It does look like most of the MPs are going to put Rishi as far ahead as they can. Penny’s poor showing is disappointing, but she’ll throw her support behind Rishi on Monday morning and get a top job out of it.
It doesn't matter how far ahead Sunak is unless Johnson fails to get 100.
I’m not convinced this is a shoe in for Johnson if he makes the final two .
I think the fact he’s still under investigation could be a big factor .
It’s Sunak, trust me. Brady and co knew that when they announced the vote; the Cabinet knew that when they met at the Carlton Club. Johnson may not make the hundred, and if he does there will be the most intense pressure for him to withdraw and play ball.
It’s obvious Sunak will top the MPs poll by miles. The Tories - as has everyone else - understand that Truss’s problem was not being the MPs’ choice. They won’t make that mistake again. All Brady’s comments about the member stage were carefully worded, hedged to indicate it may or may not happen, and they are relaxed about the logistics and practical problems because it’s not going to happen.
Sunak will be PM Monday evening.
What do you make of Paul Staines's "info" that declared (to him) support for the contenders among "whips, party board members, Tory vice chairs and 1922 chairmen who have to remain publicly neutral" is currently running at
18 Johnson 6 Sunak 4 Mordaunt ?
The entire group of the "must remain publicly neutral" can't number many more than 28 surely?
It does look like most of the MPs are going to put Rishi as far ahead as they can. Penny’s poor showing is disappointing, but she’ll throw her support behind Rishi on Monday morning and get a top job out of it.
It doesn't matter how far ahead Sunak is unless Johnson fails to get 100.
I’m not convinced this is a shoe in for Johnson if he makes the final two .
I think the fact he’s still under investigation could be a big factor .
It’s Sunak, trust me. Brady and co knew that when they announced the vote; the Cabinet knew that when they met at the Carlton Club. Johnson may not make the hundred, and if he does there will be the most intense pressure for him to withdraw and play ball.
It’s obvious Sunak will top the MPs poll by miles. The Tories - as has everyone else - understand that Truss’s problem was not being the MPs’ choice. They won’t make that mistake again. All Brady’s comments about the member stage were carefully worded, hedged to indicate it may or may not happen, and they are relaxed about the logistics and practical problems because it’s not going to happen.
Sunak will be PM Monday evening.
What do you make of Paul Staines's "info" that declared (to him) support for the contenders among "whips, party board members, Tory vice chairs and 1922 chairmen who have to remain publicly neutral" is currently running at
18 Johnson 6 Sunak 4 Mordaunt ?
The entire group of the "must remain publicly neutral" can't number many more than 28 surely?
Truss appointees as Whips. Now unemployable by Sunak or Mordaunt. Hoping Boris might have some use for them.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
I supported Brexit and voted Con at a GE for the first time in 2019 so ought to be the sort of person who would welcome person Boris back but the thought fills me with dread. I don't have anything against Boris personally and can understand why some people would welcome him back but now is not the right time.
The Tories need to learn the lesson from the US Democrats. The Dems thought that Roe vs Wade would unlock the midterms but they are now starting to get crushed on inflation and crime:
The lesson is that fighting the culture wars (whether from the left or right) can work when the economy is going well but when the economy is bad that is only thing that matters (see Maslow's hierarchy of needs).
In my view, the economy is the only thing that matters until the election and the only Tory who has the credibility to take the fight to Labour is Rishi.
I'd vote for him (not that I can)
Agree to a point. Which is re: US mid-terms, think Dems "getting crushed" by "the bottom falling out" is overstating the situation by a bunch.
But that cost-of-living is cancelling out gains due to Roe v Wade repeal is clear. Question is, by how much and what's the final balance?
Note that my own ballot should be in tomorrow's mail. With two important statewide races - US Senator and WA Secretary of State - where Democrat is ahead but opponent (Republican in first, Nonpartisan in other) is closing the gap.
Again, question is, will they pass ahead when all the votes are returned and counted? My guess is that Dems retain US Senate - and SOS is too close to call.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
I think the Boris to the Home office rumour was nonsense but wonder if Boris could take a party chairman role. I guess it depends on the standards committee
Vox pops in Bridgend on ITV Wales News was overwhelmingly Johnson. Interviewees were very skeptical of Labour and Starmer in particular.
I may have read this all wrong and despite the scandals and the desperate economic situation, Johnson might pull another five years off against the run of play.
Madness!
Vox pops do not a properly conducted survey make. They probably went out on the streets looking for interviewees in the middle of the day, and found an assortment of confused elderly people and dangerous imbeciles wandering about, who are amongst Johnson's few remaining supporters. How quickly we forget that, by the time he was thrown out, his ratings weren't very much better than Truss's.
For any Tory leader to win the next election, they are going to need to claw back the vast bulk of the huge flow of voters whose predilections have now swung directly from Conservative to Labour - and we've not even had most of the pain from the latest economic shockwave yet. The mortgage interest rate rises feeding through, the tax rises, the spending cuts, the collapsing public services. Basically, unless, in a shock plot twist, Keir Starmer is revealed quite literally to be Satan, the Tories are headed for opposition. The only question is how serious their defeat will be.
I suspect in that scenario many voters would consider Satan the lesser of two evils
Vox pops in Bridgend on ITV Wales News was overwhelmingly Johnson. Interviewees were very skeptical of Labour and Starmer in particular.
I may have read this all wrong and despite the scandals and the desperate economic situation, Johnson might pull another five years off against the run of play.
Madness!
Vox pops do not a properly conducted survey make. They probably went out on the streets looking for interviewees in the middle of the day, and found an assortment of confused elderly people and dangerous imbeciles wandering about, who are amongst Johnson's few remaining supporters. How quickly we forget that, by the time he was thrown out, his ratings weren't very much better than Truss's.
For any Tory leader to win the next election, they are going to need to claw back the vast bulk of the huge flow of voters whose predilections have now swung directly from Conservative to Labour - and we've not even had most of the pain from the latest economic shockwave yet. The mortgage interest rate rises feeding through, the tax rises, the spending cuts, the collapsing public services. Basically, unless, in a shock plot twist, Keir Starmer is revealed quite literally to be Satan, the Tories are headed for opposition. The only question is how serious their defeat will be.
I suspect in that scenario many voters would consider Satan the lesser of two evils
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
Crazy thought - Boris as party chairman?
I think “Ukraine Supremo” works better from him because it can be unpaid and outside of Gvt, allowing him to still make cash from speaking.
If you wanted him in the tent more firmly (and he wanted to be in it as anything other than PM) I think you’d made him “Deputy PM and Minister for Ukraine with a coordinating role”. That way he gets to pretend some parity with Rishi.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
Crazy thought - Boris as party chairman?
I doubt he wants/would take any party/government job, with the possible exception of FS.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
Crazy thought - Boris as party chairman?
I think “Ukraine Supremo” works better from him because it can be unpaid and outside of Gvt, allowing him to still make cash from speaking.
If you wanted him in the tent more firmly (and he wanted to be in it as anything other than PM) I think you’d made him “Deputy PM and Minister for Ukraine with a coordinating role”. That way he gets to pretend some parity with Rishi.
Chairman keeps his contact with the members/activists. Potential for damage is quite limited.
It does look like most of the MPs are going to put Rishi as far ahead as they can. Penny’s poor showing is disappointing, but she’ll throw her support behind Rishi on Monday morning and get a top job out of it.
It doesn't matter how far ahead Sunak is unless Johnson fails to get 100.
I’m not convinced this is a shoe in for Johnson if he makes the final two .
I think the fact he’s still under investigation could be a big factor .
It’s Sunak, trust me. Brady and co knew that when they announced the vote; the Cabinet knew that when they met at the Carlton Club. Johnson may not make the hundred, and if he does there will be the most intense pressure for him to withdraw and play ball.
It’s obvious Sunak will top the MPs poll by miles. The Tories - as has everyone else - understand that Truss’s problem was not being the MPs’ choice. They won’t make that mistake again. All Brady’s comments about the member stage were carefully worded, hedged to indicate it may or may not happen, and they are relaxed about the logistics and practical problems because it’s not going to happen.
Sunak will be PM Monday evening.
What do you make of Paul Staines's "info" that declared (to him) support for the contenders among "whips, party board members, Tory vice chairs and 1922 chairmen who have to remain publicly neutral" is currently running at
18 Johnson 6 Sunak 4 Mordaunt ?
The entire group of the "must remain publicly neutral" can't number many more than 28 surely?
The split of the group seems unduly skewed compared with the generality of other Tory MPs, and if their jobs require neutrality then telling Guido who they are backing seems a peculiar thing to do. And they’ve all declared already, while so many other MPs are still taking soundings? Plus we know Guido ramps for Johnson. So I am sceptical. He can’t be contradicted, after all?
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
It does look like most of the MPs are going to put Rishi as far ahead as they can. Penny’s poor showing is disappointing, but she’ll throw her support behind Rishi on Monday morning and get a top job out of it.
It doesn't matter how far ahead Sunak is unless Johnson fails to get 100.
I’m not convinced this is a shoe in for Johnson if he makes the final two .
I think the fact he’s still under investigation could be a big factor .
It’s Sunak, trust me. Brady and co knew that when they announced the vote; the Cabinet knew that when they met at the Carlton Club. Johnson may not make the hundred, and if he does there will be the most intense pressure for him to withdraw and play ball.
It’s obvious Sunak will top the MPs poll by miles. The Tories - as has everyone else - understand that Truss’s problem was not being the MPs’ choice. They won’t make that mistake again. All Brady’s comments about the member stage were carefully worded, hedged to indicate it may or may not happen, and they are relaxed about the logistics and practical problems because it’s not going to happen.
Sunak will be PM Monday evening.
What do you make of Paul Staines's "info" that declared (to him) support for the contenders among "whips, party board members, Tory vice chairs and 1922 chairmen who have to remain publicly neutral" is currently running at
18 Johnson 6 Sunak 4 Mordaunt ?
The entire group of the "must remain publicly neutral" can't number many more than 28 surely?
The split of the group seems unduly skewed compared with the generality of other Tory MPs, and if their jobs require neutrality then telling Guido who they are backing seems a peculiar thing to do. And they’ve all declared already, while so many other MPs are still taking soundings? Plus we know Guido ramps for Johnson. So I am sceptical.
And as many have said, with the exception of the 1922 roles, those job titles make them Truss loyalists and so more likely Boris supporters than not.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
I think the Boris to the Home office rumour was nonsense but wonder if Boris could take a party chairman role. I guess it depends on the standards committee
Extraordinary Ambassador to AND for Ukraine. With serious remit. That or nothing.
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
He wouldn’t. But if Boris decided not to stand then Sunak would definitely want his endorsement. Makes him PM by Monday lunchtime.
Vox pops in Bridgend on ITV Wales News was overwhelmingly Johnson. Interviewees were very skeptical of Labour and Starmer in particular.
I may have read this all wrong and despite the scandals and the desperate economic situation, Johnson might pull another five years off against the run of play.
Madness!
Vox pops do not a properly conducted survey make. They probably went out on the streets looking for interviewees in the middle of the day, and found an assortment of confused elderly people and dangerous imbeciles wandering about, who are amongst Johnson's few remaining supporters. How quickly we forget that, by the time he was thrown out, his ratings weren't very much better than Truss's.
For any Tory leader to win the next election, they are going to need to claw back the vast bulk of the huge flow of voters whose predilections have now swung directly from Conservative to Labour - and we've not even had most of the pain from the latest economic shockwave yet. The mortgage interest rate rises feeding through, the tax rises, the spending cuts, the collapsing public services. Basically, unless, in a shock plot twist, Keir Starmer is revealed quite literally to be Satan, the Tories are headed for opposition. The only question is how serious their defeat will be.
I suspect in that scenario many voters would consider Satan the lesser of two evils
He is at least more industrious than Johnson.
Notorious rebel against authority, the father of lies…. There’s a certain resemblance.
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
The other thing for Rishi is what do you do if you got overlooked not just once but twice? Do you go, third time's the charm, or do you go, sod this for a game of soldiers?
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Vox pops in Bridgend on ITV Wales News was overwhelmingly Johnson. Interviewees were very skeptical of Labour and Starmer in particular.
I may have read this all wrong and despite the scandals and the desperate economic situation, Johnson might pull another five years off against the run of play.
Madness!
Vox pops do not a properly conducted survey make. They probably went out on the streets looking for interviewees in the middle of the day, and found an assortment of confused elderly people and dangerous imbeciles wandering about, who are amongst Johnson's few remaining supporters. How quickly we forget that, by the time he was thrown out, his ratings weren't very much better than Truss's.
For any Tory leader to win the next election, they are going to need to claw back the vast bulk of the huge flow of voters whose predilections have now swung directly from Conservative to Labour - and we've not even had most of the pain from the latest economic shockwave yet. The mortgage interest rate rises feeding through, the tax rises, the spending cuts, the collapsing public services. Basically, unless, in a shock plot twist, Keir Starmer is revealed quite literally to be Satan, the Tories are headed for opposition. The only question is how serious their defeat will be.
I suspect in that scenario many voters would consider Satan the lesser of two evils
He is at least more industrious than Johnson.
Notorious rebel against authority, the father of lies…. There’s a certain resemblance.
Satan could presumably supply the country with cheap heating easily. I’d vote for him on that basis.
Vox pops in Bridgend on ITV Wales News was overwhelmingly Johnson. Interviewees were very skeptical of Labour and Starmer in particular.
I may have read this all wrong and despite the scandals and the desperate economic situation, Johnson might pull another five years off against the run of play.
Madness!
Vox pops do not a properly conducted survey make. They probably went out on the streets looking for interviewees in the middle of the day, and found an assortment of confused elderly people and dangerous imbeciles wandering about, who are amongst Johnson's few remaining supporters. How quickly we forget that, by the time he was thrown out, his ratings weren't very much better than Truss's.
For any Tory leader to win the next election, they are going to need to claw back the vast bulk of the huge flow of voters whose predilections have now swung directly from Conservative to Labour - and we've not even had most of the pain from the latest economic shockwave yet. The mortgage interest rate rises feeding through, the tax rises, the spending cuts, the collapsing public services. Basically, unless, in a shock plot twist, Keir Starmer is revealed quite literally to be Satan, the Tories are headed for opposition. The only question is how serious their defeat will be.
I suspect in that scenario many voters would consider Satan the lesser of two evils
He is at least more industrious than Johnson.
Notorious rebel against authority, the father of lies…. There’s a certain resemblance.
Tells people they can have whatever they want without adverse consequences?
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
Times reporting same. "Senior" figures trying to broker a deal.
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
He wouldn’t. But if Boris decided not to stand then Sunak would definitely want his endorsement. Makes him PM by Monday lunchtime.
There’s no chance of him getting that anyway given Johnson blames him for the VONC. I doubt many of Johnson’s supporters would follow a Johnson recommendation given they see Sunak as Judas .
Have Tory MPs forgotten that before he resigned Boris admitted to meeting a KGB spy, without officials present, without informing the civil service of the meeting and that he could not confirm that state matters had not been discussed?
These facts alone should stop him being a candidate.
Garth! Are you one of those Tories for whom ONE vale just ain't enough?
As you can see, am myself proud patron of TWO shanties! (But nary a pot to piss in.)
Ha. Yes, I think I was GarethoftheVale and then had log in issues so become the 2nd one.
Ironically the "Vale" was the Vale of White Horse but I haven't lived there for 8 years now. Was told changing username was a lot of work for the mods.
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
Times reporting same. "Senior" figures trying to broker a deal.
Broker what sort of deal . Johnson would only accept PM .
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
He wouldn’t. But if Boris decided not to stand then Sunak would definitely want his endorsement. Makes him PM by Monday lunchtime.
There’s no chance of him getting that anyway given Johnson blames him for the VONC. I doubt many of Johnson’s supporters would follow a Johnson recommendation given they see Sunak as Judas .
Put yourself in his place though. If you start to think Sunak might win anyway, why not pull out, endorse him, and try to take credit for it?
You were planning to spend a few more years inflating your bank balance anyway, and you’d be a shoe in to replace him if he loses in ‘24, at which point the Labour administration is likely to be quite weak and could fall quickly.
You can make Sunak’s life a bit easier with the members, for which at the very least he’ll enable you to more easily switch seats, which makes that 2024 possibility more feasible.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
Crazy thought - Boris as party chairman?
I doubt he wants/would take any party/government job, with the possible exception of FS.
Agreed. He wouldn't have enough sense to be Business Sec, ChEx, or something at the CabOff (he'd soon break something important), nobody would want him at Defence, and he wouldn't want to have his face rubbed in it at the HO, Educayshun, or as LOTH etc.
I wonder if he might win Penny over somehow. Some (not all) aspects of "war on woke" may be of little importance come election time even if they work well in the gutter press attracting eyeballs now. E.g. if he lets a refugee boat sink with heavy loss of life he'll be a hero in the Alf Garnett market even if he appeared at an LGBTQ gig the day before.
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
I would have thought in Boris mind, the great Churchillian return is too soon....the world / Tory party needs to burn for a few years first (plus he could really do with some reddies).
Sunak needs to be the Quorn commentator puppet pig of this contest, mellifluously ooking the Tory members in the eyes and going "Forget about the alternative, Patricia"
(FPT)
Sunak is a bit like a meat substitute. It portrays itself as a healthier alternative, but when you actually look at it, it's completely empty of all nutritive value.
Yes. but you believe in the nutritional value of red earth dust so your judgement is questionable
Sunak needs a big majority of MPs and buy off Bozo with a big Ukraine related role - Tsar special envoy or some such, give him something to do that he is actually passable at. Then can we please have a couple boring months of stable government with occasional Mark Francois baiting
Bozo is only interested in being PM. Nothing else will satisfy his fat ego .
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
He wouldn’t. But if Boris decided not to stand then Sunak would definitely want his endorsement. Makes him PM by Monday lunchtime.
There’s no chance of him getting that anyway given Johnson blames him for the VONC. I doubt many of Johnson’s supporters would follow a Johnson recommendation given they see Sunak as Judas .
Have Tory MPs forgotten that before he resigned Boris admitted to meeting a KGB spy, without officials present, without informing the civil service of the meeting and that he could not confirm that state matters had not been discussed?
These facts alone should stop him being a candidate.
He is a 'cult' figure in the same mould as Corbyn and both are doing or did terrible damage to their parties
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
A gross simplification, Mr Pigeon, straight out of the Conservative Central Office prompt book.
Even so, if you contrast it with the current Conservative offering of arrogance, greed, selfishness, incompetence, cronyism and corruption, the Lib Dem offering does look tempting.
Sky News reporter Mark Stone, who is on the flight with Boris Johnson back from the Dominican Republic to Gatwick, said that Johnson was booed by passengers as he boarded.
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
There’s rather more to it than that, as you would have seen during coalition, but being as we are in à FPTP system where minor parties generally have no opportunity to enact meaningful policy the Lib Dems have to scrap for every seat they can get, and hope for a more democratic system some day.
Sunak needs to be the Quorn commentator puppet pig of this contest, mellifluously ooking the Tory members in the eyes and going "Forget about the alternative, Patricia"
(FPT)
Sunak is a bit like a meat substitute. It portrays itself as a healthier alternative, but when you actually look at it, it's completely empty of all nutritive value.
Funny how vegetarians tend to live so much longer than flesheaters then. Raw soya is 36% protein. His vegetarianism is one of the things I like about Rishi Sunak. Same goes for Jeremy Corbyn.
Who do you think has the healthier diet - Rishi Sunak or Boris Johnson?
Sky News reporter Mark Stone, who is on the flight with Boris Johnson back from the Dominican Republic to Gatwick, said that Johnson was booed by passengers as he boarded.
I would have thought in Boris mind, the great Churchillian return is too soon....the world / Tory party needs to burn for a few years first (plus he could really do with some reddies).
Churchill used his time own (as Leader of the Opposition) to write his WW2 memoirs, for fun, profit AND his own historical record and reputation.
Sky News reporter Mark Stone, who is on the flight with Boris Johnson back from the Dominican Republic to Gatwick, said that Johnson was booed by passengers as he boarded.
The actual full quote isn't really that interesting. That tweet makes it sound like the whole plane stood up and booed. Instead the quote from Mark Stone is one or two, so sounds like a couple of people did.
Still reeling from Wallace's intervention. What on earth was he thinking? Can so many people truly think a return to what precipitated this crisis is a solution?
Sky News reporter Mark Stone, who is on the flight with Boris Johnson back from the Dominican Republic to Gatwick, said that Johnson was booed by passengers as he boarded.
The actual full quote isn't really that interesting. That tweet makes it sound like the whole plane stood up and booed. Instead the quote from Mark Stone is one or two, so sounds like a couple of people did.
Maybe they were just asking for some booze for the flight.
I would have thought in Boris mind, the great Churchillian return is too soon....the world / Tory party needs to burn for a few years first (plus he could really do with some reddies).
Churchill used his time own (as Leader of the Opposition) to write his WW2 memoirs, for fun, profit AND his own historical record and reputation.
I would imagine Boris is thinking more of "wilderness years" of the 30s, where he warned of the rise of Nazism, leading to the big comeback to help save the world.
I've got a feeling Boris won't run. It will be a repeat of 2016 when he'll judge that the mood of the parliamentary party isn't behind him and bow out.
Agree. And I think he’ll endorse Rishi, and be given an Ukraine role and/or pick of safe seats. He’ll hang around and generally be Boris, and be a campaigning weapon in 2024.
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
Crazy thought - Boris as party chairman?
I think “Ukraine Supremo” works better from him because it can be unpaid and outside of Gvt, allowing him to still make cash from speaking.
Sky News reporter Mark Stone, who is on the flight with Boris Johnson back from the Dominican Republic to Gatwick, said that Johnson was booed by passengers as he boarded.
Still reeling from Wallace's intervention. What on earth was he thinking? Can so many people truly think a return to what precipitated this crisis is a solution?
Well he really doesn't like Sunak (because of perceived lack of support of Ukraine)...but leaning into to idea of PM Boris, Die Harder, absolutely bonkers.
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
There’s rather more to it than that, as you would have seen during coalition, but being as we are in à FPTP system where minor parties generally have no opportunity to enact meaningful policy the Lib Dems have to scrap for every seat they can get, and hope for a more democratic system some day.
From a systems thinking point of view you can make an argument that the current system we have for apportioning power (FPTP) is suboptimal and produces the negative outcomes we all bemoan in these comment pages as the rational actors in the system play the game they find themselves in. The jolly good chaps of the post war era are gone and we are now seeing how FPTP works unchecked by moral values. So electoral reform is the prerequisite for making the first steps to systematically sort our problems. (And of course it would help smaller parties, so yes there is self interest too)
Anyway the hustings are going to be very interesting as Johnson tries to wriggle out of the privileges committee, his partygate and above all else his lies as rest assured these are coming at hi like an express train
It's worth the MPs remembering Boris only wants to be leader so they can defend him. The members dont care about that but they should.
What constitutes a nomination by a Tory MP in the leadup to choice of finalists?
When Guido puts them on his spreadsheet? Or some more formal procedure? And can members remove or change their nomination before 2pm Mon deadline?
Yes. Numbers are just based on Twitter posts/media comments etc and compiled by journalists/supporters of each candidate.
As has been pointed out many times before, this is the worlds most sophisticated and duplicitous electorate. Exercise extreme caution with regards to all reports of the numbers of supporters for any candidate.
You cannot take any nomination as guaranteed until Graham Brady’s announcement, following the vote at 2pm on Monday.
Sunak needs a big majority of MPs and buy off Bozo with a big Ukraine related role - special envoy or some such, give him something to do that he is actually passable at. Then can we please have a couple boring months of stable government with occasional Mark Francois baiting
Re: Ben Wallace & Boris, perhaps the most Wallace-friendly way to look at his endorsement, is that he is strongly signalling to Sunak that IF he get the brass ring, he MUST back UKR and not bean count on this front.
Because Wallace is gonna be Defense Secretary, regardless of who is next PM. Unless he refuses or later resigns, over the PM's commitment to UKR. Think that's the dynamic.
It really doesnt matter which party makes the next governement. They are all shit. We are heading towards borrowing so much all our grandchildren will be just about paying enough tax to pay the debt interest. The longer parties, and they are all at it continue the sham that social democracy is affordable the sooner we get to the point.
I hate the fact our grand children will be paying huge taxes and get nothing in return. Labour , Tories and lib dems should be ashamed
If Johnson decides not to stand, who would he be most likely to support?
Privately or publicly? I suspect he'd pretend to want to keep out of it publicly. Who hed support privately would depend if he could be bought off with a role from Sunak, otherwise support anyone but Sunak.
Still reeling from Wallace's intervention. What on earth was he thinking? Can so many people truly think a return to what precipitated this crisis is a solution?
Well he really doesn't like Sunak (because of perceived lack of support of Ukraine)...but leaning into to idea of PM Boris, Die Harder, absolutely bonkers.
Might it be that Wallace is simply picking the candidate who he thinks will do best by his department? Boris backed him on upping the defence budget and is quite keen on all that, Sunak is seen as being prepared to keep defence spending at its most minimal level, though he could reasonably argue he's changed his mind post-Ukraine.
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
There’s rather more to it than that, as you would have seen during coalition, but being as we are in à FPTP system where minor parties generally have no opportunity to enact meaningful policy the Lib Dems have to scrap for every seat they can get, and hope for a more democratic system some day.
From a systems thinking point of view you can make an argument that the current system we have for apportioning power (FPTP) is suboptimal and produces the negative outcomes we all bemoan in these comment pages as the rational actors in the system play the game they find themselves in. The jolly good chaps of the post war era are gone and we are now seeing how FPTP works unchecked by moral values. So electoral reform is the prerequisite for making the first steps to systematically sort our problems. (And of course it would help smaller parties, so yes there is self interest too)
No electoral system is perfect and electoral reform would not solve all out our political problems. But I'd agree it would be a good start.
Still reeling from Wallace's intervention. What on earth was he thinking? Can so many people truly think a return to what precipitated this crisis is a solution?
Well he really doesn't like Sunak (because of perceived lack of support of Ukraine)...but leaning into to idea of PM Boris, Die Harder, absolutely bonkers.
Might it be that Wallace is simply picking the candidate who he thinks will do best by his department? Boris backed him on upping the defence budget and is quite keen on all that, Sunak is seen as being prepared to keep defence spending at its most minimal level, though he could reasonably argue he's changed his mind post-Ukraine.
If I was Wallace, I would privately ask for assurance from Sunak that money would be forthcoming and that if it reneged on that he would resign and that would cause mayhem....and stay out of the Boris drama.
Still find the anonymous backer indication both unhelpful and bullshit. I know it's just a pundits list, but either he's making it up or a bunch of people who are not supposed to publicly declare are telling him and given how few they are would in effect be publicly declaring for a bunch of them.
If Johnson decides not to stand, who would he be most likely to support?
Privately or publicly? I suspect he'd pretend to want to keep out of it publicly. Who hed support privately would depend if he could be bought off with a role from Sunak, otherwise support anyone but Sunak.
Both. I assumed he would be more likely to support Mordaunt but not sure.
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
There’s rather more to it than that, as you would have seen during coalition, but being as we are in à FPTP system where minor parties generally have no opportunity to enact meaningful policy the Lib Dems have to scrap for every seat they can get, and hope for a more democratic system some day.
From a systems thinking point of view you can make an argument that the current system we have for apportioning power (FPTP) is suboptimal and produces the negative outcomes we all bemoan in these comment pages as the rational actors in the system play the game they find themselves in. The jolly good chaps of the post war era are gone and we are now seeing how FPTP works unchecked by moral values. So electoral reform is the prerequisite for making the first steps to systematically sort our problems. (And of course it would help smaller parties, so yes there is self interest too)
No electoral system is perfect and electoral reform would not solve all out our political problems. But I'd agree it would be a good start.
PR will cement centralist social democracy which will lead to bankruptcy. It will also lead to a democractic deficit when people refuse to vote because they would prefer to know what they are actually voting for rather than cast a vote and then politicians in smoky rooms decide what they voted for and then claim a mandate for it they never had. I cite the 2010 to 2015 years. I voted tory.....if I knew what the coalition would decide they had a mandate for I would have voted against
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
There’s rather more to it than that, as you would have seen during coalition, but being as we are in à FPTP system where minor parties generally have no opportunity to enact meaningful policy the Lib Dems have to scrap for every seat they can get, and hope for a more democratic system some day.
From a systems thinking point of view you can make an argument that the current system we have for apportioning power (FPTP) is suboptimal and produces the negative outcomes we all bemoan in these comment pages as the rational actors in the system play the game they find themselves in. The jolly good chaps of the post war era are gone and we are now seeing how FPTP works unchecked by moral values. So electoral reform is the prerequisite for making the first steps to systematically sort our problems. (And of course it would help smaller parties, so yes there is self interest too)
No electoral system is perfect and electoral reform would not solve all out our political problems. But I'd agree it would be a good start.
PR will cement centralist social democracy which will lead to bankruptcy. It will also lead to a democractic deficit when people refuse to vote because they would prefer to know what they are actually voting for rather than cast a vote and then politicians in smoky rooms decide what they voted for and then claim a mandate for it they never had. I cite the 2010 to 2015 years. I voted tory.....if I knew what the coalition would decide they had a mandate for I would have voted against
I voted hoping for a coalition. I had no way of indicating that as my preference sadly.
But my point wasnt the precise form the electoral reform takes, but that plenty of improvements could be made in that sphere. I'd be happy with some form of PR but there are other matters too. The Tories have not been above making changes.
Still find the anonymous backer indication both unhelpful and bullshit. I know it's just a pundits list, but either he's making it up or a bunch of people who are not supposed to publicly declare are telling him and given how few they are would in effect be publicly declaring for a bunch of them.
Whips, CCHQ, Party board
Guido redacted it further.
Guido is obviously on team Boris (Probably for commercial reasons since he'll drive more traffic across order-order) but his spreadsheet is a good resource.
Still reeling from Wallace's intervention. What on earth was he thinking? Can so many people truly think a return to what precipitated this crisis is a solution?
Well he really doesn't like Sunak (because of perceived lack of support of Ukraine)...but leaning into to idea of PM Boris, Die Harder, absolutely bonkers.
Might it be that Wallace is simply picking the candidate who he thinks will do best by his department? Boris backed him on upping the defence budget and is quite keen on all that, Sunak is seen as being prepared to keep defence spending at its most minimal level, though he could reasonably argue he's changed his mind post-Ukraine.
He should think about the country. Can we afford what he wants even at the level promised? I doubt it.
Still find the anonymous backer indication both unhelpful and bullshit. I know it's just a pundits list, but either he's making it up or a bunch of people who are not supposed to publicly declare are telling him and given how few they are would in effect be publicly declaring for a bunch of them.
Still find the anonymous backer indication both unhelpful and bullshit. I know it's just a pundits list, but either he's making it up or a bunch of people who are not supposed to publicly declare are telling him and given how few they are would in effect be publicly declaring for a bunch of them.
Whips, CCHQ, Party board
Guido redacted it further.
Yes, and telling us so many of them back Boris over Sunak is designed to impact the contest, the thing they claim they shouldn't do.
Still reeling from Wallace's intervention. What on earth was he thinking? Can so many people truly think a return to what precipitated this crisis is a solution?
Well he really doesn't like Sunak (because of perceived lack of support of Ukraine)...but leaning into to idea of PM Boris, Die Harder, absolutely bonkers.
Might it be that Wallace is simply picking the candidate who he thinks will do best by his department? Boris backed him on upping the defence budget and is quite keen on all that, Sunak is seen as being prepared to keep defence spending at its most minimal level, though he could reasonably argue he's changed his mind post-Ukraine.
He should think about the country. Can we afford what he wants even at the level promised? I doubt it.
As Pitt the Elder - and also Pitt the Younger - famously said (I think) "Can we afford not to do it?"
Kind of matches what I think about Rishi to be Frank.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
Hahahahahahahaha!
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
There’s rather more to it than that, as you would have seen during coalition, but being as we are in à FPTP system where minor parties generally have no opportunity to enact meaningful policy the Lib Dems have to scrap for every seat they can get, and hope for a more democratic system some day.
From a systems thinking point of view you can make an argument that the current system we have for apportioning power (FPTP) is suboptimal and produces the negative outcomes we all bemoan in these comment pages as the rational actors in the system play the game they find themselves in. The jolly good chaps of the post war era are gone and we are now seeing how FPTP works unchecked by moral values. So electoral reform is the prerequisite for making the first steps to systematically sort our problems. (And of course it would help smaller parties, so yes there is self interest too)
No electoral system is perfect and electoral reform would not solve all out our political problems. But I'd agree it would be a good start.
PR will cement centralist social democracy which will lead to bankruptcy. It will also lead to a democractic deficit when people refuse to vote because they would prefer to know what they are actually voting for rather than cast a vote and then politicians in smoky rooms decide what they voted for and then claim a mandate for it they never had. I cite the 2010 to 2015 years. I voted tory.....if I knew what the coalition would decide they had a mandate for I would have voted against
I voted hoping for a coalition. I had no way of indicating that as my preference sadly.
But my point wasnt the precise form the electoral reform takes, but that plenty of improvements could be made in that sphere. I'd be happy with some form of PR but there are other matters too. The Tories have not been above making changes.
If I had known it would have been a ld/con coalition and what they would choose I would have either voted differently or not bothered. Indeed I haven't voted since despite having voted in every general and local election up to that point. The coalition showed me my vote is worthless. They took it and counted as a mandate despite the fact I despised everything they did. If they had stood on what they planned to do my vote would have been for anyone but them
Comments
If you think Boris is going to win, back him at much better than even money.
It really is that simple.
18 Johnson
6 Sunak
4 Mordaunt
?
The entire group of the "must remain publicly neutral" can't number many more than 28 surely?
When/if they lose then, he’ll be back to reform the party around himself.
Could have been written for Boris.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71l85z2bXAs&list=RDMM&index=21
But that cost-of-living is cancelling out gains due to Roe v Wade repeal is clear. Question is, by how much and what's the final balance?
Note that my own ballot should be in tomorrow's mail. With two important statewide races - US Senator and WA Secretary of State - where Democrat is ahead but opponent (Republican in first, Nonpartisan in other) is closing the gap.
Again, question is, will they pass ahead when all the votes are returned and counted? My guess is that Dems retain US Senate - and SOS is too close to call.
https://twitter.com/thetimes/status/1583560721182642176
Hahahaha anyone who has tried to assist an elderly relative with IT issues is currently laughing their colon inside out.
https://twitter.com/BrianSpanner1/status/1583574131093929984
If you wanted him in the tent more firmly (and he wanted to be in it as anything other than PM) I think you’d made him “Deputy PM and Minister for Ukraine with a coordinating role”. That way he gets to pretend some parity with Rishi.
As you can see, am myself proud patron of TWO shanties! (But nary a pot to piss in.)
The DM front page wanting him to team up with Sunak is ludicrous. Why on earth would Sunak who will very likely lead after the nominations close throw away his only chance to become PM to defenestrate himself and become Bozos gimp .
In my humble AND foreign opinion.
That is almost certainly the one I'd think.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0eGRuLfesiI
Looks like cattle class....cheque for the speaking engagements must not have cleared yet.
There’s a certain resemblance.
I think I've cast my last Tory vote. If the Tories won't stand up for free markets and aspiration, hopefully Davey's party will.
These facts alone should stop him being a candidate.
Ironically the "Vale" was the Vale of White Horse but I haven't lived there for 8 years now. Was told changing username was a lot of work for the mods.
Explaining your PhD project to your family
https://twitter.com/schumacherbj/status/1583366382082985984
You were planning to spend a few more years inflating your bank balance anyway, and you’d be a shoe in to replace him if he loses in ‘24, at which point the Labour administration is likely to be quite weak and could fall quickly.
You can make Sunak’s life a bit easier with the members, for which at the very least he’ll enable you to more easily switch seats, which makes that 2024 possibility more feasible.
Everyone gets something they want.
I wonder if he might win Penny over somehow. Some (not all) aspects of "war on woke" may be of little importance come election time even if they work well in the gutter press attracting eyeballs now. E.g. if he lets a refugee boat sink with heavy loss of life he'll be a hero in the Alf Garnett market even if he appeared at an LGBTQ gig the day before.
He lied & cried but still went bust
And when he split from No. 10
All he left us was his Truss
The Lib Dem platform is basically electoral reform, electoral reform, electoral reform, nimbyism, and electoral reform. With a bit of nimbyism, and perhaps some residual Europhilia. I remain to be convinced that the writings of Milton Friedman figure particularly highly on their book club list.
Even so, if you contrast it with the current Conservative offering of arrogance, greed, selfishness, incompetence, cronyism and corruption, the Lib Dem offering does look tempting.
https://twitter.com/HarryTaylr/status/1583581325768167424
Raw soya is 36% protein.
His vegetarianism is one of the things I like about Rishi Sunak. Same goes for Jeremy Corbyn.
Who do you think has the healthier diet - Rishi Sunak or Boris Johnson?
https://twitter.com/TomTugendhat/status/1583560749955584001?s=20&t=XYqBBn4lRvPtCCMvBmNDiQ
She’s out to ~15/1
Sunak 4/6
Boris 2/1
Starmer 90/1
When Guido puts them on his spreadsheet? Or some more formal procedure? And can members remove or change their nomination before 2pm Mon deadline?
As has been pointed out many times before, this is the worlds most sophisticated and duplicitous electorate. Exercise extreme caution with regards to all reports of the numbers of supporters for any candidate.
You cannot take any nomination as guaranteed until Graham Brady’s announcement, following the vote at 2pm on Monday.
Because Wallace is gonna be Defense Secretary, regardless of who is next PM. Unless he refuses or later resigns, over the PM's commitment to UKR. Think that's the dynamic.
I hate the fact our grand children will be paying huge taxes and get nothing in return. Labour , Tories and lib dems should be ashamed
But my point wasnt the precise form the electoral reform takes, but that plenty of improvements could be made in that sphere. I'd be happy with some form of PR but there are other matters too. The Tories have not been above making changes.
Guido redacted it further.
Guido is obviously on team Boris (Probably for commercial reasons since he'll drive more traffic across order-order) but his spreadsheet is a good resource.
She was probably nailed on to make the last two so when she gets knocked out it’s not a given that she’ll endorse Johnson .
Johnson did of course sack her from the Defence brief a few years ago so I don’t think she’s his biggest fan .