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PB Predictions Competition 2026 – update – politicalbetting.com

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  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,829
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting development.

    "Nice Côte d’Azur Airport has adopted an immigration policy that every EU airport should follow. It allows Britons who have registered for the new biometric checks to use the e-gates, whereas most EU airports force them to queue to see an immigration officer. Better yet, when flights from the UK land, its immigration staff open more e-gates for Britons, converting EU lanes into all-passports ones."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/news/french-fixed-immigration-chaos-british

    At Tenerife South last week, we first went to a big bank of machines to register our biometric data. We then went through e-gates (very quickly).

    On the way back, we also used e-gates, but there were fewer, and for some reason they took forever to process each person. Our flight was delayed around 20 minutes waiting for a group of 6 who were stuck in the e-gate queue. Mind, it was their fault for hanging about in the lounge, rather than getting into the non-Schengen area as soon as the departure zone appeared on the screens (like the other 181 passengers had done).

    At Leeds Bradford, there is still manual passport control.
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 2,354

    To be fair at least Wes is trying to find money to pay for stuff.

    But not in away that will grow the pie. THAT is the trick. But it is alien to the Socialist mindset.

    We. Need. To. Grow. Wealth.

    Start from that, Labour. Evertything else is a fail that leads to closed hospitals.
    95% of share trading in the City is not related to productive investment - start with improving that balance.
  • edited May 21
    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 41,579
    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    A one point lead that will decay back to -10 points once Burnham has to choose between raising lots of unpopular taxes or cut welfare spending to pay for his agenda.

    I seriously don't see how this leadership change will make any difference. Treating Burnham like the chosen one and raising expectations so high and acting like he's going to wave some magic wand and suddenly the weekly shop falls by £40 and filling up the tank drops by £20.

    I really think Labour need to start lowering expectations or the polling crash when it turns out Burnham will do almost nothing different to Starmer is going to leave them in a worse place than they are now.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 41,035
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    I know people do not support the death penalty, but these arseholes should surely never again be out of prison?

    "Girl begged for help at window as officials drove away from 'beastie house', paedophile ring report says"

    https://news.sky.com/story/girl-begged-for-help-at-window-as-officials-drove-away-from-beastie-house-paedophile-ring-report-says-13545820

    And don't get me started on those who failed to intervene.

    Those charged with protecting children preferred a quiet life, and looked the other way.

    Same old, same old.
    They do appear to be quite selective. Some cases they try to take away your children for misgendering one of their classmates, but in others seem to have little trouble ignoring or batting away very legitimate concerns of abuse.
    No child has ever been taken away for misgendering a classmate. Don’t be silly.

    The Sky story is horrific. At least some justice has now arrived.
    Such stories are not confined to the UK.
    This was reported from Florida a couple of days ago.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article315443888.html
    ..The twins and their older brother Tal Alexander were convicted in March of multiple federal sex crimes, including sex trafficking. But a Miami Herald investigation found their pattern of drugging, raping, and videotaping their abuse of girls began decades earlier – when they were as young as 15 and still in high school.

    Six women told the Herald they were raped or assaulted by one or more of the brothers between 2002 and 2004, while the three brothers were attending Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School near Aventura. One spoke to police, and despite her accusations, police did not interview all the boys, and the school appears to have taken no disciplinary action.

    The women said the assaults were rampant, and occurred at teen hangouts devoid of parental supervision, at the homes of the Alexander brothers or their friends. Half of the women spoke to the FBI about what happened to them when they were younger.

    The women were students at Krop, a large Miami-Dade public high school, or nearby Miami Country Day School, a private school. One was in eighth grade when a group of boys, including Tal, “dragged” her into a bedroom, she said. She believes she was drugged.

    “It just seems like the adults completely f—--- abdicated their responsibility,” that woman told the Herald.

    In the 2003 report, which notes that Krop’s principal was informed after a school resource officer called law enforcement, police did not interview the brothers, and the State Attorney’s Office declined to press charges...
    Yes, there is a subset of men who are total shits. And if they think that there are no consequences for bad beheviour will act in ways that are almost incomprehensible.
    These are the sort of men who joined Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger. If they had ever possessed any form of humanity, it had left them long ago. I remember having this discussion with @Leon_VotedForStarmer where we agreed we had both met murderers, and they were not necessarily terrible people. A murder might be committed in a moment of madness (premeditated murder is different of course).

    But, sex criminals of this type? They are simply purely evil.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 41,579

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 41,579
    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    I know people do not support the death penalty, but these arseholes should surely never again be out of prison?

    "Girl begged for help at window as officials drove away from 'beastie house', paedophile ring report says"

    https://news.sky.com/story/girl-begged-for-help-at-window-as-officials-drove-away-from-beastie-house-paedophile-ring-report-says-13545820

    And don't get me started on those who failed to intervene.

    Those charged with protecting children preferred a quiet life, and looked the other way.

    Same old, same old.
    They do appear to be quite selective. Some cases they try to take away your children for misgendering one of their classmates, but in others seem to have little trouble ignoring or batting away very legitimate concerns of abuse.
    No child has ever been taken away for misgendering a classmate. Don’t be silly.

    The Sky story is horrific. At least some justice has now arrived.
    Such stories are not confined to the UK.
    This was reported from Florida a couple of days ago.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article315443888.html
    ..The twins and their older brother Tal Alexander were convicted in March of multiple federal sex crimes, including sex trafficking. But a Miami Herald investigation found their pattern of drugging, raping, and videotaping their abuse of girls began decades earlier – when they were as young as 15 and still in high school.

    Six women told the Herald they were raped or assaulted by one or more of the brothers between 2002 and 2004, while the three brothers were attending Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School near Aventura. One spoke to police, and despite her accusations, police did not interview all the boys, and the school appears to have taken no disciplinary action.

    The women said the assaults were rampant, and occurred at teen hangouts devoid of parental supervision, at the homes of the Alexander brothers or their friends. Half of the women spoke to the FBI about what happened to them when they were younger.

    The women were students at Krop, a large Miami-Dade public high school, or nearby Miami Country Day School, a private school. One was in eighth grade when a group of boys, including Tal, “dragged” her into a bedroom, she said. She believes she was drugged.

    “It just seems like the adults completely f—--- abdicated their responsibility,” that woman told the Herald.

    In the 2003 report, which notes that Krop’s principal was informed after a school resource officer called law enforcement, police did not interview the brothers, and the State Attorney’s Office declined to press charges...
    Yes, there is a subset of men who are total shits. And if they think that there are no consequences for bad beheviour will act in ways that are almost incomprehensible.
    These are the sort of men who joined Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger. If they had ever possessed any form of humanity, it had left them long ago. I remember having this discussion with @Leon_VotedForStarmer where we agreed we had both met murderers, and they were not necessarily terrible people. A murder might be committed in a moment of madness (premeditated murder is different of course).

    But, sex criminals of this type? They are simply purely evil.
    It's the most compelling argument for bringing back the death penalty. There's really nothing for society to gain by keeping these people alive.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 34,040

    Charging every person £100 to object is an excellent idea. Would stop all of the pointless mast objections from "local residents".

    Planners don't weigh objections. If twenty people make the same point "It will spoil our view!" that counts as a single reason not 20. I good reason carries more weight than 100 daft ones!

    Peter.
    That's correct, though number of objections may have an effect on planning committee when politics comes in.

    The best tool for writing objections is the "list of relevant planning matters", which saves writing the 90% of it that will be binned.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,556
    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    There was Google AI in 1970?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 40,613
    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    Back in 1970 it would have been some vile gassy watery stuff like Ansells bitter with an OG of about 2.5.
    I remember M&B Springfield at 35p in the Feathers Hotel Ledbury circa 1980, and they weren't cheap! Better than M&B Brew XI but still pretty nasty.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,829
    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    60p or 65p a pint in Brum in 1985. One place had a lunchtime offer of 35p a pint.

    I can't remember what the prices were in the north east when I started boozing in 1983. Presumably around 50p.
  • eekeek Posts: 34,568

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    Back in 1970 it would have been some vile gassy watery stuff like Ansells bitter with an OG of about 2.5.
    I remember M&B Springfield at 35p in the Feathers Hotel Ledbury circa 1980, and they weren't cheap! Better than M&B Brew XI but still pretty nasty.
    It also would have been 2/0 (2 shillings and 0 pence) as decimalization was in 1971
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,556
    edited May 21
    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    I know people do not support the death penalty, but these arseholes should surely never again be out of prison?

    "Girl begged for help at window as officials drove away from 'beastie house', paedophile ring report says"

    https://news.sky.com/story/girl-begged-for-help-at-window-as-officials-drove-away-from-beastie-house-paedophile-ring-report-says-13545820

    And don't get me started on those who failed to intervene.

    Those charged with protecting children preferred a quiet life, and looked the other way.

    Same old, same old.
    They do appear to be quite selective. Some cases they try to take away your children for misgendering one of their classmates, but in others seem to have little trouble ignoring or batting away very legitimate concerns of abuse.
    No child has ever been taken away for misgendering a classmate. Don’t be silly.

    The Sky story is horrific. At least some justice has now arrived.
    Such stories are not confined to the UK.
    This was reported from Florida a couple of days ago.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article315443888.html
    ..The twins and their older brother Tal Alexander were convicted in March of multiple federal sex crimes, including sex trafficking. But a Miami Herald investigation found their pattern of drugging, raping, and videotaping their abuse of girls began decades earlier – when they were as young as 15 and still in high school.

    Six women told the Herald they were raped or assaulted by one or more of the brothers between 2002 and 2004, while the three brothers were attending Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School near Aventura. One spoke to police, and despite her accusations, police did not interview all the boys, and the school appears to have taken no disciplinary action.

    The women said the assaults were rampant, and occurred at teen hangouts devoid of parental supervision, at the homes of the Alexander brothers or their friends. Half of the women spoke to the FBI about what happened to them when they were younger.

    The women were students at Krop, a large Miami-Dade public high school, or nearby Miami Country Day School, a private school. One was in eighth grade when a group of boys, including Tal, “dragged” her into a bedroom, she said. She believes she was drugged.

    “It just seems like the adults completely f—--- abdicated their responsibility,” that woman told the Herald.

    In the 2003 report, which notes that Krop’s principal was informed after a school resource officer called law enforcement, police did not interview the brothers, and the State Attorney’s Office declined to press charges...
    Yes, there is a subset of men who are total shits. And if they think that there are no consequences for bad beheviour will act in ways that are almost incomprehensible.
    These are the sort of men who joined Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger. If they had ever possessed any form of humanity, it had left them long ago. I remember having this discussion with @Leon_VotedForStarmer where we agreed we had both met murderers, and they were not necessarily terrible people. A murder might be committed in a moment of madness (premeditated murder is different of course).

    But, sex criminals of this type? They are simply purely evil.
    What do we do about the judges who let teenage rapists walk out of court? These kids learn at a very young age that there’s little actual consequence for serious sexual offences.

    https://www.dailymail.com/news/article-15836845/Teenage-gang-lured-schoolgirl-15-underpass-laughed-filmed-raping-handed-youth-rehabilitation-orders.html
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,872
    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    I started pub drinking in London in late 1971/1972. Beer was 14p. A year or two later it was still as low as 10p in working mens' clubs in the north.

    It's not a figure you forget. It's like the 6d (2.5p) bars of chocolate, eight squares, from slot machines in the 1960s.
  • eekeek Posts: 34,568
    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Shots were 3 for £1 in 1990
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,635
    Green Party candidate for Makerfield pulls out for family reasons

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2057487844000645322?s=61
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,950
    "I Was Threatened With A Machete. The Police Did Nothing

    Connor Tomlinson"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClASfi-RzoA
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,798
    edited May 21
    eek said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Shots were 3 for £1 in 1990
    Tbe price of alcoholic drinks sticks firmly in our brain as a glimpse of a better time. But has the price of a pint risen by notably more than inflation? I have no idea what a pint of milk cost in 1989. But I know that a pint of Boddies at the Comfortable Gill in Stockport was 88p.

    And I remember my shock at my first £1+ pint. Colwyn Bay Rugby Club, 1990. I was 15.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 37,208
    rcs1000 said:

    Taz said:


    ‘ 🚨 NEW: Five people have been arrested in Manchester over allegations of election fraud

    It follows an investigation into the Tameside Labour group which put forward fake independent candidates in the local elections to split votes for opposition parties ’


    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2057470914485268916?s=61

    That sounds like smart electioneering rather than fraud.
    Now you say that, wasn't there a similar case using spoiler candidates in America recently?
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,635

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    60p or 65p a pint in Brum in 1985. One place had a lunchtime offer of 35p a pint.

    I can't remember what the prices were in the north east when I started boozing in 1983. Presumably around 50p.
    When I worked at the Shirley Legion in 1988 a pint of Mild was 50p and Carling 83p.

    Can’t remember what Brew XI was
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,635
    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    I know people do not support the death penalty, but these arseholes should surely never again be out of prison?

    "Girl begged for help at window as officials drove away from 'beastie house', paedophile ring report says"

    https://news.sky.com/story/girl-begged-for-help-at-window-as-officials-drove-away-from-beastie-house-paedophile-ring-report-says-13545820

    And don't get me started on those who failed to intervene.

    Those charged with protecting children preferred a quiet life, and looked the other way.

    Same old, same old.
    They do appear to be quite selective. Some cases they try to take away your children for misgendering one of their classmates, but in others seem to have little trouble ignoring or batting away very legitimate concerns of abuse.
    No child has ever been taken away for misgendering a classmate. Don’t be silly.

    The Sky story is horrific. At least some justice has now arrived.
    Such stories are not confined to the UK.
    This was reported from Florida a couple of days ago.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article315443888.html
    ..The twins and their older brother Tal Alexander were convicted in March of multiple federal sex crimes, including sex trafficking. But a Miami Herald investigation found their pattern of drugging, raping, and videotaping their abuse of girls began decades earlier – when they were as young as 15 and still in high school.

    Six women told the Herald they were raped or assaulted by one or more of the brothers between 2002 and 2004, while the three brothers were attending Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School near Aventura. One spoke to police, and despite her accusations, police did not interview all the boys, and the school appears to have taken no disciplinary action.

    The women said the assaults were rampant, and occurred at teen hangouts devoid of parental supervision, at the homes of the Alexander brothers or their friends. Half of the women spoke to the FBI about what happened to them when they were younger.

    The women were students at Krop, a large Miami-Dade public high school, or nearby Miami Country Day School, a private school. One was in eighth grade when a group of boys, including Tal, “dragged” her into a bedroom, she said. She believes she was drugged.

    “It just seems like the adults completely f—--- abdicated their responsibility,” that woman told the Herald.

    In the 2003 report, which notes that Krop’s principal was informed after a school resource officer called law enforcement, police did not interview the brothers, and the State Attorney’s Office declined to press charges...
    Yes, there is a subset of men who are total shits. And if they think that there are no consequences for bad beheviour will act in ways that are almost incomprehensible.
    These are the sort of men who joined Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger. If they had ever possessed any form of humanity, it had left them long ago. I remember having this discussion with @Leon_VotedForStarmer where we agreed we had both met murderers, and they were not necessarily terrible people. A murder might be committed in a moment of madness (premeditated murder is different of course).

    But, sex criminals of this type? They are simply purely evil.
    What do we do about the judges who let teenage rapists walk out of court? These kids learn at a very young age that there’s little actual consequence for serious sexual offences.

    https://www.dailymail.com/news/article-15836845/Teenage-gang-lured-schoolgirl-15-underpass-laughed-filmed-raping-handed-youth-rehabilitation-orders.html
    ‘The judge also praised the boys for their conduct during the trial, saying 'I think of you as very young and none of you have been in any big trouble before.

    'You have all done very well with the restrictions put in place throughout the trial.’
  • FossFoss Posts: 2,927
    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    I know people do not support the death penalty, but these arseholes should surely never again be out of prison?

    "Girl begged for help at window as officials drove away from 'beastie house', paedophile ring report says"

    https://news.sky.com/story/girl-begged-for-help-at-window-as-officials-drove-away-from-beastie-house-paedophile-ring-report-says-13545820

    And don't get me started on those who failed to intervene.

    Those charged with protecting children preferred a quiet life, and looked the other way.

    Same old, same old.
    They do appear to be quite selective. Some cases they try to take away your children for misgendering one of their classmates, but in others seem to have little trouble ignoring or batting away very legitimate concerns of abuse.
    No child has ever been taken away for misgendering a classmate. Don’t be silly.

    The Sky story is horrific. At least some justice has now arrived.
    Such stories are not confined to the UK.
    This was reported from Florida a couple of days ago.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article315443888.html
    ..The twins and their older brother Tal Alexander were convicted in March of multiple federal sex crimes, including sex trafficking. But a Miami Herald investigation found their pattern of drugging, raping, and videotaping their abuse of girls began decades earlier – when they were as young as 15 and still in high school.

    Six women told the Herald they were raped or assaulted by one or more of the brothers between 2002 and 2004, while the three brothers were attending Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School near Aventura. One spoke to police, and despite her accusations, police did not interview all the boys, and the school appears to have taken no disciplinary action.

    The women said the assaults were rampant, and occurred at teen hangouts devoid of parental supervision, at the homes of the Alexander brothers or their friends. Half of the women spoke to the FBI about what happened to them when they were younger.

    The women were students at Krop, a large Miami-Dade public high school, or nearby Miami Country Day School, a private school. One was in eighth grade when a group of boys, including Tal, “dragged” her into a bedroom, she said. She believes she was drugged.

    “It just seems like the adults completely f—--- abdicated their responsibility,” that woman told the Herald.

    In the 2003 report, which notes that Krop’s principal was informed after a school resource officer called law enforcement, police did not interview the brothers, and the State Attorney’s Office declined to press charges...
    Yes, there is a subset of men who are total shits. And if they think that there are no consequences for bad beheviour will act in ways that are almost incomprehensible.
    These are the sort of men who joined Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger. If they had ever possessed any form of humanity, it had left them long ago. I remember having this discussion with @Leon_VotedForStarmer where we agreed we had both met murderers, and they were not necessarily terrible people. A murder might be committed in a moment of madness (premeditated murder is different of course).

    But, sex criminals of this type? They are simply purely evil.
    What do we do about the judges who let teenage rapists walk out of court? These kids learn at a very young age that there’s little actual consequence for serious sexual offences.

    https://www.dailymail.com/news/article-15836845/Teenage-gang-lured-schoolgirl-15-underpass-laughed-filmed-raping-handed-youth-rehabilitation-orders.html
    Mandatory minimums. And disciplinaries for judges who ignore them.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 48,229
    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    Scotch subsamples etc, but the suspiciously high number for the SNP seems entirely immune to the Burnham charm.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,950
    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,635

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    Back in 1970 it would have been some vile gassy watery stuff like Ansells bitter with an OG of about 2.5.
    I remember M&B Springfield at 35p in the Feathers Hotel Ledbury circa 1980, and they weren't cheap! Better than M&B Brew XI but still pretty nasty.
    I remember the old ad jingle. ‘Springfield, a wonderful brew, Springfield, just right for you’

    It was better than Brew XI but a low bar. I always preferred a pint of Directors bitter if on.
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 5,681
    algarkirk said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    I started pub drinking in London in late 1971/1972. Beer was 14p. A year or two later it was still as low as 10p in working mens' clubs in the north.

    It's not a figure you forget. It's like the 6d (2.5p) bars of chocolate, eight squares, from slot machines in the 1960s.
    IIRC, when I started my first Saturday job at the garage petrol pumps, 4* was something like 2/9 a gallon.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,170
    edited May 21
    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    60p or 65p a pint in Brum in 1985. One place had a lunchtime offer of 35p a pint.

    I can't remember what the prices were in the north east when I started boozing in 1983. Presumably around 50p.
    When I worked at the Shirley Legion in 1988 a pint of Mild was 50p and Carling 83p.

    Can’t remember what Brew XI was
    I remember being on the committee agonising over whether to put up Fosters from 69p to 72p per pint in the college bar when I was at Durham in 1987-8. We were already the most expensive student bar at the time. I can't remember what we charged for anything else now!
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,950
    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Really? Seems like yesterday to me. Most of the interesting things I remember doing happened before 2005.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,170

    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    Scotch subsamples etc, but the suspiciously high number for the SNP seems entirely immune to the Burnham charm.
    At 5%, doesn't that make the SNP at about 60% in Scotland?
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,635
    Tory Party Comms with a sense of humour

    https://x.com/cchqpress/status/2057488741686444436?s=61
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,170
    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    Back in 1970 it would have been some vile gassy watery stuff like Ansells bitter with an OG of about 2.5.
    I remember M&B Springfield at 35p in the Feathers Hotel Ledbury circa 1980, and they weren't cheap! Better than M&B Brew XI but still pretty nasty.
    I remember the old ad jingle. ‘Springfield, a wonderful brew, Springfield, just right for you’

    It was better than Brew XI but a low bar. I always preferred a pint of Directors bitter if on.
    And Directors wasn't all that good, normally anything else on was better (apart from Best, which decidedly was anything but). Seems a long time ago now!
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,548
    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Well it is half your lifetime. Rather bigger proportion for old geezers like me of course.

    But starting uni will be a whole *adult* lifetime ago for almost everybody regardless of how old they are.

    So that equalises us. We're the same on that basis.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,528
    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    Its about volume. Pubs were packed in the Seventies and Eighties with most drinking several pints several times a wek. Beer was a bit of a loss leader and the profit on the shorts etc.

    Pubs now are much quieter. Culture has changed.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,170
    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,670
    AnneJGP said:

    algarkirk said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    I started pub drinking in London in late 1971/1972. Beer was 14p. A year or two later it was still as low as 10p in working mens' clubs in the north.

    It's not a figure you forget. It's like the 6d (2.5p) bars of chocolate, eight squares, from slot machines in the 1960s.
    IIRC, when I started my first Saturday job at the garage petrol pumps, 4* was something like 2/9 a gallon.
    I started driving in about 1957. IIRC petrol was 3/9d a gallon.

    I was a student when beer went DOWN to 1/10d per pint. Although there were pubs in Sunderland which charged less.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    Chris Kennedy, the Green Party candidate in the Makerfield by-election, has pulled out for "personal and family reasons". The party will reopen nominations this evening.

    Politics UK understands Kennedy withdrew after the party was approached with a story about him
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    EXC: Harry Maguire not in the England squad. Told he's gutted and shocked @talkSPORT
    https://x.com/alex_crook/status/2057486712574452060?s=20
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,670
    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    A pint is £5 where I drink. Although I understand one of the neighbouring pubs is a bit cheaper. They don't keep the beer as well, though. IMHO!
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,170
    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,670
    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Well it is half your lifetime. Rather bigger proportion for old geezers like me of course.

    But starting uni will be a whole *adult* lifetime ago for almost everybody regardless of how old they are.

    So that equalises us. We're the same on that basis.
    I started Higher Education ...... professional exams, requiring f/t education in 1958. I actually went to uni (p/t) in about 1997.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,806

    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting development.

    "Nice Côte d’Azur Airport has adopted an immigration policy that every EU airport should follow. It allows Britons who have registered for the new biometric checks to use the e-gates, whereas most EU airports force them to queue to see an immigration officer. Better yet, when flights from the UK land, its immigration staff open more e-gates for Britons, converting EU lanes into all-passports ones."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/news/french-fixed-immigration-chaos-british

    At Tenerife South last week, we first went to a big bank of machines to register our biometric data. We then went through e-gates (very quickly).

    On the way back, we also used e-gates, but there were fewer, and for some reason they took forever to process each person. Our flight was delayed around 20 minutes waiting for a group of 6 who were stuck in the e-gate queue. Mind, it was their fault for hanging about in the lounge, rather than getting into the non-Schengen area as soon as the departure zone appeared on the screens (like the other 181 passengers had done).

    At Leeds Bradford, there is still manual passport control.
    I came through the tunnel on Tuesday and they aren’t doing it yet, either, despite my recollection that they earlier said they would be.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,806
    MaxPB said:

    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    I know people do not support the death penalty, but these arseholes should surely never again be out of prison?

    "Girl begged for help at window as officials drove away from 'beastie house', paedophile ring report says"

    https://news.sky.com/story/girl-begged-for-help-at-window-as-officials-drove-away-from-beastie-house-paedophile-ring-report-says-13545820

    And don't get me started on those who failed to intervene.

    Those charged with protecting children preferred a quiet life, and looked the other way.

    Same old, same old.
    They do appear to be quite selective. Some cases they try to take away your children for misgendering one of their classmates, but in others seem to have little trouble ignoring or batting away very legitimate concerns of abuse.
    No child has ever been taken away for misgendering a classmate. Don’t be silly.

    The Sky story is horrific. At least some justice has now arrived.
    Such stories are not confined to the UK.
    This was reported from Florida a couple of days ago.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article315443888.html
    ..The twins and their older brother Tal Alexander were convicted in March of multiple federal sex crimes, including sex trafficking. But a Miami Herald investigation found their pattern of drugging, raping, and videotaping their abuse of girls began decades earlier – when they were as young as 15 and still in high school.

    Six women told the Herald they were raped or assaulted by one or more of the brothers between 2002 and 2004, while the three brothers were attending Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School near Aventura. One spoke to police, and despite her accusations, police did not interview all the boys, and the school appears to have taken no disciplinary action.

    The women said the assaults were rampant, and occurred at teen hangouts devoid of parental supervision, at the homes of the Alexander brothers or their friends. Half of the women spoke to the FBI about what happened to them when they were younger.

    The women were students at Krop, a large Miami-Dade public high school, or nearby Miami Country Day School, a private school. One was in eighth grade when a group of boys, including Tal, “dragged” her into a bedroom, she said. She believes she was drugged.

    “It just seems like the adults completely f—--- abdicated their responsibility,” that woman told the Herald.

    In the 2003 report, which notes that Krop’s principal was informed after a school resource officer called law enforcement, police did not interview the brothers, and the State Attorney’s Office declined to press charges...
    Yes, there is a subset of men who are total shits. And if they think that there are no consequences for bad beheviour will act in ways that are almost incomprehensible.
    These are the sort of men who joined Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger. If they had ever possessed any form of humanity, it had left them long ago. I remember having this discussion with @Leon_VotedForStarmer where we agreed we had both met murderers, and they were not necessarily terrible people. A murder might be committed in a moment of madness (premeditated murder is different of course).

    But, sex criminals of this type? They are simply purely evil.
    It's the most compelling argument for bringing back the death penalty. There's really nothing for society to gain by keeping these people alive.
    Except the possibility that they might be innocent, like the guy released from his prison sentence for rape after fifteen years just this week, after another guy was proven to have done it.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 32,930
    edited May 21
    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    A lot of things we don't pay for (at least directly) which we did then.
    News. Music.
    You had to buy Loot to know where to look for a flat to rent.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,914

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    A pint is £5 where I drink. Although I understand one of the neighbouring pubs is a bit cheaper. They don't keep the beer as well, though. IMHO!
    Currently enjoying a pint of 6% Ale that cost me £2.20 in Wetherspoons. It makes my Brexit hating soul feel dirty.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,556
    edited May 21

    Chris Kennedy, the Green Party candidate in the Makerfield by-election, has pulled out for "personal and family reasons". The party will reopen nominations this evening.

    Politics UK understands Kennedy withdrew after the party was approached with a story about him

    LOL, another vetting failure.

    There’s a definite business opportunity in doing what the Americans call “Opposition Research” on candidates and prospective candidates, but for the parties themselves.

    I’ll do the Labour and Green ones, and my lefty friend can do Tories and Reform.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570
    edited May 21
    MaxPB said:

    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    A one point lead that will decay back to -10 points once Burnham has to choose between raising lots of unpopular taxes or cut welfare spending to pay for his agenda.

    I seriously don't see how this leadership change will make any difference. Treating Burnham like the chosen one and raising expectations so high and acting like he's going to wave some magic wand and suddenly the weekly shop falls by £40 and filling up the tank drops by £20.

    I really think Labour need to start lowering expectations or the polling crash when it turns out Burnham will do almost nothing different to Starmer is going to leave them in a worse place than they are now.
    I don’t agree with that.

    I fully expect Burnham not to be the Messiah, or even that competent. But the maths doesn’t point to a bigger polling crash than they are currently labouring under.

    Starmer is dismissed by the right - he’s not winning any Tory or Reform voters any time soon. And he’s loathed by the left, which is why the Green and Indy (and SNP/Plaid) votes are so high. Labour could I’m sure go lower, but they are at historical lows already.

    Burnham will be more divisive, and tribal. He’s also more charismatic. And Northern. That means that a large chunk of Greens will likely come home, a number of disillusioned floating voters who just want a clear narrative may return from the land of “undecided” and “will not vote”, and a few Northern patriots will fall in, alongside some Welsh Plaid-adjacent voters. Lib Dem types will remain unmoved or oblivious because they’re playing in a totally different electoral milieu.

    He doesn’t need to be competent or deliver. Simply by being louder and more Bolshie, and less equivocating, he’ll keep more of the base onside.

    See - as people point out on here - the Boris floor vs the Rishi floor.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    And then you look at Chinese cars...not the crap they send to the West, the stuff in China. £40-50k, f##k me, what a car you can get.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,670
    CatMan said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    A pint is £5 where I drink. Although I understand one of the neighbouring pubs is a bit cheaper. They don't keep the beer as well, though. IMHO!
    Currently enjoying a pint of 6% Ale that cost me £2.20 in Wetherspoons. It makes my Brexit hating soul feel dirty.
    There's no Wetherspoons anywhere near us. Am I sorry about that; I like the pub where I drink.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,556

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    Of course they’re better, for certain definitions of ‘better’. They have traction control, lane assist, stability systems, online connectivity, and a whacking great f****ing iPad where the buttons used to be.

    It’s a combination of increasing regulations, and a market that paid almost no attention to the sticker price of the car, only to the monthly payments - then interest rates went from 1% to 6% overnight, and those monthlies started to look absolutely terrible.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 32,930
    Burnham's agenda can be summed up in two words.
    Levelling Up.
    Lots on the right used to think that was a splendid idea.
    Maybe some still do?
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 10,245
    edited May 21
    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    1/4d for a pint of bitter when I started in 1961. 1/2d for a pint of mild.

    Actually I started drinking pints in 1959. Shhh.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570
    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    Cheap haircuts galloped away during Covid. There is no cheap haircut anymore.

    Though I noticed today in Switzerland (I’m in Nyon with work) the local barber was actually cheaper than my usual Brockley place. Nothing else is cheaper in Switzerland. Not even a litre of petrol these days.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,670
    MelonB said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    Cheap haircuts galloped away during Covid. There is no cheap haircut anymore.

    Though I noticed today in Switzerland (I’m in Nyon with work) the local barber was actually cheaper than my usual Brockley place. Nothing else is cheaper in Switzerland. Not even a litre of petrol these days.
    £10 for a haircut here. A bit more if it's 'fancy'!
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    And then you look at Chinese cars...not the crap they send to the West, the stuff in China. £40-50k, f##k me, what a car you can get.
    Son’s gap year travels recently took him to Xinjiang. In Urumqi and Kashgar he says 90%+ of cars are EV. Meanwhile we’re still mithering about whether our populace could ever embrace electric. With prices like those they will.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,806

    Chris Kennedy, the Green Party candidate in the Makerfield by-election, has pulled out for "personal and family reasons". The party will reopen nominations this evening.

    Politics UK understands Kennedy withdrew after the party was approached with a story about him

    Not just the Greens, potentially:

    Labour says there are "serious and deeply troubling allegations" relating to the social media pages of the Reform UK candidate in the Makerfield by-election.

    The campaigning organisation Searchlight claims Robert Kenyon was friends with fascist campaigner Gary Raikes on a now deleted Facebook page, a claim that is not disputed by Reform UK.

    Kenyon also had an X account terminated by X in 2024. Reform are offering no explanation as to why this happened.

    The party says their candidate's Facebook page was removed after he was elected as a local councillor earlier this month.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570

    CatMan said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    A pint is £5 where I drink. Although I understand one of the neighbouring pubs is a bit cheaper. They don't keep the beer as well, though. IMHO!
    Currently enjoying a pint of 6% Ale that cost me £2.20 in Wetherspoons. It makes my Brexit hating soul feel dirty.
    There's no Wetherspoons anywhere near us. Am I sorry about that; I like the pub where I drink.
    Wetherspoons has a very good business model. Are they the best pubs? Of course not. Are they great value for money? Absolutely. My Brexit hating soul has learned to separate the art from the artist, as we all must do with Michael Jackson.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    Sandpit said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    Of course they’re better, for certain definitions of ‘better’. They have traction control, lane assist, stability systems, online connectivity, and a whacking great f****ing iPad where the buttons used to be.

    It’s a combination of increasing regulations, and a market that paid almost no attention to the sticker price of the car, only to the monthly payments - then interest rates went from 1% to 6% overnight, and those monthlies started to look absolutely terrible.
    When I visited a few showrooms in China, I was really impressed with external styling (lots of "heavily" influenced by European cars), but the quality of interiors and some really smart thinking about some of the functionality was unexpected. The low end BYDs and MGs being set to the UK aren't a patch on them.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,714
    edited May 21
    MelonB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    A one point lead that will decay back to -10 points once Burnham has to choose between raising lots of unpopular taxes or cut welfare spending to pay for his agenda.

    I seriously don't see how this leadership change will make any difference. Treating Burnham like the chosen one and raising expectations so high and acting like he's going to wave some magic wand and suddenly the weekly shop falls by £40 and filling up the tank drops by £20.

    I really think Labour need to start lowering expectations or the polling crash when it turns out Burnham will do almost nothing different to Starmer is going to leave them in a worse place than they are now.
    I don’t agree with that.

    I fully expect Burnham not to be the Messiah, or even that competent. But the maths doesn’t point to a bigger polling crash than they are currently labouring under.

    Starmer is dismissed by the right - he’s not winning any Tory or Reform voters any time soon. And he’s loathed by the left, which is why the Green and Indy (and SNP/Plaid) votes are so high. Labour could I’m sure go lower, but they are at historical lows already.

    Burnham will be more divisive, and tribal. He’s also more charismatic. And Northern. That means that a large chunk of Greens will likely come home, a number of disillusioned floating voters who just want a clear narrative may return from the land of “undecided” and “will not vote”, and a few Northern patriots will fall in, alongside some Welsh Plaid-adjacent voters. Lib Dem types will remain unmoved or oblivious because they’re playing in a totally different electoral milieu.

    He doesn’t need to be competent or deliver. Simply by being louder and more Bolshie, and less equivocating, he’ll keep more of the base onside.

    See - as people point out on here - the Boris floor vs the Rishi floor.
    Good evening

    Having spent the afternoon in hospital as my wife had an investigatory procedure I haven't been listening to the news

    However, Burnham has the opportunity, if he wins, to change the narrative for labour and as I have said he is more likely to be Blairite and in endorsing Mahmood clearly knows immigration is a huge issue outside of London and some cities

    Starmer is either demob happy, or in denial, because he seems to be much more relaxed

    Anyway only 4 weeks to go to this huge political event

    And I am very relaxed about it
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 10,245
    edited May 21
    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    My first car was a 1948 Ford Pop, second hand at £14. LHT 218.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 21
    MelonB said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    And then you look at Chinese cars...not the crap they send to the West, the stuff in China. £40-50k, f##k me, what a car you can get.
    Son’s gap year travels recently took him to Xinjiang. In Urumqi and Kashgar he says 90%+ of cars are EV. Meanwhile we’re still mithering about whether our populace could ever embrace electric. With prices like those they will.
    Something that was quite weird to start with, no gas stations. I literally saw one gas station in Shenzhen, where Rolls and Lambos were filling up. And vast majority of the new Chinese EV cars have their equivalent of Tesla FSD, so I was riding in my driverless robotaxi thinking I was billy big bollocks and I look around and there loads of people sitting on their phones while being driving in their Xiaomi's, XPeng and Yang Wangs.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570

    Rachel Reeves’ “Great British Summer Savings” scheme is estimated to cost around £300 million, the Treasury has said.

    “This will apply to ticket prices for both adults and children, covering attractions such as fairs, theme parks, zoos, and museums. It will include children’s tickets for cinemas, concerts, soft play, and the theatre, and it will cut the cost of children’s meals in restaurants and cafes from VAT to five per cent as well.

    Final costings for all the measures will be detailed at the next budget following scoring from the Office for Budget Responsibility, the department said.

    It was Rishi's Dishes.

    What's this? Rachel's Rates?
    Splash out to help out.

    Almost uncannily timely, as gurus in the field have been calling for something like this:

    https://www.cityam.com/brits-arent-spending-enough-time-for-splash-out-to-help-out/
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,528
    IanB2 said:

    Chris Kennedy, the Green Party candidate in the Makerfield by-election, has pulled out for "personal and family reasons". The party will reopen nominations this evening.

    Politics UK understands Kennedy withdrew after the party was approached with a story about him

    Not just the Greens, potentially:

    Labour says there are "serious and deeply troubling allegations" relating to the social media pages of the Reform UK candidate in the Makerfield by-election.

    The campaigning organisation Searchlight claims Robert Kenyon was friends with fascist campaigner Gary Raikes on a now deleted Facebook page, a claim that is not disputed by Reform UK.

    Kenyon also had an X account terminated by X in 2024. Reform are offering no explanation as to why this happened.

    The party says their candidate's Facebook page was removed after he was elected as a local councillor earlier this month.
    It is pretty much priced in for Reform candidates. They do not want to stand down candidates for dodgy SM posts, after all pretty much all their existing MPs would be for the chop if they did that.

    Part of the Reform agenda is to normalise casual racism and extreme right links.
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,635
    PJH said:

    Taz said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    Back in 1970 it would have been some vile gassy watery stuff like Ansells bitter with an OG of about 2.5.
    I remember M&B Springfield at 35p in the Feathers Hotel Ledbury circa 1980, and they weren't cheap! Better than M&B Brew XI but still pretty nasty.
    I remember the old ad jingle. ‘Springfield, a wonderful brew, Springfield, just right for you’

    It was better than Brew XI but a low bar. I always preferred a pint of Directors bitter if on.
    And Directors wasn't all that good, normally anything else on was better (apart from Best, which decidedly was anything but). Seems a long time ago now!
    Early eighties Directors was fine. Certainly when Brew XI and Springfield were the alternatives.

    Sometime late eighties it just seems to change.

    Mind you by then I’d moved to Banks’s.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570

    MelonB said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    And then you look at Chinese cars...not the crap they send to the West, the stuff in China. £40-50k, f##k me, what a car you can get.
    Son’s gap year travels recently took him to Xinjiang. In Urumqi and Kashgar he says 90%+ of cars are EV. Meanwhile we’re still mithering about whether our populace could ever embrace electric. With prices like those they will.
    Something that was quite weird to start with, no gas stations. I literally saw one gas station in Shenzhen, where Rolls and Lambos were filling up. And vast majority of the new Chinese EV cars have their equivalent of Tesla FSD, so I was riding in my driverless robotaxi thinking I was billy big bollocks and I look around and there loads of people sitting on their phones while being driving in their Xiaomi's, XPeng and Yang Wangs.
    There’s a book to be written about major technological or infrastructure changes that some countries think almost impossible while others just get on with it. See high speed rail (Anglosphere vs all comers) or chip & pin and contactless payments (US vs everyone else).
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570

    MelonB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    A one point lead that will decay back to -10 points once Burnham has to choose between raising lots of unpopular taxes or cut welfare spending to pay for his agenda.

    I seriously don't see how this leadership change will make any difference. Treating Burnham like the chosen one and raising expectations so high and acting like he's going to wave some magic wand and suddenly the weekly shop falls by £40 and filling up the tank drops by £20.

    I really think Labour need to start lowering expectations or the polling crash when it turns out Burnham will do almost nothing different to Starmer is going to leave them in a worse place than they are now.
    I don’t agree with that.

    I fully expect Burnham not to be the Messiah, or even that competent. But the maths doesn’t point to a bigger polling crash than they are currently labouring under.

    Starmer is dismissed by the right - he’s not winning any Tory or Reform voters any time soon. And he’s loathed by the left, which is why the Green and Indy (and SNP/Plaid) votes are so high. Labour could I’m sure go lower, but they are at historical lows already.

    Burnham will be more divisive, and tribal. He’s also more charismatic. And Northern. That means that a large chunk of Greens will likely come home, a number of disillusioned floating voters who just want a clear narrative may return from the land of “undecided” and “will not vote”, and a few Northern patriots will fall in, alongside some Welsh Plaid-adjacent voters. Lib Dem types will remain unmoved or oblivious because they’re playing in a totally different electoral milieu.

    He doesn’t need to be competent or deliver. Simply by being louder and more Bolshie, and less equivocating, he’ll keep more of the base onside.

    See - as people point out on here - the Boris floor vs the Rishi floor.
    Good evening

    Having spent the afternoon in hospital as my wife had an investigatory procedure I haven't been listening to the news

    However, Burnham has the opportunity, if he wins, to change the narrative for labour and as I have said he is more likely to be Blairite and in endorsing Mahmood clearly knows immigration is a huge issue outside of London and some cities

    Starmer is either demob happy, or in denial, because he seems to be much more relaxed

    Anyway only 4 weeks to go to this huge political event

    And I am very relaxed about it
    You’re right to be relaxed: I don’t think policy will change significantly. It’s all vibes.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 21
    MelonB said:

    Rachel Reeves’ “Great British Summer Savings” scheme is estimated to cost around £300 million, the Treasury has said.

    “This will apply to ticket prices for both adults and children, covering attractions such as fairs, theme parks, zoos, and museums. It will include children’s tickets for cinemas, concerts, soft play, and the theatre, and it will cut the cost of children’s meals in restaurants and cafes from VAT to five per cent as well.

    Final costings for all the measures will be detailed at the next budget following scoring from the Office for Budget Responsibility, the department said.

    It was Rishi's Dishes.

    What's this? Rachel's Rates?
    Splash out to help out.

    Almost uncannily timely, as gurus in the field have been calling for something like this:

    https://www.cityam.com/brits-arent-spending-enough-time-for-splash-out-to-help-out/
    As an theme park owner interviewed on R5 this evening said, the vat cut is welcome, but its too short temporary period (EU countries have lower VAT on many aspects of hospitality) and of course if the government hadn't f##king raised NI contributions / minimum wage / business rates, I wouldn't drowning the first place. Combined with all the turn over taxes, the vastly increased energy bills*, he said would like to pass on some of the VAT saving, but will have to see.

    * forecast to raise 13% for residental users for the next cap revision.

    As I said down thread, I think rather than seeing big cuts to prices, it might well be that hospitality use it as an brief respite and use as way of making some money. As VAT is also hidden tax in the UK, compared to say US, its easy to do so.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,817
    Cookie said:

    eek said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Shots were 3 for £1 in 1990
    Tbe price of alcoholic drinks sticks firmly in our brain as a glimpse of a better time. But has the price of a pint risen by notably more than inflation? I have no idea what a pint of milk cost in 1989. But I know that a pint of Boddies at the Comfortable Gill in Stockport was 88p.

    And I remember my shock at my first £1+ pint. Colwyn Bay Rugby Club, 1990. I was 15.
    When I went to Cambridge in 1992, the pubs were at 1.50 or so a pint, and the Union offered something pretty horrible for a quid.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,534
    That Deltapoll highlights what many have been telling Labour for months.

    No point chasing Reform voters and even if Burnham wins the by-election that can’t be used to suggest he’s managed some great inroads into the Reform vote .

    Burnham is clearly liked in that area it’s more a personal vote for him .
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,570

    MelonB said:

    Rachel Reeves’ “Great British Summer Savings” scheme is estimated to cost around £300 million, the Treasury has said.

    “This will apply to ticket prices for both adults and children, covering attractions such as fairs, theme parks, zoos, and museums. It will include children’s tickets for cinemas, concerts, soft play, and the theatre, and it will cut the cost of children’s meals in restaurants and cafes from VAT to five per cent as well.

    Final costings for all the measures will be detailed at the next budget following scoring from the Office for Budget Responsibility, the department said.

    It was Rishi's Dishes.

    What's this? Rachel's Rates?
    Splash out to help out.

    Almost uncannily timely, as gurus in the field have been calling for something like this:

    https://www.cityam.com/brits-arent-spending-enough-time-for-splash-out-to-help-out/
    As an theme park owner interviewed on R5 this evening said, the vat cut is welcome, but its too short temporary period (EU countries have lower VAT on many aspects of hospitality) and of course if the government hadn't f##king raised NI / minimum wage, I wouldn't drowning the first place. Combined with all the turn over taxes, the vastly increased energy bills*, he said would like to pass on some of the VAT saving, but will have to see.

    * forecast to raise 13% for residental users for the next cap revision.
    I suppose every little helps. But they should go wilder. The author in the link says:

    Your chancellor for the day might roll out special party zones with low employment tax costs, property taxes and VAT for hospitality businesses. You might even make weddings tax-deductible, including stag and hen expenditure.

    Let’s do it
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 21
    MelonB said:

    MelonB said:

    Rachel Reeves’ “Great British Summer Savings” scheme is estimated to cost around £300 million, the Treasury has said.

    “This will apply to ticket prices for both adults and children, covering attractions such as fairs, theme parks, zoos, and museums. It will include children’s tickets for cinemas, concerts, soft play, and the theatre, and it will cut the cost of children’s meals in restaurants and cafes from VAT to five per cent as well.

    Final costings for all the measures will be detailed at the next budget following scoring from the Office for Budget Responsibility, the department said.

    It was Rishi's Dishes.

    What's this? Rachel's Rates?
    Splash out to help out.

    Almost uncannily timely, as gurus in the field have been calling for something like this:

    https://www.cityam.com/brits-arent-spending-enough-time-for-splash-out-to-help-out/
    As an theme park owner interviewed on R5 this evening said, the vat cut is welcome, but its too short temporary period (EU countries have lower VAT on many aspects of hospitality) and of course if the government hadn't f##king raised NI / minimum wage, I wouldn't drowning the first place. Combined with all the turn over taxes, the vastly increased energy bills*, he said would like to pass on some of the VAT saving, but will have to see.

    * forecast to raise 13% for residental users for the next cap revision.
    I suppose every little helps. But they should go wilder. The author in the link says:

    Your chancellor for the day might roll out special party zones with low employment tax costs, property taxes and VAT for hospitality businesses. You might even make weddings tax-deductible, including stag and hen expenditure.

    Let’s do it
    The other thing he said was seasonal business only open 6 months a year, this season is employing less people for less hours particularly outside of the summer holidays and looked into more automation.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 10,245
    MelonB said:

    MelonB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    A one point lead that will decay back to -10 points once Burnham has to choose between raising lots of unpopular taxes or cut welfare spending to pay for his agenda.

    I seriously don't see how this leadership change will make any difference. Treating Burnham like the chosen one and raising expectations so high and acting like he's going to wave some magic wand and suddenly the weekly shop falls by £40 and filling up the tank drops by £20.

    I really think Labour need to start lowering expectations or the polling crash when it turns out Burnham will do almost nothing different to Starmer is going to leave them in a worse place than they are now.
    I don’t agree with that.

    I fully expect Burnham not to be the Messiah, or even that competent. But the maths doesn’t point to a bigger polling crash than they are currently labouring under.

    Starmer is dismissed by the right - he’s not winning any Tory or Reform voters any time soon. And he’s loathed by the left, which is why the Green and Indy (and SNP/Plaid) votes are so high. Labour could I’m sure go lower, but they are at historical lows already.

    Burnham will be more divisive, and tribal. He’s also more charismatic. And Northern. That means that a large chunk of Greens will likely come home, a number of disillusioned floating voters who just want a clear narrative may return from the land of “undecided” and “will not vote”, and a few Northern patriots will fall in, alongside some Welsh Plaid-adjacent voters. Lib Dem types will remain unmoved or oblivious because they’re playing in a totally different electoral milieu.

    He doesn’t need to be competent or deliver. Simply by being louder and more Bolshie, and less equivocating, he’ll keep more of the base onside.

    See - as people point out on here - the Boris floor vs the Rishi floor.
    Good evening

    Having spent the afternoon in hospital as my wife had an investigatory procedure I haven't been listening to the news

    However, Burnham has the opportunity, if he wins, to change the narrative for labour and as I have said he is more likely to be Blairite and in endorsing Mahmood clearly knows immigration is a huge issue outside of London and some cities

    Starmer is either demob happy, or in denial, because he seems to be much more relaxed

    Anyway only 4 weeks to go to this huge political event

    And I am very relaxed about it
    You’re right to be relaxed: I don’t think policy will change significantly. It’s all vibes.
    I think Burnham will be less tribal and defensive. He will embrace others including in other parties. MPs morale will soar. The change will be obvious.

    On policy he'll take Thames Water into public ownership, drop the EU red lines, set up a Commission to investigate PR.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,932
    Barnesian said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    My first car was a 1948 Ford Pop, second hand at £14. LHT 218.
    First car I drove around fields was a Ford Pop. Nothing as flashy as yours - cost a fiver!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,932
    dixiedean said:

    Burnham's agenda can be summed up in two words.
    Levelling Up.
    Lots on the right used to think that was a splendid idea.
    Maybe some still do?

    That was in the days before we spent it all on Covid...
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,932
    IanB2 said:

    Chris Kennedy, the Green Party candidate in the Makerfield by-election, has pulled out for "personal and family reasons". The party will reopen nominations this evening.

    Politics UK understands Kennedy withdrew after the party was approached with a story about him

    Not just the Greens, potentially:

    Labour says there are "serious and deeply troubling allegations" relating to the social media pages of the Reform UK candidate in the Makerfield by-election.

    The campaigning organisation Searchlight claims Robert Kenyon was friends with fascist campaigner Gary Raikes on a now deleted Facebook page, a claim that is not disputed by Reform UK.

    Kenyon also had an X account terminated by X in 2024. Reform are offering no explanation as to why this happened.

    The party says their candidate's Facebook page was removed after he was elected as a local councillor earlier this month.
    FFS Reform. You so deserve to crash and burn.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,798
    Sandpit said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    Of course they’re better, for certain definitions of ‘better’. They have traction control, lane assist, stability systems, online connectivity, and a whacking great f****ing iPad where the buttons used to be.

    It’s a combination of increasing regulations, and a market that paid almost no attention to the sticker price of the car, only to the monthly payments - then interest rates went from 1% to 6% overnight, and those monthlies started to look absolutely terrible.
    None of these things make the car better. Most of them are incidental to being able to drive the thing. I could bake you a cake and stick an ipad on it: it wouldn't make it a better cake.

    There is nothing my 2009 Ford Focus does.not uave that I want in a car.
    Except that beepy sound on reversing. I quite like that actually.
    And a digital radio.
    But that's it.

    I test drove a Cupra Born recently. What an amazingly IRRITATING car. It came with a feature where it reflected your dashboard indicators on the windscreen in case you can't be bothered to glance down slightly and don't particularly rate the utility of visibility. Utter gash.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,798
    Sandpit said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    Of course they’re better, for certain definitions of ‘better’. They have traction control, lane assist, stability systems, online connectivity, and a whacking great f****ing iPad where the buttons used to be.

    It’s a combination of increasing regulations, and a market that paid almost no attention to the sticker price of the car, only to the monthly payments - then interest rates went from 1% to 6% overnight, and those monthlies started to look absolutely terrible.
    None of these things make the car better. Most of them are incidental to being able to drive the thing. I could bake you a cake and stick an ipad on it: it wouldn't make it a better cake.

    There is nothing my 2009 Ford Focus does.not uave that I want in a car.
    Except that beepy sound on reversing. I quite like that actually.
    And a digital radio.
    But that's it.

    I test drove a Cupra Born recently. What an amazingly IRRITATING car. It came with a feature where it reflected your dashboard indicators on the windscreen in case you can't be bothered to glance down slightly and don't particularly rate the utility of visibility. Utter gash.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 21
    England got a leak problem (again),

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/c78ke277pmdo

    No Foden, Maguire, Shaw, Tomori.

    Stones, Madueke, Colwill, Henderson in.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,548
    MelonB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Foss said:

    New DeltaPoll

    General Election Voting Intention

    Con 17%
    Lab 20%
    Lib Dem 11%
    Reform 28%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 13%
    Other 6%

    W/ Burnham

    Con 15%
    Lab 28%
    Lib Dem 8%
    Reform 27%
    SNP 5%
    PC 1%
    Green 10%
    Other 6%

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/burnham-260521

    A one point lead that will decay back to -10 points once Burnham has to choose between raising lots of unpopular taxes or cut welfare spending to pay for his agenda.

    I seriously don't see how this leadership change will make any difference. Treating Burnham like the chosen one and raising expectations so high and acting like he's going to wave some magic wand and suddenly the weekly shop falls by £40 and filling up the tank drops by £20.

    I really think Labour need to start lowering expectations or the polling crash when it turns out Burnham will do almost nothing different to Starmer is going to leave them in a worse place than they are now.
    I don’t agree with that.

    I fully expect Burnham not to be the Messiah, or even that competent. But the maths doesn’t point to a bigger polling crash than they are currently labouring under.

    Starmer is dismissed by the right - he’s not winning any Tory or Reform voters any time soon. And he’s loathed by the left, which is why the Green and Indy (and SNP/Plaid) votes are so high. Labour could I’m sure go lower, but they are at historical lows already.

    Burnham will be more divisive, and tribal. He’s also more charismatic. And Northern. That means that a large chunk of Greens will likely come home, a number of disillusioned floating voters who just want a clear narrative may return from the land of “undecided” and “will not vote”, and a few Northern patriots will fall in, alongside some Welsh Plaid-adjacent voters. Lib Dem types will remain unmoved or oblivious because they’re playing in a totally different electoral milieu.

    He doesn’t need to be competent or deliver. Simply by being louder and more Bolshie, and less equivocating, he’ll keep more of the base onside.

    See - as people point out on here - the Boris floor vs the Rishi floor.
    Yep. SKS is massively unpopular to a degree not rationally explicable by what he has or hasn't done as PM. His personal poll ratings are dire. He's a drag on the Labour vote. Therefore replacing him with a leader who connects better with the public will boost the party's electoral prospects. That is why it's happening. The notion it will depend on 'delivery' is false. That's not how politics works these days. I say this with no relish whatsoever because it's not a good thing. I'm rooting for him for the pure and simple reason that stopping Reform is imperative. It trumps everything.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 9,400
    Today I learnt that Palantir (tech company increasingly winning govt contracts) which has a pretty creepy techno-fascist vibe is run in the UK by Oswald Mosley's grandson. You couldn't make it up!
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,548

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Well it is half your lifetime. Rather bigger proportion for old geezers like me of course.

    But starting uni will be a whole *adult* lifetime ago for almost everybody regardless of how old they are.

    So that equalises us. We're the same on that basis.
    I started Higher Education ...... professional exams, requiring f/t education in 1958. I actually went to uni (p/t) in about 1997.
    Ah ok. So my formulation breaks down entirely there. You are quite a recent graduate!
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,556
    Cookie said:

    Sandpit said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    Of course they’re better, for certain definitions of ‘better’. They have traction control, lane assist, stability systems, online connectivity, and a whacking great f****ing iPad where the buttons used to be.

    It’s a combination of increasing regulations, and a market that paid almost no attention to the sticker price of the car, only to the monthly payments - then interest rates went from 1% to 6% overnight, and those monthlies started to look absolutely terrible.
    None of these things make the car better. Most of them are incidental to being able to drive the thing. I could bake you a cake and stick an ipad on it: it wouldn't make it a better cake.

    There is nothing my 2009 Ford Focus does.not uave that I want in a car.
    Except that beepy sound on reversing. I quite like that actually.
    And a digital radio.
    But that's it.

    I test drove a Cupra Born recently. What an amazingly IRRITATING car. It came with a feature where it reflected your dashboard indicators on the windscreen in case you can't be bothered to glance down slightly and don't particularly rate the utility of visibility. Utter gash.
    Yes, I contend that “Peak Car” was 2008-2013 depending on the model. Before engines were routinely turbocharged, nannying assistance controls were introduced, and screens replaced buttons and dials.

    They’re not as fuel efficient, nor as ‘safe’, but they’re generally cheap to run and reliable in use.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,653
    dixiedean said:

    Burnham's agenda can be summed up in two words.
    Levelling Up.
    Lots on the right used to think that was a splendid idea.
    Maybe some still do?

    Levelling who up to who.

    Few people want those poroer than themselves to be levelled up to.

    Lots want to be levelled up to those richer than themselves.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 23,238
    There's definitely a spring in the step of Labour today. Even Rachel seems to be basking in it. Either they're all Villa supporters or Burnham has broght the joy back to their politics. I must say I like this version of Labour much more than the rather haggard one that they've been showing for most of the last year
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,653
    IanB2 said:

    MaxPB said:

    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sean_F said:

    I know people do not support the death penalty, but these arseholes should surely never again be out of prison?

    "Girl begged for help at window as officials drove away from 'beastie house', paedophile ring report says"

    https://news.sky.com/story/girl-begged-for-help-at-window-as-officials-drove-away-from-beastie-house-paedophile-ring-report-says-13545820

    And don't get me started on those who failed to intervene.

    Those charged with protecting children preferred a quiet life, and looked the other way.

    Same old, same old.
    They do appear to be quite selective. Some cases they try to take away your children for misgendering one of their classmates, but in others seem to have little trouble ignoring or batting away very legitimate concerns of abuse.
    No child has ever been taken away for misgendering a classmate. Don’t be silly.

    The Sky story is horrific. At least some justice has now arrived.
    Such stories are not confined to the UK.
    This was reported from Florida a couple of days ago.

    https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article315443888.html
    ..The twins and their older brother Tal Alexander were convicted in March of multiple federal sex crimes, including sex trafficking. But a Miami Herald investigation found their pattern of drugging, raping, and videotaping their abuse of girls began decades earlier – when they were as young as 15 and still in high school.

    Six women told the Herald they were raped or assaulted by one or more of the brothers between 2002 and 2004, while the three brothers were attending Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School near Aventura. One spoke to police, and despite her accusations, police did not interview all the boys, and the school appears to have taken no disciplinary action.

    The women said the assaults were rampant, and occurred at teen hangouts devoid of parental supervision, at the homes of the Alexander brothers or their friends. Half of the women spoke to the FBI about what happened to them when they were younger.

    The women were students at Krop, a large Miami-Dade public high school, or nearby Miami Country Day School, a private school. One was in eighth grade when a group of boys, including Tal, “dragged” her into a bedroom, she said. She believes she was drugged.

    “It just seems like the adults completely f—--- abdicated their responsibility,” that woman told the Herald.

    In the 2003 report, which notes that Krop’s principal was informed after a school resource officer called law enforcement, police did not interview the brothers, and the State Attorney’s Office declined to press charges...
    Yes, there is a subset of men who are total shits. And if they think that there are no consequences for bad beheviour will act in ways that are almost incomprehensible.
    These are the sort of men who joined Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger. If they had ever possessed any form of humanity, it had left them long ago. I remember having this discussion with @Leon_VotedForStarmer where we agreed we had both met murderers, and they were not necessarily terrible people. A murder might be committed in a moment of madness (premeditated murder is different of course).

    But, sex criminals of this type? They are simply purely evil.
    It's the most compelling argument for bringing back the death penalty. There's really nothing for society to gain by keeping these people alive.
    Except the possibility that they might be innocent, like the guy released from his prison sentence for rape after fifteen years just this week, after another guy was proven to have done it.
    How about those that are convicted murderers, get released and then go and murder again:

    Two killers who went on to torture and set fire to a Vietnamese woman have been given whole-life jail terms.

    Quyen Ngoc Nguyen's body was discovered in a burning car in Shiney Row, near Sunderland, in August 2017.

    Stephen Unwin, 40, of Houghton-le-Spring, was convicted at Newcastle Crown Court of her rape and murder.

    William McFall, 51, who is from Northern Ireland but lived in Blackpool, was found guilty of murder but cleared of rape.

    The pair first met in jail while serving life terms for separate murders and made contact again after being released.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-43896258
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 2,571
    Sandpit said:

    Cookie said:

    Sandpit said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    Of course they’re better, for certain definitions of ‘better’. They have traction control, lane assist, stability systems, online connectivity, and a whacking great f****ing iPad where the buttons used to be.

    It’s a combination of increasing regulations, and a market that paid almost no attention to the sticker price of the car, only to the monthly payments - then interest rates went from 1% to 6% overnight, and those monthlies started to look absolutely terrible.
    None of these things make the car better. Most of them are incidental to being able to drive the thing. I could bake you a cake and stick an ipad on it: it wouldn't make it a better cake.

    There is nothing my 2009 Ford Focus does.not uave that I want in a car.
    Except that beepy sound on reversing. I quite like that actually.
    And a digital radio.
    But that's it.

    I test drove a Cupra Born recently. What an amazingly IRRITATING car. It came with a feature where it reflected your dashboard indicators on the windscreen in case you can't be bothered to glance down slightly and don't particularly rate the utility of visibility. Utter gash.
    Yes, I contend that “Peak Car” was 2008-2013 depending on the model. Before engines were routinely turbocharged, nannying assistance controls were introduced, and screens replaced buttons and dials.

    They’re not as fuel efficient, nor as ‘safe’, but they’re generally cheap to run and reliable in use.
    Having driven top end Company Cars for 25 years my last 2 derivatives of the D5 Volvo non hybrid XC 90,and latterly XC 60 for the more rural Devon Roads, have been better than any oil leaking Range Rover, boring Merc, twitchy BMW etc

    I've not had better than a top if the range 95 Saab 20 years ago.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 21
    Brixian59 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Cookie said:

    Sandpit said:

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.

    PJH said:

    PJH said:

    Andy_JS said:

    10p in 1970 is equivalent to £1.40 today according to the Bank of England's inflation calculator. So why is the average price of a pint around £6.50 today? (depending on where you are)

    That seems undervalued. I just looked up Mars Bars, they were 6d so ought to be about 40p now if that's true.
    Wondering what has got cheaper (relatively). Electronic goods, a lot of things we have today simply didn't exist.

    Cars? Austin 1100 was £800 so the equivalent of £20k but you'd get a much better spec than that now.
    New cars in past 5 years have seen a huge amount of price inflation. Its up 35% in 5 years. No doubt they are better.
    Of course they’re better, for certain definitions of ‘better’. They have traction control, lane assist, stability systems, online connectivity, and a whacking great f****ing iPad where the buttons used to be.

    It’s a combination of increasing regulations, and a market that paid almost no attention to the sticker price of the car, only to the monthly payments - then interest rates went from 1% to 6% overnight, and those monthlies started to look absolutely terrible.
    None of these things make the car better. Most of them are incidental to being able to drive the thing. I could bake you a cake and stick an ipad on it: it wouldn't make it a better cake.

    There is nothing my 2009 Ford Focus does.not uave that I want in a car.
    Except that beepy sound on reversing. I quite like that actually.
    And a digital radio.
    But that's it.

    I test drove a Cupra Born recently. What an amazingly IRRITATING car. It came with a feature where it reflected your dashboard indicators on the windscreen in case you can't be bothered to glance down slightly and don't particularly rate the utility of visibility. Utter gash.
    Yes, I contend that “Peak Car” was 2008-2013 depending on the model. Before engines were routinely turbocharged, nannying assistance controls were introduced, and screens replaced buttons and dials.

    They’re not as fuel efficient, nor as ‘safe’, but they’re generally cheap to run and reliable in use.
    Having driven top end Company Cars for 25 years my last 2 derivatives of the D5 Volvo non hybrid XC 90,and latterly XC 60 for the more rural Devon Roads, have been better than any oil leaking Range Rover, boring Merc, twitchy BMW etc

    I've not had better than a top if the range 95 Saab 20 years ago.
    Chinese owned, Geely. Zeekr is their better brand.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,653
    rcs1000 said:

    Cookie said:

    eek said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Shots were 3 for £1 in 1990
    Tbe price of alcoholic drinks sticks firmly in our brain as a glimpse of a better time. But has the price of a pint risen by notably more than inflation? I have no idea what a pint of milk cost in 1989. But I know that a pint of Boddies at the Comfortable Gill in Stockport was 88p.

    And I remember my shock at my first £1+ pint. Colwyn Bay Rugby Club, 1990. I was 15.
    When I went to Cambridge in 1992, the pubs were at 1.50 or so a pint, and the Union offered something pretty horrible for a quid.
    Around 1990 a pint would cost about £1 in Yorkshire.

    As would fish and chips.

    Which suggests that fish and chips has had higher inflation.
  • sladeslade Posts: 2,385
    When I went to Manchester Uni in 1962 a pint of Boddingtons was 1 shilling and 4 pence ( about 6p). But my annual grant was £225 of which £165 went on Hall of Residence fees.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,548
    edited May 21
    dixiedean said:

    Burnham's agenda can be summed up in two words.
    Levelling Up.
    Lots on the right used to think that was a splendid idea.
    Maybe some still do?

    That's right. That's the essence of it. I personally don't think he'll be able to do much radically different to Starmer/Reeves because he'll face the same constraints. But I am certain he's more serious about 'LU' than the person who invented the phrase and I do think he's got the persona to sell it with some credibility.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,856
    rcs1000 said:

    Cookie said:

    eek said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Shots were 3 for £1 in 1990
    Tbe price of alcoholic drinks sticks firmly in our brain as a glimpse of a better time. But has the price of a pint risen by notably more than inflation? I have no idea what a pint of milk cost in 1989. But I know that a pint of Boddies at the Comfortable Gill in Stockport was 88p.

    And I remember my shock at my first £1+ pint. Colwyn Bay Rugby Club, 1990. I was 15.
    When I went to Cambridge in 1992, the pubs were at 1.50 or so a pint, and the Union offered something pretty horrible for a quid.
    What was she/he called?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 32,930
    rcs1000 said:

    Cookie said:

    eek said:

    MaxPB said:

    Andy_JS said:

    A pint of beer cost about 10 pence in 1970 according to Google AI.

    It cost 24p or 25p in 1978 in a Social Club when I was 18 and bizarrely working behind the bar for a few months. I think shorts were more expensive, perhaps 28p or 29p
    79p for the cheapest pints in 2005 when I started uni in Cardiff, about £1 in London.

    Seems like a lifetime ago now.
    Shots were 3 for £1 in 1990
    Tbe price of alcoholic drinks sticks firmly in our brain as a glimpse of a better time. But has the price of a pint risen by notably more than inflation? I have no idea what a pint of milk cost in 1989. But I know that a pint of Boddies at the Comfortable Gill in Stockport was 88p.

    And I remember my shock at my first £1+ pint. Colwyn Bay Rugby Club, 1990. I was 15.
    When I went to Cambridge in 1992, the pubs were at 1.50 or so a pint, and the Union offered something pretty horrible for a quid.
    Time spent in the company of Cambridge University students?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 51,548

    dixiedean said:

    Burnham's agenda can be summed up in two words.
    Levelling Up.
    Lots on the right used to think that was a splendid idea.
    Maybe some still do?

    Levelling who up to who.

    Few people want those poroer than themselves to be levelled up to.

    Lots want to be levelled up to those richer than themselves.
    North to the South
    Blue collar to white collar
    State to private
    Non grads to grads
    Hands to brain
    Young to old
    Renters to owners
    Towns to cities
    Skint to loaded

    We'll see how he goes.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    edited May 21
    There was talk about if it was Orange Man that was causing World Cup hotels / tickets were not selling,

    Nobody Is Buying FIFA World Cup Tickets In Vancouver Even At A Third Of The Price
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96PnXK3s1aI
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,635
    We’ve been marched up to the top of the hill so many times.

    Is it a deal ?

    ‘ US-Iran Draft Agreement Reached Via Pakistan Mediation, Expected To Be Announced In Next Few Hours
    t.me/ilnair/645000’

    https://x.com/livesquawk/status/2057509897294483532?s=61
  • I think Burnham will be a very positive step, at least initially.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    PPS LUKE CHARTERS resigns
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 92,332
    Adam Wharton is out the England squad.
This discussion has been closed.