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Sunnak’s approach to PMQs isn’t working – politicalbetting.com

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  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,269
    TOPPING said:

    Chris said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    Certainly history is littered with people who thought "Leading a political party is really simple - I could easily do better".
    Everyone on here for a start.
    To be fair, I want to be unDictator.

    Which removes most of the problems that social democratic multi-party democracy causes for leaders.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072

    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Scholz really is the roadblock. Will that change on Friday ?

    Ukraine wants German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

    The Netherlands has German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

    Watch Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte ( @MinPres ) respond to
    @ak_mack ’s question about his government sending tanks to Ukraine.

    https://twitter.com/AtlanticCouncil/status/1615461700202897413

    I'd be quite surprised if Germany refused requests by other countries to transfer Leopards to Ukraine (assuming Biden has told him the US wants this), less sure if Germany will promise tanks itself but could also be a yes. But it's a question of how many countries are on board. Not much point if only Poland and Finland promise a dozen tanks each.

    There are a dozen or more European countries that have Leopard tanks. Some of them are obviously not going to be giving any to Ukraine (Hungary, Austria, Switzerland), or unlikely to (Portugal). Not sure if we've heard in public from many of the others.
    Scholz's refusal is ever harder to explain. But the latest straw in the wind doesn't give grounds for any optimism. Boris Pistorius, incoming new German defence minister who will be a key player in the decision, is reported as having been a member of the German-Russia Friendship parliamentary group until it was dissolved following the invasion of Ukraine. No doubt there's a bit of Kompromat knocking around somewhere.
    That's possibly an unfair characterisation.
    Since the invasion he's been relatively forthright in supporting Ukraine.

    We'll find out this week.

    Curiously Germany has supplied a very large amount of aid to Ukraine, but managed to get negative credit for it, thanks to their reluctance to publicly lead on it.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957
    Chris said:

    TOPPING said:

    Chris said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    Certainly history is littered with people who thought "Leading a political party is really simple - I could easily do better".
    Everyone on here for a start.
    Explanation for the benefit of the terminally stupid: there's a difference between criticising bad leadership and thinking you could be a better leader.
    Yes and plenty of people on here, perhaps such as yourself, are terminally stupid also.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,635
    edited January 2023
    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    They always do, our last working man's lunch was at Claridge's.

    Next month's is some rough sounding place called The Wolseley.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,269
    Nigelb said:

    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Scholz really is the roadblock. Will that change on Friday ?

    Ukraine wants German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

    The Netherlands has German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

    Watch Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte ( @MinPres ) respond to
    @ak_mack ’s question about his government sending tanks to Ukraine.

    https://twitter.com/AtlanticCouncil/status/1615461700202897413

    I'd be quite surprised if Germany refused requests by other countries to transfer Leopards to Ukraine (assuming Biden has told him the US wants this), less sure if Germany will promise tanks itself but could also be a yes. But it's a question of how many countries are on board. Not much point if only Poland and Finland promise a dozen tanks each.

    There are a dozen or more European countries that have Leopard tanks. Some of them are obviously not going to be giving any to Ukraine (Hungary, Austria, Switzerland), or unlikely to (Portugal). Not sure if we've heard in public from many of the others.
    Scholz's refusal is ever harder to explain. But the latest straw in the wind doesn't give grounds for any optimism. Boris Pistorius, incoming new German defence minister who will be a key player in the decision, is reported as having been a member of the German-Russia Friendship parliamentary group until it was dissolved following the invasion of Ukraine. No doubt there's a bit of Kompromat knocking around somewhere.
    That's possibly an unfair characterisation.
    Since the invasion he's been relatively forthright in supporting Ukraine.

    We'll find out this week.

    Curiously Germany has supplied a very large amount of aid to Ukraine, but managed to get negative credit for it, thanks to their reluctance to publicly lead on it.
    The bad rep has come more, I think, from the process of multiple refusals, followed by an "OK then". And the process of saying OK, but having all kinds of weird obstacles, halts, changes of mind leading to delays etc.

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    TOPPING said:

    Chris said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    Certainly history is littered with people who thought "Leading a political party is really simple - I could easily do better".
    Everyone on here for a start.
    Nah.
    I could very probably do better in terms of both policy and morals, but would fall way short on persuasive bullshit.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,190

    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Scholz really is the roadblock. Will that change on Friday ?

    Ukraine wants German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

    The Netherlands has German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

    Watch Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte ( @MinPres ) respond to
    @ak_mack ’s question about his government sending tanks to Ukraine.

    https://twitter.com/AtlanticCouncil/status/1615461700202897413

    I'd be quite surprised if Germany refused requests by other countries to transfer Leopards to Ukraine (assuming Biden has told him the US wants this), less sure if Germany will promise tanks itself but could also be a yes. But it's a question of how many countries are on board. Not much point if only Poland and Finland promise a dozen tanks each.

    There are a dozen or more European countries that have Leopard tanks. Some of them are obviously not going to be giving any to Ukraine (Hungary, Austria, Switzerland), or unlikely to (Portugal). Not sure if we've heard in public from many of the others.
    Scholz's refusal is ever harder to explain. But the latest straw in the wind doesn't give grounds for any optimism. Boris Pistorius, incoming new German defence minister who will be a key player in the decision, is reported as having been a member of the German-Russia Friendship parliamentary group until it was dissolved following the invasion of Ukraine. No doubt there's a bit of Kompromat knocking around somewhere.
    We'll see. Silly allegations aside, there's no reason to think Pistorius is going to be especially opposed to allowing Leopards to Ukraine. I would guess Scholz chose him as someone he trusts to carry out whatever policy the German government decides on.

    Last week the German government said no requests had been made, and Habeck said that Germany shouldn't prevent other countries from transferring Leopards to Ukraine. To me the signs are that Germany will at least give permission for other countries to give Ukraine Leopards.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,585
    Scott_xP said:

    Sandpit said:

    If there’s any scandal there at all, it’s with the boring accountant who decided to replace it.

    Every PM (of late) gets their own unique design
    The new incumbent could and should have declined the offer, on the basis of cost.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    Chris said:

    ... Boris Pistorius, incoming new German defence minister ...

    OK. I'm finally convinced. We're living in a simulation.
    I'd be a good leader so long as people left me alone and didn’t hassle me.
  • TOPPING said:

    Chris said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    Certainly history is littered with people who thought "Leading a political party is really simple - I could easily do better".
    Everyone on here for a start.
    To be fair, I want to be unDictator.

    Which removes most of the problems that social democratic multi-party democracy causes for leaders.
    I go the other way. I wouldn't be a politician for love nor money.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705

    TOPPING said:

    Chris said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    Certainly history is littered with people who thought "Leading a political party is really simple - I could easily do better".
    Everyone on here for a start.
    To be fair, I want to be unDictator.

    Which removes most of the problems that social democratic multi-party democracy causes for leaders.
    I go the other way. I wouldn't be a politician for love nor money.
    What would convince you?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,397

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    They always do, our last working man's lunch was at Claridge's.

    Next month's is some rough sounding place called The Wolseley.
    I went there once. They told me they would serve anyone and anything, because they had Catholic tastes.
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291
    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    I shall be wearing my gold and turquoise pleated number.
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    I don't think the committee will report by next month, but I'm up for that bet for say a late May working man's lunch.
    We can and shall do that. I'm not expecting early May to be entirely joyous elecorally. Thank goodness my term ends in 2025.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951
    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    The Tories only got 28% last time the council seats up in May were up anyway and lost over 1000 council seats.

    I therefore doubt the swing will be that bad, albeit a few more seats lost to Labour maybe
    I think its going to be terrible, especially in the Southern strongholds.

    In BCP, for example, my old patch, it wouldn't surprise me to see Bournemouth and Poole Tories down to a handful each. And Christchurch entirely wiped out....
    The Conservatives failed to win control of BCP council in May 2019 anyway.

    It is NOC with a LD council leader with Labour, Green and Independent support

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Bournemouth,_Christchurch_and_Poole_Council_election
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951
    edited January 2023

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    No as Boris is the only Tory alternative to Sunak who might poll better than Sunak.

    So that ensures Sunak is safe until the next general election if Boris cannot return
  • TOPPING said:

    Chris said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    Certainly history is littered with people who thought "Leading a political party is really simple - I could easily do better".
    Everyone on here for a start.
    To be fair, I want to be unDictator.

    Which removes most of the problems that social democratic multi-party democracy causes for leaders.
    I go the other way. I wouldn't be a politician for love nor money.
    What would convince you?
    Nothing. I am not suited to either the backstabbing nor the compromises necessary. I have a VERY low opinion of politicians and my opinion of my own political abilities are not much higher.
  • JohnO said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    I don't think the committee will report by next month, but I'm up for that bet for say a late May working man's lunch.
    We can and shall do that. I'm not expecting early May to be entirely joyous elecorally. Thank goodness my term ends in 2025.
    In late May we can also toast the King's coronation.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    .
    JohnO said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    I shall be wearing my gold and turquoise pleated number.
    Is that the 90s theme look ?
  • JohnO said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    I shall be wearing my gold and turquoise pleated number.
    I've actually bought a pair of new red shoes for our meet up.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,397

    JohnO said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    I shall be wearing my gold and turquoise pleated number.
    I've actually bought a pair of new red shoes for our meet up.
    Will you Shearer steak?
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291

    JohnO said:

    JohnO said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    A glass of bubbly for me if Sunak survives and five cokes for you if he doesn't at our pie and chips workingman's lunch next month?

    Sunak's there for the duration. He was more than adequate at PMQs bearing in mind the weakness of his hand and a darned sight better than Truss, Johnson and May but not a patch on Dave C.
    I don't think the committee will report by next month, but I'm up for that bet for say a late May working man's lunch.
    We can and shall do that. I'm not expecting early May to be entirely joyous elecorally. Thank goodness my term ends in 2025.
    In late May we can also toast the King's coronation.
    You being such a devoted Royalist.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Passport renewal - website says "up to 10 weeks" - applied 3 Jan, they received my old passport 9 Jan, although they'd got in two days before. New passport delivered today. Used standard (not express) service, though did pay for secure postage.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127
    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    The Tories only got 28% last time the council seats up in May were up anyway and lost over 1000 council seats.

    I therefore doubt the swing will be that bad, albeit a few more seats lost to Labour maybe
    I think its going to be terrible, especially in the Southern strongholds.

    In BCP, for example, my old patch, it wouldn't surprise me to see Bournemouth and Poole Tories down to a handful each. And Christchurch entirely wiped out....
    The Conservatives failed to win control of BCP council in May 2019 anyway.

    It is NOC with a LD council leader with Labour, Green and Independent support

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Bournemouth,_Christchurch_and_Poole_Council_election
    I know. I was at the count. But they did a darn sight better than 10 seats

    It isn't NOC at the moment, its a Tory minority with support from ex-Tories and a few indies.
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291
    Nigelb said:

    .

    JohnO said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    I shall be wearing my gold and turquoise pleated number.
    Is that the 90s theme look ?
    Certainly not. It's standard smart casual.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840
    edited January 2023
    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Hmm, you need to count the number of helices. DNA for instance is a double helix, albeit with one major and one minor groove; I dimly recall that collagen is a triple helix with equidistant backbones; this, the Prentice Pillar at Rosslyn Chapel, looks like a quadruple or perhaps quintuple helix on a first eyeball. Not sure what the lectern is?

    The Jenga lectern, on the contrary, reminds me of what happens to a neat arrangement of books or blocks in a pinnacle during an earthquake with a dose of twisting and torsional motion. Inverness courthouse steeple ended up like the lectern in 1816 during an earthquake - ISTR that some folk liked the memento of the quake and were upset when it was untwisted by the repair crew.

    This is a simple example elsewhere - now multiply that and you get the Trussquake all over again.

    https://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/pen-and-ink-sketch-showing-damage-caused-to-an-inn-at-news-photo/90732258?phrase=twisted earthquake chimney&adppopup=true



  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,362

    Passport renewal - website says "up to 10 weeks" - applied 3 Jan, they received my old passport 9 Jan, although they'd got in two days before. New passport delivered today. Used standard (not express) service, though did pay for secure postage.

    Suggests they haven't managed to encourage as many people to apply for a new passport early in the year as they were hoping, and so the rush of applications closer to holiday departure times will be consequently larger
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957
    JohnO said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    JohnO said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    I shall be wearing my gold and turquoise pleated number.
    Is that the 90s theme look ?
    Certainly not. It's standard smart casual.
    Sounds like a(n) oblique, if fabulous tribute to Ukraine.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840
    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    They always do, our last working man's lunch was at Claridge's.

    Next month's is some rough sounding place called The Wolseley.
    I went there once. They told me they would serve anyone and anything, because they had Catholic tastes.
    Hold on - "working man"? "Lunch"?
  • HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    No as Boris is the only Tory alternative to Sunak who might poll better than Sunak.

    So that ensures Sunak is safe until the next general election if Boris cannot return
    Even you lack certainty hence the word "might" which suggests he might not. I think might not is more likely as it took a while for many people to realise that it is not a good thing to have a lying clown in our most important office, but most people got there in the end. Even you might realise that one day perhaps?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,635
    edited January 2023
    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    They always do, our last working man's lunch was at Claridge's.

    Next month's is some rough sounding place called The Wolseley.
    I went there once. They told me they would serve anyone and anything, because they had Catholic tastes.
    Hold on - "working man"? "Lunch"?
    I self identify as working class and JohnO represents the working man in Surrey.

    I am as working class as I am modest.
  • JohnO said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    JohnO said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    I shall be wearing my gold and turquoise pleated number.
    Is that the 90s theme look ?
    Certainly not. It's standard smart casual.
    Are you sure it is not casual/smart?
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,497
    edited January 2023
    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    What MPs see in him is that there is a very large number of people that Sunak isn't.

    Someone has to lead the country while getting ready to hand over to Labour. Why not him? I can't think of anyone who would very obviously do it better. I don't really know if anyone could win the next election for the Tories, but I am quite sure it would be an immoral thing for anyone to attempt.

    I should think most Tory MPs privately think the same, and have thought it since Owen Paterson, the Savile smear and partygate.

  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,664
    algarkirk said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    What MPs see in him is that there is a very large number of people that Sunak isn't.

    Someone has to lead the country while getting ready to hand over to Labour. Why not him? I can't think of anyone who would very obviously do it better. I don't really know if anyone could win the next election for the Tories, but I am quite sure it would be an immoral thing for anyone to attempt.

    Like that's going to hold Tory MPs back.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    Foreign Minister of the country-aggressor, Sergei Lavrov declared today that the West, spearheaded by the US is leading a proxy war against Russia, with an aim of a "Final Solution to the Russian Question", similar to Hitler's goal.
    https://mobile.twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1615663991447068672
  • DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
  • Fell, and couldn’t get up around 12.15 today. Wife rang 999….told ambulance would be 5 hours. In fact it was only 30 minutes.
    By that time emergency squad from GP surgery had arrived and sorted me out.
    No bones broken or other damage; just 84 year old man slipped between zimmer frame and toilet.
    Fine now.

    So sorry to hear about your fall but good the NHS was there for you
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Legal Note:
    Lord Hope has said the Govt’s decision to invoke s35 is unlikely to be overturned because it’s reasonable.
    @LordCFalconer has said it’s politically wrong to use s35.
    These views are not incompatible. One is legal, the other political.


    https://twitter.com/SCynic1/status/1615676461712838657
  • DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072

    Legal Note:
    Lord Hope has said the Govt’s decision to invoke s35 is unlikely to be overturned because it’s reasonable.
    @LordCFalconer has said it’s politically wrong to use s35.
    These views are not incompatible. One is legal, the other political.


    https://twitter.com/SCynic1/status/1615676461712838657

    Constitutional questions are, of course, both.

    The legal question will be settled one way or another fairly soon.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,990
    @BBCNewsnight: ‘Do you think AI has made you a better artist?’

    ‘I do actually’

    @KirstyWark speaks to Taryn Southern, whose albu… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1615738169919475714
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    .

    Carnyx said:

    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    JohnO said:

    our pie and chips workingman's lunch

    Q. Does the venue for this 'lunch' have a dress code?
    They always do, our last working man's lunch was at Claridge's.

    Next month's is some rough sounding place called The Wolseley.
    I went there once. They told me they would serve anyone and anything, because they had Catholic tastes.
    Hold on - "working man"? "Lunch"?
    I self identify as working class and JohnO represents the working man in Surrey.

    I am as working class as I am modest.
    In a manner entirely legendary.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,206
    edited January 2023

    Probably already been said on here multiple times, but one thing that absolutely boils my piss - more than rent going up faster than wages every single year, more than the constant transport breakdowns, more than products getting increasingly poorly built so they fall to bits within months- is how difficult it is to get even basic maintenance done on things like boilers.

    Last month, during the cold snap, my boiler broke. Landlord tells me to call E.on. E.on sends a guy three days later (was supposed to be next day but he never turned up), who looks at it and tells me it's the landlord's problem. Landlord calls an engineer who says it's easily fixable, but he needs a part which he can't get for another week. Nine days later, the engineer finally comes back with the part, spends 20 minutes fiddling with the boiler to fix it, and then tells us we're lucky because another client he has was waiting almost a month.

    So for almost 2 weeks in December I had no heating or proper hot water beyond what I could boil in a kettle.

    And a month later the fucking thing has broken again, and the landlord is once again denying they can do anything about it, and I KNOW that it will be fucked for weeks because neither E.on or the landlord care, and I'll have to waste time on the phone threatening to withhold rent or bills before they lift a finger. And in the meantime I have no heating or hot water during a snow and ice warning.

    Almost all my salary goes to these fucking shysters. The landlord is based in China and E.on is German so it doesn't even stay within the country. It's pure extraction. We are absolutely insane for allowing this.

    To be fair to your landlord, this is a nightmare problem all round, because there aren't enough tradesman of all sort around. In a similar way veign I've resorted to doing my own car maintenance because I simply can't find a capable garage which isn't booked up weeks into the future. I'm currently running a 2008 VW B6 Passat I bought in November... So far I've had the steering column out to fix the usual electric steering lock issue, taken the electric handbrake to bits, changed the serpentine belt and tensioner after the tensioner snapped in half(that was an awful job, as the tensioner is bolted on behind the front engine cover), and still need to change the alternator pulley (ultimate cause of the snapped belt tensioner) and do the inlet manifold P2015 issue. My wife says it's the most needy car she's ever known, so I'm probably saving myself a fortune doing all the work myself...
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    Happy memories of taking a visiting friend there and seeing this at the car park.

    https://www.alamy.com/da-vinci-code-horse-manure-for-sale-at-rosslyn-chapel-image7496812.html
  • Fell, and couldn’t get up around 12.15 today. Wife rang 999….told ambulance would be 5 hours. In fact it was only 30 minutes.
    By that time emergency squad from GP surgery had arrived and sorted me out.
    No bones broken or other damage; just 84 year old man slipped between zimmer frame and toilet.
    Fine now.

    Glad you are okay. Hopefully your experience is the norm rather than the exception. Certainly the response to my Mum at the weekend was very similar to yours. Even though it was a saturday night. Exceptional (as in fantastic rather than the exception) service.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,362
    theProle said:

    Probably already been said on here multiple times, but one thing that absolutely boils my piss - more than rent going up faster than wages every single year, more than the constant transport breakdowns, more than products getting increasingly poorly built so they fall to bits within months- is how difficult it is to get even basic maintenance done on things like boilers.

    Last month, during the cold snap, my boiler broke. Landlord tells me to call E.on. E.on sends a guy three days later (was supposed to be next day but he never turned up), who looks at it and tells me it's the landlord's problem. Landlord calls an engineer who says it's easily fixable, but he needs a part which he can't get for another week. Nine days later, the engineer finally comes back with the part, spends 20 minutes fiddling with the boiler to fix it, and then tells us we're lucky because another client he has was waiting almost a month.

    So for almost 2 weeks in December I had no heating or proper hot water beyond what I could boil in a kettle.

    And a month later the fucking thing has broken again, and the landlord is once again denying they can do anything about it, and I KNOW that it will be fucked for weeks because neither E.on or the landlord care, and I'll have to waste time on the phone threatening to withhold rent or bills before they lift a finger. And in the meantime I have no heating or hot water during a snow and ice warning.

    Almost all my salary goes to these fucking shysters. The landlord is based in China and E.on is German so it doesn't even stay within the country. It's pure extraction. We are absolutely insane for allowing this.

    To be fair to your landlord, this is a nightmare problem all round, because there aren't enough tradesman of all sort around. In a similar way veign I've resorted to doing my own car maintenance because I simply can't find a capable garage which isn't booked up weeks into the future. I'm currently running a 2008 VW B6 Passat I bought in November... So far I've had the steering column out to fix the usual electric steering lock issue, taken the electric handbrake to bits, changed the serpentine belt and tensioner after the tensioner snapped in half(that was an awful job, as the tensioner is bolted on behind the front engine cover), and still need to change the alternator pulley (ultimate cause of the snapped belt tensioner) and do the inlet manifold P2015 issue. My wife says it's the most needy car she's ever known, so I'm probably saving myself a fortune doing all the work myself...
    We have the same car. Have you had to do the flywheel yet?

    That's an expensive job because you normally have to take the engine out to get to it, but my father-in-law reckons he can weld ours back together with the engine in situ, but that it should hold together until spring anyway.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,215

    Probably already been said on here multiple times, but one thing that absolutely boils my piss - more than rent going up faster than wages every single year, more than the constant transport breakdowns, more than products getting increasingly poorly built so they fall to bits within months- is how difficult it is to get even basic maintenance done on things like boilers.

    Last month, during the cold snap, my boiler broke. Landlord tells me to call E.on. E.on sends a guy three days later (was supposed to be next day but he never turned up), who looks at it and tells me it's the landlord's problem. Landlord calls an engineer who says it's easily fixable, but he needs a part which he can't get for another week. Nine days later, the engineer finally comes back with the part, spends 20 minutes fiddling with the boiler to fix it, and then tells us we're lucky because another client he has was waiting almost a month.

    So for almost 2 weeks in December I had no heating or proper hot water beyond what I could boil in a kettle.

    And a month later the fucking thing has broken again, and the landlord is once again denying they can do anything about it, and I KNOW that it will be fucked for weeks because neither E.on or the landlord care, and I'll have to waste time on the phone threatening to withhold rent or bills before they lift a finger. And in the meantime I have no heating or hot water during a snow and ice warning.

    Almost all my salary goes to these fucking shysters. The landlord is based in China and E.on is German so it doesn't even stay within the country. It's pure extraction. We are absolutely insane for allowing this.

    Why don't you get it fixed yourself and pass on the cost by way of deduction from the rent?

    Either that or move. Sounds awful.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,664

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,497

    Legal Note:
    Lord Hope has said the Govt’s decision to invoke s35 is unlikely to be overturned because it’s reasonable.
    @LordCFalconer has said it’s politically wrong to use s35.
    These views are not incompatible. One is legal, the other political.


    https://twitter.com/SCynic1/status/1615676461712838657

    Politicians are bound by the rule of law. Law is not bound by the whim of politicians. The matter will be contested unpolitically through apolitical courts (whatever the Daily Mail and the SNP think). It is best to keep this matter as dull as it truly is. Nothing much to see here.

  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,749
    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951
    edited January 2023
    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,784

    Probably already been said on here multiple times, but one thing that absolutely boils my piss - more than rent going up faster than wages every single year, more than the constant transport breakdowns, more than products getting increasingly poorly built so they fall to bits within months- is how difficult it is to get even basic maintenance done on things like boilers.

    Last month, during the cold snap, my boiler broke. Landlord tells me to call E.on. E.on sends a guy three days later (was supposed to be next day but he never turned up), who looks at it and tells me it's the landlord's problem. Landlord calls an engineer who says it's easily fixable, but he needs a part which he can't get for another week. Nine days later, the engineer finally comes back with the part, spends 20 minutes fiddling with the boiler to fix it, and then tells us we're lucky because another client he has was waiting almost a month.

    So for almost 2 weeks in December I had no heating or proper hot water beyond what I could boil in a kettle.

    And a month later the fucking thing has broken again, and the landlord is once again denying they can do anything about it, and I KNOW that it will be fucked for weeks because neither E.on or the landlord care, and I'll have to waste time on the phone threatening to withhold rent or bills before they lift a finger. And in the meantime I have no heating or hot water during a snow and ice warning.

    Almost all my salary goes to these fucking shysters. The landlord is based in China and E.on is German so it doesn't even stay within the country. It's pure extraction. We are absolutely insane for allowing this.

    A few years ago our boiler was out of action from December until March, while we waited for Corgi - with whom we then had cover - to fix it or replace it. They kept sending out people to repair it who didn't have any experience of our make of boiler, people who would basically turn up, turn it off and on again, declare it fixed and leave - only for the boiler to fail again a few hours later. I had the impression they were trying to wait us out in the hope we would simply replace it ourselves. In the end they did buy us a new boiler but it took sheer bloody mindedness on our part to make it happen.
    There is a kind of generalised incompetence/rip-off culture embedded in our economy that seems hard to shake off. I can imagine that once you add an absentee landlord to the mix it becomes even worse.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951
    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    The Tories only got 28% last time the council seats up in May were up anyway and lost over 1000 council seats.

    I therefore doubt the swing will be that bad, albeit a few more seats lost to Labour maybe
    I think its going to be terrible, especially in the Southern strongholds.

    In BCP, for example, my old patch, it wouldn't surprise me to see Bournemouth and Poole Tories down to a handful each. And Christchurch entirely wiped out....
    The Conservatives failed to win control of BCP council in May 2019 anyway.

    It is NOC with a LD council leader with Labour, Green and Independent support

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Bournemouth,_Christchurch_and_Poole_Council_election
    I know. I was at the count. But they did a darn sight better than 10 seats

    It isn't NOC at the moment, its a Tory minority with support from ex-Tories and a few indies.
    So still NOC then if no Tory majority
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    edited January 2023
    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant - and certainly unhealthy -American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,362

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
    Seems to be a common criticism of popular books - the Harry Potter books get the same criticism - that they are poorly written.

    I draw a few conclusions from this.

    1. For most people the quality of a book lies with the quality of the story, rather than with the quality of the prose. Function being more important than form.
    2. To be massively popular a book needs to be accessible. Intricate wordplay and obscure references might delight those similarly in the know, but won't encourage the average reader to recommend a book. The Da Vinci code might well have a smaller vocabulary and otherwise offend against purist sensibilities, but perhaps that makes it easier for it to tell its story.
    3. There is much that is down to chance when it comes to book publishing.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,749
    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
    I must admit I didn't bother to look for further details about the prime minister's favourite cake, beyond mentally noting that it sounded comfortably within the Western tradition of desserts.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,269
    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant - and certainly unhealthy -American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
    Red velvet cake is very very good, when made well. Anyone who says different will be arguing with my wife.
  • Probably already been said on here multiple times, but one thing that absolutely boils my piss - more than rent going up faster than wages every single year, more than the constant transport breakdowns, more than products getting increasingly poorly built so they fall to bits within months- is how difficult it is to get even basic maintenance done on things like boilers.

    Last month, during the cold snap, my boiler broke. Landlord tells me to call E.on. E.on sends a guy three days later (was supposed to be next day but he never turned up), who looks at it and tells me it's the landlord's problem. Landlord calls an engineer who says it's easily fixable, but he needs a part which he can't get for another week. Nine days later, the engineer finally comes back with the part, spends 20 minutes fiddling with the boiler to fix it, and then tells us we're lucky because another client he has was waiting almost a month.

    So for almost 2 weeks in December I had no heating or proper hot water beyond what I could boil in a kettle.

    And a month later the fucking thing has broken again, and the landlord is once again denying they can do anything about it, and I KNOW that it will be fucked for weeks because neither E.on or the landlord care, and I'll have to waste time on the phone threatening to withhold rent or bills before they lift a finger. And in the meantime I have no heating or hot water during a snow and ice warning.

    Almost all my salary goes to these fucking shysters. The landlord is based in China and E.on is German so it doesn't even stay within the country. It's pure extraction. We are absolutely insane for allowing this.

    A few years ago our boiler was out of action from December until March, while we waited for Corgi - with whom we then had cover - to fix it or replace it. They kept sending out people to repair it who didn't have any experience of our make of boiler, people who would basically turn up, turn it off and on again, declare it fixed and leave - only for the boiler to fail again a few hours later. I had the impression they were trying to wait us out in the hope we would simply replace it ourselves. In the end they did buy us a new boiler but it took sheer bloody mindedness on our part to make it happen.
    There is a kind of generalised incompetence/rip-off culture embedded in our economy that seems hard to shake off. I can imagine that once you add an absentee landlord to the mix it becomes even worse.
    Waiting months for a plumber was a staple joke in the Britain of the 1970s. For that reason I could never understand why Leavers were so keen to be rid of the Polish competition and leave the field clear for Bodgit and Scarper Ltd at massively inflated rates.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,269

    Probably already been said on here multiple times, but one thing that absolutely boils my piss - more than rent going up faster than wages every single year, more than the constant transport breakdowns, more than products getting increasingly poorly built so they fall to bits within months- is how difficult it is to get even basic maintenance done on things like boilers.

    Last month, during the cold snap, my boiler broke. Landlord tells me to call E.on. E.on sends a guy three days later (was supposed to be next day but he never turned up), who looks at it and tells me it's the landlord's problem. Landlord calls an engineer who says it's easily fixable, but he needs a part which he can't get for another week. Nine days later, the engineer finally comes back with the part, spends 20 minutes fiddling with the boiler to fix it, and then tells us we're lucky because another client he has was waiting almost a month.

    So for almost 2 weeks in December I had no heating or proper hot water beyond what I could boil in a kettle.

    And a month later the fucking thing has broken again, and the landlord is once again denying they can do anything about it, and I KNOW that it will be fucked for weeks because neither E.on or the landlord care, and I'll have to waste time on the phone threatening to withhold rent or bills before they lift a finger. And in the meantime I have no heating or hot water during a snow and ice warning.

    Almost all my salary goes to these fucking shysters. The landlord is based in China and E.on is German so it doesn't even stay within the country. It's pure extraction. We are absolutely insane for allowing this.

    A few years ago our boiler was out of action from December until March, while we waited for Corgi - with whom we then had cover - to fix it or replace it. They kept sending out people to repair it who didn't have any experience of our make of boiler, people who would basically turn up, turn it off and on again, declare it fixed and leave - only for the boiler to fail again a few hours later. I had the impression they were trying to wait us out in the hope we would simply replace it ourselves. In the end they did buy us a new boiler but it took sheer bloody mindedness on our part to make it happen.
    There is a kind of generalised incompetence/rip-off culture embedded in our economy that seems hard to shake off. I can imagine that once you add an absentee landlord to the mix it becomes even worse.
    We had cover from British Gas in our old flat. They rebuilt the boiler pretty much - it would have been cheaper for them to instal a new one. Literally - on one occasion , the chap said he'd replaced everything apart from the castings.

    In a sane world, the connections and dimensions of the wall fittings and pipe locations would be standardised and maintained by the manufacturer across models. So f you replace one from a given manufacturer, with their latest model, it wouldn't mean a full half day of fiddling with the pipe work etc.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,312
    Zelelensky speaks to Davos. He is naturally gifted at this. We are bored of him but he remains quite remarkable

    Ukraine would probably be part of Russia by now, without Zelenskyy
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,994

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
    Seems to be a common criticism of popular books - the Harry Potter books get the same criticism - that they are poorly written.

    I draw a few conclusions from this.

    1. For most people the quality of a book lies with the quality of the story, rather than with the quality of the prose. Function being more important than form.
    2. To be massively popular a book needs to be accessible. Intricate wordplay and obscure references might delight those similarly in the know, but won't encourage the average reader to recommend a book. The Da Vinci code might well have a smaller vocabulary and otherwise offend against purist sensibilities, but perhaps that makes it easier for it to tell its story.
    3. There is much that is down to chance when it comes to book publishing.
    I think there's a lot in that. The writing mustn't be clunky of course, but for a bestseller it should also not be too noticeable one way or the other. The story should just come out of the page in such a way that the reader forgets there was actually an author involved. Same with good action films or thrillers.

    Much literary fiction writing is noticeable - you feel the author's voice and you know what you are reading was written by someone. That can sometimes be compelling especially when the quality of description is inventive or evocative, but it's a different experience from reading a page turner. So is bad writing. Some of the self-published non-fiction rubbish that I've accidentally ended up reading in the last couple of years is so obviously "written", and badly, that it makes it impossible to read. The viticultural world has a fair few examples.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,362
    edited January 2023

    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant - and certainly unhealthy -American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
    Red velvet cake is very very good, when made well. Anyone who says different will be arguing with my wife.
    I've never had a version made with carrot before.

    There was a recipe for beetroot chocolate cake I used that might have described itself as a red velvet cake, but beetroot behaves rather differently to carrot in cakes.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,359

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
    Seems to be a common criticism of popular books - the Harry Potter books get the same criticism - that they are poorly written.

    I draw a few conclusions from this.

    1. For most people the quality of a book lies with the quality of the story, rather than with the quality of the prose. Function being more important than form.
    2. To be massively popular a book needs to be accessible. Intricate wordplay and obscure references might delight those similarly in the know, but won't encourage the average reader to recommend a book. The Da Vinci code might well have a smaller vocabulary and otherwise offend against purist sensibilities, but perhaps that makes it easier for it to tell its story.
    3. There is much that is down to chance when it comes to book publishing.
    I'd say what matters most, in descending order is plot, then characterisation, then worldbuilding, and then quality of the prose.

    What I don't understand was the success of writers like Sidney Sheldon, E. L. James, and Harold Robbins, whose plots were dreadful, and whose characterisation, worldbuilding, and prose were even worse than their plotting.

    WRT Harry Potter, the first three books are excellent, classics of childrens' literature on a par with The Hobbit. The last four books suffered from the perennial problem of fantasy writers who have become so successful that they can defy their editors - namely bloat.

  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,875
    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    The Tories only got 28% last time the council seats up in May were up anyway and lost over 1000 council seats.

    I therefore doubt the swing will be that bad, albeit a few more seats lost to Labour maybe
    I think its going to be terrible, especially in the Southern strongholds.

    In BCP, for example, my old patch, it wouldn't surprise me to see Bournemouth and Poole Tories down to a handful each. And Christchurch entirely wiped out....
    The Conservatives failed to win control of BCP council in May 2019 anyway.

    It is NOC with a LD council leader with Labour, Green and Independent support

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Bournemouth,_Christchurch_and_Poole_Council_election
    I know. I was at the count. But they did a darn sight better than 10 seats

    It isn't NOC at the moment, its a Tory minority with support from ex-Tories and a few indies.
    So still NOC then if no Tory majority
    It's been quite a convoluted story since the 2019 local elections. Essentially, the LD-Independent coalition fell apart, the Conservatives won a majority via defections and then lost that majority via defections. The net effect is the Conservatives have 35 of the 76 seats and govern as a minority. The assorted Independents have 19 seats and the LDs 13.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951
    edited January 2023

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    No as Boris is the only Tory alternative to Sunak who might poll better than Sunak.

    So that ensures Sunak is safe until the next general election if Boris cannot return
    Even you lack certainty hence the word "might" which suggests he might not. I think might not is more likely as it took a while for many people to realise that it is not a good thing to have a lying clown in our most important office, but most people got there in the end. Even you might realise that one day perhaps?
    Do you really think Braverman or Hunt or Cleverly or Raab or Barclay or Badenoch would do any better in the polls than Boris or Sunak? Wallace has ruled himself out. Mordaunt is too Woke to win MPs or the membership.

    Sunak is the Tories best bet to minimise the defeat, then as long as they don't become too extreme in opposition they can wait for the Labour government to become unpopular with more strikes and still high inflation
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    TimS said:

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
    Seems to be a common criticism of popular books - the Harry Potter books get the same criticism - that they are poorly written.

    I draw a few conclusions from this.

    1. For most people the quality of a book lies with the quality of the story, rather than with the quality of the prose. Function being more important than form.
    2. To be massively popular a book needs to be accessible. Intricate wordplay and obscure references might delight those similarly in the know, but won't encourage the average reader to recommend a book. The Da Vinci code might well have a smaller vocabulary and otherwise offend against purist sensibilities, but perhaps that makes it easier for it to tell its story.
    3. There is much that is down to chance when it comes to book publishing.
    I think there's a lot in that. The writing mustn't be clunky of course, but for a bestseller it should also not be too noticeable one way or the other. The story should just come out of the page in such a way that the reader forgets there was actually an author involved. Same with good action films or thrillers.

    Much literary fiction writing is noticeable - you feel the author's voice and you know what you are reading was written by someone. That can sometimes be compelling especially when the quality of description is inventive or evocative, but it's a different experience from reading a page turner. So is bad writing. Some of the self-published non-fiction rubbish that I've accidentally ended up reading in the last couple of years is so obviously "written", and badly, that it makes it impossible to read. The viticultural world has a fair few examples.
    Some quite good writers on here imo. A handful are very good.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,994
    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
    Seems to be a common criticism of popular books - the Harry Potter books get the same criticism - that they are poorly written.

    I draw a few conclusions from this.

    1. For most people the quality of a book lies with the quality of the story, rather than with the quality of the prose. Function being more important than form.
    2. To be massively popular a book needs to be accessible. Intricate wordplay and obscure references might delight those similarly in the know, but won't encourage the average reader to recommend a book. The Da Vinci code might well have a smaller vocabulary and otherwise offend against purist sensibilities, but perhaps that makes it easier for it to tell its story.
    3. There is much that is down to chance when it comes to book publishing.
    I think there's a lot in that. The writing mustn't be clunky of course, but for a bestseller it should also not be too noticeable one way or the other. The story should just come out of the page in such a way that the reader forgets there was actually an author involved. Same with good action films or thrillers.

    Much literary fiction writing is noticeable - you feel the author's voice and you know what you are reading was written by someone. That can sometimes be compelling especially when the quality of description is inventive or evocative, but it's a different experience from reading a page turner. So is bad writing. Some of the self-published non-fiction rubbish that I've accidentally ended up reading in the last couple of years is so obviously "written", and badly, that it makes it impossible to read. The viticultural world has a fair few examples.
    Some quite good writers on here imo. A handful are very good.
    HYUFD is like reading Hemingway.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951
    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    HYUFD said:

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    The Tories only got 28% last time the council seats up in May were up anyway and lost over 1000 council seats.

    I therefore doubt the swing will be that bad, albeit a few more seats lost to Labour maybe
    I think its going to be terrible, especially in the Southern strongholds.

    In BCP, for example, my old patch, it wouldn't surprise me to see Bournemouth and Poole Tories down to a handful each. And Christchurch entirely wiped out....
    The Conservatives failed to win control of BCP council in May 2019 anyway.

    It is NOC with a LD council leader with Labour, Green and Independent support

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Bournemouth,_Christchurch_and_Poole_Council_election
    I know. I was at the count. But they did a darn sight better than 10 seats

    It isn't NOC at the moment, its a Tory minority with support from ex-Tories and a few indies.
    So still NOC then if no Tory majority
    It's been quite a convoluted story since the 2019 local elections. Essentially, the LD-Independent coalition fell apart, the Conservatives won a majority via defections and then lost that majority via defections. The net effect is the Conservatives have 35 of the 76 seats and govern as a minority. The assorted Independents have 19 seats and the LDs 13.
    Note in May 2019 the Tories lost control of 44 councils and got just 28% voteshare, they are already at nearly rock bottom in the councils up this year anyway

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_United_Kingdom_local_elections
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
    Seems to be a common criticism of popular books - the Harry Potter books get the same criticism - that they are poorly written.

    I draw a few conclusions from this.

    1. For most people the quality of a book lies with the quality of the story, rather than with the quality of the prose. Function being more important than form.
    2. To be massively popular a book needs to be accessible. Intricate wordplay and obscure references might delight those similarly in the know, but won't encourage the average reader to recommend a book. The Da Vinci code might well have a smaller vocabulary and otherwise offend against purist sensibilities, but perhaps that makes it easier for it to tell its story.
    3. There is much that is down to chance when it comes to book publishing.
    I think there's a lot in that. The writing mustn't be clunky of course, but for a bestseller it should also not be too noticeable one way or the other. The story should just come out of the page in such a way that the reader forgets there was actually an author involved. Same with good action films or thrillers.

    Much literary fiction writing is noticeable - you feel the author's voice and you know what you are reading was written by someone. That can sometimes be compelling especially when the quality of description is inventive or evocative, but it's a different experience from reading a page turner. So is bad writing. Some of the self-published non-fiction rubbish that I've accidentally ended up reading in the last couple of years is so obviously "written", and badly, that it makes it impossible to read. The viticultural world has a fair few examples.
    Some quite good writers on here imo. A handful are very good.
    HYUFD is like reading Hemingway.
    Touch better for me.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,875
    The Standard laying into Khan on the front page this evening but the editorial is actually quite kind. The 5.9% increase on bus, tube and overground fares was well touted. The ban on over 60s enjoying free travel before 9am has also been made permanent and the GLA/Mayoralty precept will go up 9.7% and I suspect some of the bills in some of the Boroughs are going to be eye-wateringly bad but then of course London doesn't vote locally until 2026.

    I'm also told we are a "lefty, woke" stronghold anyway. I'm also told an Independent London could be like the Venetian Republic of old - free London (after 9am if you're over 60 apparently).
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951
    stodge said:

    The Standard laying into Khan on the front page this evening but the editorial is actually quite kind. The 5.9% increase on bus, tube and overground fares was well touted. The ban on over 60s enjoying free travel before 9am has also been made permanent and the GLA/Mayoralty precept will go up 9.7% and I suspect some of the bills in some of the Boroughs are going to be eye-wateringly bad but then of course London doesn't vote locally until 2026.

    I'm also told we are a "lefty, woke" stronghold anyway. I'm also told an Independent London could be like the Venetian Republic of old - free London (after 9am if you're over 60 apparently).

    Except half the main wealth creators who work in London live in the Home counties
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    HYUFD said:

    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617

    The Markles rejection of an apology from @JeremyClarkson is evidence that humiliation is their intent, not reconciliation. A warning to @RoyalFamily that they are not dealing with normal, rational. reasonable people, but two hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters #SparePrinceHarry
  • Chris said:

    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
    I must admit I didn't bother to look for further details about the prime minister's favourite cake, beyond mentally noting that it sounded comfortably within the Western tradition of desserts.
    In the santanic mills of western Pennsylvania back in the day, the Slavs & Italians who dominated the workforce at turn of 19th>20th-cen., called the English/Scots-Irish "native stock" workers and foremen "cake-eaters" because their wives would typically include a piece of cake in their lunch-boxes. Rich and rare behavior from perspective of eastern & southern European recent immigrants.

    My take is, Rishi Sunak is placing himself comfortably within the British tradition of desserts?

    With red velvet carrot cake being a modernizing twist?

    BTW, intensive research (two minutes googling) revels that the KEY difference between red velvet versus devils food cakes, is . . . wait for it . . . cocoa versus chocolate.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,784
    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    DJ41 said:

    A Jenga-style podium used by Liz Truss in her short-lived stint as prime minister cost taxpayers £4,175, it has emerged.

    The lectern was compared to a Jenga tower, from the board game that results in total collapse, as it featured pieces of wood that resembled Jenga blocks ready to topple. It was specially made for the former prime minister who lasted 45 days in No 10.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jan/18/liz-truss-jenga-style-podium-cost-taxpayers-4175

    About £93/day….

    Haven't any journalists sussed what that lectern was all about yet?

    Aletha Adu at the Guardian copied the story from John Stevens at the Mirror.

    The lectern was of the same style, although supposedly it wasn't the same actual lectern, as the one that was used at the Tory leadership announcement.

    Liz Truss must really have liked that unusual style of lectern.

    But I am sceptical about them being two different lecterns. Two questions: 1. where is the first one? 2. Did anyone spot any differences between them?

    Angela Rayner, who uses w********t for good purposes (bless her), may know more than she lets on when she says "(Liz Truss's) choice of a Jenga design should have been a warning sign of the chaos she was about to unleash."

    It was, Angela. I read the sign at the time.

    The word "Jenga" comes from Swahili, but Jenga is a complete red herring.

    Think of something closer to home:

    image
    Is it just me or is that an utterly baffling post?
    Not just you.
    Rosslyn Chapel in the photo. Freemasonry and Dan Brown sort of stuff.
    The big Da Vinci Code mystery is of course how did such a terribly written book sell so many copies?

    AI couldn't possibly do a worse job.
    Seems to be a common criticism of popular books - the Harry Potter books get the same criticism - that they are poorly written.

    I draw a few conclusions from this.

    1. For most people the quality of a book lies with the quality of the story, rather than with the quality of the prose. Function being more important than form.
    2. To be massively popular a book needs to be accessible. Intricate wordplay and obscure references might delight those similarly in the know, but won't encourage the average reader to recommend a book. The Da Vinci code might well have a smaller vocabulary and otherwise offend against purist sensibilities, but perhaps that makes it easier for it to tell its story.
    3. There is much that is down to chance when it comes to book publishing.
    I think there's a lot in that. The writing mustn't be clunky of course, but for a bestseller it should also not be too noticeable one way or the other. The story should just come out of the page in such a way that the reader forgets there was actually an author involved. Same with good action films or thrillers.

    Much literary fiction writing is noticeable - you feel the author's voice and you know what you are reading was written by someone. That can sometimes be compelling especially when the quality of description is inventive or evocative, but it's a different experience from reading a page turner. So is bad writing. Some of the self-published non-fiction rubbish that I've accidentally ended up reading in the last couple of years is so obviously "written", and badly, that it makes it impossible to read. The viticultural world has a fair few examples.
    Some quite good writers on here imo. A handful are very good.
    HYUFD is like reading Hemingway.
    Harsh.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,434
    edited January 2023
    DavidL said:

    Sunak’s alleged USP is that he is competent. That means he has to solve problems. At the moment he’s not doing that. They need to do a deal with the nurses today. Last week would’ve been better.
    He needs to sort out a deal with the teachers. Less critical but still urgent.
    Ideally, he would do a deal with the train staff too. Less urgent, these people provide a worse service than Ukraine even when they are not on strike. If the railways close down because people learn to live without them too bad.
    The intray is piling up Gordon Brown style. Sunak needs to start emptying it.

    That's before he even starts on the boats. Apparently they are considering a 'Get boats done' approach to the next election, which rather begs the question wtf have they been doing for the past two years. At least Boris had not been in charge of Brexit in the period running up to his election.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,951

    HYUFD said:

    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617

    The Markles rejection of an apology from @JeremyClarkson is evidence that humiliation is their intent, not reconciliation. A warning to @RoyalFamily that they are not dealing with normal, rational. reasonable people, but two hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters #SparePrinceHarry
    Only Democrats still narrowly have a favourable view of the Sussexes, Republicans view them particularly badly.

    Perhaps Meghan can run for Governor or Senator in California?
  • HYUFD said:

    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617

    The Markles rejection of an apology from @JeremyClarkson is evidence that humiliation is their intent, not reconciliation. A warning to @RoyalFamily that they are not dealing with normal, rational. reasonable people, but two hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters #SparePrinceHarry
    Only a moron could see the target of that Clarkson article as the hate fuelled one.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,434

    Mortimer said:

    On topic, Sunak's not very good at this, he's reminding us how he managed to lose to Liz Truss.

    Truly the Alan Partridge PM.

    I simply don't see what the MPs see in him. I still think May will see his premiership mortally wounded; the next political issue will see him replaced with someone less Eeyorish....
    Speaking to a former Tory strategist the other day, they are convinced that Sunak is getting ousted the moment the committee votes to suspend Boris Johnson for lying to the House.

    The moment there's no chance of Boris Johnson coming back as PM then Sunak's gone.
    Odd that they think they think that imposing yet another new PM on the nation is theoretically less damaging than getting Boris back. Both outcomes are so incredibly crap that it hardly seems worth striving for one over the other.
    And that both options are less damaging than continuing with the current incumbent. They're correct too.
  • HYUFD said:

    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617

    The Markles rejection of an apology from @JeremyClarkson is evidence that humiliation is their intent, not reconciliation. A warning to @RoyalFamily that they are not dealing with normal, rational. reasonable people, but two hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters #SparePrinceHarry
    "hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters" for rejecting an apology for what he said about her? Are you quite literally insane?
    The use of 'The Markles' displays ghastly misandry.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,434
    Scott_xP said:

    Sandpit said:

    If there’s any scandal there at all, it’s with the boring accountant who decided to replace it.

    Every PM (of late) gets their own unique design
    Exactly. It had nothing to do with Truss, and if anyone should be criticised for this it's the Civil Service. As if she even had anything to do with the hideous thing.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,557
    "They say the first step in fixing a crisis is to recognise there is a problem. So let us give thanks for a Labour leader’s dismissal of the belief that Britain’s health service is the envy of the world — a deluded concept that, in the words of Sir Keir Starmer, is “plainly wrong”. Yes, he was adopting Blairite tactics to confound expectations with a bit of political cross-dressing, while also obviously aware of polls showing the drastic collapse of faith among voters in their once-worshiped NHS. His reform plans are rudimentary, his funding suggestions sketchy and his proposal to nationalise general practitioners seems ill-conceived. Yet this is still an important moment."

    https://unherd.com/2023/01/why-would-anyone-envy-the-nhs/
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,434

    HYUFD said:

    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617

    The Markles rejection of an apology from @JeremyClarkson is evidence that humiliation is their intent, not reconciliation. A warning to @RoyalFamily that they are not dealing with normal, rational. reasonable people, but two hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters #SparePrinceHarry
    Only a moron could see the target of that Clarkson article as the hate fuelled one.
    It is just possible that they could both be dislikable twats.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,362

    Chris said:

    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
    I must admit I didn't bother to look for further details about the prime minister's favourite cake, beyond mentally noting that it sounded comfortably within the Western tradition of desserts.
    In the santanic mills of western Pennsylvania back in the day, the Slavs & Italians who dominated the workforce at turn of 19th>20th-cen., called the English/Scots-Irish "native stock" workers and foremen "cake-eaters" because their wives would typically include a piece of cake in their lunch-boxes. Rich and rare behavior from perspective of eastern & southern European recent immigrants.

    My take is, Rishi Sunak is placing himself comfortably within the British tradition of desserts?

    With red velvet carrot cake being a modernizing twist?

    BTW, intensive research (two minutes googling) revels that the KEY difference between red velvet versus devils food cakes, is . . . wait for it . . . cocoa versus chocolate.
    There is a class (and consequently VAT) consequence to this.

    Cakes are considered a necessary foodstuff, as part of a genteel afternoon tea, and are therefore exempt from VAT. Chocolate-covered biscuits are a wanton luxury, indulged in by the working class, and so consequently face the full rate of VAT at 20% to ensure that the workers are dissuaded from falling prey to their gluttonous instincts.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,329
    Scott_xP said:

    As well as being generally crap at PMQs, he also needs a better answer on Zahawi

    He cannot polish that turd
  • David Moyes is likely to be sacked by West Ham United if his side lose to Everton on Saturday, it was confirmed at a club board meeting today.

    While senior figures at West Ham recognise the success the manager has enjoyed in his second spell at the club, their drop into the Premier League relegation zone after securing only one point from seven games has persuaded them that a change may be necessary.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/david-moyes-set-for-sack-if-west-ham-united-lose-to-everton-jwblxrqcz

    I reckon Moyes will replace Lampard at some point this season.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,914
    OT. I tried to send a cheque to a French bank today and was told that no mail was being sent abroad at the moment due to a Russian cyber attack. He said it had been out for a week and would be out till further notice.

    Is this one for our resident stargazer or was he taking the piss.....?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,557
    Scott_xP said:

    @BBCNewsnight: ‘Do you think AI has made you a better artist?’

    ‘I do actually’

    @KirstyWark speaks to Taryn Southern, whose albu… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1615738169919475714

    Nick Cave says the opposite on the same Newsnight programme.
  • HYUFD said:

    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617

    The Markles rejection of an apology from @JeremyClarkson is evidence that humiliation is their intent, not reconciliation. A warning to @RoyalFamily that they are not dealing with normal, rational. reasonable people, but two hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters #SparePrinceHarry
    Only a moron could see the target of that Clarkson article as the hate fuelled one.
    It is just possible that they could both be dislikable twats.
    Sure.

    But calling them hate fuelled whilst absolving Clarkson is a bit like blaming Ukraine for Russia invading them.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840

    Chris said:

    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
    I must admit I didn't bother to look for further details about the prime minister's favourite cake, beyond mentally noting that it sounded comfortably within the Western tradition of desserts.
    In the santanic mills of western Pennsylvania back in the day, the Slavs & Italians who dominated the workforce at turn of 19th>20th-cen., called the English/Scots-Irish "native stock" workers and foremen "cake-eaters" because their wives would typically include a piece of cake in their lunch-boxes. Rich and rare behavior from perspective of eastern & southern European recent immigrants.

    My take is, Rishi Sunak is placing himself comfortably within the British tradition of desserts?

    With red velvet carrot cake being a modernizing twist?

    BTW, intensive research (two minutes googling) revels that the KEY difference between red velvet versus devils food cakes, is . . . wait for it . . . cocoa versus chocolate.
    There is a class (and consequently VAT) consequence to this.

    Cakes are considered a necessary foodstuff, as part of a genteel afternoon tea, and are therefore exempt from VAT. Chocolate-covered biscuits are a wanton luxury, indulged in by the working class, and so consequently face the full rate of VAT at 20% to ensure that the workers are dissuaded from falling prey to their gluttonous instincts.
    TBF many cakes are desserts and vv - pineapple upside down cake, Bakewell tart, etc. The demartcation might be whether one can have them with custards.

    Though we often have shortbread with our rhubarb and cream for afters - yet that remains a biscuit.
  • Roger said:

    OT. I tried to send a cheque to a French bank today and was told that no mail was being sent abroad at the moment due to a Russian cyber attack. He said it had been out for a week and would be out till further notice.

    Is this one for our resident stargazer or was he taking the piss.....?

    Genuine.

    https://personal.help.royalmail.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/12556
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,362
    Carnyx said:

    Chris said:

    Nigelb said:

    Chris said:

    Vigilant as always, a spokesman for the prime minister has weighed in on the public debate about whether people should take cakes into work or not.

    "As to the government's official position, the prime minister's official spokesman said Rishi Sunak believed "personal choice should be baked into our approach".
    [blah]
    Mr Sunak's spokesman added that the prime minister was "very partial to a piece of cake" and most enjoyed carrot and red velvet cake."
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64315384

    If Mr Sunak enjoys a piece of cake, I for one will vote to keep him in Downing Street. Hurrah!

    Sounds a fairly unpleasant American creation.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_velvet_cake

    On a culinary note, Lindsay Hoyle and chocolate teapot are trending on Twitter.
    I must admit I didn't bother to look for further details about the prime minister's favourite cake, beyond mentally noting that it sounded comfortably within the Western tradition of desserts.
    In the santanic mills of western Pennsylvania back in the day, the Slavs & Italians who dominated the workforce at turn of 19th>20th-cen., called the English/Scots-Irish "native stock" workers and foremen "cake-eaters" because their wives would typically include a piece of cake in their lunch-boxes. Rich and rare behavior from perspective of eastern & southern European recent immigrants.

    My take is, Rishi Sunak is placing himself comfortably within the British tradition of desserts?

    With red velvet carrot cake being a modernizing twist?

    BTW, intensive research (two minutes googling) revels that the KEY difference between red velvet versus devils food cakes, is . . . wait for it . . . cocoa versus chocolate.
    There is a class (and consequently VAT) consequence to this.

    Cakes are considered a necessary foodstuff, as part of a genteel afternoon tea, and are therefore exempt from VAT. Chocolate-covered biscuits are a wanton luxury, indulged in by the working class, and so consequently face the full rate of VAT at 20% to ensure that the workers are dissuaded from falling prey to their gluttonous instincts.
    TBF many cakes are desserts and vv - pineapple upside down cake, Bakewell tart, etc. The demartcation might be whether one can have them with custards.

    Though we often have shortbread with our rhubarb and cream for afters - yet that remains a biscuit.
    Any attempt by Westminster to tax shortbread would surely spell the end of the Union!
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,784

    HYUFD said:

    Prince Harry’s rating plunges to -7% amongst Americans a new US poll finds.

    Duchess Meghan’s falls even further to -13% in the US

    https://www.newsweek.com/more-prince-harry-meghan-markle-say-less-americans-like-them-poll-1774617

    The Markles rejection of an apology from @JeremyClarkson is evidence that humiliation is their intent, not reconciliation. A warning to @RoyalFamily that they are not dealing with normal, rational. reasonable people, but two hate fuelled, narcisstic monsters #SparePrinceHarry
    Only a moron could see the target of that Clarkson article as the hate fuelled one.
    It is just possible that they could both be dislikable twats.
    Sure.

    But calling them hate fuelled whilst absolving Clarkson is a bit like blaming Ukraine for Russia invading them.
    You got a like for the brazenly inappropriate analogy.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,154
    Stocky said:

    Probably already been said on here multiple times, but one thing that absolutely boils my piss - more than rent going up faster than wages every single year, more than the constant transport breakdowns, more than products getting increasingly poorly built so they fall to bits within months- is how difficult it is to get even basic maintenance done on things like boilers.

    Last month, during the cold snap, my boiler broke. Landlord tells me to call E.on. E.on sends a guy three days later (was supposed to be next day but he never turned up), who looks at it and tells me it's the landlord's problem. Landlord calls an engineer who says it's easily fixable, but he needs a part which he can't get for another week. Nine days later, the engineer finally comes back with the part, spends 20 minutes fiddling with the boiler to fix it, and then tells us we're lucky because another client he has was waiting almost a month.

    So for almost 2 weeks in December I had no heating or proper hot water beyond what I could boil in a kettle.

    And a month later the fucking thing has broken again, and the landlord is once again denying they can do anything about it, and I KNOW that it will be fucked for weeks because neither E.on or the landlord care, and I'll have to waste time on the phone threatening to withhold rent or bills before they lift a finger. And in the meantime I have no heating or hot water during a snow and ice warning.

    Almost all my salary goes to these fucking shysters. The landlord is based in China and E.on is German so it doesn't even stay within the country. It's pure extraction. We are absolutely insane for allowing this.

    Why don't you get it fixed yourself and pass on the cost by way of deduction from the rent?

    Either that or move. Sounds awful.
    I always found that notifying the landlord that I would be fixing it, and deducting the sum from rent would typically get them onto the case pronto.
This discussion has been closed.