The LDs now clear betting favourite to gain North Shropshire – politicalbetting.com
A week today the Tories will be defending the by-election – a seat they won with a majority of 40%+ over LAB at GE2019 when the LDs were in third place – 53% behind the Tories.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
414,645 booster vaccinations in 🇬🇧 yesterday (407,851 the previous Wednesday)
🏴 340,615 🏴 39,327 🏴 20,314 NI 14,389
While it is too slow, it is worth noting that the UK has delivered booster shots to a third of the population (total) by now. That puts us second behind only Israel in the whole world. And the UK is still on a sharply rising path. On current trends, you'd expect it to pass Israel around Christmas.
It's also worth noting that Europe is beginning to get a move on. A month ago just 4% of Germans had had a booster. Today it's almost 19%.
List of Tory voters that HYUFD wants to dispense with:
Red wall first time Tories Poor people Voters who have voted for other parties in the past Old Women, especially Welsh ones Non-CofE congregants The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Surely both Sleaford and Old Bexley were Tory by-election holds over the Lib Dems (and everyone else)?
Also, it isn't "cocky" to be betting favourites - supporters of all parties are allowed to, and do, place bets. Personally, I continue to think it is a very big ask for the LDs although the signs look quite good. I think the reaction over the past couple of days in the betting markets may be a slight over-reaction given how many votes will already have been cast by post.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Surely both Sleaford and Old Bexley were Tory by-election holds over the Lib Dems (and everyone else)?
Also, it isn't "cocky" to be betting favourites - supporters of all parties are allowed to, and do, place bets. Personally, I continue to think it is a very big ask for the LDs although the signs look quite good. I think the reaction over the past couple of days in the betting markets may be a slight over-reaction given how many votes will already have been cast by post.
No, Labour were a clear second before in Sleaford and Old Bexley and the main challengers, the LDs did not bother with much effort in either.
In North Shropshire the LDs are throwing everyone but the kitchen sink at it!
List of Tory voters that HYUFD wants to dispense with:
Red wall first time Tories Poor people Voters who have voted for other parties in the past Old Women, especially Welsh ones Non-CofE congregants The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
As for me, better than evens on the Cons holding a seat with such a big margin just 2 years ago is very tempting but something is stopping me. Going to sit it out.
Lord Geidt: For the credibility of this inquiry, I have tested the assertions of Lord Brownlow and the relevant political and government officials that at no point in the eight months until late February 2021, as media reports were emerging, was the prime minister made aware of either the fact or the method of the costs of refurbishing the apartment having been paid.
Electoral Commission: Lord Brownlow via WhatsApp asking him to authorise further, at that stage unspecified, refurbishment works on the residence. Lord Brownlow agreed to do so, and also explained that the proposed trust had not yet been set up but that he knew where the funding was coming from.
So, we have a clear breach of Electoral Law. And at least one clear breach of the Ministerial Code. EDIT. Also that the Number 10 lie machine is trying on the defence of "Lord Brownlow was chair of the blind trust, and acted in accordance with his experience of managing blind trusts in that way. The prime minister’s discussions with Lord Brownlow were done without him knowing the underlying donor.". Except that as the Electoral Commission note, there was no blind trust at the time of the 29/11/20 WhatsApp message, and as it is asking for further money it is clear earlier messages had also been exchanged.
As the Votemaster General notes above, "This is great news for Boris."
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Surely both Sleaford and Old Bexley were Tory by-election holds over the Lib Dems (and everyone else)?
Also, it isn't "cocky" to be betting favourites - supporters of all parties are allowed to, and do, place bets. Personally, I continue to think it is a very big ask for the LDs although the signs look quite good. I think the reaction over the past couple of days in the betting markets may be a slight over-reaction given how many votes will already have been cast by post.
No, Labour were a clear second before in Sleaford and Old Bexley and the main challengers, the LDs did not bother with much effort in either.
In North Shropshire the LDs are throwing everyone but the kitchen sink at it!
That's wasn't your original claim, although I agree the LDs put little effort into them. It does rather reduce the impact of your "five years!" claim though. Basically, what you're saying is LDs have had three successive wins over the Tories in seats they've had a proper go at (two if you exclude Richmond Park on the basis there wasn't technically a Conservative candidate).
Of those efforts, North Shropshire is EASILY the toughest ask. Both Richmond and Brecon had had Lib Dem MPs in the recent past, and Chesham was a Remain voting seat where the Lib Dems started in a clear (though poor) second.
List of Tory voters that HYUFD wants to dispense with:
Red wall first time Tories Poor people Voters who have voted for other parties in the past Old Women, especially Welsh ones Non-CofE congregants The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
Even just voting twice for Blair in near 60 years of GEs and actively playing a role at all the other GEs for the party I have been ex-communicated !!!!!
Do you know if the Borders bill has passed the HOC as I thought a vote was due this week ?
Point of order. The motion on Paterson wasn't defeated. It passed with 13 Tory votes against. It was the reaction and subsequent U-turn which led him to quit.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Surely both Sleaford and Old Bexley were Tory by-election holds over the Lib Dems (and everyone else)?
Also, it isn't "cocky" to be betting favourites - supporters of all parties are allowed to, and do, place bets. Personally, I continue to think it is a very big ask for the LDs although the signs look quite good. I think the reaction over the past couple of days in the betting markets may be a slight over-reaction given how many votes will already have been cast by post.
No, Labour were a clear second before in Sleaford and Old Bexley and the main challengers, the LDs did not bother with much effort in either.
In North Shropshire the LDs are throwing everyone but the kitchen sink at it!
That's wasn't your original claim, although I agree the LDs put little effort into them. It does rather reduce the impact of your "five years!" claim though. Basically, what you're saying is LDs have had three successive wins over the Tories in seats they've had a proper go at (two if you exclude Richmond Park on the basis there wasn't technically a Conservative candidate).
They also did pretty well in Witney, although they were still fifteen points behind.
The chart is rather strange as it adds up to over 101% while omitting Labour's candidate. I concede that he's unlikely to win, but he certainly has a better chance than the RefUK lady.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
"This is great news for Boris"
Lol
You are Muhammad Saeed al-Sahhaf and I claim my £5!
List of Tory voters that HYUFD wants to dispense with:
Red wall first time Tories Poor people Voters who have voted for other parties in the past Old Women, especially Welsh ones Non-CofE congregants The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government today.
The chart is rather strange as it adds up to over 101% while omitting Labour's candidate. I concede that he's unlikely to win, but he certainly has a better chance than the RefUK lady.
He doesn't have a better chance than the RefUK candidate - he has exactly the same chance, that being zero. Only two parties have any chance whatsoever in this one - betting on anything else is throwing the money away and only a fool would touch it.
You're right the chart must be wrong though - can't be 101% (actually nearer 102%) as not a rounding thing.
John Burn-Murdoch @jburnmurdoch · 3h 1) Good to see this now being acknowledged and communicated by WHO 2) It doesn't mean "Omicron is milder". It means immunity (via both vax and infection) is kicking in Flexed biceps Quote Tweet
Clare Wilson @ClareWilsonMed · 4h WHO says there are preliminary signs omicron is milder as hospitalisations in South Africa remain low.
414,645 booster vaccinations in 🇬🇧 yesterday (407,851 the previous Wednesday)
🏴 340,615 🏴 39,327 🏴 20,314 NI 14,389
While it is too slow, it is worth noting that the UK has delivered booster shots to a third of the population (total) by now. That puts us second behind only Israel in the whole world. And the UK is still on a sharply rising path. On current trends, you'd expect it to pass Israel around Christmas.
It's also worth noting that Europe is beginning to get a move on. A month ago just 4% of Germans had had a booster. Today it's almost 19%.
I suspect Europe is later than us as they were 1-2 months behind last time.
Perhaps they are limited by people reaching the 6 month point?
The Europe numbers are better than I'd expected: a month ago they'd done virtually none. Now, most of them are moving at c. 3% of the population a week. If they'd started a little earlier, they'd be really motoring.
That being said, we are very lucky in the UK that we did AZ first (for most people). Mix and match is simply better.
(There was a - small - study in the US published this week that showed boosting Pfizer with J&J resulted in a much longer lived immune response.)
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing.
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government.
The regulations allow massive piss ups without masks, they do not allow masklessness in Tesco.
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government.
The Covid hypocrisy is everywhere. Journalists, public, politicians. Probably PBers, too.
Everyone just loves telling everyone else what to do.
@HenryJFoy Scandal - the EU likes to brag it has donated more Covid vaccines than any other state... but it has only delivered 124m of the 353m it claims to have donated, far fewer than the US, for example, has shipped to poorer countries https://www.ft.com/content/d0b53ea4-5eef-4bc7-814c-a69b0dfa1c06
The chart is rather strange as it adds up to over 101% while omitting Labour's candidate. I concede that he's unlikely to win, but he certainly has a better chance than the RefUK lady.
He doesn't have a better chance than the RefUK candidate - he has exactly the same chance, that being zero. Only two parties have any chance whatsoever in this one - betting on anything else is throwing the money away and only a fool would touch it.
You're right the chart must be wrong though - can't be 101% (actually nearer 102%) as not a rounding thing.
It comes from Betfair where there will usually be an overround (else a bot is going to come in and grab the free money).
The chart is rather strange as it adds up to over 101% while omitting Labour's candidate. I concede that he's unlikely to win, but he certainly has a better chance than the RefUK lady.
How do you think bookies make their profit? It is called the "over-round".
List of Tory voters that HYUFD wants to dispense with:
Red wall first time Tories Poor people Voters who have voted for other parties in the past Old Women, especially Welsh ones Non-CofE congregants The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
Even just voting twice for Blair in near 60 years of GEs and actively playing a role at all the other GEs for the party I have been ex-communicated !!!!!
Do you know if the Borders bill has passed the HOC as I thought a vote was due this week ?
Passed the report state on Tuesday. Priti Vacant's attempt to make your brave son a criminal is still in the bill. And her proposal to strip citizenship from non-British forrin scum is still in the bill.
Lets be fair, with *that* as a government, ex-communication isn't a bad thing.
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government.
The regulations allow massive piss ups without masks, they do not allow masklessness in Tesco.
Its the fact they are bringing up an absolutely ludicrous potential "loophole", clutching their pearls at the horror somebody might do such a thing and put everybody at risk....and they will all be there with their masks at the press conference nursing their hangovers from last night bash.
List of Tory voters that HYUFD wants to dispense with:
Red wall first time Tories Poor people Voters who have voted for other parties in the past Old Women, especially Welsh ones Non-CofE congregants The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
Anyone with any sort of Libertarian (spits) inclinations.
Of course people want as normal a life as possible. But most people are sensible enough to understand that it isn't always possible.
You are also going down a very deep and dangerous rabbit hole. Yes, we get lots of road deaths each year. We also invest heavily to try to reduce that figure, including bringing in legislation and laws that restrict what we can do in our cars - such as the use of mobile phones.
It's also a terrible analogy. Five people a day die on our roads. 161 died of Covid yesterday alone. Well over an order of magnitude higher.
Actually I think it might be a very good comparison if not analogy. Governments put a monetary value on people's lives. That value is not fixed but depends on what area of governance and risk you are talking about. So we find that the value of a statistical life for rail passengers (how much money the Government is willing to spend to save each life) is massively higher than the same value for car passengers. It has never been the case that the Government has a fixed value on human life. If it had been then either we would have had everyone in lockdown every winter (if the value had been high) or we would have made no safety improvements at all to our transport infrastructure (if the value had been too low).
In the context of Covid it is for society as a whole to decide what is an acceptable number of deaths for given levels of authoritarian regulation. We do it for Flu and set the bar very high. My personal view is we should have a similarly high bar for Covid. Sadly at the moment both the authoritarian political classes and much of the population seem to agree that it should be much lower. How long that will last when they find all their pubs and shops have disappeared and they are out of a job is another matter.
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing.
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government.
The regulations allow massive piss ups without masks, they do not allow masklessness in Tesco.
Its the fact they are bringing up an absolutely ludicrous potential "loophole", clutching their pearls at the horror somebody might do such a thing and put everybody at risk....and they will all be there with their masks at the press conference nursing their hangovers from last night bash.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
414,645 booster vaccinations in 🇬🇧 yesterday (407,851 the previous Wednesday)
🏴 340,615 🏴 39,327 🏴 20,314 NI 14,389
Just had my third jabberoo.
AZ-AZ–Moderna is my regimen I am past caring don't know how good that is supposed to be overall
We'll ask in a month, and see if an answer happens ...
I had all 3 pfizer
I was Pfizer x2 then Moderna. But complicated slightly by actually having the virus in between jabs 2 & 3 - which I would like to dream might confer even more immunity.
The chart is rather strange as it adds up to over 101% while omitting Labour's candidate. I concede that he's unlikely to win, but he certainly has a better chance than the RefUK lady.
I THINK it's intended to demonstrate that the Tory candidate is slipping, and defections to Reform have little to do with it.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Eh? The graph is of punters not LDs.
The letters from renowned betting experts have clearly now arrived
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government.
The Covid hypocrisy is everywhere. Journalists, public, politicians. Probably PBers, too.
Everyone just loves telling everyone else what to do.
The whole thing is a charade.
I think posts like that are unhelpful. You should post more constructively.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Eh? The graph is of punters not LDs.
It is their cockyness driving the betting markets, they would have been far better staying as underdogs so even a close second would look great for them.
Now the LDs are favourites even a narrow Tory hold with a slashed majority is an early Christmas present for Boris
414,645 booster vaccinations in 🇬🇧 yesterday (407,851 the previous Wednesday)
🏴 340,615 🏴 39,327 🏴 20,314 NI 14,389
Just had my third jabberoo.
AZ-AZ–Moderna is my regimen I am past caring don't know how good that is supposed to be overall
We'll ask in a month, and see if an answer happens ...
I had all 3 pfizer
I was Pfizer x2 then Moderna. But complicated slightly by actually having the virus in between jabs 2 & 3 - which I would like to dream might confer even more immunity.
414,645 booster vaccinations in 🇬🇧 yesterday (407,851 the previous Wednesday)
🏴 340,615 🏴 39,327 🏴 20,314 NI 14,389
Just had my third jabberoo.
AZ-AZ–Moderna is my regimen I am past caring don't know how good that is supposed to be overall
We'll ask in a month, and see if an answer happens ...
I had all 3 pfizer
I was Pfizer x2 then Moderna. But complicated slightly by actually having the virus in between jabs 2 & 3 - which I would like to dream might confer even more immunity.
It will. Neutralising sera of prior infection + Pfi-Pfi-Mod will be very effacious.
414,645 booster vaccinations in 🇬🇧 yesterday (407,851 the previous Wednesday)
🏴 340,615 🏴 39,327 🏴 20,314 NI 14,389
Just had my third jabberoo.
AZ-AZ–Moderna is my regimen I am past caring don't know how good that is supposed to be overall
We'll ask in a month, and see if an answer happens ...
I had all 3 pfizer
I was Pfizer x2 then Moderna. But complicated slightly by actually having the virus in between jabs 2 & 3 - which I would like to dream might confer even more immunity.
One interesting thing is that everyone who works closely (Well till we're WFH) with me is in their early 40s to mid 50s and we're all pretty much/in the very near future boosted. There's a definite sense of people who are able and willing to get ahead of the curve; but the booster program is obviously not down to the average person in their 40s yet.
List of Tory voters that HYUFD wants to dispense with:
Red wall first time Tories Poor people Voters who have voted for other parties in the past Old Women, especially Welsh ones Non-CofE congregants The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
If Conservatives lose the seat at the by-election, how will that compare with other "safe" seats lost by governing parties?
Depends on the majority really. Any majority at all would immediately catapult it just above Orpington and into the top 13 swings in UK by-elections. One of those wasn't a gain (Birmingham Hodge Hill - LDs just short of gain), one was against an opposition party (Bradford West) and three were holds by the sitting MP who resigned (Rochester & Strood and Clacton for defectors to UKIP, and Lincoln for Dick Taverne for Democratic Labour/prototype SDP).
The Birmingham Hodge Hill one is interesting. I wonder if HYUFD classes that as a great Labour win on the same basis he is ramping Shropshire for Johnson? Of course, Blair did go on to win the General Election the following year, albeit on a much reduced majority and vote.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Eh? The graph is of punters not LDs.
It is their cockyness driving the betting markets, they would have been far better staying as underdogs so even a close second would look great for them.
Now the LDs are favourites even a narrow Tory hold with a slashed majority is an early Christmas present for Boris
Of course people want as normal a life as possible. But most people are sensible enough to understand that it isn't always possible.
You are also going down a very deep and dangerous rabbit hole. Yes, we get lots of road deaths each year. We also invest heavily to try to reduce that figure, including bringing in legislation and laws that restrict what we can do in our cars - such as the use of mobile phones.
It's also a terrible analogy. Five people a day die on our roads. 161 died of Covid yesterday alone. Well over an order of magnitude higher.
Actually I think it might be a very good comparison if not analogy. Governments put a monetary value on people's lives. That value is not fixed but depends on what area of governance and risk you are talking about. So we find that the value of a statistical life for rail passengers (how much money the Government is willing to spend to save each life) is massively higher than the same value for car passengers. It has never been the case that the Government has a fixed value on human life. If it had been then either we would have had everyone in lockdown every winter (if the value had been high) or we would have made no safety improvements at all to our transport infrastructure (if the value had been too low).
In the context of Covid it is for society as a whole to decide what is an acceptable number of deaths for given levels of authoritarian regulation. We do it for Flu and set the bar very high. My personal view is we should have a similarly high bar for Covid. Sadly at the moment both the authoritarian political classes and much of the population seem to agree that it should be much lower. How long that will last when they find all their pubs and shops have disappeared and they are out of a job is another matter.
I understand what you mean, but the issue is that Covid was an unknown quantity. The number of rail and road deaths is pretty constant at a certain level, with variation. Flu deaths are also a known quantity, with wider variations.
We could not say that for Covid when it started, and we can not say it for Omicron - although I am hopeful.
We can decide that an 'acceptable' number of deaths is, but we have no way of ensuring that Covid will happily say: "Oh, I've killed enough. I'll stop now." It is all too easy to reach the agreed level, and find out a week later you've doubled it and it is out of control.
We have more information on the earlier variants, including amongst vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, so we could - perhaps - do so for that. But now there's Omicron.
Road and rail accidents also do not have exponential growth (aside from very low figures), and it is much easier to lose control of a pandemic than it is a safety case.
Finally, there's the issue of the tyranny of the majority. It is not a random subset of the population being affected, but very specific groups. That makes me very uneasy.
Of course people want as normal a life as possible. But most people are sensible enough to understand that it isn't always possible.
You are also going down a very deep and dangerous rabbit hole. Yes, we get lots of road deaths each year. We also invest heavily to try to reduce that figure, including bringing in legislation and laws that restrict what we can do in our cars - such as the use of mobile phones.
It's also a terrible analogy. Five people a day die on our roads. 161 died of Covid yesterday alone. Well over an order of magnitude higher.
Actually I think it might be a very good comparison if not analogy. Governments put a monetary value on people's lives. That value is not fixed but depends on what area of governance and risk you are talking about. So we find that the value of a statistical life for rail passengers (how much money the Government is willing to spend to save each life) is massively higher than the same value for car passengers. It has never been the case that the Government has a fixed value on human life. If it had been then either we would have had everyone in lockdown every winter (if the value had been high) or we would have made no safety improvements at all to our transport infrastructure (if the value had been too low).
In the context of Covid it is for society as a whole to decide what is an acceptable number of deaths for given levels of authoritarian regulation. We do it for Flu and set the bar very high. My personal view is we should have a similarly high bar for Covid. Sadly at the moment both the authoritarian political classes and much of the population seem to agree that it should be much lower. How long that will last when they find all their pubs and shops have disappeared and they are out of a job is another matter.
It is a difficult balance to strike. In healthcare, the study of such matters is known as Health Economics. Unsurprisingly it is a somewhat dry subject, but it is essentially what NICE and other healthcare bodies use to determine whether a drug or device is to be reimbursed. It also considers QALYs (quality adjusted life year) to determine whether an individual has a quality of life improvement associated with the intervention, thereby justifying it.
A similar calculation is probably done by government to attempt to calculate the benefits of intervention v non intervention. That said, we are talking of the government of Boris Johnson, so probably not.
If Conservatives lose the seat at the by-election, how will that compare with other "safe" seats lost by governing parties?
Depends on the majority really. Any majority at all would immediately catapult it just above Orpington and into the top 13 swings in UK by-elections. One of those wasn't a gain (Birmingham Hodge Hill - LDs just short of gain), one was against an opposition party (Bradford West) and three were holds by the sitting MP who resigned (Rochester & Strood and Clacton for defectors to UKIP, and Lincoln for Dick Taverne for Democratic Labour/prototype SDP).
The Birmingham Hodge Hill one is interesting. I wonder if HYUFD classes that as a great Labour win on the same basis he is ramping Shropshire for Johnson? Of course, Blair did go on to win the General Election the following year, albeit on a much reduced majority and vote.
Hodge Hill was a boost for Labour at a time of by election losses to the LDs post Iraq, no doubt
Cases down week on week. Consistent with analysis of the specimen date returns which semed to suggest the current rise was coming to an end. Alternatively, dead cat restrictions working their magic already!
I think the LibDems have played a blinder of a campaign in N.Shropshire. There's a logic in asserting themselves as the home for moderate Tories who've supported Paterson for decades but think "all of this" is beyond the pale. But it's a bit of a jump from that assertion and 10pc last time to "Winning Here" two years later. If they pull it off, they've done execptionally well.
While the odds reflect the success of that, I think it just as likely that most Lab voters outside the bubble won't get (or agree with) the tactical voting campaign, the 'left' vote remains split, and the Tories (also relying on habitual votes outside the bubble) get home with a reduced 40pc of a reduced turnout.
(PS: on the graph, the Reform candidate should be *Kirsty* Walmsley - Rebecca's her middle name. Her performance will be interesting too.. previous Tory councillor herself, mum's still a Tory councillor, dad used to lead the county council but is now her campaign manager. You can imagine a section of Oswestry Tory society seeing that as a decent punt for a protest vote.)
I'm still not convinced that the markets have got this right on N Shropshire, given that:
- A lot of postal votes were probably cast before the lastest farrago of scandals, own-goals and in-fighting - It won't be obvious whether Labour or the LibDems are the better place for an anti-Boris vote - If you're disgruntled, haven't put in a postal vote, but would have voted Tory, you'll probably stay at home rather than come out to vote LD or Lab.
So I still think the Tories are value at the current odds. I may be totally wrong, of course!
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government.
The regulations allow massive piss ups without masks, they do not allow masklessness in Tesco.
Its the fact they are bringing up an absolutely ludicrous potential "loophole", clutching their pearls at the horror somebody might do such a thing and put everybody at risk....and they will all be there with their masks at the press conference nursing their hangovers from last night bash.
"Clutching their pearls"
Written by you.
Irony eats itself.
Ha! There's some truth in that – Francis is Pearl-clutcher General at times
I'm still not convinced that the markets have got this right on N Shropshire, given that:
- A lot of postal votes were probably cast before the lastest farrago of scandals, own-goals and in-fighting - It won't be obvious whether Labour or the LibDems are the better place for an anti-Boris vote - If you're disgruntled, haven't put in a postal vote, but would have voted Tory, you'll probably stay at home rather than come out to vote LD or Lab.
So I still think the Tories are value at the current odds. I may be totally wrong, of course!
I love the absolute the hypocrisy of the media, concerned somebody might go into Tesco without a mask, but last night they had a massive piss up at their journalist awards ceremony, with zero masks or social distancing. But they all will be there with the threatre of masks at the press conference with the government.
The regulations allow massive piss ups without masks, they do not allow masklessness in Tesco.
Its the fact they are bringing up an absolutely ludicrous potential "loophole", clutching their pearls at the horror somebody might do such a thing and put everybody at risk....and they will all be there with their masks at the press conference nursing their hangovers from last night bash.
"Clutching their pearls"
Written by you.
Irony eats itself.
Ha! There's some truth in that – Francis is Pearl-clutcher General at times
If Conservatives lose the seat at the by-election, how will that compare with other "safe" seats lost by governing parties?
Depends on the majority really. Any majority at all would immediately catapult it just above Orpington and into the top 13 swings in UK by-elections. One of those wasn't a gain (Birmingham Hodge Hill - LDs just short of gain), one was against an opposition party (Bradford West) and three were holds by the sitting MP who resigned (Rochester & Strood and Clacton for defectors to UKIP, and Lincoln for Dick Taverne for Democratic Labour/prototype SDP).
The Birmingham Hodge Hill one is interesting. I wonder if HYUFD classes that as a great Labour win on the same basis he is ramping Shropshire for Johnson? Of course, Blair did go on to win the General Election the following year, albeit on a much reduced majority and vote.
Hodge Hill was a boost for Labour at a time of by election losses to the LDs post Iraq, no doubt
I don't think that's quite right. It could have been worse - clearly - but it was a bigger swing than either Brent East or Leicester South, and the headlines following it were pretty bleak. Hartlepool, later that year, was a bit better for them although less of an obvious anti-Iraq War seat than any of the earlier ones.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Eh? The graph is of punters not LDs.
It is their cockyness driving the betting markets, they would have been far better staying as underdogs so even a close second would look great for them.
Now the LDs are favourites even a narrow Tory hold with a slashed majority is an early Christmas present for Boris
If that was an early Christmas present for "Boris" then it shows how shit he is. It is a little like a child pretending that Father Christmas bringing them a piece of coal is something to rejoice about.
First like the Tories in this seat when they win it next week.
Only if there are barrowloads of postal votes, I suspect.
I suspect Labour and the Lib Dem split will end up handing the seat to the Tories by default.
Oh I don't know. If the Tories are doing as badly as the media would like us to believe, a split vote between the Lib Dems and Labour could see the Tories come third...
I'm still not convinced that the markets have got this right on N Shropshire, given that:
- A lot of postal votes were probably cast before the lastest farrago of scandals, own-goals and in-fighting - It won't be obvious whether Labour or the LibDems are the better place for an anti-Boris vote - If you're disgruntled, haven't put in a postal vote, but would have voted Tory, you'll probably stay at home rather than come out to vote LD or Lab.
So I still think the Tories are value at the current odds. I may be totally wrong, of course!
Do we know when the postal votes were sent out?
Some time ago, I believe. See here, for example (25th Nov):
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
Eh? The graph is of punters not LDs.
It is their cockyness driving the betting markets, they would have been far better staying as underdogs so even a close second would look great for them.
Now the LDs are favourites even a narrow Tory hold with a slashed majority is an early Christmas present for Boris
Honestly though - what are you hearing? What is your best guess at the result?
Of course people want as normal a life as possible. But most people are sensible enough to understand that it isn't always possible.
You are also going down a very deep and dangerous rabbit hole. Yes, we get lots of road deaths each year. We also invest heavily to try to reduce that figure, including bringing in legislation and laws that restrict what we can do in our cars - such as the use of mobile phones.
It's also a terrible analogy. Five people a day die on our roads. 161 died of Covid yesterday alone. Well over an order of magnitude higher.
Actually I think it might be a very good comparison if not analogy. Governments put a monetary value on people's lives. That value is not fixed but depends on what area of governance and risk you are talking about. So we find that the value of a statistical life for rail passengers (how much money the Government is willing to spend to save each life) is massively higher than the same value for car passengers. It has never been the case that the Government has a fixed value on human life. If it had been then either we would have had everyone in lockdown every winter (if the value had been high) or we would have made no safety improvements at all to our transport infrastructure (if the value had been too low).
In the context of Covid it is for society as a whole to decide what is an acceptable number of deaths for given levels of authoritarian regulation. We do it for Flu and set the bar very high. My personal view is we should have a similarly high bar for Covid. Sadly at the moment both the authoritarian political classes and much of the population seem to agree that it should be much lower. How long that will last when they find all their pubs and shops have disappeared and they are out of a job is another matter.
It is a difficult balance to strike. In healthcare, the study of such matters is known as Health Economics. Unsurprisingly it is a somewhat dry subject, but it is essentially what NICE and other healthcare bodies use to determine whether a drug or device is to be reimbursed. It also considers QALYs (quality adjusted life year) to determine whether an individual has a quality of life improvement associated with the intervention, thereby justifying it.
A similar calculation is probably done by government to attempt to calculate the benefits of intervention v non intervention. That said, we are talking of the government of Boris Johnson, so probably not.
Could be worse. https://www.codastory.com/waronscience/doctor-in-disguise-russia-coronavirus/ ...Sergey Samborsky, a welder by profession, went undercover as a doctor in a Siberian hospital for three days in late October. He did what the medical staff at the hospital would not do: care for his 84-year-old grandmother and other mistreated patients in an overcrowded coronavirus ward. He documented his hospital visits with his phone and when he made the shocking footage public, he felt the Russian state media machine turn on him.
Now known across Russia as the “Grandson from Tomsk,” Samborsky, 27, had gone to Moscow to knock on the doors of federal authorities to file complaints of gross medical negligence. When it became clear that instead of considering his complaints, authorities intended to arrest him, Samborsky fled to neighboring Georgia....
Comments
Bugger.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/sports-personality/59505132
I voted for Tom Brady.
https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/special-bets/market/1.177196899
I guess it makes sense that the person from the British Isles is favourite.
Now the Tories are underdogs he can proclaim the likely narrow Tory hold thanks to 15% or so still voting Labour not LD as a triumph.
It would be the first Tory by election hold over the LDs for 5 years, since Witney in 2016 and Boris would proclaim it as a great comeback against the odds after the past fortnight.
LDs being far too cocky I think
I need some help on the best way to vote tactically in this election.
The irony of politics today is extraordinary when Boris is in touch with public opinion on this and a large part of his party are not
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/covid-vaccine-booster-doses-per-capita?country=ISR~USA~FRA~ITA~GBR~DEU~BEL~CHL
Homework, homework !
I suspect Europe is later than us as they were 1-2 months behind last time.
Perhaps they are limited by people reaching the 6 month point?
However that will be a shot across Boris' bows not to bring in a full Christmas lockdown or face a wholesale backbench revolt
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNhh-OLzWlE
Red wall first time Tories
Poor people
Voters who have voted for other parties in the past
Old Women, especially Welsh ones
Non-CofE congregants
The Scotch
Have I missed any other groups? Perhaps as a nod to the excellent bill proposing to remove citizenship from swarthy foreign-type non-Brits there should be an Electoral Reform bill to remove from traitors the right to vote if they don't pass the test. Only members of Conservative Associations and foreign-domiciled donors will be allowed a vote in the new democracy.
Also, it isn't "cocky" to be betting favourites - supporters of all parties are allowed to, and do, place bets. Personally, I continue to think it is a very big ask for the LDs although the signs look quite good. I think the reaction over the past couple of days in the betting markets may be a slight over-reaction given how many votes will already have been cast by post.
"If I'm in a theatre watching a musical, can I take my mask off to sing?"
No10: "Yes. There is a general exemption for singing"
So could I walk into Tesco without a mask as long as I'm singing?
No10: "Essentially, yes"
https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1468926687287070735?t=E3R6VSQ9aZ_mF1UAWiUTtw&s=19
Media back to their nonsense.
In North Shropshire the LDs are throwing everyone but the kitchen sink at it!
https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/old+woman#:~:text=An exceptionally fussy, timid, circumspect,anxious person, especially a woman.
As for me, better than evens on the Cons holding a seat with such a big margin just 2 years ago is very tempting but something is stopping me. Going to sit it out.
Lord Geidt: For the credibility of this inquiry, I have tested the assertions of Lord Brownlow and the relevant political and government officials that at no point in the eight months until late February 2021, as media reports were emerging, was the prime minister made aware of either the fact or the method of the costs of refurbishing the apartment having been paid.
Electoral Commission: Lord Brownlow via WhatsApp asking him to authorise further, at that stage unspecified, refurbishment works on the residence. Lord Brownlow agreed to do so, and also explained that the proposed trust had not yet been set up but that he knew where the funding was coming from.
So, we have a clear breach of Electoral Law. And at least one clear breach of the Ministerial Code. EDIT. Also that the Number 10 lie machine is trying on the defence of "Lord Brownlow was chair of the blind trust, and acted in accordance with his experience of managing blind trusts in that way. The prime minister’s discussions with Lord Brownlow were done without him knowing the underlying donor.". Except that as the Electoral Commission note, there was no blind trust at the time of the 29/11/20 WhatsApp message, and as it is asking for further money it is clear earlier messages had also been exchanged.
As the Votemaster General notes above, "This is great news for Boris."
Of those efforts, North Shropshire is EASILY the toughest ask. Both Richmond and Brecon had had Lib Dem MPs in the recent past, and Chesham was a Remain voting seat where the Lib Dems started in a clear (though poor) second.
AZ-AZ–Moderna is my regimen I
am past caringdon't know how good that is supposed to be overallDo you know if the Borders bill has passed the HOC as I thought a vote was due this week ?
The motion on Paterson wasn't defeated. It passed with 13 Tory votes against. It was the reaction and subsequent U-turn which led him to quit.
Lol
You are Muhammad Saeed al-Sahhaf and I claim my £5!
Which is the nearest your average folk get to the theatre in a year. For a musical or not.
You're right the chart must be wrong though - can't be 101% (actually nearer 102%) as not a rounding thing.
John Burn-Murdoch
@jburnmurdoch
·
3h
1) Good to see this now being acknowledged and communicated by WHO
2) It doesn't mean "Omicron is milder". It means immunity (via both vax and infection) is kicking in Flexed biceps
Quote Tweet
Clare Wilson
@ClareWilsonMed
· 4h
WHO says there are preliminary signs omicron is milder as hospitalisations in South Africa remain low.
That being said, we are very lucky in the UK that we did AZ first (for most people). Mix and match is simply better.
(There was a - small - study in the US published this week that showed boosting Pfizer with J&J resulted in a much longer lived immune response.)
Everyone just loves telling everyone else what to do.
The whole thing is a charade.
Scandal - the EU likes to brag it has donated more Covid vaccines than any other state... but it has only delivered 124m of the 353m it claims to have donated, far fewer than the US, for example, has shipped to poorer countries
https://www.ft.com/content/d0b53ea4-5eef-4bc7-814c-a69b0dfa1c06
Passed the report state on Tuesday. Priti Vacant's attempt to make your brave son a criminal is still in the bill. And her proposal to strip citizenship from non-British forrin scum is still in the bill.
Lets be fair, with *that* as a government, ex-communication isn't a bad thing.
In the context of Covid it is for society as a whole to decide what is an acceptable number of deaths for given levels of authoritarian regulation. We do it for Flu and set the bar very high. My personal view is we should have a similarly high bar for Covid. Sadly at the moment both the authoritarian political classes and much of the population seem to agree that it should be much lower. How long that will last when they find all their pubs and shops have disappeared and they are out of a job is another matter.
"Let them wear masks"
Written by you.
Irony eats itself.
Now the LDs are favourites even a narrow Tory hold with a slashed majority is an early Christmas present for Boris
Even halving the dosage of Pfizer doesn't seem to make much difference from the POV of boosters.
The Birmingham Hodge Hill one is interesting. I wonder if HYUFD classes that as a great Labour win on the same basis he is ramping Shropshire for Johnson? Of course, Blair did go on to win the General Election the following year, albeit on a much reduced majority and vote.
We could not say that for Covid when it started, and we can not say it for Omicron - although I am hopeful.
We can decide that an 'acceptable' number of deaths is, but we have no way of ensuring that Covid will happily say: "Oh, I've killed enough. I'll stop now." It is all too easy to reach the agreed level, and find out a week later you've doubled it and it is out of control.
We have more information on the earlier variants, including amongst vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, so we could - perhaps - do so for that. But now there's Omicron.
Road and rail accidents also do not have exponential growth (aside from very low figures), and it is much easier to lose control of a pandemic than it is a safety case.
Finally, there's the issue of the tyranny of the majority. It is not a random subset of the population being affected, but very specific groups. That makes me very uneasy.
A similar calculation is probably done by government to attempt to calculate the benefits of intervention v non intervention. That said, we are talking of the government of Boris Johnson, so probably not.
Recent mini-rise looks to have stopped. Looks like a milder week weather wise next week too...
Might get a bit of a decrease before the Omicron wave really gets going.
I think the LibDems have played a blinder of a campaign in N.Shropshire. There's a logic in asserting themselves as the home for moderate Tories who've supported Paterson for decades but think "all of this" is beyond the pale. But it's a bit of a jump from that assertion and 10pc last time to "Winning Here" two years later. If they pull it off, they've done execptionally well.
While the odds reflect the success of that, I think it just as likely that most Lab voters outside the bubble won't get (or agree with) the tactical voting campaign, the 'left' vote remains split, and the Tories (also relying on habitual votes outside the bubble) get home with a reduced 40pc of a reduced turnout.
(PS: on the graph, the Reform candidate should be *Kirsty* Walmsley - Rebecca's her middle name. Her performance will be interesting too.. previous Tory councillor herself, mum's still a Tory councillor, dad used to lead the county council but is now her campaign manager. You can imagine a section of Oswestry Tory society seeing that as a decent punt for a protest vote.)
- A lot of postal votes were probably cast before the lastest farrago of scandals, own-goals and in-fighting
- It won't be obvious whether Labour or the LibDems are the better place for an anti-Boris vote
- If you're disgruntled, haven't put in a postal vote, but would have voted Tory, you'll probably stay at home rather than come out to vote LD or Lab.
So I still think the Tories are value at the current odds. I may be totally wrong, of course!
Do will still have to WFH prior to driving into the office for the Christmas Party?
https://www.libdemvoice.org/postal-votes-shout-out-if-you-are-helping-in-north-shropshire-this-weekend-69180.html
https://www.codastory.com/waronscience/doctor-in-disguise-russia-coronavirus/
...Sergey Samborsky, a welder by profession, went undercover as a doctor in a Siberian hospital for three days in late October. He did what the medical staff at the hospital would not do: care for his 84-year-old grandmother and other mistreated patients in an overcrowded coronavirus ward. He documented his hospital visits with his phone and when he made the shocking footage public, he felt the Russian state media machine turn on him.
Now known across Russia as the “Grandson from Tomsk,” Samborsky, 27, had gone to Moscow to knock on the doors of federal authorities to file complaints of gross medical negligence. When it became clear that instead of considering his complaints, authorities intended to arrest him, Samborsky fled to neighboring Georgia....