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Introducing the LAB-LD “pact” that doesn’t exist and won’t – politicalbetting.com

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  • MattWMattW Posts: 18,087
    Pro_Rata said:

    FF43 said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    Literally an edge case, but there is no doubt the spectators as well as the game itself are in Wales.
    Who polices Chester City games?
    Lord High Chief Constable Drakeford. :smile:
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    There are a couple more on her Wikipedia page. Quite frankly my wife is in her mid fifties and her bum is in better shape and according to Wikipedia This pic was estimated as being painted when she was 14/15.
    What an interesting Wiki page she has. A truly remarkable life.

    Born to a family of half-Irish prostitutes and thieves, found by an artist as a girl, got painted nude, became mistress to the French King, got dumped by the French king, then lived to a ripe old age after buying a palace and marrying twice and somehow surviving the guillotine, and her great grandson was Governor General of Algeria

    Brilliant
    And all of that happened coz some pervy painter noticed she had a cute bum

    Life is splendidly mad
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    Farooq said:

    FF43 said:

    Farooq said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Don't pay too much attention to the border drawn by Google. It's not exact.
    This is the OS map. The stadium is definitely in Wales


    Oh yes, I've no doubt about that. But I wouldn't take it down to the "where is the front door" level on the basis of a google map.
    If you want to see what I mean, look here:
    https://www.google.com/maps/@55.784694,-2.0878437,16.12z

    Its close, but it's obviously not exact.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,165
    North Wales police have always been utter *****.
  • Taz said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    There are a couple more on her Wikipedia page. Quite frankly my wife is in her mid fifties and her bum is in better shape and according to Wikipedia This pic was estimated as being painted when she was 14/15.
    Could you please post a photo so we can make an objective comparison?

    After all, here at PB were are big on citations and evidence we can see with our own eyes!
  • TazTaz Posts: 10,704

    Taz said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    There are a couple more on her Wikipedia page. Quite frankly my wife is in her mid fifties and her bum is in better shape and according to Wikipedia This pic was estimated as being painted when she was 14/15.
    Could you please post a photo so we can make an objective comparison?

    After all, here at PB were are big on citations and evidence we can see with our own eyes!
    Ha ha, my wife is very shy 😂
  • By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    tlg86 said:

    From OS election maps:



    I think the front door is in England.

    When the front door is open, it's in England. When it's closed, it's in Wales.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Re: La O'Murphy, is it relevant to note that she was (apparently) just 15 years old when her "portrait" was painted?

    One wonders what Prince Andrew would have to say about that.

    Lots more interesting stuff in her wiki bio
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie-Louise_O'Murphy

    Make me proud to be Irish . . . sort of . . .

    Still above the age of consent in France, and at the time in question it was apparently 11.
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    tlg86 said:

    North Wales police have always been utter *****.

    Did you get stopped for speeding there?
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,088
    TimT said:

    pigeon said:

    TimT said:

    Foxy said:

    pigeon said:

    Seven day case rates on the Covid dashboard now updated as far as the seven days ending January 2nd:

    Northern Ireland: 2,852.7 per 100,000
    Wales: 2,577.6
    Scotland: 2,079.5
    England: 1,786.8

    Though Wales counts reinfections after 42 days, unlike the others at present. These seem to be 10-15% of cases, such as SKS.

    Anyone know if this applies to the 28 day rule for deaths? If a positive is not timestamped, can a death be counted?
    So if 4 million or so have succumbed to omicron, and only 10-15% were reinfections, how few people are now totally naive to COVID? It can only be a couple of millions or so.
    Less than that one would assume. The ONS estimate at the end of November was that 95% of adults had Covid antibodies at the end of November, before all this started, and we know how easily it spreads through schools.

    Though, to give it its due, the Omicron variant does seem to be doing a remarkable job of finding and infecting the few remaining individuals who are left. Hence the high prevalence of refusers amongst the remaining seriously ill Covid patients.
    Makes me think something is wrong with the numbers somewhere along the line. If 95% had some degree of immunity prior to omicron, then that is, say 3.3 million total (adults and kids) without any. Now 85% of 4 million is 3.4 million. the omicron cases amongst the naive. So there is no-one left with zero prior exposure ...

    Doesn't quite add up.
    I can appreciate your scepticism, although personally I'm inclined to believe the ONS numbers because AIUI they are based on random sampling of the population - and, crucially, the estimates produced are for adults, not children. There are also liable to be some individuals, particularly amongst those who have not received vaccines or whose immune systems haven't reacted strongly to them, who are not naive to the virus but whose antibodies are below detectable levels.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    TimT said:

    pigeon said:

    TimT said:

    Foxy said:

    pigeon said:

    Seven day case rates on the Covid dashboard now updated as far as the seven days ending January 2nd:

    Northern Ireland: 2,852.7 per 100,000
    Wales: 2,577.6
    Scotland: 2,079.5
    England: 1,786.8

    Though Wales counts reinfections after 42 days, unlike the others at present. These seem to be 10-15% of cases, such as SKS.

    Anyone know if this applies to the 28 day rule for deaths? If a positive is not timestamped, can a death be counted?
    So if 4 million or so have succumbed to omicron, and only 10-15% were reinfections, how few people are now totally naive to COVID? It can only be a couple of millions or so.
    Less than that one would assume. The ONS estimate at the end of November was that 95% of adults had Covid antibodies at the end of November, before all this started, and we know how easily it spreads through schools.

    Though, to give it its due, the Omicron variant does seem to be doing a remarkable job of finding and infecting the few remaining individuals who are left. Hence the high prevalence of refusers amongst the remaining seriously ill Covid patients.
    Makes me think something is wrong with the numbers somewhere along the line. If 95% had some degree of immunity prior to omicron, then that is, say 3.3 million total (adults and kids) without any. Now 85% of 4 million is 3.4 million. the omicron cases amongst the naive. So there is no-one left with zero prior exposure ...

    Doesn't quite add up.
    It does. Two or three doses of vaccine (the majority of the UK's immunity profile) gives basically no protection from being infected by Omicron. It gives substantial protection from severe disease but probably close to zero for asymptomatic or symptomatic infection.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709

    Interesting by election in Birmingham Erdington

    Hardly, on current polls Labour should increase their majority, even the combined Tory and Brexit Party vote in 2019 in the seat was only 44%, Labour got 50.3%.

    Anyway condolences to Harriet Harman on the death of her husband. RIP Sidney Poitier too
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Farooq said:

    tlg86 said:

    North Wales police have always been utter *****.

    Did you get stopped for speeding there?
    One hopes he drove too araf to interest the heddlu.
  • eekeek Posts: 24,797
    tlg86 said:

    North Wales police have always been utter *****.

    Only if the work is easy though - which is why they love speed traps (money for old rope).
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 15,545
    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    Farooq said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Don't pay too much attention to the border drawn by Google. It's not exact.
    This is the OS map. The stadium is definitely in Wales


    Could the club quickly build a new front door and a long tunnel to link to the stadium?
    The activity itself is taking place in Wales and that is what is being controlled. If the issue was about how the club is regulated then English regulation would apply because the club is registered in England. (I think).
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Pro_Rata said:

    FF43 said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    Literally an edge case, but there is no doubt the spectators as well as the game itself are in Wales.
    Who polices Chester City games?
    Chester constabulary. Wonder if they’ve even got authority to enforce Welsh law?
  • A man in India got jabbed with a Covid-19 vaccine at least eight times last year, a health official said.

    Brahmdeo Mandal, 65, has claimed that he received 11 doses of the vaccine in Bihar state.

    The retired postman said the jabs had helped him to get rid of aches and pains and "stay healthy". He claimed he had not suffered any adverse effects.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-59905339
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,002
    edited January 2022

    Interesting comments from Cummings re Guardians alleged party

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1479481033993211905?t=-7mrC04uLXRVca_I05esAA&s=19

    Where as the other party, he was conveniently ill for...Anybody think there is a game being played here....just as party gate dies down a bit, up pop Big Dom, throwing out some more breadcrumbs.
    And he says Carrie's presence was legitimate
    Surely Carrie's presence is problematic because if it was, as Cummings said, a business meeting (or series of business meetings) then Carrie should not have been there. If Carrie was there, which is fine in itself because it is her garden, then it was a social meeting so Cummings should not have been there.
    The strange thing here is Cummings is trashing the Guardian's party picture which is the one most people recognise, and endorsing Carrie's presence while at the same time referring to a party that took place that he did not attend

    It is surreal how Cummings was the target for the lefts fury once and now they are quoting him regularly, but suddenly he sabotages the Guardians party picture
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 24,585
    BigRich said:

    iSAGE want unis to go back to online only and everybody to self-test every time you leave the house.....

    I absolutely don't understand why the NUS are not all over this.

    If teaching is all online, then there are no practicals, no language labs, no computer examples classes, etc.

    Their tuition is seriously diminished. Their learning experience is seriously diminished.

    There should be a fee discount.

    What are the NUS playing at -- their job is to look after students?
    I thought the Job of the NUS was to coach and mentor the next generation of Labour MPs?
    The Labour Party have always been far too right wing for the NUS. Even under Corbyn.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    IshmaelZ said:

    Re: La O'Murphy, is it relevant to note that she was (apparently) just 15 years old when her "portrait" was painted?

    One wonders what Prince Andrew would have to say about that.

    Lots more interesting stuff in her wiki bio
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie-Louise_O'Murphy

    Make me proud to be Irish . . . sort of . . .

    Still above the age of consent in France, and at the time in question it was apparently 11.
    Sounds shocking to us, of course - 11. Wtf

    And yet the age of consent in Spain was 13 - until
    2013.
  • FF43 said:

    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    Farooq said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Don't pay too much attention to the border drawn by Google. It's not exact.
    This is the OS map. The stadium is definitely in Wales


    Could the club quickly build a new front door and a long tunnel to link to the stadium?
    The activity itself is taking place in Wales and that is what is being controlled. If the issue was about how the club is regulated then English regulation would apply because the club is registered in England. (I think).
    Before we get this out of proportion:

    https://www.wrexham.com/news/small-football-club-in-flintshire-told-by-police-of-potential-breaches-of-welsh-coronavirus-regulations-213784.html
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,709
    By 52% to 23% Britons say it was the wrong outcome to find the four people accused of criminal damage for pulling down the statue of Edward Colston not guilty.

    81% of Conservative voters think it was the wrong outcome, however Labour voters by 47% to 27% think it was the right outcome
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1479487302338494464?s=20
  • MattWMattW Posts: 18,087
    edited January 2022
    tlg86 said:

    Selebian said:

    Interesting by election in Birmingham Erdington

    Curtains for SKS if it's in any way interesting, surely?
    Asian % in...

    Batley and Spen - 20%
    Erdington - 10%

    George Galloway less of a threat here.
    No disrespect to the memory of Jack D, however the largest majority here since 2000 was Sion Simon.

    Probably about to be overtaken, however.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,165
    Farooq said:

    tlg86 said:

    North Wales police have always been utter *****.

    Did you get stopped for speeding there?
    I've never actually driven in North Wales and I've never been done for speeding. That's not to say I don't speed at times, but one thing I've learned is that concentration is a lot more important than speeding. I think being caught using a mobile should be 9 points. I say that as someone who doesn't do that, but I know just how dangerous it is to be distracted at the wheel.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    Although if we did no doubt we’d discover in very short order that we’re fighting the wrong one. The real importance of planning is the extent to which you can be flexible to rapidly changing circumstances and evidence.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    alex_ said:

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    Although if we did no doubt we’d discover in very short order that we’re fighting the wrong one. The real importance of planning is the extent to which you can be flexible to rapidly changing circumstances and evidence.
    I hate to labour the point but it would also REALLY help if we knew where the damn virus came from, in terms of stopping the next
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    edited January 2022
    tlg86 said:

    Farooq said:

    tlg86 said:

    North Wales police have always been utter *****.

    Did you get stopped for speeding there?
    I've never actually driven in North Wales and I've never been done for speeding. That's not to say I don't speed at times, but one thing I've learned is that concentration is a lot more important than speeding. I think being caught using a mobile should be 9 points. I say that as someone who doesn't do that, but I know just how dangerous it is to be distracted at the wheel.
    A post of yours I can wholly endorse.

    Is it possible, by the way, to get points that aren't multiples of three? I've heard of people getting 3 or 6, but never 1 or 5 etc.
  • tlg86 said:

    North Wales police have always been utter *****.

    I would not attack our police but those who make idiotic laws
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,147

    Interesting comments from Cummings re Guardians alleged party

    https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/1479481033993211905?t=-7mrC04uLXRVca_I05esAA&s=19

    Where as the other party, he was conveniently ill for...Anybody think there is a game being played here....just as party gate dies down a bit, up pop Big Dom, throwing out some more breadcrumbs.
    And he says Carrie's presence was legitimate
    Surely Carrie's presence is problematic because if it was, as Cummings said, a business meeting (or series of business meetings) then Carrie should not have been there. If Carrie was there, which is fine in itself because it is her garden, then it was a social meeting so Cummings should not have been there.
    The strange thing here is Cummings is trashing the Guardian's party picture which is the one most people recognise, and endorsing Carrie's presence while at the same time referring to a party that took place that he did not attend

    It is surreal how Cummings was the target for the lefts fury once and now they are quoting him regularly, but suddenly he sabotages the Guardians party picture
    'Left'? A lot of Tories hated his guts, and didn't like his specs-shopping expedition.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    MaxPB said:

    TimT said:

    pigeon said:

    TimT said:

    Foxy said:

    pigeon said:

    Seven day case rates on the Covid dashboard now updated as far as the seven days ending January 2nd:

    Northern Ireland: 2,852.7 per 100,000
    Wales: 2,577.6
    Scotland: 2,079.5
    England: 1,786.8

    Though Wales counts reinfections after 42 days, unlike the others at present. These seem to be 10-15% of cases, such as SKS.

    Anyone know if this applies to the 28 day rule for deaths? If a positive is not timestamped, can a death be counted?
    So if 4 million or so have succumbed to omicron, and only 10-15% were reinfections, how few people are now totally naive to COVID? It can only be a couple of millions or so.
    Less than that one would assume. The ONS estimate at the end of November was that 95% of adults had Covid antibodies at the end of November, before all this started, and we know how easily it spreads through schools.

    Though, to give it its due, the Omicron variant does seem to be doing a remarkable job of finding and infecting the few remaining individuals who are left. Hence the high prevalence of refusers amongst the remaining seriously ill Covid patients.
    Makes me think something is wrong with the numbers somewhere along the line. If 95% had some degree of immunity prior to omicron, then that is, say 3.3 million total (adults and kids) without any. Now 85% of 4 million is 3.4 million. the omicron cases amongst the naive. So there is no-one left with zero prior exposure ...

    Doesn't quite add up.
    It does. Two or three doses of vaccine (the majority of the UK's immunity profile) gives basically no protection from being infected by Omicron. It gives substantial protection from severe disease but probably close to zero for asymptomatic or symptomatic infection.
    My mistake. I was confusing re-infections with those who are not naive. Of course, a big chunk of the 85% will be breakthrough infections of the vaccinated who have not previously had COVID.
  • MaxPB said:

    TimT said:

    pigeon said:

    TimT said:

    Foxy said:

    pigeon said:

    Seven day case rates on the Covid dashboard now updated as far as the seven days ending January 2nd:

    Northern Ireland: 2,852.7 per 100,000
    Wales: 2,577.6
    Scotland: 2,079.5
    England: 1,786.8

    Though Wales counts reinfections after 42 days, unlike the others at present. These seem to be 10-15% of cases, such as SKS.

    Anyone know if this applies to the 28 day rule for deaths? If a positive is not timestamped, can a death be counted?
    So if 4 million or so have succumbed to omicron, and only 10-15% were reinfections, how few people are now totally naive to COVID? It can only be a couple of millions or so.
    Less than that one would assume. The ONS estimate at the end of November was that 95% of adults had Covid antibodies at the end of November, before all this started, and we know how easily it spreads through schools.

    Though, to give it its due, the Omicron variant does seem to be doing a remarkable job of finding and infecting the few remaining individuals who are left. Hence the high prevalence of refusers amongst the remaining seriously ill Covid patients.
    Makes me think something is wrong with the numbers somewhere along the line. If 95% had some degree of immunity prior to omicron, then that is, say 3.3 million total (adults and kids) without any. Now 85% of 4 million is 3.4 million. the omicron cases amongst the naive. So there is no-one left with zero prior exposure ...

    Doesn't quite add up.
    It does. Two or three doses of vaccine (the majority of the UK's immunity profile) gives basically no protection from being infected by Omicron. It gives substantial protection from severe disease but probably close to zero for asymptomatic or symptomatic infection.
    Yep, I had 3 doses of vaccine and still got it.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Leon said:

    alex_ said:

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    Although if we did no doubt we’d discover in very short order that we’re fighting the wrong one. The real importance of planning is the extent to which you can be flexible to rapidly changing circumstances and evidence.
    I hate to labour the point but it would also REALLY help if we knew where the damn virus came from, in terms of stopping the next
    Fair point.

    However more generally, whilst it is of course possible that another deadly pandemic could be along in a couple of years, there might not be another one for 50. Plenty of time for responsible govts to put in place excellent plans, let them lapse, do them again etc etc.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    That has been worrying me for some time.

    The planet has dealt very poorly with a relatively mild pandemic. How on earth are we going to perform if a really nasty virus or bacteria gets a grip?
  • CookieCookie Posts: 11,184
    alex_ said:

    Pro_Rata said:

    FF43 said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    Literally an edge case, but there is no doubt the spectators as well as the game itself are in Wales.
    Who polices Chester City games?
    Chester constabulary. Wonder if they’ve even got authority to enforce Welsh law?
    Cheshire Police also have a dodgy chief constable, which thinks football fans standing up leads to them taking cochineal.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
  • Leon said:

    Taz said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    There are a couple more on her Wikipedia page. Quite frankly my wife is in her mid fifties and her bum is in better shape and according to Wikipedia This pic was estimated as being painted when she was 14/15.
    What an interesting Wiki page she has. A truly remarkable life.

    Born to a family of half-Irish prostitutes and thieves, found by an artist as a girl, got painted nude, became mistress to the French King, got dumped by the French king, then lived to a ripe old age after buying a palace and marrying twice and somehow surviving the guillotine, and her great grandson was Governor General of Algeria

    Brilliant
    She also (allegedly) was fancied by Casanova. AND her father was arrested and incarcerated in the Bastille for trying to blackmail the French court by threatening to turn over to the British govt correspondence between the Kings first minister and the Old Pretender.
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489
    FF43 said:

    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    Farooq said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Don't pay too much attention to the border drawn by Google. It's not exact.
    This is the OS map. The stadium is definitely in Wales


    Could the club quickly build a new front door and a long tunnel to link to the stadium?
    The activity itself is taking place in Wales and that is what is being controlled. If the issue was about how the club is regulated then English regulation would apply because the club is registered in England. (I think).
    I understand that the Belgium/Netherlands Boarder is very complex with enclaves and exclaves.

    The rule there is if any building spans the boarder then the whole building is under the derestriction of whichever nation the front door is in. I don't know if the same principle applies in other places?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    That has been worrying me for some time.

    The planet has dealt very poorly with a relatively mild pandemic. How on earth are we going to perform if a really nasty virus or bacteria gets a grip?
    Was it really “relatively mild”? Or does it only appear so because of the vaccines? Place this virus back in 1918 and what damage does it do?

    Actually I think the most notable feature of this virus was its relative apparent harmlessness to the young and working age. The way modern society is today, I think one affecting children in particular could mean never being allowed to leave our houses ever again…
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391
    I wonder if and when Drakeford starts to get some blowback. Press conference today was completely batty and deluded, and Wales is not sufficiently foreign to be cut off from mainstream UK media where they might note Wales has more cases and a worse trajectory despite restrictions
  • Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Re: La O'Murphy, is it relevant to note that she was (apparently) just 15 years old when her "portrait" was painted?

    One wonders what Prince Andrew would have to say about that.

    Lots more interesting stuff in her wiki bio
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie-Louise_O'Murphy

    Make me proud to be Irish . . . sort of . . .

    Still above the age of consent in France, and at the time in question it was apparently 11.
    Sounds shocking to us, of course - 11. Wtf

    And yet the age of consent in Spain was 13 - until
    2013.
    It was commonplace in the 60s to argue that teenagers were maturing earlier and therefore the age of consent deserved to be lowered. I might even have suggested as much myself on occasion.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,851
    edited January 2022
    Leon said:

    glw said:

    Leon said:

    His point about Daszak - the creepy scientist at Wuhan - successfully avoiding all questions (let alone arrest/trial etc) is bang on. The Americans can’t do much about Chinese labs and Chinese boffins, but Daszak is a US citizen, who got US funding, and he lives in the USA

    He could be hauled in front of a Senate committee/courtroom tomorrow. Yet they don’t do it

    Which strongly suggests plenty of important people in the USA are worried as F about their possible guilt, and are quite content for the whole Covid-origin question to be airily waved away as “unknowable”

    Which is even more reason to investigate it

    Did you see this? A suspected Delta lab-leak from a BSL3 laboratory in Taiwan.

    https://fortune.com/2021/12/10/taiwan-investigates-covid-lab-leak-scientist-tests-positive-bite-infected-mouse/

    Far too many people act as though lab-leaks of dangerous viruses can't happen.
    Yes indeed. Which makes the successful suppression of the lab leak hypothesis - as a “racist conspiracy” - for at least a year, all the more remarkable, and outrageous

    They acted like it was an insane concept - a virus leaking from a lab! No way! - and anyone who voiced the possibility was a crackpot Trumpite

    Quintessential gaslighting

    I confess it worked on me, for a while. My initial assumption when the virus first emerged was Oh it must have come from the lab. The coincidence was just too much. This was, let it be noted, the initial assumption of the Chinese scientist who runs the lab - batwoman Shi - she thought “Christ what if it got out of my lab” and she rushed back from Shanghai to “check”. So it was not an absurd theory to HER

    Then the Lancet letter came out and everyone denounced the hypothesis and I thought “well they must know what they’re talking about”

    A couple of months later the doubts began. THAT virus in THAT city with THAT lab? Etc
    The point you make is a good one. No way should that lab leak theory (lol) have been laughed at. At least nobody's laughing now but I guess you'd say that doesn't make it all alright because it should never have been laughed at in the first place. And again you'd be right.

    However I'd like to add a point of my own and it's this. Time management. None of us are able to check out properly the merits of every point of view we come across about something interesting & important in the field of world events. If we tried to do so we'd be doing nothing else and still couldn't cover but a fraction.

    So what do we do? We use shortcuts, one of which is to place weight (or not) on something based on who & where it's coming from. I do this, you do this, we all do this. Ok, some do more digging than others and some are less biased than others (these 2 things not necessarily being correlated, btw, since you can be lazy but not prone to bias or a dervish researcher but only look for what you want) nevertheless it's true in general that people form opinions on something based largely on other people's opinions of it.

    Given the frequent necessity to take this shortcut, it's good news that there's one rule of thumb which is just incredibly efficient in terms of the time it saves and the near zero error rate it leads to for those who follow it. The rule is - Anything that come out of the mouth of an ardent Trumpite MAGA follower is complete & utter horsehit.

    Seems that here - just this once - it might have let us down. But I'll be sticking with it. Life's too short not to.
  • Cookie said:

    alex_ said:

    Pro_Rata said:

    FF43 said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    Literally an edge case, but there is no doubt the spectators as well as the game itself are in Wales.
    Who polices Chester City games?
    Chester constabulary. Wonder if they’ve even got authority to enforce Welsh law?
    Cheshire Police also have a dodgy chief constable, which thinks football fans standing up leads to them taking cochineal.
    What about The New Saints Football Club? They are based in Oswestry but play in the Cymru Premier.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Gosh that’s… quite unusual
  • (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    1h
    Wes Streeting is a serious politician. The Tories need to be worried about this guy.

    Hodges really is the "idiot" his mother accused him of being. He really is a dick. He blows hot and cold. One week it is a love-in with Johnson the next it is Wes Streeting.
    Lol! Wes Streeting is an absolute lightweight.
    Oi! He's my MP!
  • BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    Farooq said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Don't pay too much attention to the border drawn by Google. It's not exact.
    This is the OS map. The stadium is definitely in Wales


    Could the club quickly build a new front door and a long tunnel to link to the stadium?
    The activity itself is taking place in Wales and that is what is being controlled. If the issue was about how the club is regulated then English regulation would apply because the club is registered in England. (I think).
    I understand that the Belgium/Netherlands Boarder is very complex with enclaves and exclaves.

    The rule there is if any building spans the boarder then the whole building is under the derestriction of whichever nation the front door is in. I don't know if the same principle applies in other places?
    If the Cheshire Police attend the games then if it is in Wales, Drakeford can pick up the bill

    This situation highlights the nonsense of Drakeford's laws
  • A man in India got jabbed with a Covid-19 vaccine at least eight times last year, a health official said.

    Brahmdeo Mandal, 65, has claimed that he received 11 doses of the vaccine in Bihar state.

    The retired postman said the jabs had helped him to get rid of aches and pains and "stay healthy". He claimed he had not suffered any adverse effects.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-59905339

    Novak, meet Mr. Brahmdeo...
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Leon said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Gosh that’s… quite unusual
    "Turning a children fairytale into an adult one holds many surprises and new interpretations."

    I think interpretations should be singular.
  • Re: speed traps (don't know what they're called in UK) two notorious ones when I was cruising the landscape many moons ago, were Friendly (!) WV and Bunkie LA.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 15,545
    edited January 2022
    alex_ said:

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    That has been worrying me for some time.

    The planet has dealt very poorly with a relatively mild pandemic. How on earth are we going to perform if a really nasty virus or bacteria gets a grip?
    Was it really “relatively mild”? Or does it only appear so because of the vaccines? Place this virus back in 1918 and what damage does it do?

    Actually I think the most notable feature of this virus was its relative apparent harmlessness to the young and working age. The way modern society is today, I think one affecting children in particular could mean never being allowed to leave our houses ever again…
    The killer, literally, with Covid-19, as I understand is the combination of relatively high transmissibility and mortality. There are other diseases, which are more infectious and others with a higher IFR. The combination makes this thing so fatal.

    There have been three epidemics of this deadliness in modern times: Covid-19, Spanish Flu and HIV/AIDS (which people tend to forget about because of the stigma associated with it)
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    1h
    Wes Streeting is a serious politician. The Tories need to be worried about this guy.

    Hodges really is the "idiot" his mother accused him of being. He really is a dick. He blows hot and cold. One week it is a love-in with Johnson the next it is Wes Streeting.
    Lol! Wes Streeting is an absolute lightweight.
    Oi! He's my MP!
    I see his name, I think that'll be Labour's first black leader, and I am taken aback every time I see a photo of him. It just seems a really Brixton name.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,535

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    Many countries haven't learnt anything even during the pandemic when they have made the same mistakes repeatedly, or watched one country fail at something and then done the same thing themselves. There's no way the human race is going to be prepared for the next big pandemic, give it 5 to 10 years and whatever is being done to prepare will begin to be seen as wasteful and unnecessary.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    Leon said:

    His point about Daszak - the creepy scientist at Wuhan - successfully avoiding all questions (let alone arrest/trial etc) is bang on. The Americans can’t do much about Chinese labs and Chinese boffins, but Daszak is a US citizen, who got US funding, and he lives in the USA

    He could be hauled in front of a Senate committee/courtroom tomorrow. Yet they don’t do it

    Which strongly suggests plenty of important people in the USA are worried as F about their possible guilt, and are quite content for the whole Covid-origin question to be airily waved away as “unknowable”

    Which is even more reason to investigate it

    Did you see this? A suspected Delta lab-leak from a BSL3 laboratory in Taiwan.

    https://fortune.com/2021/12/10/taiwan-investigates-covid-lab-leak-scientist-tests-positive-bite-infected-mouse/

    Far too many people act as though lab-leaks of dangerous viruses can't happen.
    Yes indeed. Which makes the successful suppression of the lab leak hypothesis - as a “racist conspiracy” - for at least a year, all the more remarkable, and outrageous

    They acted like it was an insane concept - a virus leaking from a lab! No way! - and anyone who voiced the possibility was a crackpot Trumpite

    Quintessential gaslighting

    I confess it worked on me, for a while. My initial assumption when the virus first emerged was Oh it must have come from the lab. The coincidence was just too much. This was, let it be noted, the initial assumption of the Chinese scientist who runs the lab - batwoman Shi - she thought “Christ what if it got out of my lab” and she rushed back from Shanghai to “check”. So it was not an absurd theory to HER

    Then the Lancet letter came out and everyone denounced the hypothesis and I thought “well they must know what they’re talking about”

    A couple of months later the doubts began. THAT virus in THAT city with THAT lab? Etc
    The point you make is a good one. No way should that lab leak theory (lol) have been laughed at. At least nobody's laughing now but I guess you'd say that doesn't make it all alright because it should never have been laughed at in the first place. And again you'd be right.

    However I'd like to add a point of my own and it's this. Time management. None of us are able to check out properly the merits of every point of view we come across about something interesting & important in the field of world events. If we tried to do so we'd be doing nothing else and still couldn't cover but a fraction.

    So what do we do? We use shortcuts, one of which is to place weight (or not) on something based on who & where it's coming from. I do this, you do this, we all do this. Ok, some do more digging than others and some are less biased than others (these 2 things not necessarily being correlated, btw, since you can be lazy but not prone to bias or a dervish researcher but only look for what you want) nevertheless it's true in general that people form opinions on something based largely on other people's opinions of it.

    Given the frequent necessity to take this shortcut, it's good news that there's one rule of thumb which is just incredibly efficient in terms of the time it saves and the near zero error rate it leads to for those who follow it. The rule is - Anything that come out of the mouth of an ardent Trumpite MAGA follower is complete & utter horsehit.

    Seems that here - just this once - it might have let us down. But I'll be sticking with it. Life's too short not to.
    The problem - as I am sure you and Leon know - is that the lab leak theory became politicised. If you believed it, you were Trump-ist and so the polite classes didn't want to go near the theory with a barge pole.

    That distaste should have been put to one side and the facts investigated. And, if the horror of being associated with a "Trumpy" view was too much, then at least tell yourself even a broken clock is right twice a day.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    alex_ said:

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    That has been worrying me for some time.

    The planet has dealt very poorly with a relatively mild pandemic. How on earth are we going to perform if a really nasty virus or bacteria gets a grip?
    Was it really “relatively mild”? Or does it only appear so because of the vaccines? Place this virus back in 1918 and what damage does it do?

    Actually I think the most notable feature of this virus was its relative apparent harmlessness to the young and working age. The way modern society is today, I think one affecting children in particular could mean never being allowed to leave our houses ever again…
    No, it was not 'mild'. Indeed, it is pretty hard to imagine a pandemic much worse than delta - highly transmissible and lower respiratory tract-based, making it both transmissible and deadly.

    Sure, there are more 'deadly' viruses, i.e. viruses with a higher mortality rate, such as CCHF or Ebola. And historically the black death and cholera were more devastating than COVID. But there are limited ways in which disease spreads - air, water, food, contamination, vectors (insects, mites, ticks, animals), or bodily fluids. Those past deadly pandemics were spread via ways that are far easier to protect against (vectors, water) today than an airborne virus such as delta. And both CCHF and Ebola are much easier to protect against than COVID.

    Now a delta variant that caused a cytokine storm in the young would have been more deadly. But I am not sure what preparations other than what has been developed under COVID (expanded research base, deployment of new technologies, fast track approvals of drugs and vaccines) could be made ahead of time.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,623

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    That has been worrying me for some time.

    The planet has dealt very poorly with a relatively mild pandemic. How on earth are we going to perform if a really nasty virus or bacteria gets a grip?
    I don't know if we've dealt with it very poorly. 30 or 40 years ago this would just have rolled through the population. There'd have been no mass working from home, no quick vaccine turn-around, no mass lateral flow testing, much less in the way of sheer statistical information and pooled research to track and understand it globally, etc., etc.

    Essentially we know so much more about this than we would reasonably expect to have known even just a few decades back, which I think colours expectation in terms of how we "dealt" with it.

    Also, we've learned we CAN do these things, which is useful information. Back when this all started we thought lockdown might cause entire countries to collapse. It might well do if continued on an indefinite timescale, but we proved we could do these things for at least some period of time. Admittedly at great financial cost, but there you go.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 48,921
    edited January 2022
    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    Farooq said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Don't pay too much attention to the border drawn by Google. It's not exact.
    This is the OS map. The stadium is definitely in Wales


    Could the club quickly build a new front door and a long tunnel to link to the stadium?
    The activity itself is taking place in Wales and that is what is being controlled. If the issue was about how the club is regulated then English regulation would apply because the club is registered in England. (I think).
    I understand that the Belgium/Netherlands Boarder is very complex with enclaves and exclaves.

    The rule there is if any building spans the boarder then the whole building is under the derestriction of whichever nation the front door is in. I don't know if the same principle applies in other places?
    The India/Bangladesh border was even more complex until recently with enclaves within enclaves .

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–Bangladesh_enclaves
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    edited January 2022
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    Leon said:

    His point about Daszak - the creepy scientist at Wuhan - successfully avoiding all questions (let alone arrest/trial etc) is bang on. The Americans can’t do much about Chinese labs and Chinese boffins, but Daszak is a US citizen, who got US funding, and he lives in the USA

    He could be hauled in front of a Senate committee/courtroom tomorrow. Yet they don’t do it

    Which strongly suggests plenty of important people in the USA are worried as F about their possible guilt, and are quite content for the whole Covid-origin question to be airily waved away as “unknowable”

    Which is even more reason to investigate it

    Did you see this? A suspected Delta lab-leak from a BSL3 laboratory in Taiwan.

    https://fortune.com/2021/12/10/taiwan-investigates-covid-lab-leak-scientist-tests-positive-bite-infected-mouse/

    Far too many people act as though lab-leaks of dangerous viruses can't happen.
    Yes indeed. Which makes the successful suppression of the lab leak hypothesis - as a “racist conspiracy” - for at least a year, all the more remarkable, and outrageous

    They acted like it was an insane concept - a virus leaking from a lab! No way! - and anyone who voiced the possibility was a crackpot Trumpite

    Quintessential gaslighting

    I confess it worked on me, for a while. My initial assumption when the virus first emerged was Oh it must have come from the lab. The coincidence was just too much. This was, let it be noted, the initial assumption of the Chinese scientist who runs the lab - batwoman Shi - she thought “Christ what if it got out of my lab” and she rushed back from Shanghai to “check”. So it was not an absurd theory to HER

    Then the Lancet letter came out and everyone denounced the hypothesis and I thought “well they must know what they’re talking about”

    A couple of months later the doubts began. THAT virus in THAT city with THAT lab? Etc
    The point you make is a good one. No way should that lab leak theory (lol) have been laughed at. At least nobody's laughing now but I guess you'd say that doesn't make it all alright because it should never have been laughed at in the first place. And again you'd be right.

    However I'd like to add a point of my own and it's this. Time management. None of us are able to check out properly the merits of every point of view we come across about something interesting & important in the field of world events. If we tried to do so we'd be doing nothing else and still couldn't cover but a fraction.

    So what do we do? We use shortcuts, one of which is to place weight (or not) on something based on who & where it's coming from. I do this, you do this, we all do this. Ok, some do more digging than others and some are less biased than others (these 2 things not necessarily being correlated, btw, since you can be lazy but not prone to bias or a dervish researcher but only look for what you want) nevertheless it's true in general that people form opinions on something based largely on other people's opinions of it.

    Given the frequent necessity to take this shortcut, it's good news that there's one rule of thumb which is just incredibly efficient in terms of the time it saves and the near zero error rate it leads to for those who follow it. The rule is - Anything that come out of the mouth of an ardent Trumpite MAGA follower is complete & utter horsehit.

    Seems that here - just this once - it might have let us down. But I'll be sticking with it. Life's too short not to.
    You just don’t have a very inquiring mind. It’s not your nature. This is not a political point let alone an insult. Some of my friends (of various political persuasions) are exactly the same. They’ve got a set of opinions they formed quite young, they’re not particularly interested in anything that challenges them. They don’t want to know. Better things to do.

    They’re far from stupid, but they’re narrow in thinking. Settled. The kind of person you might want as an accountant. But definitely not the sort of person you’d want as a journalist

    Conversely, you really wouldn’t want me as your accountant. I’d get overexcited on Day 3 and tell you to invest everything in Doge just before it crashes, making you bankrupt

    The world needs all types
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,088
    edited January 2022
    maaarsh said:

    I wonder if and when Drakeford starts to get some blowback. Press conference today was completely batty and deluded, and Wales is not sufficiently foreign to be cut off from mainstream UK media where they might note Wales has more cases and a worse trajectory despite restrictions

    Probably not. The structure of devolution means that the Welsh Government gets to earn brownie points by always saying how safe and responsible it is being when it applies new rules, whilst the UK Treasury gets the brickbats for any failings in the financial support arrangements during the crisis, and all the tax rises needed to pay for it afterwards.

    The entire responsibility for this sorry state of affairs lies, of course, in Westminster not Cardiff.
  • Data suggests around 98% of UK now have some level of immunity (both natural and vaccinated) - meaning that even if infected again- will have milder disease. This is hopefully why hospitalisations have not so far risen as fast as feared.

    https://twitter.com/timspector/status/1479514782336229376?s=20
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 15,545
    edited January 2022

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    That has been worrying me for some time.

    The planet has dealt very poorly with a relatively mild pandemic. How on earth are we going to perform if a really nasty virus or bacteria gets a grip?
    I don't know if we've dealt with it very poorly. 30 or 40 years ago this would just have rolled through the population. There'd have been no mass working from home, no quick vaccine turn-around, no mass lateral flow testing, much less in the way of sheer statistical information and pooled research to track and understand it globally, etc., etc.

    Essentially we know so much more about this than we would reasonably expect to have known even just a few decades back, which I think colours expectation in terms of how we "dealt" with it.

    Also, we've learned we CAN do these things, which is useful information. Back when this all started we thought lockdown might cause entire countries to collapse. It might well do if continued on an indefinite timescale, but we proved we could do these things for at least some period of time. Admittedly at great financial cost, but there you go.
    There is an interesting counterfactual on how many would have died without vaccines and non-pharmaceutical interventions. Imperial originally modelled ca 500 000 deaths in the UK alone without interventions. (Considerably more than the death toll for all of WW2 for comparison) That feels about right to me.

    Vaccines have been the success story of this pandemic.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,399
    Of all the PBers who could possibly have posted an image of a naked teenage girl, Leon had to be the least likely.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603

    Data suggests around 98% of UK now have some level of immunity (both natural and vaccinated) - meaning that even if infected again- will have milder disease. This is hopefully why hospitalisations have not so far risen as fast as feared.

    https://twitter.com/timspector/status/1479514782336229376?s=20

    Not just hopefully, past experience of viruses suggests it is very likely to be the reason why hospitalisations aren't spiking like the previous waves. Some people have been suggesting as such for a while, the government modellers seem to have completely ignored this and come up with a set of fantasy figures.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    edited January 2022

    Of all the PBers who could possibly have posted an image of a naked teenage girl, Leon had to be the least likely.

    In my defence I didn’t start the thread. It was Carnyx!

    And if any police inspectors are reading the site, let’s reiterate the image is an extremely famous rococo painting from the 18th century, freely available in thousands of books, prints, JPEG’s etc
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603
    FF43 said:

    By far the most important bit of that Cummings blog is the last section where he points out, completely correctly, that despite covid neither we nor anyone else seem to be doing anything differently to avoid the next pandemic.

    https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1479483127118667783?s=20

    That has been worrying me for some time.

    The planet has dealt very poorly with a relatively mild pandemic. How on earth are we going to perform if a really nasty virus or bacteria gets a grip?
    I don't know if we've dealt with it very poorly. 30 or 40 years ago this would just have rolled through the population. There'd have been no mass working from home, no quick vaccine turn-around, no mass lateral flow testing, much less in the way of sheer statistical information and pooled research to track and understand it globally, etc., etc.

    Essentially we know so much more about this than we would reasonably expect to have known even just a few decades back, which I think colours expectation in terms of how we "dealt" with it.

    Also, we've learned we CAN do these things, which is useful information. Back when this all started we thought lockdown might cause entire countries to collapse. It might well do if continued on an indefinite timescale, but we proved we could do these things for at least some period of time. Admittedly at great financial cost, but there you go.
    There is an interesting counterfactual on how many would have died without vaccines and non-pharmaceutical interventions. Imperial originally modelled ca 500 000 deaths in the UK alone without interventions. (Considerably more than the death toll for all of WW2 for comparison) That feels about right to me.

    Vaccines have been the success story of this pandemic.
    They have, unfortunately a small set of idiots have decided not to get them and a large number of politicians have decided that vaccines aren't enough so have pushed for unnecessary lockdowns.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited January 2022
    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,399
    Heads up if you are in Yorkshire. Look North has a feature on 'wild' swimming.

  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,165
    Not sure if this will work for everyone, but check out London News:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/live/bbcone

    Go to 18:34

    Javid was confronted by a doctor who doesn't want to be vaccinated. Normally politicians come off looking bad in such circumstances, but on this occasion, I think it looks good for Javid.
  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,391

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    Unlocking in July (a bit late admittedly) and then not taking action 2 weeks ago looks to be a genuine masterstroke, up there with the initial vaccine procurement as moments when the government has stumbled on to a world leading approach, even if by accident.
  • HSA latest data shows that even after 3 months still very high level of protection among oldies against severe disease and hospitalisation, but protection against catching really drops off.
  • England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    Outlier in a purely good way. Drakeford should be taking notes.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 46,249
    IshmaelZ said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
    My god. A sensible law! On that refreshing note I’m off to the gym
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,279

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Looks for that Statute about what happens to Welshmen who stay in Chester overnight.
  • England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    He is quite extraordinarily out of touch and increasingly sounding so

    How this plays out for him I really do not know
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,958

    Re: speed traps (don't know what they're called in UK) two notorious ones when I was cruising the landscape many moons ago, were Friendly (!) WV and Bunkie LA.

    I once got done for speeding in Snowflake, Arizona.

    (He claimed his speed gun showed I was doing 70-odd. We looked at the car - a tiny GM Metro hire car that would have been burned off at the lights by a Trabant. We haggled a bit and I settled for a twenty bucks fine. What I learned from the whole episode was this: never let your hosts book your hire car....)
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    How much does economic /business failures impact on Welsh Govt finances? Genuine question. Basically are the trade-offs for the Welsh govt the same as they are for the English/U.K. one? (politics of it a different issue).
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    BigRich said:

    FF43 said:

    Farooq said:

    AlistairM said:

    Chester FC have been told by Police that they broke Covid regulations by having fans at recent games. Crowds allowed in England but different rules in Wales. They're now taking legal advice. Probably on how to move the border. 👇
    https://twitter.com/BarryAnderson_/status/1479450418648387586

    image

    An absolutely bizarre case! Looks from that picture that their front door is in England - my understanding is that is what determines one’s address. To which authority do they pay their council tax / rates ?
    Don't pay too much attention to the border drawn by Google. It's not exact.
    This is the OS map. The stadium is definitely in Wales


    Could the club quickly build a new front door and a long tunnel to link to the stadium?
    The activity itself is taking place in Wales and that is what is being controlled. If the issue was about how the club is regulated then English regulation would apply because the club is registered in England. (I think).
    I understand that the Belgium/Netherlands Boarder is very complex with enclaves and exclaves.

    The rule there is if any building spans the boarder then the whole building is under the derestriction of whichever nation the front door is in. I don't know if the same principle applies in other places?
    The India/Bangladesh border was even more complex until recently with enclaves within enclaves .

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India–Bangladesh_enclaves
    UAE/Oman border is the same. I suspect there’s quite a few countries where enclaves remain after conflict, or negotiations around the precise placement of borders.
    https://donstravels.com/oman-uae/

    Chester FC should cound themselves unlucky, perhaps they should lobby to move the border a couple of hundred feet West.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    So Drakeford will be happy to see the Wales rugby team play at Old Trafford or Villa Park then?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    edited January 2022
    tlg86 said:

    Not sure if this will work for everyone, but check out London News:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/live/bbcone

    Go to 18:34

    Javid was confronted by a doctor who doesn't want to be vaccinated. Normally politicians come off looking bad in such circumstances, but on this occasion, I think it looks good for Javid.

    I’ve mentioned before that opponents of NHS vaccine mandates (because of impact on staff shortages) are on dangerous ground when they come from the same groups also so (justifiably) despairing at the number of unvaxxed Covid victims they have to deal with.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Just catching up, sad news about Jack Dromey MP. RIP, and condolences to Harriet and children.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,280
    edited January 2022

    Interesting by election in Birmingham Erdington

    Sad news. RIP Jack Dromey.

    Lab 50%, Con 40%, Brexit 4%, LD 4%, Green 2%.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,603

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    Nicola is going to look really smart in 2 weeks when she rolls everything back to where England is, Scotland play in front of a packed stadium in the 6N while the parish councillor keeps Wales locked down and miserable.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    Outlier in a purely good way. Drakeford should be taking notes.
    English exceptionalism ;)
  • IshmaelZ said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
    A cartoon of Rupert Bear violating an old lady was central to the Oz trial in 1971.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,147
    Leon said:

    Of all the PBers who could possibly have posted an image of a naked teenage girl, Leon had to be the least likely.

    In my defence I didn’t start the thread. It was Carnyx!

    And if any police inspectors are reading the site, let’s reiterate the image is an extremely famous rococo painting from the 18th century, freely available in thousands of books, prints, JPEG’s etc
    I wasn't the one who posted a painting! Just talked about ancient statues.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    Drakey isn't very bright ... but he is an intellectual colossus in the Senedd.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,614
    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
    My god. A sensible law! On that refreshing note I’m off to the gym
    There was a recent case in the US, where the prosecution successfully argued that cartoons of a sexual nature depicting people who were clearly underage, should be in the same category as photographs of actual children being actually abused. No, I’m not sure I understand that one either.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,147

    IshmaelZ said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
    A cartoon of Rupert Bear violating an old lady was central to the Oz trial in 1971.
    I remember Rupert but not that part. I was at school at the time and one of my schoolmates had a copy of that Oz issue.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 49,958

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    Outlier in a purely good way. Drakeford should be taking notes.
    The way that the four nations have had different sets of Covid - for purely internal political point-scoring - should have been squashed at the very outset.
  • John Currin is a painter who tippy toes the line between erotic and pornographic (subjective measures I know); nsfw or in front of your gran I would advise. His prices are in the millions which of course makes him completely legit.

    https://tinyurl.com/2p92rbsf
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
    My god. A sensible law! On that refreshing note I’m off to the gym
    There was a recent case in the US, where the prosecution successfully argued that cartoons of a sexual nature depicting people who were clearly underage, should be in the same category as photographs of actual children being actually abused. No, I’m not sure I understand that one either.
    I might be wrong, but I believe the argument is similar to the 'violent games causing violent crimes' one. People watching cartoons showing extreme sexual content are more likely to perform extreme sexual acts because they become inured to it. It becomes normal.

    I don't consume such stuff, but I don't agree with that central idea.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 38,851
    edited January 2022
    MrEd said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    glw said:

    Leon said:

    His point about Daszak - the creepy scientist at Wuhan - successfully avoiding all questions (let alone arrest/trial etc) is bang on. The Americans can’t do much about Chinese labs and Chinese boffins, but Daszak is a US citizen, who got US funding, and he lives in the USA

    He could be hauled in front of a Senate committee/courtroom tomorrow. Yet they don’t do it

    Which strongly suggests plenty of important people in the USA are worried as F about their possible guilt, and are quite content for the whole Covid-origin question to be airily waved away as “unknowable”

    Which is even more reason to investigate it

    Did you see this? A suspected Delta lab-leak from a BSL3 laboratory in Taiwan.

    https://fortune.com/2021/12/10/taiwan-investigates-covid-lab-leak-scientist-tests-positive-bite-infected-mouse/

    Far too many people act as though lab-leaks of dangerous viruses can't happen.
    Yes indeed. Which makes the successful suppression of the lab leak hypothesis - as a “racist conspiracy” - for at least a year, all the more remarkable, and outrageous

    They acted like it was an insane concept - a virus leaking from a lab! No way! - and anyone who voiced the possibility was a crackpot Trumpite

    Quintessential gaslighting

    I confess it worked on me, for a while. My initial assumption when the virus first emerged was Oh it must have come from the lab. The coincidence was just too much. This was, let it be noted, the initial assumption of the Chinese scientist who runs the lab - batwoman Shi - she thought “Christ what if it got out of my lab” and she rushed back from Shanghai to “check”. So it was not an absurd theory to HER

    Then the Lancet letter came out and everyone denounced the hypothesis and I thought “well they must know what they’re talking about”

    A couple of months later the doubts began. THAT virus in THAT city with THAT lab? Etc
    The point you make is a good one. No way should that lab leak theory (lol) have been laughed at. At least nobody's laughing now but I guess you'd say that doesn't make it all alright because it should never have been laughed at in the first place. And again you'd be right.

    However I'd like to add a point of my own and it's this. Time management. None of us are able to check out properly the merits of every point of view we come across about something interesting & important in the field of world events. If we tried to do so we'd be doing nothing else and still couldn't cover but a fraction.

    So what do we do? We use shortcuts, one of which is to place weight (or not) on something based on who & where it's coming from. I do this, you do this, we all do this. Ok, some do more digging than others and some are less biased than others (these 2 things not necessarily being correlated, btw, since you can be lazy but not prone to bias or a dervish researcher but only look for what you want) nevertheless it's true in general that people form opinions on something based largely on other people's opinions of it.

    Given the frequent necessity to take this shortcut, it's good news that there's one rule of thumb which is just incredibly efficient in terms of the time it saves and the near zero error rate it leads to for those who follow it. The rule is - Anything that come out of the mouth of an ardent Trumpite MAGA follower is complete & utter horsehit.

    Seems that here - just this once - it might have let us down. But I'll be sticking with it. Life's too short not to.
    The problem - as I am sure you and Leon know - is that the lab leak theory became politicised. If you believed it, you were Trump-ist and so the polite classes didn't want to go near the theory with a barge pole.

    That distaste should have been put to one side and the facts investigated. And, if the horror of being associated with a "Trumpy" view was too much, then at least tell yourself even a broken clock is right twice a day.
    Yes, fair point from you there. Is it a leap year?

    The 'Authorities" shouldn't be letting politics skew how they treat something like that. I was more talking about how 'ordinary' people make their minds up on issues in the general flow of things. Who is saying what is important there, very important.

    Eg, if you switched the people backing Remain and Leave, I'd have voted Leave. No need to spin any wheels on it. Leave.
  • Carnyx said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
    A cartoon of Rupert Bear violating an old lady was central to the Oz trial in 1971.
    I remember Rupert but not that part. I was at school at the time and one of my schoolmates had a copy of that Oz issue.
    It was the schoolkids angle that did for them. In a moment of madness I joined a demo after the verdict which Felix Dennis addressed. He'd been given a short back and sides in prison which seemed particularly shocking. John and Yoko were there too. The only demo JL ever attended, apparently.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,147

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    Outlier in a purely good way. Drakeford should be taking notes.
    The way that the four nations have had different sets of Covid - for purely internal political point-scoring - should have been squashed at the very outset.
    Yes, because Mr Johnson always knows best. Aye right.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,881
    BigRich said:

    rkrkrk said:

    BigRich said:

    On Tuesday evening on this site I made a bet with rkrkrkr, that UK hospitalisations would not exceed a rate of 3,000 a day before the end of February.

    With 3 days of extra date now out, I'm feeling very confidant in this bet/prediction.

    Well good luck and obviously a large part of me hopes you win!
    I still think cases in England are rising fast (particularly among older age groups), and that will feed into hospitalizations soon.
    Good Evening rkrkrk, :)

    I what to be gentlemanly and wish you luck as well, but because of the natcher of the bet Ill stay away form theat. but thank you for the sentiment.

    Part of me is wishing I did not go for the 3,000 UK wide now. :(
    Well if you're feeling really confident we can do the same bet again, but for UK as well? More money to OGH either way!
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,147

    Carnyx said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Roger said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    As we are FINALLY TALKING ABOUT BOTTOMS, at least in the fine arts, here is one of my favourites. A Portrait of Louise O’Murphy, by Boucher



    I saw a television drama doc where they found this model and made this painting, the actress had an even better bottom and longer more slender legs.

    I’ve been obsessed by the female nude just about all my life. Painted millions And I have posed, but never like this though, that pose is just so naughty. But it makes beautiful painting from this angle.
    It is a sensationally erotic painting. One of the sexiest ever. Yet in its way quite innocent. Not “pornographic”

    My ex arguably had a peachier bottom than O’Murphy, and longer legs, likewise. No wonder the photographer got quite hot under her Sapphic collar
    Is that painting erotic? My reaction is to wonder what happened to her right thigh.
    Then you should post a painting that you DO find erotic. Go on, it might be fun

    It’s such a pleasant distraction from ICU occupancy and booster rates
    I saw this artist recently in Venice. Specialises in superheroes

    https://superrare.com/artwork-v2/in-bocca-al-lupo-31078
    Bloody hell, Roger, you realise we could all be doing stretches for having a copy of that in our cache?
    Sincere question: is that true? Could that image get you into trouble? It’s clearly a cartoon not a real person (however alarming)

    It’s mad if you could go to jail for merely looking at a cartoon. The artist might need therapy, however
    No, sorry I am wrong (hold the front page!)

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/extreme-pornography

    It is a requirement that "A reasonable person looking at the image would think that the persons or animals were real."
    A cartoon of Rupert Bear violating an old lady was central to the Oz trial in 1971.
    I remember Rupert but not that part. I was at school at the time and one of my schoolmates had a copy of that Oz issue.
    It was the schoolkids angle that did for them. In a moment of madness I joined a demo after the verdict which Felix Dennis addressed. He'd been given a short back and sides in prison which seemed particularly shocking. John and Yoko were there too. The only demo JL ever attended, apparently.
    Schoolkids as in the drawings or schoolkids as guest editors? Don't remember the former.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172
    alex_ said:

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    How much does economic /business failures impact on Welsh Govt finances? Genuine question. Basically are the trade-offs for the Welsh govt the same as they are for the English/U.K. one? (politics of it a different issue).
    I think if economic or business failure were at all relevant in Wales, then the Government would change.

    Here is Lee Waters AM for Llanelli (Labour, natch)

    "For 20 years we've pretended we know what we're doing on the economy - and the truth is we don't really know what we're doing on the economy.

    "Nobody knows what they're doing on the economy.

    "Everybody is making it up as we go along - and let's just be honest about that. We've thrown all the orthodox tools we can think of at growing the economy in the conventional way, and we've achieved static GDP over 20 years."

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-48757245

    Unsurprisingly, Labour has not "achieved static".

    Wales has grown poorer over the last 20 years.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,280
    edited January 2022

    England is a “global outlier” in the fight against the Omicron wave of coronavirus because of its anti-restrictions stance, Wales’s First Minister Mark Drakeford has said.

    He isn't very bright is he....if you are going to make some shit up, you as well make it hard to check.

    He is quite extraordinarily out of touch and increasingly sounding so

    How this plays out for him I really do not know
    It appears that a large percentage of the Welsh population enjoys being nannied at every opportunity.
This discussion has been closed.