It had seemed to me surprising that Johnson, in order to get the refurbishment of his flat paid for, should have been trying to set up a charity to cover the costs. I believe I now understand this, thanks to publication of the accounts of the Aspinall Foundation, which employs Johnson's wife. Carrie must have known how easy it is to spend charity’s funds for one’s own benefit. The Aspinall Foundation had paid large sums to its Chairman’s wife for “interior design services”. Perhaps the idea of setting up a charity was to ensure that a bit of income accrued to Carrie herself even while the refurbishment would be very much to her personal taste. (And it's not as if it's difficult to get plenty of money donated by Tory donors.)
Tory MP texts: "Boris may not be so keen for a '23 election if it looks like he could lose his seat. Unless he plans a chicken run I wouldn’t put anything past this PM."
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
The government can be concerned even by the thinner stories because it adds to the narrative given 'sleaze' is an unhelpful term covering technical admin errors up to direct corruption and even the small stuff helps the impression the bigger stuff is widespread - and that works because Boris just proved he not only doesn't care about his own standards, that's well known, but that he will expend political capital to protect the corrupt in his ranks if he thinks he can get away with it.
So even the small stuff matters to them, especially as an entire political generation have no experience of governments falling way behind in the polls mid term. But we the public should be more concerned with some cases than others.
I still find the Paterson actions unfathomable. However much they liked him as a mate and however much they disliked the current system why they thought a desperate vote to address both would help I dont know. Everytime he talks about wrongdoing and punishment the opposition have cast iron proof he does not care.
The Paterson action was an astonishing own goal. Totally unfathomable. What was there to gain to defend him ? It beggars belief. A total own goal.
They wanted to get rid of the Standards woman, presumably to replace her with their puppet. Hubris.
Maybe, but it's the tin ear to the likely public view that is truly astonishing. I feel for the Tory MPs who reluctantly followed the whip - how they will now be wishing they hadn't.
Well done the likes of Aaron Bell who correctly and bravely ignored the whips.
I’d imagine BJ’s future rests largely on how resentful those Tory mps who were harried into the sheep pens by whips feel. I tend to think if they can be bullied away from principle and honour once..
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
Still not simple, thanks the administrative refusal simply to withhold salary.
The point - for both - might also be made that if one is on 40%/41% income tax band then donations to charity do not have the same marginal cost as for most of us; indeed, depending on the details, some tax is actually refunded. So each would presumably have got tax back on the salary that he was keeping.
Pension and NI deductions, if compulsory, would also be to their overall credit.
Off topic (sorry) but on the issue of Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe and the linking of the 400m debt to Iran is there the possibility that the UK govt pays the funds into escrow with the UN on the basis that when sanctions etc allow the UN will release the funds to Iran.
This would then remove it as an issue as the UK govt can say “see, we want to pay it but technically cannot give it to you but when you sort out your issues you get it” and so it takes away a stick for Iran to beat the UK with in the eyes of the world….
Or alternatively the UK could buy Iran 400m of vaccines and have them delivered as surely the Iranian govt would love to use the money to help their people and not use it for nefarious means….!!
Do you trust the UN not to release it immediately and say “oops sorry?”
I would hope that the legal terms of the “escrow” would bind in the bank that was holding the funds that they could only release the funds once specific agreed terms were met and that the bank would have to be a major institution that isn’t going to risk their licences if they broke the terms.
Usual escrow would be permission from both sides, so Iran would just say it’s no change
Good morning everybody. Quite a pleasant morning, weather-wise.
From his post earlier today, it seems Dura Ace has been fraternising with Malc! Mr A is often abusive but his 6.42 post does seem a bit rich, even for him.
Is use of that sort of language why some posters have recently reduced their activity?
Good morning
We have seen the loss of several posters recently and it may be to do with the unrelenting anti HMG threads, but to be honest Boris and others have opened the door wide with his and their idiotic actions
As far as @Dura_Ace comments are concerned they do not contribute to the discussions but like @malcolmg are designed to be provocative and are best ignored
I have read some fantasy stuff in my time but to be accused by you of not contributing to discussions is the best. You vaccilate between between a cult Tory , you post utter claptrap , take offence at people rightly stating you are a Tory cult member who resigns at least weekly. You pontificate crap on Scotland because you lived there fifty years ago Take a hard look at your own posting before insulting me. I at least show some alternative opinions rather than posting as if it was 1920 and "upset Tunbridge Wells" was posting. @Big_G_NorthWales
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
The government can be concerned even by the thinner stories because it adds to the narrative given 'sleaze' is an unhelpful term covering technical admin errors up to direct corruption and even the small stuff helps the impression the bigger stuff is widespread - and that works because Boris just proved he not only doesn't care about his own standards, that's well known, but that he will expend political capital to protect the corrupt in his ranks if he thinks he can get away with it.
So even the small stuff matters to them, especially as an entire political generation have no experience of governments falling way behind in the polls mid term. But we the public should be more concerned with some cases than others.
I still find the Paterson actions unfathomable. However much they liked him as a mate and however much they disliked the current system why they thought a desperate vote to address both would help I dont know. Everytime he talks about wrongdoing and punishment the opposition have cast iron proof he does not care.
The Paterson action was an astonishing own goal. Totally unfathomable. What was there to gain to defend him ? It beggars belief. A total own goal.
They wanted to get rid of the Standards woman, presumably to replace her with their puppet. Hubris.
Maybe, but it's the tin ear to the likely public view that is truly astonishing. I feel for the Tory MPs who reluctantly followed the whip - how they will now be wishing they hadn't.
They made a choice, and they made it wrong. The fact that they were made to look foolish so immediately is actually good news, because it means they'll think a little harder next time about whether to obey or listen to their own conscience."Feeling" for them is the wrong response in my opinion. A better response to them would be asking "what the hell were you even thinking?"
Fair enough, but don't underestimate how difficult it is for an MP (especially a newly-elected one with ministerial ambition) to ignore a whip.
And as we know, this government prizes loyalty above all else.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
This is getting a bit like Glasgow people smugglers, is it not?
Right, before people pile on, can I make it clear that Dom Cummings is a) a mendacious idiot, not to be believed, and b) out for revenge. But nevertheless, I found this interesting:
It sounds vaguely believable, doesn't it? The 'trolley' got bored quickly once Brexit was done, needed more money, and wanted to write about Shakespeare - i.e. earn more money. If, and it's a big if, anybody more trustworthy than Dom could corroborate that Boris missed early Covid Cobra meetings in Feb 2020 because he was writing at Chevening, that may be rather damaging.
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
The government can be concerned even by the thinner stories because it adds to the narrative given 'sleaze' is an unhelpful term covering technical admin errors up to direct corruption and even the small stuff helps the impression the bigger stuff is widespread - and that works because Boris just proved he not only doesn't care about his own standards, that's well known, but that he will expend political capital to protect the corrupt in his ranks if he thinks he can get away with it.
So even the small stuff matters to them, especially as an entire political generation have no experience of governments falling way behind in the polls mid term. But we the public should be more concerned with some cases than others.
I still find the Paterson actions unfathomable. However much they liked him as a mate and however much they disliked the current system why they thought a desperate vote to address both would help I dont know. Everytime he talks about wrongdoing and punishment the opposition have cast iron proof he does not care.
The Paterson action was an astonishing own goal. Totally unfathomable. What was there to gain to defend him ? It beggars belief. A total own goal.
They wanted to get rid of the Standards woman, presumably to replace her with their puppet. Hubris.
Maybe, but it's the tin ear to the likely public view that is truly astonishing. I feel for the Tory MPs who reluctantly followed the whip - how they will now be wishing they hadn't.
They made a choice, and they made it wrong. The fact that they were made to look foolish so immediately is actually good news, because it means they'll think a little harder next time about whether to obey or listen to their own conscience."Feeling" for them is the wrong response in my opinion. A better response to them would be asking "what the hell were you even thinking?"
Indeed. One of them phoned in to Andrew Castle on LBC on Saturday morning - I can't remember who it was (someone senior in the '22, I think) but his line was "yes, I voted for it, but now I've thought about it, wished I hadn't..." The comments of some of the public who phoned in afterwards were priceless.
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
He might have thought about it before pontificating about how they should all be honest and above board and submitting all their earnings.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
Oh well, case closed, take the prisoner down.
Unionist concern for Salmond receiving justice seems very variable.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
This is getting a bit like Glasgow people smugglers, is it not?
Sorry, you are going to have to explain that one (if you can be arsed).
Interesting that even the Express is beginning to get it. The Tory party plan of firing up the Brexitism may not be a good one. People want a further referendum and want to Rejoin. Starmer is at risk of missing the boat on this too with "make Brexit work".
So when are the Lib Dems to come out and support rejoining rather than obfuscation
Rejoining will only work if and when the country as a whole want it to work. One of the reasons this has continued to be such a mess is the fissure running down the country. In addition, if we were to half-heartedly rejoin, what are the odds that we’d flip around yet again and demand another exit?
A revolving door membership suits no-one.
To get people to want to rejoin and to have that widely spread and settled would require showing that closer alignment (Single Market first, and then actively wanting to be part of more and more programmes) would work and be beneficial and wanted.
So - working for closer alignment and getting to demonstrate that it is desirable for all (or, conversely, prove that it isn’t) is the best way to have a genuine and lasting Rejoin - without sowing the seeds for yet another Brexit. Learning the lessons from the past few years where both sides poisoned the discourse with their own haste, intolerance, and failure to consider the crucial question of: “then what?”
Spot on. Rejoining in the short term is almost as silly as an idea as a no deal Brexit was. Perhaps in 15-20 years, if a consistent clear majority are in favour and the EU structures are working well, but in the short term anyone who wants a closer relationship with the EU should be focused on alignment and being good neighbours who can work constructively together, not rejoin.
Yes, and that is broadly the LD policy, with Labour coming out in even more dilute form.
Politics is what it is, and elections are too. The issue the LDs will have to be clear about in their policy is: What is the timetable for a return to freedom of movement.
If you could be in the SM without FoM we wouldn't be where we are.
Interesting that even the Express is beginning to get it. The Tory party plan of firing up the Brexitism may not be a good one. People want a further referendum and want to Rejoin. Starmer is at risk of missing the boat on this too with "make Brexit work".
So when are the Lib Dems to come out and support rejoining rather than obfuscation
I honestly think the rejoin boat has sailed. It might come back, but not now.
The easy fix is obvious. Rejoin the EEA and do a customs deal. We are fully aligned with the EEA already, we have an increasing cost on business we can remove with a bonfire of red tape, we can even spin it as the EU agreeing to OUR standards.
Ultras will hate it but they're in the minority. TBH I think A16 will get triggered, there will be a rapid escalation until everyone is staring down the barrel of a nasty trade war. Then the newspapers will do some digging and find out that we're arguing for the right to have babies even though we can't have babies and conclude it isn't worth it. Trade wars always have to end with the pieces picked up from where they were dropped - so why bother.
A period of calm coexisting where people then realise we have no say will be the gentle catalyst towards rejoin, but I would be amazed if we did.
We’re not appropriate for the EEA we are the 5/6 largest economy in the world.
An almost comedic response. We are though appropriate for trans-Pacific and Nafta?
Free trade is a goal for all major economies. We had free trade with a giant trading block just 22 miles away, we have now imposed masses of red tape and bureaucracy. Exactly the kind of thing the Tories have campaigned against for decades, yet barriers and red tape for Brexit are suddenly being lauded as a Good Thing.
We aren't that stupid...
The EEA is a rule taking organisation
NAFTA and transpacific are not.
But to be honest, and I’m not trying to be personal, you are an example of what makes PB so dull at the moment.
You have your hobby horse and you ride it into the ground. You don’t engage with posts who disagree except to insult (“comedic response”) and then the next day you are back on your hobby horse again.
He is a real nasty piece of work and among the worst government ministers in history , he has made a mess of every department he has been in charge of.
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
The government can be concerned even by the thinner stories because it adds to the narrative given 'sleaze' is an unhelpful term covering technical admin errors up to direct corruption and even the small stuff helps the impression the bigger stuff is widespread - and that works because Boris just proved he not only doesn't care about his own standards, that's well known, but that he will expend political capital to protect the corrupt in his ranks if he thinks he can get away with it.
So even the small stuff matters to them, especially as an entire political generation have no experience of governments falling way behind in the polls mid term. But we the public should be more concerned with some cases than others.
I still find the Paterson actions unfathomable. However much they liked him as a mate and however much they disliked the current system why they thought a desperate vote to address both would help I dont know. Everytime he talks about wrongdoing and punishment the opposition have cast iron proof he does not care.
The Paterson action was an astonishing own goal. Totally unfathomable. What was there to gain to defend him ? It beggars belief. A total own goal.
They wanted to get rid of the Standards woman, presumably to replace her with their puppet. Hubris.
Maybe, but it's the tin ear to the likely public view that is truly astonishing. I feel for the Tory MPs who reluctantly followed the whip - how they will now be wishing they hadn't.
Well done the likes of Aaron Bell who correctly and bravely ignored the whips.
I’d imagine BJ’s future rests largely on how resentful those Tory mps who were harried into the sheep pens by whips feel. I tend to think if they can be bullied away from principle and honour once..
Principle and honour? They were elected under Johnson's manifesto - and every single one of them knew what they were doing.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
This is getting a bit like Glasgow people smugglers, is it not?
Sorry, you are going to have to explain that one (if you can be arsed).
Sorry - an allusion to a PBer (not you) recently stating that two chaps in Glasgow were people smugglers and then being rather reluctant to back down when the known facts were pointed out.
Interesting that even the Express is beginning to get it. The Tory party plan of firing up the Brexitism may not be a good one. People want a further referendum and want to Rejoin. Starmer is at risk of missing the boat on this too with "make Brexit work".
So when are the Lib Dems to come out and support rejoining rather than obfuscation
Rejoining will only work if and when the country as a whole want it to work. One of the reasons this has continued to be such a mess is the fissure running down the country. In addition, if we were to half-heartedly rejoin, what are the odds that we’d flip around yet again and demand another exit?
A revolving door membership suits no-one.
To get people to want to rejoin and to have that widely spread and settled would require showing that closer alignment (Single Market first, and then actively wanting to be part of more and more programmes) would work and be beneficial and wanted.
So - working for closer alignment and getting to demonstrate that it is desirable for all (or, conversely, prove that it isn’t) is the best way to have a genuine and lasting Rejoin - without sowing the seeds for yet another Brexit. Learning the lessons from the past few years where both sides poisoned the discourse with their own haste, intolerance, and failure to consider the crucial question of: “then what?”
Spot on. Rejoining in the short term is almost as silly as an idea as a no deal Brexit was. Perhaps in 15-20 years, if a consistent clear majority are in favour and the EU structures are working well, but in the short term anyone who wants a closer relationship with the EU should be focused on alignment and being good neighbours who can work constructively together, not rejoin.
Yes, and that is broadly the LD policy, with Labour coming out in even more dilute form.
Politics is what it is, and elections are too. The issue the LDs will have to be clear about in their policy is: What is the timetable for a return to freedom of movement.
If you could be in the SM without FoM we wouldn't be where we are.
All taking away FoM has achieved is depriving the NHS of nurses and created a shortage of hospitality and care staff, while making things difficult for Brits wishing to travel, live or study abroad. We still have migrants coming here illegally and desperate scenes at Calais and on the channel, and have been forced to create visa exceptions to our own new restrictions just to try and keep some sectors of the economy afloat. Where's the upside?
It must be galling for the tories that lobbygate was completely self-inflicted and unforced. If Johnson had just let O-Patz (h/t gardenwalker) take his medicine it would all been over by now. But he had to go and get pissed with the Telegraph hacks where he was browbeaten into doing Saving Private Paterson by "Sir" Charles Moore.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
Oh well, case closed, take the prisoner down.
Unionist concern for Salmond receiving justice seems very variable.
My point was simply that @malcolmg's description of Ross as "bent" was seriously misplaced. He is, frankly, a little dull, a little wooden and somewhat short of inspirational but the attempt to paint him as someone who is greedily putting his nose in the trough is simply wrong.
I still think that it’s not helpful for everyone to go for Geoffrey Cox, who’s done nothing wrong except to have a great job that pays him a fortune on an hourly basis. The focus on Cox is distracting from other, potentially more serious offences that involve a genuine conflict of interest.
Cox is an excellent target for the media and the opposition because it's a visceral image that even Red Wall morons stood in the queue at Gregg's can understand.
You've got this utter monstrosity of a human being sat on his massive fucking arse in the Caribbean making piles of cash advising arseholes about wank while he's supposed to be an MP. No nuance required.
Yes, but his stuff was all declared and it's clear what he was up to for the money. Failings to declare or utter non entities getting big cash with no clear non shady reason to justify it are another level.
We know that Cox declared everything - you are missing the point. The image is the Tory pig with its snout in the trough eating money. Someone who is still paid as an MP but has essentially retired (1 contribution in the Commons in 18 months) and earns unfathomable amounts on top in a luxury Caribbean paradise just winds people up.
He is a totem that sells newspapers and keeps fuelling their longer harder investigations through the really murky waters to the genuinely Bad Stuff.
Speaking in the commons is only a fraction of the work that MPs do, although @NickPalmer would know better than me
Yes, I agree, though once in two years is a bit extreme - I'd expect any MP to be interested in *something* and find an opportunity to raise it in public, as part of a wider effort. No sane person is interested in everything - in 13 years I never took part in a single debate on the fishing industry.
If Cox were to say that he'd pursued issue X vigorously and had N meetings with interested groups and several meetings with Ministers, after which a useful amendment had been introduced by the Government, that'd be fine. But merely saying "I'm doing invisible stuff, trust me", is pushing your luck, and if it turns out you're partly doing it from the Virgin Islands, you're on thin ice in terms of public credibility.
Interesting that even the Express is beginning to get it. The Tory party plan of firing up the Brexitism may not be a good one. People want a further referendum and want to Rejoin. Starmer is at risk of missing the boat on this too with "make Brexit work".
So when are the Lib Dems to come out and support rejoining rather than obfuscation
I honestly think the rejoin boat has sailed. It might come back, but not now.
The easy fix is obvious. Rejoin the EEA and do a customs deal. We are fully aligned with the EEA already, we have an increasing cost on business we can remove with a bonfire of red tape, we can even spin it as the EU agreeing to OUR standards.
Ultras will hate it but they're in the minority. TBH I think A16 will get triggered, there will be a rapid escalation until everyone is staring down the barrel of a nasty trade war. Then the newspapers will do some digging and find out that we're arguing for the right to have babies even though we can't have babies and conclude it isn't worth it. Trade wars always have to end with the pieces picked up from where they were dropped - so why bother.
A period of calm coexisting where people then realise we have no say will be the gentle catalyst towards rejoin, but I would be amazed if we did.
We’re not appropriate for the EEA we are the 5/6 largest economy in the world.
Is 5/6 so good we're just ahead of 1, then? But seriously, are you saying that because we're 5th biggest, we're too big? So presumably Germany (4th) and maybe France (6th) and Italy (7th) are 'not appropriate'?
Germany France and Italy are in the EU (to be fair in my post, it would have been clearer if I had said EFTA not EEA).
It makes sense to have free trade with Europe. But this should be on the basis of negotiated terms or equivalence. It makes no sense for an economy of our size to be a rule taker (or to agree to dynamic alignment)
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
He might have thought about it before pontificating about how they should all be honest and above board and submitting all their earnings.
I don't think admin errors cut it any more. Too many MPs etc are using that excuse. HMG charges me 100% if I make an admin error with my taxes. (though, to be fair, they did not levy any penalty when my then very old and ailing mum made a hash of her tax - were quite happy to have the belated tax).
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
The government can be concerned even by the thinner stories because it adds to the narrative given 'sleaze' is an unhelpful term covering technical admin errors up to direct corruption and even the small stuff helps the impression the bigger stuff is widespread - and that works because Boris just proved he not only doesn't care about his own standards, that's well known, but that he will expend political capital to protect the corrupt in his ranks if he thinks he can get away with it.
So even the small stuff matters to them, especially as an entire political generation have no experience of governments falling way behind in the polls mid term. But we the public should be more concerned with some cases than others.
I still find the Paterson actions unfathomable. However much they liked him as a mate and however much they disliked the current system why they thought a desperate vote to address both would help I dont know. Everytime he talks about wrongdoing and punishment the opposition have cast iron proof he does not care.
The Paterson action was an astonishing own goal. Totally unfathomable. What was there to gain to defend him ? It beggars belief. A total own goal.
They wanted to get rid of the Standards woman, presumably to replace her with their puppet. Hubris.
Maybe, but it's the tin ear to the likely public view that is truly astonishing. I feel for the Tory MPs who reluctantly followed the whip - how they will now be wishing they hadn't.
Well done the likes of Aaron Bell who correctly and bravely ignored the whips.
I’d imagine BJ’s future rests largely on how resentful those Tory mps who were harried into the sheep pens by whips feel. I tend to think if they can be bullied away from principle and honour once..
Principle and honour? They were elected under Johnson's manifesto - and every single one of them knew what they were doing.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
For once I agree with malcolmg - THAT is the issue that will really wind up people in difficulty.
Off topic, but I saw Eternals last night - I can see why some are saying it is the most 'meh' of the Marvel movies, it is possibly the weakest of them in some ways and is structured a bit weird, but I will say it includes possibly the most blatant example of a movie revealing one of its main characters is completely pointless that I've ever seen, when one of the gang just, well, buggers off home before the end. I was expecting a Han Solo triumphal moment, but no, and it was almost refreshing in being different even if narratively it seems very weird. Unless I was bored and missed it.
On topic. This reminds me of mid term polls in earlier governments. People on both sides get too excited / fearful based on their personal views of Boris. We are a couple of years away from an election. Chill. Oh and OGH is right about nothing happen until the new boundaries are in place.
Interesting that even the Express is beginning to get it. The Tory party plan of firing up the Brexitism may not be a good one. People want a further referendum and want to Rejoin. Starmer is at risk of missing the boat on this too with "make Brexit work".
So when are the Lib Dems to come out and support rejoining rather than obfuscation
I honestly think the rejoin boat has sailed. It might come back, but not now.
The easy fix is obvious. Rejoin the EEA and do a customs deal. We are fully aligned with the EEA already, we have an increasing cost on business we can remove with a bonfire of red tape, we can even spin it as the EU agreeing to OUR standards.
Ultras will hate it but they're in the minority. TBH I think A16 will get triggered, there will be a rapid escalation until everyone is staring down the barrel of a nasty trade war. Then the newspapers will do some digging and find out that we're arguing for the right to have babies even though we can't have babies and conclude it isn't worth it. Trade wars always have to end with the pieces picked up from where they were dropped - so why bother.
A period of calm coexisting where people then realise we have no say will be the gentle catalyst towards rejoin, but I would be amazed if we did.
We’re not appropriate for the EEA we are the 5/6 largest economy in the world.
Is 5/6 so good we're just ahead of 1, then? But seriously, are you saying that because we're 5th biggest, we're too big? So presumably Germany (4th) and maybe France (6th) and Italy (7th) are 'not appropriate'?
Germany France and Italy are in the EU (to be fair in my post, it would have been clearer if I had said EFTA not EEA).
It makes sense to have free trade with Europe. But this should be on the basis of negotiated terms or equivalence. It makes no sense for an economy of our size to be a rule taker (or to agree to dynamic alignment)
If we export to the US we have to take their rules, and to the EU theirs, and pending the promised explosion in exports to tiny New Zealand upon whom I am sure we can impose British standards, expecting to 'take back control' in an increasingly inter-connected world was always a false expectation.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
This is getting a bit like Glasgow people smugglers, is it not?
Sorry, you are going to have to explain that one (if you can be arsed).
Sorry - an allusion to a PBer (not you) recently stating that two chaps in Glasgow were people smugglers and then being rather reluctant to back down when the known facts were pointed out.
That’s unfair!
I went to find the article (or tweet I believe) and couldn’t. So owned up to the fact that I thought I’d seen one but couldn’t provide the backup.
Interesting that even the Express is beginning to get it. The Tory party plan of firing up the Brexitism may not be a good one. People want a further referendum and want to Rejoin. Starmer is at risk of missing the boat on this too with "make Brexit work".
So when are the Lib Dems to come out and support rejoining rather than obfuscation
I honestly think the rejoin boat has sailed. It might come back, but not now.
The easy fix is obvious. Rejoin the EEA and do a customs deal. We are fully aligned with the EEA already, we have an increasing cost on business we can remove with a bonfire of red tape, we can even spin it as the EU agreeing to OUR standards.
Ultras will hate it but they're in the minority. TBH I think A16 will get triggered, there will be a rapid escalation until everyone is staring down the barrel of a nasty trade war. Then the newspapers will do some digging and find out that we're arguing for the right to have babies even though we can't have babies and conclude it isn't worth it. Trade wars always have to end with the pieces picked up from where they were dropped - so why bother.
A period of calm coexisting where people then realise we have no say will be the gentle catalyst towards rejoin, but I would be amazed if we did.
We’re not appropriate for the EEA we are the 5/6 largest economy in the world.
Is 5/6 so good we're just ahead of 1, then? But seriously, are you saying that because we're 5th biggest, we're too big? So presumably Germany (4th) and maybe France (6th) and Italy (7th) are 'not appropriate'?
Germany France and Italy are in the EU (to be fair in my post, it would have been clearer if I had said EFTA not EEA).
It makes sense to have free trade with Europe. But this should be on the basis of negotiated terms or equivalence. It makes no sense for an economy of our size to be a rule taker (or to agree to dynamic alignment)
Yes, clearer as in not wrong. And your second paragraph (equivalence, negotiation, not a rule taker) sounds very much like a case for, hmm, being in the EU. /snark
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
Oh well, case closed, take the prisoner down.
Unionist concern for Salmond receiving justice seems very variable.
My point was simply that @malcolmg's description of Ross as "bent" was seriously misplaced. He is, frankly, a little dull, a little wooden and somewhat short of inspirational but the attempt to paint him as someone who is greedily putting his nose in the trough is simply wrong.
The result is the same. Admin errors and claiming public moneys for double benefit. Charity is irrelevant. It's by definition his disposable income. And as I pointed out earlier, he (and others such as Mr Salmond)also get benefits independent of simply giving the income to charity, unless each is or has a punctilious accountant (which in fairness he may well be, come ot think of it).
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
This is getting a bit like Glasgow people smugglers, is it not?
Sorry, you are going to have to explain that one (if you can be arsed).
Sorry - an allusion to a PBer (not you) recently stating that two chaps in Glasgow were people smugglers and then being rather reluctant to back down when the known facts were pointed out.
That’s unfair!
I went to find the article (or tweet I believe) and couldn’t. So owned up to the fact that I thought I’d seen one but couldn’t provide the backup.
I certainly don't recall ever seeing any such article. It might well be a case of a newspaper making an error and then quietly amending it without letting on.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
Oh well, case closed, take the prisoner down.
Unionist concern for Salmond receiving justice seems very variable.
My point was simply that @malcolmg's description of Ross as "bent" was seriously misplaced. He is, frankly, a little dull, a little wooden and somewhat short of inspirational but the attempt to paint him as someone who is greedily putting his nose in the trough is simply wrong.
Good to see that you’re against painting someone as greedily putting their nose in the trough when it’s not true. Mostly.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
This is getting a bit like Glasgow people smugglers, is it not?
Sorry, you are going to have to explain that one (if you can be arsed).
Sorry - an allusion to a PBer (not you) recently stating that two chaps in Glasgow were people smugglers and then being rather reluctant to back down when the known facts were pointed out.
That’s unfair!
I went to find the article (or tweet I believe) and couldn’t. So owned up to the fact that I thought I’d seen one but couldn’t provide the backup.
I certainly don't recall ever seeing any such article. It might well be a case of a newspaper making an error and then quietly amending it without letting on.
I can't understand this map. Some of them are right, but others look totally weird. I think there's some jokes going on with place names like Air / Ayr, Ross, Sutherland, etc. But some of them look right. Very weird.
W. Wallace in Falkirk/Stirling area, obvs. But Proclaimers in Fife makes sort of sense (grew up there).
Off topic, but I saw Eternals last night - I can see why some are saying it is the most 'meh' of the Marvel movies, it is possibly the weakest of them in some ways and is structured a bit weird, but I will say it includes possibly the most blatant example of a movie revealing one of its main characters is completely pointless that I've ever seen, when one of the gang just, well, buggers off home before the end. I was expecting a Han Solo triumphal moment, but no, and it was almost refreshing in being different even if narratively it seems very weird. Unless I was bored and missed it.
Someone mentioned the film Ad Astra on here the other day. I tried to watch it last night and all I could think was that it was an extended sci-fi version of that dreadful Brad Pitt Chanel No 5 ad he did a few years ago with his voice just dribbling out things that must have seemed profound to the writers with moody shots of him!
Take out the words “Chanel No 5” from the below words from the advert and it could have been any line from the film….
“It’s not a journey. Every journey ends, but we go on. The world turns and we turn with it. Plans disappear, dreams take over, but wherever I go, there you are: my luck; my fate; my fortune. Chanel No.5, inevitable.”
Off topic, but I saw Eternals last night - I can see why some are saying it is the most 'meh' of the Marvel movies, it is possibly the weakest of them in some ways and is structured a bit weird, but I will say it includes possibly the most blatant example of a movie revealing one of its main characters is completely pointless that I've ever seen, when one of the gang just, well, buggers off home before the end. I was expecting a Han Solo triumphal moment, but no, and it was almost refreshing in being different even if narratively it seems very weird. Unless I was bored and missed it.
Someone mentioned the film Ad Astra on here the other day. I tried to watch it last night and all I could think was that it was an extended sci-fi version of that dreadful Brad Pitt Chanel No 5 ad he did a few years ago with his voice just dribbling out things that must have seemed profound to the writers with moody shots of him!
Take out the words “Chanel No 5” from the below words from the advert and it could have been any line from the film….
“It’s not a journey. Every journey ends, but we go on. The world turns and we turn with it. Plans disappear, dreams take over, but wherever I go, there you are: my luck; my fate; my fortune. Chanel No.5, inevitable.”
Might have been me. Ad Astra was one of the worst films I've seen in years. It was acted so strangely, it was so flat and lifeless, with the only moment of interest being the completely out of nowhere space baboon.
David Shukman @davidshukmanbbc · 1h So the line about phasing out ‘unabated’ coal (which is virtually all of it because there’s so little carbon capture) does survive in the latest #COP26 draft
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
For once I agree with malcolmg - THAT is the issue that will really wind up people in difficulty.
I wish the government had kept the £20/week UC uplift in place and the funding to keep rough sleepers off the street. I was trying to find anything about IDS’s position on this. I got the impression that the treasury pared back his UC proposals and he wasn’t happy about it.
Interesting poll - is this the first we’ve seen with a significant swing to Labour, as opposed to previous Tories sitting on their hands?
Of course, at any other time this sort of poll would be normal for mid-term, but the last few years have destroyed a lot of long-standing precedent.
What it does show, is that the government need to get back on top of the narrative, as the pandemic ends and we get back to ‘politics as usual’. It’s clear that the media are now going for MP conduct in a big way, and they have a lot of stories stored up and ready to print.
I still think that it’s not helpful for everyone to go for Geoffrey Cox, who’s done nothing wrong except to have a great job that pays him a fortune on an hourly basis. The focus on Cox is distracting from other, potentially more serious offences that involve a genuine conflict of interest.
He is an absolute roaster , greedy grasping useless tosser. A grifter extraordinaire , lacking any principles morals or milk of human kindness.
Not always a good idea Malc to be so blunt in public about a leading lawyer.
Nothing offensive there, his conduct is reprehensible to me , he can claim it is in the rules all he likes but it shows a lack of morals and principles in my opinion. He cannot possibly be performing the job the public pay him to do when he is based out of the country most of the time. No other employer would allow that, the supposed rules set for these public servants are non existent and allow them to do as they wish. Also as we know they are not allowed to carry out other employment from Westminster, if I was doing that in my employer's premises they would rightly sack me. MP's should have to attend and work all hours parliament is in session. They have an easy life of it and can pick and choose if they ever bother to turn up for work.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
For once I agree with malcolmg - THAT is the issue that will really wind up people in difficulty.
I wish the government had kept the £20/week UC uplift in place and the funding to keep rough sleepers off the street. I was trying to find anything about IDS’s position on this. I got the impression that the treasury pared back his UC proposals and he wasn’t happy about it.
Just been reading the Aspinall story in the Guardian. When I was a Trustee of a Citizens Advice Bureau we were not allowed to seek advice from our own advisors. And there was no question of money changing hands.
I still think that it’s not helpful for everyone to go for Geoffrey Cox, who’s done nothing wrong except to have a great job that pays him a fortune on an hourly basis. The focus on Cox is distracting from other, potentially more serious offences that involve a genuine conflict of interest.
Cox is an excellent target for the media and the opposition because it's a visceral image that even Red Wall morons stood in the queue at Gregg's can understand.
You've got this utter monstrosity of a human being sat on his massive fucking arse in the Caribbean making piles of cash advising arseholes about wank while he's supposed to be an MP. No nuance required.
Yes, but his stuff was all declared and it's clear what he was up to for the money. Failings to declare or utter non entities getting big cash with no clear non shady reason to justify it are another level.
We know that Cox declared everything - you are missing the point. The image is the Tory pig with its snout in the trough eating money. Someone who is still paid as an MP but has essentially retired (1 contribution in the Commons in 18 months) and earns unfathomable amounts on top in a luxury Caribbean paradise just winds people up.
He is a totem that sells newspapers and keeps fuelling their longer harder investigations through the really murky waters to the genuinely Bad Stuff.
Speaking in the commons is only a fraction of the work that MPs do, although @NickPalmer would know better than me
And the band played believe it if you like. Methinks evidence shows us they are too busy earning dollups of cash in somewhat odd ways to be doing much MP type work.
Just been reading the Aspinall story in the Guardian. When I was a Trustee of a Citizens Advice Bureau we were not allowed to seek advice from our own advisors. And there was no question of money changing hands.
I'm not surprised about the money, but the advice thing startles me a little - on reflection, it makes sense: no benefit of any type, in cash or kind, from the operation fo which one is a trustee.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
David, you well know Salmond donated his to charity and declared it as well.
I will, if I may, bring up the name of Kevin Rudd. Many here will know him as a former Australian Prime Minister. He was elected as the leader of the Australian Labor Party because he was seen as an election winner, which is more or less the reason why Boris Johnson was elected leader of the Conservative Party in July 2019.
What else do Rudd and Johnson have in common? They both enjoyed/enjoy little natural support within their respective parliamentary parties. Rudd was held up for several years by impressive polling figures. Once they started to turn sour, he was ousted as leader.
Off topic, but I saw Eternals last night - I can see why some are saying it is the most 'meh' of the Marvel movies, it is possibly the weakest of them in some ways and is structured a bit weird, but I will say it includes possibly the most blatant example of a movie revealing one of its main characters is completely pointless that I've ever seen, when one of the gang just, well, buggers off home before the end. I was expecting a Han Solo triumphal moment, but no, and it was almost refreshing in being different even if narratively it seems very weird. Unless I was bored and missed it.
Someone mentioned the film Ad Astra on here the other day. I tried to watch it last night and all I could think was that it was an extended sci-fi version of that dreadful Brad Pitt Chanel No 5 ad he did a few years ago with his voice just dribbling out things that must have seemed profound to the writers with moody shots of him!
Take out the words “Chanel No 5” from the below words from the advert and it could have been any line from the film….
“It’s not a journey. Every journey ends, but we go on. The world turns and we turn with it. Plans disappear, dreams take over, but wherever I go, there you are: my luck; my fate; my fortune. Chanel No.5, inevitable.”
Might have been me. Ad Astra was one of the worst films I've seen in years. It was acted so strangely, it was so flat and lifeless, with the only moment of interest being the completely out of nowhere space baboon.
That is a great all about the advert and movie.
I was at a bit of a loss as to how, when they had built such high tech moon bases and space ships, they didn’t have the tech to identify and destroy the bandits (who somehow also had the tech for a rogue moon base bizarrely) before they could drive after Brad and co and kill them!
So on earth in Afghanistan they can use satellites and drones to watch over troops etc and destroy any threat but couldn’t on the moon which is even more sparsely populated and built up than Afghanistan in the film……
Good morning everybody. Quite a pleasant morning, weather-wise.
From his post earlier today, it seems Dura Ace has been fraternising with Malc! Mr A is often abusive but his 6.42 post does seem a bit rich, even for him.
Is use of that sort of language why some posters have recently reduced their activity?
Good morning
We have seen the loss of several posters recently and it may be to do with the unrelenting anti HMG threads, but to be honest Boris and others have opened the door wide with his and their idiotic actions
As far as @Dura_Ace comments are concerned they do not contribute to the discussions but like @malcolmg are designed to be provocative and are best ignored
the loss of posters is perhaps because it is a pretty boring phase of politics - no elections on the horizon , covid settled down in terms of government restrictions etc. Lest face it as well most of the posters on here also post pretty centrish middle class posts with very earnest reasoning and its a bit boring as a result. I tend to post for two reasons - one for betting stuff so this is very much around major elections and the other when I really think there is a concensus building which i fundamentally disagree with like covid restrictions ,facemasks, testing etc . I can never summon up much energy for Westminster stuff like Mp second jobs (seems to come round every so often like a comet) or even climate change - the name COP26 means there will be a COP27 somewhere etc
Yes indeed COP26 will achieve nothing - qu'elle surprise - so let's roll onto the next one!
Is that the case?
@NickPalmer who was ... y'know ... there described it as 'people generally see it as a glass half full'.
I think all this 'how can Boris possibly survive such polling?' stuff is rather over-egging it. The Tories' blood lust for ditching leaders is something of a myth: yes they famously ousted Maggie and (less famously) IDS, but all the other leaders were able to survive mid-term polling slumps. Boris will probably be okay.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
From BBC in 2014 When Mr Salmond was both an MP and MSP between 2007 and 2010, he donated one of his parliamentary salaries into the Mary Salmond Trust, which was named after his late mother. 'Not retiring'
It has so far distributed more than £92,000 to 239 groups and young people.
and to boot..........
Alex Salmond is to donate the annual pension he will receive after stepping down as Scottish first minister to good causes.
The former SNP leader said that, for as long as he continues to be an MSP, the £42,501 sum would go into a trust.
Off topic, but I saw Eternals last night - I can see why some are saying it is the most 'meh' of the Marvel movies, it is possibly the weakest of them in some ways and is structured a bit weird, but I will say it includes possibly the most blatant example of a movie revealing one of its main characters is completely pointless that I've ever seen, when one of the gang just, well, buggers off home before the end. I was expecting a Han Solo triumphal moment, but no, and it was almost refreshing in being different even if narratively it seems very weird. Unless I was bored and missed it.
Someone mentioned the film Ad Astra on here the other day. I tried to watch it last night and all I could think was that it was an extended sci-fi version of that dreadful Brad Pitt Chanel No 5 ad he did a few years ago with his voice just dribbling out things that must have seemed profound to the writers with moody shots of him!
Take out the words “Chanel No 5” from the below words from the advert and it could have been any line from the film….
“It’s not a journey. Every journey ends, but we go on. The world turns and we turn with it. Plans disappear, dreams take over, but wherever I go, there you are: my luck; my fate; my fortune. Chanel No.5, inevitable.”
Might have been me. Ad Astra was one of the worst films I've seen in years. It was acted so strangely, it was so flat and lifeless, with the only moment of interest being the completely out of nowhere space baboon.
That is a great all about the advert and movie.
I was at a bit of a loss as to how, when they had built such high tech moon bases and space ships, they didn’t have the tech to identify and destroy the bandits (who somehow also had the tech for a rogue moon base bizarrely) before they could drive after Brad and co and kill them!
So on earth in Afghanistan they can use satellites and drones to watch over troops etc and destroy any threat but couldn’t on the moon which is even more sparsely populated and built up than Afghanistan in the film……
Wing- or rotor-borne drones don't work very well on the moon. No atmosphere ... but by the same token satellite reconnaissance works even better (except when it is dark, though then IR would work superbly).
If it's a choice between Dura Ace's coarse but funny posts, and those posters who pine for dictators, I choose Dura Ace. If it's a choice between Dura Ace's coarse but funny posts, and those posters who whose health policy is "let the feeble die", I choose Dura Ace.
I think all this 'how can Boris possibly survive such polling?' stuff is rather over-egging it. The Tories' blood lust for ditching leaders is something of a myth: yes they famously ousted Maggie and (less famously) IDS, but all the other leaders were able to survive mid-term polling slumps. Boris will probably be okay.
It's not just bad polling though.
Screwing over your own MPs in a botched vote doesn't help.
Inviting the press to examine every aspect of their lives doesn't help.
I think all this 'how can Boris possibly survive such polling?' stuff is rather over-egging it. The Tories' blood lust for ditching leaders is something of a myth: yes they famously ousted Maggie and (less famously) IDS, but all the other leaders were able to survive mid-term polling slumps. Boris will probably be okay.
Yes. Cameron was behind for the majority of his term in coalition. Often by a fair distance. I don't recall any serious effort to oust him. Then again, Dave had people skills.
Just been reading the Aspinall story in the Guardian. When I was a Trustee of a Citizens Advice Bureau we were not allowed to seek advice from our own advisors. And there was no question of money changing hands.
I'm not surprised about the money, but the advice thing startles me a little - on reflection, it makes sense: no benefit of any type, in cash or kind, from the operation fo which one is a trustee.
Clear, unambiguous. Don't recall any trustee even quoting for work either.
If it's a choice between Dura Ace's coarse but funny posts, and those posters who pine for dictators, I choose Dura Ace. If it's a choice between Dura Ace's coarse but funny posts, and those posters who whose health policy is "let the feeble die", I choose Dura Ace.
Though note he’s an avid admirer of papa Lenin.
I admire strong and able leaders You like dictators He is a fascist/communist supporter
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
This is getting a bit like Glasgow people smugglers, is it not?
Sorry, you are going to have to explain that one (if you can be arsed).
The home office trying to deport people in Glasgow, they claimed the large crowd that were on street supporting the poor souls from their thugs were "people smugglers" and not enraged citizens.
"The wildlife charity that employs Carrie Johnson is facing further questions over its finances, after its latest accounts show it paid more than £150,000 in “interior design services” to the chairman’s wife last year."
More sh!tty journalism by the Grauniad, trying to bring guilt by association. Mrs Johnson is an employee, not a trustee of the charity in question.
Again, are the media going to spend more time on actual scandals, or are they just throwing enough mud and hoping some of it sticks?
That’s exactly it. The Douglas Ross story is pretty thin gruel too. An admin error. Unless the Sunday’s have some explosive stuff this feels like the tail end of the expenses scandal did.
I think the govt need to be concerned about the fox killing lawyer and any potential dodgy dealings in Covid contracts.
The government can be concerned even by the thinner stories because it adds to the narrative given 'sleaze' is an unhelpful term covering technical admin errors up to direct corruption and even the small stuff helps the impression the bigger stuff is widespread - and that works because Boris just proved he not only doesn't care about his own standards, that's well known, but that he will expend political capital to protect the corrupt in his ranks if he thinks he can get away with it.
So even the small stuff matters to them, especially as an entire political generation have no experience of governments falling way behind in the polls mid term. But we the public should be more concerned with some cases than others.
I still find the Paterson actions unfathomable. However much they liked him as a mate and however much they disliked the current system why they thought a desperate vote to address both would help I dont know. Everytime he talks about wrongdoing and punishment the opposition have cast iron proof he does not care.
The Paterson action was an astonishing own goal. Totally unfathomable. What was there to gain to defend him ? It beggars belief. A total own goal.
Same as when BoJo stuck by the Prittster. Or Cummings. Or tried to defend Matt Handsy.
Boris gets the thrill of being the one in charge who can do whatever he likes. He also cements his status as the Big Man who will protect his underlings... As long as they stay loyal. And for two years, Johnson has got away with this.
Trouble was that this time, he didn't. (Though in the day of the vote, it looked like he had.)
Question is- what was different this time?
What was different was that they needed the co-operation of the opposition parties to set up an alternative. Stupidly, they did not get that in advance. So when the opposition said no, the whole plan fell apart.
Good morning everybody. Quite a pleasant morning, weather-wise.
From his post earlier today, it seems Dura Ace has been fraternising with Malc! Mr A is often abusive but his 6.42 post does seem a bit rich, even for him.
Is use of that sort of language why some posters have recently reduced their activity?
Good morning
We have seen the loss of several posters recently and it may be to do with the unrelenting anti HMG threads, but to be honest Boris and others have opened the door wide with his and their idiotic actions
As far as @Dura_Ace comments are concerned they do not contribute to the discussions but like @malcolmg are designed to be provocative and are best ignored
the loss of posters is perhaps because it is a pretty boring phase of politics - no elections on the horizon , covid settled down in terms of government restrictions etc. Lest face it as well most of the posters on here also post pretty centrish middle class posts with very earnest reasoning and its a bit boring as a result. I tend to post for two reasons - one for betting stuff so this is very much around major elections and the other when I really think there is a concensus building which i fundamentally disagree with like covid restrictions ,facemasks, testing etc . I can never summon up much energy for Westminster stuff like Mp second jobs (seems to come round every so often like a comet) or even climate change - the name COP26 means there will be a COP27 somewhere etc
Yes indeed COP26 will achieve nothing - qu'elle surprise - so let's roll onto the next one!
Is that the case?
@NickPalmer who was ... y'know ... there described it as 'people generally see it as a glass half full'.
I am sure lots of people there at COP26 think that it will achieve something, but the economic realities, interests and pressures affecting many of the participating nations means that probably not much will change.
I’m going to make a guess that the swing back to Labour in the red wall is higher than elsewhere and possibly now not reversible as the Tories have lost their chance to appear different
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
Oh well, case closed, take the prisoner down.
Unionist concern for Salmond receiving justice seems very variable.
My point was simply that @malcolmg's description of Ross as "bent" was seriously misplaced. He is, frankly, a little dull, a little wooden and somewhat short of inspirational but the attempt to paint him as someone who is greedily putting his nose in the trough is simply wrong.
The result is the same. Admin errors and claiming public moneys for double benefit. Charity is irrelevant. It's by definition his disposable income. And as I pointed out earlier, he (and others such as Mr Salmond)also get benefits independent of simply giving the income to charity, unless each is or has a punctilious accountant (which in fairness he may well be, come ot think of it).
It is quite amazing the amount of Tories that have memory lapses on outside earnings, bit too regular an occurence to be random lapses.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
From BBC in 2014 When Mr Salmond was both an MP and MSP between 2007 and 2010, he donated one of his parliamentary salaries into the Mary Salmond Trust, which was named after his late mother. 'Not retiring'
It has so far distributed more than £92,000 to 239 groups and young people.
and to boot..........
Alex Salmond is to donate the annual pension he will receive after stepping down as Scottish first minister to good causes.
The former SNP leader said that, for as long as he continues to be an MSP, the £42,501 sum would go into a trust.
Good morning everybody. Quite a pleasant morning, weather-wise.
From his post earlier today, it seems Dura Ace has been fraternising with Malc! Mr A is often abusive but his 6.42 post does seem a bit rich, even for him.
Is use of that sort of language why some posters have recently reduced their activity?
Good morning
We have seen the loss of several posters recently and it may be to do with the unrelenting anti HMG threads, but to be honest Boris and others have opened the door wide with his and their idiotic actions
As far as @Dura_Ace comments are concerned they do not contribute to the discussions but like @malcolmg are designed to be provocative and are best ignored
Who has been driven away? It is not always easy to spot someone who isn't posting so that is a genuine question.
I note that @Casino_Royale hasn't been around and is missed. Any know if he is ok?
SquareRoot was driven off and I played my part in that, but he deserved the responses he got here because his posts were so unpleasant, content free and with no humour to compensate.
Yes, CR posts most days on Twitter, as does @AlastairMeeks. Indeed so does Tim.
For all its faults, I do like twitter as it keeps comments concise. Sometimes the effort needed to continue an intelligent and civil argument on PB gets a bit wearing.
Yes, you can get in a tangle on here. One that sticks in my mind was a few months ago on the BAME topic and whether it applied to Ed Miliband. It was getting a right old pasting from people, as a term, and I posted against the grain, saying I personally found it ok as a word for non-white people in the UK, therefore not suitable for Ed, and that if we needed such a word, which we sometimes probably did, it seemed as good as any other I could think of. This triggered a volcanic intervention from one poster demanding of me "what, so Jews don't count then?" and many posts were then exchanged as I sought to show that my use and understanding of 'BAME' did not reveal an undercurrent of raging antisemitism. I emerged from this, bruised but just about intact, only for a different poster to open up another flank, telling me with quite some agency that Jews were BAME since they all originated from the Middle East. I bit back something flip about Woody Allen and Yasser Arafat and took stock. This was getting truly harrowing now. The casual little paddle I'd intended had become quite the epic voyage and I was absolutely spent. An exit was urgently needed. So I did the only thing I could (short of abruptly logging off, which should be kept for genuine emergencies), I did the 'anodyne closer'. I also made a firm resolution to avoid getting into such a situation on PB again, and by and large I haven't.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
For once I agree with malcolmg - THAT is the issue that will really wind up people in difficulty.
The poor cannot imagine earning that much never mind forgetting they earned it on top of their £81K salary. How does anyone forget they earned almost £30K.
I’m going to make a guess that the swing back to Labour in the red wall is higher than elsewhere and possibly now not reversible as the Tories have lost their chance to appear different
There's a bit of a "silly season" vibe to politics going on.
Not making light of the sleaze stuff at all, and Boris has been very silly and made a bad situation much worse.
But after the last few years of intense politics this little of policy rather than personal issues being debated at the moment.
For most policy issues we seem in a bit of an interregnum.
Covid is going ok and we're ready for the winter and will see what happens there. Brexit we are waiting to see what happens when Article 16 is invoked. COP26 is ongoing but nobody credible is going to argue that climate change isn't real, or that Britain isn't already doing what needs to be done and it's really the USA and China etc that will matter there.
After perpetually having years of Covid or Brexit to debate, there's not much happening now policy wise.
Maybe your last five words are part of the government's problem now? Apart from levelling-up (whatever that means) what is the government for? What is it trying to achieve for the rest of its time in power? So the policy vacuum is filled with other stuff, like sleaze.
I’m going to make a guess that the swing back to Labour in the red wall is higher than elsewhere and possibly now not reversible as the Tories have lost their chance to appear different
You may be right. Not sure.
Do we have any polling?
Thanks for your kind comments recently Stocky. You are a good friend
I think all this 'how can Boris possibly survive such polling?' stuff is rather over-egging it. The Tories' blood lust for ditching leaders is something of a myth: yes they famously ousted Maggie and (less famously) IDS, but all the other leaders were able to survive mid-term polling slumps. Boris will probably be okay.
Yes. Cameron was behind for the majority of his term in coalition. Often by a fair distance. I don't recall any serious effort to oust him. Then again, Dave had people skills.
I am interested to see if we'll reenter 'normal' politics with governments behind mid term, or if the last number of years have changed things such that, in future, being behind at such a stage will prove to be indicative of a problem.
I do think Tories are not used to it now and so will panic a lot.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
This would be the same man who made it clear that (unlike Salmond and other SNP MPs) he would only take one salary and sought to decline his MSP salary? And when he was told that that wasn't possible donated his entire MSP salary to local charities? That "creep"?
Eh? I’ve lost quite a bit of respect for Salmond lately but I’m not sure what you’re on about here.
If he did I apologise but I have a vague recollection that the evidence that he followed through on this undertaking was incomplete to non existent, a bit like my MP's (Chris Law) promise to convert some of his castle into a day care facility for disabled children.
From BBC in 2014 When Mr Salmond was both an MP and MSP between 2007 and 2010, he donated one of his parliamentary salaries into the Mary Salmond Trust, which was named after his late mother. 'Not retiring'
It has so far distributed more than £92,000 to 239 groups and young people.
and to boot..........
Alex Salmond is to donate the annual pension he will receive after stepping down as Scottish first minister to good causes.
The former SNP leader said that, for as long as he continues to be an MSP, the £42,501 sum would go into a trust.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
For once I agree with malcolmg - THAT is the issue that will really wind up people in difficulty.
The poor cannot imagine earning that much never mind forgetting they earned it on top of their £81K salary. How does anyone forget they earned almost £30K.
It is a massive disconnect that MPs think that £81k pa is not a lot of money versus normal people who think it is a vast income. What is median income at the moment, £24k, something, like that? I know people who think £24k pa is huge.
There's a bit of a "silly season" vibe to politics going on.
Not making light of the sleaze stuff at all, and Boris has been very silly and made a bad situation much worse.
But after the last few years of intense politics this little of policy rather than personal issues being debated at the moment.
For most policy issues we seem in a bit of an interregnum.
Covid is going ok and we're ready for the winter and will see what happens there. Brexit we are waiting to see what happens when Article 16 is invoked. COP26 is ongoing but nobody credible is going to argue that climate change isn't real, or that Britain isn't already doing what needs to be done and it's really the USA and China etc that will matter there.
After perpetually having years of Covid or Brexit to debate, there's not much happening now policy wise.
I'm feeling worried this morning. Johnson will look for something big to take focus in a different direction and I note that the Netherlands has just set a precedent for lockdowns again, thus giving cover in a way to other governments. It is worrying because when you look at the Dutch stats their deaths from Covid now are a small fraction of what they were in April 2020 and Jan 2021 yet have brought in these measures because of high infections. The effects of the vaccines (i.e. the weakening of the link between infection and illness) are not being recognised.
I still think that it’s not helpful for everyone to go for Geoffrey Cox, who’s done nothing wrong except to have a great job that pays him a fortune on an hourly basis. The focus on Cox is distracting from other, potentially more serious offences that involve a genuine conflict of interest.
Cox is an excellent target for the media and the opposition because it's a visceral image that even Red Wall morons stood in the queue at Gregg's can understand.
You've got this utter monstrosity of a human being sat on his massive fucking arse in the Caribbean making piles of cash advising arseholes about wank while he's supposed to be an MP. No nuance required.
Yes, but his stuff was all declared and it's clear what he was up to for the money. Failings to declare or utter non entities getting big cash with no clear non shady reason to justify it are another level.
We know that Cox declared everything - you are missing the point. The image is the Tory pig with its snout in the trough eating money. Someone who is still paid as an MP but has essentially retired (1 contribution in the Commons in 18 months) and earns unfathomable amounts on top in a luxury Caribbean paradise just winds people up.
He is a totem that sells newspapers and keeps fuelling their longer harder investigations through the really murky waters to the genuinely Bad Stuff.
Speaking in the commons is only a fraction of the work that MPs do, although @NickPalmer would know better than me
Yes, I agree, though once in two years is a bit extreme - I'd expect any MP to be interested in *something* and find an opportunity to raise it in public, as part of a wider effort. No sane person is interested in everything - in 13 years I never took part in a single debate on the fishing industry.
If Cox were to say that he'd pursued issue X vigorously and had N meetings with interested groups and several meetings with Ministers, after which a useful amendment had been introduced by the Government, that'd be fine. But merely saying "I'm doing invisible stuff, trust me", is pushing your luck, and if it turns out you're partly doing it from the Virgin Islands, you're on thin ice in terms of public credibility.
Well he could argues it counts as invisible earnings.
I’m going to make a guess that the swing back to Labour in the red wall is higher than elsewhere and possibly now not reversible as the Tories have lost their chance to appear different
My guess is that the Red Wall, as a psephological monolith, does not actually exist.
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
For once I agree with malcolmg - THAT is the issue that will really wind up people in difficulty.
The poor cannot imagine earning that much never mind forgetting they earned it on top of their £81K salary. How does anyone forget they earned almost £30K.
Not least because he would have to declare it on his tax return, for one thing.
I’m going to make a guess that the swing back to Labour in the red wall is higher than elsewhere and possibly now not reversible as the Tories have lost their chance to appear different
My guess is that the Red Wall, as a psephological monolith, does not actually exist.
Hi mate how are you, thanks for your support of late
I’m going to make a guess that the swing back to Labour in the red wall is higher than elsewhere and possibly now not reversible as the Tories have lost their chance to appear different
You may be right. Not sure.
Do we have any polling?
Thanks for your kind comments recently Stocky. You are a good friend
Not sure if you listen to the Red Box podcast but you should catch up with the last three or four months Focus Group episodes. One per month. They interview a random selection of floating voters, particularly regarding their views of Johnson and Starmer. They used to be run by Mattison.
I listen to these every month and they have been clearly more pro-Johnson than pro-Starmer. The October edition was brutal for Starmer, the November edition slightly less so. The December edition will be very interesting ...
Yes, his work as a referee certainly hasn't been a secret. It simply appears he hasn't been registering it properly. Now don't get me wrong, he should have been and he deserves a rap across the knuckles for not doing so. But it's hardly a hanging offence.
Just another bent as a three bob bit Tory who only remembers they earned £30K on the side when it appears in the newspapers. These are the creeps that voted to take £20 quid a week off people who were getting £75 a week saying they could work 2 hours a week and make it up. How do these evil gits sleep at night.
For once I agree with malcolmg - THAT is the issue that will really wind up people in difficulty.
The poor cannot imagine earning that much never mind forgetting they earned it on top of their £81K salary. How does anyone forget they earned almost £30K.
It is a massive disconnect that MPs think that £81k pa is not a lot of money versus normal people who think it is a vast income. What is median income at the moment, £24k, something, like that? I know people who think £24k pa is huge.
They are so out of touch with reality and as we see many of them hardly turn up to do the job as they are too busy being elsewhere earning even more. Sure there are plenty who are conscientious and put in the hours but there are some real roasters milking it who give them all such a bad name.
Good morning everybody. Quite a pleasant morning, weather-wise.
From his post earlier today, it seems Dura Ace has been fraternising with Malc! Mr A is often abusive but his 6.42 post does seem a bit rich, even for him.
Is use of that sort of language why some posters have recently reduced their activity?
Good morning
We have seen the loss of several posters recently and it may be to do with the unrelenting anti HMG threads, but to be honest Boris and others have opened the door wide with his and their idiotic actions
As far as @Dura_Ace comments are concerned they do not contribute to the discussions but like @malcolmg are designed to be provocative and are best ignored
Who has been driven away? It is not always easy to spot someone who isn't posting so that is a genuine question.
I note that @Casino_Royale hasn't been around and is missed. Any know if he is ok?
SquareRoot was driven off and I played my part in that, but he deserved the responses he got here because his posts were so unpleasant, content free and with no humour to compensate.
Yes, CR posts most days on Twitter, as does @AlastairMeeks. Indeed so does Tim.
For all its faults, I do like twitter as it keeps comments concise. Sometimes the effort needed to continue an intelligent and civil argument on PB gets a bit wearing.
Yes, you can get in a tangle on here. One that sticks in my mind was a few months ago on the BAME topic and whether it applied to Ed Miliband. It was getting a right old pasting from people, as a term, and I posted against the grain, saying I personally found it ok as a word for non-white people in the UK, therefore not suitable for Ed, and that if we needed such a word, which we sometimes probably did, it seemed as good as any other I could think of. This triggered a volcanic intervention from one poster demanding of me "what, so Jews don't count then?" and many posts were then exchanged as I sought to show that my use and understanding of 'BAME' did not reveal an undercurrent of raging antisemitism. I emerged from this, bruised but just about intact, only for a different poster to open up another flank, telling me with quite some agency that Jews were BAME since they all originated from the Middle East. I bit back something flip about Woody Allen and Yasser Arafat and took stock. This was getting truly harrowing now. The casual little paddle I'd intended had become quite the epic voyage and I was absolutely spent. An exit was urgently needed. So I did the only thing I could (short of abruptly logging off, which should be kept for genuine emergencies), I did the 'anodyne closer'. I also made a firm resolution to avoid getting into such a situation on PB again, and by and large I haven't.
Comments
The electoral calculus👇 has Labour gaining Boris Johnson's Uxbridge & South Ruislip https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/fcgi-bin/usercode.py?scotcontrol=Y&scotshow=Y&CON=34&LAB=40&LIB=12&Reform=2&Green=6&UKIP=&TVCON=&TVLAB=&TVLIB=&TVReform=&TVGreen=&TVUKIP=&SCOTCON=22.3&SCOTLAB=18.3&SCOTLIB=6.3&SCOTReform=0.7&SCOTGreen=0.7&SCOTUKIP=&SCOTNAT=48.3&display=AllChanged&regorseat=(none)&boundary=2019base
The point - for both - might also be made that if one is on 40%/41% income tax band then donations to charity do not have the same marginal cost as for most of us; indeed, depending on the details, some tax is actually refunded. So each would presumably have got tax back on the salary that he was keeping.
Pension and NI deductions, if compulsory, would also be to their overall credit.
Take a hard look at your own posting before insulting me. I at least show some alternative opinions rather than posting as if it was 1920 and "upset Tunbridge Wells" was posting.
@Big_G_NorthWales
And as we know, this government prizes loyalty above all else.
https://www.politico.eu/article/boris-johnson-part-time-prime-minister/
Unionist concern for Salmond receiving justice seems very variable.
If you could be in the SM without FoM we wouldn't be where we are.
NAFTA and transpacific are not.
But to be honest, and I’m not trying to be personal, you are an example of what makes PB so dull at the moment.
You have your hobby horse and you ride it into the ground. You don’t engage with posts who disagree except to insult (“comedic response”) and then the next day you are back on your hobby horse again.
If Cox were to say that he'd pursued issue X vigorously and had N meetings with interested groups and several meetings with Ministers, after which a useful amendment had been introduced by the Government, that'd be fine. But merely saying "I'm doing invisible stuff, trust me", is pushing your luck, and if it turns out you're partly doing it from the Virgin Islands, you're on thin ice in terms of public credibility.
It makes sense to have free trade with Europe. But this should be on the basis of negotiated terms or equivalence. It makes no sense for an economy of our size to be a rule taker (or to agree to dynamic alignment)
I went to find the article (or tweet I believe) and couldn’t. So owned up to the fact that I thought I’d seen one but couldn’t provide the backup.
And Moray Eels. Presumably.
The US version is just silly!
Take out the words “Chanel No 5” from the below words from the advert and it could have been any line from the film….
“It’s not a journey. Every journey ends, but we go on. The world turns and we turn with it. Plans disappear, dreams take over, but wherever I go, there you are: my luck; my fate; my fortune. Chanel No.5, inevitable.”
That is a great all about the advert and movie.
@davidshukmanbbc
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1h
So the line about phasing out ‘unabated’ coal (which is virtually all of it because there’s so little carbon capture) does survive in the latest #COP26 draft
Lena Zavaroni came from Ro'say on Bute not Arran - but close enough.
It's all a bit cryptic.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10054155/Iain-Duncan-Smith-urges-PM-Universal-Credit-uplift.html
What else do Rudd and Johnson have in common? They both enjoyed/enjoy little natural support within their respective parliamentary parties. Rudd was held up for several years by impressive polling figures. Once they started to turn sour, he was ousted as leader.
Food for thought and all of that.
So on earth in Afghanistan they can use satellites and drones to watch over troops etc and destroy any threat but couldn’t on the moon which is even more sparsely populated and built up than Afghanistan in the film……
@NickPalmer who was ... y'know ... there described it as 'people generally see it as a glass half full'.
When Mr Salmond was both an MP and MSP between 2007 and 2010, he donated one of his parliamentary salaries into the Mary Salmond Trust, which was named after his late mother.
'Not retiring'
It has so far distributed more than £92,000 to 239 groups and young people.
and to boot..........
Alex Salmond is to donate the annual pension he will receive after stepping down as Scottish first minister to good causes.
The former SNP leader said that, for as long as he continues to be an MSP, the £42,501 sum would go into a trust.
Is there really an artiste called "Gordon Brown"?
Trying to imagine what instrument he/she/it would play.
Screwing over your own MPs in a botched vote doesn't help.
Inviting the press to examine every aspect of their lives doesn't help.
Then again, Dave had people skills.
You like dictators
He is a fascist/communist supporter
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/gordon-brown-finally-admits-truth-11462790
And BTW zero marks to the cartographer for omitting Orkney and Shetland.
This did not apply with the other Ministers.
How does anyone forget they earned almost £30K.
It's been at least a week since the last one.
(Morning all)
Thanks for your kind comments recently Stocky. You are a good friend
I do think Tories are not used to it now and so will panic a lot.
I hear Paris is nice at this time of the year.
Could win back TSE that way.
Tory coalition is falling apart and so is the Tory lead
Labour now in the position to tell the SNP to go away
I listen to these every month and they have been clearly more pro-Johnson than pro-Starmer. The October edition was brutal for Starmer, the November edition slightly less so. The December edition will be very interesting ...