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The correct answer is of course octopi – politicalbetting.com

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  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,342
    Betfair's Next Prime Minister market has practically no money left in it. Almost everyone has withdrawn to avoid being caught out by breaking news.
    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/en/politics-betting-2378961
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,784
    edited April 24
    I can detect the aroma of alcohol. Own up, has someone on here been on the metholated spirit tonight?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,784

    Now Milei is sabre rattling over the Falklands.

    https://x.com/jmilei_english/status/2047781683999514681

    THE MALVINAS WERE, ARE, AND WILL ALWAYS BE ARGENTINE.
    LONG LIVE FREEDOM, DAMN IT!

    Tonight's David Reddish show was pondering whether Trump is planning to hand the Falklands to Milei to piss Starmer off for his treason or keep them for himself.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 9,233

    I can detect the aroma of alcohol. Own up, has someone on here been on the mentholated spirit tonight?

    Wot, Crème de Menthe?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,784
    edited April 24
    carnforth said:

    I can detect the aroma of alcohol. Own up, has someone on here been on the mentholated spirit tonight?

    Wot, Crème de Menthe?
    Autocorrect and PB pedantry really don't mix.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,631
    edited April 24
    .
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Just watching Jamie Oliver's "Together" made in 2022 where he cooks up a dinner for "all the lovely teachers that really went through it during the lockdown"

    Yeah, thanks for STAYING AT HOME and FUCKING UP OUR KIDS you WORKSHY TWATS. Here's a damn canape. Try not to choke. Wankers

    What annoyed me, is that in part due to union influence, the teachers in my area didn't deliver online classes and stay in touch. I can, kinda, understand a reluctance to teach in person, especially for those with health conditions. But refusing to post up a lesson and engage in online chats seemed like a dereliction of duty. The kids should have come first.
    I despise teachers, Sack them all. Along with the lawyers
    You should hear to what they say about parasols* Spectator journalists, who think everything in the world is about them.

    Educational.

    *autocorrect didn't like "arsehole"
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,364
    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader
  • isamisam Posts: 44,230
    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,784

    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader

    I'd give her the gig, certainly when PBers are touting Milliband. She appears to at least have a pair when Starmer does not.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,364
    @Sandpit ??


    Andrew Neil
    @afneil
    ·
    37m
    Hotel occupancy in Dubai down to 20%, flight traffic thru the Dubai hub down 50%. Guess there are some juicy deals on hotels and flights to be done if you’re up for it!

    https://x.com/afneil/status/2047804893289710013
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,953

    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader

    I suspect that the main numbers she will change are gilt yelds. And not in a way that is to HMG's advantage.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,861

    Now Milei is sabre rattling over the Falklands.

    https://x.com/jmilei_english/status/2047781683999514681

    THE MALVINAS WERE, ARE, AND WILL ALWAYS BE ARGENTINE.
    LONG LIVE FREEDOM, DAMN IT!

    Tonight's David Reddish show was pondering whether Trump is planning to hand the Falklands to Milei to piss Starmer off for his treason or keep them for himself.
    He can’t do as the UK would veto it on the UN Security Council and he already has one unpopular war on his hands
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,989

    @Sandpit ??


    Andrew Neil
    @afneil
    ·
    37m
    Hotel occupancy in Dubai down to 20%, flight traffic thru the Dubai hub down 50%. Guess there are some juicy deals on hotels and flights to be done if you’re up for it!

    https://x.com/afneil/status/2047804893289710013

    I was just looking at going to Berlin in June (ultimately decided against it), return flight via Dubai is 142,000 JPY vs 218,000 JPY for the next cheapest thing (via Istanbul).
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,861

    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader

    Yes they might even fall behind the LDs
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 9,233
    edited April 24

    @Sandpit ??


    Andrew Neil
    @afneil
    ·
    37m
    Hotel occupancy in Dubai down to 20%, flight traffic thru the Dubai hub down 50%. Guess there are some juicy deals on hotels and flights to be done if you’re up for it!

    https://x.com/afneil/status/2047804893289710013

    I was just looking at going to Berlin in June (ultimately decided against it), return flight via Dubai is 142,000 JPY vs 218,000 JPY for the next cheapest thing (via Istanbul).
    For the routes I've been looking at (London to Taipei and similar) Etihad is getting pretty cheap (almost down to China Eastern prices) but Emirates is holding up better. £530 return for dates in May.
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,138
    London best city in the world?
    I've just been to the most touristy pub in the most touristy part of London, gone upstairs to an under promoted event and seen 5 bands bidding for the newcomer stage at IOW festival for £13.
    All good, 3 very good.
    Finals at bush hall in May if you can find a listing.

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,784
    HYUFD said:

    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader

    Yes they might even fall behind the LDs
    I don't think so. Starmer is shipping votes to the Greens despite Zack being as mad as a box of frogs. Rayner isn't quite so Red Tory as Starmer so I see an opportunity.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,784
    HYUFD said:

    Now Milei is sabre rattling over the Falklands.

    https://x.com/jmilei_english/status/2047781683999514681

    THE MALVINAS WERE, ARE, AND WILL ALWAYS BE ARGENTINE.
    LONG LIVE FREEDOM, DAMN IT!

    Tonight's David Reddish show was pondering whether Trump is planning to hand the Falklands to Milei to piss Starmer off for his treason or keep them for himself.
    He can’t do as the UK would veto it on the UN Security Council and he already has one unpopular war on his hands
    You think Donald Trump gives two hoots about the UN Security Council?

    He's already got boots on the.ground in Fairford, Mildenhall and Lakenheath if he wants to punish Starmer treason.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,953

    isam said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    I am sure we have done this. It is a particular favourite of ours to call racist rapists out.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpqxrzr29pxo

    Absolutely appalling. I would note that:

    At the time of the rape he was homeless, having been discharged from psychiatric care three days earlier without a support package after it was decided he was no longer psychotic.

    If he weren't white, I am certain the mental health card would have been played.
    I find your final sentence incredibly disconcerting. A rapist bastard is a rapist bastard whatever their colour. No excuses and no pulling the "he got it tougher because he was white" please.
    No, I couldn't give a toss about the fate of the junkie. But you only have to look at Nottingham to see how we treat perpetrators who are not white.
    I don't believe I have defended AR or the **** in Nottingham because they are not white.

    I am fascinated that over the last few days some posters have been keen to post stories about disgusting immigrant criminality and getting substantial likes for doing so, but this one? Not so much.
    Unless you are a complete moron, I find it hard to see the fascination. Rape is a disgusting crime that should be severely punished no matter the perpetrator. But if the perpetrator(s) are people who have entered the country illegally on a small boat, that makes it more the establishment's fault than when the rapist is someone who was born here. When people, including me obviously, post these stories of illegal immigrants raping women, it isn't because we think it is bad when they do it but ok when others do, it is to illustrate that letting these people in and putting them up in little villages is madness, and the government should be doing more to stop it. It is the establishment that is being criticised, that rape is an horrific crime goes without saying

    People, including myself, also post when a man pretending to be a woman sexually assaults a real woman in prison. We don't post when men sexually assault other men in men's prisons, nor when women sexually assault women in women's prisons. That is not to say those assaults aren't bad, although the man pretending to be a woman's assault on woman is worse as well as being the establishment's fault
    The rapists in Brighton that were widely posted about on here this week are disgusting individuals for their crimes. I don't believe them being immigrants or Muslims has anything to do their criminality. Likewise the guy who raped the Sikh girl because he thought she was Muslim did not do it because he was white but because he's a nasty bastard.
    You have completely missed the point

    The rape in Brighton would not have happened if the small boats hadn't arrived. The rape of the Sikh woman would have. That is the reason people mention the former and not the latter. Thousands of crimes a year happen that we don't feel the need to mention on here, because there isn't a government policy angle. When men who arrive on small boats assault women, it is pointed out because we don't want men arriving here on small boats and being put up at the taxpayers expense in places where the locals don't want them, not because they are doing things that we otherwise think ok but decide are bad when they do them
    Your argument implies that there is absolutely nothing government could have done that would have led to the latter rape not occurring. Do you really believe that there is no action government can take to reduce rapes by the non-immigrant population?

    That’s clearly nonsense. You’re cynically using rape as a reason to oppose immigration. If you cared about rape, there are dozens of policies that government could enact to reduce rapes and/or to find and prosecute those who commit rape that would be far more effective than banning immigration.
    Two things

    1) What are these policies, and why are we not enacting them?

    2) These things are not mutually exclusive. If one of your policies is some variant on "lock up dangerous phycos more effectively", I'm all for it. There's nothing stopping you doing that whilst also sending "asylum seeking" young men to a holding camp on the Pitcairn Islands until they stop turning up (other inhospitable destinations are available).

    As an aside, a good part of a lot of our problems in the these sorts of area stem from being far too soft on complete scumbags. Take that bloke who ran over Cookie's kid's headteacher. Complete pondlife - and I would be amazed if he was not already "known to the police" for something or other. If we actually locked up people involved in petty crime, drugs offences etc for long periods of time there would be far less crime, for the simple reason that they would be unable to commit it whilst incarcerated.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,853
    The wisdom of Melania:

    https://x.com/melaniatrump/status/2047799687856447985

    "We are not here to prepare our children for yesterday's world.
    Be purposeful with your objectives and remember that Al accelerates everything"
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,861

    HYUFD said:

    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader

    Yes they might even fall behind the LDs
    I don't think so. Starmer is shipping votes to the Greens despite Zack being as mad as a box of frogs. Rayner isn't quite so Red Tory as Starmer so I see an opportunity.
    Rayner would leak more votes to the LDs and Conservatives than she would gain from the Greens and Reform
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,861
    edited April 25

    HYUFD said:

    Now Milei is sabre rattling over the Falklands.

    https://x.com/jmilei_english/status/2047781683999514681

    THE MALVINAS WERE, ARE, AND WILL ALWAYS BE ARGENTINE.
    LONG LIVE FREEDOM, DAMN IT!

    Tonight's David Reddish show was pondering whether Trump is planning to hand the Falklands to Milei to piss Starmer off for his treason or keep them for himself.
    He can’t do as the UK would veto it on the UN Security Council and he already has one unpopular war on his hands
    You think Donald Trump gives two hoots about the UN Security Council?

    He's already got boots on the.ground in Fairford, Mildenhall and Lakenheath if he wants to punish Starmer treason.
    He has far fewer US troops in the UK than there are British troops in the UK
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,490

    The wisdom of Melania:

    https://x.com/melaniatrump/status/2047799687856447985

    "We are not here to prepare our children for yesterday's world.
    Be purposeful with your objectives and remember that Al accelerates everything"

    Let me just write that down so I don't forget it.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,490
    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Deuteronomy 21:10, Exodus 21:7, Judges 19
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,342

    @Sandpit ??


    Andrew Neil
    @afneil
    ·
    37m
    Hotel occupancy in Dubai down to 20%, flight traffic thru the Dubai hub down 50%. Guess there are some juicy deals on hotels and flights to be done if you’re up for it!

    https://x.com/afneil/status/2047804893289710013

    The Financial Times reports:-

    London’s luxury hoteliers lose sleep over fall in Middle East visitors
    Expensive rooms go unsold as Iran conflict disrupts Gulf travel and dents demand from big-spending guests

    https://x.com/FT/status/2047735630361141503

    Guess there are some juicy deals on hotels and, erm, bus rides to be done if you're up for it.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,857
    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 63,928
    Good morning, everyone.

    This is a genuine question a daft jester-type character asked my party (I'm the DM) in our DnD campaign. He and his turtle friend had disagreed over whether it was octopi, octopodes, and octopuses. Interestingly, only the middle one (the right[est?] answer) is flagged by autocorrect here.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 56,838
    edited April 25

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Just watching Jamie Oliver's "Together" made in 2022 where he cooks up a dinner for "all the lovely teachers that really went through it during the lockdown"

    Yeah, thanks for STAYING AT HOME and FUCKING UP OUR KIDS you WORKSHY TWATS. Here's a damn canape. Try not to choke. Wankers

    You dormant fuck. The schools were open.
    Hm. Not entirely. There was one period where schools were closed for, what, three months in summer 2020, and anotger period in winter 2021 for which they were closed for about two, two and a half months. Sone teachera did heroically but the unions were being incredibly difficult.

    It was, without doubt, the most miserable period of my life.
    My son's school stayed open for essential workers kids throughout the pandemic. As far as I can tell that was the norm. Teachers taught from their classrooms either with a handful of kids or direct to streaming to students at home. My son did not miss a single day's school throughout the whole of lockdown.
    Well, yet again YOU had a really lovely lockdown and everything was perfect as you keep telling us. Others, not so much
    One of the most enjoyable things was watching you go to pieces on a daily basis thinking the end of the world was coming. You are in no position to criticise anyone now given your level of scaremongering during the pandemic.
    I apologise for having way more foresight and 10 times the ability to extrapolate, than anyone else on this forum

    Incidentally, talking about foresight, has anyone else noticed the weird DRYNESS? Apparently London is experiencing its driest April possibly ever, it's certainly in the top five and the forecast says it might win gold

    Weird

    My EXTRAPOLATIVE ABILITY which is UNEXAMPLED ON THIS FORUM says this is..... weird
    I remember reading a couple of years ago that our weather was going to replicate Alaska's and become continually wet.
    Just more variable, with wetter winters. Certainly Jan and Feb were very wet in these parts.

    Climate change is getting too real to ignore except for the willfully blind.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 56,838
    It is stories like this that give me concern about the Euthanasia bill:

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2026/apr/24/mother-ends-life-at-swiss-clinic-four-years-after-sons-death?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

    I do not doubt that she had major mental health issues after her bereavement, but is this what we want?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 64,490
    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Ah yes, but that was before he discovered religion.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,428

    HYUFD said:

    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader

    Yes they might even fall behind the LDs
    I don't think so. Starmer is shipping votes to the Greens despite Zack being as mad as a box of frogs. Rayner isn't quite so Red Tory as Starmer so I see an opportunity.
    Formar Labour Gen Sec Jenny Formby has just joined the Green Party
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 28,768

    FTP

    maxh said:

    maxh said:

    Nigelb said:

    maxh said:

    Dopermean said:

    FF43 said:

    murali_s said:

    Why are we still discussing Brexit? Brexit was sub optimal for the country. That much was obvious then and it is of course obvious now.

    It’s done. Let’s move on (all the poorer). Until a party or leader brings up rejoining the EU, what is the point discussing this?

    I don't think we discuss it enough (!) Given we are not going back in any time soon, and most people think it was a mistake, we should be discussing how to make the best of a bad job and what compromises we can accept to make it sort of work.

    Having said that, right now we really really should be discussing the oil -, gas -, plastics -, fertiliser - and in some cases food - free cliff we will be falling over in a few weeks time.

    There's a strange silence
    Partly people don't believe it will happen (wrongly I believe) and partly they really still don't get the impact. They have had years of being told that oil and gas are the ultimate evil and are having serious problems coming round to the idea that so much of modern life relies upon them. When your own Government persists in trying to limit or end the home grown supply of oil and gas, it is no susprise that peple find it difficult to understand just how important it is.
    Ed Miliband is Crap is Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero.
    If the UK wasn't putting in increasing renewable generation then we'd be more reliant on oil and gas and even more in the shit.

    Jackdaw and Rosebank were halted by a Scottish Judge not Miliband, https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3e1pw7npklo
    As EM said when interviewed, they have to get their EIA right to satisfy the court, otherwise they'll be stopped in court again.

    Even the most accurate on what a disaster Trump2 would be, didn't have his Iran fiasco on their dance card.
    UK having more renewables, EVs and less requirement for fossil fuel means we can use oil and gas for other purposes.

    You can criticise some specifics, CCS, floating wind, but the direction is correct.
    (Snip)

    Banning UK drilling and trying to drive out the oil companies has not meant increased UK investment in renewables. One is not dependent on the other.

    (Snip)
    Is this assertion based on knowledge of the figures Richard? The figures I have heard is that solar power has increased 30% over the past year. (Source: https://energyadvicehub.org/uk-solar-generation-smashes-annual-records-as-capacity-and-sunshine-soar/)

    I don't know how you'd test the counterfactual, nor refute it as you are doing. But happy to stand corrected as I'm sure you know more.

    There's no connection between the two things.
    The market for oil and gas is global; our renewables policies affect no one very much apart from us.

    The largest effect from discouraging UK oil and gas production is to our balance of payments and exchequer.

    maxh said:

    Dopermean said:

    FF43 said:

    murali_s said:

    Why are we still discussing Brexit? Brexit was sub optimal for the country. That much was obvious then and it is of course obvious now.

    It’s done. Let’s move on (all the poorer). Until a party or leader brings up rejoining the EU, what is the point discussing this?

    I don't think we discuss it enough (!) Given we are not going back in any time soon, and most people think it was a mistake, we should be discussing how to make the best of a bad job and what compromises we can accept to make it sort of work.

    Having said that, right now we really really should be discussing the oil -, gas -, plastics -, fertiliser - and in some cases food - free cliff we will be falling over in a few weeks time.

    There's a strange silence
    Partly people don't believe it will happen (wrongly I believe) and partly they really still don't get the impact. They have had years of being told that oil and gas are the ultimate evil and are having serious problems coming round to the idea that so much of modern life relies upon them. When your own Government persists in trying to limit or end the home grown supply of oil and gas, it is no susprise that peple find it difficult to understand just how important it is.
    Ed Miliband is Crap is Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero.
    If the UK wasn't putting in increasing renewable generation then we'd be more reliant on oil and gas and even more in the shit.

    Jackdaw and Rosebank were halted by a Scottish Judge not Miliband, https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3e1pw7npklo
    As EM said when interviewed, they have to get their EIA right to satisfy the court, otherwise they'll be stopped in court again.

    Even the most accurate on what a disaster Trump2 would be, didn't have his Iran fiasco on their dance card.
    UK having more renewables, EVs and less requirement for fossil fuel means we can use oil and gas for other purposes.

    You can criticise some specifics, CCS, floating wind, but the direction is correct.
    (Snip)

    Banning UK drilling and trying to drive out the oil companies has not meant increased UK investment in renewables. One is not dependent on the other.

    (Snip)
    Is this assertion based on knowledge of the figures Richard? The figures I have heard is that solar power has increased 30% over the past year. (Source: https://energyadvicehub.org/uk-solar-generation-smashes-annual-records-as-capacity-and-sunshine-soar/)

    I don't know how you'd test the counterfactual, nor refute it as you are doing. But happy to stand corrected as I'm sure you know more.

    Solar power is completely independent of oil - we have never generated significant electricity from oil.

    Solar has soared in installation, because it is cheaper than gas and getting cheaper each year. North Sea production doesn’t really affect the world market for gas, so the price is pretty much independent of that.

    So solar would be smashing it in either case.
    Thanks both.

    Agreed on the oil; I was lazily assuming this was a discussion mainly about gas given we are currently quite reliant on it for electricity but looking back at the comment Richard replied to I see oil and gas were conflated. I entirely agree that oil and renewables are not really related.

    On the gas point, I agree with you both in a perfect market. But I wonder about the practical implications in the market as it is. If gas becomes relatively costlier/harder to extract in the UK, to what extent are companies who would like to extract it choosing to reduce their presence in the UK electricity market overall, and to what extent are they transferring investment decisions into renewables? And what would this trend look like in the longer term?

    I genuinely don't know, but interested if others have figures on this.
    The companies selling it, sell it on the world market, at the world market price.

    They have no generating capacity themselves.

    The generating companies buy gas at the world market price.

    The U.K. production, in any event, is not big enough to shift world prices (the U.K. benefit is taxes and jobs)

    So U.K. production of gas would have next to no effect on the decision of the generating companies to buy more solar.
    I'm with you on all of that.

    What about investment in future generation though?

    I can accept that the practical.answer may be that they just invest elsewhere in the world. But I am interested in whether we have figures to say that this is actually happening, rather than that the generating companies are switching investments towards renewable capacity in the UK.

    I take the point also about solar being so cheap, but then prima facie does that not making switching investments rather than removing them from UK more attractive?

    Apologies if I'm being dense!
    The oil and gas producing companies are investing in oil and gas elsewhere. Norway for example. Or in shutting down the North Sea - lots of work in that. For a while.

    Solar, in the U.K., is limited by planning. There is more money chasing projects that can happen.

    Perhaps the bit you are missing is that oil (in particular) is required to make a lot of things. This is the long tail of net zero.
    One of the most ghastly things about it (against stiff competition) is that the Norwegians are just sticking their own straw down there, sucking up what we're leaving, and selling it back to us. It's being perpetrated by people who hate this country, and supported by people who are mentally ill.
    Norway hates the UK? I mean they sent a bit of a crappy Christmas tree that time..
    The Norwegian King is about 90th in line to the British throne. Some judicious accidents and we could unite the two countries under one monarch.
    89 unrelated accidents. Plausible.
    Perhaps they could stand by Russian windows.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,488
    IanB2 said:

    HYUFD said:

    https://x.com/BBCNewsnight/status/2047807378825814401

    BBC Newsnight
    @BBCNewsnight
    “Angela Rayner... is the one real star.”

    Telegraph columnist, Tim Stanley, says the former Deputy Prime Minister “would change their numbers overnight” if she became Labour leader

    Yes they might even fall behind the LDs
    I don't think so. Starmer is shipping votes to the Greens despite Zack being as mad as a box of frogs. Rayner isn't quite so Red Tory as Starmer so I see an opportunity.
    Formar Labour Gen Sec Jenny Formby has just joined the Green Party
    So it’s not all bad news for Starmer then?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 79,488
    viewcode said:

    FTP

    maxh said:

    maxh said:

    Nigelb said:

    maxh said:

    Dopermean said:

    FF43 said:

    murali_s said:

    Why are we still discussing Brexit? Brexit was sub optimal for the country. That much was obvious then and it is of course obvious now.

    It’s done. Let’s move on (all the poorer). Until a party or leader brings up rejoining the EU, what is the point discussing this?

    I don't think we discuss it enough (!) Given we are not going back in any time soon, and most people think it was a mistake, we should be discussing how to make the best of a bad job and what compromises we can accept to make it sort of work.

    Having said that, right now we really really should be discussing the oil -, gas -, plastics -, fertiliser - and in some cases food - free cliff we will be falling over in a few weeks time.

    There's a strange silence
    Partly people don't believe it will happen (wrongly I believe) and partly they really still don't get the impact. They have had years of being told that oil and gas are the ultimate evil and are having serious problems coming round to the idea that so much of modern life relies upon them. When your own Government persists in trying to limit or end the home grown supply of oil and gas, it is no susprise that peple find it difficult to understand just how important it is.
    Ed Miliband is Crap is Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero.
    If the UK wasn't putting in increasing renewable generation then we'd be more reliant on oil and gas and even more in the shit.

    Jackdaw and Rosebank were halted by a Scottish Judge not Miliband, https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3e1pw7npklo
    As EM said when interviewed, they have to get their EIA right to satisfy the court, otherwise they'll be stopped in court again.

    Even the most accurate on what a disaster Trump2 would be, didn't have his Iran fiasco on their dance card.
    UK having more renewables, EVs and less requirement for fossil fuel means we can use oil and gas for other purposes.

    You can criticise some specifics, CCS, floating wind, but the direction is correct.
    (Snip)

    Banning UK drilling and trying to drive out the oil companies has not meant increased UK investment in renewables. One is not dependent on the other.

    (Snip)
    Is this assertion based on knowledge of the figures Richard? The figures I have heard is that solar power has increased 30% over the past year. (Source: https://energyadvicehub.org/uk-solar-generation-smashes-annual-records-as-capacity-and-sunshine-soar/)

    I don't know how you'd test the counterfactual, nor refute it as you are doing. But happy to stand corrected as I'm sure you know more.

    There's no connection between the two things.
    The market for oil and gas is global; our renewables policies affect no one very much apart from us.

    The largest effect from discouraging UK oil and gas production is to our balance of payments and exchequer.

    maxh said:

    Dopermean said:

    FF43 said:

    murali_s said:

    Why are we still discussing Brexit? Brexit was sub optimal for the country. That much was obvious then and it is of course obvious now.

    It’s done. Let’s move on (all the poorer). Until a party or leader brings up rejoining the EU, what is the point discussing this?

    I don't think we discuss it enough (!) Given we are not going back in any time soon, and most people think it was a mistake, we should be discussing how to make the best of a bad job and what compromises we can accept to make it sort of work.

    Having said that, right now we really really should be discussing the oil -, gas -, plastics -, fertiliser - and in some cases food - free cliff we will be falling over in a few weeks time.

    There's a strange silence
    Partly people don't believe it will happen (wrongly I believe) and partly they really still don't get the impact. They have had years of being told that oil and gas are the ultimate evil and are having serious problems coming round to the idea that so much of modern life relies upon them. When your own Government persists in trying to limit or end the home grown supply of oil and gas, it is no susprise that peple find it difficult to understand just how important it is.
    Ed Miliband is Crap is Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero.
    If the UK wasn't putting in increasing renewable generation then we'd be more reliant on oil and gas and even more in the shit.

    Jackdaw and Rosebank were halted by a Scottish Judge not Miliband, https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3e1pw7npklo
    As EM said when interviewed, they have to get their EIA right to satisfy the court, otherwise they'll be stopped in court again.

    Even the most accurate on what a disaster Trump2 would be, didn't have his Iran fiasco on their dance card.
    UK having more renewables, EVs and less requirement for fossil fuel means we can use oil and gas for other purposes.

    You can criticise some specifics, CCS, floating wind, but the direction is correct.
    (Snip)

    Banning UK drilling and trying to drive out the oil companies has not meant increased UK investment in renewables. One is not dependent on the other.

    (Snip)
    Is this assertion based on knowledge of the figures Richard? The figures I have heard is that solar power has increased 30% over the past year. (Source: https://energyadvicehub.org/uk-solar-generation-smashes-annual-records-as-capacity-and-sunshine-soar/)

    I don't know how you'd test the counterfactual, nor refute it as you are doing. But happy to stand corrected as I'm sure you know more.

    Solar power is completely independent of oil - we have never generated significant electricity from oil.

    Solar has soared in installation, because it is cheaper than gas and getting cheaper each year. North Sea production doesn’t really affect the world market for gas, so the price is pretty much independent of that.

    So solar would be smashing it in either case.
    Thanks both.

    Agreed on the oil; I was lazily assuming this was a discussion mainly about gas given we are currently quite reliant on it for electricity but looking back at the comment Richard replied to I see oil and gas were conflated. I entirely agree that oil and renewables are not really related.

    On the gas point, I agree with you both in a perfect market. But I wonder about the practical implications in the market as it is. If gas becomes relatively costlier/harder to extract in the UK, to what extent are companies who would like to extract it choosing to reduce their presence in the UK electricity market overall, and to what extent are they transferring investment decisions into renewables? And what would this trend look like in the longer term?

    I genuinely don't know, but interested if others have figures on this.
    The companies selling it, sell it on the world market, at the world market price.

    They have no generating capacity themselves.

    The generating companies buy gas at the world market price.

    The U.K. production, in any event, is not big enough to shift world prices (the U.K. benefit is taxes and jobs)

    So U.K. production of gas would have next to no effect on the decision of the generating companies to buy more solar.
    I'm with you on all of that.

    What about investment in future generation though?

    I can accept that the practical.answer may be that they just invest elsewhere in the world. But I am interested in whether we have figures to say that this is actually happening, rather than that the generating companies are switching investments towards renewable capacity in the UK.

    I take the point also about solar being so cheap, but then prima facie does that not making switching investments rather than removing them from UK more attractive?

    Apologies if I'm being dense!
    The oil and gas producing companies are investing in oil and gas elsewhere. Norway for example. Or in shutting down the North Sea - lots of work in that. For a while.

    Solar, in the U.K., is limited by planning. There is more money chasing projects that can happen.

    Perhaps the bit you are missing is that oil (in particular) is required to make a lot of things. This is the long tail of net zero.
    One of the most ghastly things about it (against stiff competition) is that the Norwegians are just sticking their own straw down there, sucking up what we're leaving, and selling it back to us. It's being perpetrated by people who hate this country, and supported by people who are mentally ill.
    Norway hates the UK? I mean they sent a bit of a crappy Christmas tree that time..
    The Norwegian King is about 90th in line to the British throne. Some judicious accidents and we could unite the two countries under one monarch.
    89 unrelated accidents. Plausible.
    Perhaps they could stand by Russian windows.
    Just tell ICE that their dicks must be even smaller than Trump’s.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,463
    Dopermean said:

    London best city in the world?
    I've just been to the most touristy pub in the most touristy part of London, gone upstairs to an under promoted event and seen 5 bands bidding for the newcomer stage at IOW festival for £13.
    All good, 3 very good.
    Finals at bush hall in May if you can find a listing.

    This is what I love about London. There is just always so much going on. It's full of grafters and strivers, trying to make it, coming up with things, putting on a show. There's an irrepressible energy to the place. Sometimes you just stumble on something. It's never boring.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,631
    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Has supported Corbyn and the Greens, too.
    And is now MAGA.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 20,949
    Nigelb said:

    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Has supported Corbyn and the Greens, too.
    And is now MAGA.
    I don’t think Ed Miliband is now MAGA…
  • isamisam Posts: 44,230
    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Brent and Finchy


  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 63,928
    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Brent and Finchy


    Pretty sure the punishment for posting that photo is still exile to ConHome.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,363
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Ah yes, but that was before he discovered religion.
    After his second experiment with Ayahuasca?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892
    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 4,469
    rcs1000 said:

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    Deuteronomy 21:10, Exodus 21:7, Judges 19
    Anything that involves smiting of sleazy twats would be appropriate i think.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 66,577

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,861

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    UK house prices are also slightly above the US median
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 4,469
    rcs1000 said:

    The wisdom of Melania:

    https://x.com/melaniatrump/status/2047799687856447985

    "We are not here to prepare our children for yesterday's world.
    Be purposeful with your objectives and remember that Al accelerates everything"

    Let me just write that down so I don't forget it.
    The empty headed harlot strikes again. Strangely she's not the most repellent member of the Trump clan.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 56,838
    MelonB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Ah yes, but that was before he discovered religion.
    After his second experiment with Ayahuasca?
    A second example to consider how it can scramble your brain and turn you into a frothing right wing grifter.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323
    edited April 25
    So according to that table we have a lower GDP per capita than every US state .

    Does seem hard to believe , it also on the other hand could highlight that you can’t measure quality of life simply by GDP.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,193

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 63,928
    nico67 said:

    So according to that table we have a lower GDP per capita than every US state .

    Does seem hard to believe , it also on the other hand could highlight that you can’t measure quality of life simply by GDP.

    In the wake of the failed Hungarian uprising against the Soviets in the 1950s, GDP improved. And life expectancy declined.

    I just watched a video on The City, the other day, which indicates the first cities initially saw things get worse for most people, despite improvement in agriculture that enabled settlements to increase in size.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=872JcpP3FEM

    Money does matter. But it's not the only thing.

    Also figures can be misleading, as China often seems to have lower debt than it does because a lot of it is held on a provincial rather than national level.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,449

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    An independence referendum in England?

    OK by me
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892
    edited April 25

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    How well I remember the EU saying that the UK was not allowed to have a referendum on membership.

    Currently the rUK has the only say so I’m not sure why you’re pissed off.
  • Rayner has done a deal with Burnham IMV.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323
    This is a particularly sad case .

    Was there no way back for this poor lady to find some solace and not want to end her life? . She was physically fit and although I do support assisted dying I couldn’t support it in this instance .

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2026/apr/24/mother-ends-life-at-swiss-clinic-four-years-after-sons-death
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,133
    Cicero said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The wisdom of Melania:

    https://x.com/melaniatrump/status/2047799687856447985

    "We are not here to prepare our children for yesterday's world.
    Be purposeful with your objectives and remember that Al accelerates everything"

    Let me just write that down so I don't forget it.
    The empty headed harlot strikes again. Strangely she's not the most repellent member of the Trump clan.
    I’m sure she’s not great, and deserves some criticism for her politics, but using language like ‘empty headed harlot’ merely confirms what @Cyclefree has to say about issues of gender here.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 25,449

    Rayner has done a deal with Burnham IMV.

    Does it involve Burnham endorsing Rayner and staying in Manchester?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,861
    edited April 25

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    How well I remember the EU saying that the UK was not allowed to have a referendum on membership.

    Currently the rUK has the only say so I’m not sure why you’re pissed off.
    The UK EU referendum of 2016 was 41 years after the first EEC referendum in 1975 not a mere 12 years after, ie a genuine generation.

    The EU also went out of its way to make the departure terms as tough as possible for the UK.

    The 2016 referendum itself in any case did not deliver Brexit, MPs and peers rejected multiple EU Withdrawal Agreements and the UK remained in the EU for over 3 years after the June 2016 Leave vote. Only the Conservative majority in 2019 actually saw the UK leave the EU
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 136,861

    Rayner has done a deal with Burnham IMV.

    Means nothing unless Burnham returns as an MP
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,429

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Two points. Scotland decided to stay 12 years ago.

    Suppose Scotland decided to leave, would its government and the leavers be equally keen on the idea of a vote every 12 years or so about joining the UK again?

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,342

    Rayner has done a deal with Burnham IMV.

    There is still almost no money in the Betfair next PM market. Punters know something is up and probably imminent but not what.
    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/en/politics-betting-2378961

    What there is, though, is resistance to Angela Rayner even though she remains favourite.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,193

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    How well I remember the EU saying that the UK was not allowed to have a referendum on membership.

    Currently the rUK has the only say so I’m not sure why you’re pissed off.
    I wanted a vote to say piss off and stop blaming everything on the English…
  • MattWMattW Posts: 33,499
    Brains Trust:

    Do we have any PB users of Proton Mail?

    What do you think?

    They are Western European based (Switzerland) and are now putting forward their offering as being less dependent on the USA, and have strong privacy protections.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 14,284

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    Now do a comparison to the Nordic countries
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 35,223
    edited April 25

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    How well I remember the EU saying that the UK was not allowed to have a referendum on membership.

    Currently the rUK has the only say so I’m not sure why you’re pissed off.
    I wanted a vote to say piss off and stop blaming everything on the English…
    I'm quite ashamed that there are 9 American states with lower obesity than the UK. I mean wtf?
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 14,284
    algarkirk said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Two points. Scotland decided to stay 12 years ago.

    Suppose Scotland decided to leave, would its government and the leavers be equally keen on the idea of a vote every 12 years or so about joining the UK again?

    If there was a significant change in public sentiment then a new vote would be justified, IMO. There hasn’t been, unlike say UK sentiment on the EU.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323
    edited April 25
    Rayner can forget becoming leader until her HMRC investigation finishes .

    And she will carry that baggage with her so her star has waned somewhat even though she’s very popular with the membership.

    According to reports she’s disputing that she actually owes them anything at all . If HMRC agree then of course it changes things somewhat although a section of the public might still not believe she was an innocent party .

    As everyone in here knows I’m a fan of her and would happily see her take over as PM .

    I get that she’s a marmite character but you don’t need a majority of people onside with our electoral system .
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 103,805
    MattW said:

    Brains Trust:

    Do we have any PB users of Proton Mail?

    What do you think?

    They are Western European based (Switzerland) and are now putting forward their offering as being less dependent on the USA, and have strong privacy protections.

    I do, but really know nothing of comparable advantage despite using it.

    Helpful comment i know.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,363
    edited April 25
    nico67 said:

    So according to that table we have a lower GDP per capita than every US state .

    Does seem hard to believe , it also on the other hand could highlight that you can’t measure quality of life simply by GDP.

    The US does have markedly higher GDP per capita than most other countries, and that gap has grown significantly in recent years. The quality of life counter argument is valid, but not really enough.

    The bigger question is: has that gap grown because the Americans are innately more brilliant than us sclerotic lazy Europeans? Has it grown because the US has had much better government policy? Has it happened randomly? Is GDP data hiding reality? Or some other reason?

    Looking at the numbers, it’s largely a mixture of culture, gdp data flaws, and “other reason”.

    Around half of the growing gap since 2008 is directly down to differential growth in the US oil and gas industry. They’ve had a shale boom. The indirect impact - cheaper domestic feedstocks for industry - isn’t measured but could well close much of the rest.

    The remainder, in fact more than 100% of the remainder, is a mixture of US corporate profits growing more rapidly than European ones (corporate profit is a key component of GDP - which is what distorts GDP stats for Ireland and Singapore) which in turn has been put down to the US continental market scale, labour regulations, and capital liquidity; and the higher average labour hours per year for the average worker. That last one is the culture one.

    The reason we are behind even the poorest state is simply that the US is a single market so GDP and therefore prices cannot get too differentiated before businesses relocate states. So if the US as a whole is much richer per capita, so will be most of its states.

    US income is less equally distributed than UK or European income. But median income metrics are still better there than here. Inflation has eaten into that - the US is no longer a cheaper place to exist than here - but trickle down does exist.

    The only financial metric where we punch at or above the US is household wealth.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,679

    I've never got the appeal of Dubai.

    I'd go for the horse racing at Meydan but that's all.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466

    kinabalu said:

    malcolmg said:

    kinabalu said:

    MikeL said:

    Thoroughly disgusted that the unelected house has been able to filibuster the assisted dying bill that the elected house had passed.

    I hope next month a supporter of the bill gets drawn high up the private members ballot and reproposes the bill and the elected house passes it again.

    Then the Parliament Act should be used and the unelected house removed from the equation.

    It's not passing the House in its current form.
    That is up to MPs.

    They voted for it last year. They should again.
    You seem to forget quite a few MPs only supported the bill/didn't vote against it because they wanted to see what the final bill would look like.

    Sadly the supporters of the bill have made the safeguards look laughable.
    MPs voted how they voted, you may wish they had done otherwise but they did what they did at third reading. They could and should vote the same way yet again.

    The safeguards are laughably onerous, agreed. Far too many that should not be there and should be stripped out.

    But better to accept it as it is than liberalise it further, don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good enough for now.
    I would just say it had a 23 vote majority in the house so no guarantee it would pass if reintroduced
    There is never any guarantees in life, agreed.

    But MPs should do the right thing and pass it, unamended, then override the unelected Lords.

    The Lords could have chosen to pass reasonable amendments to send to the elected chamber to continue. Instead they have chosen to dick about, so the Commons should pass it unamended and have the Lords forfeit the right to suggest amendments.
    We all know that the people who are opposed are actually opposed on moral / religious grounds.

    Nobody who was opposed said: "I will switch to supporting it with certain specified safeguards".

    Instead they played a clever game - raising endless issues when really they were just flat out opposed whatever the safeguards.

    I actually think the proposers missed a trick:

    It became stand practice for TV presenters to say "this is a very difficult, complex issue ......"

    They should have been confronted with the answer: "No, it's not difficult. It's very simple. People should have the right to decide their own lives." Saying it was difficult / complex was pandering to the objectors and gave credibility to their objections.

    Next time the response should be: "What safeguards do you want?"

    As we saw with a famous poster on this site, when confronted they went round in circles for a while but ultimately admitted they wouldn't agree to it under any circumstances, even if they themselves could draw up the safeguards.
    It just needs sufficient controls to make it completely safe. Eg a diagnosis from 3 different doctors that you are 100% certain to die in the next 6 months, your own wish for an assisted passage recorded on film with the date verified by you holding up that day's newspaper, the video of this (together with the diagnoses) reviewed by a panel of experts comprised of a psychiatrist, a social worker, a senior police officer, and a moral philosopher, then assuming the green light one final step - a hearing at the Old Bailey in front of a judge and jury.
    what a load of absolute bollox, if someone wants to die and have a real illness that will be terminal then it should be their choice not a shedload of arsehole public officials who are fecking useless in most things they do, fecking supposed experts who are less than useless, one or two max doctors should be all it needs.
    Yes, sorry, I was making that same point but sarcastically.
    I for one am shocked to find that Malc has not paused to consider whether subtle humour was at work.
    To be fair I was busy and not concentrating 100% on PB.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,363

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    How well I remember the EU saying that the UK was not allowed to have a referendum on membership.

    Currently the rUK has the only say so I’m not sure why you’re pissed off.
    I wanted a vote to say piss off and stop blaming everything on the English…
    I'm quite ashamed that there are 9 American states with lower obesity than the UK. I mean wtf?
    Wegovy innit
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892
    edited April 25
    algarkirk said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Two points. Scotland decided to stay 12 years ago.

    Suppose Scotland decided to leave, would its government and the leavers be equally keen on the idea of a vote every 12 years or so about joining the UK again?

    There's precisely zero legislation in UK laws about time limits between referendums (unless you count at least 7 years between hypothetical border polls in NI). On your second point I would be quite happy to follow the UK precedent of a party or parties getting a parliamentarty majority for referendums, eg Cameron holding an EU ref on 37% of the vote.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 103,805
    algarkirk said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Two points. Scotland decided to stay 12 years ago.

    Suppose Scotland decided to leave, would its government and the leavers be equally keen on the idea of a vote every 12 years or so about joining the UK again?

    Certainly not, and we all know that I'm sure. But i still fall on the side that if Scotland keeps voting in parties who want to hold a vote and their parliament wants one they should get it.

    Though i expect a lot of converts to the view of needing a confirmatory vote in Sindy ever passes.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466
    Eabhal said:

    boulay said:

    Eabhal said:

    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    I am on a train. The bloke opposite me is talking to the bloke next to him that he has tiny eustachian tubes. The bloke next to him said he thinks he has the mindset to cope. TBOM says he woke up and still thought he was asleep. TBNTH says his wife has ear candles

    I want them both dead.

    I'm gibbering at this point. It's like two AIs talking to each other. It's all stream of consciousness. There's no mediation between thought and speech, no summaries, it's just event, event, event, event, he said this I said that he said that. If either of them use the phrase "I was loving" instead of "I love" I will not be responsible for my actions. I have my eyes closed and a clenched fist rammed into my lips. Now I know why telepaths go mad.

    We need to go back to the 1940s, when men smoked pipes, read newspapers, and only talked on trains when it advanced the plot.
    I’m in a pub and there are 5 wasted men in their 70s violently arguing about the best German Chancellor. On the other side there are two people in their 50s on a date and… the flame doesn’t die.
    Who are the runners and riders in the best chancellor debate?
    Brandt? One mentioned Scholz and it all got a bit heated. And then a discussion on Adenauer.

    Amazing that people can debate like this. I need to read more.
    Boomers got real education not your modern namby pamby woke mince.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466

    @Sandpit ??


    Andrew Neil
    @afneil
    ·
    37m
    Hotel occupancy in Dubai down to 20%, flight traffic thru the Dubai hub down 50%. Guess there are some juicy deals on hotels and flights to be done if you’re up for it!

    https://x.com/afneil/status/2047804893289710013

    If you want to go to an expensive sand dune, no thanks
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 7,960
    edited April 25
    Test
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,198
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Just watching Jamie Oliver's "Together" made in 2022 where he cooks up a dinner for "all the lovely teachers that really went through it during the lockdown"

    Yeah, thanks for STAYING AT HOME and FUCKING UP OUR KIDS you WORKSHY TWATS. Here's a damn canape. Try not to choke. Wankers

    You dormant fuck. The schools were open.
    Hm. Not entirely. There was one period where schools were closed for, what, three months in summer 2020, and anotger period in winter 2021 for which they were closed for about two, two and a half months. Sone teachera did heroically but the unions were being incredibly difficult.

    It was, without doubt, the most miserable period of my life.
    My son's school stayed open for essential workers kids throughout the pandemic. As far as I can tell that was the norm. Teachers taught from their classrooms either with a handful of kids or direct to streaming to students at home. My son did not miss a single day's school throughout the whole of lockdown.
    Well, yet again YOU had a really lovely lockdown and everything was perfect as you keep telling us. Others, not so much
    One of the most enjoyable things was watching you go to pieces on a daily basis thinking the end of the world was coming. You are in no position to criticise anyone now given your level of scaremongering during the pandemic.
    I apologise for having way more foresight and 10 times the ability to extrapolate, than anyone else on this forum

    Incidentally, talking about foresight, has anyone else noticed the weird DRYNESS? Apparently London is experiencing its driest April possibly ever, it's certainly in the top five and the forecast says it might win gold

    Weird

    My EXTRAPOLATIVE ABILITY which is UNEXAMPLED ON THIS FORUM says this is..... weird
    I remember having fierce arguments with you two decades ago about the dangers and risks posed by global warming that you disputed and now you are claiming some prescient ability based on noticing something the Met Office is posting videos about on YouTube.

    Lol.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,631
    Had he just called his magnum opus something else, this would be a more widely held opinion.

    Francis Fukuyama is a fucking genius and a prophet.
    https://x.com/DastDn/status/1787622378928766985
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466
    edited April 25
    MattW said:

    Brains Trust:

    Do we have any PB users of Proton Mail?

    What do you think?

    They are Western European based (Switzerland) and are now putting forward their offering as being less dependent on the USA, and have strong privacy protections.

    my grandson uses it and likes it , he is techy type.
    PS: Nowt wrong with ymail
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,679
    nico67 said:

    Rayner can forget becoming leader until her HMRC investigation finishes .

    And she will carry that baggage with her so her star has waned somewhat even though she’s very popular with the membership.

    According to reports she’s disputing that she actually owes them anything at all . If HMRC agree then of course it changes things somewhat although a section of the public might still not believe she was an innocent party .

    As everyone in here knows I’m a fan of her and would happily see her take over as PM .

    I get that she’s a marmite character but you don’t need a majority of people onside with our electoral system .

    I don't dislike her - apart from Rupert Lowe, I don't have strong views about any current politician, certainly in comparison to the verbal vitriol dished out by some on here.

    I presume she's not liked as a potential Prime Minister, just as Prescott wasn't back in the day, because she lacks (apparently) the necessary gravitas and would be a "leftie" in office (whatever that means, which in this case I presume for most on here would be "I would pay more taxes and people who I don't think deserve anything would get more benefits").

    It comes back to what you're looking for in a Prime Minister - Margaret Thatcher seems to be the benchmark on here but times change and the role of the PM changes with them.

    Rayner is probably no less fiscally incoherent than Badenoch, Starmer, Davey, Farage or Polanski and the unpleasant truth is it really doesn't matter who is Prime Minister that much. They have arguably as much say over the future direction of Britain as Sadiq Khan has over the future direction of London, possibly a shade less.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,463
  • Taz said:

    Cicero said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The wisdom of Melania:

    https://x.com/melaniatrump/status/2047799687856447985

    "We are not here to prepare our children for yesterday's world.
    Be purposeful with your objectives and remember that Al accelerates everything"

    Let me just write that down so I don't forget it.
    The empty headed harlot strikes again. Strangely she's not the most repellent member of the Trump clan.
    I’m sure she’s not great, and deserves some criticism for her politics, but using language like ‘empty headed harlot’ merely confirms what @Cyclefree has to say about issues of gender here.
    Disagree. Every thing we know about her suggests she has always had a transactional relationship with Donald, she was willing to trade sex and incuriousness about his business and political dealings for status and trinkets.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466
    algarkirk said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Two points. Scotland decided to stay 12 years ago.

    Suppose Scotland decided to leave, would its government and the leavers be equally keen on the idea of a vote every 12 years or so about joining the UK again?

    Is that like the English wanting back in EU and clamouring for another vote
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466
    Eabhal said:

    algarkirk said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Two points. Scotland decided to stay 12 years ago.

    Suppose Scotland decided to leave, would its government and the leavers be equally keen on the idea of a vote every 12 years or so about joining the UK again?

    If there was a significant change in public sentiment then a new vote would be justified, IMO. There hasn’t been, unlike say UK sentiment on the EU.
    If English parties were ruling for a generation then surely it would be possible, we would not be inclined to act like Colonial Masters like England does.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892
    Nigelb said:

    Had he just called his magnum opus something else, this would be a more widely held opinion.

    Francis Fukuyama is a fucking genius and a prophet.
    https://x.com/DastDn/status/1787622378928766985

    Rather spoiled by Elon being first in replies with his nerd's shallow philosophising.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 8,323

    nico67 said:

    So according to that table we have a lower GDP per capita than every US state .

    Does seem hard to believe , it also on the other hand could highlight that you can’t measure quality of life simply by GDP.

    What about drug deaths murders rapes gangs
    Qualify of life is an individual thing . Personally I think too many constantly moan about the UK and don’t appreciate how lucky we are to live here .

    My glass is half full . Yes we have our fair share of problems but which country doesn’t and we also have the best capital city in the world .

  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,198

    Taz said:

    Cicero said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The wisdom of Melania:

    https://x.com/melaniatrump/status/2047799687856447985

    "We are not here to prepare our children for yesterday's world.
    Be purposeful with your objectives and remember that Al accelerates everything"

    Let me just write that down so I don't forget it.
    The empty headed harlot strikes again. Strangely she's not the most repellent member of the Trump clan.
    I’m sure she’s not great, and deserves some criticism for her politics, but using language like ‘empty headed harlot’ merely confirms what @Cyclefree has to say about issues of gender here.
    Disagree. Every thing we know about her suggests she has always had a transactional relationship with Donald, she was willing to trade sex and incuriousness about his business and political dealings for status and trinkets.
    I don't think that's true. There's evidence that Melania encouraged Trump to move into politics. That she pursued him because she believed he could do so. She's a much more conscious actor in her and Trump's life than all the memes about her being a hostage allow for.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    An independence referendum in England?

    OK by me
    Who do you become independent from?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    feel free to feck off any time you wish, holding a country prisoner because you are scared to go it alone is pretty pathetic for the supposed world power.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,466
    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    isam said:

    Piers Morgan asked Russell Brand which passages were relevant to him when he brought a Bible into court.

    https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/2047782854772326876?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    The Brand story is something to think about in relation to the discussion @Cyclefree started yesterday.

    See also this piece of trash with millions of followers.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Tate

    Or story like this from Texas.
    Can you imagine having to sign a waiver for your kid to play baseball because the coach is a child sex offender?
    https://x.com/watchkeep/status/2047496359280861382

    Or the existence in office, re-elected, of the current US President.

    My point certainly isn't that sexual abuse is the preserve of the right wing (there are plenty of counter examples to that), just that sexual abusers are openly defended, or excused, or actively supported, by millions of people.

    However much we think "but I'm not like that, and nor are any of my friends", Cyclefree has a point.
    That's Russell Brand who was courted by, checks notes, Ed Miliband?
    Brent and Finchy


    that would scare the dogs
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,631
    MelonB said:

    nico67 said:

    So according to that table we have a lower GDP per capita than every US state .

    Does seem hard to believe , it also on the other hand could highlight that you can’t measure quality of life simply by GDP.

    The US does have markedly higher GDP per capita than most other countries, and that gap has grown significantly in recent years. The quality of life counter argument is valid, but not really enough.

    The bigger question is: has that gap grown because the Americans are innately more brilliant than us sclerotic lazy Europeans? Has it grown because the US has had much better government policy? Has it happened randomly? Is GDP data hiding reality? Or some other reason?

    Looking at the numbers, it’s largely a mixture of culture, gdp data flaws, and “other reason”.

    Around half of the growing gap since 2008 is directly down to differential growth in the US oil and gas industry. They’ve had a shale boom. The indirect impact - cheaper domestic feedstocks for industry - isn’t measured but could well close much of the rest.

    The remainder, in fact more than 100% of the remainder, is a mixture of US corporate profits growing more rapidly than European ones (corporate profit is a key component of GDP - which is what distorts GDP stats for Ireland and Singapore) which in turn has been put down to the US continental market scale, labour regulations, and capital liquidity; and the higher average labour hours per year for the average worker. That last one is the culture one.

    The reason we are behind even the poorest state is simply that the US is a single market so GDP and therefore prices cannot get too differentiated before businesses relocate states. So if the US as a whole is much richer per capita, so will be most of its states.

    US income is less equally distributed than UK or European income. But median income metrics are still better there than here. Inflation has eaten into that - the US is no longer a cheaper place to exist than here - but trickle down does exist.

    The only financial metric where we punch at or above the US is household wealth.
    US capital markets provide huge amounts of money to invest in US business.
    Ours tend also to provide money to invest in the US.
    If it hasn't gone into domestic property.

    Many/most of our best ideas end up as part of US businesses.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,679
    MelonB said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    How well I remember the EU saying that the UK was not allowed to have a referendum on membership.

    Currently the rUK has the only say so I’m not sure why you’re pissed off.
    I wanted a vote to say piss off and stop blaming everything on the English…
    I'm quite ashamed that there are 9 American states with lower obesity than the UK. I mean wtf?
    Wegovy innit
    The Wegovy/Mounjaro etc phenomenon is fascinating.

    It's a juxtaposition of the prioritisation of health and wealth such as we saw in the pandemic and marks, to this observer, a potentially significant cultural change.

    I've considered it - I'm not called Stodge for no reason - but decided to control my weight the old fashioned way (or try to, I'm a bluff old traditionalist in many ways including my fondness for unhealthy breakfasts at cafes).

    The impact these chemicals have had across the economy is incredible - Mrs Stodge (she's called it through being married to me, that's all) tells me EBay and similar are flooded with oversize clothes which are no longer required (she calls them size 18 and upwards, I've no clue) and stores which formerly did well from having niche ranges for "larger" ladies are having to cut back as more go on to the weight-control medications.

    However, and this is anecdotally, I've read the medicines are themselves as much of a dependency as tobacco, alcohol, sex, flint knapping, chinese food and Lingfield Park racing and if you come off them, the weight goes back on twice as fast as going off a conventional diet.

    That means presumably any interruption of supply means trouble and if you can't pay to stay on the tablets, you're back looking for larger size clothing soon which means money for EBay sellers (and others).
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,631
    On Brand, and bearing in mind how hard it is for Piers Morgan to remain silent for more than a second, this is perhaps the pinnacle of his broadcasting career.
    https://x.com/I_amMukhtar/status/2047782854772326876
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,890
    Each man's death diminishes me,
    For I am involved in mankind.
    Therefore, send not to know
    For whom the bell tolls,
    It tolls for thee.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,144
    edited April 25
    malcolmg said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    feel free to feck off any time you wish, holding a country prisoner because you are scared to go it alone is pretty pathetic for the supposed world power.
    Good morning @malcolmg

    I hope all is well in Ayrshire overlooking beautiful Arran, home to some members of our family

    I think the Scots should be allowed a referendum because the arguments can be made and a decision taken

    However, I do think that should if be to remain then that should end the debate for a generation
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,679
    HYUFD said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    How well I remember the EU saying that the UK was not allowed to have a referendum on membership.

    Currently the rUK has the only say so I’m not sure why you’re pissed off.
    The UK EU referendum of 2016 was 41 years after the first EEC referendum in 1975 not a mere 12 years after, ie a genuine generation.

    The EU also went out of its way to make the departure terms as tough as possible for the UK.

    The 2016 referendum itself in any case did not deliver Brexit, MPs and peers rejected multiple EU Withdrawal Agreements and the UK remained in the EU for over 3 years after the June 2016 Leave vote. Only the Conservative majority in 2019 actually saw the UK leave the EU
    Hang on, that's not entirely right.

    We COULD have left without an agreement - indeed, the "No Deal Brexit" was a mantra for some on the LEAVE side.

    Yes, the 2019 GE created a Parliamentary majority for the Withdrawal Agreement but had it not done so, we could still have walked away if no further extension were agreed with the EU.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,892
    malcolmg said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Do the other side of the union, the rUK get a say too? I understand why the EU got so pissed of with the U.K. when I look at the SNP
    An independence referendum in England?

    OK by me
    Who do you become independent from?
    Well, they'd have to stop talking about 'our' north sea reserves for a start.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,429
    kle4 said:

    algarkirk said:

    A useful corrective to the ‘why can’t we be more like ‘Murica’ twats.



    https://x.com/simongerman600/status/2047835504482079016?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    This is the country you want to leave, right?
    This is the union I want to have the choice on whether I want to leave, not have it decided by people like you.
    Two points. Scotland decided to stay 12 years ago.

    Suppose Scotland decided to leave, would its government and the leavers be equally keen on the idea of a vote every 12 years or so about joining the UK again?

    Certainly not, and we all know that I'm sure. But i still fall on the side that if Scotland keeps voting in parties who want to hold a vote and their parliament wants one they should get it.

    Though i expect a lot of converts to the view of needing a confirmatory vote in Sindy ever passes.
    Maybe the right answer is, if independents clearly win a Scottish election, is to take that as a mandate and first for the UK government and Scottish government to negotiate and agree the terms of a putative deal, put the agreed document to the public and then hold a referendum.

    EU rules made this impossible, IIRC, for Brexit, but I think we should learn from that mistake.

This discussion has been closed.