The polling that should scare Sunak and every Tory – politicalbetting.com

System

The polling that should scare Sunak and every Tory – politicalbetting.com

Consumer confidence falls as household finance measures fall to historic lows, our latest analysis with @Cebr_uk shows https://t.co/C5Wu3VUABa pic.twitter.com/u55Vg4MZYb

Read the full story here

IshmaelZ

Sunak Sunk. Rishi Poor.

IanB2

Second rate, like Johnson.

BigRich

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

FrancisUrquhart

IanB2 said:

Second rate, like Johnson.

Generous. More like third rate.

Malmesbury

BigRich said:

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

What about a combination of c & d ?

Shades of Mannerheim.....

Aslan

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

There were reports yesterday that Russian commanders were being put into the Belarusian army to make sure the troops comply with orders. No idea if it's true.

ping

Watford!!!

@Ave_it

Taz

They are already starting to frame it as being down to the war.

It is potentially toxic to them but what is labours solution ?

Theuniondivvie

Aslan said:

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

There were reports yesterday that Russian commanders were being put into the Belarusian army to make sure the troops comply with orders. No idea if it's true.

Seems like recipe for a grenade in the tent if ever I saw one.

FF43

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

Lukashenko gives a convincing impression of being completely stupid, but his sheer survival suggests a certain wiliness where his own preservation is concerned. Rats have a good sense of sinking ships and while Lukashenko will nod along to Putin's delusions he doesn't see any upside in direct participation.

Aslan

Theuniondivvie said:

Aslan said:

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

There were reports yesterday that Russian commanders were being put into the Belarusian army to make sure the troops comply with orders. No idea if it's true.

Seems like recipe for a grenade in the tent if ever I saw one.

Or a bullet in the back of the head once you are in the confusion of a war zone.

ydoethur

FrancisUrquhart said:

IanB2 said:

Second rate, like Johnson.

Generous. More like third rate.

Why do you both rate him so far above his abilities?

Malmesbury

Theuniondivvie said:

Aslan said:

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

There were reports yesterday that Russian commanders were being put into the Belarusian army to make sure the troops comply with orders. No idea if it's true.

Seems like recipe for a grenade in the tent if ever I saw one.

{Captain Robert Corbet has entered the chat}

eek

For an example of the impact

We were the fancy new Restaurant / Bar in Richmond's Town Square (Rishi's constituency not London) yesterday at 1pm. Total number of customers in the place was 7 and we were outnumbered by the staff.

A month ago we had to wait for a table.

Gallowgate

Payrise season is coming up also

Malmesbury

FF43 said:

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

Lukashenko gives a convincing impression of being completely stupid, but his sheer survival suggests a certain wiliness where his own preservation is concerned. Rats have a good sense of sinking ships and while Lukashenko will nod along to Putin's delusions he doesn't see any upside in direct participation.

f) The Russian plan is going so brilliantly that they don't really need the Belarusian troops, but are pranking NATO.

Sunil_Prasannan

Aslan said:

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

There were reports yesterday that Russian commanders were being put into the Belarusian army to make sure the troops comply with orders. No idea if it's true.

A bit like British commanders in the Indian Army?

TimT

ping said:

Watford!!!

@Ave_it

Where is Ave_it these days? I miss his cheery posts.

ydoethur

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

Malmesbury

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

The B ark is almost ready

HYUFD

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Taz

Malmesbury said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

The B ark is almost ready

And once the B Ark left the good people of Golgafrincha all died.

ydoethur

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

Gallowgate

Newcastle fans singing "He's coming for you, he's coming for you, Mike Ashley, he's coming for you"

JohnLilburne

eek said:

For an example of the impact

We were the fancy new Restaurant / Bar in Richmond's Town Square (Rishi's constituency not London) yesterday at 1pm. Total number of customers in the place was 7 and we were outnumbered by the staff.

A month ago we had to wait for a table.

I know I am going to have higher costs in the next few months. Energy, the TV contract, mortgage, petrol, all going up. That's going to have to come out of my spare cash for enjoying myself (and I aim to maintain the travel fund, so actually I'll be spending outside the UK). No option, really. I may be drinking in Wetherspoons for the foreseeable future.

Malmesbury

Taz said:

Malmesbury said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

The B ark is almost ready

And once the B Ark left the good people of Golgafrincha all died.

This time round, we keeping the telephone sanitisers. Cleaners Good. DfE Bad.

Chris

Malmesbury said:

FF43 said:

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

Lukashenko gives a convincing impression of being completely stupid, but his sheer survival suggests a certain wiliness where his own preservation is concerned. Rats have a good sense of sinking ships and while Lukashenko will nod along to Putin's delusions he doesn't see any upside in direct participation.

f) The Russian plan is going so brilliantly that they don't really need the Belarusian troops, but are pranking NATO.

It's not a good sign that the Russians seem so desperate to rope in Belarus, a country with a smaller population than Belgium.

Not good for the Russians, I mean.

Gallowgate

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

JohnLilburne

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

Leon

“History is a nightmare from which I am trying to awake” - James Joyce

Has never felt more apt

HYUFD

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Average pay rise across the UK just 2% last year

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/18/average-pay-deal-britain

williamglenn

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

Gallowgate

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Average pay rise across the UK just 2% last year

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/18/average-pay-deal-britain

What's that got to do with my point?

Nigelb

Chris said:

Malmesbury said:

FF43 said:

BigRich said:

FPT

dixiedean said:

Whatever happened to the Belarus invasion?
False report? Mutiny?
Still hasn't barked.

I was wondering that, a few possibility's:

a) Its happened, some Belarusian forces are in Ukraine, but keeping, bit nil Publicity.
b) Its about to happen, just not on the predicted timescale.
c) it was never going to happen, but was all to put presser on the Ukrainians, by tying up forces on the boarder.
d) The Belarus dictator had to agree to it while he was in Moscow, to avoid being detained! but had no intention of invading
e) Its been ordered, but ether the generals or the men seed no way! and he is now busy suppressing a mutiny/rebellion.

I think c) is the most likely situation, but happy who knows?

Lukashenko gives a convincing impression of being completely stupid, but his sheer survival suggests a certain wiliness where his own preservation is concerned. Rats have a good sense of sinking ships and while Lukashenko will nod along to Putin's delusions he doesn't see any upside in direct participation.

f) The Russian plan is going so brilliantly that they don't really need the Belarusian troops, but are pranking NATO.

It's not a good sign that the Russians seem so desperate to rope in Belarus, a country with a smaller population than Belgium.

Not good for the Russians, I mean.

And who historically have always been pretty friendly with Ukraine.

kle4

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

It's essentially open to anyone these days, but not sure it comes with the sort of power backup they are looking for right now.

Cookie

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Yes, but that's also true for all those of us who didn't get a 5.5% pay rise.

TimT

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

Would that make HMQ the Ukrainian Head of State? The UK and Ukr in a new UK?

Mexicanpete

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Oh and all those holidays and the short working days. How my late father would laugh at all those Tory lazy teacher stereotypes as he marked maths homework each night until after 9.00 pm.

williamglenn

kle4 said:

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

It's essentially open to anyone these days, but not sure it comes with the sort of power backup they are looking for right now.

Neither does being given EU candidate status, but symbolism does matter.

Gallowgate

Cookie said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Yes, but that's also true for all those of us who didn't get a 5.5% pay rise.

Obviously.

Nigelb

Conforms with my limited knowledge of army catering…
https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1503019415662694402

HYUFD

Mexicanpete said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Oh and all those holidays and the short working days. How my late father would laugh at all those Tory lazy teacher stereotypes as he markef maths homework each night until after 9.00 pm.

I did not say teachers did not work hard in term but they get longer holidays than the average worker too of course yes

Leon

Inflation for Brits is going to be tough, but not existential

Food price inflation means Famine in poor countries

A thread detailing why. This year’s Ukrainian harvest is probably already ruined

https://twitter.com/lugaricano/status/1503019196829126661?s=21

Gallowgate

HYUFD said:

Mexicanpete said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Oh and all those holidays and the short working days. How my late father would laugh at all those Tory lazy teacher stereotypes as he markef maths homework each night until after 9.00 pm.

I did not say teachers did not work hard in term but they get longer holidays than the average worker too of course yes

They get longer holidays as a trade off for not being able to choose when to take them. That seems fair enough to me.

HYUFD

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Average pay rise across the UK just 2% last year

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/18/average-pay-deal-britain

What's that got to do with my point?

Everything, inflation is a problem for everyone Sunak and the Bank of England need to get a grip on.

However new teachers did get a well above average payrise just 2 years ago

NickPalmer

Taz said:

They are already starting to frame it as being down to the war.

It is potentially toxic to them but what is labours solution ?

Yes, that's going to be the line - every problem of every kind, regardless of the actual casuses, will be ascribed to the war and the pandemic. I think it'll work up to a point, but will fall over when specific mistakes and U-turns are highlighted.

Labour's line will be "yes, things are difficult, thanks to the wat, pandemic, and Tory mismanagement - Labour will spread the burden fairly instead of loading it on low incomes as Sunak's policies are doing". That too will work up to a point, but people will want more specifics.

The underlying Tory problem is going to be "time for a change to an unthreatening alternative". Most people are up for that, and I don't see how the Conservatives avoid it. Both "No, it's not time for a change, everything is fine" and "Starmer is an dangerous menace" look unpromising.

Gallowgate

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Average pay rise across the UK just 2% last year

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/18/average-pay-deal-britain

What's that got to do with my point?

Everything, inflation is a problem for everyone Sunak and the Bank of England need to get a grip on.

However new teachers did get a well above average payrise just 2 years ago

So what is your point?

Mexicanpete

HYUFD said:

Mexicanpete said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Oh and all those holidays and the short working days. How my late father would laugh at all those Tory lazy teacher stereotypes as he markef maths homework each night until after 9.00 pm.

I did not say teachers did not work hard in term but they get longer holidays than the average worker too of course yes

You do have the annoying habit of trotting out the usual cheap stereotypes whenever the subject is brought up.

kle4

williamglenn said:

kle4 said:

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

It's essentially open to anyone these days, but not sure it comes with the sort of power backup they are looking for right now.

Neither does being given EU candidate status, but symbolism does matter.

True, but as the EU is a tighter knit grouping eventual accession, years off presumably, would afford a bit more in terms of acting beyond NATO obligations.

Leon

williamglenn said:

kle4 said:

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

It's essentially open to anyone these days, but not sure it comes with the sort of power backup they are looking for right now.

Neither does being given EU candidate status, but symbolism does matter.

It would be vetoed by India, Pakistan and SA, who are all studiously neutral on Ukraine

ydoethur

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Taz

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Average pay rise across the UK just 2% last year

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/18/average-pay-deal-britain

I expect it to be much higher this time next year

kle4

NickPalmer said:

Taz said:

They are already starting to frame it as being down to the war.

It is potentially toxic to them but what is labours solution ?

Yes, that's going to be the line - every problem of every kind, regardless of the actual casuses, will be ascribed to the war and the pandemic. I think it'll work up to a point, but will fall over when specific mistakes and U-turns are highlighted.

Labour's line will be "yes, things are difficult, thanks to the wat, pandemic, and Tory mismanagement - Labour will spread the burden fairly instead of loading it on low incomes as Sunak's policies are doing". That too will work up to a point, but people will want more specifics.

The underlying Tory problem is going to be "time for a change to an unthreatening alternative". Most people are up for that, and I don't see how the Conservatives avoid it. Both "No, it's not time for a change, everything is fine" and "Starmer is an dangerous menace" look unpromising.

It's been seen before that even if people accept issues are a result of war it doesn't follow they won't think someone else could handle them better.

I think we can overcomplicate things. Tories will do the 'No time for a change because of X' which doesn't require that they say all is fine, just that disruption is not a good idea, and Labour will go 'Tories have been incompetent'.

Starmer is neither fool nor dangerous, so it will not be easy for the Tories. Blandness can be a positive if people don't buy attack lines.

Nigelb

Taz said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

Inflation between April 2020 and January 2022 has been 5.9% according to CPI, so a real terms pay cut since then.

Average pay rise across the UK just 2% last year

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/18/average-pay-deal-britain

I expect it to be much higher this time next year

Agreed - but it’s also likely to be a real terms pay cut for a lot of people, possibly the majority.

kle4

Leon said:

Inflation for Brits is going to be tough, but not existential

Food price inflation means Famine in poor countries

A thread detailing why. This year’s Ukrainian harvest is probably already ruined

https://twitter.com/lugaricano/status/1503019196829126661?s=21

Not going to be popular with some

Rethink the EU’s Common Agricultural Policy. Pledges in the Green Deal such as converting conventional production into organic and reducing pesticides need to be postponed. The Green Deal cannot come at the cost of global food security.

rottenborough

There is the mother of all recessions coming I fear.

Tories will be able to blame Putin, which may be enough to still win in 2024.

Theuniondivvie

kle4 said:

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

It's essentially open to anyone these days, but not sure it comes with the sort of power backup they are looking for right now.

Nor the financial clout, the support of which Ukraine is going to need in pretty much any future scenario. I'm open to correction but I'd be surprised if the vast majority of Ukrainians know of the existence of the Commonwealth, let alone the valuable 'symbolism' of membership.

biggles

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

Don’t waste your time. He doesn’t understand public sector pay - or rather, he wilfully misunderstands it.

HYUFD

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

Gallowgate

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

StuartDickson

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Demand 10% if you don’t want a decline in your standard of living.

Leon

kle4 said:

Leon said:

Inflation for Brits is going to be tough, but not existential

Food price inflation means Famine in poor countries

A thread detailing why. This year’s Ukrainian harvest is probably already ruined

https://twitter.com/lugaricano/status/1503019196829126661?s=21

Not going to be popular with some

Rethink the EU’s Common Agricultural Policy. Pledges in the Green Deal such as converting conventional production into organic and reducing pesticides need to be postponed. The Green Deal cannot come at the cost of global food security.

No, but something has to give


In China, it may be Zero Covid that goes

‘Based on experience China had accumulated and the dynamic zero-COVID policy, it is tougher for China to win battle this time, as "victory" not only means containment of cases, but also minimizing impact on economy, livelihoods.‘

Chinese state media

https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/1503019442510315528?s=21

biggles

Leon said:

williamglenn said:

kle4 said:

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

It's essentially open to anyone these days, but not sure it comes with the sort of power backup they are looking for right now.

Neither does being given EU candidate status, but symbolism does matter.

It would be vetoed by India, Pakistan and SA, who are all studiously neutral on Ukraine

We could see if they fancy replacing Scotland in the U.K.?

TOPPING

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

biggles

Nigelb said:

Conforms with my limited knowledge of army catering…
https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1503019415662694402

Those gherkins look good.

Gallowgate

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

londonpubman

Inflation = huge problem

Not all workers or pensioners getting increases in line with inflation. Even those who do will pay tax at their highest rate on the increase so will be worse off in real terms

People's hard worked for savings being eroded

Bank of England doesn't seem bothered, no monetary policy control applied

People associate inflation with Labour and will think 'may as well vote for the real thing'!

😡😡😡😡😡

TOPPING

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

DecrepiterJohnL

OT just noticed the BAFTAs on telly tonight. In more innocent times we'd be poring over these for Oscar clues.

Gallowgate

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

HYUFD

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers standing for parliament either, indeed a number do but unless you are in a safe seat generally less job security

biggles

londonpubman said:

Inflation = huge problem

Not all workers or pensioners getting increases in line with inflation. Even those who do will pay tax at their highest rate on the increase so will be worse off in real terms

People's hard worked for savings being eroded

Bank of England doesn't seem bothered, no monetary policy control applied

People associate inflation with Labour and will think 'may as well vote for the real thing'!

😡😡😡😡😡

Since I have another five years on my mortgage fix, I’m quite a fan. The mortgage value may look trivial by the end.

Leon

‘Russian economy will shrink by 30% in a year’

https://www.cityam.com/russian-economy-to-lose-nearly-third-of-its-value/

That must be almost unprecedented

ydoethur

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

Nothing to stop Hyufd making stupid comparisons if that is what CCHQ wants.

kle4

Leon said:

kle4 said:

Leon said:

Inflation for Brits is going to be tough, but not existential

Food price inflation means Famine in poor countries

A thread detailing why. This year’s Ukrainian harvest is probably already ruined

https://twitter.com/lugaricano/status/1503019196829126661?s=21

Not going to be popular with some

Rethink the EU’s Common Agricultural Policy. Pledges in the Green Deal such as converting conventional production into organic and reducing pesticides need to be postponed. The Green Deal cannot come at the cost of global food security.

No, but something has to give

Oh I agree, but the 'nothing is being done' crowd would seize on it as evidence of backsliding, even if there was a justifiable reason.

HYUFD

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

Gallowgate

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers standing for parliament either, indeed a number do but unless you are in a safe seat generally less job security

Nothing stopping the "average Britain" from becoming a teacher either.

You attempted the lazy "stop complaining" argument and I was happy to counter it.

Gallowgate

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

and MPs?

ydoethur

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

and MPs?

Didn't they have an enormous pay rise this year as well, because of all the extra work the pandemic caused?

JosiasJessop

Leon said:

‘Russian economy will shrink by 30% in a year’

https://www.cityam.com/russian-economy-to-lose-nearly-third-of-its-value/

That must be almost unprecedented

Surprised it won't be more, IMO.

(as ever, IANAE)

CarlottaVance

biggles said:

Nigelb said:

Conforms with my limited knowledge of army catering…
https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1503019415662694402

Those gherkins look good.

They might be pickled cucumber. I visited the USSR in 1982 and the only green vegetable (indeed the only vegetable, apart from potato) I saw for two weeks was pickled cucumber. When the Britannia 737 took off from Sheremetyevo one of the tour reps who had been there for the whole season ran forward to the galley, retrieved and brandished a carton shouting "LOOK! MILK - REAL MILK!".

biggles

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

and MPs?

Also worth nothing he still doesn’t understand why it’s silly to compare them to the “average worker”.

MoonRabbit

There is nothing better for hangover than to go out into the park for a dawdling walk. And then eat roast beef Yorkshire pudding and gravy, and places that allow you to put as much gravy on as you want being the best (gravy supernova out your pudding)

And then go home and put your favourite pyjama suite on. 😻

Are you there Leon? Are you in the room right now so won’t miss what I have for you? You do trust me?

JohnLilburne

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

They didn't try that on with Civil Servants - I got no pay rise last year, but no effect on the pension. But I suspect with teachers that means those who have reached the maximum of a pay scale.

Carnyx

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

HYUFD's comparison is arguably unsound, in one sense. He is comparing teachers with an average of all pensions in the UK. Not with professional persons such as HYUFDs (I assume). Like comparing the sweetness of say apples with all fruits, including coconuts and tomatoes. THis way, he's counting in the short-term contract workers and the like picking broccoli in the fields on his preferred side of the scales.

Bear in mind also that pensions have always been an important part of the salary package in the public sector whose take home pay was always reduced to take this into account. Private sector, not so much, for several reasons. For that reason, too, the comparison is dodgy.

TOPPING

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers standing for parliament either, indeed a number do but unless you are in a safe seat generally less job security

Nothing stopping the "average Britain" from becoming a teacher either.

You attempted the lazy "stop complaining" argument and I was happy to counter it.

I believe we have some teachers on here. They have decided to become teachers which places them above some occupations and below others on the remunerative front. They have presumably decided that the benefits of being a teacher (imparting wisdom to the next generation, longer blocks of holidays, whatever else) are compensation enough for them not to seek other avenues of employment.

If they are so unhappy being teachers then they can leave and become investment bankers or MPs or flint knappers or sit and tend their gardens.

Or of course they can continue to be teachers and whinge like fuck about it on PB.

Leon

JosiasJessop said:

Leon said:

‘Russian economy will shrink by 30% in a year’

https://www.cityam.com/russian-economy-to-lose-nearly-third-of-its-value/

That must be almost unprecedented

Surprised it won't be more, IMO.

(as ever, IANAE)

It’s fairly enormous. For comparison it’s worse than the effect of the Great Depression in the USA, and almost as bad as the effect of the First World War on the French economy

And it’s all happening in one year. Not 3-5 years


https://www.businessinsider.com/the-worst-gdp-collapses-since-1870-2015-7

HYUFD

biggles said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

and MPs?

Also worth nothing he still doesn’t understand why it’s silly to compare them to the “average worker”.

Why? The average teacher in the average comprehensive does not have qualifications and grades vastly higher than the average worker

kle4

Theuniondivvie said:

kle4 said:

williamglenn said:

@DanielKorski
Perhaps Ukraine should be invited to join The Commonwealth @BorisJohnson? Ukraine should become an EU member but the bloc struggles to swap its technocratic model of accession for a strategic move. Inviting Ukraine to The @commonwealthsec would be a valuable signal of support

https://twitter.com/DanielKorski/status/1503016507508416512

It's essentially open to anyone these days, but not sure it comes with the sort of power backup they are looking for right now.

Nor the financial clout, the support of which Ukraine is going to need in pretty much any future scenario. I'm open to correction but I'd be surprised if the vast majority of Ukrainians know of the existence of the Commonwealth, let alone the valuable 'symbolism' of membership.

Don't even get to meet the Queen thesedays what with her needing a break from things, so lacks some glamour.

HYUFD

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

and MPs?

Didn't they have an enormous pay rise this year as well, because of all the extra work the pandemic caused?

No about in line with inflation

biggles

Farooq said:

londonpubman said:

Inflation = huge problem

Not all workers or pensioners getting increases in line with inflation. Even those who do will pay tax at their highest rate on the increase so will be worse off in real terms

People's hard worked for savings being eroded

Bank of England doesn't seem bothered, no monetary policy control applied

People associate inflation with Labour and will think 'may as well vote for the real thing'!

😡😡😡😡😡

They do?

Yeah I wondered. I associate inflation with the 80s/90s Tory Government. Maybe it’s an age thing.

TimT

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

I have a lot of sympathy with teachers (my father was one, and in a way, I am too) and they most certainly should earn a decent living and pension. But that is simply a ridiculous comment. If you wanted loads of money, you shouldn't have become a teacher.

ydoethur

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

They didn't try that on with Civil Servants - I got no pay rise last year, but no effect on the pension. But I suspect with teachers that means those who have reached the maximum of a pay scale.

It does. Which has a personal resonance for me as that's where I am.

Instructive that it didn't affect Civil Servants. Can I send that on to my union as that could be the basis for a legal challenge?

MoonRabbit

JosiasJessop said:

Leon said:

‘Russian economy will shrink by 30% in a year’

https://www.cityam.com/russian-economy-to-lose-nearly-third-of-its-value/

That must be almost unprecedented

Surprised it won't be more, IMO.

(as ever, IANAE)

And then there is black market isn’t there? That 30% replaced by invisible 30%?

Except maybe not for social media influencers. Gosh I feel so sorry for them bawling their eyes out… NOT! 😈

biggles

HYUFD said:

biggles said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

and MPs?

Also worth nothing he still doesn’t understand why it’s silly to compare them to the “average worker”.

Why? The average teacher in the average comprehensive does not have qualifications vastly higher than the average worker

Go away and look into how an average is calculated. Then look at the requirements to be a qualified teacher.

Edit - and I’m not even a great supporter of teachers wanting boosted pay!

Leon

MoonRabbit said:

JosiasJessop said:

Leon said:

‘Russian economy will shrink by 30% in a year’

https://www.cityam.com/russian-economy-to-lose-nearly-third-of-its-value/

That must be almost unprecedented

Surprised it won't be more, IMO.

(as ever, IANAE)

And then there is black market isn’t there? That 30% replaced by invisible 30%?

Except maybe not for social media influencers. Gosh I feel so sorry for them bawling their eyes out… NOT! 😈

Russia’s lost GDP is not going to be replaced by “the black market”

Putin is, in effect, inflicting damage on his economy equivalent to the wreckage from a world war. That chart says Belgium shrank by 32% from 1914-18

And he’s doing it in one single year, if that prediction pans out

biggles

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

They didn't try that on with Civil Servants - I got no pay rise last year, but no effect on the pension. But I suspect with teachers that means those who have reached the maximum of a pay scale.

It does. Which has a personal resonance for me as that's where I am.

Instructive that it didn't affect Civil Servants. Can I send that on to my union as that could be the basis for a legal challenge?

In most Departments in the CS it is the same at the top of the pay scale. A small non-consolidated payment.

ydoethur

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers standing for parliament either, indeed a number do but unless you are in a safe seat generally less job security

Nothing stopping the "average Britain" from becoming a teacher either.

You attempted the lazy "stop complaining" argument and I was happy to counter it.

I believe we have some teachers on here. They have decided to become teachers which places them above some occupations and below others on the remunerative front. They have presumably decided that the benefits of being a teacher (imparting wisdom to the next generation, longer blocks of holidays, whatever else) are compensation enough for them not to seek other avenues of employment.

If they are so unhappy being teachers then they can leave and become investment bankers or MPs or flint knappers or sit and tend their gardens.

Or of course they can continue to be teachers and whinge like fuck about it on PB.

Or of course you could leave PB and not have to read any comments I make criticising your friends in the government and their fraud and criminality.

This would have the further benefit you would no longer bore us with your pushing of Russian propaganda.

biggles

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

TOPPING said:

Gallowgate said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

JohnLilburne said:

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

ydoethur said:

Gallowgate said:

Payrise season is coming up also

Unless you're a teacher, in which case it's 'real terms pay freeze and massive cut in your pension.'

While the DfE buy cheap booze and party illegally. And get away with it.

This is not being well received, oddly.

New teachers got a 5.5% payrise in 2020 and of course teachers still get better pensions than the average worker

You may not have noticed, but the majority of teachers are not new teachers.

And removing the index linking by stealth doesn't even guarantee the second part of your sentence is true.

What are they doing to the pension? The Civil Service scheme is now a career average scheme, with an NRA of State Pension Age, but they've maintained the index linking. And everyone got to keep accrued benefits of course.

They have declared that there is to be no index linking for anyone who didn't get a pay rise this year. They also refused a nominal £1 pay rise to resolve the situation on the grounds 'this would not be an appropriate use of public money.'

They apparently said that without irony, which given the ways they are using public money, often illegally, is even more shocking.

Officially the removal is for this year only, but given they are on their own admission criminals I don't trust them not to find a way to extend it.

Average teacher pension though still equates to £30,000 a year compared to the average British pension of only £21,000 a year

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/teachers-pension-scheme-protected-to-ensure-it-remains-among-most-lucrative

https://www.wealthadviser.co/2021/05/26/300889/average-uk-expected-retirement-income-gbp1k-year

How does it compare to the pension of investment bankers?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming investment bankers who are not, as far as I'm aware, paid for by the state.

OK - how does it compare to the pension of MPs?

Nothing to stop teachers becoming MPs, if that is the pension they want.

So then why did @HYUFD make the stupid comparison in the first place?

It is not stupid, the point remains teachers get a good pension compared to the average worker

and MPs?

Didn't they have an enormous pay rise this year as well, because of all the extra work the pandemic caused?

No about in line with inflation

MPs deserve inflation matching pay rises but other public sector workers don’t? Gotcha.

londonpubman

biggles said:

Farooq said:

londonpubman said:

Inflation = huge problem

Not all workers or pensioners getting increases in line with inflation. Even those who do will pay tax at their highest rate on the increase so will be worse off in real terms

People's hard worked for savings being eroded

Bank of England doesn't seem bothered, no monetary policy control applied

People associate inflation with Labour and will think 'may as well vote for the real thing'!

😡😡😡😡😡

They do?

Yeah I wondered. I associate inflation with the 80s/90s Tory Government. Maybe it’s an age thing.

Maybe it is an age thing!

That being said I am not sure CPI got to 5.4% at any time from 1997 to 2010.

It (ok RPI, no CPI then) certainly did 1974 to 1979!