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A 2023 Truss exit now a 58% chance in the betting – politicalbetting.com

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  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,152
    Jonathan said:

    A semi skilled politician would have recovered from the special budget by now. Somehow Truss contrives to keep it all going and makes it worse. It’s quite impressive.

    The ‘not me gov’ line is almost as damaging as the u turn which itself was almost as bad as the original error.

    Well they've doubled down because her and Kwasi really do believe in what they announced so as well as being incompetent and shockingly awful politicians they're probably slightly mad too.
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163

    Carnyx said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Senior Tory & Truss backer tells me '22 was worst they'd witnessed for any PM

    "There's a lot of Qs about Kwasi. MPs think he is a busted flush already. Maybe Liz'll have to make changes

    "I feel embarrassed to have sold [the PM] as a safe pair of hands. I sold them a pup"


    https://twitter.com/REWearmouth/status/1580276459154784256

    Her first public hustings session showed the real Liz Truss. The worst of the candidates offered up.

    Anybody who thinks that Liz Truss was a "safe pair of hands" should be seriously considering their career choice. Because we put the security of the nation's finances in people making that judgment call.

    Tory MPs. What a bunch of muppets.
    You have just spent a couple of years on here supporting these very "muppets".

    If they have lost the likes of you then it is an extinction level GE approaching.
    Only two years?? (Seriously, was MM UKip or LD before?)
    I seem to recall him driving Boris's people around Dorset at one point....
    Devon please.

    His wife and his dog. (Which was great for some gossip...the things that dog had to say!)
    Mark's taxis?

    image
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,502
    kle4 said:

    Charles response of “dear oh dear” is utterly hilarious. Not sure it was all that wise to release 😂😂

    https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/1580264025648431105?s=46&t=nTTewo43Z2NdbzsWySoOUw

    It's either an innocent remark it was very unwise to release at such a time for the PM due to how it could be used, or Charles is a secret genius making an uninnocent remark which he can pretend is innocent, or it is open war between PM and monarch.
    Actually I heard it as a self-deprecating "You must have a tough life to be delighted to see me".
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    At least there's something to cheer up Theuniondivvie
    So long as they don't smash up the Pool.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Nigelb said:

    Acid from Bryant.
    Liz Truss has one roll of the dice left, calling a general election to secure a mandate for her government. She likes a gamble…
    https://twitter.com/RhonddaBryant/status/1580299884057350145

    Top trolling.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,350
    Scott_xP said:
    My plan to bed Margot Robbie is more likely to pay off than.....
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Leon said:

    Russian proverb: we are born in an open green field, we die in a dark forest

    I get that sense at the moment. We are besieged by death, disease, and dire news, on all fronts. Of course part of this is the age of most PB-ers: ailing parents, dying friends, they come with middle age and old age

    And yet the world is also FUCKED. The forest closes in

    Union dissolution syndrome.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513

    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Londoners outside the Supreme Court back indyref2 over 'Westminster crooks' thenational.scot/news/23043552.…

    https://twitter.com/helen91155348/status/1580283753263661056?s=46&t=JqZDbKABYXg4uCmV-rI_Og

    A stunning intervention from The National, which will no doubt be enjoyed by its solitary remaining reader
    Quite a few PBTories and Unionists seem to subscribe to it.
    Or are triggered by mention of it.
    I was just going to ask whether you were about and well - I don't seem to have caught your posts recently.
    Among other things a good friend who has been suffering/dying from MND for the last 2 years is reaching the hinner end. My appetite for wanking on on PB is somewhat diminished.
    Horrible. Sympathies
    Thanks.
    I had to write a very difficult text this morning to him, in effect a farewell, as he has gone into a hospice where he’ll be sedated as he dies due to them withdrawing the respirator on which he’s become dependent. Grim and sad.
    I don’t know if giving that a like was appropriate, but it was an expression of sympathy. Grim indeed.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,502
    Jonathan said:

    TimS said:

    Labour need to lay down a VONC. Tomorrow. Too good an opportunity to miss.

    Win win.

    A ) General Election

    Or.

    B ) Liz secured in post.


    Can you imagine a general election with Liz Truss at the helm after losing a VONC with a 80 seat majority? 🍿 X ♾️
    Yes, I was thinking just that scenario.
  • dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    At least there's something to cheer up Theuniondivvie
    Thanks, a bit of mildly tasteless humour is just what the doctor ordered 🙂
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720

    Scott_xP said:

    Extraordinary statement from a Conservative MP who attended the 1922:

    “After tonight most Tory MPs accept that our current leader, given the decisions she took with the Fiscal Statement, can never provide the reassurance needed to arrest the loss of market confidence…


    https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1580280661944201222

    I wonder how may letters are in? It doesn't immediately matter if the 22 don't change the rules. But the 22 is a big part of the problem.

    Perhaps Conservative MPs need a new iteration of the 22?
    The way the 22 set up the contest was shambolic.. Brady needs to go, and whole process needs massive reform. I still can’t figure out how the membership looked at Truss and thought “there’s my election winner!”
    Easy. They didn't want Sunak (raised taxes, too mean to Boris) and they didn't want Mordaunt (too woke).

    The striking/scary thing is that the Eurosceptic Right landed on Truss as their standard bearer, becuase they were almost certain to get their candidate into the last round.

    Remember that Neil Kinnock speech against Militant?

    I’ll tell you what happens with impossible promises. You start with far-fetched resolutions. They are then pickled into a rigid dogma, a code, and you go through the years sticking to that, out-dated, mis-placed, irrelevant to the real needs, and you end up in the grotesque chaos of a Labour council, a Labour council, hiring taxis to scuttle round a city handing out redundancy notices to its own workers.

    The details of the grotesque chaos will be different, but the principle applies to Conservatives as well.
    Starmer should quote this at the next PMQs.

    The grotesque chaos of a Tory government, a Tory government, hiring Treasury officials to scuttle round the city handing out unfunded tax cuts to its own hedge fund managers.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    edited October 2022
    Carnyx said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    At least there's something to cheer up Theuniondivvie
    So long as they don't smash up the Pool.
    Think it was actually in Glasgow!

    This comment from half-time on BBC is quite funny:
    'Liverpool there for the taking'

    Steven Thompson

    Former Rangers striker on BBC Sportsound

    A point would be brilliant for Rangers, a fantastic result, but Liverpool are there for the taking.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Now the 10 o'clock news includes in its headlines King Charles' extraordinary "dear oh dear" remark on meeting Liz Truss. https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/1580264025648431105
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639

    Carnyx said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    At least there's something to cheer up Theuniondivvie
    So long as they don't smash up the Pool.
    Think it was actually in Glasgow!
    So it was - got slightly muddled by the inversion of the score.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    Leon said:

    Russian proverb: we are born in an open green field, we die in a dark forest

    I get that sense at the moment. We are besieged by death, disease, and dire news, on all fronts. Of course part of this is the age of most PB-ers: ailing parents, dying friends, they come with middle age and old age

    And yet the world is also FUCKED. The forest closes in

    Union dissolution syndrome.
    Imagine this. Just imagine.

    Some things have nothing whatsoever to do with Scotland’s constitutional status.

    Have I blown your mind?
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,871
    edited October 2022
    Jonathan said:

    A semi skilled politician would have recovered from the special budget by now. Somehow Truss contrives to keep it all going and makes it worse. It’s quite impressive.

    The ‘not me gov’ line is almost as damaging as the u turn which itself was almost as bad as the original error.

    A semi-skilled politician wouldn't have done the half-a-budget in the first place, they were almost certainly warned that you can't simply announce big tax cuts and say wait several weeks for the numbers.

    It is quite simply one of the biggest political own goals I can recall. I don't feel the least bit sorry for Truss and Kwarteng, this is something that is their own damn fault.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,672

    Leon said:

    Russian proverb: we are born in an open green field, we die in a dark forest

    I get that sense at the moment. We are besieged by death, disease, and dire news, on all fronts. Of course part of this is the age of most PB-ers: ailing parents, dying friends, they come with middle age and old age

    And yet the world is also FUCKED. The forest closes in

    Union dissolution syndrome.
    The weird thing is, I had another excellent night tonight. Out in Soho with a funny old friend. It was absolutely FULL of people. On a mild Wednesday in October it was like a hot Saturday in June. Remarkable. I am not sure I have ever seen it so busy on a normal weeknight

    Part of this must be the Frieze Art Fair. Which attracts tens of thousands of rich people from around the world, and they are all arty boho types who will flock to Soho, but also London simply feels festive. And opulent. Today was the first time I checked the new revamped area around Denmark St and the north end of Charing X Road. It used to be a pretty sketchy and grimy khazi, now it gleams with huge TV screens and new theatres and glass walls and money

    And there are multiple places like this in London (cf Soho House in the Strand which I mentioned last night)

    The disconnect between the mouthfeel of actual life and the news menu of despair grows ever wider, as does the disconnect between London and much of the rest of the UK. So much for levelling up
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,854
    Nigelb said:

    Acid from Bryant.
    Liz Truss has one roll of the dice left, calling a general election to secure a mandate for her government. She likes a gamble…
    https://twitter.com/RhonddaBryant/status/1580299884057350145

    That's not a gamble, that's self destruction.

    I get politicians are confident and can also be pig headed, but I cannot believe Truss thinks going for a GE right now is anything but the worst thing she could try.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    “We’re either dead or a joke” says another Conservative MP, on the prospect of either keeping Liz Truss as PM or removing her just a month after the last leadership contest.

    “So bleak”.


    https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1580303602257534976
  • I was thinking that the Conservatives might do best in the longer term if they instigated PR and went to the country. I know it sounds desperate but they really are stuffed.

    It's possible that the voters determined to put the Tories out of power (75%+) may vote instead for what they believe because the chance of continuity conservative deconstruction of the economy would be tiny.

    PR might shortcut the tactical voted parliament where the Conservatives don't exist and avoid the possibility of everyone deciding to move on without them.

    I'm not a Conservative but I do think we should have a plethora of views in Parliament. I'm offering this idea for the good of democracy knowing that they would not do the same for me. (The high ground has a nice view.)

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"
  • glwglw Posts: 9,871

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,854
    edited October 2022
    Nigelb said:

    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"

    Odious is too generous a word.

    But the people who made him and fund him are almost worse. He's a horrible grifter, they choose to back him.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Tory MP to @KevinASchofield after grim 1922 Committee meeting: "The mood was a bit like ’what’s going to happen next to bring this to a conclusion?'”

    Bin Lizzy?

    https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/liz-truss-1922-committee-showdown_uk_63470b22e4b0b7f89f52758c
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    But would they?
    Because they'd have a huge amount of cash to strengthen their squad before their first season.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,152
    Nigelb said:

    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"

    If someone refuses to pay to court awarded damages in a civil claim could that become a criminal matter (contempt of court) and result in a prison sentence?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,854
    dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    Jonathan said:

    A semi skilled politician would have recovered from the special budget by now. Somehow Truss contrives to keep it all going and makes it worse. It’s quite impressive.

    The ‘not me gov’ line is almost as damaging as the u turn which itself was almost as bad as the original error.

    A semi-skilled politician wouldn't have done the half-a-budget in the first place, they were almost certainly warned that you can't simply announce big tax cuts and say wait several weeks for the numbers.

    It is quite simply one of the biggest politcal own goals I can recall. I don't feel the least bit sorry for Truss and Kwarteng, this is something that is their own damn fault.
    This is the bit I don't get. There was no need to do it at all. Just announce the energy support.
    And a Budget as usual in the Spring.
    They really thought it would be popular with everyone, wanted to make a mark immediately, and couldn't wait.

    Well, she got to make an impression like she wanted at least.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Volcanic night in the Conservative party

    A senior Tory MP who attended 1922 said the PM "should never be trusted" with a financial statement again

    "It's a bit like asking the gas engineer who has just blown up your house to come back and have another go"
    https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/liz-truss-in-battle-to-save-leadership-amid-tory-backbench-fury
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    edited October 2022
    TimS said:

    Third time in my adult life I’ve felt that great, irresistible and irreversible sea change in voter sentiment. Once in 1992, after black Wednesday. Again in 2009, albeit more weakly, after the financial crisis. And now in 2022.

    This is the true meaning of democracy. You get the sense the public have just sat down and decided it’s time for a change. Time to give the other lot a go. There’s no going back now. Just as in the mid 1990s it’s a weight off the shoulders.

    Imagine living in an autocratic regime where that experience is denied you and politics is just frustration and resignation.

    Labour has two years to spin the narrative.
    No rebuttal will be given the time of day. See the it's the BofE's fault. It's a global problem. Etc.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720
    kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Acid from Bryant.
    Liz Truss has one roll of the dice left, calling a general election to secure a mandate for her government. She likes a gamble…
    https://twitter.com/RhonddaBryant/status/1580299884057350145

    That's not a gamble, that's self destruction.

    I get politicians are confident and can also be pig headed, but I cannot believe Truss thinks going for a GE right now is anything but the worst thing she could try.
    I would worry a bit if she called a GE. Because that somehow makes Putin pressing the nuclear button more credible. It would show that deluded, wilful self destruction is a thing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,854

    kle4 said:

    Charles response of “dear oh dear” is utterly hilarious. Not sure it was all that wise to release 😂😂

    https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/1580264025648431105?s=46&t=nTTewo43Z2NdbzsWySoOUw

    It's either an innocent remark it was very unwise to release at such a time for the PM due to how it could be used, or Charles is a secret genius making an uninnocent remark which he can pretend is innocent, or it is open war between PM and monarch.
    Actually I heard it as a self-deprecating "You must have a tough life to be delighted to see me".
    Which is why I go for explanation 1, it was an innocent remark. But it is very funny in the circumstances.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317
    kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Acid from Bryant.
    Liz Truss has one roll of the dice left, calling a general election to secure a mandate for her government. She likes a gamble…
    https://twitter.com/RhonddaBryant/status/1580299884057350145

    That's not a gamble, that's self destruction.

    I get politicians are confident and can also be pig headed, but I cannot believe Truss thinks going for a GE right now is anything but the worst thing she could try.
    Calling and (probably) losing a general election is the only dignified exit for Truss from her current predicament.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    dixiedean said:

    Labour has two years to spin the narrative.

    No, they have about 2 weeks
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,874
    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,555
    What is the Tories off ramp? Perhaps Elon can pen a way out.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,424
    A
    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    Nonsense. Celtic park is bigger than all but three premier league grounds, a better atmosphere than all except Liverpool, and the premiership is the best supported league in Europe (per capita).

    Rangers beat Dortmund last season.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,672
    TimS said:

    Third time in my adult life I’ve felt that great, irresistible and irreversible sea change in voter sentiment. Once in 1992, after black Wednesday. Again in 2009, albeit more weakly, after the financial crisis. And now in 2022.

    This is the true meaning of democracy. You get the sense the public have just sat down and decided it’s time for a change. Time to give the other lot a go. There’s no going back now. Just as in the mid 1990s it’s a weight off the shoulders.

    Imagine living in an autocratic regime where that experience is denied you and politics is just frustration and resignation.

    Many of us felt like that, being in the EU. "We can never get rid of them, they just go on and on. We don't even have a vote"

    Hence, Brexit

    Do you begin to understand it, yet?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    edited October 2022
    kle4 said:

    dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    Jonathan said:

    A semi skilled politician would have recovered from the special budget by now. Somehow Truss contrives to keep it all going and makes it worse. It’s quite impressive.

    The ‘not me gov’ line is almost as damaging as the u turn which itself was almost as bad as the original error.

    A semi-skilled politician wouldn't have done the half-a-budget in the first place, they were almost certainly warned that you can't simply announce big tax cuts and say wait several weeks for the numbers.

    It is quite simply one of the biggest politcal own goals I can recall. I don't feel the least bit sorry for Truss and Kwarteng, this is something that is their own damn fault.
    This is the bit I don't get. There was no need to do it at all. Just announce the energy support.
    And a Budget as usual in the Spring.
    They really thought it would be popular with everyone, wanted to make a mark immediately, and couldn't wait.

    Well, she got to make an impression like she wanted at least.
    That's the Occam's razor explanation sadly.
    Must be a huge psychological blow to find that what you've really always wanted to do isn't supported. Even by those who benefit the most.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,476
    GIN1138 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"

    If someone refuses to pay to court awarded damages in a civil claim could that become a criminal matter (contempt of court) and result in a prison sentence?
    He claims to be nearly bankrupt. I suspect he will never pay.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,152
    TimS said:

    Third time in my adult life I’ve felt that great, irresistible and irreversible sea change in voter sentiment. Once in 1992, after black Wednesday. Again in 2009, albeit more weakly, after the financial crisis. And now in 2022.

    This is the true meaning of democracy. You get the sense the public have just sat down and decided it’s time for a change. Time to give the other lot a go. There’s no going back now. Just as in the mid 1990s it’s a weight off the shoulders.

    Imagine living in an autocratic regime where that experience is denied you and politics is just frustration and resignation.

    Labour will win the next election there's no doubt about that. Like you say the public have made up their minds.

    For Con now it's all about how bad the defeat will be and mitigating the losses as much as possible. Obviously going into a general election with someone that can't even string two coherent sentences together is an interesting plan..
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,874
    dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    Jonathan said:

    A semi skilled politician would have recovered from the special budget by now. Somehow Truss contrives to keep it all going and makes it worse. It’s quite impressive.

    The ‘not me gov’ line is almost as damaging as the u turn which itself was almost as bad as the original error.

    A semi-skilled politician wouldn't have done the half-a-budget in the first place, they were almost certainly warned that you can't simply announce big tax cuts and say wait several weeks for the numbers.

    It is quite simply one of the biggest politcal own goals I can recall. I don't feel the least bit sorry for Truss and Kwarteng, this is something that is their own damn fault.
    This is the bit I don't get. There was no need to do it at all. Just announce the energy support.
    And a Budget as usual in the Spring.
    That’s what happens when dogma overrides common sense.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,570

    Scott_xP said:

    Extraordinary statement from a Conservative MP who attended the 1922:

    “After tonight most Tory MPs accept that our current leader, given the decisions she took with the Fiscal Statement, can never provide the reassurance needed to arrest the loss of market confidence…


    https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1580280661944201222

    I wonder how may letters are in? It doesn't immediately matter if the 22 don't change the rules. But the 22 is a big part of the problem.

    Perhaps Conservative MPs need a new iteration of the 22?
    The way the 22 set up the contest was shambolic.. Brady needs to go, and whole process needs massive reform. I still can’t figure out how the membership looked at Truss and thought “there’s my election winner!”
    I think they believed that they win elections come rain or shine and that, however tough things looked in the opinion polls, swingback and boundary commissions and the God given Tory right to rule would see them through. And then they voted for the loudest dog whistle in the contest.

    I can't think of any other reason for it?
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,424
    Scott_xP said:

    Tory MP to @KevinASchofield after grim 1922 Committee meeting: "The mood was a bit like ’what’s going to happen next to bring this to a conclusion?'”

    Bin Lizzy?

    https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/liz-truss-1922-committee-showdown_uk_63470b22e4b0b7f89f52758c

    Thought experiment: Starmer calls vote of no confidence next week
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    .
    GIN1138 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"

    If someone refuses to pay to court awarded damages in a civil claim could that become a criminal matter (contempt of court) and result in a prison sentence?
    There’s a lot of talk of his sequestering his assets in places where they won’t be subject to the judgment against him.
    Whether the shell game works, who knows ?

    There’s also the offence of criminal bankruptcy.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Leon said:

    "We can never get rid of them, they just go on and on. We don't even have a vote"

    Dan Fucking Hannan.

    Before Brexit, we could vote him out.

    Now, we are stuck with him forever
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    But would they?
    Because they'd have a huge amount of cash to strengthen their squad before their first season.
    I think with the massive extra TV cash they'd probably find a level somewhere in the PL.

    But I don't think it's the worst thing for them to find that, right now anyway, there are plenty bigger, better, richer football teams out there quite happy to hand them out a humping on a reasonably regular basis, given that that's what the rest of Scottish football has had to take from them for a long long time.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Eabhal said:

    Thought experiment: Starmer calls vote of no confidence next week

    Truss wins it, and is gone within weeks
  • dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    But would they?
    Because they'd have a huge amount of cash to strengthen their squad before their first season.
    I believe they’d also earn considerably more in the Championship than they do now. But as everyone knows the superiority of the PL has nothing to do with money.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,871
    dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    But would they?
    Because they'd have a huge amount of cash to strengthen their squad before their first season.
    It takes years of investment to build a squad. The top Championship teams keep going up and down despite throwing money at recruitment. Sure in the long run you'd expect the Glasgow clubs to reach that level, but one season's money is a drop in the bucket.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,424
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Third time in my adult life I’ve felt that great, irresistible and irreversible sea change in voter sentiment. Once in 1992, after black Wednesday. Again in 2009, albeit more weakly, after the financial crisis. And now in 2022.

    This is the true meaning of democracy. You get the sense the public have just sat down and decided it’s time for a change. Time to give the other lot a go. There’s no going back now. Just as in the mid 1990s it’s a weight off the shoulders.

    Imagine living in an autocratic regime where that experience is denied you and politics is just frustration and resignation.

    Many of us felt like that, being in the EU. "We can never get rid of them, they just go on and on. We don't even have a vote"

    Hence, Brexit

    Do you begin to understand it, yet?
    FFS, we did have a vote, the only thing stopping us having one was our own politicians. I actually grudgingly admire Cameron for having the balls to go for it.

    Quite distinct from Indyref2, where it is being prevented by an outside force.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    This is genius


  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Scott_xP said:

    Eabhal said:

    Thought experiment: Starmer calls vote of no confidence next week

    Truss wins it, and is gone within weeks
    Seems the most likely outcome.

    She wont make xmas. But she will win a VONC next week.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,424
    Foxy said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"

    If someone refuses to pay to court awarded damages in a civil claim could that become a criminal matter (contempt of court) and result in a prison sentence?
    He claims to be nearly bankrupt. I suspect he will never pay.
    Apparently he made $800,000 in just one day. Surely the courts (Marshals?) can hunt that down?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,672

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    ...
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,555
    I’m not even sure a Labour VONC can save Liz now. Labour will have to conjure up something special to hang onto this asset.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    Foxy said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"

    If someone refuses to pay to court awarded damages in a civil claim could that become a criminal matter (contempt of court) and result in a prison sentence?
    He claims to be nearly bankrupt. I suspect he will never pay.
    He should be rotting in a prison cell hopefully beaten to a pulp on a nightly basis ! What he did to those grieving families was disgusting, utterly inhumane .

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,158
    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Tory papers have retreated into safe territory of the Royals and coronation to avoid discussing the obvious.

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,854
    edited October 2022
    Scott_xP said:

    Leon said:

    "We can never get rid of them, they just go on and on. We don't even have a vote"

    Dan Fucking Hannan.

    Before Brexit, we could vote him out.

    Now, we are stuck with him forever
    Brexit didn't invent peerages. There was a good chance he'd have got one anyway. I get the gag, but it's a poor example.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,476
    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
    I think quite likely to be relegated at some point. There needs to be a plan for that.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    Jonathan said:

    I’m not even sure a Labour VONC can save Liz now. Labour will have to conjure up something special to hang onto this asset.

    They could always call a VONC and vote against.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    kle4 said:

    Brexit didn't invent peerages. There was a good chance he'd have got one anyway. I get the gag, but it's a poor example.

    Without Brexit he would still be an MEP, and no Tory PM would have a reason to give him one
  • Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    Potentially, if Gove is seen as kingmaker, and if he doesn’t try to make himself King!

    Depends if Sunak tries, and if not, where his many MP supporters go

    I’m trying to re-run a leadership race with Gove instead of Sunak and see who has ‘the Big Mo’

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    ...
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,158
    O/T
    My next blood donation is scheduled for Monday 24th. Better not miss it given the shortage of donors at the moment.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,672
    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    But would they?
    Because they'd have a huge amount of cash to strengthen their squad before their first season.
    It takes years of investment to build a squad. The top Championship teams keep going up and down despite throwing money at recruitment. Sure in the long run you'd expect the Glasgow clubs to reach that level, but one season's money is a drop in the bucket.
    Rangers and Celtic are both "bigger" clubs than Man City in terms of tradition and support. The only thing thwarting them is the stupid tiny Scottish league

    Let them into the EPL and they would be bought by a trillionaire within weeks
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,570
    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
    Best match I've ever been at was Celtic v. Barca, ten years ago last week. 2 - 1. Both sets of fans were amazing.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Friday is the next market meltdown, so Monday would be good for a VONC
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,476
    nico679 said:

    Foxy said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Top bloke Alex Jones.

    https://twitter.com/BrandyZadrozny/status/1580285490334310401
    As the jury reads the damages and the Sandy Hook parents weep, Alex Jones is on his broadcast, laughing and assuring his audience that he won't actually be paying any of this money.

    "Do these people actually think they're getting any of this money?"

    If someone refuses to pay to court awarded damages in a civil claim could that become a criminal matter (contempt of court) and result in a prison sentence?
    He claims to be nearly bankrupt. I suspect he will never pay.
    He should be rotting in a prison cell hopefully beaten to a pulp on a nightly basis ! What he did to those grieving families was disgusting, utterly inhumane .

    I have no sympathy, and hope that he is skint forever. US bankruptcy laws do seem more lenient than ours though.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    From her demeanour I sense Truss has constructed her own world - kind of parallel to this one - and is living contentedly in that.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,152
    edited October 2022
    Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    If it went to the membership again (Kemi Vs Rishi for example) then possibly yes, but if it's a coronation among MPs then probably no (as they will rally around someone more senior like Rishi or Penny IMO)
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    6m
    I mean, look at this. Who in Government says "I know. Let's try and trash the OBR. That'll reassure the markets".

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1580308053932449793
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,424
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
    I think quite likely to be relegated at some point. There needs to be a plan for that.
    The premiership is just the Scottish championship. Would be roughly the same quality.

    Ross County making a surprise push for the premier league title after being bought by the Trump family...
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,570
    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    But would they?
    Because they'd have a huge amount of cash to strengthen their squad before their first season.
    It takes years of investment to build a squad. The top Championship teams keep going up and down despite throwing money at recruitment. Sure in the long run you'd expect the Glasgow clubs to reach that level, but one season's money is a drop in the bucket.
    Rangers and Celtic are both "bigger" clubs than Man City in terms of tradition and support. The only thing thwarting them is the stupid tiny Scottish league

    Let them into the EPL and they would be bought by a trillionaire within weeks
    They would lose the guaranteed European football though.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    kinabalu said:

    From her demeanour I sense Truss has constructed her own world - kind of parallel to this one - and is living contentedly in that.

    What is it doing to her family though?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,158
    GIN1138 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    If it went to the membership again (Kemi Vs Rishi for example) then possibly yes, but if it's a coronation among MPs then probably no (as they will rally around someone more senior like Rishi or Penny IMO)
    If it's a coronation I hope members rip up their membership cards. Someone else can deliver the leaflets.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,476
    GIN1138 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    If it went to the membership again (Kemi Vs Rishi for example) then possibly yes, but if it's a coronation among MPs then probably no (as they will rally around someone more senior like Rishi or Penny IMO)
    I think the membership is suitably chastened and would pick someone electable, but I could be wrong.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,158

    I was thinking that the Conservatives might do best in the longer term if they instigated PR and went to the country. I know it sounds desperate but they really are stuffed.

    It's possible that the voters determined to put the Tories out of power (75%+) may vote instead for what they believe because the chance of continuity conservative deconstruction of the economy would be tiny.

    PR might shortcut the tactical voted parliament where the Conservatives don't exist and avoid the possibility of everyone deciding to move on without them.

    I'm not a Conservative but I do think we should have a plethora of views in Parliament. I'm offering this idea for the good of democracy knowing that they would not do the same for me. (The high ground has a nice view.)

    Also with PR ReformUK would probably get 5% of seats, possibly more.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,555
    Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    Potentially good choice for opposition. Not a safe pair of hands to stabilise government.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Foxy said:

    I think the membership is suitably chastened and would pick someone electable, but I could be wrong.

    I wish MPs would just accept that members wanted to Truss. We don’t want another GE, we don’t want another leadership election - we just want you to get on with the job
    https://twitter.com/Liv_Lever/status/1580267296861585409
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Tory MPs with huge majorities today saying they think they’ll lose their seat. They’re getting restless and impatient - more despair with every poll. Some have adopted a f**k it attitude and are sharing unfiltered thoughts cause they think nothing to lose
    https://twitter.com/hoffman_noa/status/1580310611061542913
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,672
    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
    I think quite likely to be relegated at some point. There needs to be a plan for that.
    AIUI the only thing stopping the merging of the English and Scottish leagues is the fear that FIFA would then say: Well there must be a British national football team, not four different teams

    The EPL should leverage its notable power to stop a club Super League (a concept which is hated by FIFA and UEFA) and say: the price for us maintaining that opposition is: we need to merge English and Scottish club football, but we get to keep England/Scotland as separate FIFA sides

    UK football is already uniquely constituted within football, anyway, so this would be just another quirk

    It would mean a lot of Scottish clubs would go to very low British "divisions", but on the whole Scottish football would benefit tremendously. Esp Rangers and Celtic
  • Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
    I think quite likely to be relegated at some point. There needs to be a plan for that.
    Welsh clubs have played in the EPL and have been relegated before.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,854

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    6m
    I mean, look at this. Who in Government says "I know. Let's try and trash the OBR. That'll reassure the markets".

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1580308053932449793

    Economic forecasters do often seem pretty bad at it. But government is worse.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,080
    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Londoners outside the Supreme Court back indyref2 over 'Westminster crooks' thenational.scot/news/23043552.…

    https://twitter.com/helen91155348/status/1580283753263661056?s=46&t=JqZDbKABYXg4uCmV-rI_Og

    A stunning intervention from The National, which will no doubt be enjoyed by its solitary remaining reader
    Quite a few PBTories and Unionists seem to subscribe to it.
    Or are triggered by mention of it.
    The only reason it even exists is tthat the owners made the disastrous mistake of doing a Neil with the Herald and shifting it from middle of the road fairly balanced to near full-on Britnat and lost half their readers, so had to do something to try and get some of them back.
    The National doesn't officially report its circulation, perhaps because it is too low to measure. But it is rumoured to be around 6,000. Astonishingly small. It is about as widely read as The Skibbereen Eagle, and similarly self-important
    For those ignorant of the County Cork newspaper industry, Leon's joke is even more cutting than it appears. The Skibbereen Eagle folded many years ago, to be absorbed by the other Skibbereen-based newspaper, the Southern Star, which claims a weekly readership of 50,000 and the title of best-selling newspaper in County Cork.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    Scott_xP said:

    Foxy said:

    I think the membership is suitably chastened and would pick someone electable, but I could be wrong.

    I wish MPs would just accept that members wanted to Truss. We don’t want another GE, we don’t want another leadership election - we just want you to get on with the job
    https://twitter.com/Liv_Lever/status/1580267296861585409
    But. What is the "job"?
    No mandate. No consent
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,555
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
    I think quite likely to be relegated at some point. There needs to be a plan for that.
    AIUI the only thing stopping the merging of the English and Scottish leagues is the fear that FIFA would then say: Well there must be a British national football team, not four different teams

    The EPL should leverage its notable power to stop a club Super League (a concept which is hated by FIFA and UEFA) and say: the price for us maintaining that opposition is: we need to merge English and Scottish club football, but we get to keep England/Scotland as separate FIFA sides

    UK football is already uniquely constituted within football, anyway, so this would be just another quirk

    It would mean a lot of Scottish clubs would go to very low British "divisions", but on the whole Scottish football would benefit tremendously. Esp Rangers and Celtic
    Can’t see this going down at all well. Is it a Liz Truss policy?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    ...
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,152
    edited October 2022
    Jonathan said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    Potentially good choice for opposition. Not a safe pair of hands to stabilise government.
    Yeah, I think Kemi needs a few years as LOTO. Up against dreary PM SKS she'll do well (and she'll be able to quietly ditch the culture wars stuff too)

    For Kemi's POV it would probably be better for her for Liz to stick around until the election disaster and then she (Kemi) can take over... If they go for Penny lets say and she manages to keep Con losses to a minimum she'll deserve to be able to stick around as LOTO and maybe have another crack at an election in a few years.

    But on the other hand if Liz sticks around Kemi might not have much of a party left to take over lol.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,315
    Jonathan said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    Potentially good choice for opposition. Not a safe pair of hands to stabilise government.
    She doesn't have a radical fiscal agenda, so there's no reason she wouldn't be a suitable candidate if they're looking beyond the ex-PMs of Johnson and May.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,854
    Scott_xP said:

    ...

    'Advisers say unfunded cuts no longer credible'

    Other advisers say why the heck would you think unfunded cuts were ever credible?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,158
    edited October 2022
    The political situation is astonishing when you consider the current composition of the House of Commons, with Labour on less than 200 seats (following the suspensions of people like the MP for Leicester East).

    Con 356
    Lab 198

    https://members.parliament.uk/parties/Commons
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,475

    Anyway, in other news, my wife and i have been safely delivered of a son: 7lb 13oz. Very pleased to now have one of each, son and daughter.

    She was safely discharged from hospital this afternoon. Both mum and baby tired but doing well and pleased to be back home.

    Congratulations sir
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965
    Scott_xP said:

    kle4 said:

    Brexit didn't invent peerages. There was a good chance he'd have got one anyway. I get the gag, but it's a poor example.

    Without Brexit he would still be an MEP, and no Tory PM would have a reason to give him one
    Martin Callanan got voted out in a Euro election. Then got a seat in the Lords. Indeed, he popped up on TV this morning.

    Nowt to do with Brexit.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,476

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    dixiedean said:

    Seven one.

    The Old Firm in the Champions League are finding out what it's like generally to be a non-Old Firm team in the Scottish Premiership.
    People sometimes opine that Rangers and Celtic would be good additions to the Premier League, in reality they'd almost certainly end up in the Championship within a season or two.
    They would earn significantly more in the Championship, and even in League 2, than the pittance the SFA and SPFL have negotiated for Scottish football. With crowds of around 50,000 each week, they would probably be relegated to the Championship, but would soon return to the Premiership, where they would eventually settle as mid table teams. Scottish football would be more competitive and better without them.
    I'd love Celtic and Rangers in the EPL (we can call it the BPL)

    They have amazing passionate fans (OK they can get a bit punchy, but so can the English). Their support is fervent and their singing is brilliant. They have all the necessary traditions and big epic grounds. I am pretty sure that after a few years of EPL money they would be competing at the top, adding to the list of six or seven possible winners, and broadening the appeal of the league even more. One or both would be bought by some billionaire

    It is a damn shame it cannot happen, as things stands
    I think quite likely to be relegated at some point. There needs to be a plan for that.
    Welsh clubs have played in the EPL and have been relegated before.
    Exactly so. Celtic would have to be willing to play a wet Tuesday in Stoke.

    Personally, I would like to see Celtic and Rangers remain in the Scottish League. English clubs can play them in the European cups from time to time.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,247
    Foxy said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Does Kemi Badenoch have a path to the leadership if Truss goes?

    If it went to the membership again (Kemi Vs Rishi for example) then possibly yes, but if it's a coronation among MPs then probably no (as they will rally around someone more senior like Rishi or Penny IMO)
    I think the membership is suitably chastened and would pick someone electable, but I could be wrong.
    The Tories have been in power for 12 years, the membership want more rightwing policies to show for it. They would likely prefer a more rightwing agenda in opposition than a move back to the centre which still likely leads to defeat anyway even if saving a few seats
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