politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The debates: The broadcaster up the ante and threaten to em
politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The debates: The broadcaster up the ante and threaten to empty chair Cameron
“The party leaders will be formally invited to take part in these debates. In the event that any of the invited party leaders decline to participate, debates will take place with the party leaders who accept the invitation.”
Comments
-
Blimey.0
-
Not true mike, they have said they will empty chair anybody, no mention of Cameron.0
-
TSE sniping the first, how unfair.0
-
I reckon the head to head Dave vs Ed is the least likely debate to take place as the Lib Dems lawyer up.0
-
Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.0 -
Ed chickening out is probably the best outcome for Lab0
-
All this fits with my view that they think that this is the format that is going to stack up to any legal challenge that might be expected. And that David Cameron will graciously or ungraciously accede - probably graciously.0
-
Completely off topic, but I was always a big fan of "Call My Bluff"0
-
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
0 -
Surely Sinn Fein shouldn't turn up on principle!0
-
The Lib Dems won't challenge the debate format. A bad debate format is better than no debates for the Lib Dems. The debates are one of the few possible game-changers that they have.0
-
-
The broadcasters must be hoping Cameron still says no. Then somebody will start a rumour that he's going to show up at the last minute, and they can hype up an awesome, suspenseful build-up that the voters will find far more interesting than the actual debates.0
-
Good. Cameron needs to stop playing games and get on with it.0
-
FPT
@RobD re. Dark Knight
The guys doing the robbery are shown getting shot by each other/Bank Manager/run over by the bus0 -
Mr. Eagles, disagree. Miliband needs to change the perception he's a weird creature. The debates present such an opportunity.
Mr. Topping, on that narrow point, I disagree. Cameron doesn't want the debates. Lots to lose, and Miliband has much to gain (for all the talk of UKIP and the SNP, it's the blue-red contest that will determine the next PM). By reducing the debates to farce, Cameron enjoys the advantage. If they don't happen, his is the strategic victory.0 -
Ed chickens out of nothing.TheScreamingEagles said:Ed chickening out is probably the best outcome for Lab
Leveson,Syria,Murdoch.
He is fearless (as well as Crap)
0 -
Mr. Owls, not sure bandwagon-jumping is renowned as a heroic activity.0
-
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
FPT Wumper, thanks for that useful and detailed analysis.0
-
But do you actually see it? Maybe it was one of the other Nolan films!Sunil_Prasannan said:FPT
@RobD re. Dark Knight
The guys doing the robbery are shown getting shot by each other/Bank Manager/run over by the bus0 -
Has he come out against mirror group newspapers yet? You know the ones who have massive hacking liabilities.bigjohnowls said:
Ed chickens out of nothing.TheScreamingEagles said:Ed chickening out is probably the best outcome for Lab
Leveson,Syria,Murdoch.
He is fearless (as well as Crap)
0 -
This is a smart move on the part of the broadcasters. Making the empty chair threat clear before any of the parties got a chance to publicly say they were declining will see off claims that they're politically biased.0
-
Deafening silence from the usual media quarters about yesterdays news that Mirror probably at it worse than NOTW....I would have thought that would be big news, but only the Indy reported it and they have consistently seen past just NOTW and talked about wider media and wider world impact of hacking (and I mean proper hacking).saddened said:
Has he come out against mirror group newspapers yet? You know the ones who have massive hacking liabilities.bigjohnowls said:
Ed chickens out of nothing.TheScreamingEagles said:Ed chickening out is probably the best outcome for Lab
Leveson,Syria,Murdoch.
He is fearless (as well as Crap)
Didn't Ed's spin man used to work at the Mirror? Sure he knew nothing.0 -
Even more convinced that debates won't happen.0
-
Yes you do see it!RobD said:
But do you actually see it? Maybe it was one of the other Nolan films!Sunil_Prasannan said:FPT
@RobD re. Dark Knight
The guys doing the robbery are shown getting shot by each other/Bank Manager/run over by the bus0 -
How many leaders would have to decline for that to happen?Eastwinger said:Even more convinced that debates won't happen.
0 -
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across. Red faced, aggressive and tub-thumping is OK at PMQ's but might well not work in a TV studio.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
Three debates is too many. Two would be more than enough. There's far too little well, debate, about what we do if they don't happen. Will we have question time style audiences like in 2005? Half hour interviews with Paxman? Anyone remember Blair's masochism strategy. Something akin to what Clegg does each week on the radio? All these things would be troubled by the same legal restrictions as the debates of course.0
-
Actually last time, in the first 2 debates, he did the opposite, and was criticized for not being aggressive / confrontational enough.OldKingCole said:
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across. Red faced, aggressive and tub-thumping is OK at PMQ's but might well not work in a TV studio.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
Cameron can do statesmanlike, but he's better off in the bear pit of PMQs - he'll probably beat Ed "Just" and that will be a loss relative to expectations.OldKingCole said:
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across. Red faced, aggressive and tub-thumping is OK at PMQ's but might well not work in a TV studio.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
http://sports.williamhill.com/bet/en-gb/betting/e/7077183/.html
"Will Cameron Take Part In Multi Leader Debate With 4 Or More Leaders?"
Yes @ 1/20 -
PMQ's is a weird atmosphere but Cameron has no problem doing smooth when properly prepared and in his native TV studio environment.OldKingCole said:
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across. Red faced, aggressive and tub-thumping is OK at PMQ's but might well not work in a TV studio.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
Betfair Sportsbook
Will a General Election debate take place?
Yes @ 1.83
"Debate must consist of at least David Cameron, Nick Clegg and Ed Miliband. The debate must be broadcast on either BBC, ITV or Sky TV."
0 -
Can't believe the internet lied to me.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Yes you do see it!RobD said:
But do you actually see it? Maybe it was one of the other Nolan films!Sunil_Prasannan said:FPT
@RobD re. Dark Knight
The guys doing the robbery are shown getting shot by each other/Bank Manager/run over by the bus0 -
Ah, but he was the challenger then. He's got to defend his record this time.FrancisUrquhart said:
Actually last time, in the first 2 debates, he did the opposite, and was criticized for not being aggressive / confrontational enough.OldKingCole said:
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across. Red faced, aggressive and tub-thumping is OK at PMQ's but might well not work in a TV studio.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
Still not seeing where Cameron is called out for empty chairing. Time to change the headline?0
-
Didn't notice him being red-faced aggressive and tub-thumping in the 2010 debates.OldKingCole said:
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across. Red faced, aggressive and tub-thumping is OK at PMQ's but might well not work in a TV studio.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
Same as Miliband then. Weird, gurning face.OldKingCole said:
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
Assuming he's taking part of course, and isn't a big Chi...0 -
This site is for people who follow politics, they'll understand what it means.saddened said:Still not seeing where Cameron is called out for empty chairing. Time to change the headline?
0 -
he might not want them but the British public chuffing well wants them. I agree it is good for him but not for....dust in eye....democracy.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Eagles, disagree. Miliband needs to change the perception he's a weird creature. The debates present such an opportunity.
Mr. Topping, on that narrow point, I disagree. Cameron doesn't want the debates. Lots to lose, and Miliband has much to gain (for all the talk of UKIP and the SNP, it's the blue-red contest that will determine the next PM). By reducing the debates to farce, Cameron enjoys the advantage. If they don't happen, his is the strategic victory.0 -
Yes it means that all leaders are under threat from an empty chair, but mike prefers to highlight Cameron.edmundintokyo said:
This site is for people who follow politics, they'll understand what it means.saddened said:Still not seeing where Cameron is called out for empty chairing. Time to change the headline?
0 -
I don't really see it will be much different. It will be claim and counter claim.OldKingCole said:
Ah, but he was the challenger then. He's got to defend his record this time.FrancisUrquhart said:
Actually last time, in the first 2 debates, he did the opposite, and was criticized for not being aggressive / confrontational enough.OldKingCole said:
Cameron's problem is how he'll actually come across. Red faced, aggressive and tub-thumping is OK at PMQ's but might well not work in a TV studio.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.0 -
TaPong said:Betfair Sportsbook
Will a General Election debate take place?
Yes @ 1.83
"Debate must consist of at least David Cameron, Nick Clegg and Ed Miliband. The debate must be broadcast on either BBC, ITV or Sky TV."0 -
As mentioned to @Morris_Dancer I believe he has tactically played a blinder. For himself. And I suppose that was the aim.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
But I think that he has caused mayhem and diminished the democratic process by politicking.
I would be interested to know the ideal line-up as determined by PB consensus, should such a think exist.
I think:
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick.0 -
Do they?TOPPING said:
he might not want them but the British public chuffing well wants them. I agree it is good for him but not for....dust in eye....democracy.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Eagles, disagree. Miliband needs to change the perception he's a weird creature. The debates present such an opportunity.
Mr. Topping, on that narrow point, I disagree. Cameron doesn't want the debates. Lots to lose, and Miliband has much to gain (for all the talk of UKIP and the SNP, it's the blue-red contest that will determine the next PM). By reducing the debates to farce, Cameron enjoys the advantage. If they don't happen, his is the strategic victory.
I doubt anyone cares very much.
0 -
The LibDems have gone all huffy over the inclusion of the other minor parties; it's just as likely to be Clegg throwing a hissy fit, and staying at home.saddened said:
Yes it means that all leaders are under threat from an empty chair, but mike prefers to highlight Cameron.edmundintokyo said:
This site is for people who follow politics, they'll understand what it means.saddened said:Still not seeing where Cameron is called out for empty chairing. Time to change the headline?
0 -
What we don't know (or at least I don't know) is the proposed order of the debates.
There is little chance of the 7 leader debates making radical changes to the VI situation, it will move a few loons on the edges. It won't create a Plaid / SNP surge in Surrey and Manchester. The Greens and UKIP will go +/- a few in various directions. LibDems won't see a surge comparable to 2010. Because of the sheer number of leaders on show neither Cameron or Millband will have enough exposure to make a massive positive move or fall too far.
The place for big movement is in the 1 to 1. If it is held first the effect can be countered over the rest of the campaign by the looser, if it is held last it has the potential to have a far greater effect on the election.0 -
And Natalie! (Greens within 1% of the LibDems in January's polls so far!)TOPPING said:
As mentioned to @Morris_Dancer I believe he has tactically played a blinder. For himself. And I suppose that was the aim.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
But I think that he has caused mayhem and diminished the democratic process by politicking.
I would be interested to know the ideal line-up as determined by PB consensus, should such a think exist.
I think:
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick.0 -
I don't see any ideal line-up. The current proposal is as good a practical suggestion as we're likely to get. But it is very generous to the Greens in particular, and to a lesser extent Plaid Cymru.TOPPING said:
As mentioned to @Morris_Dancer I believe he has tactically played a blinder. For himself. And I suppose that was the aim.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
But I think that he has caused mayhem and diminished the democratic process by politicking.
I would be interested to know the ideal line-up as determined by PB consensus, should such a think exist.
I think:
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick.0 -
Cameron now looks weak if he agrees. Threatened into it by the broadcasters. He needed to agree to the debates as soon as the Greens were in,0
-
They care.Eastwinger said:
Do they?TOPPING said:
he might not want them but the British public chuffing well wants them. I agree it is good for him but not for....dust in eye....democracy.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Eagles, disagree. Miliband needs to change the perception he's a weird creature. The debates present such an opportunity.
Mr. Topping, on that narrow point, I disagree. Cameron doesn't want the debates. Lots to lose, and Miliband has much to gain (for all the talk of UKIP and the SNP, it's the blue-red contest that will determine the next PM). By reducing the debates to farce, Cameron enjoys the advantage. If they don't happen, his is the strategic victory.
I doubt anyone cares very much.
theguardian.com/media/2010/apr/23/election-debate-tv-ratings
9.4m is surely CBB territory?0 -
It means that Cameron has been singled out not by the broadcasters but by PB.com. Draw your own conclusionsedmundintokyo said:
This site is for people who follow politics, they'll understand what it means.saddened said:Still not seeing where Cameron is called out for empty chairing. Time to change the headline?
0 -
As things stand, I would include the Greens. The irony being that things may not have stood like this had they been invited in the first place.TOPPING said:
As mentioned to @Morris_Dancer I believe he has tactically played a blinder. For himself. And I suppose that was the aim.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
But I think that he has caused mayhem and diminished the democratic process by politicking.
I would be interested to know the ideal line-up as determined by PB consensus, should such a think exist.
I think:
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick.
Personally I wouldn't include the nationalist parties but obviously (a) they should have a right of reply on the night of the debate and (b) there should be multi-way debates in Scotland, Wales & NI involving the principal parties there.
Perhaps we need some permanent criteria? Standing in 400 constituencies and polling above 5% (as per some averaging formula)? With the final lineup only being decided 1 week before the debate (so as to allow for late surges)?0 -
I think Camerons first suggestion ofTOPPING said:
As mentioned to @Morris_Dancer I believe he has tactically played a blinder. For himself. And I suppose that was the aim.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
But I think that he has caused mayhem and diminished the democratic process by politicking.
I would be interested to know the ideal line-up as determined by PB consensus, should such a think exist.
I think:
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick.
2 (Cam Mil) , 3 (+ Cleg) and 5 (+ Far and Ben) was as good as any.
You could argue 2, 4, 5. by giving the kippers 2 shots0 -
If anyone dare not be there, it's not Clegg. If you see what I mean.TheWatcher said:
The LibDems have gone all huffy over the inclusion of the other minor parties; it's just as likely to be Clegg throwing a hissy fit, and staying at home.saddened said:
Yes it means that all leaders are under threat from an empty chair, but mike prefers to highlight Cameron.edmundintokyo said:
This site is for people who follow politics, they'll understand what it means.saddened said:Still not seeing where Cameron is called out for empty chairing. Time to change the headline?
0 -
The only people who have noticed so far are political obsessives, nearly all of whom have decided who they will vote for at least two years ago (and in most cases three general elections ago).Alistair said:Cameron now looks weak if he agrees. Threatened into it by the broadcasters. He needed to agree to the debates as soon as the Greens were in,
0 -
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick, Bennett (Sky/C4)TOPPING said:
As mentioned to @Morris_Dancer I believe he has tactically played a blinder. For himself. And I suppose that was the aim.edmundintokyo said:
Cameron's team are doing fine. They've got the debates including three Labour competitors, and the only downside is incredibly minor damage for looking like they want to duck them, which everyone will have forgotten about in a week.TOPPING said:
Agree. re the broadcasters.Morris_Dancer said:Hmm. I still dislike the broadcasters trying to be the tail that wags the dog. There are questions over Northern Irish parties as well, and Clegg must be livid with the situation.
Cameron isn't the only leader with a decision to make.
That said, I genuinely can't think what the best situation would be. Cam, EdM, Nick, Farage is probably it, which the broadcasters came up with.
Although it benefits him and the Cons, in the light of the farce that "the debates" is becoming, I believe Cam/Lynton misplayed this.
But I think that he has caused mayhem and diminished the democratic process by politicking.
I would be interested to know the ideal line-up as determined by PB consensus, should such a think exist.
I think:
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick.
Cam, EdM, Nick, Nicola (STV)
Cam, EdM, Nick, Wood (Wales)
Cam, EdM
Cam, EdM, Nige, Nick, Bennett,Nicola (BBC & ITV)
Perhaps0 -
Hey I'm still undecided ^_~antifrank said:
The only people who have noticed so far are political obsessives, nearly all of whom have decided who they will vote for at least two years ago (and in most cases three general elections ago).Alistair said:Cameron now looks weak if he agrees. Threatened into it by the broadcasters. He needed to agree to the debates as soon as the Greens were in,
0 -
"You either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain."RobD said:
Can't believe the internet lied to me.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Yes you do see it!RobD said:
But do you actually see it? Maybe it was one of the other Nolan films!Sunil_Prasannan said:FPT
@RobD re. Dark Knight
The guys doing the robbery are shown getting shot by each other/Bank Manager/run over by the bus0 -
Well played by team Cameron....wrong footed them all.0
-
0
-
That is brutally effective from the Conservative viewpoint. I very much doubt that the SNP will be too upset by it either.Theuniondivvie said:The Tories latest poster.
http://tinyurl.com/mumkkso0 -
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:0 -
If he accepts, I agree with others that Cameron has done well. He took a bold risk and has now got not just the Greens, but two further left wing parties included. Given that he realistically had no hopes of stopping the debates, this is as good a line-up as he could have hoped for.
If he ducks now, which I wouldn't put past him, he'll look truly ridiculous. The media have reported his insistence about including the Greens with more credulity than it deserved, but the public didn't buy it. If he comes up with another excuse, he'll get slaughtered.0 -
The Tories latest poster.
Not for Scotland, though, surely!!0 -
Per Guido:saddened said:
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:
Tory statement:
“These new proposals are being considered as part of the ongoing discussions about the debates.”
And Labour:
“We will debate anyone the broadcasters choose to invite and we are pleased to see the clear proposal to have three debates all in the general election campaign. The broadcasters have obviously made a very significant move to adopt wholesale the Prime Minister’s proposals and it surely now not possible for him to maintain his opposition to participating in these debates. We relish the opportunity for Ed Miliband to take on David Cameron directly in a head to head debate.”0 -
Quite.antifrank said:
That is brutally effective from the Conservative viewpoint. I very much doubt that the SNP will be too upset by it either.Theuniondivvie said:The Tories latest poster.
http://tinyurl.com/mumkkso
Not sure if it will fill any authentic Unionists with joy though.0 -
The losers in this are the Lib Dems & Farage. Oh and Ed probably isn't too happy about the exposure given to the left wing alternatives.
The massive winners are Plaid. Lucky buggers.0 -
All the polling evidence is that the public did buy it. I agree he has to sign up to this proposal.Socrates said:If he ducks now, which I wouldn't put past him, he'll look truly ridiculous. The media have reported his insistence about including the Greens with more credulity than it deserved, but the public didn't buy it. If he comes up with another excuse, he'll get slaughtered.
0 -
Cameron would turn a tactical victory into a massive strategic defeat if he now runs scared again. You'll have five leaders that want to debate and one that doesn't - one who is making excuses for the second time in a row.Tissue_Price said:
Per Guido:saddened said:
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:
Tory statement:
“These new proposals are being considered as part of the ongoing discussions about the debates.”
And Labour:
“We will debate anyone the broadcasters choose to invite and we are pleased to see the clear proposal to have three debates all in the general election campaign. The broadcasters have obviously made a very significant move to adopt wholesale the Prime Minister’s proposals and it surely now not possible for him to maintain his opposition to participating in these debates. We relish the opportunity for Ed Miliband to take on David Cameron directly in a head to head debate.”
It'll be like the kid that says his computer crashed so he couldn't finish his homework and needs an extension. First time, you're sceptical but you give him the benefit of the doubt. When he then misses the extension because his printer supposedly broke down, everyone knows what's up.0 -
Thanks.Tissue_Price said:
Per Guido:saddened said:
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:
Tory statement:
“These new proposals are being considered as part of the ongoing discussions about the debates.”
And Labour:
“We will debate anyone the broadcasters choose to invite and we are pleased to see the clear proposal to have three debates all in the general election campaign. The broadcasters have obviously made a very significant move to adopt wholesale the Prime Minister’s proposals and it surely now not possible for him to maintain his opposition to participating in these debates. We relish the opportunity for Ed Miliband to take on David Cameron directly in a head to head debate.”0 -
"We will debate WITH anyone the broadcasters choose to invite"Tissue_Price said:
Per Guido:saddened said:
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:
Tory statement:
“These new proposals are being considered as part of the ongoing discussions about the debates.”
And Labour:
“We will debate anyone the broadcasters choose to invite and we are pleased to see the clear proposal to have three debates all in the general election campaign. The broadcasters have obviously made a very significant move to adopt wholesale the Prime Minister’s proposals and it surely now not possible for him to maintain his opposition to participating in these debates. We relish the opportunity for Ed Miliband to take on David Cameron directly in a head to head debate.”
0 -
The majority thought he was trying to dodge the debates. How is that evidence they bought it?Tissue_Price said:
All the polling evidence is that the public did buy it. I agree he has to sign up to this proposal.Socrates said:If he ducks now, which I wouldn't put past him, he'll look truly ridiculous. The media have reported his insistence about including the Greens with more credulity than it deserved, but the public didn't buy it. If he comes up with another excuse, he'll get slaughtered.
0 -
So long as they are not pedants.Sunil_Prasannan said:
"We will debate WITH anyone the broadcasters choose to invite"Tissue_Price said:
Per Guido:saddened said:
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:
Tory statement:
“These new proposals are being considered as part of the ongoing discussions about the debates.”
And Labour:
“We will debate anyone the broadcasters choose to invite and we are pleased to see the clear proposal to have three debates all in the general election campaign. The broadcasters have obviously made a very significant move to adopt wholesale the Prime Minister’s proposals and it surely now not possible for him to maintain his opposition to participating in these debates. We relish the opportunity for Ed Miliband to take on David Cameron directly in a head to head debate.”
0 -
Agreed, he'd be stupid to turn down the debates now. He's got as much as he's going to get.Socrates said:
Cameron would turn a tactical victory into a massive strategic defeat if he now runs scared again. You'll have five leaders that want to debate and one that doesn't - one who is making excuses for the second time in a row.Tissue_Price said:
Per Guido:saddened said:
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:
Tory statement:
“These new proposals are being considered as part of the ongoing discussions about the debates.”
And Labour:
“We will debate anyone the broadcasters choose to invite and we are pleased to see the clear proposal to have three debates all in the general election campaign. The broadcasters have obviously made a very significant move to adopt wholesale the Prime Minister’s proposals and it surely now not possible for him to maintain his opposition to participating in these debates. We relish the opportunity for Ed Miliband to take on David Cameron directly in a head to head debate.”
It'll be like the kid that says his computer crashed so he couldn't finish his homework and needs an extension. First time, you're sceptical but you give him the benefit of the doubt. When he then misses the extension because his printer supposedly broke down, everyone knows what's up.0 -
How unpopular is Salmond in England? I would have thought he could be seen as a shrewd operator who might rein in some of Labour's wilder ideas.antifrank said:
That is brutally effective from the Conservative viewpoint. I very much doubt that the SNP will be too upset by it either.Theuniondivvie said:The Tories latest poster.
http://tinyurl.com/mumkkso
And he has experience of being a very significant part of an effective government!0 -
The majority thought the Greens should be included. And now they have been. Cameron's magnanimity in agreeing to share the airtime more widely will be rewarded.Socrates said:
The majority thought he was trying to dodge the debates. How is that evidence they bought it?Tissue_Price said:
All the polling evidence is that the public did buy it. I agree he has to sign up to this proposal.Socrates said:If he ducks now, which I wouldn't put past him, he'll look truly ridiculous. The media have reported his insistence about including the Greens with more credulity than it deserved, but the public didn't buy it. If he comes up with another excuse, he'll get slaughtered.
0 -
The debates should all feature
Dave
Ed
Nick
Nige
Nic
For 30 mins then have 30 mins of Dave vs Ed
With three different topics0 -
Why has the Tory poster got Salmond instead of Sturgeon?0
-
Antifrank
"That is brutally effective from the Conservative viewpoint. I very much doubt that the SNP will be too upset by it either. "
Only a Tory would find that effective in the same way a non Tory would find a mug shot of Cameron and 'Five More Years' (or any variation thereof) effective0 -
Dave: "I'll debate Ed Miliband!"Neil said:
So long as they are not pedants.Sunil_Prasannan said:
"We will debate WITH anyone the broadcasters choose to invite"Tissue_Price said:
Per Guido:saddened said:
Last I heard labour where preparing a response so you have a link to any official acceptance?Alistair said:
Tory statement:
“These new proposals are being considered as part of the ongoing discussions about the debates.”
And Labour:
“We will debate anyone the broadcasters choose to invite and we are pleased to see the clear proposal to have three debates all in the general election campaign. The broadcasters have obviously made a very significant move to adopt wholesale the Prime Minister’s proposals and it surely now not possible for him to maintain his opposition to participating in these debates. We relish the opportunity for Ed Miliband to take on David Cameron directly in a head to head debate.”
Moderator: "With whom, Prime Minister?" 0 -
Of course, this analysis starts from the premise of the initial debate proposal, in which Cameron was a massive loser. In net terms he still is, compared to no debates at all, but I don't think that was ever a massive runner, notwithstanding any legal impediment.Pong said:The losers in this are the Lib Dems & Farage. Oh and Ed probably isn't too happy about the exposure given to the left wing alternatives.
The massive winners are Plaid. Lucky buggers.0 -
Very, according to Nick Cohen.OldKingCole said:
How unpopular is Salmond in England? I would have thought he could be seen as a shrewd operator who might rein in some of Labour's wilder ideas.antifrank said:
That is brutally effective from the Conservative viewpoint. I very much doubt that the SNP will be too upset by it either.Theuniondivvie said:The Tories latest poster.
http://tinyurl.com/mumkkso
And he's the experience of being a very significant part of an effective government!
Nick Cohen @NickCohen4 · 36m 36 minutes ago
@chrisdeerin @alexmassie @montie People loathe Salmond here0 -
Photogenics?Sunil_Prasannan said:Why has the Tory poster got Salmond instead of Sturgeon?
0 -
Don't you mean Nat instead of Nic?isam said:The debates should all feature
Dave
Ed
Nick
Nige
Nic
For 30 mins then have 30 mins of Dave vs Ed
With three different topics0 -
Because Salmond is the leader-to-be of the Westminster SNP contingent? And because English people recognise Salmond.Sunil_Prasannan said:Why has the Tory poster got Salmond instead of Sturgeon?
0 -
It's a brutal personal attack on someone who is widely thought to be not up to the job. The Conservatives are going to make Ed Miliband's abysmal public image a centrepiece of their campaign. I expect this is just a warm-up.Roger said:Antifrank
"That is brutally effective from the Conservative viewpoint. I very much doubt that the SNP will be too upset by it either. "
Only a Tory would find that effective in the same way a non Tory would find a mug shot of Cameron and 'Five More Years' (or any variation thereof) effective
To answer Old King Cole's point: I don't think Alex Salmond is particularly unpopular in England. But the idea is that Ed Miliband will be duped by a smarter operator.0 -
It's a brutal personal attack masquerading as another political point. I expect several variations on this theme, rather than a simple poster of Ed with the word "USELESS".antifrank said:
It's a brutal personal attack on someone who is widely thought to be not up to the job. The Conservatives are going to make Ed Miliband's abysmal public image a centrepiece of their campaign. I expect this is just a warm-up.Roger said:Antifrank
"That is brutally effective from the Conservative viewpoint. I very much doubt that the SNP will be too upset by it either. "
Only a Tory would find that effective in the same way a non Tory would find a mug shot of Cameron and 'Five More Years' (or any variation thereof) effective
To answer Old King Cole's point: I don't think Alex Salmond is particularly unpopular in England. But the idea is that Ed Miliband will be duped by a smarter operator.0 -
Why has the Tory poster got Salmond instead of Sturgeon?
I wondered that. Nobody knows who the f8ck Sturgeon is?0
