Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
That is entirely the point.
Some of these fans are obnoxious, but those who misbehave can be dealt with accordingly.
They are being barred, not because of their behaviour, but because some of the local inhabitants want to assault them.
A Sikh woman wrote a play. That violently issue or part of the Sikh community. After riotous violence, death threats etc, the police said that would not/could not protect the theatre. Since the play was “provocative”.
So the theatre closed the play on safety grounds.
In Birmingham
It is said that Tommy Lots Of Names was inspired by this - create a threat of violence against people (demo goes violent) and get *their* activities banned. See the EDL.
I really fear for our country following West Midlands disgraceful prohibitation of Maccabi Tel Aviv fans attending their match at Villa
Has there ever been such a crass decision by the police effectively saying 'Jews are not welcome here' ?
The trouble is the way the Internet/modern media is, if the police had said it can go ahead and there was a riot then everyone and his dog would be screaming: why did they allow this to go ahead.
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Or, more likely, play the game behind closed doors. Punish the club because it has shit fans incapable of behaving themselves.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I accept that I am rich. Inheriting from hard-working parents helped!
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Or, more likely, play the game behind closed doors. Punish the club because it has shit fans incapable of behaving themselves.
Which also has the merit of being the standard, existing solution to the problem.
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
It’s the equivalent of asking women not to wear skirts because they might get raped by undesirable locals
We have become totally supine in the face of Islamist menaces, we yield to them constantly out of rank cowardice, and every time we do this emboldens them more - and further enshittifies Britain
At some point the appeasement has to stop or we will sink into horrible sectarian strife and the Ulsterisation of the UK will be complete
I suggest this is a good place to say Stop, no more
To his credit Starmer appears to realise this
It's rather less clearcut than that, since from what I have read, at least, Maccabi also seem to have something of a Millwall element among their fans.
The way to deal with it is, of course, not to privilege either side, and restrict both sets of fans in order to avoid trouble. Hand out exemplary punishment to those who do kick off. Pretending the match can just go ahead without some special precautions won't wash, though.
If the ban on Maccabi Tel Aviv fans remains, I think it could be a pivotal moment in British history
I agree. It’s the moment when it becomes undeniable that multiculturalism and mass immigration is a calamitous failure - and a danger to us all
Nurse! he's out of bed again.
I mean, I know you're a travel writer for a comic, but don't let that impede you. Albeit that fash-curious is as predictable as it is dull.
Why not stay in the States and get paid a multiple of your current salary to write for the Portland Mid County Memo? You'd love it, they'd love your cute mildly racist schtick, and we'd love it too, knowing we were unlikely to encounter you guttered outside some Soho flop house.
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Or, more likely, play the game behind closed doors. Punish the club because it has shit fans incapable of behaving themselves.
Which also has the merit of being the standard, existing solution to the problem.
Coventry City got punished and couldn't even get into europe in 1988 because of the thuggery that went on by Liverpool fans at Heysel ! Wasn't even anything to do with us ! It's not something that comes round particularly often for us either.
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
That is entirely the point.
Some of these fans are obnoxious, but those who misbehave can be dealt with accordingly.
They are being barred, not because of their behaviour, but because some of the local inhabitants want to assault them.
A Sikh woman wrote a play. That violently issue or part of the Sikh community. After riotous violence, death threats etc, the police said that would not/could not protect the theatre. Since the play was “provocative”.
So the theatre closed the play on safety grounds.
In Birmingham
It is said that Tommy Lots Of Names was inspired by this - create a threat of violence against people (demo goes violent) and get *their* activities banned. See the EDL.
Excellent example
I remember being enraged by that decision. The craven surrender to an ethnic minority mob (Sikh in this case). A spineless government unwilling to defend free speech
I actually wrote about it, saying “this feels like a terrible precedent”, and “this will only encourage more mobs to do the same”
And, sadly, here we are. Decades of appeasement and cowardice have left us in a perilous place
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
It’s the equivalent of asking women not to wear skirts because they might get raped by undesirable locals
We have become totally supine in the face of Islamist menaces, we yield to them constantly out of rank cowardice, and every time we do this emboldens them more - and further enshittifies Britain
At some point the appeasement has to stop or we will sink into horrible sectarian strife and the Ulsterisation of the UK will be complete
I suggest this is a good place to say Stop, no more
To his credit Starmer appears to realise this
It's rather less clearcut than that, since from what I have read, at least, Maccabi also seem to have something of a Millwall element among their fans.
The way to deal with it is, of course, not to privilege either side, and restrict both sets of fans in order to avoid trouble. Hand out exemplary punishment to those who do kick off. Pretending the match can just go ahead without some special precautions won't wash, though.
Aston Villa fans aren't particularly the issue here. And it is the first time I can recall foreign team fans being barred in England, yes Maccabi are trouble but far from unique trouble.
Because of shifting populations, the direct route to a Catholic School went through a Protestant street.
A campaign of intimidation and violence was launched, to try and get the school run diverted.
Instead of diverting the children, the Chief Constable of NI lined the road with a wall of armoured Land Rovers.
Then told the waiting press that while he was Chief Constable, the right of the law abiding to use the Queens highway would not be infringed.
Then he led the assembled group of children & parents to the school. He was wearing dress uniform, unlike all the other officers, who were in full riot gear.
That’s what leadership and moral values looks like, I think.
If the ban on Maccabi Tel Aviv fans remains, I think it could be a pivotal moment in British history
I agree. It’s the moment when it becomes undeniable that multiculturalism and mass immigration is a calamitous failure - and a danger to us all
Nurse! he's out of bed again.
I mean, I know you're a travel writer for a comic, but don't let that impede you. Albeit that fash-curious is as predictable as it is dull.
Why not stay in the States and get paid a multiple of your current salary to write for the Portland Mid County Memo? You'd love it, they'd love your cute mildly racist schtick, and we'd love it too, knowing we were unlikely to encounter you guttered outside some Soho flop house.
Deal?
I thought your position was that I should be “arrested on return to the UK” - tho you never really explained how and why
Talking of crass appeasement of local sentiment, it was outrageous that Sam Fender’s ersatz drivel won the Mercury ahead of the wonderful Pink Pantheress.
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
It really isn’t bizarre. There are many clubs with problem fans and it is only a small minority who are problems. None of them are being targetted for such treatment and the threat is not necessarily from the Tel Aviv fans but it could be to them. The arrest data after the Ajax game was over was predominantly Dutch supporters.
So one has to ask what is the difference between fans of Maccabi Tel Aviv, who are being banned en masse, and fans of other clubs with known hooligan following such as the Krakow teams, the Italian sides with their ultras, or local teams like Millwall or Portsmouth.
The Police are used to dealing with these situations and have done for many years.
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
It’s the equivalent of asking women not to wear skirts because they might get raped by undesirable locals
We have become totally supine in the face of Islamist menaces, we yield to them constantly out of rank cowardice, and every time we do this emboldens them more - and further enshittifies Britain
At some point the appeasement has to stop or we will sink into horrible sectarian strife and the Ulsterisation of the UK will be complete
I suggest this is a good place to say Stop, no more
To his credit Starmer appears to realise this
It’s amazing that so many people don’t see this. It must be because, although it is happening right before our eyes, the incremental nature of the change disguises the long term effect.
I was talking about the Villa situation with my Dad last night. We were imagining how his Dad, who passed away in 1973, would have reacted if you’d told him that Israeli football fans were banned from Birmingham because large parts of the city were majority Islamic.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I accept that I am rich. Inheriting from hard-working parents helped!
That is the HYUFD plan for the entire nation! He hasn't quite worked out the average age of inheritance is early sixties, nor that shock horror, some families don't have an estate of multiple properties to divvy up between their kids.
I really fear for our country following West Midlands disgraceful prohibitation of Maccabi Tel Aviv fans attending their match at Villa
Has there ever been such a crass decision by the police effectively saying 'Jews are not welcome here' ?
I agree. But the Maccabi Tel Aviv are hardly shrinking violets so there's bound to be a massive punch up. But we can enjoy both: the punch up and Sir Keir having to take responsibility for it because he overruled the police.
Given that twattish members of the Israeli government (including Bibi I think) called 4 Maccabi fans getting their hair pulled a pogrom, I‘m surprised they want a repeat performance in the maelstrom of Villla Park. I assume stores of hyperbole are replenished and ready if Sir Keir squeezes out a u turn from WMP.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Or, more likely, play the game behind closed doors. Punish the club because it has shit fans incapable of behaving themselves.
Point of order, and I’m no fan of Villa, the threat is not from the Villa fans but from local residents according to Villa accounts online.
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
It’s the equivalent of asking women not to wear skirts because they might get raped by undesirable locals
We have become totally supine in the face of Islamist menaces, we yield to them constantly out of rank cowardice, and every time we do this emboldens them more - and further enshittifies Britain
At some point the appeasement has to stop or we will sink into horrible sectarian strife and the Ulsterisation of the UK will be complete
I suggest this is a good place to say Stop, no more
To his credit Starmer appears to realise this
It's rather less clearcut than that, since from what I have read, at least, Maccabi also seem to have something of a Millwall element among their fans.
The way to deal with it is, of course, not to privilege either side, and restrict both sets of fans in order to avoid trouble. Hand out exemplary punishment to those who do kick off. Pretending the match can just go ahead without some special precautions won't wash, though.
Aston Villa fans aren't particularly the issue here. And it is the first time I can recall foreign team fans being barred in England, yes Maccabi are trouble but far from unique trouble.
I suspect Plod just wanted a quiet weekend and decided that the inflamed political situation in the background was a sufficient pretext. However, what will be interesting is if it really does kick off. What line should Sir Keir and Kemi take then?
@jonsopel The optics of the #AstonVilla ban are truly appalling. How can it be that there is enough policing every weekend to maintain public safety when tens of thousands of pro-Palestinian supporters gather, but there isn’t when it’s maybe a 1000 Maccabi fans on the one night an Israeli club is playing in Britain?
Leave aside the nationality of those banned, once again the police are deciding that football fans are fair game but protesters are not.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I have a friend who is worth about £950m. Literally (he married very well)
He once denied that he was “truly rich”. Why? Because he hangs out in LA with people worth multiple billions not just one billion, and THEY are the “truly rich” in his eyes
Crassus' view was that you weren't truly rich unless you could recruit and equip a legion, at your own expense.
Recruiting, arming, paying, and maintaining 5,000 soldiers today? That would cost probably about £1bn annually, in a rich world country.
It would be fascinating to work out - if it’s possible - the richest man or woman in history
Elon must be up there
But then, how do you assess a medieval king in a feudal state who theoretically owns the entire nation?
Or a Roman emperor like Augustus?
Augustus was also worshipped as a god, and founded a dynasty, which gives him something of an edge.
More admirable is Andrew Carnegie, who gave most of his enormous wealth away.
Gained in part from shooting at strikers, albeit that was bog standard for rich capitalists in the US at the time.
Perhaps more telling is his [edit] *self-built* birthplace museum, in Dunfermline. It is quite something to visit. The actual tiny family weaver's cottage (itself a rare and interesting survivor) is absolutely dwarfed by massive halls and galleries surrounding it, including a museum gallery partly filled with the silver keys and orations of thanks and so forth from the opening of new libraries and so on, arising from his spending his wealth - admittedly on many libraries and museums in the UK. He certainly liked his reputation to be polished.
His trust still survives and is active today IIRC. And his dinosaur Diplodocus carnegiei and its plaster casts in London, etc., are still very much doing service in museums.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I'd be fine with Israeli teams being banned by UEFA for the war in Gaza. I'm not fine with Maccabi being banned because we can't/won't police it.
Talking of crass appeasement of local sentiment, it was outrageous that Sam Fender’s ersatz drivel won the Mercury ahead of the wonderful Pink Pantheress.
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
It’s the equivalent of asking women not to wear skirts because they might get raped by undesirable locals
We have become totally supine in the face of Islamist menaces, we yield to them constantly out of rank cowardice, and every time we do this emboldens them more - and further enshittifies Britain
At some point the appeasement has to stop or we will sink into horrible sectarian strife and the Ulsterisation of the UK will be complete
I suggest this is a good place to say Stop, no more
To his credit Starmer appears to realise this
It's rather less clearcut than that, since from what I have read, at least, Maccabi also seem to have something of a Millwall element among their fans.
The way to deal with it is, of course, not to privilege either side, and restrict both sets of fans in order to avoid trouble. Hand out exemplary punishment to those who do kick off. Pretending the match can just go ahead without some special precautions won't wash, though.
Aston Villa fans aren't particularly the issue here. And it is the first time I can recall foreign team fans being barred in England, yes Maccabi are trouble but far from unique trouble.
I suspect Plod just wanted a quiet weekend and decided that the inflamed political situation in the background was a sufficient pretext. However, what will be interesting is if it really does kick off. What line should Sir Keir and Kemi take then?
If tel aviv fans are now allowed, it seems almost certain to kick off. Unless WMP draft about 10,000 officers
Interesting that the Birmingham MPs "unwise" tweet is coming in for serious criticism from across the political spectrum and people who don't generally do politics.
Excellent and really important work by @AyoubKhanMP . Maccabi Tel Aviv fans behaviour has been shocking and the fact they remain in European competition is a stain on the sport we all love
When I have time I look forward to reading all his comments demanding that fans from teams who have violent racist ultras are also banned, some of the Italian and Central European teams are terrible for this.
The solution while requiring considerable policing, ought to be quite simple.
Hold the match at a neutral venue, limiting the numbers so that opposing fans can be well segregated, and ban for life anyone initiating violence.
Sectarianism cannot be allowed to prevail.
The wailing on behalf of the Maccabi fans on here is bizarre. Invert it and imagine a bunch of ultras from an Islamic country marauding around Jewish parts of London and threatening to kill them.
I think in both scenarios you can make a case against collective punishment, and for asking the police to follow an intelligence-led approach.
That's generally been quite successful with football-related violence, so you'd expect that liaising with the Israeli police would be useful.
And then a few arrests of people who are calling for violence against the visiting football fans, and I think you could go a long way towards heading off any trouble.
The most important point seems to be that the police haven't banned visiting fans on the basis of the violence they might be guilty of perpetrating, but due to the risk of other people perpetrating violence against them. I've come across this attitude from the police before, of asking victims to modify their behaviour rather than confronting criminals. It's the wrong approach.
It’s the equivalent of asking women not to wear skirts because they might get raped by undesirable locals
We have become totally supine in the face of Islamist menaces, we yield to them constantly out of rank cowardice, and every time we do this emboldens them more - and further enshittifies Britain
At some point the appeasement has to stop or we will sink into horrible sectarian strife and the Ulsterisation of the UK will be complete
I suggest this is a good place to say Stop, no more
To his credit Starmer appears to realise this
It's rather less clearcut than that, since from what I have read, at least, Maccabi also seem to have something of a Millwall element among their fans.
The way to deal with it is, of course, not to privilege either side, and restrict both sets of fans in order to avoid trouble. Hand out exemplary punishment to those who do kick off. Pretending the match can just go ahead without some special precautions won't wash, though.
Aston Villa fans aren't particularly the issue here. And it is the first time I can recall foreign team fans being barred in England, yes Maccabi are trouble but far from unique trouble.
I suspect Plod just wanted a quiet weekend and decided that the inflamed political situation in the background was a sufficient pretext. However, what will be interesting is if it really does kick off. What line should Sir Keir and Kemi take then?
There likely will be clashes and those involved on both sides should be dealt with harshly and speedily.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I accept that I am rich. Inheriting from hard-working parents helped!
That is the HYUFD plan for the entire nation! He hasn't quite worked out the average age of inheritance is early sixties, nor that shock horror, some families don't have an estate of multiple properties to divvy up between their kids.
Or indeed enough dosh to even worry about IHT. (oh, how I had to reassure at least one elderly relative panicked by the Tories.) But those folk don't count so have, not coincidentally, buggered off to Reform etc.
Interesting that the Birmingham MPs "unwise" tweet is coming in for serious criticism from across the political spectrum and people who don't generally do politics.
@iqbalmohamedMP Thank you all who put the safety of Aston Villa fans, Birmingham residents snd the British public above the zionist and political pressure to let Israeli hooligans and terrorists run riot in our country.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I honestly would tactically vote for Starmer Labour to beat the Greens, Polanski is Corbyn with bells on
Interesting that the Birmingham MPs "unwise" tweet is coming in for serious criticism from across the political spectrum and people who don't generally do politics.
@iqbalmohamedMP Thank you all who put the safety of Aston Villa fans, Birmingham residents snd the British public above the zionist and political pressure to let Israeli hooligans and terrorists run riot in our country.
When people crowbar zionist into these kind of statements we know what they really mean.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I honestly would tactically vote for Starmer Labour to beat the Greens, Polanski is Corbyn with bells on
Yes, the Greens are quite loathsome. And they have a worrying grip on the young
Some of the members maybe, Starmer is not stupid enough to require taxpayers to fund it.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
Interesting that the Birmingham MPs "unwise" tweet is coming in for serious criticism from across the political spectrum and people who don't generally do politics.
@iqbalmohamedMP Thank you all who put the safety of Aston Villa fans, Birmingham residents snd the British public above the zionist and political pressure to let Israeli hooligans and terrorists run riot in our country.
When people crowbar zionist in this kind of context we know what they really mean.
And terrorist. The Tel Aviv mob are pretty hideous, but I'm not sure I'd call them terrorists. Feels pretty racist to me.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I accept that I am rich. Inheriting from hard-working parents helped!
That is the HYUFD plan for the entire nation! He hasn't quite worked out the average age of inheritance is early sixties, nor that shock horror, some families don't have an estate of multiple properties to divvy up between their kids.
Plenty of deposits for houses are obtained by 30 to 40 year olds from grandparents via inheritance or parents via the 7 year survivorship gift rule.
Some of the members maybe, Starmer is not stupid enough to require taxpayers to fund it.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
The CoE does as well.
I suspect some form of ‘reparations’ will come via the foreign aid budget in future.
My wife and I have just received our postal votes for our local ward election
Only 2 candidates - conservative and reform
My wife and I voted conservative without any hesitation whatsoever
That will be interesting. If the Conservatives beat Reform there in a head to head vote it will show that their best hope for survival while we keep FPTP is tactical votes from voters who normally back Labour, the LDs, the Greens, Plaid etc where the Conservatives and Reform are the main contenders in a ward or seat
Interesting that the Birmingham MPs "unwise" tweet is coming in for serious criticism from across the political spectrum and people who don't generally do politics.
@iqbalmohamedMP Thank you all who put the safety of Aston Villa fans, Birmingham residents snd the British public above the zionist and political pressure to let Israeli hooligans and terrorists run riot in our country.
When people crowbar zionist in this kind of context we know what they really mean.
And terrorist. The Tel Aviv mob are pretty hideous, but I'm not sure I'd call them terrorists. Feels pretty racist to me.
Where as I bet in Iqbal worldview, Hamas are militants, freedom fighters, remember that they are the democratically elected government....
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I honestly would tactically vote for Starmer Labour to beat the Greens, Polanski is Corbyn with bells on
Yes, the Greens are quite loathsome. And they have a worrying grip on the young
I agree. But there's a very simple reason that my daughter and most of her contemporaries will vote Green: tuition fees. LibLabCon have royally shafted the young, and in particular that large part of it which goes to university. Why wouldn't you vote Green if all the others are proposing that yiu should start your adult life £50k or more in debt?
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I'd be fine with Israeli teams being banned by UEFA for the war in Gaza. I'm not fine with Maccabi being banned because we can't/won't police it.
Likewise
There is an argument to be had about banning Israeli sports teams. We ban Russian teams. Israel’s relentless attacks on Gaza are not entirely different from Putin slaughtering Ukrainians - tho Israel was gravely provoked, unlike Russia
I’m honestly not sure where I stand on that. Could be persuaded either way. However this case is wholly different - this is banning an away team because the local fans/populace are racist thugs who want to attack the away supporters simply because of their racial and religious identity
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I honestly would tactically vote for Starmer Labour to beat the Greens, Polanski is Corbyn with bells on
Yes he is but where does that leave greens in the rural shires who don’t go for wealth taxes, gender wars and Gaza, going to the Lib Dem’s ?
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I accept that I am rich. Inheriting from hard-working parents helped!
That is the HYUFD plan for the entire nation! He hasn't quite worked out the average age of inheritance is early sixties, nor that shock horror, some families don't have an estate of multiple properties to divvy up between their kids.
Plenty of deposits for houses are obtained by 30 to 40 year olds from grandparents via inheritance or parents via the 7 year survivorship gift rule.
None of my 3 children depended on hand downs from us but bought their homes on their own finances
The idea children depend on hand downs from their parents applies to a privileged few, and frankly Reeves would be justified in abolishing the 7 year rule
Voters may want the Chancellor to increase borrowing rather than tax but as Truss found out that is not an option the markets will accept.
Most likely though she won't increase income tax, national insurance or VAT in line with the Labour manifesto. However she probably will freeze the income tax threshold and increase capital gains tax and possibly have a mansion tax too
IHT is in her sights
I doubt she would be that stupid, if she is Labour will be 3rd or even 4th in most polls soon
She has no good options. She’s fucked the economy with terrible decisions and now she has to raise taxes in a way which will be hideously unpopular - and breaking her promise; it’s also likely she will chase even more rich people away from London - the exodus is already large (the telegraph has been writing about it all week)
That screws the london economy and thus the uk economy and also shrinks our tax base so she will probably make everything worse, again, and end up with less tax than before. So she will have to come back for more taxes. And so on
We are in a doom loop. We are New York City in the 1970s
And maybe New York City in the 2020s if Mamdani wins its Mayoral race next month given his hammer the rich with tax and abolish billionaires platform
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I honestly would tactically vote for Starmer Labour to beat the Greens, Polanski is Corbyn with bells on
Yes, the Greens are quite loathsome. And they have a worrying grip on the young
I agree. But there's a very simple reason that my daughter and most of her contemporaries will vote Green: tuition fees. LibLabCon have royally shafted the young, and in particular that large part of it which goes to university. Why wouldn't you vote Green if all the others are proposing that yiu should start your adult life £50k or more in debt?
True, but this will be a non issue very soon when it becomes clear that going to university is worse than pointless
I think there's a good chance this match doesn't get played at Villa Park. Away fans or not, there's now a huge risk it attracts trouble makers.
It’s probably easier to remove Villa from the competition if visiting there is so dangerous for away teams fans. Not like the old days of the Barton Arms.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I have a friend who is worth about £950m. Literally (he married very well)
He once denied that he was “truly rich”. Why? Because he hangs out in LA with people worth multiple billions not just one billion, and THEY are the “truly rich” in his eyes
Crassus' view was that you weren't truly rich unless you could recruit and equip a legion, at your own expense.
Recruiting, arming, paying, and maintaining 5,000 soldiers today? That would cost probably about £1bn annually, in a rich world country.
It would be fascinating to work out - if it’s possible - the richest man or woman in history
Elon must be up there
But then, how do you assess a medieval king in a feudal state who theoretically owns the entire nation?
Or a Roman emperor like Augustus?
Simon Beresford (I think - the ST rich list guy) did it 15 years ago in a book called “the richest of the rich”. His methodology was % of GDP at death.
I still have it somewhere but from memory it was Hammurabi of Babylon, then Alan Rufus (he owned 7% of England’s GDP on the basis of being the childhood best friend of William the Bastard)
Talking of crass appeasement of local sentiment, it was outrageous that Sam Fender’s ersatz drivel won the Mercury ahead of the wonderful Pink Pantheress.
Why was it outrageous ?
The judges are either deaf, or bowed to the pressure to give it to a performer from up north. I suspect the latter.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I accept that I am rich. Inheriting from hard-working parents helped!
That is the HYUFD plan for the entire nation! He hasn't quite worked out the average age of inheritance is early sixties, nor that shock horror, some families don't have an estate of multiple properties to divvy up between their kids.
Plenty of deposits for houses are obtained by 30 to 40 year olds from grandparents via inheritance or parents via the 7 year survivorship gift rule.
None of my 3 children depended on hand downs from us but bought their homes on their own finances
The idea children depend on hand downs from their parents applies to a privileged few, and frankly Reeves would be justified in abolishing the 7 year rule
Congratulations, your family's application for Sainthood is in the post.
Most voters however will vote on what maximises their self interest and that includes vehement opposition to abolishing the 7 year rule
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I honestly would tactically vote for Starmer Labour to beat the Greens, Polanski is Corbyn with bells on
Yes he is but where does that leave greens in the rural shires who don’t go for wealth taxes, gender wars and Gaza, going to the Lib Dem’s ?
Yes, Polanski will send many 2024 Green voters LD or even back to Tory in Herefordshire and Suffolk but gain some voters from Labour in the inner cities and university towns
Some of the members maybe, Starmer is not stupid enough to require taxpayers to fund it.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
The CoE does as well.
I suspect some form of ‘reparations’ will come via the foreign aid budget in future.
Lenny Henry has written a book on it too.
Yes and Lenny Henry's plan was made, taxpayers will not accept higher taxes to fund a higher foreign aid budget to fund reparations.
If you wanted an early Christmas present for Farage that would be it
The Jewish population of Birmingham is only 0.1% compared to 0.5% in England as a whole.
In my experience, football 'fan' ultras will pick up on any excuse or incident to aggravate their rivals and provoke a ruck. See Rangers and Celtic with their references to 1690, 1916, down to individual offences like the Kurt Zouma cat abuse case, and so on
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I have a friend who is worth about £950m. Literally (he married very well)
He once denied that he was “truly rich”. Why? Because he hangs out in LA with people worth multiple billions not just one billion, and THEY are the “truly rich” in his eyes
Crassus' view was that you weren't truly rich unless you could recruit and equip a legion, at your own expense.
Recruiting, arming, paying, and maintaining 5,000 soldiers today? That would cost probably about £1bn annually, in a rich world country.
It would be fascinating to work out - if it’s possible - the richest man or woman in history
Elon must be up there
But then, how do you assess a medieval king in a feudal state who theoretically owns the entire nation?
Or a Roman emperor like Augustus?
Simon Beresford (I think - the ST rich list guy) did it 15 years ago in a book called “the richest of the rich”. His methodology was % of GDP at death.
I still have it somewhere but from memory it was Hammurabi of Babylon, then Alan Rufus (he owned 7% of England’s GDP on the basis of being the childhood best friend of William the Bastard)
According to wiki Rufus was only third in England at the time of the Doomsday Book so seems an unlikely candidate.
One determinant may be when the daily movements on the financial markets make you thousands of pounds richer or poorer.
It certainly makes those spending their time in bookies or obsessing on niche betting websites look small time in comparison.
This determinant can only properly be appreciated by those with DC pensions.
I think you are really rich once you reach the point that you don't have to care about movements on the stock market, or about money in general. The money is always there, to enable you to do the things you want to do.
And when one reaches that stage people start to believe that to be "really rich" you have homes in at least 3 countries and at least one of a boat or private jet. It is amazing how few people are willing to accept they are rich.
I accept that I am rich. Inheriting from hard-working parents helped!
That is the HYUFD plan for the entire nation! He hasn't quite worked out the average age of inheritance is early sixties, nor that shock horror, some families don't have an estate of multiple properties to divvy up between their kids.
Plenty of deposits for houses are obtained by 30 to 40 year olds from grandparents via inheritance or parents via the 7 year survivorship gift rule.
None of my 3 children depended on hand downs from us but bought their homes on their own finances
The idea children depend on hand downs from their parents applies to a privileged few, and frankly Reeves would be justified in abolishing the 7 year rule
Congratulations, your family's application for Sainthood is in the post.
Most voters however will vote on what maximises their self interest and that includes vehement opposition to abolishing the 7 year rule
It's not sainthood - it is what the vast majority have to do
Some of the members maybe, Starmer is not stupid enough to require taxpayers to fund it.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
...I suspect some form of ‘reparations’ will come via the foreign aid budget in future...
I hope not. We aren't responsible for the past (defined as before our parents' births). Things were different then.
Talking of crass appeasement of local sentiment, it was outrageous that Sam Fender’s ersatz drivel won the Mercury ahead of the wonderful Pink Pantheress.
Why was it outrageous ?
The judges are either deaf, or bowed to the pressure to give it to a performer from up north. I suspect the latter.
The Jewish population of Birmingham is only 0.1% compared to 0.5% in England as a whole.
In my experience, football 'fan' ultras will pick up on any excuse or incident to aggravate their rivals and provoke a ruck. See Rangers and Celtic with their references to 1690, 1916, down to individual offences like the Kurt Zouma cat abuse case, and so on
Time to end the disastrous experiment that is Association Football.
Repeat offenders will be required to watch The Hundred on a continuous loop forever.
“I do think he needs help,” Pritzker said of Trump to Tim Miller, the host of “The Bulwark” podcast. “And I don’t think anybody around him on a day-to-day basis wants to get him any help because they have more power based upon his diminished capacity.” Pritzker then brought up Miller, whom he said “clearly is the one pushing the tactics at [Department of Homeland Security], at [Customs and Border Protection], at [Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE)].”
“He’s clearly the person that is aiming to have Donald Trump become an authoritarian leader,” Pritzker continued. “And I wish that, you know, people could at least recognize that Stephen Miller is bad for the country, and he is abusing the fact that Donald Trump has diminished capacity.”
Perhaps someone should report him for elder abuse?
Some of the members maybe, Starmer is not stupid enough to require taxpayers to fund it.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
The CoE does as well.
I suspect some form of ‘reparations’ will come via the foreign aid budget in future.
Lenny Henry has written a book on it too.
Yes and Lenny Henry's plan was made, taxpayers will not accept higher taxes to fund a higher foreign aid budget to fund reparations.
If you wanted an early Christmas present for Farage that would be it
His and his fellow authors interview in the Guardian, which is pretty favourable to his cause, makes it clear it’s long term borrowing needed to fund it.
‘ Even though it sticks in our throats that we were still paying for the compensation to slave owners until 2015, that’s a really good example of how you borrow money and pay it back over a long period of time. There’s loads and loads of ways. And so people should not be scared that reparations would bankrupt Britain.’
Mark David Johnston The Liberal Democrats 1009 Natasha Lawrence The Green Party 368 Will De Save The Conservative Party 251 Marcus John Harriott Reform UK 242 Jonathan Francis White Independent 218
LD 48.32% [+11.68] Grn 17.62% [-0.55] Con 12.02% [-16.88] Ref 11.59% [new] Ind 10.44% [new]
Some of the members maybe, Starmer is not stupid enough to require taxpayers to fund it.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
...I suspect some form of ‘reparations’ will come via the foreign aid budget in future...
I hope not. We aren't responsible for the past (defined as before our parents' births). Things were different then.
There’s also climate reparations on the table too.
It’s always a shakedown for cash.
My ancestors were either rural farm workers in Warwickshire or Irish Navvies breaking their backs digging canals. Depending on which side.
Of course I should pay money to the descendants of,slaves 😂
The Jewish population of Birmingham is only 0.1% compared to 0.5% in England as a whole.
In my experience, football 'fan' ultras will pick up on any excuse or incident to aggravate their rivals and provoke a ruck. See Rangers and Celtic with their references to 1690, 1916, down to individual offences like the Kurt Zouma cat abuse case, and so on
Time to end the disastrous experiment that is Association Football.
Repeat offenders will be required to watch The Hundred on a continuous loop forever.
Hang on, this isn't a football issue. It is policing a political protest that happens to be at football.
Some of the members maybe, Starmer is not stupid enough to require taxpayers to fund it.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
The CoE does as well.
I suspect some form of ‘reparations’ will come via the foreign aid budget in future.
Lenny Henry has written a book on it too.
Yes and Lenny Henry's plan was made, taxpayers will not accept higher taxes to fund a higher foreign aid budget to fund reparations.
If you wanted an early Christmas present for Farage that would be it
His and his fellow authors interview in the Guardian, which is pretty favourable to his cause, makes it clear it’s long term borrowing needed to fund it.
‘ Even though it sticks in our throats that we were still paying for the compensation to slave owners until 2015, that’s a really good example of how you borrow money and pay it back over a long period of time. There’s loads and loads of ways. And so people should not be scared that reparations would bankrupt Britain.’
The Jewish population of Birmingham is only 0.1% compared to 0.5% in England as a whole.
In my experience, football 'fan' ultras will pick up on any excuse or incident to aggravate their rivals and provoke a ruck. See Rangers and Celtic with their references to 1690, 1916, down to individual offences like the Kurt Zouma cat abuse case, and so on
It isn't football ultras who are the threat here. It is Islamist thugs who want Birmingham to be a Jew-free city.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
The Greens didn't do too well in one of the local elections yesterday in Staines.
Staines: LD 804 Reform 499 Ind 261 Con 231 Green 163 Lab 158 Tusc 8
Lib Dem gain from Green
LD 37.85% [new] Ref 23.49% [new] Ind 12.29% [new unless comparing to the previous ind] Con 10.88% [-4.73] Grn 7.67% [-27.84] Lab 7.44% [-14.07] TUSC 0.38% [new]
Indeed it is, but the Villa ground is actually in Witton adjacent to Aston and Bordesley by the Blues Ground is also a shithole. I was there in April. It’s vile. It was far nicer when the land was derelict. By the West Brom ground is also a toilet.
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Or, more likely, play the game behind closed doors. Punish the club because it has shit fans incapable of behaving themselves.
Are you sure that it’s AV fans causing the issue? Surely more likely to be unpleasant locals
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Or, more likely, play the game behind closed doors. Punish the club because it has shit fans incapable of behaving themselves.
Are you sure that it’s AV fans causing the issue? Surely more likely to be unpleasant locals
Some proper numpties around on this issue. Clearly never been to Villa Park.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
The Greens didn't do too well in one of the local elections yesterday in Staines.
Staines: LD 804 Reform 499 Ind 261 Con 231 Green 163 Lab 158 Tusc 8
Lib Dem gain from Green
LD 37.85% [new] Ref 23.49% [new] Ind 12.29% [new unless comparing to the previous ind] Con 10.88% [-4.73] Grn 7.67% [-27.84] Lab 7.44% [-14.07] TUSC 0.38% [new]
Their brand of Corbynite hard left crap is not going to go down well in the leafy shires.
I really fear for our country following West Midlands disgraceful prohibitation of Maccabi Tel Aviv fans attending their match at Villa
Has there ever been such a crass decision by the police effectively saying 'Jews are not welcome here' ?
The trouble is the way the Internet/modern media is, if the police had said it can go ahead and there was a riot then everyone and his dog would be screaming: why did they allow this to go ahead.
Maybe it's time to restrict pointless gossip on the internet. Especially if it seems to be leading to the infringement of other freedoms we've always taken for granted.
Love to know where the money is coming from - this Government can't even pay for all the things it currently spends money on let alone other items.
They make it clear in the guardian article I linked, as we only recently paid off the money paid to slave owners, do,the same borrow/issue gilts, on a long term basis to cover the £19 trillion we are deemed to owe and pay it back gradually
I really fear for our country following West Midlands disgraceful prohibitation of Maccabi Tel Aviv fans attending their match at Villa
Has there ever been such a crass decision by the police effectively saying 'Jews are not welcome here' ?
The trouble is the way the Internet/modern media is, if the police had said it can go ahead and there was a riot then everyone and his dog would be screaming: why did they allow this to go ahead.
Maybe it's time to restrict pointless gossip on the internet.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid. This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
I'd be fine with Israeli teams being banned by UEFA for the war in Gaza. I'm not fine with Maccabi being banned because we can't/won't police it.
Likewise
There is an argument to be had about banning Israeli sports teams. We ban Russian teams. Israel’s relentless attacks on Gaza are not entirely different from Putin slaughtering Ukrainians - tho Israel was gravely provoked, unlike Russia
I’m honestly not sure where I stand on that. Could be persuaded either way. However this case is wholly different - this is banning an away team because the local fans/populace are racist thugs who want to attack the away supporters simply because of their racial and religious identity
I really fear for our country following West Midlands disgraceful prohibitation of Maccabi Tel Aviv fans attending their match at Villa
Has there ever been such a crass decision by the police effectively saying 'Jews are not welcome here' ?
The trouble is the way the Internet/modern media is, if the police had said it can go ahead and there was a riot then everyone and his dog would be screaming: why did they allow this to go ahead.
Maybe it's time to restrict pointless gossip on the internet.
Just tax it heavily. It causes problems like other sins we tax, drinking, gambling, smoking etc and we are discussing the main owners as arguably the richest people in history. Why are we so shy in taking this obvious step when we have run out of things to tax.
Voters may want the Chancellor to increase borrowing rather than tax but as Truss found out that is not an option the markets will accept.
Most likely though she won't increase income tax, national insurance or VAT in line with the Labour manifesto. However she probably will freeze the income tax threshold and increase capital gains tax and possibly have a mansion tax too
IHT is in her sights
I doubt she would be that stupid, if she is Labour will be 3rd or even 4th in most polls soon
She has no good options. She’s fucked the economy with terrible decisions and now she has to raise taxes in a way which will be hideously unpopular - and breaking her promise; it’s also likely she will chase even more rich people away from London - the exodus is already large (the telegraph has been writing about it all week)
That screws the london economy and thus the uk economy and also shrinks our tax base so she will probably make everything worse, again, and end up with less tax than before. So she will have to come back for more taxes. And so on
We are in a doom loop. We are New York City in the 1970s
And maybe New York City in the 2020s if Mamdani wins its Mayoral race next month given his hammer the rich with tax and abolish billionaires platform
It is not within the mayoral powers to abolish billionaires.
Kemi going in high off her feet with a two footed challenge..
Badenoch has spoken to broadcasters on the football fan ban:
“This is a national disgrace. This is something that the police should be able to deal with. We cannot be a country where we tell Jewish people that they can’t come to watch football because their security is not going to be looked after. What I want to see is the police finding ways to make sure they can be secure and sending the message to the Islamists and those who are pushing anti-Jewish hatred that this does not happen in the UK. Britain has always been a sanctuary for Jews and it always should be.”
Badenoch was asked if the police should reverse the decision:
“Yes, they should. And if not, the Home Secretary should get involved. Last week, she was telling us uh all the things that she wanted to do for Jewish people. I didn’t believe her then. I remember when she was lying down in front of a Sainsbury’s because it was selling Israeli goods. They need to give confidence to Jewish people in our country. And if the Home Secretary can’t do it, then the Prime Minister should. He needs to show that he’s got a backbone and isn’t so weak that he will just allow Jewish people to be terrorised here
One solution to the villa tel aviv brouhaha would be for UEFA to ban Aston Villa on the grounds that their fans are anti semitic thugs who threaten Jewish fans with “no mercy” before they even arrive
Villa booted out. Tel aviv get the win by default. We can all move on
Or, more likely, play the game behind closed doors. Punish the club because it has shit fans incapable of behaving themselves.
Are you sure that it’s AV fans causing the issue? Surely more likely to be unpleasant locals
Some proper numpties around on this issue. Clearly never been to Villa Park.
I’ve been to Villa Park dozens of times, same with Wolves, my first ever game was Villa-Bournemouth in 72. This game. Always remember it as the referee was Derek Nippard.
Kemi going in high off her feet with a two footed challenge..
Badenoch has spoken to broadcasters on the football fan ban:
“This is a national disgrace. This is something that the police should be able to deal with. We cannot be a country where we tell Jewish people that they can’t come to watch football because their security is not going to be looked after. What I want to see is the police finding ways to make sure they can be secure and sending the message to the Islamists and those who are pushing anti-Jewish hatred that this does not happen in the UK. Britain has always been a sanctuary for Jews and it always should be.”
Badenoch was asked if the police should reverse the decision:
“Yes, they should. And if not, the Home Secretary should get involved. Last week, she was telling us uh all the things that she wanted to do for Jewish people. I didn’t believe her then. I remember when she was lying down in front of a Sainsbury’s because it was selling Israeli goods. They need to give confidence to Jewish people in our country. And if the Home Secretary can’t do it, then the Prime Minister should. He needs to show that he’s got a backbone and isn’t so weak that he will just allow Jewish people to be terrorised here
For once at least she is absolutely right. Said the same thing myself last night. This is a national embarrassment .
Comments
A Sikh woman wrote a play. That violently issue or part of the Sikh community. After riotous violence, death threats etc, the police said that would not/could not protect the theatre. Since the play was “provocative”.
So the theatre closed the play on safety grounds.
In Birmingham
It is said that Tommy Lots Of Names was inspired by this - create a threat of violence against people (demo goes violent) and get *their* activities banned. See the EDL.
The way to deal with it is, of course, not to privilege either side, and restrict both sets of fans in order to avoid trouble. Hand out exemplary punishment to those who do kick off.
Pretending the match can just go ahead without some special precautions won't wash, though.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gkm4jyrpdo
I mean, I know you're a travel writer for a comic, but don't let that impede you. Albeit that fash-curious is as predictable as it is dull.
Why not stay in the States and get paid a multiple of your current salary to write for the Portland Mid County Memo?
You'd love it, they'd love your cute mildly racist schtick, and we'd love it too, knowing we were unlikely to encounter you guttered outside some Soho flop house.
Deal?
It's not something that comes round particularly often for us either.
I remember being enraged by that decision. The craven surrender to an ethnic minority mob (Sikh in this case). A spineless government unwilling to defend free speech
I actually wrote about it, saying “this feels like a terrible precedent”, and “this will only encourage more mobs to do the same”
And, sadly, here we are. Decades of appeasement and cowardice have left us in a perilous place
The Holy Cross school in NI
Because of shifting populations, the direct route to a Catholic School went through a Protestant street.
A campaign of intimidation and violence was launched, to try and get the school run diverted.
Instead of diverting the children, the Chief Constable of NI lined the road with a wall of armoured Land Rovers.
Then told the waiting press that while he was Chief Constable, the right of the law abiding to use the Queens highway would not be infringed.
Then he led the assembled group of children & parents to the school. He was wearing dress uniform, unlike all the other officers, who were in full riot gear.
That’s what leadership and moral values looks like, I think.
So one has to ask what is the difference between fans of Maccabi Tel Aviv, who are being banned en masse, and fans of other clubs with known hooligan following such as the Krakow teams, the Italian sides with their ultras, or local teams like Millwall or Portsmouth.
The Police are used to dealing with these situations and have done for many years.
I was talking about the Villa situation with my Dad last night. We were imagining how his Dad, who passed away in 1973, would have reacted if you’d told him that Israeli football fans were banned from Birmingham because large parts of the city were majority Islamic.
This is fucking ENGLAND
All I did was make onion soup overnight.
“Green party calls for all Israeli teams to be banned from international competitions because of events in Gaza
“The Green party has issued a statement on the Maccabi Tel Aviv fan ban, in a comment from its co-deputy leader, Mothin Ali, a Leeds councillor.
“He has criticised Keir Starmer for trying to over-rule an operatational decision taken by the police. Ali said:
“Everyone should be able to feel safe when they attend a football match, that’s non-negotiable. It’s irresponsible for Keir Starmer to question a safety decision of a local authority, especially when he is responsible for their chronic underfunding.
“Ali went on to implicitly defend the plan, but he also went much further – saying all Israeli teams should be banned from international competitions because of what is happening in Gaza. He said:
“Under normal circumstances, supporters from across the fanbase should be allowed to attend and provision taken to ban violent elements such as The Ultras. But these are not normal circumstances: these games are taking place in the context of thousands of civilians being killed in Gaza, the illegal occupation of Palestinian land, and the upholding of a system of apartheid.
This raises serious moral questions for the UK, UEFA, and the wider football community. We need a sporting and cultural boycott of all Israeli teams, like we saw for South African teams under apartheid”
(Guardian liveblog)
The Greens really have parked their eco-tanks on Jezbollah’s allottment. THEY are going to be the pro-Palestinian Islamo-Marxist party
It is such a strange evolution for a movement that began with saving newts and protecting bats. They seem to have forgotten all that
I wonder how older Green Party members feel about all this. Some must be really unhappy
Dig deep taxpayers. It’s coming. More and more in Labour support it.
https://www.appg-ar.org/uk-reparations-conference-2025-agenda
https://x.com/jonsopel/status/1979122475104338298
@jonsopel
The optics of the #AstonVilla ban are truly appalling. How can it be that there is enough policing every weekend to maintain public safety when tens of thousands of pro-Palestinian supporters gather, but there isn’t when it’s maybe a 1000 Maccabi fans on the one night an Israeli club is playing in Britain?
Leave aside the nationality of those banned, once again the police are deciding that football fans are fair game but protesters are not.
Perhaps more telling is his [edit] *self-built* birthplace museum, in Dunfermline. It is quite something to visit. The actual tiny family weaver's cottage (itself a rare and interesting survivor) is absolutely dwarfed by massive halls and galleries surrounding it, including a museum gallery partly filled with the silver keys and orations of thanks and so forth from the opening of new libraries and so on, arising from his spending his wealth - admittedly on many libraries and museums in the UK. He certainly liked his reputation to be polished.
His trust still survives and is active today IIRC. And his dinosaur Diplodocus carnegiei and its plaster casts in London, etc., are still very much doing service in museums.
I'm not fine with Maccabi being banned because we can't/won't police it.
https://x.com/iqbalmohamedMP/status/1978894124968255833
@iqbalmohamedMP
Thank you all who put the safety of Aston Villa fans, Birmingham residents snd the British public above the zionist and political pressure to let Israeli hooligans and terrorists run riot in our country.
Otherwise Labour would fall to third or even 4th, certainly in seats outside the inner cities and university towns.
If a few wealthy old aristocratic families and companies like Barclays want to give some reparations for owning slaves or investing in slave trading companies from the 17th to early 19th century so be it, most British people won't and nor should they as their largely working class or peasant ancestors at the time had no involvement in it at all
I suspect some form of ‘reparations’ will come via the foreign aid budget in future.
Lenny Henry has written a book on it too.
But there's a very simple reason that my daughter and most of her contemporaries will vote Green: tuition fees. LibLabCon have royally shafted the young, and in particular that large part of it which goes to university. Why wouldn't you vote Green if all the others are proposing that yiu should start your adult life £50k or more in debt?
There is an argument to be had about banning Israeli sports teams. We ban Russian teams. Israel’s relentless attacks on Gaza are not entirely different from Putin slaughtering Ukrainians - tho Israel was gravely provoked, unlike Russia
I’m honestly not sure where I stand on that. Could be persuaded either way. However this case is wholly different - this is banning an away team because the local fans/populace are racist thugs who want to attack the away supporters simply because of their racial and religious identity
The idea children depend on hand downs from their parents applies to a privileged few, and frankly Reeves would be justified in abolishing the 7 year rule
I still have it somewhere but from memory it was Hammurabi of Babylon, then Alan Rufus (he owned 7% of England’s GDP on the basis of being the childhood best friend of William the Bastard)
Most voters however will vote on what maximises their self interest and that includes vehement opposition to abolishing the 7 year rule
If you wanted an early Christmas present for Farage that would be it
Repeat offenders will be required to watch The Hundred on a continuous loop forever.
‘ Even though it sticks in our throats that we were still paying for the compensation to slave owners until 2015, that’s a really good example of how you borrow money and pay it back over a long period of time. There’s loads and loads of ways. And so people should not be scared that reparations would bankrupt Britain.’
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/sep/24/lenny-henry-marcus-ryder-the-case-for-reparations-slavery
Mark David Johnston The Liberal Democrats 1009
Natasha Lawrence The Green Party 368
Will De Save The Conservative Party 251
Marcus John Harriott Reform UK 242
Jonathan Francis White Independent 218
LD 48.32% [+11.68]
Grn 17.62% [-0.55]
Con 12.02% [-16.88]
Ref 11.59% [new]
Ind 10.44% [new]
{No Lab, prev 16.28%}
It’s always a shakedown for cash.
My ancestors were either rural farm workers in Warwickshire or Irish Navvies breaking their backs digging canals. Depending on which side.
Of course I should pay money to the descendants of,slaves 😂
None of us owe these grifters a penny.
That would be an ecumenical matter.
Staines:
LD 804
Reform 499
Ind 261
Con 231
Green 163
Lab 158
Tusc 8
Lib Dem gain from Green
LD 37.85% [new]
Ref 23.49% [new]
Ind 12.29% [new unless comparing to the previous ind]
Con 10.88% [-4.73]
Grn 7.67% [-27.84]
Lab 7.44% [-14.07]
TUSC 0.38% [new]
Perhaps they should be bought in as consultants?
Badenoch has spoken to broadcasters on the football fan ban:
“This is a national disgrace. This is something that the police should be able to deal with. We cannot be a country where we tell Jewish people that they can’t come to watch football because their security is not going to be looked after. What I want to see is the police finding ways to make sure they can be secure and sending the message to the Islamists and those who are pushing anti-Jewish hatred that this does not happen in the UK. Britain has always been a sanctuary for Jews and it always should be.”
Badenoch was asked if the police should reverse the decision:
“Yes, they should. And if not, the Home Secretary should get involved. Last week, she was telling us uh all the things that she wanted to do for Jewish people. I didn’t believe her then. I remember when she was lying down in front of a Sainsbury’s because it was selling Israeli goods. They need to give confidence to Jewish people in our country. And if the Home Secretary can’t do it, then the Prime Minister should. He needs to show that he’s got a backbone and isn’t so weak that he will just allow Jewish people to be terrorised here
https://fb.watch/CNV-pMtLwK/?fs=e