"Covid will be a threat to the NHS for at least the next five years and testing and vaccines may be needed for a decade or longer, the government’s scientific advisers have said.
Documents released this afternoon show that ministers have been told that it will take “at least a further five years for Covid-19 to settle to a predictable endemic state” — where the virus lingers in the background but does not threaten to rapidly overwhelm the health system." (£)
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
Maybe. Personally, I am deeply bored of Brexit but nearly every day something* crops up to remind me what a piss-poor decision the country took.
(*in the real world, not just on PB!)
Try to spot some positive Brexit things. There are many, as the negatives. If you're not spotting them then you haven't let go to the debate. Perhaps there are more negatives than positives - I don't know. However if you entirely fail to see any positives then you're making a mistake.
Please list some. I would love to know some that are not as easy to shoot down as a very large floating (Col.) blimp.
It's small potatoes now, but these could be big things. UVdL discussing mandatory vaccinaction in the EU - we can differ.
But take farming subsidies - there's at least a good chance it'll be better.
We could have taken our own path with vaccination if we had been part of EU ( I believe Hungary and Malta did). Farming subsidies? Better for whom? Definitely not the farmer and probably not the consumer
Next?
I suspect it ends at this point, unless we can bottle "sovereignty". That's cheap as chips at the moment.
Hah, that old one. If we didn't have sovereignty we would have had to ask the EU for permission for the referendum. We didn't, any more than we needed permission to go to war. We always had sovereignty. It was another Brexiteer con trick.
Yet the only way to exercise it was to leave. Otherwise the UK was constrained by the rules of the club.
I see that an Italian man, who wanted a covid pass but didn’t fancy the vaccine, has been caught trying to get vaccinated in a fake arm.
Edit/ actually according to R4 police are still looking for him, after he ran off when the nurse thought his arm (which had a silicon mould over his real arm) looked a bit funny.
Father is jailed for 21 years and his partner for a minimum of 29 years over the torture and killing of six-year-old Arthur Labinjo-Hughes https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-59522243
How minimum is minimum? I know lots of things get said about our criminal justice system but what is the real situation. I'm more concerned she never be placed in a role of care ever again.
"For some serious violent or sexual offences where the sentence is 7 years or more the offender will be released at the two-thirds point." 29 year sentence: 19 yrs 4 months.
She's 32 now so she'll be at least 51 when released, which is heavily odds against to have another child thankfully.
Should have been a whole life tariff.
If we had it, should have been the death penalty. Thankfully we don't have it, but should be a whole life tariff.
Cases like this, and the Everard murder make me wonder about the death penalty. If the only argument against it is wrongful convictions then cases like this are surely certain enough? Why should these people be allowed another minute of life?
I have some sympathy with that view, in that I share your revulsion at the crime. Wrongful conviction has been the mainstay argument against the death penalty, but there are others.
1. I do not want the State to have the power of life and death over me.
2. Juries will be less willing to convict if they think a death sentence might be imposed. In this case they might only have been willing to convict her for manslaughter rather than murder, and her sentence would then have been much lighter.
On point 2, that is me. I would not under any circumstances convict if death was the penalty. I could not live with the knowledge that my decision led to the death of another person. Especially if it later turned out the the conviction was unsafe. (And yes, i know there is a counter argument, what happens if they are set free and kill again. But that's not my decision).
There's an additional complication here too. They would have to screen out jurors like you and me in a trial where the death penalty is possible. Then you are no longer judged by a jury of your peers, but by a jury of those in favour of the death penalty, which creates all kinds of biases in the administration of justice.
And thinking about it, that opens up a whole can of worms, what other views are unacceptable for a juror? Gender, religion, race...
Anyway, I would just give the required answer.
Presumably you would give the true answer when questioned under oath, or risk going to jail for perjury...
And how would you ensure that the jury for the perjury trial did not contain people who didn't believe in the death penalty? (You would also need to prosecute those people who claimed not to believe in the death penalty so as to avoid the extraordinary inconvenience of being a juror in a long trial.)
There are numerous democracies that have both trial by jury and the death penalty and make it work. But I agree that it’s not practical to implement such a change with only a 52-48 majority. What was striking to me when living in Asia was that even when talking to otherwise highly liberal internationalised Gen X-ers and Millennials, it was almost impossible to find anyone who didn’t full throatedly support the death penalty for at least some crimes.
Not in our corner of the world though, Europe.
The death penalty is like abortion and Brexit; there is a formidable case for both sides of the argument and a large majority of people are incapable of seeing the strength of the side they don't take - a truth frequently demonstrated on PB.
This is characteristic of issues where none of the alternatives is without difficulty, the issue tends to raise strong feeling, and no society can absolutely sit on the fence about it - they are binaries. Politicians in power hate them for all those reasons and infinitely prefer to put them quietly to bed and allow hot potatoes to become cold potatoes over time.
Is it legitimate for a State to kill an innocent man?
I have never met anyone pro the death penalty who can answer that question.
Is it legitimate to incarcerate an innocent man? And indeed refuse to release them beyond their sentence if they do not admit guilt?
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
Maybe. Personally, I am deeply bored of Brexit but nearly every day something* crops up to remind me what a piss-poor decision the country took.
(*in the real world, not just on PB!)
Try to spot some positive Brexit things. There are many, as the negatives. If you're not spotting them then you haven't let go to the debate. Perhaps there are more negatives than positives - I don't know. However if you entirely fail to see any positives then you're making a mistake.
Please list some. I would love to know some that are not as easy to shoot down as a very large floating (Col.) blimp.
It's small potatoes now, but these could be big things. UVdL discussing mandatory vaccinaction in the EU - we can differ.
But take farming subsidies - there's at least a good chance it'll be better.
We could have taken our own path with vaccination if we had been part of EU ( I believe Hungary and Malta did). Farming subsidies? Better for whom? Definitely not the farmer and probably not the consumer
Next?
I suspect it ends at this point, unless we can bottle "sovereignty". That's cheap as chips at the moment.
Hah, that old one. If we didn't have sovereignty we would have had to ask the EU for permission for the referendum. We didn't, any more than we needed permission to go to war. We always had sovereignty. It was another Brexiteer con trick.
We only had permission to leave post Lisbon treaty. And when we chose leave the EU chose to rape us up the ass with the NI Protocol.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
I rest my case. You endorsed the vanity party of a crypto-fascist. Well done.
Trying to suggest that Theresa May is s more xenophobic or racist and xenophobic than your Mr Farage is the most ridiculous and dumb thing you have ever written on here. It is really really really stupid Philip!
This seems quite a lazy and off base insult to both PT and NF.
“Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy.
Crypto-fascism is the secret support for, or admiration of, fascism.”
Nigel Farage was described by founder of UKIP, Alan Sked as a racist. Farage is also very definitely far right. He is renowned for making nationalistic statements. he is also renowned for making anti-immigrant comments. He is well known for the hate mongering anti-immigrant poster in the Brexit campaign He has made admiring comments regarding Vladimir Putin, and is a known friend and obsequious admirer of Donald Trump. He did not challenge the lie that Trump had his election "stolen".
It is not lazy to suggest he is a crypto-fascist. It is also a fact (based on what he said) that Philip voted for him. I am right of centre, but I would never have voted for anyone with Farage's atrocious record of prejudice. Neither would I ever endorse Trump.
I can't stand Farage but he does not believe in dictatorial power or suppression of opposition. In fact he makes rather grand stands in defence of parliamentary sovereignty and free speech. His admiring comments of Putin were in one specific area and he then clarified he didn't like Putin overall and condemned his attacks on journalists.
I refer to my other post regarding Farage's obsequious interview of Trump. Perhaps you don't think Trump would apply dictatorial power if he could? And if he could would Farage criticise him? No of course not.
As obsequious and disturbing as Farage's interview of Trump was, I think the Pier Morgan one was worse.
You're not expecting Morgan to jettyson Trump are you?
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
I rest my case. You endorsed the vanity party of a crypto-fascist. Well done.
Trying to suggest that Theresa May is s more xenophobic or racist and xenophobic than your Mr Farage is the most ridiculous and dumb thing you have ever written on here. It is really really really stupid Philip!
This seems quite a lazy and off base insult to both PT and NF.
“Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy.
Crypto-fascism is the secret support for, or admiration of, fascism.”
Nigel Farage was described by founder of UKIP, Alan Sked as a racist. Farage is also very definitely far right. He is renowned for making nationalistic statements. he is also renowned for making anti-immigrant comments. He is well known for the hate mongering anti-immigrant poster in the Brexit campaign He has made admiring comments regarding Vladimir Putin, and is a known friend and obsequious admirer of Donald Trump. He did not challenge the lie that Trump had his election "stolen".
It is not lazy to suggest he is a crypto-fascist. It is also a fact (based on what he said) that Philip voted for him. I am right of centre, but I would never have voted for anyone with Farage's atrocious record of prejudice. Neither would I ever endorse Trump.
I can't stand Farage but he does not believe in dictatorial power or suppression of opposition. In fact he makes rather grand stands in defence of parliamentary sovereignty and free speech. His admiring comments of Putin were in one specific area and he then clarified he didn't like Putin overall and condemned his attacks on journalists.
I refer to my other post regarding Farage's obsequious interview of Trump. Perhaps you don't think Trump would apply dictatorial power if he could? And if he could would Farage criticise him? No of course not.
As obsequious and disturbing as Farage's interview of Trump was, I think the Pier Morgan one was worse.
Those of a nervous disposition, look away: Risk Assessment for Omicron has been published.
Everything is still uncertain, but it doesn't look good.
As SAGE said: 'It is important to be prepared for a potentially very significant wave of infections with associated hospitalisations now, ahead of data being available.
Once again: until we know about infection severity, it's meaningless. A variant with increased transmissibility and lower severity is desirable.
However, the fact that the scientists are essentially being forced to guess does nothing to stop all the journalists from picking up the worst case scenario and running with it.
Everybody who's in the slightest bit nervous about this disease - which is a very large fraction of the population - is going to be shitting themselves in self-imposed lockdown within the next few days at this rate. Now, that might actually help the non-nervous fraction of the population stay out of lockdown, by reducing the number of people left in circulation, but OTOH it's going to be a catastrophe for many businesses. At this rate, a second ruined Christmas is going to destroy large swathes of the hospitality trade and of the surviving physical shops.
Unfortunately it's not the worst-case scenario, it's the central scenario. The two things we know with reasonable confidence are that Omicron is extremely transmissible, and that prior infection doesn't seem to provide much protection against it. We currently have almost no data on severity or on vaccine effectiveness against it. The central assumption must be that it's just as severe, and that vaccines are somewhat less effective against it. The worst-case scenario is that vaccines are a lot less effective against it, in which case we're f**d. The best case scenario is that it's a lot milder than delta and that vaccines remain very effective against it, but that may just be wishful thinking. We should begin to have preliminary answers in about two weeks time.
Norwegians sound quite hopeful
Dozens of Christmas party-goers who became infected with suspected cases of Omicron Covid in Norway have only mild symptoms, doctors have revealed.
Up to 60 people who fell ill after attending a party on Oslo's waterfront a week ago have so-far developed headaches and sore throats while a few have a cough.
Tine Ravlo, chief physician for the district where the outbreak took place, said the symptoms are broadly consistent with what is being reported from South Africa, where the variant first emerged.
...
Mr Ravlo said the 'incubation period' of the new variant - the time from infection to first symptoms - appears to be two to four days.
That is far less than the seven to 14 days for most other Covid variants, and would potentially make outbreaks easier to spot - though the data is still preliminary.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
OK! I refer to my previous posts. Particularly the one mentioning Alan Sked. If you think that in the light of Mr Sked's allegations (which Farage has never denied) that Farage is a "decent person" then you clearly have some strange and not very pleasant views.
"Covid will be a threat to the NHS for at least the next five years and testing and vaccines may be needed for a decade or longer, the government’s scientific advisers have said.
Documents released this afternoon show that ministers have been told that it will take “at least a further five years for Covid-19 to settle to a predictable endemic state” — where the virus lingers in the background but does not threaten to rapidly overwhelm the health system." (£)
Seattle Times ($) - BREAKING NEWS State Supreme Court declines to redraw political maps, accepts redistricting commission’s work The Washington Supreme Court will not exercise its authority to redraw the state’s congressional and legislative district maps, leaving in place the work of the bipartisan redistricting commission. The decision lifts uncertainty over the new boundaries for the state’s 10 congressional districts and 49 legislative districts, which will be in place for the next decade.
SSI - the maps drawn (sort of) and approved in haste (but past legal deadline) are upheld. Which is bad news for Democrats in general, and for Democratic US Rep. Kim Schreier (D-WA) in the 8th congressional district, which loses its best Democratic area (Bellevue) and picks up GOP turf in exurban & rural Pierce and Snohomish counties.
Addendum - and Democratic notion that Democratic-oriented state supreme court would serve as backstop is proven a fallacy.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
Maybe. Personally, I am deeply bored of Brexit but nearly every day something* crops up to remind me what a piss-poor decision the country took.
(*in the real world, not just on PB!)
Try to spot some positive Brexit things. There are many, as the negatives. If you're not spotting them then you haven't let go to the debate. Perhaps there are more negatives than positives - I don't know. However if you entirely fail to see any positives then you're making a mistake.
Please list some. I would love to know some that are not as easy to shoot down as a very large floating (Col.) blimp.
It's small potatoes now, but these could be big things. UVdL discussing mandatory vaccinaction in the EU - we can differ.
But take farming subsidies - there's at least a good chance it'll be better.
We could have taken our own path with vaccination if we had been part of EU ( I believe Hungary and Malta did). Farming subsidies? Better for whom? Definitely not the farmer and probably not the consumer
Next?
I suspect it ends at this point, unless we can bottle "sovereignty". That's cheap as chips at the moment.
Hah, that old one. If we didn't have sovereignty we would have had to ask the EU for permission for the referendum. We didn't, any more than we needed permission to go to war. We always had sovereignty. It was another Brexiteer con trick.
We only had permission to leave post Lisbon treaty. And when we chose leave the EU chose to rape us up the ass with the NI Protocol.
Better off out.
It's not rape when both parties consent, just saying.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
OK! I refer to my previous posts. Particularly the one mentioning Alan Sked. If you think that in the light of Mr Sked's allegations (which Farage has never denied) that Farage is a "decent person" then you clearly have some strange and not very pleasant views.
Link anything you think is relevant. You've made over 8k previous posts.
Is your name Lockdown because you'll be coming soon.
That infection stat about Omicron and the double jabbed really is an eye opener.
Hopefully the effects are mild.
The effects of the line won't be mild.
For some odd reason, my ability at delivering good chat-up lines has been somewhat curtailed for the last couple of decades. I keep on suggesting to Mrs J that it might be a good idea for me to update my skills in this area - to keep current - but her reaction dissuades me ...
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
I dunno, I can always find a sharp angle somewhere.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
I rest my case. You endorsed the vanity party of a crypto-fascist. Well done.
Trying to suggest that Theresa May is s more xenophobic or racist and xenophobic than your Mr Farage is the most ridiculous and dumb thing you have ever written on here. It is really really really stupid Philip!
There is no case to answer. The European Parliament election wasn't a proper election so casting a protest vote in that was entirely legitimate.
Your logic is utterly perverted in saying people can't vote for their own reasons or have protest votes.
Infinitely more serious than the shambolic European Parliament elections after we should have already left the European Parliament was the 2019 General Election.
Are you claiming that everyone like @MikeSmithson who voted for Jeremy Corbyn's Labour Party were deliberately endorsing what @MikeSmithson calls an antisemitic pensioner?
Don't be pathetic.
The choice was a **** sandwich or **** on toast. I didn't care for either so I chose the smallest portion, namely a Corbyn minority rather than a Johnson majority.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
Maybe. Personally, I am deeply bored of Brexit but nearly every day something* crops up to remind me what a piss-poor decision the country took.
(*in the real world, not just on PB!)
Try to spot some positive Brexit things. There are many, as the negatives. If you're not spotting them then you haven't let go to the debate. Perhaps there are more negatives than positives - I don't know. However if you entirely fail to see any positives then you're making a mistake.
Please list some. I would love to know some that are not as easy to shoot down as a very large floating (Col.) blimp.
It's small potatoes now, but these could be big things. UVdL discussing mandatory vaccinaction in the EU - we can differ.
But take farming subsidies - there's at least a good chance it'll be better.
We could have taken our own path with vaccination if we had been part of EU ( I believe Hungary and Malta did). Farming subsidies? Better for whom? Definitely not the farmer and probably not the consumer
Next?
I suspect it ends at this point, unless we can bottle "sovereignty". That's cheap as chips at the moment.
Hah, that old one. If we didn't have sovereignty we would have had to ask the EU for permission for the referendum. We didn't, any more than we needed permission to go to war. We always had sovereignty. It was another Brexiteer con trick.
Yet the only way to exercise it was to leave. Otherwise the UK was constrained by the rules of the club.
It's like telling a woman in a coercive relationship she has full control as she can leave the relationship.
And then using that as a reason she shouldn't leave the relationship. 🤦♂️
If you only have control if you end the relationship, then you need to end the relationship if you want control.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
My issue with Farage is that I believed him when he emphasised the importance of democracy and the rule of law before the EU referendum. He portrayed himself as a lover of those values, and the EU as a threat to them. Simply, I thought he was someone who prioritised systems over outcomes.
Since the EU referendum, he has cosied up to people who do not believe in democracy or the rule of law. He has proven himself to be someone who doesn't give a shit about systems, and instead he has turned into a bit of a right wing authoritarian.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
Maybe. Personally, I am deeply bored of Brexit but nearly every day something* crops up to remind me what a piss-poor decision the country took.
(*in the real world, not just on PB!)
Try to spot some positive Brexit things. There are many, as the negatives. If you're not spotting them then you haven't let go to the debate. Perhaps there are more negatives than positives - I don't know. However if you entirely fail to see any positives then you're making a mistake.
Please list some. I would love to know some that are not as easy to shoot down as a very large floating (Col.) blimp.
It's small potatoes now, but these could be big things. UVdL discussing mandatory vaccinaction in the EU - we can differ.
But take farming subsidies - there's at least a good chance it'll be better.
We could have taken our own path with vaccination if we had been part of EU ( I believe Hungary and Malta did). Farming subsidies? Better for whom? Definitely not the farmer and probably not the consumer
Next?
I suspect it ends at this point, unless we can bottle "sovereignty". That's cheap as chips at the moment.
Hah, that old one. If we didn't have sovereignty we would have had to ask the EU for permission for the referendum. We didn't, any more than we needed permission to go to war. We always had sovereignty. It was another Brexiteer con trick.
We only had permission to leave post Lisbon treaty. And when we chose leave the EU chose to rape us up the ass with the NI Protocol.
Better off out.
It's not rape when both parties consent, just saying.
We were given the punishment beating we were warned of (thanks to T Blair's GFA)
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
Farage is a horrible man perpetuating well known antisemitic tropes, the sort I'd expect a Corbynista to come out with.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
Father is jailed for 21 years and his partner for a minimum of 29 years over the torture and killing of six-year-old Arthur Labinjo-Hughes https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-59522243
Every so often an article like this appears in the mainstream media.
"Why we should close women's prisons and treat their crimes more fairly Mirko Bagaric Sentencing systems around the world should be radically reformed to start with the assumption that women should not be sent to prison for their crimes"
Catching up, but the step-mother of the little chap in Solihull deserves prison and is, I expect, going to have a VERY bad time. For a while at any rate.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
My issue with Farage is that I believed him when he emphasised the importance of democracy and the rule of law before the EU referendum. He portrayed himself as a lover of those values, and the EU as a threat to them. Simply, I thought he was someone who prioritised systems over outcomes.
Since the EU referendum, he has cosied up to people who do not believe in democracy or the rule of law. He has proven himself to be someone who doesn't give a shit about systems, and instead he has turned into a bit of a right wing authoritarian.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
As a Celt I'd like to know when all these bloody Anglo-Saxons are going home. Please take the Jutes and Norman's with you.
What's a celt doing in a fen?
Surely the more right wing Angles will be along to complain about being lumped in with those bloody Saxons? Again.
Bit like the whole "Asian" nonsense.
I am sure the more acute Angles will indeed be raising the point.
Surely the Right Angles will be be the ones concerned?
The obtuse Angles couldn't give a toss, and the reflex Angles are arguing with themselves now.
... waits for someone to pun isosceles...
That's a height of punmanship I don't see even @ydoethur scalene.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
My issue with Farage is that I believed him when he emphasised the importance of democracy and the rule of law before the EU referendum. He portrayed himself as a lover of those values, and the EU as a threat to them. Simply, I thought he was someone who prioritised systems over outcomes.
Since the EU referendum, he has cosied up to people who do not believe in democracy or the rule of law. He has proven himself to be someone who doesn't give a shit about systems, and instead he has turned into a bit of a right wing authoritarian.
He really didn't claim he was perfect.
No, but when he says one thing and then demonstrates something different by his actions, you have to wonder where is agenda really is.
Freedoms are being suppressed around the world, and it is very largely from the “right”.
Farage is a knowing and willing participant in this populist-authoritarianism, as can be seen from his “did he just say that?” comments about immigration and his continued love affair with the anti-democratic and failed putschist, Donald Trump.
Here’s another horrible example, from the Guardian today
Poland is planning to introduce a centralised register of pregnancies that would oblige doctors to report all pregnancies and miscarriages to the government.
This is the battle of our times, and it’s incumbent on any politically aware person to pick a side.
Stalin banned abortion in 1933, only being legalised again in 1955. Access to abortion is not really a right-or-left issue; it's a control issue.
China is an interesting one. From having rather lax contraception and abortion laws during the one-child era, they've moved to only abortion-for-medical-reasons now there's a three-child rule. State central planning and control intruding onto family plannig and control ...
Father is jailed for 21 years and his partner for a minimum of 29 years over the torture and killing of six-year-old Arthur Labinjo-Hughes https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-59522243
How minimum is minimum? I know lots of things get said about our criminal justice system but what is the real situation. I'm more concerned she never be placed in a role of care ever again.
"For some serious violent or sexual offences where the sentence is 7 years or more the offender will be released at the two-thirds point." 29 year sentence: 19 yrs 4 months.
She's 32 now so she'll be at least 51 when released, which is heavily odds against to have another child thankfully.
Should have been a whole life tariff.
If we had it, should have been the death penalty. Thankfully we don't have it, but should be a whole life tariff.
Cases like this, and the Everard murder make me wonder about the death penalty. If the only argument against it is wrongful convictions then cases like this are surely certain enough? Why should these people be allowed another minute of life?
I have some sympathy with that view, in that I share your revulsion at the crime. Wrongful conviction has been the mainstay argument against the death penalty, but there are others.
1. I do not want the State to have the power of life and death over me.
2. Juries will be less willing to convict if they think a death sentence might be imposed. In this case they might only have been willing to convict her for manslaughter rather than murder, and her sentence would then have been much lighter.
On point 2, that is me. I would not under any circumstances convict if death was the penalty. I could not live with the knowledge that my decision led to the death of another person. Especially if it later turned out the the conviction was unsafe. (And yes, i know there is a counter argument, what happens if they are set free and kill again. But that's not my decision).
There's an additional complication here too. They would have to screen out jurors like you and me in a trial where the death penalty is possible. Then you are no longer judged by a jury of your peers, but by a jury of those in favour of the death penalty, which creates all kinds of biases in the administration of justice.
And thinking about it, that opens up a whole can of worms, what other views are unacceptable for a juror? Gender, religion, race...
Anyway, I would just give the required answer.
Presumably you would give the true answer when questioned under oath, or risk going to jail for perjury...
And how would you ensure that the jury for the perjury trial did not contain people who didn't believe in the death penalty? (You would also need to prosecute those people who claimed not to believe in the death penalty so as to avoid the extraordinary inconvenience of being a juror in a long trial.)
There are numerous democracies that have both trial by jury and the death penalty and make it work. But I agree that it’s not practical to implement such a change with only a 52-48 majority. What was striking to me when living in Asia was that even when talking to otherwise highly liberal internationalised Gen X-ers and Millennials, it was almost impossible to find anyone who didn’t full throatedly support the death penalty for at least some crimes.
Not in our corner of the world though, Europe.
The death penalty is like abortion and Brexit; there is a formidable case for both sides of the argument and a large majority of people are incapable of seeing the strength of the side they don't take - a truth frequently demonstrated on PB.
This is characteristic of issues where none of the alternatives is without difficulty, the issue tends to raise strong feeling, and no society can absolutely sit on the fence about it - they are binaries. Politicians in power hate them for all those reasons and infinitely prefer to put them quietly to bed and allow hot potatoes to become cold potatoes over time.
Is it legitimate for a State to kill an innocent man?
I have never met anyone pro the death penalty who can answer that question.
None of the alternatives is without difficulty. Answer this one: is it legitimate for a State to keep an innocent man in prison serving a whole life term?
The answer to both is No; and the resolution of it is the due process of law.
And in both cases (life sentence and execution) it leaves the possibility of an innocent person who is never exonerated. To which, after doing the best you can, there is no solution.
PS I am anti death penalty. But I recognise there is a perfectly good case in its favour.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
My issue with Farage is that I believed him when he emphasised the importance of democracy and the rule of law before the EU referendum. He portrayed himself as a lover of those values, and the EU as a threat to them. Simply, I thought he was someone who prioritised systems over outcomes.
Since the EU referendum, he has cosied up to people who do not believe in democracy or the rule of law. He has proven himself to be someone who doesn't give a shit about systems, and instead he has turned into a bit of a right wing authoritarian.
He really didn't claim he was perfect.
No, but when he says one thing and then demonstrates something different by his actions, you have to wonder where is agenda really is.
Freedoms are being suppressed around the world, and it is very largely from the “right”.
Farage is a knowing and willing participant in this populist-authoritarianism, as can be seen from his “did he just say that?” comments about immigration and his continued love affair with the anti-democratic and failed putschist, Donald Trump.
Here’s another horrible example, from the Guardian today
Poland is planning to introduce a centralised register of pregnancies that would oblige doctors to report all pregnancies and miscarriages to the government.
This is the battle of our times, and it’s incumbent on any politically aware person to pick a side.
Stalin banned abortion in 1933, only being legalised again in 1955. Access to abortion is not really a right-or-left issue; it's a control issue.
China is an interesting one. From having rather lax contraception and abortion laws during the one-child era, they've moved to only abortion-for-medical-reasons now there's a three-child rule. State central planning and control intruding onto family plannig and control ...
I used to work with a Romanian, whose father was a gynecologist in the days of the Communists. The police used to call by and check his records to ensure he wasn't doing abortions. Could be doing that in Texas now of course.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
By the way, for the record, I have never said I "had no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME" you lying little toad. I thought it obnoxious.
We know you hated Mrs May. Is it really a misogyny thing? If so it would go with the Brexit Party voting record very well.
You're the lying little toad who lied and said I voted for Farage "knowingly and lovingly" when you knew that wasn't true.
So I'm guessing you knowingly and lovingly tell migrants to GO HOME. Your logic. If you don't like it, don't throw stones at others.
Diddums are you gammoning Philip?. Re your other post, I would agree, voting for a party where the leader is a known antisemite is something I wouldn't do. People need to think that when they vote for a party they do endorse the leader. You endorsed Farage. My instinct is that you perhaps admire Farage as much as he admires Trump, but you just don't want to admit it. Let's face it, you wouldn't have advanced your obsession with exiting the EU without Farage. You must really love him, and he loves you.
But I never voted for Farage.
I voted against the racist who tells migrants to GO HOME that was ruining the country.
And in a two for the price of one I voted for Farage to be kicked out of the European Parliament.
Farage has no power and no elected position as a result of my vote.
If I had a vote to kick Corbyn out of Westminster in the same way I was able to kick Farage out of the European Parliament I'd gladly take it
Keep protesting Phil. Your claim that May is a xenophobe to cover up your own xenophobic EU-loathing is pathetic. May was a hopeless PM (not as incompetent as her successor though whom you inexplicably idolise), but she was not and is not a racist or xenophobe, she is actually a decent person. You voted for the Brexit Party. Everyone knows that is/was Nigel Farage. He is not in any way a decent person. You endorsed him. Own it.
Farage seems a decent person to me. Why do you say otherwise? (Aside from association with not-nice-types)
My issue with Farage is that I believed him when he emphasised the importance of democracy and the rule of law before the EU referendum. He portrayed himself as a lover of those values, and the EU as a threat to them. Simply, I thought he was someone who prioritised systems over outcomes.
Since the EU referendum, he has cosied up to people who do not believe in democracy or the rule of law. He has proven himself to be someone who doesn't give a shit about systems, and instead he has turned into a bit of a right wing authoritarian.
He really didn't claim he was perfect.
No, but when he says one thing and then demonstrates something different by his actions, you have to wonder where is agenda really is.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
I rest my case. You endorsed the vanity party of a crypto-fascist. Well done.
Trying to suggest that Theresa May is s more xenophobic or racist and xenophobic than your Mr Farage is the most ridiculous and dumb thing you have ever written on here. It is really really really stupid Philip!
This seems quite a lazy and off base insult to both PT and NF.
“Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy.
Crypto-fascism is the secret support for, or admiration of, fascism.”
Nigel Farage was described by founder of UKIP, Alan Sked as a racist. Farage is also very definitely far right. He is renowned for making nationalistic statements. he is also renowned for making anti-immigrant comments. He is well known for the hate mongering anti-immigrant poster in the Brexit campaign He has made admiring comments regarding Vladimir Putin, and is a known friend and obsequious admirer of Donald Trump. He did not challenge the lie that Trump had his election "stolen".
It is not lazy to suggest he is a crypto-fascist. It is also a fact (based on what he said) that Philip voted for him. I am right of centre, but I would never have voted for anyone with Farage's atrocious record of prejudice. Neither would I ever endorse Trump.
I can't stand Farage but he does not believe in dictatorial power or suppression of opposition. In fact he makes rather grand stands in defence of parliamentary sovereignty and free speech. His admiring comments of Putin were in one specific area and he then clarified he didn't like Putin overall and condemned his attacks on journalists.
Did he ever condemn Trump's attack on the 'lame stream media'?
Freedoms are being suppressed around the world, and it is very largely from the “right”.
Farage is a knowing and willing participant in this populist-authoritarianism, as can be seen from his “did he just say that?” comments about immigration and his continued love affair with the anti-democratic and failed putschist, Donald Trump.
Here’s another horrible example, from the Guardian today
Poland is planning to introduce a centralised register of pregnancies that would oblige doctors to report all pregnancies and miscarriages to the government.
This is the battle of our times, and it’s incumbent on any politically aware person to pick a side.
Stalin banned abortion in 1933, only being legalised again in 1955. Access to abortion is not really a right-or-left issue; it's a control issue.
China is an interesting one. From having rather lax contraception and abortion laws during the one-child era, they've moved to only abortion-for-medical-reasons now there's a three-child rule. State central planning and control intruding onto family plannig and control ...
I used to work with a Romanian, whose father was a gynecologist in the days of the Communists. The police used to call by and check his records to ensure he wasn't doing abortions. Could be doing that in Texas now of course.
Surely if he was doing them, he wouldn't be keeping records of it?
Freedoms are being suppressed around the world, and it is very largely from the “right”.
Farage is a knowing and willing participant in this populist-authoritarianism, as can be seen from his “did he just say that?” comments about immigration and his continued love affair with the anti-democratic and failed putschist, Donald Trump.
Here’s another horrible example, from the Guardian today
Poland is planning to introduce a centralised register of pregnancies that would oblige doctors to report all pregnancies and miscarriages to the government.
This is the battle of our times, and it’s incumbent on any politically aware person to pick a side.
Stalin banned abortion in 1933, only being legalised again in 1955. Access to abortion is not really a right-or-left issue; it's a control issue.
China is an interesting one. From having rather lax contraception and abortion laws during the one-child era, they've moved to only abortion-for-medical-reasons now there's a three-child rule. State central planning and control intruding onto family plannig and control ...
I used to work with a Romanian, whose father was a gynecologist in the days of the Communists. The police used to call by and check his records to ensure he wasn't doing abortions. Could be doing that in Texas now of course.
As I said, control.
Let's take a look at Corbyn's favourite country: Venezuela.
"Abortion in Venezuela is currently illegal except in some specific cases outlined in the Venezuelan Constitution,[1] and the country has one of Latin America's most restrictive laws.[2]
The punishment for a woman who has an abortion for any other reason is a prison sentence lasting anywhere between six months and two years."
The high-rollers of PB are prob more interested in this-
3m ago 18:39 Time is becoming a factor once again. Nepomniachtchi just spent eight minutes deciding on 63. ... Kg7, leaving him with 15 minutes. Carlsen is down to 13min 15sec. Aside from the 30-second increment for each move, that’s all the time they will get.
Looking at the PP odds, it's 1/14 the Conservatives so stick £28k on now and you could have £30k by the early hours of Friday. However, the Tory vote share odds look more interesting. 5/2 50-54.99% looks sensible but if @HYUFD is right and there's been very little movement, could 7/1 55-59.99% be worth a play?
I did what every sensible punter shouldn't do and backed them both so it wasn't a complete loss.
For me, it wasn't how much Old Bexley & Sidcup told us but how little. The Conservatives stayed above 50% and Labour got above 30% on a turnout more suited to a local Government by-election. Both parties will feel a sense of relief but not much more.
Let's be honest - the Conservatives held every Council seat in the Constituency with vote shares in 2018 ranging from 56% in Falconwood & Welling to 70% in St Mary's & St James. To expect any opposition party to roll that over is to expect if not the impossible then perhaps the highly improbable.
On last night's evidence, Labour might fancy their chances in the aforementioned Falconwood & Welling seat of nicking a seat but if in 2018 the Conservatives can still poll 60%+, these aren't places which will shift in a few weeks.
More than half the confirmed cases of the new Omicron variant in the UK have occurred following at least two vaccination doses, health officials have said.
A new technical briefing from the UK Health Security Agency (UKHSA) says 12 of the 22 known cases up to 30 November had been fully vaccinated.
Another two people infected had been given their first dose at least four weeks earlier.
Six were unvaccinated, with no data available on two of the cases.
Crunching the numbers that's not bad news at all, given the extremely high rates of vaccination in the population as a whole.
See edit:
So if we are 69% double vacced you would expect 15 cases if vacc had no effect whatever. In fact 12 cases, and the 2 unknowns are probably " x vacced too (because 69% are), suggesting that 2 x vacc has pretty much no effect whatever on infection.
Of course, we're also in the 'beware of extrapolation from small datasets' space.
The other thing is that most are said to be in travellers, who are presumably more likely to be vaccinated.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
I rest my case. You endorsed the vanity party of a crypto-fascist. Well done.
Trying to suggest that Theresa May is s more xenophobic or racist and xenophobic than your Mr Farage is the most ridiculous and dumb thing you have ever written on here. It is really really really stupid Philip!
This seems quite a lazy and off base insult to both PT and NF.
“Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy.
Crypto-fascism is the secret support for, or admiration of, fascism.”
Nigel Farage was described by founder of UKIP, Alan Sked as a racist. Farage is also very definitely far right. He is renowned for making nationalistic statements. he is also renowned for making anti-immigrant comments. He is well known for the hate mongering anti-immigrant poster in the Brexit campaign He has made admiring comments regarding Vladimir Putin, and is a known friend and obsequious admirer of Donald Trump. He did not challenge the lie that Trump had his election "stolen".
It is not lazy to suggest he is a crypto-fascist. It is also a fact (based on what he said) that Philip voted for him. I am right of centre, but I would never have voted for anyone with Farage's atrocious record of prejudice. Neither would I ever endorse Trump.
I can't stand Farage but he does not believe in dictatorial power or suppression of opposition. In fact he makes rather grand stands in defence of parliamentary sovereignty and free speech. His admiring comments of Putin were in one specific area and he then clarified he didn't like Putin overall and condemned his attacks on journalists.
Did he ever condemn Trump's attack on the 'lame stream media'?
I don't think he's condemned Trump's anything.
He may have suggested that Trump has been far too reticent about telling everyone how fabulous Donald Trump is. That'd be the only possibility.
It's not mild if it's putting kids into hospital...
I just wonder if this 'genius move' of letting millions of kids in the UK be exposed to Delta is going to bite us on the ass down the line when it comes to Omicron, with reliance on so called immunity via exposure not holding up with this variant.
Freedoms are being suppressed around the world, and it is very largely from the “right”.
Farage is a knowing and willing participant in this populist-authoritarianism, as can be seen from his “did he just say that?” comments about immigration and his continued love affair with the anti-democratic and failed putschist, Donald Trump.
Here’s another horrible example, from the Guardian today
Poland is planning to introduce a centralised register of pregnancies that would oblige doctors to report all pregnancies and miscarriages to the government.
This is the battle of our times, and it’s incumbent on any politically aware person to pick a side.
Stalin banned abortion in 1933, only being legalised again in 1955. Access to abortion is not really a right-or-left issue; it's a control issue.
China is an interesting one. From having rather lax contraception and abortion laws during the one-child era, they've moved to only abortion-for-medical-reasons now there's a three-child rule. State central planning and control intruding onto family plannig and control ...
The FT had an interesting article this week about China potentially hitting peak population in 2022 and the likelihood that it may decline until 2055 or something like that, given the demographic pyramid and social pressures on adult children of the one child policy.
Father is jailed for 21 years and his partner for a minimum of 29 years over the torture and killing of six-year-old Arthur Labinjo-Hughes https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-59522243
How minimum is minimum? I know lots of things get said about our criminal justice system but what is the real situation. I'm more concerned she never be placed in a role of care ever again.
"For some serious violent or sexual offences where the sentence is 7 years or more the offender will be released at the two-thirds point." 29 year sentence: 19 yrs 4 months.
She's 32 now so she'll be at least 51 when released, which is heavily odds against to have another child thankfully.
Should have been a whole life tariff.
If we had it, should have been the death penalty. Thankfully we don't have it, but should be a whole life tariff.
Cases like this, and the Everard murder make me wonder about the death penalty. If the only argument against it is wrongful convictions then cases like this are surely certain enough? Why should these people be allowed another minute of life?
I have some sympathy with that view, in that I share your revulsion at the crime. Wrongful conviction has been the mainstay argument against the death penalty, but there are others.
1. I do not want the State to have the power of life and death over me.
2. Juries will be less willing to convict if they think a death sentence might be imposed. In this case they might only have been willing to convict her for manslaughter rather than murder, and her sentence would then have been much lighter.
On point 2, that is me. I would not under any circumstances convict if death was the penalty. I could not live with the knowledge that my decision led to the death of another person. Especially if it later turned out the the conviction was unsafe. (And yes, i know there is a counter argument, what happens if they are set free and kill again. But that's not my decision).
There's an additional complication here too. They would have to screen out jurors like you and me in a trial where the death penalty is possible. Then you are no longer judged by a jury of your peers, but by a jury of those in favour of the death penalty, which creates all kinds of biases in the administration of justice.
And thinking about it, that opens up a whole can of worms, what other views are unacceptable for a juror? Gender, religion, race...
Anyway, I would just give the required answer.
Presumably you would give the true answer when questioned under oath, or risk going to jail for perjury...
And how would you ensure that the jury for the perjury trial did not contain people who didn't believe in the death penalty? (You would also need to prosecute those people who claimed not to believe in the death penalty so as to avoid the extraordinary inconvenience of being a juror in a long trial.)
There are numerous democracies that have both trial by jury and the death penalty and make it work. But I agree that it’s not practical to implement such a change with only a 52-48 majority. What was striking to me when living in Asia was that even when talking to otherwise highly liberal internationalised Gen X-ers and Millennials, it was almost impossible to find anyone who didn’t full throatedly support the death penalty for at least some crimes.
Not in our corner of the world though, Europe.
The death penalty is like abortion and Brexit; there is a formidable case for both sides of the argument and a large majority of people are incapable of seeing the strength of the side they don't take - a truth frequently demonstrated on PB.
This is characteristic of issues where none of the alternatives is without difficulty, the issue tends to raise strong feeling, and no society can absolutely sit on the fence about it - they are binaries. Politicians in power hate them for all those reasons and infinitely prefer to put them quietly to bed and allow hot potatoes to become cold potatoes over time.
Is it legitimate for a State to kill an innocent man?
I have never met anyone pro the death penalty who can answer that question.
The US state kills innocent people all the time through the use of drone strikes.
I heard a rumour that there’s 50 hours of lost footage in the can from their final recording session, Peter Jackson has been approached but doesn’t know if he’s worthy enough to take on the project
People will be relieved to hear I've dropped a concerted attempt to tailor the Clash song 'Tommy Gun' into 'Omicron'. It ought to work really well but I just can't make it happen.
It's not mild if it's putting kids into hospital...
I just wonder if this 'genius move' of letting millions of kids in the UK be exposed to Delta is going to bite us on the ass down the line when it comes to Omicron, with reliance on so called immunity via exposure not holding up with this variant.
No. Even if there is significant reinfection, prior infection will tend to moderate severity. Besides, I think significant reinfection is overstating things. There has been very little reinfection with delta, so even if omicron is two or three times more able to do so, it’s still not huge. I’m not convinced by the belief that everyone in SA has had Covid argument. We’ve had this tried many times and the antibody evidence doesn’t stack up. It’s pretty certain now that we will see omicron gaining traction here. What effect that has on severe illness, hospitalisation and death is really anyone’s guess right now. My guess is not too much, but I am likely going to be wrong.
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
I rest my case. You endorsed the vanity party of a crypto-fascist. Well done.
Trying to suggest that Theresa May is s more xenophobic or racist and xenophobic than your Mr Farage is the most ridiculous and dumb thing you have ever written on here. It is really really really stupid Philip!
This seems quite a lazy and off base insult to both PT and NF.
“Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy.
Crypto-fascism is the secret support for, or admiration of, fascism.”
Nigel Farage was described by founder of UKIP, Alan Sked as a racist. Farage is also very definitely far right. He is renowned for making nationalistic statements. he is also renowned for making anti-immigrant comments. He is well known for the hate mongering anti-immigrant poster in the Brexit campaign He has made admiring comments regarding Vladimir Putin, and is a known friend and obsequious admirer of Donald Trump. He did not challenge the lie that Trump had his election "stolen".
It is not lazy to suggest he is a crypto-fascist. It is also a fact (based on what he said) that Philip voted for him. I am right of centre, but I would never have voted for anyone with Farage's atrocious record of prejudice. Neither would I ever endorse Trump.
I can't stand Farage but he does not believe in dictatorial power or suppression of opposition. In fact he makes rather grand stands in defence of parliamentary sovereignty and free speech. His admiring comments of Putin were in one specific area and he then clarified he didn't like Putin overall and condemned his attacks on journalists.
Did he ever condemn Trump's attack on the 'lame stream media'?
I don't think he's condemned Trump's anything.
He may have suggested that Trump has been far too reticent about telling everyone how fabulous Donald Trump is. That'd be the only possibility.
Well he himself certainly makes up the shortfall. Pleased to say I didn't catch a second of the interview. Not a single second.
It's not mild if it's putting kids into hospital...
I just wonder if this 'genius move' of letting millions of kids in the UK be exposed to Delta is going to bite us on the ass down the line when it comes to Omicron, with reliance on so called immunity via exposure not holding up with this variant.
No. Even if there is significant reinfection, prior infection will tend to moderate severity. Besides, I think significant reinfection is overstating things. There has been very little reinfection with delta, so even if omicron is two or three times more able to do so, it’s still not huge. I’m not convinced by the belief that everyone in SA has had Covid argument. We’ve had this tried many times and the antibody evidence doesn’t stack up. It’s pretty certain now that we will see omicron gaining traction here. What effect that has on severe illness, hospitalisation and death is really anyone’s guess right now. My guess is not too much, but I am likely going to be wrong.
There are two versions of “covid is here forever”.
Version 1 is that it ceases being a major public health concern after this winter and floats around like influenza or pneumonia, competing for the same victims, while being annoying or barely noticeable for everyone else.
Version 2 is that we’re locked in a continual race between viral evolution and science, and that 2021 is more or less as good as things get until we get another major scientific breakthrough. There are no doubt many already falling into an almost existential depression at the possibility this might be true.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
Which country?
GB. Based on pcr indicated as Omicron from Glasgow, Milton Keynes and Alderley Park
Freedoms are being suppressed around the world, and it is very largely from the “right”.
Farage is a knowing and willing participant in this populist-authoritarianism, as can be seen from his “did he just say that?” comments about immigration and his continued love affair with the anti-democratic and failed putschist, Donald Trump.
Here’s another horrible example, from the Guardian today
Poland is planning to introduce a centralised register of pregnancies that would oblige doctors to report all pregnancies and miscarriages to the government.
This is the battle of our times, and it’s incumbent on any politically aware person to pick a side.
Stalin banned abortion in 1933, only being legalised again in 1955. Access to abortion is not really a right-or-left issue; it's a control issue.
China is an interesting one. From having rather lax contraception and abortion laws during the one-child era, they've moved to only abortion-for-medical-reasons now there's a three-child rule. State central planning and control intruding onto family plannig and control ...
Abortion is not a right or left issue, nor one that can be determined by religion, or by science. Nor is it about control particularly. It is inevitably unsatisfactory because any possible law on the matter will in some cases not adequately balance the competing claims of the mother and the unborn.
Right, left, science and religion are little use because none of them can deal with a metaphysical question of when is a person a person, and none can perfectly balance the competing claims of the mother and the unborn, who has no spokesman but the law.
FWIW the Bill Clinton sentiment works best as an aspiration for me: abortion should be safe, legal and rare.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
Lib Dems in By Elections - Win Big or Die Not Tryin'
It's working a treat mid-term.
It's not going to work come GE time though.
It never has done - even at the peak of the Party's strength it was probably competitive in no more than 75 seats.
Let's be honest - neither the Conservatives nor Labour campaign in every seat either. The election is therefore a series of skirmishes and in many areas not even that.
In East Ham, for example, the Conservative and LD efforts are token at best. Labour do a little canvassing and delivery but it's not the effort there would be in a marginal.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
You’re looking at very small data sets without knowing the context. T Cell responses from the boosters look top notch.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
Go back to previous new waves and there were stories as such. Delta was certainly linked to greater childhood issues at one stage. Data beats anecdote/anecdata every time.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
You’re looking at very small data sets without knowing the context. T Cell responses from the boosters look top notch.
Seems to me that would be more of a cause for concern than for optimism, at least until the context has been clarified. You could say exactly the same (small dataset/no context) about your T cell response comment.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
If cases shoot up to large numbers (as per other waves) then I strongly suspect the SAGE-Cabinet Office-Dept Health triumvirate will panic and force lockdown on Johnson anyway.
But I remain optimistic that this will amount to next to nothing in the end. Maybe I am deluded.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
Go back to previous new waves and there were stories as such. Delta was certainly linked to greater childhood issues at one stage. Data beats anecdote/anecdata every time.
The “highly transmissible” Omicron variant of coronavirus ripping through South Africa is putting disproportionately large numbers of children under 5 years old in hospitals, a top South African government medical adviser said Friday.
The alarming development raises the prospect of a new global battle cycle against the virus, given that the new variant has already spread to dozens of countries. The South African scientists also said the new variant was spreading much quicker than any previous wave of the coronavirus.
In a worrying virtual press conference, government adviser Waasila Jassat, speaking about the worst-affected area of Gauteng province (which includes the city of Johannesburg), said: “It’s clear in Gauteng, the week-on-week increase we’re seeing in cases and admissions is higher than we’ve seen it before. We’ve seen quite a sharp increase [in hospital admissions] across all age groups but particularly in the under 5s.”
She added: “The incidence in those under 5 is now second highest, second only to those over 60. The trend that we’re seeing now, that is different to what we’ve seen before, is a particular increase in hospital admissions in children under 5 years.
“We’ve always seen children not being very heavily affected by the COVID epidemic in the past, not having many admissions. In the third wave, we saw more admissions in young children under 5 and in teenagers, 15-19, and now, at the start of this fourth wave, we have seen quite a sharp increase across all age groups, but particularly in the under 5s.”
It's not mild if it's putting kids into hospital...
I just wonder if this 'genius move' of letting millions of kids in the UK be exposed to Delta is going to bite us on the ass down the line when it comes to Omicron, with reliance on so called immunity via exposure not holding up with this variant.
No. Even if there is significant reinfection, prior infection will tend to moderate severity. Besides, I think significant reinfection is overstating things. There has been very little reinfection with delta, so even if omicron is two or three times more able to do so, it’s still not huge. I’m not convinced by the belief that everyone in SA has had Covid argument. We’ve had this tried many times and the antibody evidence doesn’t stack up. It’s pretty certain now that we will see omicron gaining traction here. What effect that has on severe illness, hospitalisation and death is really anyone’s guess right now. My guess is not too much, but I am likely going to be wrong.
There are two versions of “covid is here forever”.
Version 1 is that it ceases being a major public health concern after this winter and floats around like influenza or pneumonia, competing for the same victims, while being annoying or barely noticeable for everyone else.
Version 2 is that we’re locked in a continual race between viral evolution and science, and that 2021 is more or less as good as things get until we get another major scientific breakthrough. There are no doubt many already falling into an almost existential depression at the possibility this might be true.
Reinfections tend to mildness over time as the immune system learns to respond. Variants will break through the primary defence, but then get overwhelmed. Covid is not going away folks, but in a few years it will be more like other cold viruses, thanks to our repeated exposures. Already seeing that for breakthrough illness among the vaccinated where the main symptoms have changed.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
Do we? There are stories from SA of it putting children in hospital.
Go back to previous new waves and there were stories as such. Delta was certainly linked to greater childhood issues at one stage. Data beats anecdote/anecdata every time.
The “highly transmissible” Omicron variant of coronavirus ripping through South Africa is putting disproportionately large numbers of children under 5 years old in hospitals, a top South African government medical adviser said Friday.
The alarming development raises the prospect of a new global battle cycle against the virus, given that the new variant has already spread to dozens of countries. The South African scientists also said the new variant was spreading much quicker than any previous wave of the coronavirus.
In a worrying virtual press conference, government adviser Waasila Jassat, speaking about the worst-affected area of Gauteng province (which includes the city of Johannesburg), said: “It’s clear in Gauteng, the week-on-week increase we’re seeing in cases and admissions is higher than we’ve seen it before. We’ve seen quite a sharp increase [in hospital admissions] across all age groups but particularly in the under 5s.”
She added: “The incidence in those under 5 is now second highest, second only to those over 60. The trend that we’re seeing now, that is different to what we’ve seen before, is a particular increase in hospital admissions in children under 5 years.
“We’ve always seen children not being very heavily affected by the COVID epidemic in the past, not having many admissions. In the third wave, we saw more admissions in young children under 5 and in teenagers, 15-19, and now, at the start of this fourth wave, we have seen quite a sharp increase across all age groups, but particularly in the under 5s.”
Five years on, and the bitter sore losers still don't understand why they lost...
We should have bets on whose will be a longer sulk: Scott's or Ted Heath's.
Obviously Farage and co would have gone away quietly if 52-48 had been 48-52 (!)
I would imagine most people would like to think they're better than stooping to Farage's standards.
Not our Scott I suppose.
You voted for Farage, knowingly and lovingly. Denying him thrice before the cock crows (OK after) isn't going to get you off the hook for being a supporter of a crypto-fascist.
Bullshit. That is a lie.
Did you vote for UKIP or Brexit Party?
Not at a General Election, no.
At a bullshit European Parliament election I begrudgingly cast a protest vote, as a last resort, when my own party was mired in failure led by a racist xenophobe who told immigrants to GO HOME.
But you've already told me before you have no issues with sending vans into minority areas saying GO HOME. So I'll take no lectures from one as blind as you.
I rest my case. You endorsed the vanity party of a crypto-fascist. Well done.
Trying to suggest that Theresa May is s more xenophobic or racist and xenophobic than your Mr Farage is the most ridiculous and dumb thing you have ever written on here. It is really really really stupid Philip!
This seems quite a lazy and off base insult to both PT and NF.
“Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy.
Crypto-fascism is the secret support for, or admiration of, fascism.”
Nigel Farage was described by founder of UKIP, Alan Sked as a racist. Farage is also very definitely far right. He is renowned for making nationalistic statements. he is also renowned for making anti-immigrant comments. He is well known for the hate mongering anti-immigrant poster in the Brexit campaign He has made admiring comments regarding Vladimir Putin, and is a known friend and obsequious admirer of Donald Trump. He did not challenge the lie that Trump had his election "stolen".
It is not lazy to suggest he is a crypto-fascist. It is also a fact (based on what he said) that Philip voted for him. I am right of centre, but I would never have voted for anyone with Farage's atrocious record of prejudice. Neither would I ever endorse Trump.
I can't stand Farage but he does not believe in dictatorial power or suppression of opposition. In fact he makes rather grand stands in defence of parliamentary sovereignty and free speech. His admiring comments of Putin were in one specific area and he then clarified he didn't like Putin overall and condemned his attacks on journalists.
Did he ever condemn Trump's attack on the 'lame stream media'?
I don't think he's condemned Trump's anything.
He may have suggested that Trump has been far too reticent about telling everyone how fabulous Donald Trump is. That'd be the only possibility.
Well he himself certainly makes up the shortfall. Pleased to say I didn't catch a second of the interview. Not a single second.
It look to me that parts of this interview are a case that Ofcom should already have been investigating, under its guidelines. In the first part he by implication, and emphasis, supports Trump's claim that the election was stolen by postal voting. Later on, he suggests that Trump was encouraging the most peaceful outcome possible in the January riot from the beginning. It's a strangely muted and haunting rogues' gallery, but it's clear from the interview that Farage is still a danger for UK politics.
It's not mild if it's putting kids into hospital...
I just wonder if this 'genius move' of letting millions of kids in the UK be exposed to Delta is going to bite us on the ass down the line when it comes to Omicron, with reliance on so called immunity via exposure not holding up with this variant.
No. Even if there is significant reinfection, prior infection will tend to moderate severity. Besides, I think significant reinfection is overstating things. There has been very little reinfection with delta, so even if omicron is two or three times more able to do so, it’s still not huge. I’m not convinced by the belief that everyone in SA has had Covid argument. We’ve had this tried many times and the antibody evidence doesn’t stack up. It’s pretty certain now that we will see omicron gaining traction here. What effect that has on severe illness, hospitalisation and death is really anyone’s guess right now. My guess is not too much, but I am likely going to be wrong.
There are two versions of “covid is here forever”.
Version 1 is that it ceases being a major public health concern after this winter and floats around like influenza or pneumonia, competing for the same victims, while being annoying or barely noticeable for everyone else.
Version 2 is that we’re locked in a continual race between viral evolution and science, and that 2021 is more or less as good as things get until we get another major scientific breakthrough. There are no doubt many already falling into an almost existential depression at the possibility this might be true.
Reinfections tend to mildness over time as the immune system learns to respond. Variants will break through the primary defence, but then get overwhelmed. Covid is not going away folks, but in a few years it will be more like other cold viruses, thanks to our repeated exposures. Already seeing that for breakthrough illness among the vaccinated where the main symptoms have changed.
Lib Dems in By Elections - Win Big or Die Not Tryin'
It's working a treat mid-term.
It's not going to work come GE time though.
It never has done - even at the peak of the Party's strength it was probably competitive in no more than 75 seats.
Let's be honest - neither the Conservatives nor Labour campaign in every seat either. The election is therefore a series of skirmishes and in many areas not even that.
In East Ham, for example, the Conservative and LD efforts are token at best. Labour do a little canvassing and delivery but it's not the effort there would be in a marginal.
If the Cleggasim had lasted a few more weeks UNS would have them hit >75
Jeffrey Barrett @jcbarret · 1h So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
But… we don’t care if it causes cases, only if that leads to widespread infirmity. And that we still do not know but have reason for optimism
If cases shoot up to large numbers (as per other waves) then I strongly suspect the SAGE-Cabinet Office-Dept Health triumvirate will panic and force lockdown on Johnson anyway.
But I remain optimistic that this will amount to next to nothing in the end. Maybe I am deluded.
I'm quite confident that between Javid and Sunak there'd be much more resistance to another lockdown again than there was when the furlough scheme was still running and HandsFaceArse was in charge of Health.
There's no point having a post-vaccines lockdown. The original lockdowns bought time for the vaccines, but what's the point now?
Lewis Goodall @lewis_goodall · 1h Replying to @lewis_goodall From 7th December-9th January in Ireland nightclubs to close Social distancing in restaurants- table service only Masks worn when not at table Max of 50% capacity at cultural/sporting events Covid pass required for gyms Max of three households for indoor household mixing
Lib Dems in By Elections - Win Big or Die Not Tryin'
It's working a treat mid-term.
It's not going to work come GE time though.
It never has done - even at the peak of the Party's strength it was probably competitive in no more than 75 seats.
Let's be honest - neither the Conservatives nor Labour campaign in every seat either. The election is therefore a series of skirmishes and in many areas not even that.
In East Ham, for example, the Conservative and LD efforts are token at best. Labour do a little canvassing and delivery but it's not the effort there would be in a marginal.
If the Cleggasim had lasted a few more weeks UNS would have them hit >75
It's not mild if it's putting kids into hospital...
I just wonder if this 'genius move' of letting millions of kids in the UK be exposed to Delta is going to bite us on the ass down the line when it comes to Omicron, with reliance on so called immunity via exposure not holding up with this variant.
No. Even if there is significant reinfection, prior infection will tend to moderate severity. Besides, I think significant reinfection is overstating things. There has been very little reinfection with delta, so even if omicron is two or three times more able to do so, it’s still not huge. I’m not convinced by the belief that everyone in SA has had Covid argument. We’ve had this tried many times and the antibody evidence doesn’t stack up. It’s pretty certain now that we will see omicron gaining traction here. What effect that has on severe illness, hospitalisation and death is really anyone’s guess right now. My guess is not too much, but I am likely going to be wrong.
There are two versions of “covid is here forever”.
Version 1 is that it ceases being a major public health concern after this winter and floats around like influenza or pneumonia, competing for the same victims, while being annoying or barely noticeable for everyone else.
Version 2 is that we’re locked in a continual race between viral evolution and science, and that 2021 is more or less as good as things get until we get another major scientific breakthrough. There are no doubt many already falling into an almost existential depression at the possibility this might be true.
Reinfections tend to mildness over time as the immune system learns to respond. Variants will break through the primary defence, but then get overwhelmed. Covid is not going away folks, but in a few years it will be more like other cold viruses, thanks to our repeated exposures. Already seeing that for breakthrough illness among the vaccinated where the main symptoms have changed.
Where are the data supporting that?
ONS has looked at this from their regular survey data and in terms of reinfection has shown this, it is not linked at all to how severe you had it the first time. Regardless of bad or mild, it has been shown in all but a very small number of cases to be mild second time around. If that is true for new variant, thats a different matter.
Comments
Documents released this afternoon show that ministers have been told that it will take “at least a further five years for Covid-19 to settle to a predictable endemic state” — where the virus lingers in the background but does not threaten to rapidly overwhelm the health system." (£)
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/nhs-will-be-plagued-by-covid-for-at-least-five-years-7v90l05l6
Edit/ actually according to R4 police are still looking for him, after he ran off when the nurse thought his arm (which had a silicon mould over his real arm) looked a bit funny.
Better off out.
Dozens of Christmas party-goers who became infected with suspected cases of Omicron Covid in Norway have only mild symptoms, doctors have revealed.
Up to 60 people who fell ill after attending a party on Oslo's waterfront a week ago have so-far developed headaches and sore throats while a few have a cough.
Tine Ravlo, chief physician for the district where the outbreak took place, said the symptoms are broadly consistent with what is being reported from South Africa, where the variant first emerged.
...
Mr Ravlo said the 'incubation period' of the new variant - the time from infection to first symptoms - appears to be two to four days.
That is far less than the seven to 14 days for most other Covid variants, and would potentially make outbreaks easier to spot - though the data is still preliminary.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10270907/Norway-Covid-60-infected-Omicron-Christmas-party-mild-symptoms.html
State Supreme Court declines to redraw political maps, accepts redistricting commission’s work
The Washington Supreme Court will not exercise its authority to redraw the state’s congressional and legislative district maps, leaving in place the work of the bipartisan redistricting commission. The decision lifts uncertainty over the new boundaries for the state’s 10 congressional districts and 49 legislative districts, which will be in place for the next decade.
SSI - the maps drawn (sort of) and approved in haste (but past legal deadline) are upheld. Which is bad news for Democrats in general, and for Democratic US Rep. Kim Schreier (D-WA) in the 8th congressional district, which loses its best Democratic area (Bellevue) and picks up GOP turf in exurban & rural Pierce and Snohomish counties.
Addendum - and Democratic notion that Democratic-oriented state supreme court would serve as backstop is proven a fallacy.
29 years is when she will be eligible to apply for parole. She has a life sentence with a minimum term of 29 years.
The boyfriend is 21 years which is eligible to be reduced to 14 years.
https://www.judiciary.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/R-v-Tustin-and-Hughes-sentencing-031221-4.pdf
And then using that as a reason she shouldn't leave the relationship. 🤦♂️
If you only have control if you end the relationship, then you need to end the relationship if you want control.
Since the EU referendum, he has cosied up to people who do not believe in democracy or the rule of law. He has proven himself to be someone who doesn't give a shit about systems, and instead he has turned into a bit of a right wing authoritarian.
Best to be out of such a nasty semi-state.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/28/jewish-groups-and-mps-condemn-nigel-farage-for-antisemitic-dog-whistles
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/us-jewish-lobby-nigel-farage-power-anti-semitism-ukip-leader-a8031191.html
HAve a good evening.
China is an interesting one. From having rather lax contraception and abortion laws during the one-child era, they've moved to only abortion-for-medical-reasons now there's a three-child rule. State central planning and control intruding onto family plannig and control ...
The answer to both is No; and the resolution of it is the due process of law.
And in both cases (life sentence and execution) it leaves the possibility of an innocent person who is never exonerated. To which, after doing the best you can, there is no solution.
PS I am anti death penalty. But I recognise there is a perfectly good case in its favour.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-59521556
Let's take a look at Corbyn's favourite country: Venezuela.
"Abortion in Venezuela is currently illegal except in some specific cases outlined in the Venezuelan Constitution,[1] and the country has one of Latin America's most restrictive laws.[2]
The punishment for a woman who has an abortion for any other reason is a prison sentence lasting anywhere between six months and two years."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Venezuela
3m ago
18:39
Time is becoming a factor once again. Nepomniachtchi just spent eight minutes deciding on 63. ... Kg7, leaving him with 15 minutes. Carlsen is down to 13min 15sec. Aside from the 30-second increment for each move, that’s all the time they will get.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/live/2021/dec/03/magnus-carlsen-v-ian-nepomniachtchi-world-chess-championship-game-6-live
This was my comment on here on Wednesday evening:
Looking at the PP odds, it's 1/14 the Conservatives so stick £28k on now and you could have £30k by the early hours of Friday. However, the Tory vote share odds look more interesting. 5/2 50-54.99% looks sensible but if @HYUFD is right and there's been very little movement, could 7/1 55-59.99% be worth a play?
I did what every sensible punter shouldn't do and backed them both so it wasn't a complete loss.
For me, it wasn't how much Old Bexley & Sidcup told us but how little. The Conservatives stayed above 50% and Labour got above 30% on a turnout more suited to a local Government by-election. Both parties will feel a sense of relief but not much more.
Let's be honest - the Conservatives held every Council seat in the Constituency with vote shares in 2018 ranging from 56% in Falconwood & Welling to 70% in St Mary's & St James. To expect any opposition party to roll that over is to expect if not the impossible then perhaps the highly improbable.
On last night's evidence, Labour might fancy their chances in the aforementioned Falconwood & Welling seat of nicking a seat but if in 2018 the Conservatives can still poll 60%+, these aren't places which will shift in a few weeks.
Adam H
@AdamH86_Abdn
·
11m
The
@ScotTories
office in West Mount Street, Aberdeen appears to have been vandalised overnight 🏚
This has happened at least twice before and the vandal is known to target Conservative and Labour offices in Aberdeen
https://twitter.com/AdamH86_Abdn/status/1466838319883591685?s=20
bad news
To criticise Steps is to hate life.
I just wonder if this 'genius move' of letting millions of kids in the UK be exposed to Delta is going to bite us on the ass down the line when it comes to Omicron, with reliance on so called immunity via exposure not holding up with this variant.
Here's one of their many fine tracks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NO-h9PFum4
https://airwars.org/conflict-data
I’m not convinced by the belief that everyone in SA has had Covid argument. We’ve had this tried many times and the antibody evidence doesn’t stack up.
It’s pretty certain now that we will see omicron gaining traction here. What effect that has on severe illness, hospitalisation and death is really anyone’s guess right now. My guess is not too much, but I am likely going to be wrong.
Version 1 is that it ceases being a major public health concern after this winter and floats around like influenza or pneumonia, competing for the same victims, while being annoying or barely noticeable for everyone else.
Version 2 is that we’re locked in a continual race between viral evolution and science, and that 2021 is more or less as good as things get until we get another major scientific breakthrough. There are no doubt many already falling into an almost existential depression at the possibility this might be true.
Jeffrey Barrett
@jcbarret
·
1h
So my main take-away is that growth looks fast in a country with immunity mostly from vaccines, rather than previous infection (and with a big ongoing Delta wave). We'll know a lot more soon, but this is not reassuring.
Right, left, science and religion are little use because none of them can deal with a metaphysical question of when is a person a person, and none can perfectly balance the competing claims of the mother and the unborn, who has no spokesman but the law.
FWIW the Bill Clinton sentiment works best as an aspiration for me: abortion should be safe, legal and rare.
It's not going to work come GE time though.
Let's be honest - neither the Conservatives nor Labour campaign in every seat either. The election is therefore a series of skirmishes and in many areas not even that.
In East Ham, for example, the Conservative and LD efforts are token at best. Labour do a little canvassing and delivery but it's not the effort there would be in a marginal.
Data beats anecdote/anecdata every time.
But I remain optimistic that this will amount to next to nothing in the end. Maybe I am deluded.
The alarming development raises the prospect of a new global battle cycle against the virus, given that the new variant has already spread to dozens of countries. The South African scientists also said the new variant was spreading much quicker than any previous wave of the coronavirus.
In a worrying virtual press conference, government adviser Waasila Jassat, speaking about the worst-affected area of Gauteng province (which includes the city of Johannesburg), said: “It’s clear in Gauteng, the week-on-week increase we’re seeing in cases and admissions is higher than we’ve seen it before. We’ve seen quite a sharp increase [in hospital admissions] across all age groups but particularly in the under 5s.”
She added: “The incidence in those under 5 is now second highest, second only to those over 60. The trend that we’re seeing now, that is different to what we’ve seen before, is a particular increase in hospital admissions in children under 5 years.
“We’ve always seen children not being very heavily affected by the COVID epidemic in the past, not having many admissions. In the third wave, we saw more admissions in young children under 5 and in teenagers, 15-19, and now, at the start of this fourth wave, we have seen quite a sharp increase across all age groups, but particularly in the under 5s.”
https://www.thedailybeast.com/omicron-variant-puttings-huge-numbers-of-kids-under-5-years-old-in-hospital-in-south-africa
Looks pretty solidly sourced
https://www.thedailybeast.com/omicron-variant-puttings-huge-numbers-of-kids-under-5-years-old-in-hospital-in-south-africa
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKZfKDciBMU
There's no point having a post-vaccines lockdown. The original lockdowns bought time for the vaccines, but what's the point now?
Lewis Goodall
@lewis_goodall
·
1h
Replying to
@lewis_goodall
From 7th December-9th January in Ireland nightclubs to close
Social distancing in restaurants- table service only
Masks worn when not at table
Max of 50% capacity at cultural/sporting events
Covid pass required for gyms
Max of three households for indoor household mixing
Prof. Christina Pagel
@chrischirp
·
50m
In my opinion this is a brave decision [Ireland lockdown] and let's hope it's enough.