And by 39 on average they will be on the housing ladder and open to voting Conservative
    Why set you sights so low? Maybe try to get more peopel on the ladder and open to voting Conservative sooner? Just a thought.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,539

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    The polling of public opinion seems to be that they support the Government on small boats, think Lineker's comments were out of order, but they still like Lineker and think he should be presenting MOTD and not taken off air.
    As with many of us here, support freedom of speech but also agree with government policy on small boats.

    Obviously none of the pollsters are asking how funny we think it is, that the BBC have got themselves into a right mess from which there’s no way out that doesn’t diminish themselves and the “unique way they’re funded”?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,586
    edited March 2023
    dixiedean said:

    Foxy said:

    dixiedean said:

    Surely MOTD viewership depends solely on which teams have won?

    Yeah.
    As an Evertonian I can barely recall tuning in.
    Better for thee than me today.

    4/1 on Leicester relegation is great value. Should be evens or odds on.
    There's a fair way to go and it's three from eight.
    No one is marooned, and a single win jumps you heavily.
    Could be the most fascinating relegation battle in years. Wouldn't put money on anyone right now. Particularly as none of the eight seem able to score much.
    Yeah, but we have Rodgers, and his teams always fade in the run in. We have no leeway for that.

    The stands started emptying 20 min early today, with the remaining fans singing that Brendan needs to be sacked. It is getting to be a toxic atmosphere.

    Cracking goal by Daka though.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,960
    FF43 said:

    My guess is Lineker will refuse to make any apology or future commitment. The BBC will then issue a statement along the lines of, we have concluded our investigation and discussed our findings with Gary. We reiterated to him the importance of all our personnel maintaining strict neutrality on political issues. No further action will be taken.

    They did that on Thursday.

    Then fucked it up on Friday
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,640
    TimS said:

    I think it’s really hard to say what the reaction to the SVB news right now, but it looks like a lot of tech companies on both sides of the Atlantic are badly exposed, and a number are basically insolvent now. I worry the markets have been waiting for a reason to go into meltdown. This could be it.

    That’s the worry.

    But, fundamentals are quite strong. It’s been a long time since I’ve been able to say that.

    Commodity prices are declining and a Chinese steel-buying boom looks unlikely in the immediate future. So companies will have more money to spend soon.

    Wage inflation is taking off in the developed world thanks to continuing labour market tightness and cost of living, and that will continue. But the cost of living will fall due to commodities. So people will also have more money to spend soon. Plus they all saved during Covid and haven’t spent it all yet.

    And large language model AI is going to transform the white collar sector imminently.

    So this looks like a 1987 or 1997. Buying opportunity.
    The tech sector has started to get very interesting again and this will undoubtedly set things back, but I tend to agree that there will also be some very tasty bargains emerging over the next few weeks. But care will be needed. Totally agree on AI. I’ve just taken an advisory board position with one and I’m excited about it.

  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,351
    edited March 2023
    GIN1138 said:

    Foxy said:

    50% favourable vs 30% unfavourable for GL on Yougov Daily.

    53% vs 27% think BBC wrong to suspend GL

    51% to 28% support other presenters in their solidarity.

    Hmm. On those numbers there will be something of a reverse ferret.
    What the BBC should have done is... nothing. Until summer... Then they should have quietly "revamped" MOTD and announced the new look version would be without the Sainted Gary. They should have thanked him so much for his contribution, wished him all the best etc etc. And quietly shoved him out of the back door.

    But they are where they are. At this point I can't see how they can take him back. The moment the producers start allowing the "talent" to call the shots their finished... As literally every loudmouth at the BBC will think they have carte blanche to say whatever they want and they will be untouchable.

    For better or worse they've taken a stand against Lineker and they have to stick by that now and wait for the media storm to roll on to the next "crisis"
    Logically, you're right. Regardless of one's views on Lineker's tweets, unless Lineker backs down (removes the tweet and promises good future behaviour), I'm not quite sure how the BBC can find a way out of this without removing him permanently. And it doesn't look as if Lineker will back down, for which he deserves credit (sticking to his principles/beliefs).

    All of which makes me think that it's been handled terribly. The BBC management have made what should have been a private matter a public one. They should have sought a resolution quietly, in private, without removing him from his role tonight and provoking the outpouring of solidarity. Poor decision-making.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,572
    DougSeal said:

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That’s okay because it was the Government’s words, not actions, Lineker was so comparing. Which is why the public support him on this issue against the Tories, whose rhetoric has also been described as Nazi-like by Holocaust survivors. Who they also tried to ban as a result.
    So you think that Lineker has been equating the government's words to gas chambers and starvation ghettoes ?

    Which would be even sillier of him than equating the government's words to the words of Hitler etc - assuming that Lineker has even read Mein Kampf etc, which I very much doubt.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
    And by 39 on average they will be on the housing ladder and open to voting Conservative
    That’s the point. Most of them won’t. The ladder keeps being pulled up.
  • Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 45% (-2)
    CON: 29% (=)
    LDM: 10% (+2)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)
    GRN: 3% (=)

    Via @Survation, On 2-3 March,
    Changes w/ 10-16 February.

    The Rishi boat bounce continues
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,196
    dixiedean said:

    FF43 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Foxy said:

    50% favourable vs 30% unfavourable for GL on Yougov Daily.

    53% vs 27% think BBC wrong to suspend GL

    51% to 28% support other presenters in their solidarity.

    Hmm. On those numbers there will be something of a reverse ferret.
    What the BBC should have done is... nothing. Until summer... Then they should have quietly "revamped" MOTD and announced the new look version would be without the Sainted Gary. They should have thanked him so much for his contribution, wished him all the best etc etc. And quietly shoved him out of the back door.

    But they are where they are. At this point I can't see how they can take him back. The moment the producers start allowing the "talent" to call the shots their finished... As literally every loudmouth at the BBC will think they have carte blanche to say whatever they want and they will be untouchable.

    For better or worse they've taken a stand against Lineker and they have to stick by that now and wait for the media storm to roll on to the next "crisis"
    My guess is Lineker will refuse to make any apology or future commitment. The BBC will then issue a statement along the lines of, we have concluded our investigation and discussed our findings with Gary. We reiterated to him the importance of all our personnel maintaining strict neutrality on political issues. No further action will be taken.
    He's not their "personnel'.
    Contracted employees put on football commentary today.
    Why should he maintain strict neutrality?
    Before you answer that, ask yourself how you would feel if that was made a condition of contracting you.
    sssh! That's the loophole that gets everyone out of this- in public, anyway.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,299
    edited March 2023

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    The polling of public opinion seems to be that they support the Government on small boats, think Lineker's comments were out of order, but they still like Lineker and think he should be presenting MOTD and not taken off air.
    I disagree with the public on some of that (unsurprisingly) but it seems like a more coherent and self-consistent set of opinions from the public than normal.

    The people who tried to get Lineker to shut up, or cancel him for refusing to do so, are the people who allowed tribal politics to override good sense in this situation.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,967

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    No one has.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,351

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    It's a good job nobody's done that, then.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,340

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Just looked in my old work email account. I’ve had invites to five law firm briefings about the SVB collapse sent today. That’s not a great sign!

    Tempted to sell my financials when they open. They could drop sharply when the USA opens.
    I wouldn't. I've heard no panic at all amongst my contacts.

    If there is one I will be buying on Monday.
    I think the market quite toppy at the moment. A lot of companies will be squeezed by the cost of borrowing. I moved last week to a more defensive position with more in cash. I am inclined to make that more defensive still on Monday.
    I refer the honourable gentleman to the comments I made yesterday about SVB.

    Don't panic, I'm working on it [The SVB fallout]

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330951/#Comment_4330951

    Honestly if it wasn't for insider trading rules the fact Caesar's wife must be above suspicion I'd be buying lots of bank shares right now.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330959/#Comment_4330959

    It’s true, though, that banks in the US are sitting on some very hefty unrealised losses on their HTM bonds. That’s not a problem if they have strong balance sheets, but I’d guess there are a number of regional banks anxious about their corporate depositors deciding their cash would be safer in govt bonds.

    Other runs might not be impossible ?
    I think most of you know my job involves stress testing the financial institution I work for (and the wider industry.)

    As worst case scenarios go this isn't in the top 20 and we can survive most of the scenarios.

    I think a nuclear exchange in Ukraine and/or a Chinese invasion of Taiwan is what might bugger things up.
    Come on, if your financial institution can't survive a stress-test of the end of the world then you're not really doing your job properly.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,960
    ...
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,554
    nico679 said:

    Who knew that the country needs immigration ? Sadly not enough given the Brexit vote .

    Amazing how quiet the Daily Mail and the rest of the right wing trash papers are on the fact that the government is having to loosen its work visa requirements.

    If by "having to", you mean "choosing to", sure. Skilled workers from all over the globe? Excellent. I don't regret the end of the fast lane for White People From Europe but perhaps you do.

    Polling shows the country as a whole is now rather relaxed about legal immigration, and the scale of this feeling is such that it must include many leave voters.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,960
    ...
  • Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 45% (-2)
    CON: 29% (=)
    LDM: 10% (+2)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)
    GRN: 3% (=)

    Via @Survation, On 2-3 March,
    Changes w/ 10-16 February.

    The Rishi boat bounce continues

    That poll was taken before the announcement of the boat bill
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,394
    edited March 2023
    And here's the nub of the problem.
    If you want to control your minions put them on the payroll. Pay sick pay and pay your employees NI.
    But they don't cos it's cheaper.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,572

    DougSeal said:

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That’s okay because it was the Government’s words, not actions, Lineker was so comparing. Which is why the public support him on this issue against the Tories, whose rhetoric has also been described as Nazi-like by Holocaust survivors. Who they also tried to ban as a result.
    So you think that Lineker has been equating the government's words to gas chambers and starvation ghettoes ?

    Which would be even sillier of him than equating the government's words to the words of Hitler etc - assuming that Lineker has even read Mein Kampf etc, which I very much doubt.
    A few Mein Kampf references to Jews:

    The Jewish doctrine of Marxism rejects the aristocratic principle of Nature and replaces the eternal privilege of power and strength by the mass of numbers and their dead weight. Thus it denies the value of personality in man, contests the significance of nationality and race, and thereby withdraws from humanity the premise of its existence and its culture. As a foundation of the universe, this doctrine would bring about the end of any order intellectually conceivable to man. And as, in this greatest of all recognizable organisms, the result of an application of such a law could only be chaos, on earth it could only be destruction for the inhabitants of this planet.

    If, with the help of his Marxist creed, the Jew is victorious over the other peoples of the world, his crown will be the funeral wreath of humanity and this planet will, as it did thousands of years ago, move through the ether devoid of men.

    Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord [p. 60].

    ...To what an extent the whole existence of this people is based on a continuous lie is shown incomparably by the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, so infinitely hated by the Jews. They are based on a forgery, the Frankfurter Zeitung moans and screams once every week: the best proof that they are authentic... For once this book has become the common property of a people, the Jewish menace may be considered as broken

    Here he stops at nothing, and in his vileness he becomes so gigantic that no one need be surprised if among our people the personification of the devil as the symbol of all evil assumes the living shape of the Jew.


    https://www.yadvashem.org/docs/extracts-from-mein-kampf.html

    I'm not up to date on what Sunak and Braverman's thoughts are on illegal immigrants but I suspect there's not much correlation with Hitler.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,586
    TimS said:

    Klopp backs Lineker.

    Time for the goalies next. Which way round is it: Southall the lefty and Shilton the righty?
    Shilton backs Lineker though:

    https://twitter.com/Peter_Shilton/status/1634286069989494788?t=1soBVUjSdQ9z5l6uNJIOeA&s=19
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,960
    ...
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,967

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Just looked in my old work email account. I’ve had invites to five law firm briefings about the SVB collapse sent today. That’s not a great sign!

    Tempted to sell my financials when they open. They could drop sharply when the USA opens.
    I wouldn't. I've heard no panic at all amongst my contacts.

    If there is one I will be buying on Monday.
    I think the market quite toppy at the moment. A lot of companies will be squeezed by the cost of borrowing. I moved last week to a more defensive position with more in cash. I am inclined to make that more defensive still on Monday.
    I refer the honourable gentleman to the comments I made yesterday about SVB.

    Don't panic, I'm working on it [The SVB fallout]

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330951/#Comment_4330951

    Honestly if it wasn't for insider trading rules the fact Caesar's wife must be above suspicion I'd be buying lots of bank shares right now.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330959/#Comment_4330959

    It’s true, though, that banks in the US are sitting on some very hefty unrealised losses on their HTM bonds. That’s not a problem if they have strong balance sheets, but I’d guess there are a number of regional banks anxious about their corporate depositors deciding their cash would be safer in govt bonds.

    Other runs might not be impossible ?
    I think most of you know my job involves stress testing the financial institution I work for (and the wider industry.)

    As worst case scenarios go this isn't in the top 20 and we can survive most of the scenarios.

    I think a nuclear exchange in Ukraine and/or a Chinese invasion of Taiwan is what might bugger things up.
    I get that.
    The systemic risk isn’t large, but that doesn’t mean there might not be some quite sharp sectoral consequences.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,923
    Scott_xP said:

    ...

    Still massive on a per capita basis.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,340
    Sandpit said:

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    The polling of public opinion seems to be that they support the Government on small boats, think Lineker's comments were out of order, but they still like Lineker and think he should be presenting MOTD and not taken off air.
    As with many of us here, support freedom of speech but also agree with government policy on small boats.

    Obviously none of the pollsters are asking how funny we think it is, that the BBC have got themselves into a right mess from which there’s no way out that doesn’t diminish themselves and the “unique way they’re funded”?
    I actually support the BBC suspending Lineker on this, even if I'm in the minority, because I think he overstepped the mark with something so controversial that they were damned if they did and damned if they didn't, and thus brought them into disrepute.

    He created that situation. And he has to understand that's not ok.
  • jamesdoylejamesdoyle Posts: 790
    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
    And by 39 on average they will be on the housing ladder and open to voting Conservative
    But they won't be. Because of Conservative policies
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,554
    edited March 2023
    Who made the decision to suspend Lineker? In all the coverage I haven't seen this information.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,351
    It's no surprise that the public is in support of 'stopping the small boats'. I mean, even lefties like me think that it isn't good at all to have so many people crossing the sea in that way - there must be a better way. So yes, I want to stop the 'small boats'.

    What's important is a) whether the policy introduced last week will actually work, and b) what does a sensible and humane asylum seeker/refugee policy look like?
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,273
    The issue of child deportation and detention under the new immigration bill could become an issue.

    The government says that only in limited circumstances would that apply .

    Apparently even Priti Patel is concerned by those aspects of the bill !

    She’s hardly Mary Poppins so I’d expect a quick row back from no 10 unless they want their boat policy to sink without trace !

  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,394
    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Klopp backs Lineker.

    Time for the goalies next. Which way round is it: Southall the lefty and Shilton the righty?
    Shilton backs Lineker though:

    https://twitter.com/Peter_Shilton/status/1634286069989494788?t=1soBVUjSdQ9z5l6uNJIOeA&s=19
    Southall probably doesn't cos he hasn't set up a worker's Soviet.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,781
    edited March 2023
    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
    And by 39 on average they will be on the housing ladder and open to voting Conservative
    That’s the point. Most of them won’t. The ladder keeps being pulled up.
    39 is the current age more first own property with or without a mortgage than rent
  • Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Just looked in my old work email account. I’ve had invites to five law firm briefings about the SVB collapse sent today. That’s not a great sign!

    Tempted to sell my financials when they open. They could drop sharply when the USA opens.
    I wouldn't. I've heard no panic at all amongst my contacts.

    If there is one I will be buying on Monday.
    I think the market quite toppy at the moment. A lot of companies will be squeezed by the cost of borrowing. I moved last week to a more defensive position with more in cash. I am inclined to make that more defensive still on Monday.
    I refer the honourable gentleman to the comments I made yesterday about SVB.

    Don't panic, I'm working on it [The SVB fallout]

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330951/#Comment_4330951

    Honestly if it wasn't for insider trading rules the fact Caesar's wife must be above suspicion I'd be buying lots of bank shares right now.

    https://vf.politicalbetting.com/discussion/comment/4330959/#Comment_4330959

    It’s true, though, that banks in the US are sitting on some very hefty unrealised losses on their HTM bonds. That’s not a problem if they have strong balance sheets, but I’d guess there are a number of regional banks anxious about their corporate depositors deciding their cash would be safer in govt bonds.

    Other runs might not be impossible ?
    I think most of you know my job involves stress testing the financial institution I work for (and the wider industry.)

    As worst case scenarios go this isn't in the top 20 and we can survive most of the scenarios.

    I think a nuclear exchange in Ukraine and/or a Chinese invasion of Taiwan is what might bugger things up.
    I get that.
    The systemic risk isn’t large, but that doesn’t mean there might not be some quite sharp sectoral consequences.
    This isn't an official prediction but I suspect the successful companies/sectors impact by SVB will get picked up.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,586
    carnforth said:

    Who made the decision to suspend Lineker? In all the coverage I haven't seen this information.

    Government stooges and placemen at the top of the BBC.

    If Lineker stays sacked, it is hard to see them surviving with their blatant bias.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,394

    Sandpit said:

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    The polling of public opinion seems to be that they support the Government on small boats, think Lineker's comments were out of order, but they still like Lineker and think he should be presenting MOTD and not taken off air.
    As with many of us here, support freedom of speech but also agree with government policy on small boats.

    Obviously none of the pollsters are asking how funny we think it is, that the BBC have got themselves into a right mess from which there’s no way out that doesn’t diminish themselves and the “unique way they’re funded”?
    I actually support the BBC suspending Lineker on this, even if I'm in the minority, because I think he overstepped the mark with something so controversial that they were damned if they did and damned if they didn't, and thus brought them into disrepute.

    He created that situation. And he has to understand that's not ok.
    So have plenty of others. But they've been pro government with nary a comment. That is the issue.
    Andrew Neill made a career of it.
    And he didn't score either.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,781
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
    And by 39 on average they will be on the housing ladder and open to voting Conservative
    Why set you sights so low? Maybe try to get more peopel on the ladder and open to voting Conservative sooner? Just a thought.
    I am not opposed to building more affordable housing for 30 to 40s, especially in London and the Home Counties where property is most expensive.

    Albeit that would come at the cost of some NIMBY over 50s going LD or Residents' Association/Independent at local elections especially
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,650
    edited March 2023
    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    I see Big G is back astroturfing for Sunak.
    The Betws-y-Coed Conservative Club petty cash box is one helluva drug.

    Predicable silly response but adds nothing to genuine debate

    Why not address the issues in a mature manner
    The issue is that the Tories are playing you like a fiddle. Bereft of any achievement whatsoever, they hope to claw back support in the form of a bleating about the boats and a French bung.
    You should welcome the new closer relationship with Europe, the WF, and joint action with Macron on the boats but then it wasn't Strarmer who was in Paris this week
    I welcome all the above.

    I still think Rishi is a nob, and I disdain and despise his willingness to foist Braverman upon the nation.

    And his record everywhere else (HS2 etc) is also shite.
    Rishi is playing excellently off a very difficult wicket.

    I have no complaints whatsoever. He's restored fiscal sanity, despatched Sturgeon, resolved NI, and is now tackling the boat issue with Macron and clearing the asylum backlog. Inflation is starting to come down. And the public services settlements are starting to come through.

    Yes, he'll still lose - because of cost of living, mortgage payments continuing to soar, and general exhaustion of the Conservatives (much of which is entirely their own fault) - but it's one heck of an honourable and determined rearguard action that commands my full respect.

    I have renewed my Conservative membership and will definitely be voting for him next year.
    The Conservatives should be shouting about bringing about full employment.

    But they wont as they don't seem to think that full employment is a good thing.

    Perhaps because they think Thatcher had high unemployment so high unemployment must be good, perhaps because full employment leads to higher pay and they've lost touch with aspirational workers.
    What the Conservatives need to address is the corrosion in aspiration and the inability of those between 25-45 to accumulate wealth.

    It's not just in the Conservative Party. I genuinely see a total dearth of thinking on all sides of the house.

    Strangely, there were some interesting thinkers in the Coalition government from the LD side - Laws, Davey, Webb & Browne - on top of Gove, Hague and Osborne, who were the most serious thinkers on the Conservative benches.
    Ideally yes, especially those between 30-40.

    Then again the Conservatives won a landslide in 2019 despite losing most voters under 39
    A quarter of those voters will have moved into the higher age bracket in 2024 and you haven’t replaced the ones who have died.
    And by 39 on average they will be on the housing ladder and open to voting Conservative
    That’s the point. Most of them won’t. The ladder keeps being pulled up.
    39 is the current age more first own property with or without a mortgage than rent
    Does the 'rent' figure include those still living at home? Seems an increasing number these days.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,196
    carnforth said:

    Who made the decision to suspend Lineker? In all the coverage I haven't seen this information.

    Sunday Times says it was Tim Davie himself. Though that my be stirring.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,554

    It's no surprise that the public is in support of 'stopping the small boats'. I mean, even lefties like me think that it isn't good at all to have so many people crossing the sea in that way - there must be a better way. So yes, I want to stop the 'small boats'.

    What's important is a) whether the policy introduced last week will actually work, and b) what does a sensible and humane asylum seeker/refugee policy look like?

    If we open a "safe and legal route", say by accepting asylum applications at the British Embassy in Paris, what happens to the half of applicants who are refused? They will get in the boats anyway.

    If a humane asylum policy involves shutting down the boat route for good, must it necessarily involve something not very humane looking (like the Rwanda policy)?
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,703
    What an improvement, MoTD without punditry, replays or idiotic graphics. It's the way forward!
    Pity about Leicester, though tbh they were useless.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    Turns out if you do MOTD with no presenters, pundits nor commentators then it's total crap.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,572
    edited March 2023

    DougSeal said:

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That’s okay because it was the Government’s words, not actions, Lineker was so comparing. Which is why the public support him on this issue against the Tories, whose rhetoric has also been described as Nazi-like by Holocaust survivors. Who they also tried to ban as a result.
    So you think that Lineker has been equating the government's words to gas chambers and starvation ghettoes ?

    Which would be even sillier of him than equating the government's words to the words of Hitler etc - assuming that Lineker has even read Mein Kampf etc, which I very much doubt.
    A few Mein Kampf references to Jews:

    The Jewish doctrine of Marxism rejects the aristocratic principle of Nature and replaces the eternal privilege of power and strength by the mass of numbers and their dead weight. Thus it denies the value of personality in man, contests the significance of nationality and race, and thereby withdraws from humanity the premise of its existence and its culture. As a foundation of the universe, this doctrine would bring about the end of any order intellectually conceivable to man. And as, in this greatest of all recognizable organisms, the result of an application of such a law could only be chaos, on earth it could only be destruction for the inhabitants of this planet.

    If, with the help of his Marxist creed, the Jew is victorious over the other peoples of the world, his crown will be the funeral wreath of humanity and this planet will, as it did thousands of years ago, move through the ether devoid of men.

    Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord [p. 60].

    ...To what an extent the whole existence of this people is based on a continuous lie is shown incomparably by the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, so infinitely hated by the Jews. They are based on a forgery, the Frankfurter Zeitung moans and screams once every week: the best proof that they are authentic... For once this book has become the common property of a people, the Jewish menace may be considered as broken

    Here he stops at nothing, and in his vileness he becomes so gigantic that no one need be surprised if among our people the personification of the devil as the symbol of all evil assumes the living shape of the Jew.


    https://www.yadvashem.org/docs/extracts-from-mein-kampf.html

    I'm not up to date on what Sunak and Braverman's thoughts are on illegal immigrants but I suspect there's not much correlation with Hitler.
    It took me all of five minutes to google Hitler's thoughts about Jews, come to the conclusion that they bare no resemblance to government thoughts about illegal immigrants and then copy them into a comment here.

    Dos anyone think Lineker bothered to do any such checking ?

    I'll also suggest that anyone spouting off about Nazi Germany is very likely publicising their ignorance about both the present and the past.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,960

    carnforth said:

    Who made the decision to suspend Lineker? In all the coverage I haven't seen this information.

    Sunday Times says it was Tim Davie himself. Though that my be stirring.
    Davie today does seem to the one bricking it
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,973

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 45% (-2)
    CON: 29% (=)
    LDM: 10% (+2)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)
    GRN: 3% (=)

    Via @Survation, On 2-3 March,
    Changes w/ 10-16 February.

    The Rishi boat bounce continues

    3 polls with Lib Dem increases. Probably MoE, but I wonder if the warm vibes about the EU the previous week might have had a small halo effect for the LDs.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,781

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 45% (-2)
    CON: 29% (=)
    LDM: 10% (+2)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)
    GRN: 3% (=)

    Via @Survation, On 2-3 March,
    Changes w/ 10-16 February.

    The Rishi boat bounce continues

    Gives 163 Tory seats on the new boundaries, albeit a Labour majority of 168, slightly less than the Blair majority of 179 in 1997

    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/fcgi-bin/usercode.py?scotcontrol=Y&CON=29&LAB=45&LIB=10&Reform=4&Green=3&UKIP=&TVCON=&TVLAB=&TVLIB=&TVReform=&TVGreen=&TVUKIP=&SCOTCON=17.7&SCOTLAB=30.3&SCOTLIB=6&SCOTReform=0.7&SCOTGreen=1.3&SCOTUKIP=&SCOTNAT=41&display=AllChanged&regorseat=(none)&boundary=2019nbbase
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,578

    Turns out if you do MOTD with no presenters, pundits nor commentators then it's total crap.

    It really is. Sterile.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,394
    Davie will go to protect Sharp.
    Deputy heads will roll.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,008

    I mean, I'm ashamed to say it but surely the real Match Of The Day was the England v. France rugby game?

    Posh lads given a spanking.

    How sad.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,792

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 45% (-2)
    CON: 29% (=)
    LDM: 10% (+2)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)
    GRN: 3% (=)

    Via @Survation, On 2-3 March,
    Changes w/ 10-16 February.

    The Rishi boat bounce continues

    Broken, sleazy Labour on the slide!
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,114

    ohnotnow said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Not sure people realise just how big a deal the Silicon Valley Bank collapse is. They’ll find out on Monday. It will be carnage.

    To coin a Twitter term, “this”.

    It’s going to eclipse anything to do with small boats, Lineker or Ukraine next week.
    How do you know this? For now it's just guesswork.
    It’s killing off a large percentage of the tech startup sector in a single move. I don’t think we are going to see contagion, but it’s a very big story.
    Previous governments home and around the world have printed money, picked money for free off trees, telling us how clever they are, and there will never be any reckoning for what they are doing. I feel Sorry for Rishi and Starmer as we now enter age of reckoning for what went on before.

    Market mayhem is coming. I don’t know exactly when, maybe as soon as Friday of next week. But for certain a lot of that printed money when into stocks, over inflating them and the market.

    It’s a pile of tinder just waiting for a spark.

    Mark my words. A reckoning is coming. Beware the Ides. Beware the Ides of March.
    The flame of Leon has been taken up !
    Needs a bit more random capitalisation - but almost there!
    At the same it's a nevertheless an interesting post from Lady Rabbit, though. I'm a bit unclear about this whole SVB business ; something else I've just read says only about 4% of their business is international, and that they have a "very limited presence in the UK market". Is this anything like right ?
    The U.K. VC market is smallish. Plus I understand that quite a few startups liked the idea of using SVB

    @Mexicanpete please don't go. You are one of the only people that makes this site bearable.

    I have no plans but there is more to life than posting nonsense 24/7.
    Garbage. Posting nonsense 24/7 is your patriotic duty.

    Seriously - we will be left with @Leon23 if everyone leaves
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,967
    FF43 said:

    My guess is Lineker will refuse to make any apology or future commitment. The BBC will then issue a statement along the lines of, we have concluded our investigation and discussed our findings with Gary. We reiterated to him the importance of all our personnel maintaining strict neutrality on political issues. No further action will be taken.

    When has that ever been the case ?

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,539
    dixiedean said:

    And here's the nub of the problem.
    If you want to control your minions put them on the payroll. Pay sick pay and pay your employees NI.
    But they don't cos it's cheaper.

    The Lineker court case that’s ongoing, looks very poor on how the BBC treated presenters a decade ago. They insisted that they work through personal service companies, while keeping a level of control that clearly made them employees under IR35.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,517
    Don't know what football programme this is on BBC1 at the moment, but it's quite relaxing.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,858
    When Priti Patel is rumoured to be readying to criticise the current immigration policy, surely things have gone too far?
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,973
    edited March 2023

    DougSeal said:

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That’s okay because it was the Government’s words, not actions, Lineker was so comparing. Which is why the public support him on this issue against the Tories, whose rhetoric has also been described as Nazi-like by Holocaust survivors. Who they also tried to ban as a result.
    So you think that Lineker has been equating the government's words to gas chambers and starvation ghettoes ?

    Which would be even sillier of him than equating the government's words to the words of Hitler etc - assuming that Lineker has even read Mein Kampf etc, which I very much doubt.
    A few Mein Kampf references to Jews:

    The Jewish doctrine of Marxism rejects the aristocratic principle of Nature and replaces the eternal privilege of power and strength by the mass of numbers and their dead weight. Thus it denies the value of personality in man, contests the significance of nationality and race, and thereby withdraws from humanity the premise of its existence and its culture. As a foundation of the universe, this doctrine would bring about the end of any order intellectually conceivable to man. And as, in this greatest of all recognizable organisms, the result of an application of such a law could only be chaos, on earth it could only be destruction for the inhabitants of this planet.

    If, with the help of his Marxist creed, the Jew is victorious over the other peoples of the world, his crown will be the funeral wreath of humanity and this planet will, as it did thousands of years ago, move through the ether devoid of men.

    Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord [p. 60].

    ...To what an extent the whole existence of this people is based on a continuous lie is shown incomparably by the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, so infinitely hated by the Jews. They are based on a forgery, the Frankfurter Zeitung moans and screams once every week: the best proof that they are authentic... For once this book has become the common property of a people, the Jewish menace may be considered as broken

    Here he stops at nothing, and in his vileness he becomes so gigantic that no one need be surprised if among our people the personification of the devil as the symbol of all evil assumes the living shape of the Jew.


    https://www.yadvashem.org/docs/extracts-from-mein-kampf.html

    I'm not up to date on what Sunak and Braverman's thoughts are on illegal immigrants but I suspect there's not much correlation with Hitler.
    It took me all of five minutes to google Hitler's thoughts about Jews, come to the conclusion that they bare no resemblance to government thoughts about illegal immigrants and then copy them into a comment here.

    Dos anyone think Lineker bothered to do any such checking ?

    I'll also suggest that anyone spouting off about Nazi Germany is very likely publicising their ignorance about both the present and the past.
    As a number of people have pointed out the current government’s language doesn’t bear much resemblance to 1930s Germany, it’s much more like 1930s Britain. To say we were lukewarm about receiving Jewish refugees from Germany that decade would be kind.
  • SNAP POLL: Britons say BBC was wrong to suspend Gary Lineker

    All Britons: 27% right / 53% wrong
    Con voters: 51% / 36%
    Lab voters: 10% / 75%

    Whomp whomp
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,351
    HYUFD said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 45% (-2)
    CON: 29% (=)
    LDM: 10% (+2)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)
    GRN: 3% (=)

    Via @Survation, On 2-3 March,
    Changes w/ 10-16 February.

    The Rishi boat bounce continues

    Gives 163 Tory seats on the new boundaries, albeit a Labour majority of 168, slightly less than the Blair majority of 179 in 1997

    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/fcgi-bin/usercode.py?scotcontrol=Y&CON=29&LAB=45&LIB=10&Reform=4&Green=3&UKIP=&TVCON=&TVLAB=&TVLIB=&TVReform=&TVGreen=&TVUKIP=&SCOTCON=17.7&SCOTLAB=30.3&SCOTLIB=6&SCOTReform=0.7&SCOTGreen=1.3&SCOTUKIP=&SCOTNAT=41&display=AllChanged&regorseat=(none)&boundary=2019nbbase
    Better than 1997?
    Good result for your boys, then.
  • Everybody should hear this

    Mahlalela by Letta Mbulu, with Hugh Masakela

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlqppHJ2U-E
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,608
    edited March 2023
    TimS said:

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    LAB: 45% (-2)
    CON: 29% (=)
    LDM: 10% (+2)
    REF: 4% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)
    GRN: 3% (=)

    Via @Survation, On 2-3 March,
    Changes w/ 10-16 February.

    The Rishi boat bounce continues

    3 polls with Lib Dem increases. Probably MoE, but I wonder if the warm vibes about the EU the previous week might have had a small halo effect for the LDs.
    Local election campaigns firing up???
  • This was the day the culture war was lost.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,578
    edited March 2023

    Turns out if you do MOTD with no presenters, pundits nor commentators then it's total crap.

    It really is. Sterile.
    Andy_JS said:

    Don't know what football programme this is on BBC1 at the moment, but it's quite relaxing.

    Yes I have it on with the sound off.
    I haven't a clue what is happening.
    It is as relaxing as watching tropical fish in an aquarium.
    It reminds me of the old interludes - the potter and so on.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,394
    Sandpit said:

    dixiedean said:

    And here's the nub of the problem.
    If you want to control your minions put them on the payroll. Pay sick pay and pay your employees NI.
    But they don't cos it's cheaper.

    The Lineker court case that’s ongoing, looks very poor on how the BBC treated presenters a decade ago. They insisted that they work through personal service companies, while keeping a level of control that clearly made them employees under IR35.
    Well yes.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,792

    Everybody should hear this

    Mahlalela by Letta Mbulu, with Hugh Masakela

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlqppHJ2U-E

    My Cosmos is Mine - Depeche Mode

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S698DWXhu5I
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,517
    edited March 2023
    Anyone know the details on why Silicon Valley Bank collapsed? (Apart from not having enough money).
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    SNAP POLL: Britons say BBC was wrong to suspend Gary Lineker

    All Britons: 27% right / 53% wrong
    Con voters: 51% / 36%
    Lab voters: 10% / 75%

    Whomp whomp

    Its a bit more complicated than that.....

    Most Britons...
    1. Think the BBC are in the wrong over suspending Lineker;
    2. Don't think it's acceptable to compare gov policy with that of the Nazis;
    3. Support sports correspondents promoting their own politics on their own personal channels;
    4. Like Stopping The Boats™


    https://twitter.com/BNHWalker/status/1634682526835908610?s=20
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,653

    DougSeal said:

    By 47% to 34% the public do not think it is ever appropriate to compare government policy to actions by the Nazis

    Yougov

    That’s okay because it was the Government’s words, not actions, Lineker was so comparing. Which is why the public support him on this issue against the Tories, whose rhetoric has also been described as Nazi-like by Holocaust survivors. Who they also tried to ban as a result.
    So you think that Lineker has been equating the government's words to gas chambers and starvation ghettoes ?

    Which would be even sillier of him than equating the government's words to the words of Hitler etc - assuming that Lineker has even read Mein Kampf etc, which I very much doubt.
    A few Mein Kampf references to Jews:

    The Jewish doctrine of Marxism rejects the aristocratic principle of Nature and replaces the eternal privilege of power and strength by the mass of numbers and their dead weight. Thus it denies the value of personality in man, contests the significance of nationality and race, and thereby withdraws from humanity the premise of its existence and its culture. As a foundation of the universe, this doctrine would bring about the end of any order intellectually conceivable to man. And as, in this greatest of all recognizable organisms, the result of an application of such a law could only be chaos, on earth it could only be destruction for the inhabitants of this planet.

    If, with the help of his Marxist creed, the Jew is victorious over the other peoples of the world, his crown will be the funeral wreath of humanity and this planet will, as it did thousands of years ago, move through the ether devoid of men.

    Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord [p. 60].

    ...To what an extent the whole existence of this people is based on a continuous lie is shown incomparably by the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, so infinitely hated by the Jews. They are based on a forgery, the Frankfurter Zeitung moans and screams once every week: the best proof that they are authentic... For once this book has become the common property of a people, the Jewish menace may be considered as broken

    Here he stops at nothing, and in his vileness he becomes so gigantic that no one need be surprised if among our people the personification of the devil as the symbol of all evil assumes the living shape of the Jew.


    https://www.yadvashem.org/docs/extracts-from-mein-kampf.html

    I'm not up to date on what Sunak and Braverman's thoughts are on illegal immigrants but I suspect there's not much correlation with Hitler.
    It took me all of five minutes to google Hitler's thoughts about Jews, come to the conclusion that they bare no resemblance to government thoughts about illegal immigrants and then copy them into a comment here.

    Dos anyone think Lineker bothered to do any such checking ?

    I'll also suggest that anyone spouting off about Nazi Germany is very likely publicising their ignorance about both the present and the past.
    Whereas Sugar Photoshoping Corbyn in Nazi Uniform in a car with Hitler?

    No suspension.

    Why Richard
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,703
    Barnesian said:

    Turns out if you do MOTD with no presenters, pundits nor commentators then it's total crap.

    It really is. Sterile.
    Andy_JS said:

    Don't know what football programme this is on BBC1 at the moment, but it's quite relaxing.

    Yes I have it on with the sound off.
    I haven't a clue what is happening.
    It is as relaxing as watching tropical fish in an aquarium.
    It reminds me of the old interludes - the potter and so on.
    You should try with the sound on.

This discussion has been closed.