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North Shropshire isn’t Tatton, nor Chesham & Amersham – politicalbetting.com

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  • Mr. Tokyo, kudos to the excellent overflow design.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,783
    algarkirk said:

    The article is an excellent analysis. The only comment I would add is that Labour have a better chance in OB&S than the LDs do in NS. But neither chance is good.

    Interested to know why you think Lab have a better chance in OB&S than the LDs in NS. That doesn't seem to be the general opinion. I agree most believe both are difficult.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,494

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    Zarah sultana as next labour leader, lol.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582
    Scott_xP said:

    But there is a worrying side to this as well. It seems the phone app communicates with servers (I guess..), and therefore it would be easy for a malicious actor to stop that communication working, denying your usage of the car. Or for Tesla themselves to 'decide' that you shouldn't be able to use your car.

    Normal car keys, please. None of this Internet of Tat rubbish. ;)

    I got an email from one of my "smarthome" vendors recently advising me of a great new feature.

    Right now everything is cloud connected, so if I want to use Alexa to turn the lights on, it only works if my DSL circuits are up.

    In future they will be able to use local WiFi to talk to each other.

    What a concept...
    Ah, so replicating what X10 home automation has been doing for decades. Get a decent home router with incoming VPN, and you can do everything these ‘cloud’ services do, without needing to rely on some company staying in business and keeping their servers running.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    David Gauke in the NS:

    https://www.newstatesman.com/comment/2021/11/boris-johnson-has-been-a-disastrous-prime-minister-but-the-conservatives-will-stick-with-him



    Boris Johnson has been a disastrous prime minister – but the Conservatives will stick with him

    The likelihood, however, is that for all his misjudgements, scandals and failure to grasp basic details (not to mention his indecisiveness, poor parliamentary performances and lack of vision for what to do with his majority), the Conservative Party will stick with him for now. And that tells us more about the Conservative Party than it does about Boris Johnson.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    Yes, a mixture of Muslim and Orthodox I think but not much in evidence thanks to communism I suppose. We had a really amazing family holiday there a few years back. Would really recommend for anyone with young kids, it is so family friendly indeed so friendly full stop. People just seemed to want to pick up our kids and cuddle them in the street all the time. Fantastic country.
    An acquaintance went there around 1980, when it was still hard-line Communist. Said it seemed friendly, so far as anyone was able to be. Scenery, he said, was amazing!
    It is stunning. Beaches are lovely, food good too. But really it was the warmth of the welcome that has stayed with me. I think in terms of reality vs expectations it's probably the biggest upside surprise I've ever had on a holiday.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371
    IanB2 said:

    darkage said:

    Zarah sultana as next labour leader, lol.

    She'd be worse than the currant one.
    That's a grape pun.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    Chateau Musar has been producing top quality reds for decades.

    AIR Georgian wines are made in a 'traditional' method no longer found elsewhere; M&S used to do a good one.

    From Turkey, Urla Vourla is worth looking out for.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582
    So, wake up this morning to see riots in half of Western Europe, half of the USA, and Russia seriously threatening to go into Ukraine.

    Looks like a quiet winter we’ve got coming up…. :open_mouth:
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    IanB2 said:

    darkage said:

    Zarah sultana as next labour leader, lol.

    She'd be worse than the currant one.
    There’s a raisin why people shouldn’t go directly from Uni to Parliament!
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,783

    Mr. Tokyo, I am not convinced.

    Also, the worst that can happen is hackers utilising the tiny processing power of thousands of IoT devices and using that to break into banks or create DDOS attacks to bring down major online infrastructure.

    Edited extra bit: or, in your bath situation, they could run it and see whether sufficient water damage can be caused to ruin your home.

    Realistically finding a hackable internet-connected device isn't likely to be the main bottleneck for a DDoS. I know it's been done on occasion, but it's unusual for it to be the best way, especially when routers are such garbage.

    You can't ruin my home by overflowing the bath because it has advanced Japanese overflow hole technology which sends the water down the drain if the level gets too high using gravity, and even if they somehow managed emit a tone that called all the spiders in the house and persuaded them to block the hole, all you'd do would be to put water on same tiled floor and down the same drain that I use when operating my shower normally.
    I was thinking how lazy or impatient do we have to get that we want to boil a kettle remotely, but then I think of TV remote controls. I can't imagine having to get up to turn the TV over now and I can't remember that being an issue before them, but then I remember only having 2 channels.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,494

    Aye, the Internet of Things is rampantly over-used. I do think, even as a luddite, there are reasonable cases (cameras and doorbells). But an internet-connected kettle? Only for lazy swine.

    I don't have an internet-connected kettle but I can run (or reheat) my bath from my phone, and also all the heaters/air conditioners in the house and office. This is really handy - I mainly use it in the house, for instance I want to warm up downstairs when I'm in bed. It would work if it was only on my local house network rather than going via the internet but I'm sure it's easier to support and troubleshoot an internet service than one that's only on a LAN.

    I don't really see why you *wouldn't* want to be able to do that - a net-connected kettle would also be handy. If you want a cup of tea when you get up, I think you obviously want to start boiling the kettle before you get out of bed. It's not just a matter of being lazy, it's also a time-saver. I suppose someone could hack it, but the worst thing that would happen would be that my house would get heated when I didn't want it to, which doesn't sound catastrophic.

    Basically anything electronic should be operable from your phone, unless there's a security reason not to do it. (Cameras are a case where there actually *is* a good security reason not to...)
    How do you fill the kettle?
    I imagine you'd refill it after you use it? However it's true there are limits on the bath, because it can't control the plug, and also can't get the spiders out.
    Couldn’t the smart robot vacuum team up with “smart bath” and vacuum the spiders out?

    When I was a nipper I used to say to the spider, I’m about to pour lots of hot water in this bath, but I’m giving you fifteen seconds to get out. You should see their little faces looking up.

    once you drown them in hot water they just dissolve to nothing. No problem
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    Chateau Musar has been producing top quality reds for decades.

    AIR Georgian wines are made in a 'traditional' method no longer found elsewhere; M&S used to do a good one.

    From Turkey, Urla Vourla is worth looking out for.
    Yes, had some very pleasant Turkish wines while holidaying there. The (Moslem) restauranteur was very proud of them.
  • darkage said:

    Regarding the internet of things: Read Shoshana Zuboff's book 'the Age of Surveillance Capitalism'; or if you can't manage the book, some of the articles and podcasts she did around the time such as this interview with David Runciman of Cambridge University.

    https://www.talkingpoliticspodcast.com/blog/2019/144-the-nightmare-of-surveillance-capitalism

    Zuboff describes how this is fundamentally altering human nature. People are becoming addicted to and dependent on technology in ways that are completely unnecessary, to serve the interests of commerce. I've seen this over and over again, and it is just all really sad.

    This stuff all just seems so pointless. You want to boil the kettle? Press the on switch and wait for a minute. Want to know if your fridge is running low? Open it and look inside. One day we're going to wake up and realise we can't have a cup of tea because Vladimir Putin has hacked our kettles.
    It all reeks of more money than sense, too. Like boiling water taps and wine fridges. Meanwhile the world heats up, refugees are drowning in the channel, kids in this country are going to school hungry, hospitals are failing, the government shovels billions to its pals. But let's keep on buying pointless tat!
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Mr. Tokyo, kudos to the excellent overflow design.

    It should have a call and float system to yank the plug out when the water reaches a certain height
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,136
    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,582
    Foxy said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    I thought Thangam Debbonaire quite brilliant in the debate. She is one to watch and a future Leader candidate. I do have a soft spot for Sultana, apart from the usual anti-semitic blind spot. She has quite a strong twitter and tiktok following. She is likely to be the hard left candidate in the next contest.

    https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8p638YK/
    So, apart from the racism, she’s a good egg?
  • House Dems jumping around in celebration at passing the huge Biden social and climate Bill.

    But surely it'll never make it through the Senate?
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496
    edited November 2021
    kjh said:

    algarkirk said:

    The article is an excellent analysis. The only comment I would add is that Labour have a better chance in OB&S than the LDs do in NS. But neither chance is good.

    Interested to know why you think Lab have a better chance in OB&S than the LDs in NS. That doesn't seem to be the general opinion. I agree most believe both are difficult.
    1) OB&S is not posh Tory, Con and Lab are the only two mainstream parties to choose from
    2) The current London anti Tory effect and trend, which will wholly benefit Labour
    3) In NS LDs are coming from third
    4) Historically NS is a Con v Lab seat, essentially rural, in which the working class tend to vote Labour, outnumbered by the rest who vote Tory. Its a bit like rural Lincolnshire, but less affected than Lincs by EU migration.
    5) ATM the rural community is less likely to have Brexit buyer's remorse than urban south east.

    Tories still should win both, but I have a halfpenny e/w on Labour for OB&S.

  • Dura_Ace said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    It's nothing to do with money as a tow back costs almost nothing. It's just that the government doesn't have the guts to do it.
    They’ve made the (probably correct) calculation that the sort of people who would feel a rustling in their trousers at the optics of an inflatable full of kids, sorry, evil people traffickers being forcibly towed back to French waters are stuck to them like shit on a blanket while the average punter already having doubts about BJism might feel a bit queasy. Imagine a capsize or a despairing migrant throwing themselves into the sea with their kids. Again, that might float certain people’s boats, as it were, but..
  • kjh said:

    Mr. Tokyo, I am not convinced.

    Also, the worst that can happen is hackers utilising the tiny processing power of thousands of IoT devices and using that to break into banks or create DDOS attacks to bring down major online infrastructure.

    Edited extra bit: or, in your bath situation, they could run it and see whether sufficient water damage can be caused to ruin your home.

    Realistically finding a hackable internet-connected device isn't likely to be the main bottleneck for a DDoS. I know it's been done on occasion, but it's unusual for it to be the best way, especially when routers are such garbage.

    You can't ruin my home by overflowing the bath because it has advanced Japanese overflow hole technology which sends the water down the drain if the level gets too high using gravity, and even if they somehow managed emit a tone that called all the spiders in the house and persuaded them to block the hole, all you'd do would be to put water on same tiled floor and down the same drain that I use when operating my shower normally.
    I was thinking how lazy or impatient do we have to get that we want to boil a kettle remotely, but then I think of TV remote controls. I can't imagine having to get up to turn the TV over now and I can't remember that being an issue before them, but then I remember only having 2 channels.
    The next problem is that you have to somehow locate the TV remote control, which often involves strenuous activity like getting up and walking over to a different part of the room. This is why ultimately everything should end up run from your phone, which never leaves your side. I'm like that with my heating/aircon, each unit has a remote control but I hardly ever use it even when I'm in the same room because the phone is handier.
  • Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    I thought Thangam Debbonaire quite brilliant in the debate. She is one to watch and a future Leader candidate. I do have a soft spot for Sultana, apart from the usual anti-semitic blind spot. She has quite a strong twitter and tiktok following. She is likely to be the hard left candidate in the next contest.

    https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8p638YK/
    So, apart from the racism, she’s a good egg?
    Yeah, this shouldn't be seen as an "accidental flaw" that can be put to one side. Anyone still thinking it is okay to be anti-semitic or racist should not be a candidate as an MP for a major party.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    edited November 2021

    Dura_Ace said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    It's nothing to do with money as a tow back costs almost nothing. It's just that the government doesn't have the guts to do it.
    They’ve made the (probably correct) calculation that the sort of people who would feel a rustling in their trousers at the optics of an inflatable full of kids, sorry, evil people traffickers being forcibly towed back to French waters are stuck to them like shit on a blanket while the average punter already having doubts about BJism might feel a bit queasy. Imagine a capsize or a despairing migrant throwing themselves into the sea with their kids. Again, that might float certain people’s boats, as it were, but..
    You can't legally tow back beyond the French 12 mile TL so they'd have to follow the Australian tow back model: load the informal immigrants into a lifeboat, tow it west to Brest just outside the TL and pay off one of them with cash to drive the lifeboat onto the French coast.

    If they did that two or three times the crossings would stop.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    Chateau Musar has been producing top quality reds for decades.

    AIR Georgian wines are made in a 'traditional' method no longer found elsewhere; M&S used to do a good one.

    From Turkey, Urla Vourla is worth looking out for.
    Yes, had some very pleasant Turkish wines while holidaying there. The (Moslem) restauranteur was very proud of them.
    Islam was not always so. Try reading the Rubaiyat of old Omar.

    "I often wonder what the vintner's buy
    One half so precious as the goods they sell"

  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,800

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    Hope you both get better soon!
  • Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    There are two sorts of Georgian wine.

    One is Qvevri, traditionally made and matured in buried in clay pots on the twigs and leaves, which for the White is fairly unique. Expensive, even in Georgia.

    The rest is mostly commercial, semi-sweet reds originally aimed at the Russian market and now I'm not sure who they'd sell it to.

    It's a gorgeous country, and well worth a visit when this has all blown over.
  • ClippPClippP Posts: 1,904
    ydoethur said:

    theakes said:

    Expecting to visit the seat in the next 48 hours, will objectively and honestly report back my feelings about what is happening. Live in a neighbouring seat and have to say the signs at this early stage are contrary to what Pipa feels. One problem for the Conservatives is that their candidate lives in Birmingham and apparently did not take any media interviews for a week, saying he wanted to get to know the constituency!!!!
    But I will see what I find.

    If Ed Davey has an ounce of political sense he will ignore sleaze and go with that. Albeit it may be less effective as Ben Wood (Lab) is also from Oswestry.
    I do not think that the leader of the party has much to do with setting the tone for Lib Dem byelection campaigns, Mr Ydoethur. I may be wrong of course.

    But from what I gather, it is the local people themselves who are raising the issue of Tory sleaze - the Lib Dem campaign is concentrating on the poor service given the the NHS locally.
  • darkage said:

    Regarding the internet of things: Read Shoshana Zuboff's book 'the Age of Surveillance Capitalism'; or if you can't manage the book, some of the articles and podcasts she did around the time such as this interview with David Runciman of Cambridge University.

    https://www.talkingpoliticspodcast.com/blog/2019/144-the-nightmare-of-surveillance-capitalism

    Zuboff describes how this is fundamentally altering human nature. People are becoming addicted to and dependent on technology in ways that are completely unnecessary, to serve the interests of commerce. I've seen this over and over again, and it is just all really sad.

    This stuff all just seems so pointless. You want to boil the kettle? Press the on switch and wait for a minute. Want to know if your fridge is running low? Open it and look inside. One day we're going to wake up and realise we can't have a cup of tea because Vladimir Putin has hacked our kettles.
    It all reeks of more money than sense, too. Like boiling water taps and wine fridges. Meanwhile the world heats up, refugees are drowning in the channel, kids in this country are going to school hungry, hospitals are failing, the government shovels billions to its pals. But let's keep on buying pointless tat!
    All just marketing fluff. Doesn't benefit quality of life very much if at all. And unless you earn at the rate of a PL footballer or above it certainly does not benefit quality of life to justify the extra working hours to pay for it all resulting in reduced leisure time.
  • darkage said:

    Regarding the internet of things: Read Shoshana Zuboff's book 'the Age of Surveillance Capitalism'; or if you can't manage the book, some of the articles and podcasts she did around the time such as this interview with David Runciman of Cambridge University.

    https://www.talkingpoliticspodcast.com/blog/2019/144-the-nightmare-of-surveillance-capitalism

    Zuboff describes how this is fundamentally altering human nature. People are becoming addicted to and dependent on technology in ways that are completely unnecessary, to serve the interests of commerce. I've seen this over and over again, and it is just all really sad.

    This stuff all just seems so pointless. You want to boil the kettle? Press the on switch and wait for a minute. Want to know if your fridge is running low? Open it and look inside. One day we're going to wake up and realise we can't have a cup of tea because Vladimir Putin has hacked our kettles.
    It all reeks of more money than sense, too. Like boiling water taps and wine fridges. Meanwhile the world heats up, refugees are drowning in the channel, kids in this country are going to school hungry, hospitals are failing, the government shovels billions to its pals. But let's keep on buying pointless tat!
    At least with regard to heating, the ability to turn it on just before you need it saves you energy, because otherwise you'd leave it on or put it on a timer. On a renewable-dominated electric grid you may also want to add some additional clevers like heating up spaces (or the water in your bath or kettle) when there's surplus power and your previous usage suggests you're likely to need it, which also require that the thing is connected to a network.

    You of course still want the physical switch on the thing for when Vladimir Putin hacks your stuff, or Priti Patel orders your service provider to ban you from making tea to punish you for an unpatriotic comment or whatever. Or more commonly, for when you lose your phone or something breaks of its own accord.
  • kjh said:

    Mr. Tokyo, I am not convinced.

    Also, the worst that can happen is hackers utilising the tiny processing power of thousands of IoT devices and using that to break into banks or create DDOS attacks to bring down major online infrastructure.

    Edited extra bit: or, in your bath situation, they could run it and see whether sufficient water damage can be caused to ruin your home.

    Realistically finding a hackable internet-connected device isn't likely to be the main bottleneck for a DDoS. I know it's been done on occasion, but it's unusual for it to be the best way, especially when routers are such garbage.

    You can't ruin my home by overflowing the bath because it has advanced Japanese overflow hole technology which sends the water down the drain if the level gets too high using gravity, and even if they somehow managed emit a tone that called all the spiders in the house and persuaded them to block the hole, all you'd do would be to put water on same tiled floor and down the same drain that I use when operating my shower normally.
    I was thinking how lazy or impatient do we have to get that we want to boil a kettle remotely, but then I think of TV remote controls. I can't imagine having to get up to turn the TV over now and I can't remember that being an issue before them, but then I remember only having 2 channels.
    The next problem is that you have to somehow locate the TV remote control, which often involves strenuous activity like getting up and walking over to a different part of the room. This is why ultimately everything should end up run from your phone, which never leaves your side. I'm like that with my heating/aircon, each unit has a remote control but I hardly ever use it even when I'm in the same room because the phone is handier.
    Also, if I misplace my phone, I can call myself from a computer and it rings.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    algarkirk said:

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    Chateau Musar has been producing top quality reds for decades.

    AIR Georgian wines are made in a 'traditional' method no longer found elsewhere; M&S used to do a good one.

    From Turkey, Urla Vourla is worth looking out for.
    Yes, had some very pleasant Turkish wines while holidaying there. The (Moslem) restauranteur was very proud of them.
    Islam was not always so. Try reading the Rubaiyat of old Omar.

    "I often wonder what the vintner's buy
    One half so precious as the goods they sell"

    He had some good thoughts, old Omar, didn't he!

    My textbook on Islam, collected when I went on 10 weeks course, suggests that teaching on alcohol moved from tolerance to outright prohibition over the development of the surahs.
    Apparently Moslems shouldn't buy or sell it, or even work where it is sold.
  • House Dems jumping around in celebration at passing the huge Biden social and climate Bill.

    But surely it'll never make it through the Senate?

    Not in its current form but they might still get a Manchinized version?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    There are two sorts of Georgian wine.

    One is Qvevri, traditionally made and matured in buried in clay pots on the twigs and leaves, which for the White is fairly unique. Expensive, even in Georgia.

    The rest is mostly commercial, semi-sweet reds originally aimed at the Russian market and now I'm not sure who they'd sell it to.

    It's a gorgeous country, and well worth a visit when this has all blown over.
    I've an acquaintance who worked there for a while who speaks highly of the country. It's on my bucket-list, although low, but at the stage I've now reached, I'm somewhat doubtful of reaching that far down!
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496
    edited November 2021

    algarkirk said:

    IanB2 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    Chateau Musar has been producing top quality reds for decades.

    AIR Georgian wines are made in a 'traditional' method no longer found elsewhere; M&S used to do a good one.

    From Turkey, Urla Vourla is worth looking out for.
    Yes, had some very pleasant Turkish wines while holidaying there. The (Moslem) restauranteur was very proud of them.
    Islam was not always so. Try reading the Rubaiyat of old Omar.

    "I often wonder what the vintner's buy
    One half so precious as the goods they sell"

    He had some good thoughts, old Omar, didn't he!

    My textbook on Islam, collected when I went on 10 weeks course, suggests that teaching on alcohol moved from tolerance to outright prohibition over the development of the surahs.
    Apparently Moslems shouldn't buy or sell it, or even work where it is sold.
    Ditto, thoughts about depictions of the prophet have shifted. Not uncommon in the medieval world. There are mainstream print publications that occasionally reproduce one or two in the public domain, and such is the climate of the modern world that I am not going to say who.

  • Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    There are two sorts of Georgian wine.

    One is Qvevri, traditionally made and matured in buried in clay pots on the twigs and leaves, which for the White is fairly unique. Expensive, even in Georgia.

    The rest is mostly commercial, semi-sweet reds originally aimed at the Russian market and now I'm not sure who they'd sell it to.

    It's a gorgeous country, and well worth a visit when this has all blown over.
    I've an acquaintance who worked there for a while who speaks highly of the country. It's on my bucket-list, although low, but at the stage I've now reached, I'm somewhat doubtful of reaching that far down!
    I did it as part of a multi-country tour - flew from Kyiv and back. Four or five days in Tbilisi is certainly worthwhile. For my next trip I was going to combine it with Armenia but that might be a while yet as I now have a backlog of places to visit.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Take Back Controoo...oohhhhh

    Boris Johnson has ordered a cross-Whitehall review into the migrant crisis after being “exasperated” by his government’s failure to stem the numbers.
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/boris-johnson-demands-channel-migrant-fix-9mvrnrbfm

    The problem with current British politics in a nutshell.

    Most of our leaders are from a slice of the population who just have to say "make it so" and it will be so. The successful campaigns of 2016 and 2019 were all about the idea that the reason things weren't right in the UK was a lack of wanting, a lack of people saying "make it so" and rotten foreigners blocking our way to our rightful place at the top.

    It's an appealing theory, and it's understandable that people voted for it.

    Unfortunately, as the difficulty of stopping the tiny boats shows, wanting isn't anything like enough.
    I remain entertained by the prospects of them coming up with a deal to deport asylum seekers to an Albanian gulag. When so many of these boats are arriving and people are literally running off, how exactly are they to be deported?

    Perhaps Boris might want to look into the police and into Border Force and into the huge cuts made to their budgets by successive Tory governments...
    I very much doubt the Albanians would be up for this. What if the refugees decided they wanted to stay in Albania? It's a beautiful country and it has far nicer weather than we do.
    Moslem heritage, too, AIUI.
    And wine. Kantina Belba Is a nice white a friend brought some to a picnic.
    Never seen Albanian wine. Bought some pleasant Lebanese red the other day, and someone brought a Georgian white to our Wine Appreciation Group not long ago.
    I know people speak highly of Georgian wine, but I’ve tasted both red and white and am yet to be impressed.
    There are two sorts of Georgian wine.

    One is Qvevri, traditionally made and matured in buried in clay pots on the twigs and leaves, which for the White is fairly unique. Expensive, even in Georgia.

    The rest is mostly commercial, semi-sweet reds originally aimed at the Russian market and now I'm not sure who they'd sell it to.

    It's a gorgeous country, and well worth a visit when this has all blown over.
    Joe Fattorini goes to Georgia in episode 3 of The Wine Show's second series.

    He visits a Qvevri winery and climbs into one of the buried clay pots! It does look a fascinating place to visit.
  • theakestheakes Posts: 930
    Algarkirk: Shropshire North, I think it is universally accepted that the Lib Dems are running in second place, the jokers in the pack are probably Conservative abstentions and Reform. The election may be decided on the postal vote, especially if there is bad weather on polling day. But I will see what I find.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,372
    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    I thought Thangam Debbonaire quite brilliant in the debate. She is one to watch and a future Leader candidate. I do have a soft spot for Sultana, apart from the usual anti-semitic blind spot. She has quite a strong twitter and tiktok following. She is likely to be the hard left candidate in the next contest.

    https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8p638YK/
    So, apart from the racism, she’s a good egg?
    It seems to be the case. Some people have a blind spot for it if they like the MP
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631

    Foxy said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    I thought Thangam Debbonaire quite brilliant in the debate. She is one to watch and a future Leader candidate. I do have a soft spot for Sultana, apart from the usual anti-semitic blind spot. She has quite a strong twitter and tiktok following. She is likely to be the hard left candidate in the next contest.

    https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8p638YK/
    What other forms of racism deserve description as "blind spots" in your language?
    Well quite often people have blind spots on specific issues, including racism. While obviously wrong, it doesn't cancel them completely in my eyes. To restrict politics to those of some impossible standard of being perfect on all measures would make it very difficult to populate Parliaments.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    edited November 2021
    Andy_JS said:

    Wasn't Brecon & Radnor a Leave seat that went to the LDs in a by-election?

    Yes. And not too far from N Shropshire
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,783

    kjh said:

    Mr. Tokyo, I am not convinced.

    Also, the worst that can happen is hackers utilising the tiny processing power of thousands of IoT devices and using that to break into banks or create DDOS attacks to bring down major online infrastructure.

    Edited extra bit: or, in your bath situation, they could run it and see whether sufficient water damage can be caused to ruin your home.

    Realistically finding a hackable internet-connected device isn't likely to be the main bottleneck for a DDoS. I know it's been done on occasion, but it's unusual for it to be the best way, especially when routers are such garbage.

    You can't ruin my home by overflowing the bath because it has advanced Japanese overflow hole technology which sends the water down the drain if the level gets too high using gravity, and even if they somehow managed emit a tone that called all the spiders in the house and persuaded them to block the hole, all you'd do would be to put water on same tiled floor and down the same drain that I use when operating my shower normally.
    I was thinking how lazy or impatient do we have to get that we want to boil a kettle remotely, but then I think of TV remote controls. I can't imagine having to get up to turn the TV over now and I can't remember that being an issue before them, but then I remember only having 2 channels.
    The next problem is that you have to somehow locate the TV remote control, which often involves strenuous activity like getting up and walking over to a different part of the room. This is why ultimately everything should end up run from your phone, which never leaves your side. I'm like that with my heating/aircon, each unit has a remote control but I hardly ever use it even when I'm in the same room because the phone is handier.
    I'm always losing my phone! I could get another phone to phone my phone I suppose. I must admit I do sometimes wish my remote controls had sirens on it, also my glasses. So that is the next two things to be linked to the internet.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631
    IanB2 said:

    darkage said:

    Zarah sultana as next labour leader, lol.

    She'd be worse than the currant one.
    I think though she has every raisin to be the chosen one of the Corbynites next contest.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424

    Andy_JS said:

    Wasn't Brecon & Radnor a Leave seat that went to the LDs in a by-election?

    Yes. And not too far from N Shropshire
    B&R had a long tradition of Liberalism, though. Since WWII all three parties have held it.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,067
    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,126
    Andy_JS said:

    Apparently WHO head Dr Tedros has said there's "no point in giving booster jabs to healthy adults."

    From their global perspective this is true. Not quite 'no point' but a wrong priority.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,311

    Jade Walks Her Talk and shows some Chalk

    14:25 Haydock - Flight Deck [Old Bony]
    14:40 Ascot - Song for Someone [nb]

    Thats 2 for this Saturday. Sorry it’s not sooner I was gone shopping.

    I have put a bit on flight deck at Haydock but think your Ascot one will be beaten by BUZZ so gave that a miss.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    edited November 2021
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    I thought Thangam Debbonaire quite brilliant in the debate. She is one to watch and a future Leader candidate. I do have a soft spot for Sultana, apart from the usual anti-semitic blind spot. She has quite a strong twitter and tiktok following. She is likely to be the hard left candidate in the next contest.

    https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8p638YK/
    What other forms of racism deserve description as "blind spots" in your language?
    Well quite often people have blind spots on specific issues, including racism. While obviously wrong, it doesn't cancel them completely in my eyes. To restrict politics to those of some impossible standard of being perfect on all measures would make it very difficult to populate Parliaments.
    That's a very nice idea, in theory. Does she ascribe to such a forgiving view toward those who are her opponents, I wonder? Can we think of other politicians accused of racism whose supporters would be rightly ridiculed if they described incidents and allegations as being true, but a 'blind spot'?

    I don't believe in cancelling people forever, even for some pretty distasteful stuff, particularly if it is not borne out by their behaviour in future. But I think describing racism as a blind spot would not pass muster with most people even for politicians they like - hence usually it is denied.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,783
    algarkirk said:

    kjh said:

    algarkirk said:

    The article is an excellent analysis. The only comment I would add is that Labour have a better chance in OB&S than the LDs do in NS. But neither chance is good.

    Interested to know why you think Lab have a better chance in OB&S than the LDs in NS. That doesn't seem to be the general opinion. I agree most believe both are difficult.
    1) OB&S is not posh Tory, Con and Lab are the only two mainstream parties to choose from
    2) The current London anti Tory effect and trend, which will wholly benefit Labour
    3) In NS LDs are coming from third
    4) Historically NS is a Con v Lab seat, essentially rural, in which the working class tend to vote Labour, outnumbered by the rest who vote Tory. Its a bit like rural Lincolnshire, but less affected than Lincs by EU migration.
    5) ATM the rural community is less likely to have Brexit buyer's remorse than urban south east.

    Tories still should win both, but I have a halfpenny e/w on Labour for OB&S.

    I don't disagree with any of that, but these are by elections. The LDs are going for NS and not OB&S. They are very good at by elections so I take it they know what they are doing (I have been involved in this in the past). They do have superior by election team to Lab. If, and it is a big if, they can get themselves into the challenger position in the minds of the voters in NS they can challenge in my opinion.

    So the impact they can have in a by election is generally greater than Lab, but if and only if they are going for it and if and only if they can position themselves as the challenger.

    I think both are unlikely to change hands, but if I had to bet on one I would go for NS, even though the evidence (outside of a by election) is as you say in favour of Lab (in both).
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    Looking at the list of Candidates for Shropshire N, there seem to be quite a few candidates who will draw a few votes from the Tories.

    I'm glad to see the Monster Raving Loonies are up and running. What, though, is the Reclaim party?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631
    edited November 2021
    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    Yes I have a friend who chose her own surname as a rejection of patriarchy. Sticking with her birth surname would have been choosing her fathers name over her husbands, and her mother's original surname would be her grandfather's etc ad infinitum.

    I don't think Sultana will win, but she is likely to be the left candidate. The new rules make it unlikely that she will make the final slate. Indeed that is why they were brought in.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371
    edited November 2021

    Getting them ready for university sex work?

    A brilliant story, and the headline's blown it.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,817
    edited November 2021

    Aye, the Internet of Things is rampantly over-used. I do think, even as a luddite, there are reasonable cases (cameras and doorbells). But an internet-connected kettle? Only for lazy swine.

    I don't have an internet-connected kettle but I can run (or reheat) my bath from my phone, and also all the heaters/air conditioners in the house and office. This is really handy - I mainly use it in the house, for instance I want to warm up downstairs when I'm in bed. It would work if it was only on my local house network rather than going via the internet but I'm sure it's easier to support and troubleshoot an internet service than one that's only on a LAN.

    I don't really see why you *wouldn't* want to be able to do that - a net-connected kettle would also be handy. If you want a cup of tea when you get up, I think you obviously want to start boiling the kettle before you get out of bed. It's not just a matter of being lazy, it's also a time-saver. I suppose someone could hack it, but the worst thing that would happen would be that my house would get heated when I didn't want it to, which doesn't sound catastrophic.

    Basically anything electronic should be operable from your phone, unless there's a security reason not to do it. (Cameras are a case where there actually *is* a good security reason not to...)
    How do you fill the kettle?
    I imagine you'd refill it after you use it? However it's true there are limits on the bath, because it can't control the plug, and also can't get the spiders out.
    Couldn’t the smart robot vacuum team up with “smart bath” and vacuum the spiders out?

    When I was a nipper I used to say to the spider, I’m about to pour lots of hot water in this bath, but I’m giving you fifteen seconds to get out. You should see their little faces looking up.

    once you drown them in hot water they just dissolve to nothing. No problem

    Aye, the Internet of Things is rampantly over-used. I do think, even as a luddite, there are reasonable cases (cameras and doorbells). But an internet-connected kettle? Only for lazy swine.

    I don't have an internet-connected kettle but I can run (or reheat) my bath from my phone, and also all the heaters/air conditioners in the house and office. This is really handy - I mainly use it in the house, for instance I want to warm up downstairs when I'm in bed. It would work if it was only on my local house network rather than going via the internet but I'm sure it's easier to support and troubleshoot an internet service than one that's only on a LAN.

    I don't really see why you *wouldn't* want to be able to do that - a net-connected kettle would also be handy. If you want a cup of tea when you get up, I think you obviously want to start boiling the kettle before you get out of bed. It's not just a matter of being lazy, it's also a time-saver. I suppose someone could hack it, but the worst thing that would happen would be that my house would get heated when I didn't want it to, which doesn't sound catastrophic.

    Basically anything electronic should be operable from your phone, unless there's a security reason not to do it. (Cameras are a case where there actually *is* a good security reason not to...)
    How do you fill the kettle?
    I imagine you'd refill it after you use it? However it's true there are limits on the bath, because it can't control the plug, and also can't get the spiders out.
    Couldn’t the smart robot vacuum team up with “smart bath” and vacuum the spiders out?

    When I was a nipper I used to say to the spider, I’m about to pour lots of hot water in this bath, but I’m giving you fifteen seconds to get out. You should see their little faces looking up.

    once you drown them in hot water they just dissolve to nothing. No problem
    I find that impossible to believe simply because the chitin in the exoskeleton is a crosslinked polymer and therefore insoluble. I do wonder where your spiders are ending up that you can't see them any more. Perhaps you need a mirror to examine your posterior aspect?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    edited November 2021

    Andy_JS said:

    Wasn't Brecon & Radnor a Leave seat that went to the LDs in a by-election?

    Yes. And not too far from N Shropshire
    That was very hard going, though, and considerably helped by the right-wing/leaver vote being split. And with something of a local core vote on which to build, and Kirsty's popularity as the AM which, having canvassed there, came up a lot on the doorstep.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371

    Looking at the list of Candidates for Shropshire N, there seem to be quite a few candidates who will draw a few votes from the Tories.

    I'm glad to see the Monster Raving Loonies are up and running. What, though, is the Reclaim party?

    The Tories selected their candidate days ago.

    Oh sorry, did you mean the Official Monster Raving Loony Party?
  • kjh said:

    kjh said:

    Mr. Tokyo, I am not convinced.

    Also, the worst that can happen is hackers utilising the tiny processing power of thousands of IoT devices and using that to break into banks or create DDOS attacks to bring down major online infrastructure.

    Edited extra bit: or, in your bath situation, they could run it and see whether sufficient water damage can be caused to ruin your home.

    Realistically finding a hackable internet-connected device isn't likely to be the main bottleneck for a DDoS. I know it's been done on occasion, but it's unusual for it to be the best way, especially when routers are such garbage.

    You can't ruin my home by overflowing the bath because it has advanced Japanese overflow hole technology which sends the water down the drain if the level gets too high using gravity, and even if they somehow managed emit a tone that called all the spiders in the house and persuaded them to block the hole, all you'd do would be to put water on same tiled floor and down the same drain that I use when operating my shower normally.
    I was thinking how lazy or impatient do we have to get that we want to boil a kettle remotely, but then I think of TV remote controls. I can't imagine having to get up to turn the TV over now and I can't remember that being an issue before them, but then I remember only having 2 channels.
    The next problem is that you have to somehow locate the TV remote control, which often involves strenuous activity like getting up and walking over to a different part of the room. This is why ultimately everything should end up run from your phone, which never leaves your side. I'm like that with my heating/aircon, each unit has a remote control but I hardly ever use it even when I'm in the same room because the phone is handier.
    I'm always losing my phone! I could get another phone to phone my phone I suppose. I must admit I do sometimes wish my remote controls had sirens on it, also my glasses. So that is the next two things to be linked to the internet.
    Try a Google smart speaker. Several times a day I call out "Google Find My Phone" and it always does.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,067
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    Yes I have a friend who chose her own surname as a rejection of patriarchy. Sticking with her birth surname would have been choosing her fathers name over her husbands, and her mother's original surname would be her grandfather's etc ad infinitum.

    I don't think Sultana will win, but she is likely to be the left candidate. The new rules make it unlikely that she will make the final slate. Indeed that is why they were brought in.
    Not sure that's quite it.
    In her twenties, she changed her name by deed poll from Singh to Debbonaire, borrowed from a valued relative from her first marriage.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371
    edited November 2021
    IanB2 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Wasn't Brecon & Radnor a Leave seat that went to the LDs in a by-election?

    Yes. And not too far from N Shropshire
    That was very hard going, though, and considerably helped by the right-wing/leaver vote being split. And with something of a local core vote on which to build, and Kirsty's popularity as the AM which, having canvassed there, came up a lot on the doorstep.
    Even allowing for all of that, plus the disgraced Tory candidate, I was genuinely shocked you pulled that off, as you will doubtless remember.

    NS would be about fifty times harder.

    I don't say it can't be done. I do say it is very unlikely and would definitely be terminal for the egregious Johnson.

    So naturally I'm desperately hoping for it to happen, I just can't see it!
  • I was just idly wondering why I'd never heard the word Zionophobia, so I looked it up and it's certainly been used a fair bit in the USA ("on college campus" often seems to be in the same stories)

    It's never been used on PB (at least on Vanilla, that is), nor zionophobic or -phobe.

    Is it different from antisemitism?

    Is it useful as a kind of differentiator for the antisemites with Jewish friends who all just hate Israel?
  • One former minister puts it bluntly: “What’s the mood? I’ll tell you: there’s been a big increase in the number of people who think Boris is a c**t.”

    https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-tory-sleaze-backlash-mps-imagining-life-after-pm-1310824
  • ydoethur said:

    Looking at the list of Candidates for Shropshire N, there seem to be quite a few candidates who will draw a few votes from the Tories.

    I'm glad to see the Monster Raving Loonies are up and running. What, though, is the Reclaim party?

    The Tories selected their candidate days ago.

    Oh sorry, did you mean the Official Monster Raving Loony Party?
    Isn't Reclaim the Lozza Fox vehicle?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371

    One former minister puts it bluntly: “What’s the mood? I’ll tell you: there’s been a big increase in the number of people who think Boris is a c**t.”

    https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-tory-sleaze-backlash-mps-imagining-life-after-pm-1310824

    Alan Duncan said that years ago!

    Shame they didn't listen to him then...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371

    ydoethur said:

    Looking at the list of Candidates for Shropshire N, there seem to be quite a few candidates who will draw a few votes from the Tories.

    I'm glad to see the Monster Raving Loonies are up and running. What, though, is the Reclaim party?

    The Tories selected their candidate days ago.

    Oh sorry, did you mean the Official Monster Raving Loony Party?
    Isn't Reclaim the Lozza Fox vehicle?
    It's not having any brush with credibility then.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,126
    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    Yes, Debbonaire comes over well. As for the 'left' in Labour, the problem imo is they're too weak not too strong. As usual you get overswing and it's happened here in response to Corbyn. The party leadership is extremely averse to anything which might conjur up memories of that man in the minds of floating voters. Hence, very very cagey on certain issues that for me they could be stronger on. But if one takes the view that winning an election is more important than pleasing me, as many will, then I reckon Starmer is playing things about right. Roll on those policies. Let's hope there's some killers.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883
    edited November 2021

    One former minister puts it bluntly: “What’s the mood? I’ll tell you: there’s been a big increase in the number of people who think Boris is a c**t.”

    https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-tory-sleaze-backlash-mps-imagining-life-after-pm-1310824

    Did he also put it "Crisply"?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631

    I was just idly wondering why I'd never heard the word Zionophobia, so I looked it up and it's certainly been used a fair bit in the USA ("on college campus" often seems to be in the same stories)

    It's never been used on PB (at least on Vanilla, that is), nor zionophobic or -phobe.

    Is it different from antisemitism?

    Is it useful as a kind of differentiator for the antisemites with Jewish friends who all just hate Israel?

    Not a word that I have ever encountered. Certainly sympathy for the plight of the Palestinians does spill over to anti-semitism.

    Personally I think that British influence and actions in the Middle East over the last Century or so have been a litany of mistakes in which we have managed to offend all sides. We should steer clear of any further involvement.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    kjh said:

    kjh said:

    Mr. Tokyo, I am not convinced.

    Also, the worst that can happen is hackers utilising the tiny processing power of thousands of IoT devices and using that to break into banks or create DDOS attacks to bring down major online infrastructure.

    Edited extra bit: or, in your bath situation, they could run it and see whether sufficient water damage can be caused to ruin your home.

    Realistically finding a hackable internet-connected device isn't likely to be the main bottleneck for a DDoS. I know it's been done on occasion, but it's unusual for it to be the best way, especially when routers are such garbage.

    You can't ruin my home by overflowing the bath because it has advanced Japanese overflow hole technology which sends the water down the drain if the level gets too high using gravity, and even if they somehow managed emit a tone that called all the spiders in the house and persuaded them to block the hole, all you'd do would be to put water on same tiled floor and down the same drain that I use when operating my shower normally.
    I was thinking how lazy or impatient do we have to get that we want to boil a kettle remotely, but then I think of TV remote controls. I can't imagine having to get up to turn the TV over now and I can't remember that being an issue before them, but then I remember only having 2 channels.
    The next problem is that you have to somehow locate the TV remote control, which often involves strenuous activity like getting up and walking over to a different part of the room. This is why ultimately everything should end up run from your phone, which never leaves your side. I'm like that with my heating/aircon, each unit has a remote control but I hardly ever use it even when I'm in the same room because the phone is handier.
    I'm always losing my phone! I could get another phone to phone my phone I suppose. I must admit I do sometimes wish my remote controls had sirens on it, also my glasses. So that is the next two things to be linked to the internet.
    Try a Google smart speaker. Several times a day I call out "Google Find My Phone" and it always does.
    Or Google device finder and you can make your tablet or computer make it ring
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631
    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    Yes, Debbonaire comes over well. As for the 'left' in Labour, the problem imo is they're too weak not too strong. As usual you get overswing and it's happened here in response to Corbyn. The party leadership is extremely averse to anything which might conjur up memories of that man in the minds of floating voters. Hence, very very cagey on certain issues that for me they could be stronger on. But if one takes the view that winning an election is more important than pleasing me, as many will, then I reckon Starmer is playing things about right. Roll on those policies. Let's hope there's some killers.
    When you hear Sultana on the subject of tuition fees or on the increased NI on the working ages, you do get a good idea of what should be a central Labour theme. She may not be the right vessel, but this is something that the Front bench should be pushing:

    https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8pMd3Rc/
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,132
    Charles said:

    Quincel said:

    TOPPING said:

    Good post.

    North Shropshire = Crawford/Porter.

    Plenty of what ifs, it's politics/boxing anything could happen but at the end of the day it's not really possible to see beyond the favourite.

    One of my favourite quotes about elections, which annoyingly I've never been able to find the source for but I'm sure was a quote by a pollster two days before the 2012 election, is "Anything could happen in the next 48 hours, but it probably won't". Sums up uncertainty but probability so well, and is often a very useful (and profitable) approach to take.
    If you are looking for a quote 2 days before the 2012 election…
    Presumably about the 2012 US election?
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    So will those who criticise the PM for using ‘Boris’ and Grant Shapps for his pseudonym also lay into Thangam Singh Debbonaire?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,132

    Aye, the Internet of Things is rampantly over-used. I do think, even as a luddite, there are reasonable cases (cameras and doorbells). But an internet-connected kettle? Only for lazy swine.

    I don't have an internet-connected kettle but I can run (or reheat) my bath from my phone, and also all the heaters/air conditioners in the house and office. This is really handy - I mainly use it in the house, for instance I want to warm up downstairs when I'm in bed. It would work if it was only on my local house network rather than going via the internet but I'm sure it's easier to support and troubleshoot an internet service than one that's only on a LAN.

    I don't really see why you *wouldn't* want to be able to do that - a net-connected kettle would also be handy. If you want a cup of tea when you get up, I think you obviously want to start boiling the kettle before you get out of bed. It's not just a matter of being lazy, it's also a time-saver. I suppose someone could hack it, but the worst thing that would happen would be that my house would get heated when I didn't want it to, which doesn't sound catastrophic.

    Basically anything electronic should be operable from your phone, unless there's a security reason not to do it. (Cameras are a case where there actually *is* a good security reason not to...)
    How do you fill the kettle?
    Are the taps in your kitchen not connected to WiFi?
  • The boosters look to be seriously impressive:

    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1461337249950404625
  • MaxPB said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    Hope you both get better soon!
    Thanks Max, appreciated. Think I'm on the mend now and hopefully my wife will follow.
  • kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Apparently WHO head Dr Tedros has said there's "no point in giving booster jabs to healthy adults."

    From their global perspective this is true. Not quite 'no point' but a wrong priority.
    He has a point. Having a booster shot might have stopped me catching COVID, but I didn't die of it, didn't trouble local health services (I have been getting a bit of remote monitoring though) and if I wasn't banged up until Tuesday, would probably be out and about today.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,132
    darkage said:

    Regarding the internet of things: Read Shoshana Zuboff's book 'the Age of Surveillance Capitalism'; or if you can't manage the book, some of the articles and podcasts she did around the time such as this interview with David Runciman of Cambridge University.

    https://www.talkingpoliticspodcast.com/blog/2019/144-the-nightmare-of-surveillance-capitalism

    Zuboff describes how this is fundamentally altering human nature. People are becoming addicted to and dependent on technology in ways that are completely unnecessary, to serve the interests of commerce. I've seen this over and over again, and it is just all really sad.

    Technology has been fundamentally altering human nature for tens of thousands of years. First we became dependent on fire. Then on clothes. Then shelter. Then we stopped being able to feed ourselves and relied on other to do so.

    Many were increasingly of the opinion that they’d all made a big mistake in coming down from the trees in the first place. And some said that even the trees had been a bad move, and that no one should ever have left the oceans.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    Foxy said:

    I was just idly wondering why I'd never heard the word Zionophobia, so I looked it up and it's certainly been used a fair bit in the USA ("on college campus" often seems to be in the same stories)

    It's never been used on PB (at least on Vanilla, that is), nor zionophobic or -phobe.

    Is it different from antisemitism?

    Is it useful as a kind of differentiator for the antisemites with Jewish friends who all just hate Israel?

    Not a word that I have ever encountered. Certainly sympathy for the plight of the Palestinians does spill over to anti-semitism.

    Personally I think that British influence and actions in the Middle East over the last Century or so have been a litany of mistakes in which we have managed to offend all sides. We should steer clear of any further involvement.
    I'm not sure what British policy vis a vis Palestine was much before the Balfour Declaration (no doubt one of our historians will enlighten me) but Dr F is right; from then on it's been a catalogue of 'how not to do it!'
    IIRC TE Lawrence was very much against the Sykes-Picot carve-up.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,132

    The boosters look to be seriously impressive:

    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1461337249950404625

    Israel is back down to de minimis numbers of cases a day.

    Given the Western World has almost unlimited supplies of vaccines, it is incomprehensible so many countries are not simply allowing anyone beyond the 5-6 month mark to get a booster.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    edited November 2021

    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Apparently WHO head Dr Tedros has said there's "no point in giving booster jabs to healthy adults."

    From their global perspective this is true. Not quite 'no point' but a wrong priority.
    He has a point. Having a booster shot might have stopped me catching COVID, but I didn't die of it, didn't trouble local health services (I have been getting a bit of remote monitoring though) and if I wasn't banged up until Tuesday, would probably be out and about today.
    Corresponds with my wife's and my experience. Although she was coughing a bit longer than I was.
  • ydoethur said:

    One former minister puts it bluntly: “What’s the mood? I’ll tell you: there’s been a big increase in the number of people who think Boris is a c**t.”

    https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-tory-sleaze-backlash-mps-imagining-life-after-pm-1310824

    Alan Duncan said that years ago!

    Shame they didn't listen to him then...
    I know this will trigger some people, who will find it arrogant and patronising.

    But the fact that BoJo is a terrible person and totally unfit for high office really was obvious to anyone paying attention beforehand.
    That is true, but when you vote for a party you are offered a package, and may end up voting for a party with any number of drawbacks.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331

    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    So will those who criticise the PM for using ‘Boris’ and Grant Shapps for his pseudonym also lay into Thangam Singh Debbonaire?
    Changing your name id not the same as adopting a second identity as Shapps/ Green has done.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,494

    Andy_JS said:

    Wasn't Brecon & Radnor a Leave seat that went to the LDs in a by-election?

    Yes. And not too far from N Shropshire
    And perhaps obsessing over demographics and history of a seat is the noise to blot out if you want to make betting simply on a key factor in the eventual result? I am on Lib Dem’s at 3.1. I wouldn’t have gone near this bet last may. But what what is key factor for surprise result? for me the key factor is, what is mood in country now for bloody nose wake up call? In the last week we have had the MPs behind Johnson missing for debates and PMQs, not there making noise in his favour. These are his Pretorian guards in the house! If they are not happy, and some on government payroll not happy, what are they saying in their prayers at night? One bad result and we can be rid of him? So what makes so many punters on here think the voters thoughts and feelings are going to be different?

    Admittedly it’s a long shot, and Libdems will have to campaign well on local issues, so voters know they returning someone who will fight for what matters locally. But that’s why I vote Libdems in first place.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    edited November 2021
    ydoethur said:

    One former minister puts it bluntly: “What’s the mood? I’ll tell you: there’s been a big increase in the number of people who think Boris is a c**t.”

    https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-tory-sleaze-backlash-mps-imagining-life-after-pm-1310824

    Alan Duncan said that years ago!

    Shame they didn't listen to him then...
    Yes, the evidence has been there for some time, and while it's welcome that they appear to have woken up to it, it seems to be the fact that he's now a potential vote loser, rather than his essential c**tishness that has made the difference.

    Edit: I see Romford's Stuart has pretty much made the same point.
  • ydoethur said:

    One former minister puts it bluntly: “What’s the mood? I’ll tell you: there’s been a big increase in the number of people who think Boris is a c**t.”

    https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-tory-sleaze-backlash-mps-imagining-life-after-pm-1310824

    Alan Duncan said that years ago!

    Shame they didn't listen to him then...
    I know this will trigger some people, who will find it arrogant and patronising.

    But the fact that BoJo is a terrible person and totally unfit for high office really was obvious to anyone paying attention beforehand.
    That is true, but when you vote for a party you are offered a package, and may end up voting for a party with any number of drawbacks.
    That's true, and 2019 was for many a "can't they all lose?" election. I can't blame people who voted Conservative to keep Corbyn out.

    My beef is with those in the Conservative party who let Johnson get so far up the greasy pole. Especially those who pushed BoJo as the solution to the Conservatives' woes in 2019. And yes Master Sunak, I am looking at you.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331

    ydoethur said:

    One former minister puts it bluntly: “What’s the mood? I’ll tell you: there’s been a big increase in the number of people who think Boris is a c**t.”

    https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-tory-sleaze-backlash-mps-imagining-life-after-pm-1310824

    Alan Duncan said that years ago!

    Shame they didn't listen to him then...
    I know this will trigger some people, who will find it arrogant and patronising.

    But the fact that BoJo is a terrible person and totally unfit for high office really was obvious to anyone paying attention beforehand.
    Indeed the Eddie Mair 'you're a nasty piece of work' interview dates back to 2013.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631

    Foxy said:

    I was just idly wondering why I'd never heard the word Zionophobia, so I looked it up and it's certainly been used a fair bit in the USA ("on college campus" often seems to be in the same stories)

    It's never been used on PB (at least on Vanilla, that is), nor zionophobic or -phobe.

    Is it different from antisemitism?

    Is it useful as a kind of differentiator for the antisemites with Jewish friends who all just hate Israel?

    Not a word that I have ever encountered. Certainly sympathy for the plight of the Palestinians does spill over to anti-semitism.

    Personally I think that British influence and actions in the Middle East over the last Century or so have been a litany of mistakes in which we have managed to offend all sides. We should steer clear of any further involvement.
    I'm not sure what British policy vis a vis Palestine was much before the Balfour Declaration (no doubt one of our historians will enlighten me) but Dr F is right; from then on it's been a catalogue of 'how not to do it!'
    IIRC TE Lawrence was very much against the Sykes-Picot carve-up.
    I would say the mistakes are far from limited to Palestine/Israel, but even there our Imperial mistakes are appalling. Having created a Jewish homeland via the Balfour declaration, to then prevent Jewish immigration in the face of genocide in the 1930s, or post genocide in the 1940s managed to offend the zionists too.

    Then there is installing the House of Saud, the creation of Iraq, the coup in Iran, the Surz crisis, the war in Aden, arming Saddam against Iran, the Al Yamanah Arms deal, Iraq wars, Syria, Libya etc etc. The toxic mistakes just keep on coming.

    Stay clear of anything further is my advice.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,494
    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    And not an MP after the next election sadly, as the Green’s will take her seat in a little shock result.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,126
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    Yes, Debbonaire comes over well. As for the 'left' in Labour, the problem imo is they're too weak not too strong. As usual you get overswing and it's happened here in response to Corbyn. The party leadership is extremely averse to anything which might conjur up memories of that man in the minds of floating voters. Hence, very very cagey on certain issues that for me they could be stronger on. But if one takes the view that winning an election is more important than pleasing me, as many will, then I reckon Starmer is playing things about right. Roll on those policies. Let's hope there's some killers.
    When you hear Sultana on the subject of tuition fees or on the increased NI on the working ages, you do get a good idea of what should be a central Labour theme. She may not be the right vessel, but this is something that the Front bench should be pushing:

    https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8pMd3Rc/
    They should. In a populist age you handicap yourself if you shy away from it. Also a risk though in that Labour are vulnerable to 'class war' attacks when sounding radical. So they need to get across anger at the working poor being screwed but without looking like they have the affluent and those aspiring to be affluent in their cross hairs.

    PS: You're an interesting poster. One of the most left wing on here on many things yet a staunch Lib Dem!
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    edited November 2021
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    I was just idly wondering why I'd never heard the word Zionophobia, so I looked it up and it's certainly been used a fair bit in the USA ("on college campus" often seems to be in the same stories)

    It's never been used on PB (at least on Vanilla, that is), nor zionophobic or -phobe.

    Is it different from antisemitism?

    Is it useful as a kind of differentiator for the antisemites with Jewish friends who all just hate Israel?

    Not a word that I have ever encountered. Certainly sympathy for the plight of the Palestinians does spill over to anti-semitism.

    Personally I think that British influence and actions in the Middle East over the last Century or so have been a litany of mistakes in which we have managed to offend all sides. We should steer clear of any further involvement.
    I'm not sure what British policy vis a vis Palestine was much before the Balfour Declaration (no doubt one of our historians will enlighten me) but Dr F is right; from then on it's been a catalogue of 'how not to do it!'
    IIRC TE Lawrence was very much against the Sykes-Picot carve-up.
    I would say the mistakes are far from limited to Palestine/Israel, but even there our Imperial mistakes are appalling. Having created a Jewish homeland via the Balfour declaration, to then prevent Jewish immigration in the face of genocide in the 1930s, or post genocide in the 1940s managed to offend the zionists too.

    Then there is installing the House of Saud, the creation of Iraq, the coup in Iran, the Surz crisis, the war in Aden, arming Saddam against Iran, the Al Yamanah Arms deal, Iraq wars, Syria, Libya etc etc. The toxic mistakes just keep on coming.

    Stay clear of anything further is my advice.
    As I might have been called up had Suez really got nasty I watched the situation then quite carefully. And you're right.

    However, I don't think we encouraged the House of Saud did we?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371

    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    And not an MP after the next election sadly, as the Green’s will take her seat in a little shock result.
    I thought for a moment you meant Sultana and I was a little startled to see that she would lose an 18,000 vote advantage over the Greens!

    But that's another defeat for Labour that could happen. Coventry South is seat that's not out of reach for the Tories - indeed they were a bit unlucky not to take it last time.
  • rcs1000 said:

    The boosters look to be seriously impressive:

    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1461337249950404625

    Israel is back down to de minimis numbers of cases a day.

    Given the Western World has almost unlimited supplies of vaccines, it is incomprehensible so many countries are not simply allowing anyone beyond the 5-6 month mark to get a booster.
    Together with not accepting increased acquired immunity during summer they've missed the opportunity to get ahead of Delta before winter.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,126

    kinabalu said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Apparently WHO head Dr Tedros has said there's "no point in giving booster jabs to healthy adults."

    From their global perspective this is true. Not quite 'no point' but a wrong priority.
    He has a point. Having a booster shot might have stopped me catching COVID, but I didn't die of it, didn't trouble local health services (I have been getting a bit of remote monitoring though) and if I wasn't banged up until Tuesday, would probably be out and about today.
    Yes. What he says is valid from his global perspective as head of the WHO.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,494
    Carnyx said:

    Aye, the Internet of Things is rampantly over-used. I do think, even as a luddite, there are reasonable cases (cameras and doorbells). But an internet-connected kettle? Only for lazy swine.

    I don't have an internet-connected kettle but I can run (or reheat) my bath from my phone, and also all the heaters/air conditioners in the house and office. This is really handy - I mainly use it in the house, for instance I want to warm up downstairs when I'm in bed. It would work if it was only on my local house network rather than going via the internet but I'm sure it's easier to support and troubleshoot an internet service than one that's only on a LAN.

    I don't really see why you *wouldn't* want to be able to do that - a net-connected kettle would also be handy. If you want a cup of tea when you get up, I think you obviously want to start boiling the kettle before you get out of bed. It's not just a matter of being lazy, it's also a time-saver. I suppose someone could hack it, but the worst thing that would happen would be that my house would get heated when I didn't want it to, which doesn't sound catastrophic.

    Basically anything electronic should be operable from your phone, unless there's a security reason not to do it. (Cameras are a case where there actually *is* a good security reason not to...)
    How do you fill the kettle?
    I imagine you'd refill it after you use it? However it's true there are limits on the bath, because it can't control the plug, and also can't get the spiders out.
    Couldn’t the smart robot vacuum team up with “smart bath” and vacuum the spiders out?

    When I was a nipper I used to say to the spider, I’m about to pour lots of hot water in this bath, but I’m giving you fifteen seconds to get out. You should see their little faces looking up.

    once you drown them in hot water they just dissolve to nothing. No problem

    Aye, the Internet of Things is rampantly over-used. I do think, even as a luddite, there are reasonable cases (cameras and doorbells). But an internet-connected kettle? Only for lazy swine.

    I don't have an internet-connected kettle but I can run (or reheat) my bath from my phone, and also all the heaters/air conditioners in the house and office. This is really handy - I mainly use it in the house, for instance I want to warm up downstairs when I'm in bed. It would work if it was only on my local house network rather than going via the internet but I'm sure it's easier to support and troubleshoot an internet service than one that's only on a LAN.

    I don't really see why you *wouldn't* want to be able to do that - a net-connected kettle would also be handy. If you want a cup of tea when you get up, I think you obviously want to start boiling the kettle before you get out of bed. It's not just a matter of being lazy, it's also a time-saver. I suppose someone could hack it, but the worst thing that would happen would be that my house would get heated when I didn't want it to, which doesn't sound catastrophic.

    Basically anything electronic should be operable from your phone, unless there's a security reason not to do it. (Cameras are a case where there actually *is* a good security reason not to...)
    How do you fill the kettle?
    I imagine you'd refill it after you use it? However it's true there are limits on the bath, because it can't control the plug, and also can't get the spiders out.
    Couldn’t the smart robot vacuum team up with “smart bath” and vacuum the spiders out?

    When I was a nipper I used to say to the spider, I’m about to pour lots of hot water in this bath, but I’m giving you fifteen seconds to get out. You should see their little faces looking up.

    once you drown them in hot water they just dissolve to nothing. No problem
    I find that impossible to believe simply because the chitin in the exoskeleton is a crosslinked polymer and therefore insoluble. I do wonder where your spiders are ending up that you can't see them any more. Perhaps you need a mirror to examine your posterior aspect?
    Maybe I am just ignoring them and just getting on with the bath, instead of going back and forth with vacuum muttering as do so like my friend does! 🕷
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,371

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    I was just idly wondering why I'd never heard the word Zionophobia, so I looked it up and it's certainly been used a fair bit in the USA ("on college campus" often seems to be in the same stories)

    It's never been used on PB (at least on Vanilla, that is), nor zionophobic or -phobe.

    Is it different from antisemitism?

    Is it useful as a kind of differentiator for the antisemites with Jewish friends who all just hate Israel?

    Not a word that I have ever encountered. Certainly sympathy for the plight of the Palestinians does spill over to anti-semitism.

    Personally I think that British influence and actions in the Middle East over the last Century or so have been a litany of mistakes in which we have managed to offend all sides. We should steer clear of any further involvement.
    I'm not sure what British policy vis a vis Palestine was much before the Balfour Declaration (no doubt one of our historians will enlighten me) but Dr F is right; from then on it's been a catalogue of 'how not to do it!'
    IIRC TE Lawrence was very much against the Sykes-Picot carve-up.
    I would say the mistakes are far from limited to Palestine/Israel, but even there our Imperial mistakes are appalling. Having created a Jewish homeland via the Balfour declaration, to then prevent Jewish immigration in the face of genocide in the 1930s, or post genocide in the 1940s managed to offend the zionists too.

    Then there is installing the House of Saud, the creation of Iraq, the coup in Iran, the Surz crisis, the war in Aden, arming Saddam against Iran, the Al Yamanah Arms deal, Iraq wars, Syria, Libya etc etc. The toxic mistakes just keep on coming.

    Stay clear of anything further is my advice.
    As I might have been called up had Suez really got nasty I watched the situation then quite carefully. And you're right.

    However, I don't think we encouraged the House of Saud did we?
    We armed them and covertly supported their war against the Hashemites after the Sharif Hussein bin Ali refused to endorse the creation of the British and French mandates in Arabia.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    I was just idly wondering why I'd never heard the word Zionophobia, so I looked it up and it's certainly been used a fair bit in the USA ("on college campus" often seems to be in the same stories)

    It's never been used on PB (at least on Vanilla, that is), nor zionophobic or -phobe.

    Is it different from antisemitism?

    Is it useful as a kind of differentiator for the antisemites with Jewish friends who all just hate Israel?

    Not a word that I have ever encountered. Certainly sympathy for the plight of the Palestinians does spill over to anti-semitism.

    Personally I think that British influence and actions in the Middle East over the last Century or so have been a litany of mistakes in which we have managed to offend all sides. We should steer clear of any further involvement.
    I'm not sure what British policy vis a vis Palestine was much before the Balfour Declaration (no doubt one of our historians will enlighten me) but Dr F is right; from then on it's been a catalogue of 'how not to do it!'
    IIRC TE Lawrence was very much against the Sykes-Picot carve-up.
    I would say the mistakes are far from limited to Palestine/Israel, but even there our Imperial mistakes are appalling. Having created a Jewish homeland via the Balfour declaration, to then prevent Jewish immigration in the face of genocide in the 1930s, or post genocide in the 1940s managed to offend the zionists too.

    Then there is installing the House of Saud, the creation of Iraq, the coup in Iran, the Surz crisis, the war in Aden, arming Saddam against Iran, the Al Yamanah Arms deal, Iraq wars, Syria, Libya etc etc. The toxic mistakes just keep on coming.

    Stay clear of anything further is my advice.
    As I might have been called up had Suez really got nasty I watched the situation then quite carefully. And you're right.

    However, I don't think we encouraged the House of Saud did we?
    We armed them and covertly supported their war against the Hashemites after the Sharif Hussein bin Ali refused to endorse the creation of the British and French mandates in Arabia.
    Another damn fool idea! Whose was it?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    .
    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    And not an MP after the next election sadly, as the Green’s will take her seat in a little shock result.
    I thought for a moment you meant Sultana and I was a little startled to see that she would lose an 18,000 vote advantage over the Greens!

    But that's another defeat for Labour that could happen. Coventry South is seat that's not out of reach for the Tories - indeed they were a bit unlucky not to take it last time.
    If Labour lose Bristol West and Coventry South (neither of which are beyond the realms of probability) Mr Johnson really doesn't need to worry about his current local difficulties
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,494
    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    pigeon said:

    BigRich said:

    Crazy scenes in Holland. Let us hope the CMO, Javid and Johnson have got this right.

    https://twitter.com/alanvibe/status/1461809955648987136

    Gosh!

    Has the Netherlands re-imposesed a full lockdown? or just tweaked the restrictions for the unvaccinated?

    p.s. I do like the chap pushing a bicycle thought in the middle, very Dutch.
    Woke up this morning to see the rioting in Rotterdam on the news. It appears to be a reaction to what is described as a "partial lockdown" that has been imposed on the whole population, allegedly for three weeks - although we all know what happened over here last year, where the Government tried to deploy one of these useless "circuit breakers" in November, lifted it again, and finally ended up imprisoning everybody from Christmas to Easter.

    Once ministers impose these measures, previous experience shows that they find it very hard to let go of them, because of the rising case numbers and the panicked screaming from the boffins that follows as soon as they do so. The only thing that brings relief is warm weather: a lot of people in the countries that are finding themselves back in yet another cycle of lockdowns are probably terrified that they're going to be stuck in them for six months.
    My gut instinct is that we are not very far behind, although this isn't reflected in the data as yet. Its a good time to get stuff done before the next lockdown.
    Agreed. I may be suffering from some cognitive bias because my wife and I currently have it, but there seems to be a lot of it about, it's spreading really easily pretty much whenever people interact indoors. I know so many people getting it right now.
    I do feel a bit better this morning after a relatively good night. Adjusting for my wife's tendency to be more stoical than me I suspect she now has it worse. I'm going to go and make her a cup of tea.
    I hope that, when you've made the tea and can settle down again to read this, you both continue to feel better.
    If you are doing so, then it's clear, that for Mr & Mrs OLB, This Thing Will Pass!

    Best of!
    Seconded.
    I’m more or less over the after effects, having been back at work for a week.
    ydoethur said:

    For your viewing pleasure, here is Zarah Sultana being tied up in knots by her own mini-brain. Note Shadow Leader of the House Thangam Debbonaire's body language...

    https://twitter.com/beardedjourno/status/1461692937201500161

    Where does the hard left find these utter morons like Sultana?

    How on Earth can she not think of another word for 'dodgy?'

    Admittedly I might have asked her to withdraw it on the grounds that called Grant Shapps 'dodgy' is something of an understatement, but surely 'inept,' 'dubious,' 'duplicitous,' 'lazy' and 'pig ignorant' would all have fitted the bill?

    But then, she never was exactly with it.
    Economical with the probity ?
    I wonder if in her head Sultana regards the Speaker as "establishment to be resisted", like all other authority figures, for plucky activists.
    If she’s the best the Labour left has, then the threat of their taking over the party again seems somewhat diminished.

    Debbonaire seems very impressive.
    Great name (which she chose herself via deed poll, apparently), and a cellist of professional standard to boot.
    And not an MP after the next election sadly, as the Green’s will take her seat in a little shock result.
    I thought for a moment you meant Sultana and I was a little startled to see that she would lose an 18,000 vote advantage over the Greens!

    But that's another defeat for Labour that could happen. Coventry South is seat that's not out of reach for the Tories - indeed they were a bit unlucky not to take it last time.
    I meant the Bristol one. My friend in the seat voted Thamgham now votes green in all elections and is sure they will win it. In fact she says they will win two bristol seats that would make a pair.
This discussion has been closed.