I seem to remember when people argued Germany was the leader of the free world and Britain would be captured by Russian money. Any rethinking going on?
Come back to me for an answer when we have a transcript of the conversation between Johnson and Lebedev, and an accurate report of Johnson's activity and with whom he engaged on Lebedev's yacht whilst Johnson was Foreign Secretary. Johnson rocking up to Kyiv every five minutes doesn't clear up that particular mess, does it?
How convenient to throw enough caveats in that your demands make your claim unfalsifiable. The trips point is deliberately misleading. Boris, for all his flaws, has been unwavering and leading in the military and financial support provided to Kyiv.
Oh perlease. If it were anyone else I might give them the benefit of the doubt. Johnson's comprehensive self serving backstory allows me to treat his Ukrainian altruism, not so much with a pinch of salt, but with the entire county of Cheshire.
Self-serving or otherwise, the UK has been a steadfast ally of Ukraine while Germany equivocates with one eye on future Russian deals. Completely the opposite to what Remainers predicted and no hint of contrition or self-reflection.
I had not realised there was a “Remainer” position on Ukraine. Or is this just another Brexiter delusion?
Only because Remainers and the BBC pushed him so much. The Leave campaign did everything they could to marginalize him. He doesn't represent mainstream Leavers.
F*** me! He was their poster boy!
Remember the first rule of Brexit: everything that happens is the fault of Remainers & no responsibility whatsoever can attach to those who campaigned or voted for Brexit.
Nope. In this case Mexicanpete is wrong. The official Leave campaign explicitly refused to include Farage in their campaign. Hence the reason Aaron Banks tried a legal challenge to get Leave.EU made into the official campaign as he believed it was a stitch up to ensure Remain won.
In the words of Dominic Cummings, Farage was a "vain shallow egomaniac" and an "irrelevant pundit, happily and safely ignored".
You are at least being a little disingenuous to me. Yes Farage was persona non grata in Team Johnson-Cummings, but he remained a high profile figure in the greater Leave campaign.
So he was persona non grata with the official campaign. How then can they be held responsible for him? Tony Blair at least had the self awareness to know that if he campaigned for Remain it would drive more people to the Leave campaign. And yet I could claim he was the 'poster boy' for Remain as he made his views clear and would be as equally wrong as you are.
Again, I must have missed the bit where Tony Blair set up the “EU Party”, spent years on Question Time promoting further integration, and then led a major, albeit “unofficial”, pro-EU campaign during the referendum.
We know you don’t like Farage, and have profound disagreements with him, but he is your ideological comrade-in-arms nonetheless.
The Pro-EU party was Labour. Blair didn't have to appear on question time to promote his cause. He was the PM.
Farage was as much my ideological comrade in arms as Stalin was to Kier Starmer. Both are/would be ludicrous claims.
You are in sad denial about the central role Farage, a man quite literally known as “Mr Brexit”.
You can’t just distance yourself from him, Richard. He was instrumental in bringing your pet project to life.
It does seem quite bizarre to argue that Farage was not a key figure in the drive to Brexit. Indeed quite a weird parallel universe.
I understand why people want to distance themselves from him and his Brexit, but quite a rewrite of history.
I seem to remember when people argued Germany was the leader of the free world and Britain would be captured by Russian money. Any rethinking going on?
Come back to me for an answer when we have a transcript of the conversation between Johnson and Lebedev, and an accurate report of Johnson's activity and with whom he engaged on Lebedev's yacht whilst Johnson was Foreign Secretary. Johnson rocking up to Kyiv every five minutes doesn't clear up that particular mess, does it?
How convenient to throw enough caveats in that your demands make your claim unfalsifiable. The trips point is deliberately misleading. Boris, for all his flaws, has been unwavering and leading in the military and financial support provided to Kyiv.
Oh perlease. If it were anyone else I might give them the benefit of the doubt. Johnson's comprehensive self serving backstory allows me to treat his Ukrainian altruism, not so much with a pinch of salt, but with the entire county of Cheshire.
Self-serving or otherwise, the UK has been a steadfast ally of Ukraine while Germany equivocates with one eye on future Russian deals. Completely the opposite to what Remainers predicted and no hint of contrition or self-reflection.
I had not realised there was a “Remainer” position on Ukraine. Or is this just another Brexiter delusion?
Only because Remainers and the BBC pushed him so much. The Leave campaign did everything they could to marginalize him. He doesn't represent mainstream Leavers.
F*** me! He was their poster boy!
Remember the first rule of Brexit: everything that happens is the fault of Remainers & no responsibility whatsoever can attach to those who campaigned or voted for Brexit.
Nope. In this case Mexicanpete is wrong. The official Leave campaign explicitly refused to include Farage in their campaign. Hence the reason Aaron Banks tried a legal challenge to get Leave.EU made into the official campaign as he believed it was a stitch up to ensure Remain won.
In the words of Dominic Cummings, Farage was a "vain shallow egomaniac" and an "irrelevant pundit, happily and safely ignored".
You are at least being a little disingenuous to me. Yes Farage was persona non grata in Team Johnson-Cummings, but he remained a high profile figure in the greater Leave campaign.
So he was persona non grata with the official campaign. How then can they be held responsible for him? Tony Blair at least had the self awareness to know that if he campaigned for Remain it would drive more people to the Leave campaign. And yet I could claim he was the 'poster boy' for Remain as he made his views clear and would be as equally wrong as you are.
Again, I must have missed the bit where Tony Blair set up the “EU Party”, spent years on Question Time promoting further integration, and then led a major, albeit “unofficial”, pro-EU campaign during the referendum.
We know you don’t like Farage, and have profound disagreements with him, but he is your ideological comrade-in-arms nonetheless.
The Pro-EU party was Labour. Blair didn't have to appear on question time to promote his cause. He was the PM.
Farage was as much my ideological comrade in arms as Stalin was to Kier Starmer. Both are/would be ludicrous claims.
You are in sad denial about the central role Farage, a man quite literally known as “Mr Brexit”.
You can’t just distance yourself from him, Richard. He was instrumental in bringing your pet project to life.
Must be why the Remain campaign tried to promote him as much as possible and the Leave campaign tried to marginalize him as much as possible. Because he was so helpful to the Leave cause.
Also, Brexit is not a project. It is removing oneself from a project. The EU is the project. And if you look at living standards and unemployment and poverty rates, it is doing a lot worse than the UK.
That seems an odd claim to make when we are the only G7 country yet to get back to pre-covid GDP, despite most of Europe being more affected by the Ukraine war.
Maybe it would be best if everyone just forgot about things like this.
Considering the amount of time devoted in Catholic sermons, teaching, etc., etc. re: the horrors of sins of the flesh such as brazen hussies parading in mini-skirts & the like, hard to agree.
Unless you think truly "sensational" aspect of this story, is that it allegedly took place during COVID lockdown?
36 million people – get more from the Government than they pay in tax, according to a study by Civitas.
This is up from 24 million, or two-fifths of households, when Tony Blair was in power at the turn of the millennium.
The top 10 per cent of earners pay 53 per cent of all income tax, turning the levy – the Treasury’s biggest single earner – into a ‘stealth wealth tax’, Civitas said.
The surge in state ‘dependency’ means the poorest fifth of households receive £17,600 more on average in welfare and non-financial benefits from the State than they pay in tax.
I seem to remember when people argued Germany was the leader of the free world and Britain would be captured by Russian money. Any rethinking going on?
Come back to me for an answer when we have a transcript of the conversation between Johnson and Lebedev, and an accurate report of Johnson's activity and with whom he engaged on Lebedev's yacht whilst Johnson was Foreign Secretary. Johnson rocking up to Kyiv every five minutes doesn't clear up that particular mess, does it?
How convenient to throw enough caveats in that your demands make your claim unfalsifiable. The trips point is deliberately misleading. Boris, for all his flaws, has been unwavering and leading in the military and financial support provided to Kyiv.
Oh perlease. If it were anyone else I might give them the benefit of the doubt. Johnson's comprehensive self serving backstory allows me to treat his Ukrainian altruism, not so much with a pinch of salt, but with the entire county of Cheshire.
Self-serving or otherwise, the UK has been a steadfast ally of Ukraine while Germany equivocates with one eye on future Russian deals. Completely the opposite to what Remainers predicted and no hint of contrition or self-reflection.
I had not realised there was a “Remainer” position on Ukraine. Or is this just another Brexiter delusion?
Only because Remainers and the BBC pushed him so much. The Leave campaign did everything they could to marginalize him. He doesn't represent mainstream Leavers.
F*** me! He was their poster boy!
Remember the first rule of Brexit: everything that happens is the fault of Remainers & no responsibility whatsoever can attach to those who campaigned or voted for Brexit.
Nope. In this case Mexicanpete is wrong. The official Leave campaign explicitly refused to include Farage in their campaign. Hence the reason Aaron Banks tried a legal challenge to get Leave.EU made into the official campaign as he believed it was a stitch up to ensure Remain won.
In the words of Dominic Cummings, Farage was a "vain shallow egomaniac" and an "irrelevant pundit, happily and safely ignored".
You are at least being a little disingenuous to me. Yes Farage was persona non grata in Team Johnson-Cummings, but he remained a high profile figure in the greater Leave campaign.
So he was persona non grata with the official campaign. How then can they be held responsible for him? Tony Blair at least had the self awareness to know that if he campaigned for Remain it would drive more people to the Leave campaign. And yet I could claim he was the 'poster boy' for Remain as he made his views clear and would be as equally wrong as you are.
Again, I must have missed the bit where Tony Blair set up the “EU Party”, spent years on Question Time promoting further integration, and then led a major, albeit “unofficial”, pro-EU campaign during the referendum.
We know you don’t like Farage, and have profound disagreements with him, but he is your ideological comrade-in-arms nonetheless.
The Pro-EU party was Labour. Blair didn't have to appear on question time to promote his cause. He was the PM.
Farage was as much my ideological comrade in arms as Stalin was to Kier Starmer. Both are/would be ludicrous claims.
You are in sad denial about the central role Farage, a man quite literally known as “Mr Brexit”.
You can’t just distance yourself from him, Richard. He was instrumental in bringing your pet project to life.
Must be why the Remain campaign tried to promote him as much as possible and the Leave campaign tried to marginalize him as much as possible. Because he was so helpful to the Leave cause.
Also, Brexit is not a project. It is removing oneself from a project. The EU is the project. And if you look at living standards and unemployment and poverty rates, it is doing a lot worse than the UK.
That seems an odd claim to make when we are the only G7 country yet to get back to pre-covid GDP, despite most of Europe being more affected by the Ukraine war.
Lol, what sort of cherry picking of time frames is this? Regardless, the UK has a much higher GDP per capita than the EU.
36 million people – get more from the Government than they pay in tax, according to a study by Civitas.
This is up from 24 million, or two-fifths of households, when Tony Blair was in power at the turn of the millennium.
The top 10 per cent of earners pay 53 per cent of all income tax, turning the levy – the Treasury’s biggest single earner – into a ‘stealth wealth tax’, Civitas said.
The surge in state ‘dependency’ means the poorest fifth of households receive £17,600 more on average in welfare and non-financial benefits from the State than they pay in tax.
I seem to remember when people argued Germany was the leader of the free world and Britain would be captured by Russian money. Any rethinking going on?
Come back to me for an answer when we have a transcript of the conversation between Johnson and Lebedev, and an accurate report of Johnson's activity and with whom he engaged on Lebedev's yacht whilst Johnson was Foreign Secretary. Johnson rocking up to Kyiv every five minutes doesn't clear up that particular mess, does it?
How convenient to throw enough caveats in that your demands make your claim unfalsifiable. The trips point is deliberately misleading. Boris, for all his flaws, has been unwavering and leading in the military and financial support provided to Kyiv.
Oh perlease. If it were anyone else I might give them the benefit of the doubt. Johnson's comprehensive self serving backstory allows me to treat his Ukrainian altruism, not so much with a pinch of salt, but with the entire county of Cheshire.
Self-serving or otherwise, the UK has been a steadfast ally of Ukraine while Germany equivocates with one eye on future Russian deals. Completely the opposite to what Remainers predicted and no hint of contrition or self-reflection.
I had not realised there was a “Remainer” position on Ukraine. Or is this just another Brexiter delusion?
Only because Remainers and the BBC pushed him so much. The Leave campaign did everything they could to marginalize him. He doesn't represent mainstream Leavers.
F*** me! He was their poster boy!
Remember the first rule of Brexit: everything that happens is the fault of Remainers & no responsibility whatsoever can attach to those who campaigned or voted for Brexit.
Nope. In this case Mexicanpete is wrong. The official Leave campaign explicitly refused to include Farage in their campaign. Hence the reason Aaron Banks tried a legal challenge to get Leave.EU made into the official campaign as he believed it was a stitch up to ensure Remain won.
In the words of Dominic Cummings, Farage was a "vain shallow egomaniac" and an "irrelevant pundit, happily and safely ignored".
You are at least being a little disingenuous to me. Yes Farage was persona non grata in Team Johnson-Cummings, but he remained a high profile figure in the greater Leave campaign.
So he was persona non grata with the official campaign. How then can they be held responsible for him? Tony Blair at least had the self awareness to know that if he campaigned for Remain it would drive more people to the Leave campaign. And yet I could claim he was the 'poster boy' for Remain as he made his views clear and would be as equally wrong as you are.
Again, I must have missed the bit where Tony Blair set up the “EU Party”, spent years on Question Time promoting further integration, and then led a major, albeit “unofficial”, pro-EU campaign during the referendum.
We know you don’t like Farage, and have profound disagreements with him, but he is your ideological comrade-in-arms nonetheless.
The Pro-EU party was Labour. Blair didn't have to appear on question time to promote his cause. He was the PM.
Farage was as much my ideological comrade in arms as Stalin was to Kier Starmer. Both are/would be ludicrous claims.
You are in sad denial about the central role Farage, a man quite literally known as “Mr Brexit”.
You can’t just distance yourself from him, Richard. He was instrumental in bringing your pet project to life.
Must be why the Remain campaign tried to promote him as much as possible and the Leave campaign tried to marginalize him as much as possible. Because he was so helpful to the Leave cause.
Also, Brexit is not a project. It is removing oneself from a project. The EU is the project. And if you look at living standards and unemployment and poverty rates, it is doing a lot worse than the UK.
That seems an odd claim to make when we are the only G7 country yet to get back to pre-covid GDP, despite most of Europe being more affected by the Ukraine war.
Lol, what sort of cherry picking of time frames is this? Regardless, the UK has a much higher GDP per capita than the EU.
No, that time frame is the same as when the Brexit transition period ended, three years ago next week.
Comments
I understand why people want to distance themselves from him and his Brexit, but quite a rewrite of history.
Unless you think truly "sensational" aspect of this story, is that it allegedly took place during COVID lockdown?
This is up from 24 million, or two-fifths of households, when Tony Blair was in power at the turn of the millennium.
The top 10 per cent of earners pay 53 per cent of all income tax, turning the levy – the Treasury’s biggest single earner – into a ‘stealth wealth tax’, Civitas said.
The surge in state ‘dependency’ means the poorest fifth of households receive £17,600 more on average in welfare and non-financial benefits from the State than they pay in tax.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11664757/Over-half-households-State-pay-tax.html