Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

It is now evens that Johnson will survive 2022 – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,049
edited March 2022 in General
imageIt is now evens that Johnson will survive 2022 – politicalbetting.com

Read the full story here

«1345

Comments

  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202
    edited February 2022
    Well that’s just wrong 🙂

    image
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,551
    edited February 2022
    Guardian suggesting tonight that Johnson due to his legal representation will avoid an FPN but the minions might not.

    Suggestions that repondees have completed the forms with "no comment" to avoid prejudicing themselves.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,018
    Betting on nothing happening looks to have been a good bet once again.
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,625

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,362
    There were no parties.

    Oh, wait...

    Johnson tells ministers he wants to give his side of story over parties https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/feb/23/johnson-parties-met-investigation?utm_term=Autofeed&CMP=twt_gu&utm_medium&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1645644006
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202
    Taz said:

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
    He’s like gone by yesterday already. 😊
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,320
    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,023
    I don’t think Johnson is clear. He keeps making mistake after mistake. Look at his latest response to Ukraine.

    ..I’m also in a weird state of disbelief that we could be on the verge of a major conflict on the continent. There’s absolutely no way that this doesn’t spill over into neighbouring countries (particularly Baltics). If Putin invades then all bets are off what he does next,

    But oh well. Not our problem (according to some)
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,625

    Guardian suggesting tonight that Johnson due to his legal representation will avoid an FPN but the minions might not

    That looks even worse for Johnson. His minions get an FPN and he gets nothing. It seems, whether it is or not is moot, unfair.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,018

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Nah, we'll get our state pensions.

    My civil service pension on the other hand...
  • FPT:
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    They can absolutely categorically fuck off

    An @theipaper exclusive: The salary threshold at which graduates start repaying their student loans is set to drop from £27,295 a year to £25,000. Universities are also expecting repayment term to go from 30 to 40 years

    https://twitter.com/whazell/status/1496460151796256769?s=21

    There was a debate about serfdom in Russia early this morning.

    Seems we are intent on bringing it back to the UK.
    In addition to the ever-ageing population, the Covid debt burden and everything else we already have to pay for, it looks increasingly likely that the British state is going to have to find the funds to hugely increase the defence budget, and rehome its fair share of the millions of Ukrainian refugees liable to be driven westwards by a Russian conquest.

    The Government's plan to tax the absolute crap out of the working age population whilst leaving the elderly, with their inflation-busting pension increases and their enormous property wealth, almost untouched (a one year only suspension of the triple lock excepted) is going to be tested to destruction over the coming years.
    The Government does not need to massively increase defence spending. Poland and the Baltic States will but Putin would have to get through France and Germany before he got to us and we have nuclear weapons and are already spending the required sum NATO wants of its members. Most of the Ukrainian refugees can be housed in neighbouring states and many will prefer to fight than flee.

    The young will get more of an inheritance once they reach middle age then any generation before them and inheritance and property ownership are key Tory principles so obviously a Tory government wants to keep taxes on both low. There has also been no rise in income tax under this government and as you say pensioners have seem the triple lock suspended in breach of the Tory manifesto, as tough a decision post Covid as the NI rise to refund the extra funds the NHS needed
    It is worth noting that a flood of refugees coming to the UK to avoid the war would push up house prices, and mean inheritances are maximized.
    How much do Ukrainian plumbers charge?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,551
    Taz said:

    Guardian suggesting tonight that Johnson due to his legal representation will avoid an FPN but the minions might not

    That looks even worse for Johnson. His minions get an FPN and he gets nothing. It seems, whether it is or not is moot, unfair.
    Johnson will view no FPN as a vindication of his behaviour, a confirmation of innocence.

    My lapdog Conservative MP will agree.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Taz said:

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
    He’s like gone by yesterday already. 😊
    He is history

    Boris who?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,440
    edited February 2022

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Hmm I can't see how you won't get one. An alternative to NI (Yes I know it doesn't actually fund your pension) would need announcing.
    I think what is more likely to happen is the triple lock ends and age requirements head north at some point with our good friend inflation wittling the pension downward over time.
    If it was held flat till your retirement and inflation ran at 4% for the next 40 years it'd be worth £41 a week in today's money.
  • https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1496549310518988805

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 42% (+2)
    CON: 35% (-)
    LDEM: 9% (-1)
    GRN: 3% (-)

    via
    @Survation
    , 17 - 21 Feb
    Chgs. w/ 25 Jan

    SKS fans please explain?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 47,761

    FPT:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    pigeon said:

    They can absolutely categorically fuck off

    An @theipaper exclusive: The salary threshold at which graduates start repaying their student loans is set to drop from £27,295 a year to £25,000. Universities are also expecting repayment term to go from 30 to 40 years

    https://twitter.com/whazell/status/1496460151796256769?s=21

    There was a debate about serfdom in Russia early this morning.

    Seems we are intent on bringing it back to the UK.
    In addition to the ever-ageing population, the Covid debt burden and everything else we already have to pay for, it looks increasingly likely that the British state is going to have to find the funds to hugely increase the defence budget, and rehome its fair share of the millions of Ukrainian refugees liable to be driven westwards by a Russian conquest.

    The Government's plan to tax the absolute crap out of the working age population whilst leaving the elderly, with their inflation-busting pension increases and their enormous property wealth, almost untouched (a one year only suspension of the triple lock excepted) is going to be tested to destruction over the coming years.
    The Government does not need to massively increase defence spending. Poland and the Baltic States will but Putin would have to get through France and Germany before he got to us and we have nuclear weapons and are already spending the required sum NATO wants of its members. Most of the Ukrainian refugees can be housed in neighbouring states and many will prefer to fight than flee.

    The young will get more of an inheritance once they reach middle age then any generation before them and inheritance and property ownership are key Tory principles so obviously a Tory government wants to keep taxes on both low. There has also been no rise in income tax under this government and as you say pensioners have seem the triple lock suspended in breach of the Tory manifesto, as tough a decision post Covid as the NI rise to refund the extra funds the NHS needed
    It is worth noting that a flood of refugees coming to the UK to avoid the war would push up house prices, and mean inheritances are maximized.
    How much do Ukrainian plumbers charge?
    Good value, I think. Poland is full of them, undercutting the locals.
  • Statement from the Ukrainian FM- The entire night shift of Titan chemicals plant in Armyansk [Crimea] evacuated from the facility. This might be a preparation for another staged provocation by Russia. Moscow seems to have no limits in attempts to falsify pretexts for further aggression.

    https://twitter.com/osinttechnical/status/1496581666676031498?s=21
  • https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1496549310518988805

    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 42% (+2)
    CON: 35% (-)
    LDEM: 9% (-1)
    GRN: 3% (-)

    via
    @Survation
    , 17 - 21 Feb
    Chgs. w/ 25 Jan

    SKS fans please explain?

    @bigjohnowls please explain
    @HYUFD please explain
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,625

    Taz said:

    Guardian suggesting tonight that Johnson due to his legal representation will avoid an FPN but the minions might not

    That looks even worse for Johnson. His minions get an FPN and he gets nothing. It seems, whether it is or not is moot, unfair.
    Johnson will view no FPN as a vindication of his behaviour, a confirmation of innocence.

    My lapdog Conservative MP will agree.
    I’m afraid I think you’re right.

  • Taz said:

    Guardian suggesting tonight that Johnson due to his legal representation will avoid an FPN but the minions might not

    That looks even worse for Johnson. His minions get an FPN and he gets nothing. It seems, whether it is or not is moot, unfair.
    It seems unfair because it would be unfair.

    But if life were fair, the only reason we would know about Boris Johnson would be his appearence on a "cheating love rat" sequence on the Jeremy Kyle show, where he got roundly booed.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,910

    Guardian suggesting tonight that Johnson due to his legal representation will avoid an FPN but the minions might not.

    Suggestions that repondees have completed the forms with "no comment" to avoid prejudicing themselves.

    As is their right, as it would be in an interview. Let the plod prove it.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,987
    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    Why would we need to beg? We're allies in this, why wouldn't they just tell us what they decide?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,576
    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    Almost all of them members of the state Duma, who are pretty irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,551
    IshmaelZ said:

    Taz said:

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
    He’s like gone by yesterday already. 😊
    He is history

    Boris who?
    Might be a good moment to revert to his real name, which although of Russian heritage, is less exclusively so than Boris.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,910

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Live fast and die young?
    To be honest planning for your retirement based on your private pension(s) and getting any state pension as a bonus is not a bad plan at your age.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,165
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Guardian suggesting tonight that Johnson due to his legal representation will avoid an FPN but the minions might not

    That looks even worse for Johnson. His minions get an FPN and he gets nothing. It seems, whether it is or not is moot, unfair.
    Johnson will view no FPN as a vindication of his behaviour, a confirmation of innocence.

    My lapdog Conservative MP will agree.
    I’m afraid I think you’re right.

    I agree. But I think the public will generally view it with disgust.

    Boris is toast, the only question is whether he goes earlier (now looking unlikely) or later.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,369
    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    Paraguay could sanction 10,000 Russians - it doesn’t matter how many if they don’t have assets affected or it’s minor assets.

    So would you lay out for us how many of those 378 Russians will be majorly affected because if they have very little to lose it’s of fuck all use sanctioning whereas hitting two or three big players where it hurts will have more effect.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    It is not just a numbers game.
    Who are the 378? Are they good targets?
    Not defending UK or criticising EU, just pointing out that the numbers are meaningless if there are 377 nonentity or untouchable people on the list.
    A headline yes, but only a dork believes those without substantiating the facts behind them.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,320

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Live fast and die young?
    To be honest planning for your retirement based on your private pension(s) and getting any state pension as a bonus is not a bad plan at your age.
    Nah, just expecting to never retire to be honest
  • Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    Putin's party "United Russia" are fellow right-wingers.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,165
    philiph said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    It is not just a numbers game.
    Who are the 378? Are they good targets?
    Not defending UK or criticising EU, just pointing out that the numbers are meaningless if there are 377 nonentity or untouchable people on the list.
    A headline yes, but only a dork believes those without substantiating the facts behind them.
    I confess I have not looked into this closely, but I do find it interesting that Boris and Liz’s sanctions have attracted criticism far beyond the usual suspects, left and right.
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,625

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Live fast and die young?
    To be honest planning for your retirement based on your private pension(s) and getting any state pension as a bonus is not a bad plan at your age.
    I’m Gen X and that’s what I’ve done.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,052
    If Boris keeps the Labour lead closer to 5% than 10% and avoids massive losses in the May local elections he will survive past this year. If he doesn't, he won't
  • HYUFD said:

    If Boris keeps the Labour lead closer to 5% than 10% and avoids massive losses in the May local elections he will survive past this year. If he doesn't, he won't

    Two months and 17 days since the last Tory poll lead.

    (Redfield & Wilton, 6th December)
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704

    philiph said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    It is not just a numbers game.
    Who are the 378? Are they good targets?
    Not defending UK or criticising EU, just pointing out that the numbers are meaningless if there are 377 nonentity or untouchable people on the list.
    A headline yes, but only a dork believes those without substantiating the facts behind them.
    I confess I have not looked into this closely, but I do find it interesting that Boris and Liz’s sanctions have attracted criticism far beyond the usual suspects, left and right.
    And I agree the sanction given seem mild.
    I hope there is naferious activity in the unseen arena of the cyber world among other action.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Live fast and die young?
    To be honest planning for your retirement based on your private pension(s) and getting any state pension as a bonus is not a bad plan at your age.
    The key is to bet big when the Lib Dem Landslide comes...
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,379

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Live fast and die young?
    To be honest planning for your retirement based on your private pension(s) and getting any state pension as a bonus is not a bad plan at your age.
    Nah, just expecting to never retire to be honest
    You don't have to retire to receive a state pension.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,023
    HYUFD said:

    If Boris keeps the Labour lead closer to 5% than 10% and avoids massive losses in the May local elections he will survive past this year. If he doesn't, he won't

    If he keeps it close to 5% - and heads into an election, Labour will win by a margin of 10%. Mark this post
  • Here we go, this is what we were watching for.
    “The heads of the DPR and LPR asked Putin to help repel the aggression of the Ukrainian Armed Forces in order to avoid civilian casualties and a humanitarian disaster in the Donbass, Peskov said” -RIA


    https://twitter.com/NotWoofers/status/1496587843388510217?
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    The best sanction would be to trace and locate all the assets of V Putin esq.
    Having done so sequestrate every one of them, making loud and public announcements of how many billions of his ill-gotten gains have been seized.
    Do wonders for his popularity in Russia. Some of his loot could even be promised to retutn to the Russian people post Putin.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,332

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    So you think that the next generation of young workers will be less shat upon than your generation? Has to stop sometime I guess.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,320
    DavidL said:

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    So you think that the next generation of young workers will be less shat upon than your generation? Has to stop sometime I guess.
    I hope so!
  • IshmaelZ said:

    Taz said:

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
    He’s like gone by yesterday already. 😊
    He is history

    Boris who?
    Might be a good moment to revert to his real name, which although of Russian heritage, is less exclusively so than Boris.
    Alexander is Greek, and Boris is Bulgar, so Turkic (not modern Bulgarian, which is Slavic, but the language of the early medieval Bulgar Khanate)
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,080

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Maybe in your personal circumstances (!!), but generally it will be found that continually people both get old and vote in quite large numbers so that it is not easy to spot when will be the politically convenient time to announce that the era of the five shilling Lloyd George pension (now about £175 a week) has come to a close.

    This useful pocket money will fund a very modest bottle of champagne daily, though nothing else.

  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,611
    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    You seem to have an unhealthy inferiority complex.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,332
    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,052

    HYUFD said:

    If Boris keeps the Labour lead closer to 5% than 10% and avoids massive losses in the May local elections he will survive past this year. If he doesn't, he won't

    If he keeps it close to 5% - and heads into an election, Labour will win by a margin of 10%. Mark this post
    Which even then would still not be enough for a Labour majority on the new boundaries
  • Here we go, this is what we were watching for.
    “The heads of the DPR and LPR asked Putin to help repel the aggression of the Ukrainian Armed Forces in order to avoid civilian casualties and a humanitarian disaster in the Donbass, Peskov said” -RIA


    https://twitter.com/NotWoofers/status/1496587843388510217?

    So they're not even going to bother to stage a false flag operation.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,611
    philiph said:

    The best sanction would be to trace and locate all the assets of V Putin esq.

    Track and trace? That sounds like a job for Dido Harding.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,320
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    If Boris keeps the Labour lead closer to 5% than 10% and avoids massive losses in the May local elections he will survive past this year. If he doesn't, he won't

    If he keeps it close to 5% - and heads into an election, Labour will win by a margin of 10%. Mark this post
    Which even then would still not be enough for a Labour majority on the new boundaries
    Assuming uniform swing
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,362
    DavidL said:

    It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.

    I would rather we were not an International laughing stock

    I can't imagine why you don't care
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,429

    Here we go, this is what we were watching for.
    “The heads of the DPR and LPR asked Putin to help repel the aggression of the Ukrainian Armed Forces in order to avoid civilian casualties and a humanitarian disaster in the Donbass, Peskov said” -RIA


    https://twitter.com/NotWoofers/status/1496587843388510217?

    So they're not even going to bother to stage a false flag operation.
    From other sources, it seems that the Ukrainians refused to commit atrocities - the scoundrels - so poor ol' Putin has had to play lets pretend.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,215
    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1496133062295437313.html

    From Konstantin Kisin on Twitter

    "The reason NATO is expanding eastwards is the desperation of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania and other countries in the region to secure themselves against inevitable Russian aggression. They too have Russian-speaking minorities who can be weaponised against them. They too were part of the Soviet empire after being invaded and annexed by Stalin while Europe was busy with Hitler.

    The people in these countries understand something very few Westerners do: Russia is not a bear to be pacified. Russia is a hungry wolf who cares not one bit about your protestations, your pathetic sanctions or your naïve appeals to morality.

    The crisis in Ukraine is a symptom of a far bigger problem, one about which I have been warning for some time: the West is divided, distracted and weak. A terrible pandemic has ravaged the minds of Western elites for decades, turning us into a self-loathing, nihilistic people whose main preoccupation is self-flagellating while hypnotically reciting the wrongs of our past...

    While here in the West we talk endlessly about equality, diversity and social justice, in the rest of the world, things are much simpler. People respect strength and despise weakness. "



  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,517
    Bored, lying on a bed in hospital waiting to be seen with one possible broken ankle and broken bone in the other foot. What a Pillock. Hope I don't miss the PB event.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 27,551

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    You seem to have an unhealthy inferiority complex.
    Scott (and I guess myself) are on the wrong side of history. Unlike yourself who saw the damascene light and came over from the dark side.

    Praise be!
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,478
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,611
    Scott_xP said:

    DavidL said:

    It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.

    I would rather we were not an International laughing stock

    I can't imagine why you don't care
    99% of our status as a so-called international laughing stock is just the self-flaggelation of unreconciled Remainers being reflected back at them. You just need to break out of the vicious cycle you're in and stop feeling personally diminished by every bad-faith negative comment.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,018
    kjh said:

    Bored, lying on a bed in hospital waiting to be seen with one possible broken ankle and broken bone in the other foot. What a Pillock. Hope I don't miss the PB event.

    Oh dear, dare I ask what you did to sustain such injuries?

    Don't beat yourself up, we all make mistakes!
  • Interesting by election in Spelthorne tonight (a Wednesday by election!) caused by a resignation of a Tory cllr.

    It is the only area of Spelthorne to elect Labour cllrs in recent times so I would make Lab marginal favourites to gain it.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,517
    tlg86 said:

    kjh said:

    Bored, lying on a bed in hospital waiting to be seen with one possible broken ankle and broken bone in the other foot. What a Pillock. Hope I don't miss the PB event.

    Oh dear, dare I ask what you did to sustain such injuries?

    Don't beat yourself up, we all make mistakes!
    Inability to walk like a normal human being.
  • DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 47,761
    Bloody hell. Panorama on the Shropshire maternity scandal is grim.

    Not unique either with similar scandals in Morecombe Bay, Nottingham, Essex.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,478
    kjh said:

    tlg86 said:

    kjh said:

    Bored, lying on a bed in hospital waiting to be seen with one possible broken ankle and broken bone in the other foot. What a Pillock. Hope I don't miss the PB event.

    Oh dear, dare I ask what you did to sustain such injuries?

    Don't beat yourself up, we all make mistakes!
    Inability to walk like a normal human being.
    Hope you feel better soon!
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,215

    @Pulpstar I have no expectations of receiving a state pension

    Live fast and die young?
    To be honest planning for your retirement based on your private pension(s) and getting any state pension as a bonus is not a bad plan at your age.
    I am about 85% sure that I will get a state pension.
    The final salary public sector pension I built up over about 13 years is about a 75% chance.
    I am now saving for a private pension as diversifying can't be a bad thing.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,478

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
    You think the repeated Russian aggression is our fault? You think we caused Salisbury?
  • Scott_xP said:

    DavidL said:

    It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.

    I would rather we were not an International laughing stock

    I can't imagine why you don't care
    99% of our status as a so-called international laughing stock is just the self-flaggelation of unreconciled Remainers being reflected back at them. You just need to break out of the vicious cycle you're in and stop feeling personally diminished by every bad-faith negative comment.
    Rubbish

  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,813
    My supposition is that the state pension will continue to exist into the far future and will also continue to be uprated at least in line with inflation. The Government daren't shit on existing pensioners, so the only safety valve to try to do something about the cost, and forestall the collapse of the working age population under the huge burden of tax needed to fund the care and ease of pensioners, is to keep ramping the state retirement age. I doubt that a young person in their late teens or early twenties entering the workforce today will get their state handout until at least age 75 and possibly not until they're 80.

    The consequence of this is that young people from well-to-do families who can look forward to inheriting property wealth will become reliant on that to themselves retire at an acceptable age. Those who are not, unless they are exceptionally successful in their working lives, will largely work until they die, or work until they're too sick or disabled to keep going.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,332

    philiph said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    It is not just a numbers game.
    Who are the 378? Are they good targets?
    Not defending UK or criticising EU, just pointing out that the numbers are meaningless if there are 377 nonentity or untouchable people on the list.
    A headline yes, but only a dork believes those without substantiating the facts behind them.
    I confess I have not looked into this closely, but I do find it interesting that Boris and Liz’s sanctions have attracted criticism far beyond the usual suspects, left and right.
    They miscalled it. Wanted to leave something in the locker for the next outrage but got the balance wrong. Of course it has made no difference whatsoever to that psychopathic loon in the Kremlin.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202
    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    Sgt Wilson voice - Hello? Hello is that Berlin? Would you mind please faxing your list over to London, it appears we don’t know how to do this. We are awfully obliged. Thank you.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,847
    edited February 2022

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
    You think the repeated Russian aggression is our fault? You think we caused Salisbury?
    I think there's a catalogue of western failures that made Putin, a man whose background inclined to autocracy, revert away from his very pro-Western stance after 9-11, back to the familiar. Those are legal ; Iraq, economic ; the long after-effects of the early 1990s ; and strategic ; going back on original verbal assurances of not expanding NATO to Ukraine.

    We are where we are, and he's gradually become more unhinged and pathologically anti-Western over time now, on his own track. We should be looking at the absolute maximum economic sanctions, and heavily reinforcing a whole line from the Baltics to Greece.
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    darkage said:

    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1496133062295437313.html

    From Konstantin Kisin on Twitter

    "The reason NATO is expanding eastwards is the desperation of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania and other countries in the region to secure themselves against inevitable Russian aggression. They too have Russian-speaking minorities who can be weaponised against them. They too were part of the Soviet empire after being invaded and annexed by Stalin while Europe was busy with Hitler.

    The people in these countries understand something very few Westerners do: Russia is not a bear to be pacified. Russia is a hungry wolf who cares not one bit about your protestations, your pathetic sanctions or your naïve appeals to morality.

    The crisis in Ukraine is a symptom of a far bigger problem, one about which I have been warning for some time: the West is divided, distracted and weak. A terrible pandemic has ravaged the minds of Western elites for decades, turning us into a self-loathing, nihilistic people whose main preoccupation is self-flagellating while hypnotically reciting the wrongs of our past...

    While here in the West we talk endlessly about equality, diversity and social justice, in the rest of the world, things are much simpler. People respect strength and despise weakness. "



    I actually think that's quite a lenient description of the governments of the West and their policies since the fall of the blessed Lady Margaret (PBUH) and Ronald Reagan.

  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    IshmaelZ said:

    Taz said:

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
    He’s like gone by yesterday already. 😊
    He is history

    Boris who?
    Might be a good moment to revert to his real name, which although of Russian heritage, is less exclusively so than Boris.
    However you slice it, it's just not Godunov.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,478
    Foxy said:

    Bloody hell. Panorama on the Shropshire maternity scandal is grim.

    Not unique either with similar scandals in Morecombe Bay, Nottingham, Essex.

    There will always be failures in an organisation the size of the NHS. What matters is recognising those failures as quickly as possible, correcting them, and spreading lessons around the organisation.

    Too many within and without the NHS have been historically unwilling to accept that there are failures, and instead institute a CYA approach. Or even blaming the messenger: witness Stafford.

    Much of the NHS is glorious and worthy of praise. But some of the NHS is like the worst private companies: unwilling to accept blame or make progress.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,362

    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    Putin should be opposed with every available weapon in our arsenal, marshalled by competent leadership prepared to do what it takes.

    Instead we have a fucking clown and a tribute act who even if they knew what to do are unwilling to do it, and appear to be compromised.

    BoZo and Truss are making it easier for Putin.

    So which side are you on?

    Do you want us helping Putin, or do you want us to have a leader, not a liar?
  • Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    Sgt Wilson voice - Hello? Hello is that Berlin? Would you mind please faxing your list over to London, it appears we don’t know how to do this. We are awfully obliged. Thank you.
    "Your name vill also go on ze list! Vot is it?"
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,332

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
    You think the repeated Russian aggression is our fault? You think we caused Salisbury?
    I think there's a catalogue of western failures that made Putin, a man whose background inclined to autocracy, revert away from his very pro-Western stance after 9-11, to the familiar. Those are legal ; Iraq, economic ; the early 1990s ; and strategic ; going back on original verbal assurances of not expanding NATO to Ukraine.

    We are where we are now, and he's gradually more unhinged and anti-Western. We should be looking at the absolute maximum economic sanctions, and heavily reinforcing a whole line from the baltics to Greece.
    I have increasingly come to the view we should be marching towards the guns. Sanctions are not going to stop him. Never were.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 47,761

    Foxy said:

    Bloody hell. Panorama on the Shropshire maternity scandal is grim.

    Not unique either with similar scandals in Morecombe Bay, Nottingham, Essex.

    There will always be failures in an organisation the size of the NHS. What matters is recognising those failures as quickly as possible, correcting them, and spreading lessons around the organisation.

    Too many within and without the NHS have been historically unwilling to accept that there are failures, and instead institute a CYA approach. Or even blaming the messenger: witness Stafford.

    Much of the NHS is glorious and worthy of praise. But some of the NHS is like the worst private companies: unwilling to accept blame or make progress.
    This went on for years and years. Maternity seems to be particularly prone to it.
  • IshmaelZ said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Taz said:

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
    He’s like gone by yesterday already. 😊
    He is history

    Boris who?
    Might be a good moment to revert to his real name, which although of Russian heritage, is less exclusively so than Boris.
    However you slice it, it's just not Godunov.
    You are taking the Mikoyan.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,165
    DavidL said:

    philiph said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    It is not just a numbers game.
    Who are the 378? Are they good targets?
    Not defending UK or criticising EU, just pointing out that the numbers are meaningless if there are 377 nonentity or untouchable people on the list.
    A headline yes, but only a dork believes those without substantiating the facts behind them.
    I confess I have not looked into this closely, but I do find it interesting that Boris and Liz’s sanctions have attracted criticism far beyond the usual suspects, left and right.
    They miscalled it. Wanted to leave something in the locker for the next outrage but got the balance wrong. Of course it has made no difference whatsoever to that psychopathic loon in the Kremlin.
    Well it looks like Boris and Liz will have the opportunity for a “do-over”, if reports of an invasion proper tonight prove true.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704

    Scott_xP said:

    DavidL said:

    It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.

    I would rather we were not an International laughing stock

    I can't imagine why you don't care
    99% of our status as a so-called international laughing stock is just the self-flaggelation of unreconciled Remainers being reflected back at them. You just need to break out of the vicious cycle you're in and stop feeling personally diminished by every bad-faith negative comment.
    Rubbish

    Yes, it is that as well
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,440
    Ken Livingstone watches RT every day. Never seen any proapaganda or lies on it..
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,332

    DavidL said:

    philiph said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    It is not just a numbers game.
    Who are the 378? Are they good targets?
    Not defending UK or criticising EU, just pointing out that the numbers are meaningless if there are 377 nonentity or untouchable people on the list.
    A headline yes, but only a dork believes those without substantiating the facts behind them.
    I confess I have not looked into this closely, but I do find it interesting that Boris and Liz’s sanctions have attracted criticism far beyond the usual suspects, left and right.
    They miscalled it. Wanted to leave something in the locker for the next outrage but got the balance wrong. Of course it has made no difference whatsoever to that psychopathic loon in the Kremlin.
    Well it looks like Boris and Liz will have the opportunity for a “do-over”, if reports of an invasion proper tonight prove true.
    Yes they will. And it will still make no difference.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 4,769
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    The other point is that 351 of the 378 people the EU sanctioned were Duma deputies who voted for the motion to recognise the two republics - totally pointless gesture politics as they rubber-stamp whatever Putin tells them to do and few of them have any significant overseas interests or assets.

    Sending the Ukranians missiles and other munitions, otoh, is not a gesture or a global joke. Nor, in fairness to Germany, is blocking that pipeline.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202

    IshmaelZ said:

    Taz said:

    Well that’s just wrong 🙂


    So is it value betting against ?
    He’s like gone by yesterday already. 😊
    He is history

    Boris who?
    Might be a good moment to revert to his real name, which although of Russian heritage, is less exclusively so than Boris.
    I’m wrong again. I thought he was Turkish and this a belly dance

    image
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,478

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
    You think the repeated Russian aggression is our fault? You think we caused Salisbury?
    I think there's a catalogue of western failures that made Putin, a man whose background inclined to autocracy, revert away from his very pro-Western stance after 9-11, to the familiar. Those are legal ; Iraq, economic ; the early 1990s ; and strategic ; going back on original verbal assurances of not expanding NATO to Ukraine.

    We are where we are now, and he's gradually become more unhinged and anti-Western on his own track. We should be looking at the absolute maximum economic sanctions, and heavily reinforcing a whole line from the Baltics to Greece.
    Ah, so you are a 'blame us' person.

    The fault here lies in Putin. A bad actor can always find excuses for their bad behaviour. A practiced bad actor will always get fools to make the excuses for him.

    Putin was not forced to invade Georgia. He was not forced to kill Litvinenko. He was not forced to kill or jail hundreds of journalists. He was not forced to take Crimea. He was not forced to do the Salisbury poisonings. He is not being forced to attack Ukraine.

    He is evil. Whatever we did, he would find excuses for his actions.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 47,761
    MISTY said:

    darkage said:

    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1496133062295437313.html

    From Konstantin Kisin on Twitter

    "The reason NATO is expanding eastwards is the desperation of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania and other countries in the region to secure themselves against inevitable Russian aggression. They too have Russian-speaking minorities who can be weaponised against them. They too were part of the Soviet empire after being invaded and annexed by Stalin while Europe was busy with Hitler.

    The people in these countries understand something very few Westerners do: Russia is not a bear to be pacified. Russia is a hungry wolf who cares not one bit about your protestations, your pathetic sanctions or your naïve appeals to morality.

    The crisis in Ukraine is a symptom of a far bigger problem, one about which I have been warning for some time: the West is divided, distracted and weak. A terrible pandemic has ravaged the minds of Western elites for decades, turning us into a self-loathing, nihilistic people whose main preoccupation is self-flagellating while hypnotically reciting the wrongs of our past...

    While here in the West we talk endlessly about equality, diversity and social justice, in the rest of the world, things are much simpler. People respect strength and despise weakness. "



    I actually think that's quite a lenient description of the governments of the West and their policies since the fall of the blessed Lady Margaret (PBUH) and Ronald Reagan.

    Yet it is the Wokefinders on the hard right that are the biggest apologists for Putin. Farage, Banks, Hitchins, Trump etc.
  • DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
    You think the repeated Russian aggression is our fault? You think we caused Salisbury?
    I think there's a catalogue of western failures that made Putin, a man whose background inclined to autocracy, revert away from his very pro-Western stance after 9-11, to the familiar. Those are legal ; Iraq, economic ; the early 1990s ; and strategic ; going back on original verbal assurances of not expanding NATO to Ukraine.

    We are where we are now, and he's gradually become more unhinged and anti-Western on his own track. We should be looking at the absolute maximum economic sanctions, and heavily reinforcing a whole line from the Baltics to Greece.
    Ah, so you are a 'blame us' person.

    The fault here lies in Putin. A bad actor can always find excuses for their bad behaviour. A practiced bad actor will always get fools to make the excuses for him.

    Putin was not forced to invade Georgia. He was not forced to kill Litvinenko. He was not forced to kill or jail hundreds of journalists. He was not forced to take Crimea. He was not forced to do the Salisbury poisonings. He is not being forced to attack Ukraine.

    He is evil. Whatever we did, he would find excuses for his actions.
    Life is not black and white.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,576

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    Sgt Wilson voice - Hello? Hello is that Berlin? Would you mind please faxing your list over to London, it appears we don’t know how to do this. We are awfully obliged. Thank you.
    The extras are just members of the Russian parliament. Almost irrelevant.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,332
    darkage said:

    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1496133062295437313.html

    From Konstantin Kisin on Twitter

    "The reason NATO is expanding eastwards is the desperation of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania and other countries in the region to secure themselves against inevitable Russian aggression. They too have Russian-speaking minorities who can be weaponised against them. They too were part of the Soviet empire after being invaded and annexed by Stalin while Europe was busy with Hitler.

    The people in these countries understand something very few Westerners do: Russia is not a bear to be pacified. Russia is a hungry wolf who cares not one bit about your protestations, your pathetic sanctions or your naïve appeals to morality.

    The crisis in Ukraine is a symptom of a far bigger problem, one about which I have been warning for some time: the West is divided, distracted and weak. A terrible pandemic has ravaged the minds of Western elites for decades, turning us into a self-loathing, nihilistic people whose main preoccupation is self-flagellating while hypnotically reciting the wrongs of our past...

    While here in the West we talk endlessly about equality, diversity and social justice, in the rest of the world, things are much simpler. People respect strength and despise weakness. "



    So where the F are they? Why are the Ukraine’s trenches not filling up with units from all these states that fear Russia and its demented ways?
  • Foxy said:

    MISTY said:

    darkage said:

    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1496133062295437313.html

    From Konstantin Kisin on Twitter

    "The reason NATO is expanding eastwards is the desperation of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania and other countries in the region to secure themselves against inevitable Russian aggression. They too have Russian-speaking minorities who can be weaponised against them. They too were part of the Soviet empire after being invaded and annexed by Stalin while Europe was busy with Hitler.

    The people in these countries understand something very few Westerners do: Russia is not a bear to be pacified. Russia is a hungry wolf who cares not one bit about your protestations, your pathetic sanctions or your naïve appeals to morality.

    The crisis in Ukraine is a symptom of a far bigger problem, one about which I have been warning for some time: the West is divided, distracted and weak. A terrible pandemic has ravaged the minds of Western elites for decades, turning us into a self-loathing, nihilistic people whose main preoccupation is self-flagellating while hypnotically reciting the wrongs of our past...

    While here in the West we talk endlessly about equality, diversity and social justice, in the rest of the world, things are much simpler. People respect strength and despise weakness. "



    I actually think that's quite a lenient description of the governments of the West and their policies since the fall of the blessed Lady Margaret (PBUH) and Ronald Reagan.

    Yet it is the Wokefinders on the hard right that are the biggest apologists for Putin. Farage, Banks, Hitchins, Trump etc.
    "United Russia", Putin's party, are their fellow right-wingers.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,362
    Ukraine has painfully exposed the faults of a British government that prizes rhetoric over substance and revealed the truth, that Britain is more irrelevant in Europe than it has been for 300 years.
    https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1496559498571489281
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 41,478
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Bloody hell. Panorama on the Shropshire maternity scandal is grim.

    Not unique either with similar scandals in Morecombe Bay, Nottingham, Essex.

    There will always be failures in an organisation the size of the NHS. What matters is recognising those failures as quickly as possible, correcting them, and spreading lessons around the organisation.

    Too many within and without the NHS have been historically unwilling to accept that there are failures, and instead institute a CYA approach. Or even blaming the messenger: witness Stafford.

    Much of the NHS is glorious and worthy of praise. But some of the NHS is like the worst private companies: unwilling to accept blame or make progress.
    This went on for years and years. Maternity seems to be particularly prone to it.
    Yes, going back to Blair's time. So did Stafford. The difference is in Stafford the whistleblowers got pilloried for whilstleblowing.

    Maternity does seem to have issues. There was a recent conversation on here about maternity care that was not necessarily positive. When it's good (as ours was) it can be very good. When it's bad, it's disastrous.
  • pigeon said:

    My supposition is that the state pension will continue to exist into the far future and will also continue to be uprated at least in line with inflation. The Government daren't shit on existing pensioners, so the only safety valve to try to do something about the cost, and forestall the collapse of the working age population under the huge burden of tax needed to fund the care and ease of pensioners, is to keep ramping the state retirement age. I doubt that a young person in their late teens or early twenties entering the workforce today will get their state handout until at least age 75 and possibly not until they're 80.

    The consequence of this is that young people from well-to-do families who can look forward to inheriting property wealth will become reliant on that to themselves retire at an acceptable age. Those who are not, unless they are exceptionally successful in their working lives, will largely work until they die, or work until they're too sick or disabled to keep going.

    And in some ways, that's going to have to be made to work. If we are going to be healthy for longer, we can't expect to spend all the extra time not in employment. The highly cushy situation of my parent's generation (being paid a company pension for nearly 30 years) doesn't make sense by simple arithmetic. But it does mean working out what work should look like in those wind-down years.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,165

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
    You think the repeated Russian aggression is our fault? You think we caused Salisbury?
    I think there's a catalogue of western failures that made Putin, a man whose background inclined to autocracy, revert away from his very pro-Western stance after 9-11, to the familiar. Those are legal ; Iraq, economic ; the early 1990s ; and strategic ; going back on original verbal assurances of not expanding NATO to Ukraine.

    We are where we are now, and he's gradually become more unhinged and anti-Western on his own track. We should be looking at the absolute maximum economic sanctions, and heavily reinforcing a whole line from the Baltics to Greece.
    Ah, so you are a 'blame us' person.

    The fault here lies in Putin. A bad actor can always find excuses for their bad behaviour. A practiced bad actor will always get fools to make the excuses for him.

    Putin was not forced to invade Georgia. He was not forced to kill Litvinenko. He was not forced to kill or jail hundreds of journalists. He was not forced to take Crimea. He was not forced to do the Salisbury poisonings. He is not being forced to attack Ukraine.

    He is evil. Whatever we did, he would find excuses for his actions.
    You spend half your time demanding people pick a side, and the other half on querulous whataboutery toward people who are actually on your side.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,215

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The EU sanctioned 378 Russians

    The Tories sanctioned 5...

    There is an emergency EU summit tomorrow. BoZo and Truss will have to beg someone to tell them what happened.

    Global Britain is a global joke...

    And how many anti tank guns have the EU supplied?
    Germany offered some helmets and stopped people with their kit passing it on.

    These kind of comments are really uncalled for. It’s almost as if you had a different agenda Scott.
    Yes, this is a time for people to decide which side they are on.

    The government / Conservatives are not the evil actors in this saga. What's more, there might be stuff going on that isn't known atm (as seen in the Libya evacuation).

    Either you are against this Russian aggression, or you are trying to blame the west for 'poking' them into it. That poor Putin. How he is sinned against!
    No, both can be agreed to.
    You think the repeated Russian aggression is our fault? You think we caused Salisbury?
    Trying to look objectively in to the causes of the current situation is not the same as being pro-Russia. The 'poking the bear' meme has some truth in it. There was an expansion of Western institutions (including NATO and the EU) in Eastern Europe with the obvious objective of eventually bringing Russia in to the fold. This was despite earlier assurances to Russia that this was not our intention. Putin realised that this would ultimately almost certainly mean the overthrowing of his regime, which is not consistent at all with western democratic values, and this is why relations turned bad around 2008.

    It is possible to both recognise this history as a cause of the current situation and completely reject Russias current actions in Ukraine.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,332
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Bloody hell. Panorama on the Shropshire maternity scandal is grim.

    Not unique either with similar scandals in Morecombe Bay, Nottingham, Essex.

    There will always be failures in an organisation the size of the NHS. What matters is recognising those failures as quickly as possible, correcting them, and spreading lessons around the organisation.

    Too many within and without the NHS have been historically unwilling to accept that there are failures, and instead institute a CYA approach. Or even blaming the messenger: witness Stafford.

    Much of the NHS is glorious and worthy of praise. But some of the NHS is like the worst private companies: unwilling to accept blame or make progress.
    This went on for years and years. Maternity seems to be particularly prone to it.
    My wife, white, middle class, articulate, generally got on ok with maternity but the stories she told of how those not ticking those boxes got treated were deeply alarming.
This discussion has been closed.