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What a difference 13 months makes – politicalbetting.com

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  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 8,001
    Re WASPI - remember the report recommended compensation of £1,000 to £2,950 each.

    But the women actually want up to £50,000 each (ie 5 years of pension).

    What are the odds that if Burnham caves and gives them the £2,950 then they'll go back to Court and say Govt has admitted liability so we should now get the full £50,000.

    The £2,950 is completely wrong but in overall scheme of things it's not huge and the Govt could pay it as a one-off.

    But £50,000 each is obviously a massively different order of magnitude.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 12,907
    Brixian59 said:

    Utter car crash interview with Laila Cunningham.

    When it is pointed out that Jenrick and Braverman literally let the NI maniac into the UK she is all over the place.


    They don't like it up 'em sir comes to mind.

    GB News
    @GBNEWS
    ‘I am not here to relitigate Suella Braverman and Robert Jenrick.’

    https://x.com/GBNEWS/status/2064773631289266548

    It shouldn't be that difficult to formulate an answer that lets them off the hook. Something along the lines of it showing how difficult it is for an individual minister to make a difference and why the whole government needs to support Reform's agenda to be able to get things done.
    They are just 2 culprits.

    Most of the culprits are still sat on the Tory Front Bench.

    Maybe the Dakeks were right..

    Politically speaking

    E x t e r m I n a t e
    You really should take a step back and perceive that your beloved Labour party is doing the same and if not greater damage than those who you ridicule.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 12,907
    MikeL said:

    Re WASPI - remember the report recommended compensation of £1,000 to £2,950 each.

    But the women actually want up to £50,000 each (ie 5 years of pension).

    What are the odds that if Burnham caves and gives them the £2,950 then they'll go back to Court and say Govt has admitted liability so we should now get the full £50,000.

    The £2,950 is completely wrong but in overall scheme of things it's not huge and the Govt could pay it as a one-off.

    But £50,000 each is obviously a massively different order of magnitude.

    If its bad Burnham will make it worse.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,846

    Labour would scream blue murder if the Tories did this

    https://x.com/joe_mayes/status/2064771964540010935

    Exclusive: Rachel Reeves is planning to cut the tax burden faced by wealthy US expats, as she seeks to encourage more of them to relocate to Britain

    Are you complaining ?
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 8,001
    One also wonders what Lab MPs are thinking about these Burnham comments.

    First he doesn't know the fiscal rules, now he wants to pay the WASPI women.

    I would have thought at least some of them may be starting to have second thoughts.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    MikeL said:

    Re WASPI - remember the report recommended compensation of £1,000 to £2,950 each.

    But the women actually want up to £50,000 each (ie 5 years of pension).

    What are the odds that if Burnham caves and gives them the £2,950 then they'll go back to Court and say Govt has admitted liability so we should now get the full £50,000.

    The £2,950 is completely wrong but in overall scheme of things it's not huge and the Govt could pay it as a one-off.

    But £50,000 each is obviously a massively different order of magnitude.

    Don’t forget it’s a bit like the popular front of Judaea in so far as there are several groups. WASPI just want the compo. But there is the CEDAWinLAW lot and others too. CEDAW are already threatening legal action/crowdfunding but want the govt to agree to binding mediation.

    But your core point is right. Give in to these leeches and it won’t end there.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 12,907
    MikeL said:

    One also wonders what Lab MPs are thinking about these Burnham comments.

    First he doesn't know the fiscal rules, now he wants to pay the WASPI women.

    I would have thought at least some of them may be starting to have second thoughts.

    Well hopefully they're thinking 'lets keep Starmer if the alternative is a muppet'

    (I'm being unfair on muppets here)
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 63,632

    nico67 said:

    My Google isn't working properly, can somebody post me some links to the riots this murder in Northern Ireland sparked?

    This was from court last week.

    A YouTuber who murdered his pregnant girlfriend and falsely claimed he was live-streaming a video game as an alibi has been jailed for life with a minimum of 31 years.

    Stephen McCullagh, 36, was convicted by a jury at Belfast Crown Court in March of killing Natalie McNally, 32, who was 15 weeks pregnant with their child.

    During the attack, at her home in Lurgan on 18 December 2022, she suffered stab wounds, strangulation and blows to the hand.

    McCullagh concocted an alibi that he had been live-streaming himself playing computer games on his channel when Ms McNally was murdered.


    https://news.sky.com/story/youtuber-jailed-for-murdering-pregnant-girlfriend-13544222

    As a so called leftie Liberal he should have got life without parole ! Indeed this is the irritation I have when people pigeonhole those more on the left as soft on crime .

    I’m anti the death penalty but think sentences are too soft for murders .
    You’d have to leave the ECHR for life without parole to be possible
    IIRC a sentence of (say) 8,000 years, with parole a possibility after 1/3rd time served would be fine under the ECHR.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 6,065
    viewcode said:

    More reactions:


    My thoughts
    • I think Mr Tardis's point is good: the show has been dying on its arse for some time, RTD/BadWolf's departure is good not bad, and the future lies with things like BigFinish not televised drama, and a break of three-four years will not hurt and maybe help. So I can live with that.
    • Poor Ellie Littlechild (one of the hosts of WhoCulture) who was lied to on an industrial basis.
    • RTD has banked a lot of goodwill from me from QAF and RTD1, but it is difficult to forgive him for lying about the (now obviously never-existent) Xmas special. What was he thinking?
    The BigFinish audio drama's have been (mostly!) great. Really different, imaginative takes on Who (and others). Rather than TV Who's "running about for a bit then - behold! - a celeb you vaguely recognise from Eastenders and a million CGI Daleks! Squee!".
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,541

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said: "I pay more tax in the US than I did in the UK."

    Abolutely, or as a percentage? And would you be paying more if you were living in, for example, Texas?

    Both.

    Property taxes are much higher here (and are anchored to the value of the property when you bought it). I pay about $80,000 in property taxes vs one tenth of that in the UK.

    Plus, California charges a lot, especially for capital gains.
    I'm curious as to what you're paying $80k in property taxes for ?

    Is that annual or in total ? For business premises or personal residence ?
    Diversity training doesn't come cheap, you know.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,282

    DavidL said:

    An excellent piece on the wonder that is Joe Root
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/articles/c6219nxw6llo

    Yes, a really fine piece. Root is totally irreplaceable.
    I read that piece but I’m struggling to recall only winning one test match out of 17. When was that? Doesn’t match up to the stats on cricinfo.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,846
    This is a good point.
    Almost enough to put me off ABBA.

    I was listening (loudly) to Abba and like many, many years ago, I thought:
    Why is Waterloo a synonym for defeat and not for victory?..

    https://x.com/BrankoMilan/status/2064504289226035554
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 3,894
    For Fairliered and others with similar views:
    In Geneina, West Darfur, the RSF and Arab militias killed more than 15,000 non-Arab people.[7] On 22 July, a Masalit tribal leader claimed that more than 10,000 people had been killed in West Darfur alone, and that 80% of Geneina's residents had fled. Massacres against the Masalit were recorded in towns such as Tawila, Sirba, Ardamata, Kutum, and Misterei, while a mass grave was discovered around Geneina. The UK[8][15] and US[9][16] governments, witnesses, and other observers described the violence in the region as tantamount to ethnic cleansing[15][17] or even genocide,[18][19][20][21] with non-Arab groups such as the Masalit being the primary victims. The RSF and Arab militias are also accused of widespread robberies, looting food meant to feed 4.4 million people, and sexual violence against Sudanese and foreign women, particularly Masalit and non-Arab women. NGOs estimate that the actual figure of sexual violence victims could be as high as 4,400.[22] In March 2024, UNICEF reported that armed men were raping and sexually assaulting children as young as one year old.[23][24] The UN was urged to start an inquiry, and governments were encouraged to allocate resources to aid survivors.

    The RSF and Arab militias in Sudan are also accused of targeted torture and killings of intellectuals, politicians, professionals, and tribal leaders. Notable victims include Adam Zakaria Is'haq, a physician and human rights advocate, and Khamis Abakar, the governor of West Darfur, who was kidnapped, tortured, and executed.[25] The RSF also targeted the families of their opponents, such as Mustafa Tambour's family. The SAF and RSF are accused of threatening, attacking, and killing journalists and activists during the conflict. The Sudanese Journalists Syndicate documented over 40 violations in May 2023 alone. Several journalists were injured or killed, and 13 newspapers ceased operations. Humanitarian workers were also targeted, with 18 killed and many others detained.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_during_the_Sudanese_civil_war_(2023–present)

    To its credit, the Atlantic magazine has given this conflict serious coverage.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 63,632
    Battlebus said:

    A reality TV celebrity with 1.2 million followers has endorsed Restore.

    https://x.com/ScottGShore/status/2064473884003356802

    Interesting background for an influencer.

    * Bankrupt
    * Non-compliant social media influencer according to the ASA
    * Charged by the Financial Conduct Authority, alongside other influencers, in relation to promotions of unauthorised investments.
    * Axed as a cast member in 2018 after being pictured snorting a suspicious substance

    But his mother loves him. (Should add - allegedly)
    Isn’t that a very standard CV for an influencer?

    Semi-demi crook in the tradition of those adorning the back pages of Private Eye.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,282

    DavidL said:

    An excellent piece on the wonder that is Joe Root
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/articles/c6219nxw6llo

    Yes, a really fine piece. Root is totally irreplaceable.
    I read that piece but I’m struggling to recall only winning one test match out of 17. When was that? Doesn’t match up to the stats on cricinfo.
    Looking again I see it. It was bookend by quite a lot of wins.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,962
    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    ohnotnow said:

    viewcode said:

    More reactions:


    My thoughts
    • I think Mr Tardis's point is good: the show has been dying on its arse for some time, RTD/BadWolf's departure is good not bad, and the future lies with things like BigFinish not televised drama, and a break of three-four years will not hurt and maybe help. So I can live with that.
    • Poor Ellie Littlechild (one of the hosts of WhoCulture) who was lied to on an industrial basis.
    • RTD has banked a lot of goodwill from me from QAF and RTD1, but it is difficult to forgive him for lying about the (now obviously never-existent) Xmas special. What was he thinking?
    The BigFinish audio drama's have been (mostly!) great. Really different, imaginative takes on Who (and others). Rather than TV Who's "running about for a bit then - behold! - a celeb you vaguely recognise from Eastenders and a million CGI Daleks! Squee!".
    This made me smile

    https://x.com/shardzdw/status/2064765891166839104?s=61
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,846
    Plans are being laid for the World Cup.
    https://x.com/ephemeral1107/status/2064594693673857339
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Nigelb said:

    This is a good point.
    Almost enough to put me off ABBA.

    I was listening (loudly) to Abba and like many, many years ago, I thought:
    Why is Waterloo a synonym for defeat and not for victory?..

    https://x.com/BrankoMilan/status/2064504289226035554

    to meet one's waterloo has a long history as an idiom in english for being thrashed/facing certain defeat/having one's comeuppance

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,846

    Nigelb said:

    This is a good point.
    Almost enough to put me off ABBA.

    I was listening (loudly) to Abba and like many, many years ago, I thought:
    Why is Waterloo a synonym for defeat and not for victory?..

    https://x.com/BrankoMilan/status/2064504289226035554

    to meet one's waterloo has a long history as an idiom in english for being thrashed/facing certain defeat/having one's comeuppance

    Yes, obviously.
    But it's still a good question.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 28,831

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    Must be bad to make William think someone is getting radicalised.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,282
    Nigelb said:

    This is a good point.
    Almost enough to put me off ABBA.

    I was listening (loudly) to Abba and like many, many years ago, I thought:
    Why is Waterloo a synonym for defeat and not for victory?..

    https://x.com/BrankoMilan/status/2064504289226035554
    to meet one's waterloo has a long history as an idiom in english for being thrashed/facing certain defeat/having one's comeuppance

    Yes, obviously.
    But it's still a good question.


    Could you argue that the defeat was the end for Napoleon but the victory just another step for Wellington? Does that work?
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,937

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    One would have thought that Hannan would be in a good mood at this time of year.

    It's only a fortnight until our annual Independence Day celebration, with fireworks and everything.
  • PeterCairnsPeterCairns Posts: 110

    NEW: A Reform UK activist who campaigns with top party figures joined the racist rioters in Glasgow on Tuesday and has claimed that “Jews" are trying "to dilute our Protestant stock and shatter the Union”, The National can reveal.

    Grant Calder, a Reform UK member who has regularly been pictured with the party’s deputy Scottish leader Thomas Kerr, was photographed on Buchanan Street steps on Tuesday evening holding a “White Lives Matter” banner.

    Elsewhere on his social media – where he has many pictures with leading Reform UK figures including Nigel Farage, Richard Tice, and Kerr – Calder has launched diatribes against Jewish people.

    On September 7, 2025, he wrote on Facebook: “Jews are forcing us to swallow hordes of migrants, flooding land with the dregs of the world to dilute our Protestant stock and shatter the Union.”

    Reform UK did not respond to a request for comment on the activist or his links to Kerr. Full story here


    https://x.com/LauraEWebsterr/status/2064774423068934649

    https://www.thenational.scot/news/26184240.top-scottish-reform-uk-activist-claims-jews-want-shatter-uk/

    I assume it is this Thomas Kerr the article is referring to.
    https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/reform-uk-glasgow-protests-thomas-kerr-8668198
    Is Protestant Stock any good for making soup?...asking for a friend.

    Peter.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 56,906

    Battlebus said:

    A reality TV celebrity with 1.2 million followers has endorsed Restore.

    https://x.com/ScottGShore/status/2064473884003356802

    Interesting background for an influencer.

    * Bankrupt
    * Non-compliant social media influencer according to the ASA
    * Charged by the Financial Conduct Authority, alongside other influencers, in relation to promotions of unauthorised investments.
    * Axed as a cast member in 2018 after being pictured snorting a suspicious substance

    But his mother loves him. (Should add - allegedly)
    Isn’t that a very standard CV for an influencer?

    Semi-demi crook in the tradition of those adorning the back pages of Private Eye.
    And for the far right...
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,543
    MikeL said:

    One also wonders what Lab MPs are thinking about these Burnham comments.

    First he doesn't know the fiscal rules, now he wants to pay the WASPI women.

    I would have thought at least some of them may be starting to have second thoughts.

    Giving out more welfare benefits is the life purpose of the new Labour MPs.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,591

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    Doesn't look particularly radical to me. I can't see anything to disagree with there.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 103,874
    MikeL said:

    One also wonders what Lab MPs are thinking about these Burnham comments.

    First he doesn't know the fiscal rules, now he wants to pay the WASPI women.

    I would have thought at least some of them may be starting to have second thoughts.

    I think they want to do it, but keep hesitating when the cost comes up, hence why the government said no, then maybe, then no again.

    Burnham may just do it to stop the hesitation.

  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    More people,think the Police treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities.

    A turnaround since June 24

    https://x.com/luketryl/status/2064724060697735573?s=61

  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,290
    Omnium said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Utter car crash interview with Laila Cunningham.

    When it is pointed out that Jenrick and Braverman literally let the NI maniac into the UK she is all over the place.


    They don't like it up 'em sir comes to mind.

    GB News
    @GBNEWS
    ‘I am not here to relitigate Suella Braverman and Robert Jenrick.’

    https://x.com/GBNEWS/status/2064773631289266548

    It shouldn't be that difficult to formulate an answer that lets them off the hook. Something along the lines of it showing how difficult it is for an individual minister to make a difference and why the whole government needs to support Reform's agenda to be able to get things done.
    They are just 2 culprits.

    Most of the culprits are still sat on the Tory Front Bench.

    Maybe the Dakeks were right..

    Politically speaking

    E x t e r m I n a t e
    You really should take a step back and perceive that your beloved Labour party is doing the same and if not greater damage than those who you ridicule.
    It's a nakedly hypocritical position (very unlike our lefty brigade) to be furious when politicians make pronouncements on judicial verdicts or the day-to-day operations of civil servants, accusing whoever does it of overreach and undermining impartiality, but yet lay the blame for an operational asylum decision on the Home Secretary. Perhaps they should explain how Suella should or could have intervened to overturn this granting and deport the individual?

    Even more risible is how they have the balls to even talk about this case given we've heard nothing but "HOW CAN THESE EVIL FACSISTS POSSIBLY CHALLENGE THE SETTLED STATUS OF THOSE WITH ILR???" - well, let me think, because of people like this maybe?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,962
    Taz said:

    More people,think the Police treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities.

    A turnaround since June 24

    https://x.com/luketryl/status/2064724060697735573?s=61

    Maybe that's just the Keir Starmer negative polarisation effect. He says we haven't got two-tier policing, so people think we have.
  • PeterCairnsPeterCairns Posts: 110
    DavidL said:

    FF43 said:

    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    viewcode said:

    ICYMI the Speaker has gone ballistic this afternoon:-

    There are strong rumours that the Government are going to produce their defence investment plan on Friday. That would be an utter disgrace and an utter kick in the face to Members of this House. I say to Downing Street that, under the ministerial code, it is the Government’s responsibility to ensure that major announcements are made here. This may be speculation, and I am sure it will be corrected, but I will be appalled if it is done on a Friday, given that Members have been waiting so long.

    This affects all parties who have a great interest in the defence investment plan, including Members on the Government Benches. We all have jobs, and we all have people who serve in the armed forces. We must end the speculation and treat this House with the respect that elected Members deserve. Once again, it seems to me that we are becoming second-class citizens under this Government. I do not want that to be the case, and I hope that I am going to be proved wrong.

    https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2026-06-10/debates/DA392024-5FAF-486E-9EC1-508DB9AF8B57/DefenceInvestmentPlan

    Hasn't this Government got form for this? If I remember correctly the EHRC Final Guidance was released on a Friday. Happy to be corrected if wrong.
    This isn't so much disrespect, as sheer incompetence.
    They're simply unable to work out WTF they're doing on defence funding.
    Our biggest threat is Russia. And Russia is being denuded and demoralised by its failure to win its war of choice and aggression against Ukraine. So imo that should be the short term focus - helping Ukraine to the max both unilaterally and in tandem with other European countries. That ticks all the boxes.

    Longer term there's great uncertainty over America's direction which is perhaps a justifiable reason for some uncertainty about ours. You wouldn't want to commit to big expensive decisions based on deeply questionable assumptions. Not that this precludes incompetence, but it might be a factor.
    Sounds right. If we don't know how to spend our defence budget sensibly give at least some of the money to Ukraine because they need it and it will be used to address a here-and-now threat. Then we can learn from them what effective defence looks like.
    That would be fine, except we aren't spending enough even to maintain the assets we already have. So, rather than treading water while we work out what to do, we are sinking.

    Secondly, why is it that every other member of NATO is doing more than Britain to rearm? Why are we uniquely in a state of confusion about future warfare?

    I think the answer is simply that the Cabinet cannot agree how the required extra spending is to be funded.
    Tbf it is a bit more complicated than that. As well as all the competing programmes and inter-service rivalries, one new complication is the faction that wants to scrap ships and tanks and just rely on drones. Talking about spending as a percentage of GDP does not help much either because all the bills are due in actual spondulicks.
    A share of GDP is always something that politicans point to but as you point out a percentage doesn't buy a tank, money does. equally if my back was to teh wall and I needed help I'd rather have 1% from America than 10% from Albania. geography also plays a part. @% of a land locked country near teh frontier probably gets you more if use than 2% from someone teh same size at teh otehr end of teh ciontinent taht also has to fund a Navy. The more you look at GDP percnetages the elss useful they turn out to be.

    The drone issue is another one, but it's wider tahn that. from cubsats that use off teh shielf components to 3d printing we are seeing new solutions rapidly emerging taht are being draught to teh battlefiels in a fraction of the time of traditional large projects and which are not only cheaper but can be aquired in numbers that can overwhelm those traditional big ticket items.

    Right now there are probably battles over not only what to buy but confusion as to whether what we buy will be fit for purpose. Compare these two;

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Challenger_3

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_100_tank

    We seem to be upgrading 150 tanks for about £13bn each while China has a lightweight solution that on the face of it is more advanced that it will be seeling for under £8m. We are now at teh satge where new Loyal Wingman armed UAV's can be designed built tested and in service before a replacement for teh Typhon is even past teh definition stage let along designed.

    Peter.
    Anyone insisting on spending money on tanks has simply not been paying attention for the last 4 years during which Russian tank losses now exceed 10K.
    I think the Chinese Type 100, lighter, faster netcentric shows evolution as opposed to obsolescence.

    A key issue for Ukraine is the danger of availability bias, making decisions on what we see which isn't the whole picture.

    Russian trained for almost parade style attacks, mass armour in strict formation, poorly trained relying on mass effect. In the west particularly the US we went for far more flexible combined arms manouver warfare. Far harder to do, but highly effective.

    Russian failure to adapt has first meant they were advancing narrowly and slowly and once stopped became vulnerable and since the front line has solidified so tanks have become almost pillboxes. Small drones, hard to see and stop have proved very effective against fixed positions, tanks and entrenched infantry but what we haven't seen yet is if drones can be effective in a fast mobile conflict.

    Lots of drones are capable of about 60mph over about 6 miles so with artillery bombardment and rapid armoured or mechanised forces moving like we did in Iraq and Kuwait we still don't know if drones could stop the advance or be over run.

    Peter.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 21,067

    Omnium said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Utter car crash interview with Laila Cunningham.

    When it is pointed out that Jenrick and Braverman literally let the NI maniac into the UK she is all over the place.


    They don't like it up 'em sir comes to mind.

    GB News
    @GBNEWS
    ‘I am not here to relitigate Suella Braverman and Robert Jenrick.’

    https://x.com/GBNEWS/status/2064773631289266548

    It shouldn't be that difficult to formulate an answer that lets them off the hook. Something along the lines of it showing how difficult it is for an individual minister to make a difference and why the whole government needs to support Reform's agenda to be able to get things done.
    They are just 2 culprits.

    Most of the culprits are still sat on the Tory Front Bench.

    Maybe the Dakeks were right..

    Politically speaking

    E x t e r m I n a t e
    You really should take a step back and perceive that your beloved Labour party is doing the same and if not greater damage than those who you ridicule.
    It's a nakedly hypocritical position (very unlike our lefty brigade) to be furious when politicians make pronouncements on judicial verdicts or the day-to-day operations of civil servants, accusing whoever does it of overreach and undermining impartiality, but yet lay the blame for an operational asylum decision on the Home Secretary. Perhaps they should explain how Suella should or could have intervened to overturn this granting and deport the individual?

    Even more risible is how they have the balls to even talk about this case given we've heard nothing but "HOW CAN THESE EVIL FACSISTS POSSIBLY CHALLENGE THE SETTLED STATUS OF THOSE WITH ILR???" - well, let me think, because of people like this maybe?
    There are already rules in place to change the status of someone with ILR in a case like this.
  • RattersRatters Posts: 2,032
    Taz said:

    More people,think the Police treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities.

    A turnaround since June 24

    https://x.com/luketryl/status/2064724060697735573?s=61

    I'd be utterly amazed if the reverse wasn't true statistically.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,937
    Taz said:

    More people,think the Police treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities.

    A turnaround since June 24

    https://x.com/luketryl/status/2064724060697735573?s=61

    Question is- why do they think that? The two limiting answers are:

    a) because the police do treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities

    b) because public perception has been warped by a trashy information diet.

    (It could be a mixture of the two, in various proportions.)

    The response to this issue that is going to help depends a lot on which of a) and b) you think contains more of the truth. For various reasons, I'm going with b).
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397

    Taz said:

    More people,think the Police treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities.

    A turnaround since June 24

    https://x.com/luketryl/status/2064724060697735573?s=61

    Question is- why do they think that? The two limiting answers are:

    a) because the police do treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities

    b) because public perception has been warped by a trashy information diet.

    (It could be a mixture of the two, in various proportions.)

    The response to this issue that is going to help depends a lot on which of a) and b) you think contains more of the truth. For various reasons, I'm going with b).
    I’d suspect it’s far more B than A

    ‘A’ being few and far between but, like Henry Nowak, gets well publicised.

    I’m of the view they tend to treat most of us the same. With contempt.

  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,816

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    So we could have had all this racist rioting 20+ years ago then if people had been paying attention. Ah well. Better late than never.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 8,277
    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is a good point.
    Almost enough to put me off ABBA.

    I was listening (loudly) to Abba and like many, many years ago, I thought:
    Why is Waterloo a synonym for defeat and not for victory?..

    https://x.com/BrankoMilan/status/2064504289226035554

    to meet one's waterloo has a long history as an idiom in english for being thrashed/facing certain defeat/having one's comeuppance

    Yes, obviously.
    But it's still a good question.
    Because it was a damned close run thing.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,230

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    Radical?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,816

    Omnium said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Utter car crash interview with Laila Cunningham.

    When it is pointed out that Jenrick and Braverman literally let the NI maniac into the UK she is all over the place.


    They don't like it up 'em sir comes to mind.

    GB News
    @GBNEWS
    ‘I am not here to relitigate Suella Braverman and Robert Jenrick.’

    https://x.com/GBNEWS/status/2064773631289266548

    It shouldn't be that difficult to formulate an answer that lets them off the hook. Something along the lines of it showing how difficult it is for an individual minister to make a difference and why the whole government needs to support Reform's agenda to be able to get things done.
    They are just 2 culprits.

    Most of the culprits are still sat on the Tory Front Bench.

    Maybe the Dakeks were right..

    Politically speaking

    E x t e r m I n a t e
    You really should take a step back and perceive that your beloved Labour party is doing the same and if not greater damage than those who you ridicule.
    It's a nakedly hypocritical position (very unlike our lefty brigade) to be furious when politicians make pronouncements on judicial verdicts or the day-to-day operations of civil servants, accusing whoever does it of overreach and undermining impartiality, but yet lay the blame for an operational asylum decision on the Home Secretary. Perhaps they should explain how Suella should or could have intervened to overturn this granting and deport the individual?

    Even more risible is how they have the balls to even talk about this case given we've heard nothing but "HOW CAN THESE EVIL FACSISTS POSSIBLY CHALLENGE THE SETTLED STATUS OF THOSE WITH ILR???" - well, let me think, because of people like this maybe?
    Sloppy use of the 'hypocrisy' word by a PB right winger.

    This week's total: 957.

    And it's only Wednesday.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,962
    Andy_JS said:

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    Radical?
    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064479143287304300

    We must be mad, literally mad. It is like watching a nation busily engaged in heaping up its own funeral pyre.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 10,143

    Andy_JS said:

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    Radical?
    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064479143287304300

    We must be mad, literally mad. It is like watching a nation busily engaged in heaping up its own funeral pyre.
    Brexit? :wink:
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    Iran being bombed to force them to make a deal.

    What failed last time will work this time !

    Trump and Hesgeth are idiots.

  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 10,143

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    It wasn't a bigger deal because it was a police officer in line of duty - no less horrific, of course, but people are more shocked by random attacks in the street.

    Plus, in terms of rioting, what's the notional cover now - that police authorities not doing enough? That's less of a cover if the police are getting killed trying to arrest some bad'un - they were taking action.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,816

    Andy_JS said:

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    Radical?
    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064479143287304300

    We must be mad, literally mad. It is like watching a nation busily engaged in heaping up its own funeral pyre.
    I'd turned he was mad, literally mad, to think this country was so fragile and wedded to white supremacy that a small influx of black people from the Caribbean would destroy its very soul.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 21,067

    Andy_JS said:

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064767411455443137

    Why wasn’t his death a bigger deal? Oake was a brave man who died in the line of duty. His murderer was an illegal immigrant. There was a religious radicalisation angle.

    The answer, I think, is that Oake died in 2003, when our media and political leaders did not consider it quite proper to dwell on stories about white men being killed by immigrants. Making too much of a fuss was said to “stoke far-Right narratives”.

    What we are seeing now is partly the result of decades of repression, deflection and dissembling, a breakdown in trust between the old media and the country at large. That is what makes it so bitter.

    Radical?
    https://x.com/DanielJHannan/status/2064479143287304300

    We must be mad, literally mad. It is like watching a nation busily engaged in heaping up its own funeral pyre.
    We have the lowest homicide rate (per capita) since 1977.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,230
    edited June 10
    nico67 said:

    If I had my way I’d add quite a few offences to whole life terms . For example acid attacks which cause devastating impacts both physically and mentally.

    At the same time non- violent crimes should be dealt with more by tagging and house arrest , community service etc .

    This reminds me of one of the worst judgements I've read about in recent years.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-36096422

    "A man who carried out an acid attack leaving his victim blind in one eye has had his sentence cut by the Court of Appeal. Andreas Christopheros, 29, was attacked at his Truro home by David Phillips, 49, from Hastings in Sussex. Phillips admitted assault causing grievous bodily harm with intent and was given a life term in 2015. Judges imposed a 16-year sentence and said he will be eligible for parole after he has served eight. Mr Justice Wyn Williams told the court: "We acknowledge that this crime involved a great deal of planning and a great deal of determination to carry through." He ruled that Phillips, who carried out the attack in a case of mistaken identity, had wrongly been condemned as a highly dangerous man from whom the public would need future protection. "We are therefore forced to conclude that this life sentence was not justified and must be quashed," the judge ruled."
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,816

    Taz said:

    More people,think the Police treat white people less favourably than ethnic minorities.

    A turnaround since June 24

    https://x.com/luketryl/status/2064724060697735573?s=61

    Maybe that's just the Keir Starmer negative polarisation effect. He says we haven't got two-tier policing, so people think we have.
    Yep. Two Tier Keir.

    That stops as soon as he goes - unless he's replaced by somebody called Greer or Spear or something like that.

    And speaking as a Labour member I can assure you we won't let that happen. We've wised up.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,994

    Daniel Hannan seems to be radicalising. He's been quoting Enoch Powell and is now citing the murder of DC Stephen Oake:

    Twitter, not even once. Just stop bathing your brain in this shit.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452

    Oliver Kamm
    @OliverKamm

    Ludicrous, and without a shred of justification or principle. The cause of Waspi women is a prime example of a sectional interest overriding the public good.


    Quote Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal


    https://x.com/OliverKamm/status/2064802815067701757
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452

    Oliver Kamm
    @OliverKamm

    Ludicrous, and without a shred of justification or principle. The cause of Waspi women is a prime example of a sectional interest overriding the public good.


    Quote Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal


    https://x.com/OliverKamm/status/2064802815067701757
  • PeterCairnsPeterCairns Posts: 110
    edited June 10
    Andy_JS said:

    nico67 said:

    If I had my way I’d add quite a few offences to whole life terms . For example acid attacks which cause devastating impacts both physically and mentally.

    At the same time non- violent crimes should be dealt with more by tagging and house arrest , community service etc .

    This reminds me of one of the worst judgements I've read about in recent years.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-36096422

    "A man who carried out an acid attack leaving his victim blind in one eye has had his sentence cut by the Court of Appeal. Andreas Christopheros, 29, was attacked at his Truro home by David Phillips, 49, from Hastings in Sussex. Phillips admitted assault causing grievous bodily harm with intent and was given a life term in 2015. Judges imposed a 16-year sentence and said he will be eligible for parole after he has served eight. Mr Justice Wyn Williams told the court: "We acknowledge that this crime involved a great deal of planning and a great deal of determination to carry through." He ruled that Phillips, who carried out the attack in a case of mistaken identity, had wrongly been condemned as a highly dangerous man from whom the public would need future protection. "We are therefore forced to conclude that this life sentence was not justified and must be quashed," the judge ruled."
    The logic, if you can call it that is that, seems to be that as it was targetted on one person, no one else would be in danger, as he had done what he wanted. A bit like the parent who attacks someone who abused their child. However if someone is capable of that kind of planning to carry out an attack you would think they would take the precautionary approach assuming that he could do it again!

    Peter.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Seems that when Stone Roses Andy for PM said he did not think we should be in hock to bond markets he was thinking of his forthcoming splurge on WASPI pension women of billions and billions.

    Let's be honest, the wheels are already falling off this Bee Network bus and we all knew this would happen sooner rather than later.


    Although, however, I win a three figure sum if he becomes next PM, so there's that...
  • YokesYokes Posts: 1,508
    Taz said:

    Yokes said:

    Hello from Belfast, where either some people are playing whack a mole, or more likely, there is evidence of 'community engagement' . This is where the cops go to some 'community leaders' directly or indirectly and suggest it might be worth turning the heat down a bit. The approach is fairly simple, Box the scenes of trouble off, let them have a good night out, keep the public away, evacuate where necessary and otherwise just keep it at range and wait it out with a bit of dispersal work later on. After a night or two when its lost some energy, start the chats with the public local reps.

    You can if you know your way around certain parts of Belfast know who the community reps may be and therefore can identify who is keeping out of it and who isn't.

    There are still incidents tonight, particularly near to a hotel that is now an illegal migrant facility but its dampened down plenty so far.

    Few points:
    The claims by some about right wing influences outside of NI stoking up people is nonsense and out of the mouths of those who haven't got a notion of wit to look beyond their nose. Those out of the street couldn't give a fiddlers about some US commentator or indeed Nigel Farage. Its not how we work, we are remarkably self-driven when it comes to grievance. We have our own industry

    As I mentioned posting last night, the cops knew this issue was likely to come up and had contingency for mutual aid from other UK forces. Story is they have called it already which says a lot about how stretched they are to start. That the anti migrant issue is up there in contingency planning as prominent as our own traditional scrapping, is an indication of where things really are.

    There is a notable absence of terror group direction overall in what occurred. Local players in some areas (hello to a certain group in Newtownabbey) but no big sign of co-ordination/ leadership. This may be evidenced in how relatively quiet it is, at least tonight.

    The open letter from the family asking for calm clearly did the trick !!!!
    Na, the cops were down in the Loyalist heartland of the Shankill today chatting with 'community leaders'. Some of the lads there have power beyond the local area.
  • TresTres Posts: 3,676
    Cookie said:

    Taz said:

    rcs1000 said:

    carnforth said:

    My Google isn't working properly, can somebody post me some links to the riots this murder in Northern Ireland sparked?

    This was from court last week.

    A YouTuber who murdered his pregnant girlfriend and falsely claimed he was live-streaming a video game as an alibi has been jailed for life with a minimum of 31 years.

    Stephen McCullagh, 36, was convicted by a jury at Belfast Crown Court in March of killing Natalie McNally, 32, who was 15 weeks pregnant with their child.

    During the attack, at her home in Lurgan on 18 December 2022, she suffered stab wounds, strangulation and blows to the hand.

    McCullagh concocted an alibi that he had been live-streaming himself playing computer games on his channel when Ms McNally was murdered.


    https://news.sky.com/story/youtuber-jailed-for-murdering-pregnant-girlfriend-13544222

    People are more exercised about random public attacks than attacks involving people who know each other. Not surprising.
    Also not justified.

    The former are a much lower risk than the latter.
    I think this is a bit like the contrast between foreign and native criminals.

    Unless you live a life of monastic solitude at some level you have to choose someone to trust to let inside your life, and there's always a risk of that person betraying that trust. Whereas the threat from a someone you have not let inside your life feels like one that it should be possible to stop.

    In the same way that there will always be people within the native population who do evil things, but it feels like it ought to be possible to deport foreigners at the first sign of trouble.
    People fixate on the small fraction of the problem, then allow others to get away with much bigger problems.

    Jason Gideon: You know what program did the most harm to this country, in terms of crimes like this? Child abduction?
    Det. Charlotte Russet: No.
    Dr. Spencer Reid: Stranger danger.
    Jason Gideon: Flooded the schools with it.
    Dr. Spencer Reid: I remember them coming to my classroom. It was Officer Friendly with stranger danger coloring books.
    Jason Gideon: Taught a whole generation about a scary man in a trench coat, hiding behind a tree. Then we learned that strangers are only a... fraction of the offenders out there. Most are people you see every day - your family, your neighbors, schoolteachers. You know the rest. Prepared our children for 1% of the danger, made them more vulnerable to 99%. So we've been wrong before. All we can do is learn from it, and hopefully be better next time.
    Criminal Minds, episode "What Fresh Hell", season 2.
    That is so true: the creepy uncle is 10x more likely to be a child molester than some random stranger.
    Like Keith moon in Tommy.
    But to go back to Eagles' original question - why was there a riot about the murderer from Sudan but not the murderer from NI: the riots tend not to be about the crime itself, but about the political culture which appears so relaxed about letting individuals like these into the country.
    or that Elon didn't want to start a pogrom about the murderer from NI
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Cyclefree said:

    https://x.com/LOS_Fisher/status/2064768443430125723

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal

    Thus proving how unfit for PM or, indeed, any Ministerial role he is.
    I have bad news for you on that front sadly.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Is Andy Burnham serious? I'm very concerned.


    Tim Montgomerie 🇬🇧
    @montie

  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    Yokes said:

    Taz said:

    Yokes said:

    Hello from Belfast, where either some people are playing whack a mole, or more likely, there is evidence of 'community engagement' . This is where the cops go to some 'community leaders' directly or indirectly and suggest it might be worth turning the heat down a bit. The approach is fairly simple, Box the scenes of trouble off, let them have a good night out, keep the public away, evacuate where necessary and otherwise just keep it at range and wait it out with a bit of dispersal work later on. After a night or two when its lost some energy, start the chats with the public local reps.

    You can if you know your way around certain parts of Belfast know who the community reps may be and therefore can identify who is keeping out of it and who isn't.

    There are still incidents tonight, particularly near to a hotel that is now an illegal migrant facility but its dampened down plenty so far.

    Few points:
    The claims by some about right wing influences outside of NI stoking up people is nonsense and out of the mouths of those who haven't got a notion of wit to look beyond their nose. Those out of the street couldn't give a fiddlers about some US commentator or indeed Nigel Farage. Its not how we work, we are remarkably self-driven when it comes to grievance. We have our own industry

    As I mentioned posting last night, the cops knew this issue was likely to come up and had contingency for mutual aid from other UK forces. Story is they have called it already which says a lot about how stretched they are to start. That the anti migrant issue is up there in contingency planning as prominent as our own traditional scrapping, is an indication of where things really are.

    There is a notable absence of terror group direction overall in what occurred. Local players in some areas (hello to a certain group in Newtownabbey) but no big sign of co-ordination/ leadership. This may be evidenced in how relatively quiet it is, at least tonight.

    The open letter from the family asking for calm clearly did the trick !!!!
    Na, the cops were down in the Loyalist heartland of the Shankill today chatting with 'community leaders'. Some of the lads there have power beyond the local area.
    Sorry. I was being facetious.

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,230
    This is an article in the left-of-centre New Statesman.

    "How Britain lost control
    Everything is broken. Nothing changes. Voters are mad as hell

    By Anoosh Chakelian"

    https://www.newstatesman.com/cover-story/2026/06/how-britain-lost-control
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 32,633
    Andy_JS said:

    This is an article in the left-of-centre New Statesman.

    "How Britain lost control
    Everything is broken. Nothing changes. Voters are mad as hell

    By Anoosh Chakelian"

    https://www.newstatesman.com/cover-story/2026/06/how-britain-lost-control

    I played Rugby League on Darlington Street.
    Was amazed when I read Road to Wigan Pier.
    Was just a normal Wigan street as far as I was concerned.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,591
    Andy_JS said:

    This is an article in the left-of-centre New Statesman.

    "How Britain lost control
    Everything is broken. Nothing changes. Voters are mad as hell

    By Anoosh Chakelian"

    https://www.newstatesman.com/cover-story/2026/06/how-britain-lost-control

    I have seen other Darlington Streets.

    I am fortunate enough to live in the prosperous streets of Southern Greater Manchester - you don't get many HNOs here - but cross the MSC and the difference is striking. HMO after HMO with houses advertising 'the HMO guys' looking for other houses to turn into HMOs. It's no wonder these places are going Reform. Not because Reform have the answers, but because they're the lone voice suggesting this is sub-optimal.
    If you think towns like Wigan are too white to properly understand immigration, you are looking at it entirely wrong.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 59,879

    Omnium said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Utter car crash interview with Laila Cunningham.

    When it is pointed out that Jenrick and Braverman literally let the NI maniac into the UK she is all over the place.


    They don't like it up 'em sir comes to mind.

    GB News
    @GBNEWS
    ‘I am not here to relitigate Suella Braverman and Robert Jenrick.’

    https://x.com/GBNEWS/status/2064773631289266548

    It shouldn't be that difficult to formulate an answer that lets them off the hook. Something along the lines of it showing how difficult it is for an individual minister to make a difference and why the whole government needs to support Reform's agenda to be able to get things done.
    They are just 2 culprits.

    Most of the culprits are still sat on the Tory Front Bench.

    Maybe the Dakeks were right..

    Politically speaking

    E x t e r m I n a t e
    You really should take a step back and perceive that your beloved Labour party is doing the same and if not greater damage than those who you ridicule.
    It's a nakedly hypocritical position (very unlike our lefty brigade) to be furious when politicians make pronouncements on judicial verdicts or the day-to-day operations of civil servants, accusing whoever does it of overreach and undermining impartiality, but yet lay the blame for an operational asylum decision on the Home Secretary. Perhaps they should explain how Suella should or could have intervened to overturn this granting and deport the individual?

    Even more risible is how they have the balls to even talk about this case given we've heard nothing but "HOW CAN THESE EVIL FACSISTS POSSIBLY CHALLENGE THE SETTLED STATUS OF THOSE WITH ILR???" - well, let me think, because of people like this maybe?
    He didn't have ILR.
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,175
    A football betting post...

    Having been introduced to the Guardian's Bracketology for the World Cup, I'm struggling not to get Argentina vs Brazil in the semi-final and therefore their prices on Betfair at 11.5 seems long compared to France, Spain, Portugal and England...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 66,651


    Oliver Kamm
    @OliverKamm

    Ludicrous, and without a shred of justification or principle. The cause of Waspi women is a prime example of a sectional interest overriding the public good.


    Quote Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal


    https://x.com/OliverKamm/status/2064802815067701757

    That's the exact opposite of what we should be spending money on.

    He must be trying to win over a few more votes of older women in Makerfield.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 66,651

    Eabhal said:

    HYUFD said:

    'Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal

    Earlier I attended a Makerfield hustings event hosted by
    @MENnewsdesk
    , in which Burnham said: “I stick by campaigners that I support. I stuck by the Hillsborough families, I’ll stick by the Waspi women because they deserve some recompense for the unfairness.”

    Stressing he wouldn’t ditch his longterm support for Waspi women, he said he felt “uncomfortable” that some politicians threw their support behind a cause but then went into government and “didn’t do anything”

    https://x.com/LOS_Fisher/status/2064768443430125723?s=20

    Sigh.
    He’s dropping
    And our gilt rates when he takes over will be soaring.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,541
    Omnium said:

    MikeL said:

    Re WASPI - remember the report recommended compensation of £1,000 to £2,950 each.

    But the women actually want up to £50,000 each (ie 5 years of pension).

    What are the odds that if Burnham caves and gives them the £2,950 then they'll go back to Court and say Govt has admitted liability so we should now get the full £50,000.

    The £2,950 is completely wrong but in overall scheme of things it's not huge and the Govt could pay it as a one-off.

    But £50,000 each is obviously a massively different order of magnitude.

    If its bad Burnham will make it worse.
    You must admit, it's a refreshingly honest slogan.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,962
    rcs1000 said:

    Omnium said:

    MikeL said:

    Re WASPI - remember the report recommended compensation of £1,000 to £2,950 each.

    But the women actually want up to £50,000 each (ie 5 years of pension).

    What are the odds that if Burnham caves and gives them the £2,950 then they'll go back to Court and say Govt has admitted liability so we should now get the full £50,000.

    The £2,950 is completely wrong but in overall scheme of things it's not huge and the Govt could pay it as a one-off.

    But £50,000 each is obviously a massively different order of magnitude.

    If its bad Burnham will make it worse.
    You must admit, it's a refreshingly honest slogan.
    A modern St Francis of Assisi.

    Where there is doubt, let me bring falsehood.
    Where there is precarity, let me bring despair.
    Where there is unease, let me bring hatred.
    Where there is stagnation, let me bring collapse.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,541

    rcs1000 said:

    Omnium said:

    MikeL said:

    Re WASPI - remember the report recommended compensation of £1,000 to £2,950 each.

    But the women actually want up to £50,000 each (ie 5 years of pension).

    What are the odds that if Burnham caves and gives them the £2,950 then they'll go back to Court and say Govt has admitted liability so we should now get the full £50,000.

    The £2,950 is completely wrong but in overall scheme of things it's not huge and the Govt could pay it as a one-off.

    But £50,000 each is obviously a massively different order of magnitude.

    If its bad Burnham will make it worse.
    You must admit, it's a refreshingly honest slogan.
    A modern St Francis of Assisi.

    Where there is doubt, let me bring falsehood.
    Where there is precarity, let me bring despair.
    Where there is unease, let me bring hatred.
    Where there is stagnation, let me bring collapse.
    He's clearly read The Upside of Down.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,541
    Dopermean said:

    A football betting post...

    Having been introduced to the Guardian's Bracketology for the World Cup, I'm struggling not to get Argentina vs Brazil in the semi-final and therefore their prices on Betfair at 11.5 seems long compared to France, Spain, Portugal and England...

    Errrr...

    Team USA?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 28,855
    "A Republican Time for Choosing: Will we remain the party of conservative principles or embrace progressivism in the guise of populism?"
    By Mike Pence. WSJ, May 31, 2026

    https://www.wsj.com/opinion/a-republican-time-for-choosing-c1f4f8a4?st=K5T3Ro&reflink=article_imessage_share
    https://x.com/Mike_Pence/status/2061186184945017277#m

    Pence served as vice president of the United States (2017-21), and is founder of "Advancing American Freedom". This article is adapted from his book “What Conservatives Believe: Rediscovering the Conservative Conscience”

    https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/242444934-what-conservatives-believe
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,230


    Oliver Kamm
    @OliverKamm

    Ludicrous, and without a shred of justification or principle. The cause of Waspi women is a prime example of a sectional interest overriding the public good.


    Quote Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal


    https://x.com/OliverKamm/status/2064802815067701757

    That's the exact opposite of what we should be spending money on.

    He must be trying to win over a few more votes of older women in Makerfield.
    He's probably saying this because the female vote in Makerfield is likely to be receptive to him, whereas Reform and Restore are likely to be doing slightly better with men.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 28,855
    edited 1:32AM

    Is Andy Burnham serious? I'm very concerned.
    Tim Montgomerie 🇬🇧
    @montie

    "...This is genuinely worrying. I've gone on the record on a number of occasions to acknowledge @AndyBurnhamGM's real bipartisan strengths. I've admired him since we 'teamed up' (@ConHome and him) to unsuccessfully oppose the disastrous Lansley NhS reforms. He was more interested in principle than party then and I still see so much of that in him today.

    But there is no money left! We have no operable military. The young need affordable housing and the private sector won't supply enough of it. We need radical welfare reform (which won't save money in the short-term). A higher tax burden will accelerate Rachel Reeves' brain drain. Sending billions to any other causes is completely unaffordable. Is Andy Burnham serious? I'm very concerned..."


    Tim Montgomerie @montie https://x.com/montie/status/2064824259235463343#m
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,472
    So Trump has pressed the Big Red Button marked "Blast Iran to the Dark Agres".

    $200 oil, here we come.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 9,359
    One for the economics nerds- there's a growing case that Labour (Rachel Reeves) are generating a lot of productivity growth.

    Currently some debate about where the growth is coming from. Is it AI? Is it fewer workers in retail/hospitality? But it looks real.

    https://www.ft.com/content/161a60ae-130d-42e1-a5c9-886d98f28d3d?syn-25a6b1a6=1

    I do worry that Andy Burnham may undo much of the economic policy which is starting to bear fruit.
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 2,297
    rkrkrk said:

    One for the economics nerds- there's a growing case that Labour (Rachel Reeves) are generating a lot of productivity growth.

    Currently some debate about where the growth is coming from. Is it AI? Is it fewer workers in retail/hospitality? But it looks real.

    https://www.ft.com/content/161a60ae-130d-42e1-a5c9-886d98f28d3d?syn-25a6b1a6=1

    I do worry that Andy Burnham may undo much of the economic policy which is starting to bear fruit.

    Rachel has been quietly and steadily been overseeing genuine green shoots...but of course it's new the right wing nedia just dont want to report!
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 2,297
    New York just witnessed the greatest miracle since the second coming of Jesus fucking Christ!
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,541
    Brixian59 said:

    New York just witnessed the greatest miracle since the second coming of Jesus fucking Christ!

    Socialist Muslim Mayor delivers NBA championship to Nicks.
    Socialist Muslim Mayor delivers Premier League to Arsenal.

    What does this mean for the World Cup?
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,323
    rkrkrk said:

    One for the economics nerds- there's a growing case that Labour (Rachel Reeves) are generating a lot of productivity growth.

    Currently some debate about where the growth is coming from. Is it AI? Is it fewer workers in retail/hospitality? But it looks real.

    https://www.ft.com/content/161a60ae-130d-42e1-a5c9-886d98f28d3d?syn-25a6b1a6=1

    I do worry that Andy Burnham may undo much of the economic policy which is starting to bear fruit.

    Immigration? From an economics POV, new entrants to the job market may not be productive in the first few years as they grapple with the learning curve. New graduates for example. So if the pool of labour is growing less quickly then the gains from the others should show through. And back to demographics again. Not only are the domestic population leaving the UK permanently (deaths greater than births) but the domestic workforce is being replaced by a foreign one that may have more skills.

    None of the above has been investigated empirically but has been evaluated heuristically.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,346
    Won’t handing over money the country can’t afford to a group of women who unless they were living on Mars should have known about the pension changes just seriously pxss off a lot of voters who are getting zip !

    I’m beginning to think Starmer should stay on as PM .
  • RattersRatters Posts: 2,032

    So Trump has pressed the Big Red Button marked "Blast Iran to the Dark Agres".

    $200 oil, here we come.

    Weirdly it's only at $94.

    I think there's been sufficient demand destruction on the back of oil price rises, notably from China, plus other supply increases, to avoid the worst of the doomsday oil price predictions.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,290
    Andy_JS said:


    Oliver Kamm
    @OliverKamm

    Ludicrous, and without a shred of justification or principle. The cause of Waspi women is a prime example of a sectional interest overriding the public good.


    Quote Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal


    https://x.com/OliverKamm/status/2064802815067701757

    That's the exact opposite of what we should be spending money on.

    He must be trying to win over a few more votes of older women in Makerfield.
    He's probably saying this because the female vote in Makerfield is likely to be receptive to him, whereas Reform and Restore are likely to be doing slightly better with men.
    That's very perceptive. And if this is a new promise, does it indicate all is not quite so rosy in the Makerfield garden for Burnham?
  • RattersRatters Posts: 2,032

    Andy_JS said:


    Oliver Kamm
    @OliverKamm

    Ludicrous, and without a shred of justification or principle. The cause of Waspi women is a prime example of a sectional interest overriding the public good.


    Quote Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal


    https://x.com/OliverKamm/status/2064802815067701757

    That's the exact opposite of what we should be spending money on.

    He must be trying to win over a few more votes of older women in Makerfield.
    He's probably saying this because the female vote in Makerfield is likely to be receptive to him, whereas Reform and Restore are likely to be doing slightly better with men.
    That's very perceptive. And if this is a new promise, does it indicate all is not quite so rosy in the Makerfield garden for Burnham?
    No it just indicates he's an idiot who caves too easily to political pressure.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 63,946
    Good morning, everyone.

    Burnham's either disingenuous or a bloody fool.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,290
    Ratters said:

    Andy_JS said:


    Oliver Kamm
    @OliverKamm

    Ludicrous, and without a shred of justification or principle. The cause of Waspi women is a prime example of a sectional interest overriding the public good.


    Quote Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher

    NEW: Andy Burnham has hinted at a new multibillion-pound spending commitment if he becomes PM, saying that more than 3.5mn women “deserve” compensation over what he regards as a pension scandal


    https://x.com/OliverKamm/status/2064802815067701757

    That's the exact opposite of what we should be spending money on.

    He must be trying to win over a few more votes of older women in Makerfield.
    He's probably saying this because the female vote in Makerfield is likely to be receptive to him, whereas Reform and Restore are likely to be doing slightly better with men.
    That's very perceptive. And if this is a new promise, does it indicate all is not quite so rosy in the Makerfield garden for Burnham?
    No it just indicates he's an idiot who caves too easily to political pressure.
    But why would there be any pressure? Why make a massive spending commitment like this when the issue is broadly seen as settled?


    *Yes I know I'm getting overexcited about a bit of a conspiracy theory - that's me.
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,323

    Good morning, everyone.

    Burnham's either disingenuous or a bloody fool.

    Odds on one or the other?
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,817
    rkrkrk said:

    One for the economics nerds- there's a growing case that Labour (Rachel Reeves) are generating a lot of productivity growth.

    Currently some debate about where the growth is coming from. Is it AI? Is it fewer workers in retail/hospitality? But it looks real.

    https://www.ft.com/content/161a60ae-130d-42e1-a5c9-886d98f28d3d?syn-25a6b1a6=1

    I do worry that Andy Burnham may undo much of the economic policy which is starting to bear fruit.

    I still cling to the slight hope that he'll lose the by-election.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    Cyclefree said:

    viewcode said:

    Is Andy Burnham serious? I'm very concerned.
    Tim Montgomerie 🇬🇧
    @montie

    "...This is genuinely worrying. I've gone on the record on a number of occasions to acknowledge @AndyBurnhamGM's real bipartisan strengths. I've admired him since we 'teamed up' (@ConHome and him) to unsuccessfully oppose the disastrous Lansley NhS reforms. He was more interested in principle than party then and I still see so much of that in him today.

    But there is no money left! We have no operable military. The young need affordable housing and the private sector won't supply enough of it. We need radical welfare reform (which won't save money in the short-term). A higher tax burden will accelerate Rachel Reeves' brain drain. Sending billions to any other causes is completely unaffordable. Is Andy Burnham serious? I'm very concerned..."


    Tim Montgomerie @montie https://x.com/montie/status/2064824259235463343#m
    It's not just that we can't afford it. It's that this group has no justified claim at all for any money.
    Yet Burnham perpetuates the myth they’ve suffered a grave injustice.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,558
    Taz said:

    Iran being bombed to force them to make a deal.

    What failed last time will work this time !

    Trump and Hesgeth are idiots.

    That's very unkind. I've known some very charming idiots.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,558

    Good morning, everyone.

    Burnham's either disingenuous or a bloody fool.

    Isn't that a false dichotomy?

    (And I've been saying this for months.)
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,558

    rkrkrk said:

    One for the economics nerds- there's a growing case that Labour (Rachel Reeves) are generating a lot of productivity growth.

    Currently some debate about where the growth is coming from. Is it AI? Is it fewer workers in retail/hospitality? But it looks real.

    https://www.ft.com/content/161a60ae-130d-42e1-a5c9-886d98f28d3d?syn-25a6b1a6=1

    I do worry that Andy Burnham may undo much of the economic policy which is starting to bear fruit.

    I still cling to the slight hope that he'll lose the by-election.
    Stop the sell out?
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,323

    rkrkrk said:

    One for the economics nerds- there's a growing case that Labour (Rachel Reeves) are generating a lot of productivity growth.

    Currently some debate about where the growth is coming from. Is it AI? Is it fewer workers in retail/hospitality? But it looks real.

    https://www.ft.com/content/161a60ae-130d-42e1-a5c9-886d98f28d3d?syn-25a6b1a6=1

    I do worry that Andy Burnham may undo much of the economic policy which is starting to bear fruit.

    I still cling to the slight hope that he'll lose the by-election.
    Since Labour have lost the last two by-elections, perhaps the third time's a charm.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,937

    Good morning, everyone.

    Burnham's either disingenuous or a bloody fool.

    Or both. In other words, Boris with a better haircut.

    Given a choice between doing the right thing that will cause someone to argue back at them, and the wrong thing that keeps everyone happy for a bit, they both tend to choose the latter.

    Some people call it "brilliant retail politics".
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 63,946

    Good morning, everyone.

    Burnham's either disingenuous or a bloody fool.

    Or both. In other words, Boris with a better haircut.

    Given a choice between doing the right thing that will cause someone to argue back at them, and the wrong thing that keeps everyone happy for a bit, they both tend to choose the latter.

    Some people call it "brilliant retail politics".
    Not just that, the short term happiness is outweighed by long term pain. It's sacrificing the national interest for the sake of a headline.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,472
    rcs1000 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    New York just witnessed the greatest miracle since the second coming of Jesus fucking Christ!

    Socialist Muslim Mayor delivers NBA championship to Nicks.
    Socialist Muslim Mayor delivers Premier League to Arsenal.

    What does this mean for the World Cup?
    America ain't winning it...
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,937

    rkrkrk said:

    One for the economics nerds- there's a growing case that Labour (Rachel Reeves) are generating a lot of productivity growth.

    Currently some debate about where the growth is coming from. Is it AI? Is it fewer workers in retail/hospitality? But it looks real.

    https://www.ft.com/content/161a60ae-130d-42e1-a5c9-886d98f28d3d?syn-25a6b1a6=1

    I do worry that Andy Burnham may undo much of the economic policy which is starting to bear fruit.

    I still cling to the slight hope that he'll lose the by-election.
    If it weren't that Reform are the only realistic alternative, that would probably be for the best.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,498
    DavidL said:

    Labour would scream blue murder if the Tories did this

    https://x.com/joe_mayes/status/2064771964540010935

    Exclusive: Rachel Reeves is planning to cut the tax burden faced by wealthy US expats, as she seeks to encourage more of them to relocate to Britain

    Maybe. But it’s a positive step for once and to be commended.
    The clown might think about cutting tax burden on UK citizens first.
This discussion has been closed.