John Cotter @John_Cotter · 3h Some ministers will back Johnson to the hilt because the closest they would get to a cabinet under anyone else would be in Ikea.
Omicron could in theory be replaced by another variant that is more transmissible and deadly but you could say the same about the flu as well couldn't you?
Absolutely. In fact one of the risks we face is that we forget about flu for a while due to being focused on the coronavirus. We'd be damned foolish to drop our guard against flu.
Hardly any flu or RSV about. My Trust has 260 covid patients and only 6 with other respiratory virus.
They may be a bit evidence light for covid, but for other respiratory viruses "Hands, Face, Space" work a treat.
Sure such measures have supressed flu, what I meant is that we shouldn't think that coronavirus is the main pandemic threat, flu hasn't disappeared and that has long been seen as the most likely cause of the "big one".
Encouraged by the judgement the other week, I presume this guy will now argue that because Eric Gill did some really sick shit it must be removed and the corporation won't do so, so he is going to.
That is a really good and interesting article. Thanks for that. The Guardian long articles really are great reading.
I’ve been reading The Grauniad for years, and yes there is a lot of hand-wringing middle class bollocks in there, no doubt. But, for me, on balance, it’s the best of the papers. They do a lot of very good stuff that far outweighs the shite for me. But I’m of the left so I would say that.
Well I am of the right...ish. Anti-state anyway. And I agree with you. It is the last good journalistic newspaper left in the UK. The Telegraph and even the Times are very poor these days (Though the Telegraph is dire rather than just poor) and the Independent is a rag. The rest are comics. And even in that class not a patch on 2000AD
I don't agree with much of the political slant of the Guardian but they still know how to produce a proper newspaper and they have columnists and journalists who can actually write.
I know as a Brexiteer you'll be spitting your cocoa out at this, but the Economist is by far the best news periodical in the UK. Insightful and intelligent - you just have to try to ignore when its editorial slant goes against your own biases (as it does with me on occasion).
Yeah the Economist is good too. Thanks to Apple News I’ve been dipping into the Atlantic, they have some really interesting, well written articles.
On the subject of the Economist, those who derided and deride the Brexity view that the EU is a state in the making might consider their great columnist Charlesmagne's closing words (Jan 1) as he leaves his job:
"...The EU solidifies into something resembling a normal state, with border guards,debts, currency and, increasingly, shared politics..."
Of course, some see that as bad, some see it as good. I’m of the latter view, and I am still disappointed my EU citizenship has been removed against my will and I am no longer directly part of such a project.
But, it’d be a boring world if we all agreed on everything.
I think it’s always been explicit, from its founding charter, that a unified state is the eventual goal? Ages ago I shared a link to a Twitter thread that showed comprehensively that has always been explicit and that point was recognised and debated widely, in the press and on TV, before we went in.
I was watching some old Auf Weidersehen, Pet the other week, second series I think. They were going to Spain, saying how good it would be to get away from all the Customs crap to get on to the continent thanks to the EEC that was coming in shortly. How times change.
Yes, you are right and wrong. It is perfectly reasonable to want a United States of Europe. You do, I don't. It is also correct that the ambition for it was hiding in plain sight. It is also correct that at no point ever either in national politics or in the Remain campaign has it been asserted, argued for, supported or anything other than derided as a right wing conspiracy theorist fantasy.
Just wondering....when newspapers don't name an individual "for legal" reasons, but provide such a level of information that you don't need to be the world champion guess who player, in fact there is only a single individual who fits the presented facts, does that break the not naming them?
I was just about to post about that, it is jigsaw identification.
The last paragraph in this Telegraph article is reprehensible.
He must be praying even more trhan most dutiful sons for the indefinite postponement of London Bridge, after which the purse strings of the Duchy of Lancaster estate are going to be fastened against him
Bad day for poshos all round.
The Prince Andrew ruling is a victory for women
The effect is a ‘win’ for Virginia Roberts Giuffre – she can continue her quest for justice in open court
As I have repeatedly said I am not an American lawyer but the decision of the Judge is bewildering. He said:
"In a similar vein and for similar reasons, it is not open to the court now to decide, as a matter of fact, just what the parties to the release in the 2009 settlement agreement signed by Ms Giuffre and Jeffrey Epstein actually meant."
One thing which appears to have changed is that Giuffre is now saying that Andrew knew she was trafficked. That appears to be a new allegation. Is there some new evidence to support this that was not available before?
Pass but I suspect it was something innocent such as Prince Andrew asking where are you from - Florida without Prince Andrew or Virginia (at the time) understanding the consequences of the statement.
This bit is interesting for @DavidL (page 21 paragraph 55)
At trial, should the case proceed to trial, he perhaps could have an opportunity to prove that Prince Andrew could have been Sued successfully in Florida on the §2255 claim, in which case these claims might be pertinent to an assertion of the release defense in this case.
So the way to bring the Florida trial judgment back into play is to admit enough guilt that the Florida case can be investigated more thoroughly within the trial.
You would need to be incredibly stupid to do that.
Knowing where someone is from does not show knowledge that someone has been trafficked. There is something a touch troubling about allegations being added on at such a late stage unless some new evidence has come to light. That may be the case of course but I have not seen it.
I would also like to understand why she was not chosen to give evidence at the Maxwell trial and why, if she does have all this evidence, the criminal authorities have chosen not to pursue this matter. Also is she pursuing claims against the others she had sex with? If not, why not?
None of this is to defend Andrew. I don't know enough about the facts. But if there is credible evidence that someone was involved in rape and trafficking then the criminal courts are the right place for those allegations to be tested.
Wait for it. That is, until (at least) conclusion of the legal discovery period, which IIRC is scheduled to end in July.
As for criminal versus civil, in this case (as in others) the civil trial will (almost certainly) establish facts that will be crucial to a criminal indictment and trial.
But only on the balance of probabilities. Isn't the test in a US criminal trial higher than that? And if one of the key witnesses is Giuffre - the most critical witness of all, in fact - then the question of why the US authorities thought her an unsuitable witness in the Maxwell trial is surely relevant.
At any event Andrew needs far far better lawyers than the bunch of bozos currently advising him.
Don't know what you mean by your first two sentences.
And think you are jumping to concluson, that federal prosecutors considered her an "unsuitable" witness?
As for your last point, my take is NOT that his lawyers are bad - certainly they were NOT hired on that basis - but rather that they are working without a net.
Because Andy's REAL defense appears to be . . . wait for it . . . Mummy!
Re the first two sentences, what I meant was that any facts established in a civil trial would only be on the balance of possibilities whereas to establish guilt in a criminal trial the test is higher.
Re her not being suitable, I recall reading that somewhere, that US prosecutors had some concerns about her evidence. I may have remembered incorrectly of course.
Andrew's lawyers seem unknown and a curious bunch, as well as ineffective.
One aspect has puzzled me. Didn't he have Royal Protection Officers wherever he went? So establishing his whereabouts and whether he was alone or not should be relatively easy. Or am I missing something?
Before I make my own sage comments to yours, allow me to thank you for you last post! As a profoundly learned classicist, perhaps the PM may recognize similarities between himself and Nero, in particular partying while London (& beyond) was quarantining . . . on his orders.
On your points, for starters re: civil & criminal, you are correct re: test of guilt. MY point is that regardless of ground for ultimate verdict, evidence will come to light that will be grist for prosecutorial mill(s). For example, in helping to connect the dots thus strengthening chain of evidence and drawing the net tighter.
Personally think that Rancid Andy is NOT the main target. Which are more likely his major aiders & abettors. For example, corrupt previous federal prosecutors who gave Epstein and Maxwell their sweetheart "stay out of jail for ???" deals in the first place.
As for the royal protection officers, they and rest of The Firm will almost certainly know a LOT more about all of this than has been revealed.
While I would trust their sworn word on this & related topics, about as much as I would Boris Johnson's, still plenty of scope for at least selected skeletons to be tumbled out of the royal closet. Esp. when QEII is no longer around to keep the lid on Pandora's box.
All other things aside, I find that exceptionally annoying. Taking Scots voters for granted was one reason for Labour being wiped out in Scotland. Saying come home implies that labour is the natural vote for the red wall. Sorry, how about earn it?
Like Johnson has earned keeping their vote.
I am catching up on pre xmas reading. The Speccie has a long interview with Gove about levelling up. Apparently his plan is to recreate Medici Florence in the north of England.
To be clear this is not about Johnson, it’s about the idea that red wall voters are ‘naturally’ labour. Give them more credit, and something positive to vote for.
Quite similar in tone & substance to Winston Churchill's public stance in the lead-up to Neville Chamberlain's defensetration. & replacement in 1940 by . . . Winston Churchill.
Similar story in 1956 re: Harold Macmillan and Sir Anthony Eden. For same reason as 1940 and 2022.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Jesus Christ Charles give it a rest.
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
Handy bit of journalism by our ever-useless local paper:
"The Oxford Mail today messaged our Conservative MPs: John Howell, Robert Courts, David Johnston and Victoria Prentis to ask what they thought about the Prime Minister’s BYOB party.
"Just one replied: to say she was too busy to talk."
Just wondering....when newspapers don't name an individual "for legal" reasons, but provide such a level of information that you don't need to be the world champion guess who player, in fact there is only a single individual who fits the presented facts, does that break the not naming them?
I was just about to post about that, it is jigsaw identification.
The last paragraph in this Telegraph article is reprehensible.
Can you relay it here, not all of us are Tele subs.
The Daily Telegraph has contacted the RFU for comment, but the player is not a member of Eddie Jones' last England squad.
It doesn't narrow it down too much, just rules out Manu tbh - most of the Sale squad seem to have played for England at some level or another except the saffers.
Come on PB, you know everything else, what's the correct spelling?
Inquiry for an investigation.
Enquiry for a question.
As I said Rishi is incredibly good - he's pointing out that there is only a single question that needs to be asked and the answer is Yes, Boris is a lying fool who has been caught....
Handy bit of journalism by our ever-useless local paper:
"The Oxford Mail today messaged our Conservative MPs: John Howell, Robert Courts, David Johnston and Victoria Prentis to ask what they thought about the Prime Minister’s BYOB party.
"Just one replied: to say she was too busy to talk."
He's doing worse than a French President, that truly is a national embarrassment, Boris Johnson needs to go now.
Worse than that, he's doing worse than the worst ever French President.
Not forgetting the one that fell out of a train while drunk, the one who turned up at a formal dinner with all his medals on but nothing else at all and the one who died of a heart attack while being fellated.
Sam seems to have reading issues - Rishi's comment is very careful to ensure that the comment doesn't support Boris, merely to look at first glance that it does (as shown by the fact Sam's fallen for it).
BTW My excitement today was to look up from my desk to see a full-grown adult bald eagle soar across our hayfield and alight near the top of one of our hedgerow trees. Of course, the battery on the SLR was dead so no telephoto option available. On the iPhone, I have two blobs of white (head and tail) imposed on a picture of trees.
He's doing worse than a French President, that truly is a national embarrassment, Boris Johnson needs to go now.
Worse than that, he's doing worse than the worst ever French President.
Not forgetting the one that fell out of a train while drunk, the one who turned up at a formal dinner with all his medals on but nothing else at all and the one who died of a heart attack while being fellated.
Come on PB, you know everything else, what's the correct spelling?
Inquiry for an investigation.
Enquiry for a question.
As I said Rishi is incredibly good - he's pointing out that there is only a single question that needs to be asked and the answer is Yes, Boris is a lying fool who has been caught....
He is growing on me. Mainly just because Johnson and Truss are shrinking, but still.
All other things aside, I find that exceptionally annoying. Taking Scots voters for granted was one reason for Labour being wiped out in Scotland. Saying come home implies that labour is the natural vote for the red wall. Sorry, how about earn it?
Like Johnson has earned keeping their vote.
I am catching up on pre xmas reading. The Speccie has a long interview with Gove about levelling up. Apparently his plan is to recreate Medici Florence in the north of England.
Bradford Town Hall attests to a previous attempt to do exactly that. Perhaps on a smaller scale, perhaps not.
Encouraged by the judgement the other week, I presume this guy will now argue that because Eric Gill did some really sick shit it must be removed and the corporation won't do so, so he is going to.
That is a really good and interesting article. Thanks for that. The Guardian long articles really are great reading.
I’ve been reading The Grauniad for years, and yes there is a lot of hand-wringing middle class bollocks in there, no doubt. But, for me, on balance, it’s the best of the papers. They do a lot of very good stuff that far outweighs the shite for me. But I’m of the left so I would say that.
Well I am of the right...ish. Anti-state anyway. And I agree with you. It is the last good journalistic newspaper left in the UK. The Telegraph and even the Times are very poor these days (Though the Telegraph is dire rather than just poor) and the Independent is a rag. The rest are comics. And even in that class not a patch on 2000AD
I don't agree with much of the political slant of the Guardian but they still know how to produce a proper newspaper and they have columnists and journalists who can actually write.
I know as a Brexiteer you'll be spitting your cocoa out at this, but the Economist is by far the best news periodical in the UK. Insightful and intelligent - you just have to try to ignore when its editorial slant goes against your own biases (as it does with me on occasion).
Yeah the Economist is good too. Thanks to Apple News I’ve been dipping into the Atlantic, they have some really interesting, well written articles.
On the subject of the Economist, those who derided and deride the Brexity view that the EU is a state in the making might consider their great columnist Charlesmagne's closing words (Jan 1) as he leaves his job:
"...The EU solidifies into something resembling a normal state, with border guards,debts, currency and, increasingly, shared politics..."
Of course, some see that as bad, some see it as good. I’m of the latter view, and I am still disappointed my EU citizenship has been removed against my will and I am no longer directly part of such a project.
But, it’d be a boring world if we all agreed on everything.
I think it’s always been explicit, from its founding charter, that a unified state is the eventual goal? Ages ago I shared a link to a Twitter thread that showed comprehensively that has always been explicit and that point was recognised and debated widely, in the press and on TV, before we went in.
I was watching some old Auf Weidersehen, Pet the other week, second series I think. They were going to Spain, saying how good it would be to get away from all the Customs crap to get on to the continent thanks to the EEC that was coming in shortly. How times change.
Yes, you are right and wrong. It is perfectly reasonable to want a United States of Europe. You do, I don't. It is also correct that the ambition for it was hiding in plain sight. It is also correct that at no point ever either in national politics or in the Remain campaign has it been asserted, argued for, supported or anything other than derided as a right wing conspiracy theorist fantasy.
To quote the Queen's speech from the State opening of Parliament 1973:
"In co-operation with other Member States My Government will play their full part in the further development of the European Community in accordance with the programme established at the European Summit in October 1972. This programme includes progress towards economic and monetary union; measures for the establishment of a regional development fund; and co-operation in foreign policy between Member States."
All other things aside, I find that exceptionally annoying. Taking Scots voters for granted was one reason for Labour being wiped out in Scotland. Saying come home implies that labour is the natural vote for the red wall. Sorry, how about earn it?
Like Johnson has earned keeping their vote.
I am catching up on pre xmas reading. The Speccie has a long interview with Gove about levelling up. Apparently his plan is to recreate Medici Florence in the north of England.
To be clear this is not about Johnson, it’s about the idea that red wall voters are ‘naturally’ labour. Give them more credit, and something positive to vote for.
Many places in the red wall in the north east are the sort of places that, on the face of it, should have moved Tory years ago and has only stayed red through voting habit. Lots of nice housing estates with high levels of owner occupancy and good levels of disposable income. As for suggesting labour say ‘come home’, that would be a disaster for the reasons you point out. Labour have taken these places for granted for many many years. The red wall owes labour nothing.
All other things aside, I find that exceptionally annoying. Taking Scots voters for granted was one reason for Labour being wiped out in Scotland. Saying come home implies that labour is the natural vote for the red wall. Sorry, how about earn it?
Like Johnson has earned keeping their vote.
I am catching up on pre xmas reading. The Speccie has a long interview with Gove about levelling up. Apparently his plan is to recreate Medici Florence in the north of England.
Bradford Town Hall attests to a previous attempt to do exactly that. Perhaps on a smaller scale, perhaps not.
How many notable Conservatives have so far demanded Johnson quit - other than Ross, Davidson and most of the Conservative group at Holyrood?
The Scots Tories are going to have some interesting decisions to make should the party in London decline to follow their lead and be done with him pretty quickly.
How many notable Conservatives have so far demanded Johnson quit - other than Ross, Davidson and most of the Conservative group at Holyrood?
The Scots Tories are going to have some interesting decisions to make should the party in London decline to follow their lead and be done with him pretty quickly.
I wonder who has the right to the bank account and the offices (if there are any real estate assets). A crucial legal issue whenever a Presbyterian kirk split.
He's doing worse than a French President, that truly is a national embarrassment, Boris Johnson needs to go now.
Worse than that, he's doing worse than the worst ever French President.
Not forgetting the one that fell out of a train while drunk, the one who turned up at a formal dinner with all his medals on but nothing else at all and the one who died of a heart attack while being fellated.
What did the middle one pin his medals to??
One of the decorations was a sash.
Can't remember which one it was.* Might have been the same one who fell out of the train, Paul Deschanel.
The irony is that I do think Boris has had a pretty good second half to the pandemic.
From the start of the vaccine roll out this time last year he hasn't done a bad job and has made a lot of good judgement calls the latest being saying no to the "circuit breaker" over Christmas.
But his behaviour and those of his staff in 2020 is an absolute outrage, his lies and evasions have caught up with him and there's no way out that I can see...
All other things aside, I find that exceptionally annoying. Taking Scots voters for granted was one reason for Labour being wiped out in Scotland. Saying come home implies that labour is the natural vote for the red wall. Sorry, how about earn it?
Like Johnson has earned keeping their vote.
I am catching up on pre xmas reading. The Speccie has a long interview with Gove about levelling up. Apparently his plan is to recreate Medici Florence in the north of England.
Who would have guessed that the Tory levelling up policy was scribbled on the back of a rolled-up banknote?
Encouraged by the judgement the other week, I presume this guy will now argue that because Eric Gill did some really sick shit it must be removed and the corporation won't do so, so he is going to.
That is a really good and interesting article. Thanks for that. The Guardian long articles really are great reading.
I’ve been reading The Grauniad for years, and yes there is a lot of hand-wringing middle class bollocks in there, no doubt. But, for me, on balance, it’s the best of the papers. They do a lot of very good stuff that far outweighs the shite for me. But I’m of the left so I would say that.
Well I am of the right...ish. Anti-state anyway. And I agree with you. It is the last good journalistic newspaper left in the UK. The Telegraph and even the Times are very poor these days (Though the Telegraph is dire rather than just poor) and the Independent is a rag. The rest are comics. And even in that class not a patch on 2000AD
I don't agree with much of the political slant of the Guardian but they still know how to produce a proper newspaper and they have columnists and journalists who can actually write.
I know as a Brexiteer you'll be spitting your cocoa out at this, but the Economist is by far the best news periodical in the UK. Insightful and intelligent - you just have to try to ignore when its editorial slant goes against your own biases (as it does with me on occasion).
Yeah the Economist is good too. Thanks to Apple News I’ve been dipping into the Atlantic, they have some really interesting, well written articles.
On the subject of the Economist, those who derided and deride the Brexity view that the EU is a state in the making might consider their great columnist Charlesmagne's closing words (Jan 1) as he leaves his job:
"...The EU solidifies into something resembling a normal state, with border guards,debts, currency and, increasingly, shared politics..."
Of course, some see that as bad, some see it as good. I’m of the latter view, and I am still disappointed my EU citizenship has been removed against my will and I am no longer directly part of such a project.
But, it’d be a boring world if we all agreed on everything.
I think it’s always been explicit, from its founding charter, that a unified state is the eventual goal? Ages ago I shared a link to a Twitter thread that showed comprehensively that has always been explicit and that point was recognised and debated widely, in the press and on TV, before we went in.
I was watching some old Auf Weidersehen, Pet the other week, second series I think. They were going to Spain, saying how good it would be to get away from all the Customs crap to get on to the continent thanks to the EEC that was coming in shortly. How times change.
Yes, you are right and wrong. It is perfectly reasonable to want a United States of Europe. You do, I don't. It is also correct that the ambition for it was hiding in plain sight. It is also correct that at no point ever either in national politics or in the Remain campaign has it been asserted, argued for, supported or anything other than derided as a right wing conspiracy theorist fantasy.
To quote the Queen's speech from the State opening of Parliament 1973:
"In co-operation with other Member States My Government will play their full part in the further development of the European Community in accordance with the programme established at the European Summit in October 1972. This programme includes progress towards economic and monetary union; measures for the establishment of a regional development fund; and co-operation in foreign policy between Member States."
Couldn't really call that hiding, could you?
Somewhere in a box I have the election leaflet delivered by the Tory MEP for Kent West in the Euro-election of 1979; it is surprisingly pro-european
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Jesus Christ Charles give it a rest.
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
I don’t in the real world. But here I blow off steam. Much like you seem to do when you are quite as unpleasant as you are to many others on here.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Jesus Christ Charles give it a rest.
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
I don’t in the real world. But here I blow off steam. Much like you seem to do when you are quite as unpleasant as you are to many others on here.
At least Prince A still has the option of settling his problems behind the scenes.
I’m sure that is the certain outcome. Is there a betting market we can bet on out of court settlement?
It doesn’t actually solve his problem though as it doesn’t clear his name. For example, could there be other potential accusers?
In practice, he can’t clear his name though, can he? There is no outcome now where he can return to public life and continue opening new branches of Asda as if nothing has happened.
I expect a torrent of victim blaming. That is the default for legal teams defending alleged sex offenders.
There are two potential defences.
1. I never slept with her at all. If dates are specified and Andrew can show that he was elsewhere on those dates or has RP officers to confirm that he was alone then that is that. 2. I did sleep with her but I reasonably thought she wanted to sleep with me too. I had no idea at all that she was trafficked. It is possible that as part of the Epstein-Maxwell shtick they made the girls behave as if they wanted to sleep with the older men. Then it will turn on whether the belief that the girl consented was reasonable given her behaviour etc. This defence would involve questioning the girl as to the MO of Epstein and Maxwell when offering up the girls to their friends and that is where Giuffre's involvement in trafficking herself may be distinctly unhelpful to her case.
Possibly there is a third defence: I have no recollection of this girl because I had relations with lots of women at this time (I was a divorced man) but if I did sleep with her it would only have been because she was willing etc.
But even if he wins the civil suit, his name is still mud - because of that disastrous interview. And frankly no lawyer with a brain cell in their body would put Andrew up as a witness. So the best he can hope for is a generous settlement with no admission of liability and to disappear from public life and concentrate on being a grandad. Getting a settlement is what his lawyers should have been seeking from the start. He needs much much better US lawyers. There are plenty of them about. Were I funding his defence I would insist on choosing good lawyers not the dubious friends and unknown lawyers he has surrounded himself with - and doing what was best for the Royal Family not one rather dim member of it. Stupid stupid man.
Re: Andrew's possible defenses: 1. about as likely as Boris "proving" he was running marathons on HIS dates in question. 2. think you are mistaken that showing the victim was herself implicated in trafficking is itself a credible defense, given the nature of human trafficking which is rather well documented AND (I think) litigated in US courts. 3. would have to get judge drunk first for this one to fly.
Personally think His Foul Highness is unlikely to escape either admission of liability or outright conviction.
As for his legal eagles, IF it's true his lawyers are crap, WHY do you think that is? Could it be, because either no one (not even Mom) will pony up for better? Or because good ones won't touch him with a barge pole, either due to distaste or because they think likely pain would exceed the monetary gain?
John Cotter @John_Cotter · 3h Some ministers will back Johnson to the hilt because the closest they would get to a cabinet under anyone else would be in Ikea.
It's almost as if central office has sent out the template for tweets.
I wonder who else will use the same words?
That isn't Tory Central Office - it's someone has found a set of words that sounds like backing but really isn't and anyone sane is going to use it for when things go completely pear shaped next week.
Just wondering....when newspapers don't name an individual "for legal" reasons, but provide such a level of information that you don't need to be the world champion guess who player, in fact there is only a single individual who fits the presented facts, does that break the not naming them?
I was just about to post about that, it is jigsaw identification.
The last paragraph in this Telegraph article is reprehensible.
Can you relay it here, not all of us are Tele subs.
The Daily Telegraph has contacted the RFU for comment, but the player is not a member of Eddie Jones' last England squad.
It doesn't narrow it down too much, just rules out Manu tbh - most of the Sale squad seem to have played for England at some level or another except the saffers.
I see the wife of a former England player has put a statement out stating this arrest has nothing to do with her and her husband. The only similarity being she is the same age as the complainant. They had been doorstepped by the press today.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Jesus Christ Charles give it a rest.
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
I don’t in the real world. But here I blow off steam. Much like you seem to do when you are quite as unpleasant as you are to many others on here.
Not really understanding your "real world" point. You mean, you thought nobody here was in a position to bite back?
Sports streaming service DAZN is nearing a deal to acquire Britain's BT Sport in an estimated $800 million transaction that will give it access to sought-after rights to the English Premier League and UEFA Champions League matches, four sources familiar with the matter told Reuters.
A deal is expected to be reached as soon as this month, after protracted negotiations that became public last fall, the sources said. The transaction has yet to be finalized and could still fall apart, they added.
The irony is that I do think Boris has had a pretty good second half to the pandemic.
From the start of the vaccine roll out this time last year he hasn't done a bad job and has made a lot of good judgement calls the latest being saying no to the "circuit breaker" over Christmas.
But his behaviour and those of his staff in 2020 is an absolute outrage, his lies and evasions have caught up with him and there's no way out that I can see...
It's the wallpaper and Owen Paterson that did Boris in. But as neither of those seem to have enough damage to destroy Boris the 2020 Parties are being used as the quickest mechanism to destroy him.
Just wondering....when newspapers don't name an individual "for legal" reasons, but provide such a level of information that you don't need to be the world champion guess who player, in fact there is only a single individual who fits the presented facts, does that break the not naming them?
I was just about to post about that, it is jigsaw identification.
The last paragraph in this Telegraph article is reprehensible.
Can you relay it here, not all of us are Tele subs.
The Daily Telegraph has contacted the RFU for comment, but the player is not a member of Eddie Jones' last England squad.
It doesn't narrow it down too much, just rules out Manu tbh - most of the Sale squad seem to have played for England at some level or another except the saffers.
I see the wife of a former England player has put a statement out stating this arrest has nothing to do with her and her husband. The only similarity being she is the same age as the complainant. They had been doorstepped by the press today.
The irony is that I do think Boris has had a pretty good second half to the pandemic.
From the start of the vaccine roll out this time last year he hasn't done a bad job and has made a lot of good judgement calls the latest being saying no to the "circuit breaker" over Christmas.
But his behaviour and those of his staff in 2020 is an absolute outrage, his lies and evasions have caught up with him and there's no way out that I can see...
It's the wallpaper and Owen Paterson that did Boris in. But as neither of those seem to have enough damage to destroy Boris the 2020 Parties are being used as the quickest mechanism to destroy him.
I accidentally viewed a thread the day of the Paterson vote, some utter comedy gold.
Paterson hasn't had any opportunity to appeal against the investigation, I can confidently say that and I haven't read the report
and
The Tories have a majority of 80 it is fine and right, nobody will remember it.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Jesus Christ Charles give it a rest.
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
I don’t in the real world. But here I blow off steam. Much like you seem to do when you are quite as unpleasant as you are to many others on here.
Not really understanding your "real world" point. You mean, you thought nobody here was in a position to bite back?
No it means we are all (to some extent) anonymous on here and engaged in mutual banter quite divorced from family, friends and professional circles.
If we ever encounter each other in the real world then feel free to judge me based on my posts on here. I won’t judge you on yours.
It's almost as if central office has sent out the template for tweets.
I wonder who else will use the same words?
That isn't Tory Central Office - it's someone has found a set of words that sounds like backing but really isn't and anyone sane is going to use it for when things go completely pear shaped next week.
Sunak wouldn't use Conservative Central Office types to scrape pigshit off his boot.
He has access to far higher caliber of assistance within the Treasury.
Plus unlike PM does NOT need kindly donations to fund outside expertise should he feel the need.
How many notable Conservatives have so far demanded Johnson quit - other than Ross, Davidson and most of the Conservative group at Holyrood?
The Scots Tories are going to have some interesting decisions to make should the party in London decline to follow their lead and be done with him pretty quickly.
I wonder who has the right to the bank account and the offices (if there are any real estate assets). A crucial legal issue whenever a Presbyterian kirk split.
It's a good question.
AIUI the Scottish party is effectively a branch office of the UK party, so the latter would presumably control the assets? But I stand to be corrected.
The irony is that I do think Boris has had a pretty good second half to the pandemic.
From the start of the vaccine roll out this time last year he hasn't done a bad job and has made a lot of good judgement calls the latest being saying no to the "circuit breaker" over Christmas.
But his behaviour and those of his staff in 2020 is an absolute outrage, his lies and evasions have caught up with him and there's no way out that I can see...
It's the wallpaper and Owen Paterson that did Boris in. But as neither of those seem to have enough damage to destroy Boris the 2020 Parties are being used as the quickest mechanism to destroy him.
I accidentally viewed a thread the day of the Paterson vote, some utter comedy gold.
Paterson hasn't had any opportunity to appeal against the investigation, I can confidently say that and I haven't read the report
and
The Tories have a majority of 80 it is fine and right, nobody will remember it.
Just to fill up this thread with even more nonsense.
If you want an example of a country where the incoming Government's political honeymoon has soon faded, Exhibit A - Norway.
Last September, the Conservative-led coalition of Erna Solberg was defeated and a new minority government formed led by the Social Democrats with Centre as their partners - the governing parties had polled nearly 40% and won 76 seats in the 169-seat Storting.
Barely four months later and a new opinion poll has the following (changes since last September):
That's a loss of about a quarter of the Government's vote in just three months while the centre-right is up by as much as Labour is down. However, the two left and far-left parties are up five points and the next election is not until 2025 so plenty for time for things to change (or not).
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
How do you define best county? Virginia, home of the two wealthiest counties, does have oceanfront, but not in those counties.
At least Prince A still has the option of settling his problems behind the scenes.
I’m sure that is the certain outcome. Is there a betting market we can bet on out of court settlement?
It doesn’t actually solve his problem though as it doesn’t clear his name. For example, could there be other potential accusers?
In practice, he can’t clear his name though, can he? There is no outcome now where he can return to public life and continue opening new branches of Asda as if nothing has happened.
I expect a torrent of victim blaming. That is the default for legal teams defending alleged sex offenders.
There are two potential defences.
1. I never slept with her at all. If dates are specified and Andrew can show that he was elsewhere on those dates or has RP officers to confirm that he was alone then that is that. 2. I did sleep with her but I reasonably thought she wanted to sleep with me too. I had no idea at all that she was trafficked. It is possible that as part of the Epstein-Maxwell shtick they made the girls behave as if they wanted to sleep with the older men. Then it will turn on whether the belief that the girl consented was reasonable given her behaviour etc. This defence would involve questioning the girl as to the MO of Epstein and Maxwell when offering up the girls to their friends and that is where Giuffre's involvement in trafficking herself may be distinctly unhelpful to her case.
Possibly there is a third defence: I have no recollection of this girl because I had relations with lots of women at this time (I was a divorced man) but if I did sleep with her it would only have been because she was willing etc.
But even if he wins the civil suit, his name is still mud - because of that disastrous interview. And frankly no lawyer with a brain cell in their body would put Andrew up as a witness. So the best he can hope for is a generous settlement with no admission of liability and to disappear from public life and concentrate on being a grandad. Getting a settlement is what his lawyers should have been seeking from the start. He needs much much better US lawyers. There are plenty of them about. Were I funding his defence I would insist on choosing good lawyers not the dubious friends and unknown lawyers he has surrounded himself with - and doing what was best for the Royal Family not one rather dim member of it. Stupid stupid man.
Re: Andrew's possible defenses: 1. about as likely as Boris "proving" he was running marathons on HIS dates in question. 2. think you are mistaken that showing the victim was herself implicated in trafficking is itself a credible defense, given the nature of human trafficking which is rather well documented AND (I think) litigated in US courts. 3. would have to get judge drunk first for this one to fly.
Personally think His Foul Highness is unlikely to escape either admission of liability or outright conviction.
As for his legal eagles, IF it's true his lawyers are crap, WHY do you think that is? Could it be, because either no one (not even Mom) will pony up for better? Or because good ones won't touch him with a barge pole, either due to distaste or because they think likely pain would exceed the monetary gain?
This is nonsense about his lawyers; his English and US lawyers seem to be very highly regarded, and it is so impossible to second guess them, given that they a. have spoken to him and we haven't, and b. have expertise in the specific areas involved and we haven't, that anyone calling them incompetent needs treating with a lot of suspicion. A lot.
The irony is that I do think Boris has had a pretty good second half to the pandemic.
From the start of the vaccine roll out this time last year he hasn't done a bad job and has made a lot of good judgement calls the latest being saying no to the "circuit breaker" over Christmas.
But his behaviour and those of his staff in 2020 is an absolute outrage, his lies and evasions have caught up with him and there's no way out that I can see...
It's the wallpaper and Owen Paterson that did Boris in. But as neither of those seem to have enough damage to destroy Boris the 2020 Parties are being used as the quickest mechanism to destroy him.
I accidentally viewed a thread the day of the Paterson vote, some utter comedy gold.
Paterson hasn't had any opportunity to appeal against the investigation, I can confidently say that and I haven't read the report
and
The Tories have a majority of 80 it is fine and right, nobody will remember it.
and my favourite
When will Labour ever have a poll lead?
Think it rather sad that you've chosen to out OGH (or was it RCS?) in this mean way!
The irony is that I do think Boris has had a pretty good second half to the pandemic.
From the start of the vaccine roll out this time last year he hasn't done a bad job and has made a lot of good judgement calls the latest being saying no to the "circuit breaker" over Christmas.
But his behaviour and those of his staff in 2020 is an absolute outrage, his lies and evasions have caught up with him and there's no way out that I can see...
It's the wallpaper and Owen Paterson that did Boris in. But as neither of those seem to have enough damage to destroy Boris the 2020 Parties are being used as the quickest mechanism to destroy him.
Gray is going to be a damp squib, I am sure. A yes-minster recantation of the facts with no damning conclusion, and not addressing the issue of the PM’s lies at all, being beyond her brief.
The question is whether the PM is now already mortally wounded, or whether Cummo has another deadly bullet to fire.
"Outside BBC right now a man is trying to smash up Eric Gill statue while another man live streams talking about paedophiles. Gill’s horrific crimes are well known. But is this the way?" https://twitter.com/katierazz/status/1481307310534402049?s=20
Gill was a grotesque pervert, yet his artworks are often beautiful
If we destroy the art of every artist with moral failings (in contemporary eyes), we won't have a lot left. Most of that Renaissance stuff will have to go, for a start. And virtually ANYTHING Greek or Roman
To show how Woke we are, we shouldn't return the Elgin Marbles to the Parthenon, we should tip that pederastic rubbish in the Thames, thus solving two problems in one
I am certainly not arguing this, but I did say the other week, slippery slope of such decisions, where people will argue about the individuals and the politics, not the criminal act of vandalising a statue.
The likes of the Guardian fully on the side of ripping down Colston statue will be firmly against this guy smashing up this statue.
I suppose you could argue there is a moral difference between a statue erected to commemorate an evil man, and a statue of something else, carved by an evil man (or a painting painted, or a song sung, etc)
Yet we don't apply this differentiation when it comes to Gary Glitter. You won't now hear his songs on British radios. Yet you will still hear Michael Jackson. And Wagner
We are in a total confused mess on this issue. My stance is nothing should be criminally damaged, and any artwork must in itself be offensive (outwith the moral profile of the artist) for it to be banned
Gary Glitter wrote a couple of quite excellent pop anthems
You can't write hard & fast rules for this stuff. It's case by case. The Colston jury found (effectively) Justifiable Homocide (of the statue). Other cases (which are unlikely to come along on a regular basis) might be different. Sorry, WILL be different. That's the point.
As for the work of artists, the way I picture it is you have a set of scales. On one side you put their work. The greater it is, the heavier it lies. On the other side you put their crimes. Again the greater the heavier. Then you watch how the scales move and you decide from this whether to cancel. Whether YOU cancel, I mean, not what others do.
Sometimes I find this easy. Eg, Hitler's crimes are imo weightier than his watercolours. I wouldn't want one of his pictures. Conversely, Wagner's work is imo weightier than his racism. I'd listen to Wagner (if I was into classical music, which I'm not and that's my fault).
At other times it's less clear to me. Eg Rolf Harris. His watercolours are not (for me) miles better than Hitler's but his crimes are less serious. Quite a lot less serious. Again I wouldn't want a Rolf on the wall but I don't feel as strongly repulsed as I do about hanging a Hitler. And Michael Jackson is a toughie. You cannot watch that recent documentary without knowing for sure he was a predatory pedophile. But for me his work is right up there and is a massive part of late 20th century popular music. A genius of song & dance. It tips the scales in that direction and I still listen to MJ.
But anyway to summarize, you can't have generic rules on this, it's about the scales, and it's personal too, different people will feel differently about the work & the crimes of different artists, the upshot being we will *always* be in a "total confused mess" about it - and so should we be. The time when we're not is the time to worry.
I would distinguish between the person and their (artistic) product. Personally I wouldn't want to ban Mein Kampf (or Mao's Little Red Book), Rolf Harris's paintings, Gary Glitter's or Michael Jackson's music, or Eric Gill's sculptures.
But nor would I wish to see statues or other monuments of any of the above decorating my town centre.
I tried to read Mein Kampf once. For its historical interest, I hasten to add, rather than from any ideological kinship, you understand. My god what a pile of turgid bollocks it is.
I’ve also read War & Peace and all three books of the Lord of the Rings. Mainly so I could brag that I’ve read War & Peace and all three books of the Lord of the Rings. I don’t think anyone has ever been remotely impressed with either feat. War & Peace wasn’t too bad, mind, but all that Tolkien fantasy stuff was shite. I’ve not been able to even bring myself to watch the films, God knows why I persevered in reading the bloody books.
If you like overly long Russian historical novels with a huge, confusing cast of characters may I recommend Life and Fate by Vasily Grossman, looking at the Russian war experience against the background of Stalingrad. It’s not bad. There’s a prequel apparently that establishes the characters and makes Life and Fate less bewildering to read but I didn’t know about that until relatively recently. I will get round to reading them both in order before I shuffle off this mortal coil.
Schadenfreude is a terrible emotion so I am refraining from commenting on the day’s developments…
Just wondering....when newspapers don't name an individual "for legal" reasons, but provide such a level of information that you don't need to be the world champion guess who player, in fact there is only a single individual who fits the presented facts, does that break the not naming them?
I was just about to post about that, it is jigsaw identification.
The last paragraph in this Telegraph article is reprehensible.
Can you relay it here, not all of us are Tele subs.
The Daily Telegraph has contacted the RFU for comment, but the player is not a member of Eddie Jones' last England squad.
It doesn't narrow it down too much, just rules out Manu tbh - most of the Sale squad seem to have played for England at some level or another except the saffers.
I see the wife of a former England player has put a statement out stating this arrest has nothing to do with her and her husband. The only similarity being she is the same age as the complainant. They had been doorstepped by the press today.
It’s like the time the Everton player was arrested for ‘noncing’ lots of ill informed speculation on social media and people,being wrongly accused. It’s not on. It could ruin someone’s life and affect the trial.
I accidentally viewed a thread the day of the Paterson vote, some utter comedy gold.
Paterson hasn't had any opportunity to appeal against the investigation, I can confidently say that and I haven't read the report
and
The Tories have a majority of 80 it is fine and right, nobody will remember it.
and my favourite
When will Labour ever have a poll lead?
The real gems are all those who were so certain the Conservatives would hold North Shropshire - what did someone predict, oh yes, CON 45, LD 30?
There should be a thread about the market moves on the night of the by election - I think the LDs were available at 3 around midnight so plenty of opportunity for those trading to make some serious money.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Jesus Christ Charles give it a rest.
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
I don’t in the real world. But here I blow off steam. Much like you seem to do when you are quite as unpleasant as you are to many others on here.
Not really understanding your "real world" point. You mean, you thought nobody here was in a position to bite back?
No it means we are all (to some extent) anonymous on here and engaged in mutual banter quite divorced from family, friends and professional circles.
If we ever encounter each other in the real world then feel free to judge me based on my posts on here. I won’t judge you on yours.
I've come down from the upper class To mend your rotten ways My father was a man-of-power Whom everyone obeyed
So come on all you criminals! I've got to put you straight Just like I did with my old man Twenty years too late
How do you think that I know that I know your cousins?
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
How do you define best county? Virginia, home of the two wealthiest counties, does have oceanfront, but not in those counties.
I accidentally viewed a thread the day of the Paterson vote, some utter comedy gold.
Paterson hasn't had any opportunity to appeal against the investigation, I can confidently say that and I haven't read the report
and
The Tories have a majority of 80 it is fine and right, nobody will remember it.
and my favourite
When will Labour ever have a poll lead?
The real gems are all those who were so certain the Conservatives would hold North Shropshire - what did someone predict, oh yes, CON 45, LD 30?
There should be a thread about the market moves on the night of the by election - I think the LDs were available at 3 around midnight so plenty of opportunity for those trading to make some serious money.
I'll hold my hands up as one of them. But I plead that I couldn't possibly have foreseen *this* spectacular an implosion during the campaign.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Strange - as my home town does NOT have an oceanfront. Though we do have a riverbank!
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
How do you define best county? Virginia, home of the two wealthiest counties, does have oceanfront, but not in those counties.
Wrong ocean 😂
Yeah, I knew you were talking Cali, but, c'mon, anywhere in California being the 'best county' and California the 'best state'. ROTFLMAO.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Strange - as my home town does NOT have an oceanfront. Though we do have a riverbank!
A couple of questions about Sir Graham Brady Old Lady:
1) can he write a letter to himself? 2) if asked to reveal how many letters he has, must he do so (honestly)?
Yes (in theory, no, in practice)
No (other than saying when it reaches the magic number)
Thanks, a third question:
3) if asked to reveal how many letters he has, *may* he do so?
Nope, he follows the Sir Michael Spicer precedent.
He will never publicly or privately announce how many letters he has received, when the threshold for a VONC is reached, he will announce a sufficient number have been received to trigger a VONC.
The Vice-Chair of the 1922 verifies that privately by checking every letter.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Jesus Christ Charles give it a rest.
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
I don’t in the real world. But here I blow off steam. Much like you seem to do when you are quite as unpleasant as you are to many others on here.
Not really understanding your "real world" point. You mean, you thought nobody here was in a position to bite back?
No it means we are all (to some extent) anonymous on here and engaged in mutual banter quite divorced from family, friends and professional circles.
If we ever encounter each other in the real world then feel free to judge me based on my posts on here. I won’t judge you on yours.
I've come down from the upper class To mend your rotten ways My father was a man-of-power Whom everyone obeyed
So come on all you criminals! I've got to put you straight Just like I did with my old man Twenty years too late
How do you think that I know that I know your cousins?
Because I’ve never bothered to hide my identity. Most people don’t really care either, and neither do I. The only link I have obfuscated is when I refer to my mentor.
As for whatever money I have it’s about the same as any modestly successful City professional of my vintage.
I accidentally viewed a thread the day of the Paterson vote, some utter comedy gold.
Paterson hasn't had any opportunity to appeal against the investigation, I can confidently say that and I haven't read the report
and
The Tories have a majority of 80 it is fine and right, nobody will remember it.
and my favourite
When will Labour ever have a poll lead?
The real gems are all those who were so certain the Conservatives would hold North Shropshire - what did someone predict, oh yes, CON 45, LD 30?
There should be a thread about the market moves on the night of the by election - I think the LDs were available at 3 around midnight so plenty of opportunity for those trading to make some serious money.
I'll hold my hands up as one of them. But I plead that I couldn't possibly have foreseen *this* spectacular an implosion during the campaign.
Someone even predicted 20% for RefUK. And someone else thought RefUK getting 5% or more was ‘free money’.
A couple of questions about Sir Graham Brady Old Lady:
1) can he write a letter to himself? 2) if asked to reveal how many letters he has, must he do so (honestly)?
1) yes 2) no
I believe
2 is differently No - the whole point is that no MP knows if his / hers is going to be the letter that tips things over the edge. That's there to ensure people hesitate before sending the letter of.
And that's a figure which we all know is manipulated down, and depends very much on what you want to buy. Flatscreen tellies get cheaper, but food and a roof over your head does not.
US house inflation is 23% in last year !!!!!!!!!
Brace.
The offers I get for my house are ludicrous
Yes, but if houses as a whole go up, nice houses go up even more. So one's chances of ever living in one recede in the rear view mirror. I feel for you.
It’s not for sale. My wife would kill me.
Although with some of the offers…
Problem is you need somewhere better to move to and.....
We are on the best street in the best town in the best county in the best state in the US.
We could have a larger house or be 20 feet nearer the ocean but neither are strictly necessary.
Strange - as my home town does NOT have an oceanfront. Though we do have a riverbank!
Another person who took the post in the manner it was intended. Wonders never cease!
Comments
@John_Cotter
·
3h
Some ministers will back Johnson to the hilt because the closest they would get to a cabinet under anyone else would be in Ikea.
On your points, for starters re: civil & criminal, you are correct re: test of guilt. MY point is that regardless of ground for ultimate verdict, evidence will come to light that will be grist for prosecutorial mill(s). For example, in helping to connect the dots thus strengthening chain of evidence and drawing the net tighter.
Personally think that Rancid Andy is NOT the main target. Which are more likely his major aiders & abettors. For example, corrupt previous federal prosecutors who gave Epstein and Maxwell their sweetheart "stay out of jail for ???" deals in the first place.
As for the royal protection officers, they and rest of The Firm will almost certainly know a LOT more about all of this than has been revealed.
While I would trust their sworn word on this & related topics, about as much as I would Boris Johnson's, still plenty of scope for at least selected skeletons to be tumbled out of the royal closet. Esp. when QEII is no longer around to keep the lid on Pandora's box.
https://twitter.com/euanmccolm/status/1481360160832503813
https://twitter.com/RishiSunak/status/1481358087286108169
We might be about to find out if that's enough to run a country.
Come on PB, you know everything else, what's the correct spelling?
Similar story in 1956 re: Harold Macmillan and Sir Anthony Eden. For same reason as 1940 and 2022.
Enquiry for a question.
"Enquiry" if you're asking a bookshop if they have JR Hartley's Fly-Fishing in stock.
So used to say that eminent publication of fact & opinion, the National Enquirer
I am an appallingly common little man myself, but I do know quite a lot of posh and rich people, including several of your posher-and-richer-than-you cousins, and it's amazing how little they go on about it.
"The Oxford Mail today messaged our Conservative MPs: John Howell, Robert Courts, David Johnston and Victoria Prentis to ask what they thought about the Prime Minister’s BYOB party.
"Just one replied: to say she was too busy to talk."
https://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/19843290.conservative-mps-silent-boris-downing-street-byob-party/
https://twitter.com/benatipsos/status/1481362162211860480
* Truss now most senior figure not yet to have commented
* Sunak says he PM right to apologise & “supports (BJ’s) request for patience”
* Several spads helped with this list, so some decisions not to comment intentional https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1481362616803115009/photo/1
Not forgetting the one that fell out of a train while drunk, the one who turned up at a formal dinner with all his medals on but nothing else at all and the one who died of a heart attack while being fellated.
"In co-operation with other Member States My Government will play their full part in the further development of the European Community in accordance with the programme established at the European Summit in October 1972. This programme includes progress towards economic and monetary union; measures for the establishment of a regional development fund; and co-operation in foreign policy between Member States."
Couldn't really call that hiding, could you?
It’s is a remarkably well drafted tweet
*That is a joke.
The Scots Tories are going to have some interesting decisions to make should the party in London decline to follow their lead and be done with him pretty quickly.
Inquiry is a process.
Can't remember which one it was.* Might have been the same one who fell out of the train, Paul Deschanel.
*which President, not which decoration!
From the start of the vaccine roll out this time last year he hasn't done a bad job and has made a lot of good judgement calls the latest being saying no to the "circuit breaker" over Christmas.
But his behaviour and those of his staff in 2020 is an absolute outrage, his lies and evasions have caught up with him and there's no way out that I can see...
On the one hand, this has been a very loyal group to the PM as many feel they owe their seat to him.
But this means some have a more transactional view of relationship with him.
https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1481361949506129925
I wonder who else will use the same words?
1. about as likely as Boris "proving" he was running marathons on HIS dates in question.
2. think you are mistaken that showing the victim was herself implicated in trafficking is itself a credible defense, given the nature of human trafficking which is rather well documented AND (I think) litigated in US courts.
3. would have to get judge drunk first for this one to fly.
Personally think His Foul Highness is unlikely to escape either admission of liability or outright conviction.
As for his legal eagles, IF it's true his lawyers are crap, WHY do you think that is? Could it be, because either no one (not even Mom) will pony up for better? Or because good ones won't touch him with a barge pole, either due to distaste or because they think likely pain would exceed the monetary gain?
We could compare their respective integrity levels sans morality.
Sports streaming service DAZN is nearing a deal to acquire Britain's BT Sport in an estimated $800 million transaction that will give it access to sought-after rights to the English Premier League and UEFA Champions League matches, four sources familiar with the matter told Reuters.
A deal is expected to be reached as soon as this month, after protracted negotiations that became public last fall, the sources said. The transaction has yet to be finalized and could still fall apart, they added.
https://www.reuters.com/business/media-telecom/exclusive-dazn-nears-deal-buy-bt-sport-an-estimated-800-mln-sources-2022-01-12/
29, Well known, Sale, England.
Takes it down to err 1 person.
Paterson hasn't had any opportunity to appeal against the investigation, I can confidently say that and I haven't read the report
and
The Tories have a majority of 80 it is fine and right, nobody will remember it.
and my favourite
When will Labour ever have a poll lead?
If we ever encounter each other in the real world then feel free to judge me based on my posts on here. I won’t judge you on yours.
He has access to far higher caliber of assistance within the Treasury.
Plus unlike PM does NOT need kindly donations to fund outside expertise should he feel the need.
AIUI the Scottish party is effectively a branch office of the UK party, so the latter would presumably control the assets? But I stand to be corrected.
If you want an example of a country where the incoming Government's political honeymoon has soon faded, Exhibit A - Norway.
Last September, the Conservative-led coalition of Erna Solberg was defeated and a new minority government formed led by the Social Democrats with Centre as their partners - the governing parties had polled nearly 40% and won 76 seats in the 169-seat Storting.
Barely four months later and a new opinion poll has the following (changes since last September):
Conservative: 26.6% (+6.2)
Labour: 18.9% (-7.4)
Progress Party: 12.8% (+1.2)
Socialist Left: 9.7% (+2.1)
Centre: 9.4% (-4.1)
Red Party: 7.8% (+3.1)
Greens: 4.8% (+0.9)
Liberal: 4.2% (-0.4)
Christian People's Party 2.8% (-1.0)
That's a loss of about a quarter of the Government's vote in just three months while the centre-right is up by as much as Labour is down. However, the two left and far-left parties are up five points and the next election is not until 2025 so plenty for time for things to change (or not).
The question is whether the PM is now already mortally wounded, or whether Cummo has another deadly bullet to fire.
1) can he write a letter to himself?
2) if asked to reveal how many letters he has, must he do so (honestly)?
Sunak 2/1
Truss 4/1
Gove 11/1
Hunt 16/1
Javid 22/1
Tugendhat 25/1
Patel 28/1
Mordaunt 33/1
Badenoch 40/1
Raab 40/1
50 bar
I’ve also read War & Peace and all three books of the Lord of the Rings. Mainly so I could brag that I’ve read War & Peace and all three books of the Lord of the Rings. I don’t think anyone has ever been remotely impressed with either feat. War & Peace wasn’t too bad, mind, but all that Tolkien fantasy stuff was shite. I’ve not been able to even bring myself to watch the films, God knows why I persevered in reading the bloody books.
If you like overly long Russian historical novels with a huge, confusing cast of characters may I recommend Life and Fate by Vasily Grossman, looking at the Russian war experience against the background of Stalingrad. It’s not bad. There’s a prequel apparently that establishes the characters and makes Life and Fate less bewildering to read but I didn’t know about that until relatively recently. I will get round to reading them both in order before I shuffle off this mortal coil.
Schadenfreude is a terrible emotion so I am refraining from commenting on the day’s developments…
It’s like the time the Everton player was arrested for ‘noncing’ lots of ill informed speculation on social media and people,being wrongly accused. It’s not on. It could ruin someone’s life and affect the trial.
There should be a thread about the market moves on the night of the by election - I think the LDs were available at 3 around midnight so plenty of opportunity for those trading to make some serious money.
No (other than saying when it reaches the magic number)
To mend your rotten ways
My father was a man-of-power
Whom everyone obeyed
So come on all you criminals!
I've got to put you straight
Just like I did with my old man
Twenty years too late
How do you think that I know that I know your cousins?
2) no
I believe
3) if asked to reveal how many letters he has, *may* he do so?
He will never publicly or privately announce how many letters he has received, when the threshold for a VONC is reached, he will announce a sufficient number have been received to trigger a VONC.
The Vice-Chair of the 1922 verifies that privately by checking every letter.
As for whatever money I have it’s about the same as any modestly successful City professional of my vintage.
(Yes, he was right on both occasions.)