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Punters give her a 41% chance of being PM after next election – politicalbetting.com

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  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,952
    IanB2 said:

    biggles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Good speech and interesting that she referenced building and spades in the ground so much. Perhaps she's planning some genuine free market reforms on planning.

    Tbh I was wondering if the Prime Minister accidentally skipped a section there. It made no sense.
    The Prime Minister said, "We'll get spades in the ground to make sure people are not facing unaffordable energy bills."

    It makes no sense; she must have lost her place in the script and missed a sentence.
    Metaphor surely? No planning and talking, immediate action
    No, it's incoherent even as a metaphor.
    Going with "Brexit is like having a baby" would have made more sense.
    Because you’ll be paying for it the rest of your life?
    Brexit is very much like making love to a beautiful woman…

    Just no.
    I think biggles means it’s his fantasy.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208

    Who is education and who is transport?

    A delay as Truss is speaking to Biden

    https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1567245198102503425?s=20&t=B6_BE91KBQbwYmIL20hi6w
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,108

    GIN1138 said:

    HYUFD said:
    Who and what?
    The new Tory Party Chairman.

    Jake's a top bloke, follows me on Twitter, he has excellent judgment.
    He is a complete wanker, he pretends to live in a Red Wall constituency and speak for the North while maintaining multiple homes and a property empire on Ynys Mon.

    He'll be the first one out, Paterson-style
    According to Wikipedia he loves in Rossendale. Which isn't really red wall.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 5,931
    edited September 2022

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    Pretty standard fare , some vacuous nonsense that new PMs always say and also a few fluffed lines from Truss . Thankfully she didn’t channel her inner Thatcher and we didn’t hear , where there is discord ...

    However the speech was the highlight , it’s been all downhill ever since with some cabinet picks that wouldn’t look out of place if it was April fools day !
  • Sky News are dumb as a box of rocks.

    We need more Latin lessons in our schools.


    The grammar is bad but the point is an important one. Anyone who didn't realise that this was what Brexit was about is a moron.
    (Interestingly, the person I heard pointing this out most forcefully, spitting with rage about a project to dismantle the welfare state being sold as all about getting more money for the NHS, was a former Tory PM, John Major. It sure as hell isn't his party anymore).
    The IEA mob think the UK need to be more like America.

    Living as I now do in New York, I would argue that would be a big mistake.

    The problem the IEA crew have is this.

    There is no way they can get a mandate for their vision of the UK though at a General Election. I suspect that would have been the case even in 2019. (Actually, Jez vs JRM... what would have happened? Very rapid realignment, I hope.)

    But without a General Election mandate, they are going to really struggle to make it happen. Anything needing laws is going to get stuck in the Lords.

    We're going to get two years of idealogues pressing buttons and shouting, aren't we?

    If we're lucky.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,215
    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Coverage of immigration is insanely poor

    “Suella Braverman: home secretary set to take even harder line on migration”

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/sep/06/suella-braverman-home-secretary-set-to-take-even-harder-line-on-migration?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    “Even harder line”.

    From that you’d believe we are basically North Korea. Admitting no one. But in fact the UK handed out 1 MILLION visas last year and we have one of the most liberal migration regimes on earth. Plus the boat people

    It’s farcical

    You must be delighted that wishy-washy namby-pamby cancel culture loving pro-migrant snowflake Priti Patel is gone.

    Yet another liberal Home Secretary removed - perhaps we'll get a proper Conservative Home Secretary this time - to be fair, if you want a hard-line Home Secretary, wait for a Labour Government.
    It will be interesting to see if she really is 'Priti on Steroids'. Patel had the advantage of having actually done some work running government departments. Braverman has done a bit of work in a Brexit department, but then went on to be Attorney General, where her main role was to put up a respectable legal facade for dodgy political antics, and where she embarrassed herself and destroyed her reputation as a lawyer.
    I would expect it to be the usual scenario where she barks out a load of extreme rhetoric and then can't make anything happen because it is all gets bogged down in inpeneterable bureaucracy. But perhaps she will surprise us.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,415

    Sky News are dumb as a box of rocks.

    We need more Latin lessons in our schools.


    I like the way they even quote someone else saying 'alumni' and still go ahead with their version.

    I can only imagine it's pronounced alum-news and they're some kind of creature maybe related to wildebeest. Along the lines of the Alot
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,674
    HYUFD said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    We were inspired by her oratory
    Was it John Major or Tony Blair who started the tradition of the introductory speech when reaching No.10?

    Like all her predecessors, Truss was long on generalities and banal platitudes and short on specifics. Plenty of pointless commitments, a pep talk and hints of the "sunlit uplands" but no sense of any understanding of the real problems facing the country.

    Apart from that, she managed to deliver the speech and not fall over so kudos for that.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    nico679 said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    Pretty standard fare , some vacuous nonsense that new PMs always say and also a few fluffed lines from Truss . Thankfully she didn’t channel her inner Thatcher and we didn’t hear , where there is discord ...

    However the speech was the highlight , it’s been all downhill ever since with some cabinet picks that wouldn’t look out of place if it was April fools day !
    "Aspiration nation" was the low point. Could have been worse.
  • HYUFD said:

    Jacob Rees Mogg to lead the government response to tackling climate change

    https://twitter.com/PippaCrerar/status/1567216544412745730?s=20&t=S3vZZNxeI7KoT2rgiO48Mg

    That's genuinely funny. Even better that Truss apparentlycan't find ANYONE who wants to serve him as climate change minister. let nobody say that MPs will do anything for a Ministerial title.
    Given he doesn’t believe in climate change his junior minister would get to do anything so what’s the point?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    We were inspired by her oratory
    Was it John Major or Tony Blair who started the tradition of the introductory speech when reaching No.10?

    Like all her predecessors, Truss was long on generalities and banal platitudes and short on specifics. Plenty of pointless commitments, a pep talk and hints of the "sunlit uplands" but no sense of any understanding of the real problems facing the country.

    Apart from that, she managed to deliver the speech and not fall over so kudos for that.
    Heath and Thatcher did intro speeches outside No 10 too
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,689
    It seems to be a government of all the Kwasis.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,176
    edited September 2022

    HYUFD said:
    Is "without portfolio" code for Minister for the North?
    Jake. When. I. Were. A School. Girl. In. T'. North. Yeh. Were. Luc. ky.. If. Yeh.. Got. A Sheet. O. Pa. Per. Let. A. Lone. A. Port. Blu. Dy. Fo. Lio.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    edited September 2022
    Jacob Rees Mogg confirmed as new Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567245923255816193?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
  • IanB2 said:

    biggles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Good speech and interesting that she referenced building and spades in the ground so much. Perhaps she's planning some genuine free market reforms on planning.

    Tbh I was wondering if the Prime Minister accidentally skipped a section there. It made no sense.
    The Prime Minister said, "We'll get spades in the ground to make sure people are not facing unaffordable energy bills."

    It makes no sense; she must have lost her place in the script and missed a sentence.
    Metaphor surely? No planning and talking, immediate action
    No, it's incoherent even as a metaphor.
    Going with "Brexit is like having a baby" would have made more sense.
    Because you’ll be paying for it the rest of your life?
    Brexit is very much like making love to a beautiful woman…


    Just no.
    Some back and forth, a bit of yelling and then a faintly embarrassing mess?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,952
    HYUFD said:

    Who is education and who is transport?

    A delay as Truss is speaking to Biden

    https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1567245198102503425?s=20&t=B6_BE91KBQbwYmIL20hi6w
    Yes, neither is particularly fluent.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,635
    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    We were inspired by her oratory
    Was it John Major or Tony Blair who started the tradition of the introductory speech when reaching No.10?

    Like all her predecessors, Truss was long on generalities and banal platitudes and short on specifics. Plenty of pointless commitments, a pep talk and hints of the "sunlit uplands" but no sense of any understanding of the real problems facing the country.

    Apart from that, she managed to deliver the speech and not fall over so kudos for that.
    How could you forget Thatcher’s promise to replace discord with harmony?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    Simon Clarke is the new Secretary of State for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567247526587236356?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    HYUFD said:

    Who is education and who is transport?

    A delay as Truss is speaking to Biden

    https://twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1567245198102503425?s=20&t=B6_BE91KBQbwYmIL20hi6w
    A bit embarrassing when he asks her who her lead on climate change is...
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,465
    nico679 said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    Pretty standard fare , some vacuous nonsense that new PMs always say and also a few fluffed lines from Truss . Thankfully she didn’t channel her inner Thatcher and we didn’t hear , where there is discord ...

    However the speech was the highlight , it’s been all downhill ever since with some cabinet picks that wouldn’t look out of place if it was April fools day !
    What is noticeable, as with her first "victory" speech, is the style - Truss doesn't do drip-drip announcements. If she something to say, she assembles it for a big bang, rather than give hints along the way. We are literally little the wiser after her first two speeches, but on Thursday we'll get quite a lot.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,536
    I hope they’ve made Kemi a sandwich a tea. She’s been in there ages.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,215
    kle4 said:

    nico679 said:

    kle4 said:

    nico679 said:

    Leon said:

    Coverage of immigration is insanely poor

    “Suella Braverman: home secretary set to take even harder line on migration”

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/sep/06/suella-braverman-home-secretary-set-to-take-even-harder-line-on-migration?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    “Even harder line”.

    From that you’d believe we are basically North Korea. Admitting no one. But in fact the UK handed out 1 MILLION visas last year and we have one of the most liberal migration regimes on earth. Plus the boat people

    It’s farcical

    Nothing worse than someone who is the child of immigrants being anti-immigrant...
    I don't see what's bad about that. People should not be expected to hold certain opinions due to their background.
    Well I disagree . If your life chances have been helped by the welcome you were given in the UK it’s not right to then be anti giving that to others who were in the same position .
    That might well be considered hypocritical, to a degree, but it is outweighed in my view by the idea you must hold certain political opinions based on your origins or else you are condemned for your views.

    And your example does not in any case cover the children of immigrants. How many generations should they be bound by the act of their forebears? If only one parent was an immigrant are they half as bound?

    What if someone says their life chances were helped by being born in a UK with lower immigration? Are their no limits, are they required to support unrestricted immigration or can they suggest there be limits on numbers? There might have been such limits for their parents' generation, so why would it be wrong to place restrictions now? If, say, 100k were allowed in the year your parents came, and you support a limit of 100k now, is that wrong? Why, it is no more or less than was in place before?

    As I say, I am in favour of immigration, but I think it genuinely unfair to hold someone to account for choices not their own made in a different time. Patel, Braverman, anyone else with relatives who have immigrated in recent times or themselves did, I'll judge the policy on its merits, not on the race or origin of the person presenting it.
    On this, the thing with Braverman, is that she has been bigging up her immigrant background, IE in her maiden speech in parliament, explaining that her parents were fleeing 'turmoil', which she now seems to want to prevent other people from doing. So it possibly does come across as though she is celebrating a sort of 'pull the ladder up behind me' narrative, which isn't a very good look.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    Sky News are dumb as a box of rocks.

    We need more Latin lessons in our schools.


    The grammar is bad but the point is an important one. Anyone who didn't realise that this was what Brexit was about is a moron.
    (Interestingly, the person I heard pointing this out most forcefully, spitting with rage about a project to dismantle the welfare state being sold as all about getting more money for the NHS, was a former Tory PM, John Major. It sure as hell isn't his party anymore).
    The IEA mob think the UK need to be more like America.

    Living as I now do in New York, I would argue that would be a big mistake.

    I'm thinking they will be seeing Florida as their inspiration...

  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 9,946
    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    We were inspired by her oratory
    Was it John Major or Tony Blair who started the tradition of the introductory speech when reaching No.10?

    Like all her predecessors, Truss was long on generalities and banal platitudes and short on specifics. Plenty of pointless commitments, a pep talk and hints of the "sunlit uplands" but no sense of any understanding of the real problems facing the country.

    Apart from that, she managed to deliver the speech and not fall over so kudos for that.
    Every single new PM downing street speech is 'hi guys, im all about *insert generality here, for example law and order! Our NHS!* and of course we face real challenges in x and y and even z but this is a great country, i'm going to work to make it even greater. Now on with the job of government and delivering on my pledges to you.' With a few 'a new day has dawned has it not' soundbites thrown in.
    A 30 minute dirge about specific NI protocol changes would just be weird
  • Any software engineers in the house?

    If I had a system which is trying to keep count of stock, if I use an SQL database the count will always be correct because of ACID principles right, at the expense of speed? Would this be okay if I am keeping count of stock which has thousands of orders per minute?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    alex_ said:

    Sky News are dumb as a box of rocks.

    We need more Latin lessons in our schools.


    The grammar is bad but the point is an important one. Anyone who didn't realise that this was what Brexit was about is a moron.
    (Interestingly, the person I heard pointing this out most forcefully, spitting with rage about a project to dismantle the welfare state being sold as all about getting more money for the NHS, was a former Tory PM, John Major. It sure as hell isn't his party anymore).
    The IEA mob think the UK need to be more like America.

    Living as I now do in New York, I would argue that would be a big mistake.

    I'm thinking they will be seeing Florida as their inspiration...

    Yes, New York is too statist for the IEA, Mississippi might be their inspiration. Douglas Carswell over there as head of the Mississippi Centre of Public Policy and delighted by the new Cabinet
    https://twitter.com/DouglasCarswell/status/1567236170660167683?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
    https://twitter.com/DouglasCarswell/status/1567241028880531465?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673
    Nigelb said:

    IanB2 said:

    biggles said:

    IanB2 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Good speech and interesting that she referenced building and spades in the ground so much. Perhaps she's planning some genuine free market reforms on planning.

    Tbh I was wondering if the Prime Minister accidentally skipped a section there. It made no sense.
    The Prime Minister said, "We'll get spades in the ground to make sure people are not facing unaffordable energy bills."

    It makes no sense; she must have lost her place in the script and missed a sentence.
    Metaphor surely? No planning and talking, immediate action
    No, it's incoherent even as a metaphor.
    Going with "Brexit is like having a baby" would have made more sense.
    Because you’ll be paying for it the rest of your life?
    Brexit is very much like making love to a beautiful woman…

    Just no.
    I think biggles means it’s his fantasy.
    Honestly, you make a Fast Show joke in 2022 and people act is if it’s not topical….

  • Cookie said:

    GIN1138 said:

    HYUFD said:
    Who and what?
    The new Tory Party Chairman.

    Jake's a top bloke, follows me on Twitter, he has excellent judgment.
    He is a complete wanker, he pretends to live in a Red Wall constituency and speak for the North while maintaining multiple homes and a property empire on Ynys Mon.

    He'll be the first one out, Paterson-style
    According to Wikipedia he loves in Rossendale. Which isn't really red wall.
    Where does he live and laugh?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    @Jacob_Rees_Mogg
    It is an honour to be appointed as the new Secretary of State for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy. I look forward to serving the Prime Minister and the country during the challenging times ahead.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,414
    When this goes sideways, she is not going to have many friends on the backbenches
  • HYUFD said:

    Jacob Rees Mogg confirmed as new Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567245923255816193?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA

    Excellent news. I enjoy listening to JRM.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 9,946
    edited September 2022

    nico679 said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    Pretty standard fare , some vacuous nonsense that new PMs always say and also a few fluffed lines from Truss . Thankfully she didn’t channel her inner Thatcher and we didn’t hear , where there is discord ...

    However the speech was the highlight , it’s been all downhill ever since with some cabinet picks that wouldn’t look out of place if it was April fools day !
    What is noticeable, as with her first "victory" speech, is the style - Truss doesn't do drip-drip announcements. If she something to say, she assembles it for a big bang, rather than give hints along the way. We are literally little the wiser after her first two speeches, but on Thursday we'll get quite a lot.
    You never know Nick, she might be all about the tradition of announcing policy to parliament
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673
    HYUFD said:

    @Jacob_Rees_Mogg
    It is an honour to be appointed as the new Secretary of State for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy. I look forward to serving the Prime Minister and the country during the challenging times ahead.

    “PM and country”? In that order? And no Queen?

    It really is the third eleven.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    At Business I reckon JRM is basically going to be real-life Ebeneezer Scrooge.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,465
    edited September 2022

    It’s possible I suppose that Truss intends to be her own BEIS minister.

    It’s genuinely difficult to explain that appointment. She owes Rees-Mogg very little.

    I think she wants to put the department to the metaphorical fire. She was Trade Secretary (it is the DTI isn't it?) so will know the department well, and know what she thinks it needs. Which is probably a good hiding, and he will do it.
    No, BEIS is different from the DTI which Truss ran. It's Minister for the CBI, basically, plus climate change. (and ENERGY!)
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    HYUFD said:

    alex_ said:

    Sky News are dumb as a box of rocks.

    We need more Latin lessons in our schools.


    The grammar is bad but the point is an important one. Anyone who didn't realise that this was what Brexit was about is a moron.
    (Interestingly, the person I heard pointing this out most forcefully, spitting with rage about a project to dismantle the welfare state being sold as all about getting more money for the NHS, was a former Tory PM, John Major. It sure as hell isn't his party anymore).
    The IEA mob think the UK need to be more like America.

    Living as I now do in New York, I would argue that would be a big mistake.

    I'm thinking they will be seeing Florida as their inspiration...

    Yes, New York is too statist for the IEA, Mississippi might be their inspiration. Douglas Carswell over there as head of the Mississippi Centre of Public Policy and delighted by the new Cabinet
    https://twitter.com/DouglasCarswell/status/1567236170660167683?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
    https://twitter.com/DouglasCarswell/status/1567241028880531465?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
    It's all going swimmingly in Mississippi at the moment...
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,952
    This is weirdly charming.

    https://twitter.com/aaf_lukas/status/1567244683146928128
    Did you know that the Taliban possess a 80+ years old L3/35 (Carro Veloce CV-35) Italian-made tankette in working condition?
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673
    edited September 2022

    At Business I reckon JRM is basically going to be real-life Ebeneezer Scrooge.

    More like Marley. I don’t foresee a change of views in life.
  • Chris said:

    It seems to be a government of all the Kwasis.

    According to the link posted earlier, Kwasi looks to have been "friendly" with quite a few of the female Tory MPs.

    On that note, does anyone think he's had a go with Therese Coffey?

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    @Mr_John_Oxley
    ·
    5h
    My only PM motorcade fact is that Macmillan's driver had to carry a special set of thrupenny bits, in case he needed to use a phonebox to order a nuclear strike as they didn't have a secure communications system in the car.
  • HYUFD said:

    alex_ said:

    Sky News are dumb as a box of rocks.

    We need more Latin lessons in our schools.


    The grammar is bad but the point is an important one. Anyone who didn't realise that this was what Brexit was about is a moron.
    (Interestingly, the person I heard pointing this out most forcefully, spitting with rage about a project to dismantle the welfare state being sold as all about getting more money for the NHS, was a former Tory PM, John Major. It sure as hell isn't his party anymore).
    The IEA mob think the UK need to be more like America.

    Living as I now do in New York, I would argue that would be a big mistake.

    I'm thinking they will be seeing Florida as their inspiration...

    Yes, New York is too statist for the IEA, Mississippi might be their inspiration. Douglas Carswell over there as head of the Mississippi Centre of Public Policy and delighted by the new Cabinet
    https://twitter.com/DouglasCarswell/status/1567236170660167683?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
    https://twitter.com/DouglasCarswell/status/1567241028880531465?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
    Because Mississippi is renowned for its quality of living and economic vigour.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    Kemi Badenoch the new Secretary of State for International Trade and President of the Board of Trade

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567250625204731905?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
  • Chris said:

    It seems to be a government of all the Kwasis.

    According to the link posted earlier, Kwasi looks to have been "friendly" with quite a few of the female Tory MPs.

    On that note, does anyone think he's had a go with Therese Coffey?

    That is a very concerning thought for so early in the evening.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 5,931

    Chris said:

    It seems to be a government of all the Kwasis.

    According to the link posted earlier, Kwasi looks to have been "friendly" with quite a few of the female Tory MPs.

    On that note, does anyone think he's had a go with Therese Coffey?

    Very funny !
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 9,946
    HYUFD said:

    @Mr_John_Oxley
    ·
    5h
    My only PM motorcade fact is that Macmillan's driver had to carry a special set of thrupenny bits, in case he needed to use a phonebox to order a nuclear strike as they didn't have a secure communications system in the car.

    He is incorrect, it was 4 pennies
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,465

    nico679 said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    Pretty standard fare , some vacuous nonsense that new PMs always say and also a few fluffed lines from Truss . Thankfully she didn’t channel her inner Thatcher and we didn’t hear , where there is discord ...

    However the speech was the highlight , it’s been all downhill ever since with some cabinet picks that wouldn’t look out of place if it was April fools day !
    What is noticeable, as with her first "victory" speech, is the style - Truss doesn't do drip-drip announcements. If she something to say, she assembles it for a big bang, rather than give hints along the way. We are literally little the wiser after her first two speeches, but on Thursday we'll get quite a lot.
    You never know Nick, she might be all about the tradition of announcing policy to parliament
    Yes, I meant it as a compliment.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    : Liz Truss has spoken to
    @JoeBiden
    “The Prime Minister and President Biden reflected on the enduring strength of the Special Relationship”
    https://twitter.com/darrenmccaffrey/status/1567251066323976192?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 21,995
    HYUFD said:

    : Liz Truss has spoken to
    @JoeBiden
    “The Prime Minister and President Biden reflected on the enduring strength of the Special Relationship”
    https://twitter.com/darrenmccaffrey/status/1567251066323976192?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA


    I wonder if Joe actually knew who he was talking to?
  • The lack of safety net in the US (regardless of it being New York or Mississippi) is terrifying and the consequences of that are starkly visible pretty much wherever you go.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,557
    edited September 2022
    Much PB Tory ambivalence towards Truss' appointments. Is this the state of things to come?

    I am just mightily relieved Johnson has packed his trunk and said goodbye to the circus. He did so with his usual poor grace and self indulgence.

    Now he's gone there seems less expectation amongst the scribblers that he will return. Good riddance.

  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,850
    edited September 2022
    HYUFD said:

    : Liz Truss has spoken to
    @JoeBiden
    “The Prime Minister and President Biden reflected on the enduring strength of the Special Relationship”
    https://twitter.com/darrenmccaffrey/status/1567251066323976192?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA

    .."and Liz Truss agreed not to blow it up as a result of a dispute over Northern Ireland, knowing how many other issues she already to deal with on so many fronts."
  • Kemi Badenoch International trade
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673

    HYUFD said:

    @Mr_John_Oxley
    ·
    5h
    My only PM motorcade fact is that Macmillan's driver had to carry a special set of thrupenny bits, in case he needed to use a phonebox to order a nuclear strike as they didn't have a secure communications system in the car.

    He is incorrect, it was 4 pennies
    Surely MOD would accept reversed changes from the PM?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 9,946

    nico679 said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    Pretty standard fare , some vacuous nonsense that new PMs always say and also a few fluffed lines from Truss . Thankfully she didn’t channel her inner Thatcher and we didn’t hear , where there is discord ...

    However the speech was the highlight , it’s been all downhill ever since with some cabinet picks that wouldn’t look out of place if it was April fools day !
    What is noticeable, as with her first "victory" speech, is the style - Truss doesn't do drip-drip announcements. If she something to say, she assembles it for a big bang, rather than give hints along the way. We are literally little the wiser after her first two speeches, but on Thursday we'll get quite a lot.
    You never know Nick, she might be all about the tradition of announcing policy to parliament
    Yes, I meant it as a compliment.
    And i was being tongue in cheek
    But she may. Would be nice to get back to that.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 5,931
    Who will be taking over the crucial Brexit Opportunities brief !

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    edited September 2022

    The lack of safety net in the US (regardless of it being New York or Mississippi) is terrifying and the consequences of that are starkly visible pretty much wherever you go.

    Agreed, the US is great if you are a rich high earner but certainly for the poor most other western nations are better and even middle income earners maybe in terms of not having to pay for healthcare etc and greater gun control
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673

    nico679 said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    Pretty standard fare , some vacuous nonsense that new PMs always say and also a few fluffed lines from Truss . Thankfully she didn’t channel her inner Thatcher and we didn’t hear , where there is discord ...

    However the speech was the highlight , it’s been all downhill ever since with some cabinet picks that wouldn’t look out of place if it was April fools day !
    What is noticeable, as with her first "victory" speech, is the style - Truss doesn't do drip-drip announcements. If she something to say, she assembles it for a big bang, rather than give hints along the way. We are literally little the wiser after her first two speeches, but on Thursday we'll get quite a lot.
    You never know Nick, she might be all about the tradition of announcing policy to parliament
    Yes, I meant it as a compliment.
    And i was being tongue in cheek
    But she may. Would be nice to get back to that.
    We’ll see. I’m going with “all over the papers on Wednesday night following the first Cabinet earlier in the day”.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    Chloe Smith is the new Secretary of State for Work and Pensions

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567251844845420545?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,689
    HYUFD said:

    Chloe Smith is the new Secretary of State for Work and Pensions

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567251844845420545?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA

    The outgoing Cabinet's mind-bending forbearance towards Boris Johnson doesn't seem to have done them much good, does it?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,167
    edited September 2022
    HYUFD said:

    The lack of safety net in the US (regardless of it being New York or Mississippi) is terrifying and the consequences of that are starkly visible pretty much wherever you go.

    Agreed, the US is great if you are a rich high earner but certainly for the poor most other western nations are better and even middle income earners maybe in terms of not having to pay for healthcare etc and greater gun control
    It’s treacherous waters to compare, but I’d argue that there is a better quality of living in the US for the middle and top third, but you have to put up with the very visible distress and desperation of the bottom third.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,674
    Right, let's try this again for the benefit of @wooliedyed, @IanB2, @HYUFD and any others who picked up on my previous:

    Who was the first Prime Minister to conduct a speech using a lectern outside No.10 on their first day in office? Tony Blair certainly did and I think it was one of Mandelson's presentational ideas so I suspect it wasn't John Major.

    Previous Prime Ministers had made a few remarks to camera but not a formal speech with a lectern.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208

    Much PB Tory ambivalence towards Truss' appointments. Is this the state of things to come?

    I am just mightily relieved Johnson has packed his trunk and said goodbye to the circus. He did so with his usual poor grace and self indulgence.

    Now he's gone there seems less expectation amongst the scribblers that he will return. Good riddance.

    Boris has gone yes but hold onto your seats because on this Cabinet Truss' government will be the most economically rightwing this country has had since Thatcher. Indeed more laissez-faire than even Thatcher's was until her last years in office
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673
    edited September 2022
    HYUFD said:

    Much PB Tory ambivalence towards Truss' appointments. Is this the state of things to come?

    I am just mightily relieved Johnson has packed his trunk and said goodbye to the circus. He did so with his usual poor grace and self indulgence.

    Now he's gone there seems less expectation amongst the scribblers that he will return. Good riddance.

    Boris has gone yes but hold onto your seats because on this Cabinet Truss' government will be the most economically rightwing this country has had since Thatcher. Indeed more laissez-faire than even Thatcher's was until her last years in office
    As I saw someone say earlier, this isn’t Thatcherite. This is Reaganite.

    Yuck.
  • HYUFD said:

    The lack of safety net in the US (regardless of it being New York or Mississippi) is terrifying and the consequences of that are starkly visible pretty much wherever you go.

    Agreed, the US is great if you are a rich high earner but certainly for the poor most other western nations are better and even middle income earners maybe in terms of not having to pay for healthcare etc and greater gun control
    It’s treacherous waters to compare, but I’d argue that there is a better quality of living in the US for the middle and top third, but you have to put up with the very visible distress and desperation of the bottom third.
    There are also certain vicissitudes that weigh upon all but the most privileged, the lack of holidays, paid parental leave, the quality of food, the lack of intellectual life except in certain places, and the ongoing racial issue that touches everything.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,557
    HYUFD said:

    Much PB Tory ambivalence towards Truss' appointments. Is this the state of things to come?

    I am just mightily relieved Johnson has packed his trunk and said goodbye to the circus. He did so with his usual poor grace and self indulgence.

    Now he's gone there seems less expectation amongst the scribblers that he will return. Good riddance.

    Boris has gone yes but hold onto your seats because on this Cabinet Truss' government will be the most economically rightwing this country has had since Thatcher. Indeed more laissez-faire than even Thatcher's was until her last years in office
    You wrote that as though it were a good thing. Martin Sinclair is a huge concern. There will be only carcass left when he's picked through the bones of the economy.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 9,946
    biggles said:

    HYUFD said:

    @Mr_John_Oxley
    ·
    5h
    My only PM motorcade fact is that Macmillan's driver had to carry a special set of thrupenny bits, in case he needed to use a phonebox to order a nuclear strike as they didn't have a secure communications system in the car.

    He is incorrect, it was 4 pennies
    Surely MOD would accept reversed changes from the PM?
    That was also in the plan as 'it would not take appreciably more time' if they didnt have any pennies
    The car was fitted with the same equipment the AA used and he would be radioed on it and informed to go to the nearest phone box and call whitehall to authoruse retaliation
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,037
    Cyclefree said:

    This government was elected on the basis of the 2019 manifesto.

    Leaving the ECHR was not in that manifesto and the Lords would be perfectly entitled to block such a measure.

    The manifesto also contained this promise - "We will continue to grant asylum and support to refugees fleeing persecution, with the ultimate aim of helping them to return home if it is safe to do so."

    Page 39 on workers rights: not just preserving existing rights but enhancing them is worth reading too.

    If Truss wants to tear up the 2019 manifesto and govern according to a new one, she should call a GE. If not, she can do what the government which was elected promised to do in that manifesto.

    Governments are not restricted to doing only what is in their manifestoes, and for good reason as unforeseen circumstances might arise and calling a GE every time you do something new would be prohibitive. So I think claiming they need a GE to do it is being a bit unserious.

    However, what it does mean is that there is no urgency behind it, nothing menaingful for them to point to as the will of the people (people may want a grip on immigration, but that does not mean they will electorally support anything proposed to do that), and indeed the Lords can and should resist it if they think that appropriate.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,850
    edited September 2022
    stodge said:

    Right, let's try this again for the benefit of @wooliedyed, @IanB2, @HYUFD and any others who picked up on my previous:

    Who was the first Prime Minister to conduct a speech using a lectern outside No.10 on their first day in office? Tony Blair certainly did and I think it was one of Mandelson's presentational ideas so I suspect it wasn't John Major.

    Previous Prime Ministers had made a few remarks to camera but not a formal speech with a lectern.

    I remember there was huge fuss made over Mandelson's stage-managed day with the Blair speech and the union flags handed out to Party workers, made to look like ordinary people. I'm pretty sure it was Blair ; unless I've forgotten anything about Major. I can't imagine a big inaugural speech would have been his style. "That never buttered a parsnip", as he used to say.
  • IanB2 said:

    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    What was the PB view on Truss's short introductory speech ? I missed most of this.

    We were inspired by her oratory
    Was it John Major or Tony Blair who started the tradition of the introductory speech when reaching No.10?

    Like all her predecessors, Truss was long on generalities and banal platitudes and short on specifics. Plenty of pointless commitments, a pep talk and hints of the "sunlit uplands" but no sense of any understanding of the real problems facing the country.

    Apart from that, she managed to deliver the speech and not fall over so kudos for that.
    How could you forget Thatcher’s promise to replace discord with harmony?
    That worked out so well, too.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    edited September 2022
    Chris said:

    HYUFD said:

    Chloe Smith is the new Secretary of State for Work and Pensions

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567251844845420545?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA

    The outgoing Cabinet's mind-bending forbearance towards Boris Johnson doesn't seem to have done them much good, does it?
    It did for those who having backed Boris switched quickly to Liz, for the rest eg Shapps, Raab, Eustice, Sunak, Dowden, Javid, Patel it seems there is no room. For those heavyweights not even in the pre resignation Boris Cabinet like Hunt and Greg Clark, forget it
  • This is a generation whose ideologies were formed in the 90s, but they’ve learned nothing since those days.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,037
    darkage said:

    kle4 said:

    nico679 said:

    kle4 said:

    nico679 said:

    Leon said:

    Coverage of immigration is insanely poor

    “Suella Braverman: home secretary set to take even harder line on migration”

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/sep/06/suella-braverman-home-secretary-set-to-take-even-harder-line-on-migration?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

    “Even harder line”.

    From that you’d believe we are basically North Korea. Admitting no one. But in fact the UK handed out 1 MILLION visas last year and we have one of the most liberal migration regimes on earth. Plus the boat people

    It’s farcical

    Nothing worse than someone who is the child of immigrants being anti-immigrant...
    I don't see what's bad about that. People should not be expected to hold certain opinions due to their background.
    Well I disagree . If your life chances have been helped by the welcome you were given in the UK it’s not right to then be anti giving that to others who were in the same position .
    That might well be considered hypocritical, to a degree, but it is outweighed in my view by the idea you must hold certain political opinions based on your origins or else you are condemned for your views.

    And your example does not in any case cover the children of immigrants. How many generations should they be bound by the act of their forebears? If only one parent was an immigrant are they half as bound?

    What if someone says their life chances were helped by being born in a UK with lower immigration? Are their no limits, are they required to support unrestricted immigration or can they suggest there be limits on numbers? There might have been such limits for their parents' generation, so why would it be wrong to place restrictions now? If, say, 100k were allowed in the year your parents came, and you support a limit of 100k now, is that wrong? Why, it is no more or less than was in place before?

    As I say, I am in favour of immigration, but I think it genuinely unfair to hold someone to account for choices not their own made in a different time. Patel, Braverman, anyone else with relatives who have immigrated in recent times or themselves did, I'll judge the policy on its merits, not on the race or origin of the person presenting it.
    On this, the thing with Braverman, is that she has been bigging up her immigrant background, IE in her maiden speech in parliament, explaining that her parents were fleeing 'turmoil', which she now seems to want to prevent other people from doing. So it possibly does come across as though she is celebrating a sort of 'pull the ladder up behind me' narrative, which isn't a very good look.
    That's fair, and she can be judged for that. But that is a far cry from the idea that, as a general rule, it is one fo the worst things for the child of an immigrant to be anti-immigrant.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 53,521
    Another extraordinary thread about terrifying AI art

    https://twitter.com/supercomposite/status/1567162288087470081?s=21&t=kdEk5Ztjb-RkEm_BRAI0CQ

    Guys, we need to face facts. These machines are ALIVE and they are FUCKING WEIRD
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,414
    Kit Malthouse is Education Sec
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    Leon said:

    Another extraordinary thread about terrifying AI art

    https://twitter.com/supercomposite/status/1567162288087470081?s=21&t=kdEk5Ztjb-RkEm_BRAI0CQ

    Guys, we need to face facts. These machines are ALIVE and they are FUCKING WEIRD

    Perhaps Liz Truss is our first AI PM?
  • With Simon Clarke replacing Greg Clark, I’m ready to agree with those who suggested that this Cabinet is pretty much a Lizzite coup.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,037

    HYUFD said:

    Jacob Rees Mogg confirmed as new Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary

    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567245923255816193?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA

    Excellent news. I enjoy listening to JRM.
    Well, I'm glad someone is about it. Perhaps he can stick to the business of his department and not invent radical new interpretations of the British constitution whilst pretending he is a conservative, like the idea MPs shouldn't be able to remove their party leader because the public voted for them (which they did not).
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,635

    Chris said:

    It seems to be a government of all the Kwasis.

    According to the link posted earlier, Kwasi looks to have been "friendly" with quite a few of the female Tory MPs.

    On that note, does anyone think he's had a go with Therese Coffey?

    That would be a mountain too far for him to climb.
  • HYUFD said:

    Much PB Tory ambivalence towards Truss' appointments. Is this the state of things to come?

    I am just mightily relieved Johnson has packed his trunk and said goodbye to the circus. He did so with his usual poor grace and self indulgence.

    Now he's gone there seems less expectation amongst the scribblers that he will return. Good riddance.

    Boris has gone yes but hold onto your seats because on this Cabinet Truss' government will be the most economically rightwing this country has had since Thatcher. Indeed more laissez-faire than even Thatcher's was until her last years in office
    And from a government elected to level up and increase NHS funding. Red Wall voters - you have been had.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,037

    This is a generation whose ideologies were formed in the 90s, but they’ve learned nothing since those days.

    Makes a change from all those 80s throwbacks I guess.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    Has she appointed an independent ethics advisor?

    Or is she not bothering on the basis that there is no point expecting any sort of ethical standards from this government?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,952
    Cyclefree said:

    This government was elected on the basis of the 2019 manifesto.

    Leaving the ECHR was not in that manifesto and the Lords would be perfectly entitled to block such a measure.

    The manifesto also contained this promise - "We will continue to grant asylum and support to refugees fleeing persecution, with the ultimate aim of helping them to return home if it is safe to do so."

    Page 39 on workers rights: not just preserving existing rights but enhancing them is worth reading too.

    If Truss wants to tear up the 2019 manifesto and govern according to a new one, she should call a GE. If not, she can do what the government which was elected promised to do in that manifesto.

    Meet the new set of chancers.
    Not wildly different from the old set of chancers.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    This is a generation whose ideologies were formed in the 90s, but they’ve learned nothing since those days.

    The generation who's understanding of Thatcher comes from when she was going gaga, not when she was actually governing.
  • Kemi biggest winner thus far - as others have said above a brief that allows her to be out of the country lots, with low hanging fruit to spin as successes.

    Pile on her for next Tory leader.
  • Leon said:

    Another extraordinary thread about terrifying AI art

    https://twitter.com/supercomposite/status/1567162288087470081?s=21&t=kdEk5Ztjb-RkEm_BRAI0CQ

    Guys, we need to face facts. These machines are ALIVE and they are FUCKING WEIRD

    No, that's the new Cabinet you're thinking of.
  • I suspect this is the most fiscally right wing cabinet Britain has ever seen.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    edited September 2022
    Kit Malthouse the new Education Secretary, he was a staunch Boris loyalist and Boris' Deputy as Mayor of London and backed Truss for the leadership
    https://twitter.com/10DowningStreet/status/1567254103981543429?s=20&t=NUQRUhQ02LVJDL06metRrA
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 16,614
    edited September 2022
    Cyclefree said:

    Has she appointed an independent ethics advisor?

    Or is she not bothering on the basis that there is no point expecting any sort of ethical standards from this government?

    I think la Truss is on the record as believing she doesn't need one;

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62657384

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,037
    edited September 2022
    Cyclefree said:

    Has she appointed an independent ethics advisor?

    Or is she not bothering on the basis that there is no point expecting any sort of ethical standards from this government?

    I think she'd already said she wouldn't on the basis it is pointless as you can't outsource ethics.

    Which is true, the presence of an ethics adviser will not make an unethical person act ethically as we've seen, but given she thinks Boris has done nothing wrong and he should still be running the country (and us therefore missing out on these apparently vital changes she will now propose), if she is going to say she will act with integrity or punish those without it I think I may die laughing.

    It's the same thinking of why you don't need any kind of standards - I always act properly. Therefore, if someone accuses me of not doing so, they are wrong. No need to look further.

    Call it the Paterson principle.
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673

    Kemi biggest winner thus far - as others have said above a brief that allows her to be out of the country lots, with low hanging fruit to spin as successes.

    Pile on her for next Tory leader.

    Interesting post-Brexit development. In Gvt should we always view DIT as a strong platform for the next (Tory) pm?
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    Nigelb said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This government was elected on the basis of the 2019 manifesto.

    Leaving the ECHR was not in that manifesto and the Lords would be perfectly entitled to block such a measure.

    The manifesto also contained this promise - "We will continue to grant asylum and support to refugees fleeing persecution, with the ultimate aim of helping them to return home if it is safe to do so."

    Page 39 on workers rights: not just preserving existing rights but enhancing them is worth reading too.

    If Truss wants to tear up the 2019 manifesto and govern according to a new one, she should call a GE. If not, she can do what the government which was elected promised to do in that manifesto.

    Meet the new set of chancers.
    Not wildly different from the old set of chancers.
    I think I've had it with politics really.

    There has been an interesting recent case on whistleblowing in the Care Quality Commission. The NHS has quite an issue with whistleblowing and to see the same problems in the CQC is quite demoralising.

    I wonder what @Foxy thinks.

    I may write about this for my work blog, whistleblowing being my specialism these days.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    By the way, in other news, there are lots of indications that Russians are getting routed all over the place at the moment...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,208
    edited September 2022
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,276

    This is a generation whose ideologies were formed in the 90s, but they’ve learned nothing since those days.

    Yep. Thatcher's children.
    In that they were mostly children under her.
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,673

    I suspect this is the most fiscally right wing cabinet Britain has ever seen.

    On a technicality I’m going to say that’s late Gladstone. Fiscally dry as dust, in favour of free trade, and supportive of the most limited welfare possible.
This discussion has been closed.