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Doing unto Others – politicalbetting.com

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  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 55,236

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    The problem with reversing it is that the original spin about why it was necessary unwinds. Are they going to insist that Liz Truss made them do it?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837
    Supreme Court blocks Trump on deportations
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,379

    I arrived in Pézenas this afternoon, and I think that it might be my favourite place on earth

    It’s ancient and beautiful. It’s full of classy and interesting shops; I’ve seen more than ten shops selling just art within three hundred yards of my Airbnb apartment (50€ a night, it’s the first floor room on the right in the pic, above a clothes shop called Bobo Leon! The arch at the end of the street is the entrance to Jewish Street - Rue Juiverie - the Jewish ghetto from the late 13C until they were expelled from all of France in 15C)

    There’s a shop that sells biscuits and lemonade, and they’ve sold lemonade for 150 years. There are loads of fancy clothes shops, ice cream parlours, a shop that just sells an enormous range of spices from big jars. There’s a free museum of doors - I’m definitely going there tomorrow

    The place is packed with good restaurants; I had a fantastic dinner tonight, and can’t wait to go out again tomorrow. I’ve found where I’m going to be buying my lunch. There’s a patisserie that makes the town’s specialty - Petit Pâté de Pézenas, a pastry based on keema naan brought to Pézenas by Clive of India - with the same recipe that they’ve used for 247 years. There’s a craft brewery shop opposite the patisserie - maybe the town loves me

    I’m so glad I decided to book three nights here. I’d originally thought that I’d just stay two nights, but then I’d have to leave on Sunday which is always more complicated. I’ve definitely saved the best until last


    Sounds great, must go there sometime.

    Wiki tells me that the population of Pézenas has changed by no more than a 1000 or so in over 200 years. Which seems quite remarkable.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,379
    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    I agree entirely.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    Timeline of the sinking of the Bayesian, from the Marine Accident Investigation Branch interim report:

    https://youtu.be/91MQDzidQps?t=131
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,403
    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    Yes changing the threshold would help and doesn’t look like such a screeching u-turn.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,846

    Supreme Court blocks Trump on deportations

    Who's going to make him obey the Supreme Court? Do the judges control the military?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837
    Kyle Cheney
    @kyledcheney
    ·
    49m
    BREAKING: The Supreme Court rules 7-2 to further enjoin the government from summarily deporting alleged gang members under the Alien Enemies Act.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837
    George Conway 👊🇺🇸🔥
    @gtconway3d
    ·
    24m
    The Supreme Court really beat the shit out of the Government here.

    Wow.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837

    Supreme Court blocks Trump on deportations

    Who's going to make him obey the Supreme Court? Do the judges control the military?
    Well, he can choose to cross that line, but then there's no going back.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,945

    Kyle Cheney
    @kyledcheney
    ·
    49m
    BREAKING: The Supreme Court rules 7-2 to further enjoin the government from summarily deporting alleged gang members under the Alien Enemies Act.

    Be interesting to see Trump's next move.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    edited May 16
    I'll make this pleasant piccie my photo for the day.

    This is the "ride", which is a 200m section of public footpath, down the other side of the "lots of Reform decals" street I posted the other day. On the right is a 10 acre allotment site, and this is on their land and they have looked after it in nice condition for at least 50 years. When I used to cycle to infant school this was, it was less grassy.

    Nice things can come in urban areas. It's a section of a much longer route, which does however need to have some of its anti-wheelchair barriers removed !


  • TazTaz Posts: 18,163

    rcs1000 said:

    Taz said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Taz said:

    Pagan2 said:

    Penddu2 said:

    When comparing songs of yesteryear with the current batch, you have to remember that all of the good notes have been taken.

    Mathematically there are only so many combinations of 8 notes that can be played before some young music industry exective starts shouting 'plagiarism'...

    Indeed men with out hats were sued over 8 notes for plagiarism only about 40k ways to arrange 8 notes over an 8 note sequence
    Jethro Tull claim that one of their songs inspired some of the guitar work on Hotel California by The Eagles.

    George Harrison was sued for plagiarising He’s so Fine by the Chiffons. His song, y Sweet Lord from his majestic Album ‘All Things Must Pass’.

    John Lennon, being a wanker, basically sided with the suing party.

    Although George had the last laugh.
    George Harrison:

    (a) had the best selling solo album from an ex-Beatle (with -as you say- the majestic All Things Must Pass)

    and

    (b) the last number one single from an ex-Beatle (with his cover of I've Got My Mind Set on You)
    The Matt Monro version of ‘Isn’t it a Pity’ is pretty decent.

    Eric Clapton’s Layla, which features a fantastic instrumental Coda as used in Goodfellas, was about Harrison’s wife Patti with whom he was intimately acquainted.

    I’ve said before, the gaining of wisdom comes with the realisation George is the best of the Beatles.
    Something is quite possibly the very best Beatles song of all. (And Here Comes the Sun is right up there too.)
    Determining the best Beatles song of all is an impossible challenge. All you can say with certainty is that it's a very strong field.
    It certainly is and Maxwell’s Silver Hammer is not going to be up there with the best.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 84,020
    edited May 16
    Andy_JS said:

    Kyle Cheney
    @kyledcheney
    ·
    49m
    BREAKING: The Supreme Court rules 7-2 to further enjoin the government from summarily deporting alleged gang members under the Alien Enemies Act.

    Be interesting to see Trump's next move.
    Deport the gang of 7.....
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837
    GOP 'Bigly' Tax Bill stuck in the party's own swamp.

    LOL.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 84,020
    If Starmer U-Turns on WFA I thought the economy would do a Liz Truss, it was vital to save that money?

    More seriously, are they just going to end up with what I suggested at the time, to find a way to collect more tax off richer pensioners rather than means testing things like WFA.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837
    Andy_JS said:

    Kyle Cheney
    @kyledcheney
    ·
    49m
    BREAKING: The Supreme Court rules 7-2 to further enjoin the government from summarily deporting alleged gang members under the Alien Enemies Act.

    Be interesting to see Trump's next move.
    Once he's finished with The Boss, he can focus on this lot.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 84,020
    edited May 16

    George Conway 👊🇺🇸🔥
    @gtconway3d
    ·
    24m
    The Supreme Court really beat the shit out of the Government here.

    Wow.

    I don't think people give quite enough credit that some of the Supreme court might be Republican but their beliefs in things like the absolutism of the constitution trumps party politics. They are quite odd in many ways, but it also means they are very awkward for Trump when it tries to just ride roughshod over historical laws.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 6,013
    MattW said:

    I'll make this pleasant piccie my photo for the day.

    This is the "ride", which is a 200m section of public footpath, down the other side of the "lots of Reform decals" street I posted the other day. On the right is a 10 acre allotment site, and this is on their land and they have looked after it in nice condition for at least 50 years. When I used to cycle to infant school this was, it was less grassy.

    Nice things can come in urban areas. It's a section of a much longer route, which does however need to have some of its anti-wheelchair barriers removed !


    Do you have trouble with quadbikes? I was walking around some canals recently and was almost knocked into the water. How can we remove barriers to wheelchairs but still keep dirt bikes and quad bikes away?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 38,413
    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 38,413
    The Mad King is not having a good day...
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,599
    Scott_xP said:

    The Mad King is not having a good day...

    Don't diss the TayTay.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 15,103
    rcs1000 said:

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    It has been scientifically proven that the best music TV and film was when you were aged about 16 years old, however old you are.

    https://bsky.app/profile/rickchasey.bsky.social/post/3ll2btujer22a
    As someone born in 1982 its just a coincidence that I was 16 when such legendary music as Vindaloo, Viva Forever and When the Lights Go Out came out. Anyone who disagrees that's the best music can lick my Chocolate Salty Balls.

    I wouldn't say 1998 was the best year for music. Iris is one of the few songs from that year that's still on my playlist today.
    The late 90s were surprisingly shit for pop. There was a series of top of the pops from the 90s on BBC4 a few years ago. It was notable and a bit sad how tge quality tailed off. 90-95 were pretty strong,and then a steep decline thereafter. This wasn't just because of my age - I was 15 in 1990 - because once you get into the noughties things pick up a bit again.
    Errr:

    The Bends and OK Computer.
    Blur.

    Some bits of Oasis.
    Different Class by Pulp.
    Different Class was, what, 95? (Amd wasn't as good as His n Hers.) Then This is Hardcore was Rubbish, and We Love Life was 00s.
    Oasis peaked with their first album and did absolutely nothing worth bothering with after 95.
    Blur peaked with Parklife, though remained interesting thereafter.
    Can't comment on Radiohead - sorry. I think they're worthwhile but I never really got round to them.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 14,242

    Supreme Court blocks Trump on deportations

    Who's going to make him obey the Supreme Court? Do the judges control the military?
    A real constitutional crisis is when two positions meet headlong, neither veering off course, and together comprising in some sense an immovable object and an irresistible force, and where it is impossible to determine what happens next except by 'wait and see'. So far this has been avoided. I doubt if this case will be the one. But I suspect it will happen in the end

    As to the military; in the end the military decide who controls the military. Members swear an oath to defend the constitution. But of course in a proper constitutional crisis there will be doubt both as to what a particular bit of the constitution means, and whether it is embodied in the POTUS, the courts or the legislature. So it may not assist them much.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 54,017
    edited May 16
    Scott_xP said:

    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.

    "FAKE NEWS from the RADICAL LEFT LUNATICS!!!"
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 1,269
    nico67 said:

    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    Yes changing the threshold would help and doesn’t look like such a screeching u-turn.
    It might practically help most of the pensioners worst affected by the change, but would changing the threshold help fix the political problem? It feels to me like most voters won't really notice or remember a technical tweak like that, especially so long after the original action, so the government will still be in their minds the one that "took away the winter fuel payments".
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 55,236
    I think I’ve worked out which sacred cow Starmer can sacrifice next: devolution.

    https://x.com/scotgov/status/1923377958565085671

    Migration is vital for building a stronger economy in Scotland, and sustaining our public services.

    With a tailored approach to immigration, we can build a stronger economy that works for everyone in Scotland.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,595
    Scott_xP said:

    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.

    Someone definitely downgraded the US during the GFC because I remember Radio 4 noting that the dollar strengthened off the back of it. And the dollar is up today.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 38,413
    tlg86 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.

    Someone definitely downgraded the US during the GFC because I remember Radio 4 noting that the dollar strengthened off the back of it. And the dollar is up today.
    Apparently Moody's are the last to downgrade
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837
    Scott_xP said:

    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.

    How many minutes until the truthsocial tweet threatening to close down the ratings agencies WHO ARE LOSERS and WRONG ALL the TIME?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 55,331

    I arrived in Pézenas this afternoon, and I think that it might be my favourite place on earth

    It’s ancient and beautiful. It’s full of classy and interesting shops; I’ve seen more than ten shops selling just art within three hundred yards of my Airbnb apartment (50€ a night, it’s the first floor room on the right in the pic, above a clothes shop called Bobo Leon! The arch at the end of the street is the entrance to Jewish Street - Rue Juiverie - the Jewish ghetto from the late 13C until they were expelled from all of France in 15C)

    There’s a shop that sells biscuits and lemonade, and they’ve sold lemonade for 150 years. There are loads of fancy clothes shops, ice cream parlours, a shop that just sells an enormous range of spices from big jars. There’s a free museum of doors - I’m definitely going there tomorrow

    The place is packed with good restaurants; I had a fantastic dinner tonight, and can’t wait to go out again tomorrow. I’ve found where I’m going to be buying my lunch. There’s a patisserie that makes the town’s specialty - Petit Pâté de Pézenas, a pastry based on keema naan brought to Pézenas by Clive of India - with the same recipe that they’ve used for 247 years. There’s a craft brewery shop opposite the patisserie - maybe the town loves me

    I’m so glad I decided to book three nights here. I’d originally thought that I’d just stay two nights, but then I’d have to leave on Sunday which is always more complicated. I’ve definitely saved the best until last


    Sounds great, must go there sometime.

    Wiki tells me that the population of Pézenas has changed by no more than a 1000 or so in over 200 years. Which seems quite remarkable.
    I'm guessing that there would have been some substitution in that period though?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837
    Scott_xP said:

    The Mad King is not having a good day...

    He'll always have Doha.
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 6,355
    pm215 said:

    nico67 said:

    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    Yes changing the threshold would help and doesn’t look like such a screeching u-turn.
    It might practically help most of the pensioners worst affected by the change, but would changing the threshold help fix the political problem? It feels to me like most voters won't really notice or remember a technical tweak like that, especially so long after the original action, so the government will still be in their minds the one that "took away the winter fuel payments".
    The big problem with a change in threshold is that it'll mean proper, expensive means testing. The current plan to hook it pension credits is pretty much cost-free to calculate. Actual means testing will swallow much of the cash raised
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 84,020
    Melania Trump statue goes missing in Slovenia
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvg7egyrk40o

    What a strange way to describe it being stolen.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837

    If Starmer U-Turns on WFA I thought the economy would do a Liz Truss, it was vital to save that money?

    More seriously, are they just going to end up with what I suggested at the time, to find a way to collect more tax off richer pensioners rather than means testing things like WFA.

    Yep. Which is what they should have done all along, but Reeves just took whatever slops the Treasury had lying around at the bottom of the in-tray.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,403
    pm215 said:

    nico67 said:

    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    Yes changing the threshold would help and doesn’t look like such a screeching u-turn.
    It might practically help most of the pensioners worst affected by the change, but would changing the threshold help fix the political problem? It feels to me like most voters won't really notice or remember a technical tweak like that, especially so long after the original action, so the government will still be in their minds the one that "took away the winter fuel payments".
    I think the political problem remains even if they u-turn completely . At the next election the opposition parties will hammer Labour on this . They did something not in the manifesto and even if they promise to keep things like the Triple Lock why would pensioners trust them . That will be the message .

    I still find it astonishing that Starmer didn’t veto this WFA change and just waved it through .
  • CookieCookie Posts: 15,103
    MattW said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    There has been an actual study done on this which shows that music has become less complex. Both Chord changes and key changes have reduced dramatically

    The study that was done in 2022 looked at every number one hit listed on the Billboard Hot 100 since 1958 – more than 1100 songs.

    About a 25% of those songs from the 1960s to the 1990s included a key change.

    Between 2010 and 2020 the number of number one hit songs including a key change was.... 1
    Yes, it's not disputed. Music has got less complex, less interesting, less varied, and the lyrics have similarly got simpler and cruder. It's a known, measurable thing. We are not imagining it

    This happens in art forms. Who gives a fuck about modern poetry, or the latest opera? Art forms come and go, they rise and peak and fall

    Popular music peaked 1965-2000

    But other forms of art replace them, as they rise in turn. Who expected TV drama to become so sophisticated and rewarding? There was no hint of the Golden Age to come in 1980

    Meanwhile videogames are a whole new artform - not to my taste, but I accept they are now highly creative and imaginative

    The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age.
    I can offer two reasons:
    1) Young people don't court that way. They do it online and are slightly uncomfortable with the sort of IRL flirting which give clubs some of their frisson.
    2) Pubs are open later. Think back to the 90s: you went to a club whether you wanted to or not because the pubs shut at 11. Interestingly, Edinburgh's clubs were actually a bit shit for a city of its size because the pubs stayed open longer and provided less impetus to move on.

    No doubt there are others.
    I don't see it as in number two, even for a time at Uni or whatever.

    Why go to a club whether you want to or not - why be a sheep? Perhaps think for yourself or get some more interesting friends.

    Go home and get some sleep (with your pullee if that is your game) and have a better day the next day?
    Perhaps we're at cross purposes? In the 90s, if it was 11pm and you didn't want the night to end, you went to a club, because the pubs closed. That no longer has to be the case. It wasn't being a sheep - there were just far fewer options for socialising after 11pm back then. My friends were wildly interesting - that's why I wanted the evening to continue.
    There were some clubs - like the Leadmill in Sheffield - which were great nights out in their own right; where you'd arrive early. But sometimes clubs got our business because all we wanted was the night not to end yet.
  • RattersRatters Posts: 1,326
    Scott_xP said:

    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.

    I find it amazing they kept them at AAA for so long. Their reserve currency status is the only possible reason given debt levels versus AA-rated Germany.

    It doesn't really matter though. The AAA part of the government and corporate bond market has already (essentially) disappeared.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    Scott_xP said:

    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.

    Ooops.

    Has Plenipotentiary Trump responded yet?
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,403
    I hope what is being reported in the Times is accurate re a UK EU youth mobility scheme . If it’s capped then the argument can be made that it won’t effect the net migration numbers as you’ll get enough younger Brits wanting to take up the chance so it’s likely to end up neutral .

    Labour for months has been obsessed with placating Reform voters which as yet hasn’t made any difference to the polling . 75% of 2024 Labour voters voted Remain and more broadly there's a clear majority who want to see closer links with the EU . A good section of leavers also support a youth mobility scheme .
  • isamisam Posts: 41,640
    nico67 said:

    pm215 said:

    nico67 said:

    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    Yes changing the threshold would help and doesn’t look like such a screeching u-turn.
    It might practically help most of the pensioners worst affected by the change, but would changing the threshold help fix the political problem? It feels to me like most voters won't really notice or remember a technical tweak like that, especially so long after the original action, so the government will still be in their minds the one that "took away the winter fuel payments".
    I think the political problem remains even if they u-turn completely . At the next election the opposition parties will hammer Labour on this . They did something not in the manifesto and even if they promise to keep things like the Triple Lock why would pensioners trust them . That will be the message .

    I still find it astonishing that Starmer didn’t veto this WFA change and just waved it through .
    Starmer has lied or gone back on his word on almost every issue since he became an MP. The difference before was most people were too busy slagging off Brexit or Boris to notice and kind of thought of Sir Keir as a Saint because he tried to block Brexit and was direct rival of the man who got it done. But this is what he is
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,593

    I think I’ve worked out which sacred cow Starmer can sacrifice next: devolution.

    https://x.com/scotgov/status/1923377958565085671

    Migration is vital for building a stronger economy in Scotland, and sustaining our public services.

    With a tailored approach to immigration, we can build a stronger economy that works for everyone in Scotland.

    Perhaps Starmer should move all the asylum seekers to Scotland.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,593
    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    Student fees being another thing that Starmer and Reeves have increased.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 6,013

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    Student fees being another thing that Starmer and Reeves have increased.
    They were running drastically behind inflation, so not really.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,846
    Cookie said:

    MattW said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    There has been an actual study done on this which shows that music has become less complex. Both Chord changes and key changes have reduced dramatically

    The study that was done in 2022 looked at every number one hit listed on the Billboard Hot 100 since 1958 – more than 1100 songs.

    About a 25% of those songs from the 1960s to the 1990s included a key change.

    Between 2010 and 2020 the number of number one hit songs including a key change was.... 1
    Yes, it's not disputed. Music has got less complex, less interesting, less varied, and the lyrics have similarly got simpler and cruder. It's a known, measurable thing. We are not imagining it

    This happens in art forms. Who gives a fuck about modern poetry, or the latest opera? Art forms come and go, they rise and peak and fall

    Popular music peaked 1965-2000

    But other forms of art replace them, as they rise in turn. Who expected TV drama to become so sophisticated and rewarding? There was no hint of the Golden Age to come in 1980

    Meanwhile videogames are a whole new artform - not to my taste, but I accept they are now highly creative and imaginative

    The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age.
    I can offer two reasons:
    1) Young people don't court that way. They do it online and are slightly uncomfortable with the sort of IRL flirting which give clubs some of their frisson.
    2) Pubs are open later. Think back to the 90s: you went to a club whether you wanted to or not because the pubs shut at 11. Interestingly, Edinburgh's clubs were actually a bit shit for a city of its size because the pubs stayed open longer and provided less impetus to move on.

    No doubt there are others.
    I don't see it as in number two, even for a time at Uni or whatever.

    Why go to a club whether you want to or not - why be a sheep? Perhaps think for yourself or get some more interesting friends.

    Go home and get some sleep (with your pullee if that is your game) and have a better day the next day?
    Perhaps we're at cross purposes? In the 90s, if it was 11pm and you didn't want the night to end, you went to a club, because the pubs closed. That no longer has to be the case. It wasn't being a sheep - there were just far fewer options for socialising after 11pm back then. My friends were wildly interesting - that's why I wanted the evening to continue.
    There were some clubs - like the Leadmill in Sheffield - which were great nights out in their own right; where you'd arrive early. But sometimes clubs got our business because all we wanted was the night not to end yet.
    Much easier to go out earlier and still make the last bus home.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,593
    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Is anyone surprised to learn this?

    "Engineers have discovered 'kill switches' embedded in Chinese-manufactured parts on American solar farms, raising fears Beijing could manipulate supplies or 'physically destroy' grids across the US, UK and Europe. "

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-14718749/China-secretly-installed-kill-switches-solar-panels-sold-West-Beijing-plunge-enemies-darkness-event-WW3.html

    Ban them. Its not hard.
    Given the percentage of global production which comes from China now, actually it is.

    Huge strategic error by the West.
    But very profitable decisions for the executives who transferred production to China.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 55,236
    Former FBI Director James Comey to be interviewed by the US Secret Service over social media post aimed at Trump

    https://edition.cnn.com/2025/05/16/politics/comey-interviewed-secret-service
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,928
    isam said:

    nico67 said:

    pm215 said:

    nico67 said:

    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    Yes changing the threshold would help and doesn’t look like such a screeching u-turn.
    It might practically help most of the pensioners worst affected by the change, but would changing the threshold help fix the political problem? It feels to me like most voters won't really notice or remember a technical tweak like that, especially so long after the original action, so the government will still be in their minds the one that "took away the winter fuel payments".
    I think the political problem remains even if they u-turn completely . At the next election the opposition parties will hammer Labour on this . They did something not in the manifesto and even if they promise to keep things like the Triple Lock why would pensioners trust them . That will be the message .

    I still find it astonishing that Starmer didn’t veto this WFA change and just waved it through .
    Starmer has lied or gone back on his word on almost every issue since he became an MP. The difference before was most people were too busy slagging off Brexit or Boris to notice and kind of thought of Sir Keir as a Saint because he tried to block Brexit and was direct rival of the man who got it done. But this is what he is
    I noticed
  • isamisam Posts: 41,640

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    Student fees being another thing that Starmer and Reeves have increased.
    Starmer said he would scrap tuition fees
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    Cookie said:

    MattW said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    There has been an actual study done on this which shows that music has become less complex. Both Chord changes and key changes have reduced dramatically

    The study that was done in 2022 looked at every number one hit listed on the Billboard Hot 100 since 1958 – more than 1100 songs.

    About a 25% of those songs from the 1960s to the 1990s included a key change.

    Between 2010 and 2020 the number of number one hit songs including a key change was.... 1
    Yes, it's not disputed. Music has got less complex, less interesting, less varied, and the lyrics have similarly got simpler and cruder. It's a known, measurable thing. We are not imagining it

    This happens in art forms. Who gives a fuck about modern poetry, or the latest opera? Art forms come and go, they rise and peak and fall

    Popular music peaked 1965-2000

    But other forms of art replace them, as they rise in turn. Who expected TV drama to become so sophisticated and rewarding? There was no hint of the Golden Age to come in 1980

    Meanwhile videogames are a whole new artform - not to my taste, but I accept they are now highly creative and imaginative

    The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age.
    I can offer two reasons:
    1) Young people don't court that way. They do it online and are slightly uncomfortable with the sort of IRL flirting which give clubs some of their frisson.
    2) Pubs are open later. Think back to the 90s: you went to a club whether you wanted to or not because the pubs shut at 11. Interestingly, Edinburgh's clubs were actually a bit shit for a city of its size because the pubs stayed open longer and provided less impetus to move on.

    No doubt there are others.
    I don't see it as in number two, even for a time at Uni or whatever.

    Why go to a club whether you want to or not - why be a sheep? Perhaps think for yourself or get some more interesting friends.

    Go home and get some sleep (with your pullee if that is your game) and have a better day the next day?
    Perhaps we're at cross purposes? In the 90s, if it was 11pm and you didn't want the night to end, you went to a club, because the pubs closed. That no longer has to be the case. It wasn't being a sheep - there were just far fewer options for socialising after 11pm back then. My friends were wildly interesting - that's why I wanted the evening to continue.
    There were some clubs - like the Leadmill in Sheffield - which were great nights out in their own right; where you'd arrive early. But sometimes clubs got our business because all we wanted was the night not to end yet.
    Heh. Even when I was at Uni I very rarely went to clubs - except Jazz Clubs from time to time. It's never been my thing, nor really have pubs (except on weekends, especially walking weekends), or live pop music gigs, or football matches. So there's a bit of idiosyncracy behind my comment.

    Personally I've never been able to hear enough in clubs even to think about flirting.

    OTOH I was also on a thin sandwich engineering course, and lectures were basically 9 to 5 except for Wednesday afternoons, then no Easter holiday and a full working week until the next September. So no lazy summers, and not much time to waste.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 6,013

    Former FBI Director James Comey to be interviewed by the US Secret Service over social media post aimed at Trump

    https://edition.cnn.com/2025/05/16/politics/comey-interviewed-secret-service

    Arguing "86" means vote out is an interesting one. Originally 86 meant kill. But is has a wider meaning "to get rid of". So fine, right? But Trump can't be voted out, because of the term limits. So...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,837

    Cookie said:

    MattW said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    There has been an actual study done on this which shows that music has become less complex. Both Chord changes and key changes have reduced dramatically

    The study that was done in 2022 looked at every number one hit listed on the Billboard Hot 100 since 1958 – more than 1100 songs.

    About a 25% of those songs from the 1960s to the 1990s included a key change.

    Between 2010 and 2020 the number of number one hit songs including a key change was.... 1
    Yes, it's not disputed. Music has got less complex, less interesting, less varied, and the lyrics have similarly got simpler and cruder. It's a known, measurable thing. We are not imagining it

    This happens in art forms. Who gives a fuck about modern poetry, or the latest opera? Art forms come and go, they rise and peak and fall

    Popular music peaked 1965-2000

    But other forms of art replace them, as they rise in turn. Who expected TV drama to become so sophisticated and rewarding? There was no hint of the Golden Age to come in 1980

    Meanwhile videogames are a whole new artform - not to my taste, but I accept they are now highly creative and imaginative

    The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age.
    I can offer two reasons:
    1) Young people don't court that way. They do it online and are slightly uncomfortable with the sort of IRL flirting which give clubs some of their frisson.
    2) Pubs are open later. Think back to the 90s: you went to a club whether you wanted to or not because the pubs shut at 11. Interestingly, Edinburgh's clubs were actually a bit shit for a city of its size because the pubs stayed open longer and provided less impetus to move on.

    No doubt there are others.
    I don't see it as in number two, even for a time at Uni or whatever.

    Why go to a club whether you want to or not - why be a sheep? Perhaps think for yourself or get some more interesting friends.

    Go home and get some sleep (with your pullee if that is your game) and have a better day the next day?
    Perhaps we're at cross purposes? In the 90s, if it was 11pm and you didn't want the night to end, you went to a club, because the pubs closed. That no longer has to be the case. It wasn't being a sheep - there were just far fewer options for socialising after 11pm back then. My friends were wildly interesting - that's why I wanted the evening to continue.
    There were some clubs - like the Leadmill in Sheffield - which were great nights out in their own right; where you'd arrive early. But sometimes clubs got our business because all we wanted was the night not to end yet.
    Much easier to go out earlier and still make the last bus home.
    "The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age."

    And they wonder why they are so depressed and anxiety plagued.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,945
    Don't believe what I saw about half an hour ago. There's a large roundabout in a local town with a pub in the middle of the roundabout. A blue car casually drove the wrong way round the roundabout, obviously not realising that it was one-way. Luckily they didn't crash into anyone as far as I know. Not sure whether to report it or not, and if so, who to report it to.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 31,142
    Lies! I have it on very good authority that in the real world, the feeling on the doorsteps is surprisingly positive for Labour!
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,759

    Cookie said:

    MattW said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    There has been an actual study done on this which shows that music has become less complex. Both Chord changes and key changes have reduced dramatically

    The study that was done in 2022 looked at every number one hit listed on the Billboard Hot 100 since 1958 – more than 1100 songs.

    About a 25% of those songs from the 1960s to the 1990s included a key change.

    Between 2010 and 2020 the number of number one hit songs including a key change was.... 1
    Yes, it's not disputed. Music has got less complex, less interesting, less varied, and the lyrics have similarly got simpler and cruder. It's a known, measurable thing. We are not imagining it

    This happens in art forms. Who gives a fuck about modern poetry, or the latest opera? Art forms come and go, they rise and peak and fall

    Popular music peaked 1965-2000

    But other forms of art replace them, as they rise in turn. Who expected TV drama to become so sophisticated and rewarding? There was no hint of the Golden Age to come in 1980

    Meanwhile videogames are a whole new artform - not to my taste, but I accept they are now highly creative and imaginative

    The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age.
    I can offer two reasons:
    1) Young people don't court that way. They do it online and are slightly uncomfortable with the sort of IRL flirting which give clubs some of their frisson.
    2) Pubs are open later. Think back to the 90s: you went to a club whether you wanted to or not because the pubs shut at 11. Interestingly, Edinburgh's clubs were actually a bit shit for a city of its size because the pubs stayed open longer and provided less impetus to move on.

    No doubt there are others.
    I don't see it as in number two, even for a time at Uni or whatever.

    Why go to a club whether you want to or not - why be a sheep? Perhaps think for yourself or get some more interesting friends.

    Go home and get some sleep (with your pullee if that is your game) and have a better day the next day?
    Perhaps we're at cross purposes? In the 90s, if it was 11pm and you didn't want the night to end, you went to a club, because the pubs closed. That no longer has to be the case. It wasn't being a sheep - there were just far fewer options for socialising after 11pm back then. My friends were wildly interesting - that's why I wanted the evening to continue.
    There were some clubs - like the Leadmill in Sheffield - which were great nights out in their own right; where you'd arrive early. But sometimes clubs got our business because all we wanted was the night not to end yet.
    Much easier to go out earlier and still make the last bus home.
    "The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age."

    And they wonder why they are so depressed and anxiety plagued.
    They don't earn enough.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 4,759

    Cookie said:

    MattW said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    There has been an actual study done on this which shows that music has become less complex. Both Chord changes and key changes have reduced dramatically

    The study that was done in 2022 looked at every number one hit listed on the Billboard Hot 100 since 1958 – more than 1100 songs.

    About a 25% of those songs from the 1960s to the 1990s included a key change.

    Between 2010 and 2020 the number of number one hit songs including a key change was.... 1
    Yes, it's not disputed. Music has got less complex, less interesting, less varied, and the lyrics have similarly got simpler and cruder. It's a known, measurable thing. We are not imagining it

    This happens in art forms. Who gives a fuck about modern poetry, or the latest opera? Art forms come and go, they rise and peak and fall

    Popular music peaked 1965-2000

    But other forms of art replace them, as they rise in turn. Who expected TV drama to become so sophisticated and rewarding? There was no hint of the Golden Age to come in 1980

    Meanwhile videogames are a whole new artform - not to my taste, but I accept they are now highly creative and imaginative

    The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age.
    I can offer two reasons:
    1) Young people don't court that way. They do it online and are slightly uncomfortable with the sort of IRL flirting which give clubs some of their frisson.
    2) Pubs are open later. Think back to the 90s: you went to a club whether you wanted to or not because the pubs shut at 11. Interestingly, Edinburgh's clubs were actually a bit shit for a city of its size because the pubs stayed open longer and provided less impetus to move on.

    No doubt there are others.
    I don't see it as in number two, even for a time at Uni or whatever.

    Why go to a club whether you want to or not - why be a sheep? Perhaps think for yourself or get some more interesting friends.

    Go home and get some sleep (with your pullee if that is your game) and have a better day the next day?
    Perhaps we're at cross purposes? In the 90s, if it was 11pm and you didn't want the night to end, you went to a club, because the pubs closed. That no longer has to be the case. It wasn't being a sheep - there were just far fewer options for socialising after 11pm back then. My friends were wildly interesting - that's why I wanted the evening to continue.
    There were some clubs - like the Leadmill in Sheffield - which were great nights out in their own right; where you'd arrive early. But sometimes clubs got our business because all we wanted was the night not to end yet.
    Much easier to go out earlier and still make the last bus home.
    Locally at least - the bus company cancelled all the late night buses. So people are either just not going into the city centre - or are finding it cheaper to pay for a hotel room than to pay the taxi back home.

    Mostly - they're just not going out now. One of our oldest 'indie' clubs is closing down as none of the youngsters can afford the travel.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 84,020
    edited May 16
    ohnotnow said:

    Cookie said:

    MattW said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    Has someone turned down the PB IQ dial? This argument is absurd. I feel like I am arguing with 12 year olds

    "Trump will be forgotten by 2029, I literally won't remember him" - @Nigelb

    "Taylor Swift is as good as Bach and Shakespeare" - @BartholomewRoberts

    Any I've missed?

    Near the fish market in Cadiz last Wednesday week was a busker playing Sultans of Swing on a Spanish guitar. Now, what struck me was the song was released in May 1978 - 47 years later, it's still being played and referenced.

    I'm not saying people will remember Dire Straits or every song they ever created or covered but Sultans is an iconic tune and people play it and remember it.

    Even on the ship it was part of the Pop Quiz and while the 21 year old hosting the quiz wasn't born when it came out, she knew it just as people know some of the Beatles songs 60 years on.

    That's the classical music of the 21st Century and perhaps beyond - it's not a question of competing with Bach, Mozart or Elvis but there will be songs which will be remembered and the vast majority which won't.
    Yes, I agree with that

    And I've noticed the same phenom around the world. Pop music 1965-2000 is becoming the classical music of our time. The default, the standard, the accepted best, and the go-to. A bit like Renaissance art 1400-1600?

    Which throws new light on TayTay. I agree she's really good, but I would argue if she was around in 1969, 1976, or even the early 90s she would not be a tenth as famous, or even a hundredth, because she is not THAT good, and she would be competing with many more brilliant artists writing brilliant songs

    TayTay has done really well because she's a genuinely talented young woman - and cute - with a definite ability to write shimmering and catchy tunes, but she is not Bob Dylan, or even Joni Mitchell. She's done so well because she exists in a musical nadir where there is a lack of competition - and also because of a new musical ecosystem which rewards just one or two and ignores everyone else

    And, I repeat, I like her music
    I think you're just old and looking back with rose-tinted glasses. People always think older stuff is better and that modern stuff doesn't compare. There were people saying that in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s too.
    There has been an actual study done on this which shows that music has become less complex. Both Chord changes and key changes have reduced dramatically

    The study that was done in 2022 looked at every number one hit listed on the Billboard Hot 100 since 1958 – more than 1100 songs.

    About a 25% of those songs from the 1960s to the 1990s included a key change.

    Between 2010 and 2020 the number of number one hit songs including a key change was.... 1
    Yes, it's not disputed. Music has got less complex, less interesting, less varied, and the lyrics have similarly got simpler and cruder. It's a known, measurable thing. We are not imagining it

    This happens in art forms. Who gives a fuck about modern poetry, or the latest opera? Art forms come and go, they rise and peak and fall

    Popular music peaked 1965-2000

    But other forms of art replace them, as they rise in turn. Who expected TV drama to become so sophisticated and rewarding? There was no hint of the Golden Age to come in 1980

    Meanwhile videogames are a whole new artform - not to my taste, but I accept they are now highly creative and imaginative

    The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age.
    I can offer two reasons:
    1) Young people don't court that way. They do it online and are slightly uncomfortable with the sort of IRL flirting which give clubs some of their frisson.
    2) Pubs are open later. Think back to the 90s: you went to a club whether you wanted to or not because the pubs shut at 11. Interestingly, Edinburgh's clubs were actually a bit shit for a city of its size because the pubs stayed open longer and provided less impetus to move on.

    No doubt there are others.
    I don't see it as in number two, even for a time at Uni or whatever.

    Why go to a club whether you want to or not - why be a sheep? Perhaps think for yourself or get some more interesting friends.

    Go home and get some sleep (with your pullee if that is your game) and have a better day the next day?
    Perhaps we're at cross purposes? In the 90s, if it was 11pm and you didn't want the night to end, you went to a club, because the pubs closed. That no longer has to be the case. It wasn't being a sheep - there were just far fewer options for socialising after 11pm back then. My friends were wildly interesting - that's why I wanted the evening to continue.
    There were some clubs - like the Leadmill in Sheffield - which were great nights out in their own right; where you'd arrive early. But sometimes clubs got our business because all we wanted was the night not to end yet.
    Much easier to go out earlier and still make the last bus home.
    "The weird thing I find is that young people are no longer going out clubbing. Or drinking.

    Why the fuck not?

    Young people have been dancing together to rhythmic sounds since the Stone Age."

    And they wonder why they are so depressed and anxiety plagued.
    They don't earn enough.
    Going out or to event is very expensive. I have noticed post covid how much gig tickets have now become. Tickets to bands that cost £30 in 2020 are now £70+, and then add in the £7-10 pint etc, its an expensive night out.

    The noughties it was much cheaper, everywhere had deals. You had to go really hard on throwing up your cheesy chips in the taxi at the end of the night to turn it into an expensive one.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 84,020
    What could possibly go wrong.....
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    edited May 16
    carnforth said:

    MattW said:

    I'll make this pleasant piccie my photo for the day.

    This is the "ride", which is a 200m section of public footpath, down the other side of the "lots of Reform decals" street I posted the other day. On the right is a 10 acre allotment site, and this is on their land and they have looked after it in nice condition for at least 50 years. When I used to cycle to infant school this was, it was less grassy.

    Nice things can come in urban areas. It's a section of a much longer route, which does however need to have some of its anti-wheelchair barriers removed !


    Do you have trouble with quadbikes? I was walking around some canals recently and was almost knocked into the water. How can we remove barriers to wheelchairs but still keep dirt bikes and quad bikes away?
    That's a really interesting, nuanced, question. Please forgive a detailed answer.

    The basic legal and "rules" answer is that ASBO, whether quad bikes, or Sur-Ron motor bikes, or pavement parkers, is strictly a police matter, and lawful users of a path cannot be inconvenienced to prevent ASBO. That is the verdict pretty much whenever push comes to shove in the Courts - lots don't like it, including Councils and Police sometimes but they nearly always back down after some posturing. We have Supreme Court level commentary on this.

    Here we do not get quad bikes, as it is a medium sized market town, and this is within 1 mile of the centre (link below to Google maps *). Nobody who would do ASB here has a quad bike - there is no point spending several thousand on something you can only use for ASBO. There needs to be another reason to have one - either a criminal culture of using them as eg in Birmingham, or being a real agricultural area (as might apply in the lakes). We are basically industrial.

    ASB offenders use what they have already which works in the area. Here that is either youngish lads with loud exhausts on cars or motorbikes, or slightly younger types doing wheelies on ebikes. There are a few trail bikes. I see one or two illegal motorbikes of the Sur-Ron pattern each day, which are I think either drug distributors or older men wanting cheap transport; they usually behave when they follow paths or pathways - they don't want police attention or complaints.

    IMO we have far more serious ASB problems with pavement parking, which is perceived as an entitlement after decades of non-enforcement. They get quite abusive if you just point out that they have blocked a drop kerb, even at the hospital entrance, and there is a culture of driving and parking half way across the pavement so that the driver has space to open their offside door *inside the marked bay* .

    On barriers, the officially required width is a 1.5m gap, and Quads and Sur-Rons are a policing matter. I can enforce that legally (Equality Act 2010, Highways Act 1980), but it is one at a time so tedious and slow. So I prioritise routes which are stategic connections, or valuable locally (eg if the diversion is 1/2 mile in a wheelchair), and I will clear out the existing key networks to make an alternative.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    edited May 16
    MattW said:

    carnforth said:

    MattW said:

    I'll make this pleasant piccie my photo for the day.

    This is the "ride", which is a 200m section of public footpath, down the other side of the "lots of Reform decals" street I posted the other day. On the right is a 10 acre allotment site, and this is on their land and they have looked after it in nice condition for at least 50 years. When I used to cycle to infant school this was, it was less grassy.

    Nice things can come in urban areas. It's a section of a much longer route, which does however need to have some of its anti-wheelchair barriers removed !


    Do you have trouble with quadbikes? I was walking around some canals recently and was almost knocked into the water. How can we remove barriers to wheelchairs but still keep dirt bikes and quad bikes away?
    That's a really interesting, nuanced, question. Please forgive a detailed answer.

    The basic legal and "rules" answer is that ASB, whether quad bikes, or Sur-Ron motor bikes, or pavement parkers, is strictly a police matter, and lawful users of a path cannot be inconvenienced to prevent ASB. There are still nuances, but the loopholes have shrunk a long way especially wrt disability. That is the verdict pretty much whenever push comes to shove in the Courts - lots don't like it, including Councils and Police sometimes but they nearly always back down after some posturing. We have Supreme Court level commentary on this.

    Here we do not get quad bikes, as it is a medium sized market town, and this is within 1 mile of the centre (link below to Google maps *). Nobody who would do ASB here has a quad bike - there is no point spending several thousand on something you can only use for ASBO. There needs to be another reason to have one - either a criminal culture of using them as eg in Birmingham, or being a real agricultural area (as might apply in the lakes). We are basically industrial.

    ASB offenders use what they have already which works in the area. Here that is either youngish lads with loud exhausts on cars or motorbikes, or slightly younger types doing wheelies on ebikes. There are a few trail bikes. I see one or two illegal motorbikes of the Sur-Ron pattern each day, which are I think either drug distributors or older men wanting cheap transport; they usually behave when they follow paths or pathways - they don't want police attention or complaints.

    IMO we have far more serious ASB problems with pavement parking, which is perceived as an entitlement after decades of non-enforcement. They get quite abusive if you just point out that they have blocked a drop kerb, even at the hospital entrance, and there is a culture of driving and parking half way across the pavement so that the driver has space to open their offside door *inside the marked bay* .

    On barriers, the officially required width is a 1.5m gap, and Quads and Sur-Rons are a policing matter. I can enforce that legally (Equality Act 2010, Highways Act 1980), but it is one at a time so tedious and slow. So I prioritise routes which are stategic connections, or valuable locally (eg if the diversion is 1/2 mile in a wheelchair), and I will clear out the existing key networks to make an alternative.
    On policing, we need priorities to value other Highways alongside roads, with police or trained PCSOs on Sur-Rons and E-cycles, to track them down. Plus we need to shift from a 1980s model of "block 'em" to recognising that the best security is increased usage - just as we have moved from blank walls and silent courtyards to active frontages in housing estate design.

    Plus it needs varied policies, thought out by area. All of this stuff is done successfully in many places (Cardiff, City of London for stopping ASB cycling, Cleveland) under the name Operation Endurance, but police force culture is Balkanised.

    Around here, unfortunately, police gave bad advice in the 1980s and 1990s, which gets preserved in the culture of a community - so they believe that barriers prevent an ASBO problem where one would never exist, and the disabled people and mums with prams can go hang.

    Yes, it will cost more money probably. Yes, I'm willing to pay it.

    One very interesting point showing how over-focused our culture is on driving, is that Road Signs have hundreds or thousands of pages of Regulations ("You must"), but Road Signs for blind people - tactile paving - is all Guidelines which can be ignored by Highways Authrorities.

    * Location: https://maps.app.goo.gl/qPuWnopmqWRiHLRN9

    If you spin around you can see that the Public Footpath continues between the houses. There is a futile barrier at the other end of that which adds no restriction to the path width of 90cm but the money was pissed away on it anyway, so no one can take a wheelchair down it sensibly. It can be done on a cycle-as-mobility-aid (the most common moblity aid), but we have not won that battle for legal recognition yet, so I am more productive targeting other priorities.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,945
    Matt Goodwin really getting stuck into the campaign to release Lucy Connolly.

    "Matt Goodwin
    @GoodwinMJ

    Lucy Connolly poses no risk to anyone – let her go! ⁦by ⁦@AllisonPearson"

    https://x.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1923493646222901443
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    edited May 16
    Andy_JS said:

    Don't believe what I saw about half an hour ago. There's a large roundabout in a local town with a pub in the middle of the roundabout. A blue car casually drove the wrong way round the roundabout, obviously not realising that it was one-way. Luckily they didn't crash into anyone as far as I know. Not sure whether to report it or not, and if so, who to report it to.

    If you have video from your dashcam, that is one for the upload portal. You have to be quick since the police are required to serve a NIP within a fortnight (I think that is the normal period).

    Otherwise there will be a form on the relevant police force website.

    If you do not have the number plate, it will be added to the report stats.

    If you are in Scotland it is still a much more involved process. @Eabhal may know better, but their dashcam portal is some months away I think.

    For next time, if you suspect they are drunk or impaired (eg drugs or medical condition), that is considered one for 999. I was surprised when I heard Ashley Neal's commentary of all-over-the-road drivers being "I would be calling 999 at this point".
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,945
    MattW said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Don't believe what I saw about half an hour ago. There's a large roundabout in a local town with a pub in the middle of the roundabout. A blue car casually drove the wrong way round the roundabout, obviously not realising that it was one-way. Luckily they didn't crash into anyone as far as I know. Not sure whether to report it or not, and if so, who to report it to.

    If you have video from your dashcam, that is one for the upload portal. You have to be quick since the police are required to serve a NIP within a fortnight (I think that is the normal period).

    Otherwise there will be a form on the relevant police force website.

    If you do not have the number plate, it will be added to the report stats.

    If you are in Scotland it is still a much more involved process. @Eabhal may know better, but their dashcam portal is some months away I think.

    For next time, if you suspect they are drunk or impaired (eg drugs or medical condition), that is considered one for 999. I was surprised when I heard Ashley Neal's commentary of all-over-the-road drivers being "I would be calling 999 at this point".
    Thanks. My impression was they weren't drunk or otherwise impaired, they simply believed it was a 2-way road because it's such a large roundabout, and they'd probably never driven there before. The reason I say that is because they were driving so calmly, not too fast, not too slow.
  • Let’s see where things are in a couple of years. I still think Labour will recover substantially.
  • Labour should not change the WFA changes.
  • vikvik Posts: 370
    edited May 16

    What could possibly go wrong.....
    The anonymous administration official quoted in the article has furiously denied it: "These reports are untrue ... Such a plan was not discussed and makes no sense".

    I think the plan was being worked on by the administration before Trump received the $400 million plane from Qatar.

    The plan will only go ahead now if Qatar approves it & I doubt that the Qataris will approve it.

    In fact, the latest statements from Trump, after his Gulf trip, are quite pro-Palestinian:

    President Trump said on Friday that “a lot of people are starving” in the Gaza Strip under an Israeli blockade preventing aid deliveries, adding that the U.S. wanted to help alleviate the suffering.

    “We’re going to handle a couple of situations that you have here,” Mr. Trump said, speaking in the United Arab Emirates on the last leg of his visit to three Persian Gulf nations this week. “We’re looking at Gaza, and we got to get that taken care of. A lot of people are starving. A lot of people. There’s a lot of bad things going on.”

    ... ...

    Gulf Arab leaders, aware of the symbolic potency to their own people of the Palestinian plight, sought to change Mr. Trump’s rhetoric and thinking on Gaza. Sheikh Tamim bin Hamad al-Thani, the emir of Qatar, asked Mr. Trump to use American leverage to bring about peace in Gaza and end the killing.


    https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/16/world/europe/trump-gaza-starvation-famine-us-israel-aid.html?unlocked_article_code=1.Hk8.YmuM.yexxWAl-U3Fd&smid=url-share
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,945
    "Opinion
    Michelle Goldberg
    How Did So Many Elected Democrats Miss Biden’s Infirmity?" (£)

    https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/16/opinion/biden-age-democrats-coverup.html
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 14,216

    Former FBI Director James Comey to be interviewed by the US Secret Service over social media post aimed at Trump

    https://edition.cnn.com/2025/05/16/politics/comey-interviewed-secret-service

    Too late. He has sent the “bat signal”
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 14,216

    Scott_xP said:

    @yashar

    BREAKING:

    For the first time in its history, Moodys has downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA1.

    "FAKE NEWS from the RADICAL LEFT LUNATICS!!!"
    FAKE ECONOMICS from the RADICAL RIGHT LUNATICS!
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 14,216
    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    Here's one for all those of you getting excited about sub judice* the other day.

    Watters: “Do you believe Comey should be in jail?”

    Gabbard: “I do… I’m very concerned for the president’s life…And James Comey, in my view, should be held accountable and put behind bars for this.”

    https://x.com/BulwarkOnline/status/1923180901875200186


    *Autocorrect prefers "sub juice".

    Matt Gaetz, lol... https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/james-comey-86-gaetz-maga-b2752452.html
    Jack P, LOLer
    https://x.com/JimLaPorta/status/1923367572239503458
    Comey said he was knowingly making a political statement, but won’t say what it was. Do you see Comey as a lone wolf, or part of interconnected network of many with the means and access to the necessary knowledge to ensure the assassination ? ...
    Eh ?

    FWIW, I see Comey as someone who, more than any other single person, was responsible for Trump's defeat of Clinton.

    Saying you wish the current president be gone is protected political speech, which means no more than you wish him gone.
    Any attempt to criminalise that is pure authoritarianism.
    If Trump is assassinated by what looks like an opportunist nobody, you’re going to tell me it’s an opportunist nobody, not the security establishment, aren’t you?

    I’m referring solely to how close Trumps administration, advisors, confidants too, are to Putin (and by that the KGB or GRU whatever they now called, as its secret service run country) and what the Trump team are doing to the military and security leadership, systems and structures, in the US.

    https://bylinetimes.com/2024/11/12/lobbyists-oligarchs-and-power-the-pro-putin-network-raising-fears-of-foreign-influence-in-trumps-team/

    But am I wrong to say, if this was any other country in the world, even UK, the security establishment would act - so why are we not anticipating disquiet in US? If it was happening here in UK we would have disquiet.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,945
    edited 1:31AM
    Interesting — the next series of The Traitors UK will be a celebrity show with these contestants:

    "Alan Carr – Comedian
    Cat Burns – Singer/Songwriter
    Celia Imrie – Actor
    Charlotte Church – Singer/Activist
    Clare Balding – Broadcaster and Author
    David Olusoga – Historian and Filmmaker
    Joe Marler – Former England Rugby Player and Podcaster
    Joe Wilkinson – Comedian
    Jonathan Ross – Presenter
    Kate Garraway – Broadcaster
    Lucy Beaumont – Comedian
    Mark Bonnar – Actor
    Nick Mohammed – Actor and Comedian
    Niko Omilana – Content Creator
    Paloma Faith – Singer/Songwriter and Actor
    Ruth Codd – Actor
    Stephen Fry – Actor, Writer, Presenter
    Tameka Empson – Actor and Comedian
    Tom Daley – Olympian, Author, Broadcaster and Entrepreneur"

    https://dvd-fever.co.uk/the-celebrity-traitors-announced-for-2025-on-bbc1/
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 84,020
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting — the next series of The Traitors UK will be a celebrity show with these contestants:

    https://dvd-fever.co.uk/the-celebrity-traitors-announced-for-2025-on-bbc1/

    Why does every tv show these days have to have a celebrity version or fronted by a celebrity to go travelling or talk about their eating disorder.....
  • vikvik Posts: 370
    edited 2:41AM

    vik said:

    "Reform is much more of a threat to Labour in Scotland compared to the rest of the UK, according to pollster Professor Sir John Curtice.
    In an exclusive interview with The Steamie, The Scotsman’s politics podcast, Sir John said the newly-acquired support for Labour in Scotland in last year’s general election is “vulnerable”.
    He says this means Labour are more in danger of losing votes to Nigel Farage’s Reform UK in Scotland, whereas in the rest of the UK most of Reform’s vote is coming from the Conservatives."


    https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nigel-farages-reform-is-more-of-a-threat-to-labour-in-scotland-says-professor-sir-john-curtice-5131742

    That (your?) 10/1 bet you made is looking better by the day.
    I'll probably lose my money on the Hamilton Larkhall bet, but it'll be great to get a happy surprise. :)

    I think Reform will definitely give the SNP a shock & cause more despair to Labour & Conservatives, and will come in second. Actually winning the seat might be tough for them, unless the swing against the SNP is really bad. I don't know the extent to which Scots are tired of 18 years of SNP governance and want a change.

    Realistically, I think the result will be something like SNP 31%, Reform 27%, Labour 20%, Cons 11%. Optimistically, maybe it'll be SNP 29% & Reform 29%, and Reform might edge ahead by a handful of votes.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,340
    vik said:

    vik said:

    "Reform is much more of a threat to Labour in Scotland compared to the rest of the UK, according to pollster Professor Sir John Curtice.
    In an exclusive interview with The Steamie, The Scotsman’s politics podcast, Sir John said the newly-acquired support for Labour in Scotland in last year’s general election is “vulnerable”.
    He says this means Labour are more in danger of losing votes to Nigel Farage’s Reform UK in Scotland, whereas in the rest of the UK most of Reform’s vote is coming from the Conservatives."


    https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nigel-farages-reform-is-more-of-a-threat-to-labour-in-scotland-says-professor-sir-john-curtice-5131742

    That (your?) 10/1 bet you made is looking better by the day.
    I'll probably lose my money on the Hamilton Larkhall bet, but it'll be great to get a happy surprise. :)

    I think Reform will definitely give the SNP a shock & cause more despair to Labour & Conservatives, and will come in second. Actually winning the seat might be tough for them, unless the swing against the SNP is really bad. I don't know the extent to which Scots are tired of 18 years of SNP governance and want a change.

    Realistically, I think the result will be something like SNP 31%, Reform 27%, Labour 20%, Cons 11%. Optimistically, maybe it'll be SNP 29% & Reform 29%, and Reform might edge ahead by a handful of votes.
    Sadly, I agree with your analysis in Hamilton and Larkhall, you only have to look at yesterday's local by-election result in Scotland to see the current political direction of travel in the centre belt here.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 30,620
    edited 3:30AM
    deleted; scooped
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 30,620
    Andy_JS said:

    MattW said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Don't believe what I saw about half an hour ago. There's a large roundabout in a local town with a pub in the middle of the roundabout. A blue car casually drove the wrong way round the roundabout, obviously not realising that it was one-way. Luckily they didn't crash into anyone as far as I know. Not sure whether to report it or not, and if so, who to report it to.

    If you have video from your dashcam, that is one for the upload portal. You have to be quick since the police are required to serve a NIP within a fortnight (I think that is the normal period).

    Otherwise there will be a form on the relevant police force website.

    If you do not have the number plate, it will be added to the report stats.

    If you are in Scotland it is still a much more involved process. @Eabhal may know better, but their dashcam portal is some months away I think.

    For next time, if you suspect they are drunk or impaired (eg drugs or medical condition), that is considered one for 999. I was surprised when I heard Ashley Neal's commentary of all-over-the-road drivers being "I would be calling 999 at this point".
    Thanks. My impression was they weren't drunk or otherwise impaired, they simply believed it was a 2-way road because it's such a large roundabout, and they'd probably never driven there before. The reason I say that is because they were driving so calmly, not too fast, not too slow.
    Rather than the police, consider asking the council to improve road signs. Or petition the government to ban the installation of snowflake roundabouts that have different rules from every other roundabout in the country.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 30,620
    Lisa Nandy’s Culture Department faces axe
    The move would end 33 years as a standalone government department and eliminate the role of Culture Secretary

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/05/16/lisa-nandy-culture-department-faces-axe/ (£££)
  • vikvik Posts: 370
    edited 4:15AM
    "As new polling conducted by Ipsos exclusively for the New Statesman reveals today, if there is a story and a thesis behind Rachel Reeves’ fiscal policy, the public has no idea what it is. The country is being run according to fiscal rules that 96 per cent of people could not explain. Labour is asking the public to agree to cuts to benefits and unprotected spending for reasons that are mysterious to the average person, and are therefore not really reasons at all."

    https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/economy/2025/05/revealed-no-one-understands-rachel-reevess-fiscal-rules
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,608
    Well it looks as if Starmers relaunch as Reform-lite is working as some of us predicted:

    https://bsky.app/profile/yougov.co.uk/post/3lpbk6a32b22u
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,949
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting — the next series of The Traitors UK will be a celebrity show with these contestants:

    "Alan Carr – Comedian
    Cat Burns – Singer/Songwriter
    Celia Imrie – Actor
    Charlotte Church – Singer/Activist
    Clare Balding – Broadcaster and Author
    David Olusoga – Historian and Filmmaker
    Joe Marler – Former England Rugby Player and Podcaster
    Joe Wilkinson – Comedian
    Jonathan Ross – Presenter
    Kate Garraway – Broadcaster
    Lucy Beaumont – Comedian
    Mark Bonnar – Actor
    Nick Mohammed – Actor and Comedian
    Niko Omilana – Content Creator
    Paloma Faith – Singer/Songwriter and Actor
    Ruth Codd – Actor
    Stephen Fry – Actor, Writer, Presenter
    Tameka Empson – Actor and Comedian
    Tom Daley – Olympian, Author, Broadcaster and Entrepreneur"

    https://dvd-fever.co.uk/the-celebrity-traitors-announced-for-2025-on-bbc1/

    Why is that interesting?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,949
    vik said:

    vik said:

    "Reform is much more of a threat to Labour in Scotland compared to the rest of the UK, according to pollster Professor Sir John Curtice.
    In an exclusive interview with The Steamie, The Scotsman’s politics podcast, Sir John said the newly-acquired support for Labour in Scotland in last year’s general election is “vulnerable”.
    He says this means Labour are more in danger of losing votes to Nigel Farage’s Reform UK in Scotland, whereas in the rest of the UK most of Reform’s vote is coming from the Conservatives."


    https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nigel-farages-reform-is-more-of-a-threat-to-labour-in-scotland-says-professor-sir-john-curtice-5131742

    That (your?) 10/1 bet you made is looking better by the day.
    I'll probably lose my money on the Hamilton Larkhall bet, but it'll be great to get a happy surprise. :)

    I think Reform will definitely give the SNP a shock & cause more despair to Labour & Conservatives, and will come in second. Actually winning the seat might be tough for them, unless the swing against the SNP is really bad. I don't know the extent to which Scots are tired of 18 years of SNP governance and want a change.

    Realistically, I think the result will be something like SNP 31%, Reform 27%, Labour 20%, Cons 11%. Optimistically, maybe it'll be SNP 29% & Reform 29%, and Reform might edge ahead by a handful of votes.
    It was a great tip.

    Reform should probably be a 4/1 shot, not 10/1.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 65,248
    Good morning and it is beautiful here in Llandudno

    Opinion piece in the Guardian is not a good read for Starmer fans

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/may/16/keir-starmer-x-immigration-albania-enoch-powell?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    Andy_JS said:

    MattW said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Don't believe what I saw about half an hour ago. There's a large roundabout in a local town with a pub in the middle of the roundabout. A blue car casually drove the wrong way round the roundabout, obviously not realising that it was one-way. Luckily they didn't crash into anyone as far as I know. Not sure whether to report it or not, and if so, who to report it to.

    If you have video from your dashcam, that is one for the upload portal. You have to be quick since the police are required to serve a NIP within a fortnight (I think that is the normal period).

    Otherwise there will be a form on the relevant police force website.

    If you do not have the number plate, it will be added to the report stats.

    If you are in Scotland it is still a much more involved process. @Eabhal may know better, but their dashcam portal is some months away I think.

    For next time, if you suspect they are drunk or impaired (eg drugs or medical condition), that is considered one for 999. I was surprised when I heard Ashley Neal's commentary of all-over-the-road drivers being "I would be calling 999 at this point".
    Thanks. My impression was they weren't drunk or otherwise impaired, they simply believed it was a 2-way road because it's such a large roundabout, and they'd probably never driven there before. The reason I say that is because they were driving so calmly, not too fast, not too slow.
    That's quite possible; or it's possible that they just ignored it. Both happen all the time.

    Road design - especially junction design, and road markings not maintained, add to that. One is an artefact of road design still in the 1970s in many respects; the other like potholes - failure to invest in the public realm which is far worse since 2010.

    Here's one at my local hospital, as of August 2024, which is supposed to be a (painted) mini-roundabout but was nearly gone *then*:
    https://maps.app.goo.gl/APG7enMYvVRpxQSw6

    Satellite. This is a 3-5k vehicles per day location.
    https://maps.app.goo.gl/VGJHmcX7YAZWCKFDA
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 14,203
    carnforth said:

    Former FBI Director James Comey to be interviewed by the US Secret Service over social media post aimed at Trump

    https://edition.cnn.com/2025/05/16/politics/comey-interviewed-secret-service

    Arguing "86" means vote out is an interesting one. Originally 86 meant kill. But is has a wider meaning "to get rid of". So fine, right? But Trump can't be voted out, because of the term limits. So...
    86 did not originally mean ‘kill’. It meant no longer available or eject.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149

    vik said:

    vik said:

    "Reform is much more of a threat to Labour in Scotland compared to the rest of the UK, according to pollster Professor Sir John Curtice.
    In an exclusive interview with The Steamie, The Scotsman’s politics podcast, Sir John said the newly-acquired support for Labour in Scotland in last year’s general election is “vulnerable”.
    He says this means Labour are more in danger of losing votes to Nigel Farage’s Reform UK in Scotland, whereas in the rest of the UK most of Reform’s vote is coming from the Conservatives."


    https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nigel-farages-reform-is-more-of-a-threat-to-labour-in-scotland-says-professor-sir-john-curtice-5131742

    That (your?) 10/1 bet you made is looking better by the day.
    I'll probably lose my money on the Hamilton Larkhall bet, but it'll be great to get a happy surprise. :)

    I think Reform will definitely give the SNP a shock & cause more despair to Labour & Conservatives, and will come in second. Actually winning the seat might be tough for them, unless the swing against the SNP is really bad. I don't know the extent to which Scots are tired of 18 years of SNP governance and want a change.

    Realistically, I think the result will be something like SNP 31%, Reform 27%, Labour 20%, Cons 11%. Optimistically, maybe it'll be SNP 29% & Reform 29%, and Reform might edge ahead by a handful of votes.
    It was a great tip.

    Reform should probably be a 4/1 shot, not 10/1.
    I see that Reform are still available at 8-1.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 14,203
    I hope everyone, including @BartholomewRoberts , is clear that this is a crime against humanity.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 14,203
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting — the next series of The Traitors UK will be a celebrity show with these contestants:

    "Alan Carr – Comedian
    Cat Burns – Singer/Songwriter
    Celia Imrie – Actor
    Charlotte Church – Singer/Activist
    Clare Balding – Broadcaster and Author
    David Olusoga – Historian and Filmmaker
    Joe Marler – Former England Rugby Player and Podcaster
    Joe Wilkinson – Comedian
    Jonathan Ross – Presenter
    Kate Garraway – Broadcaster
    Lucy Beaumont – Comedian
    Mark Bonnar – Actor
    Nick Mohammed – Actor and Comedian
    Niko Omilana – Content Creator
    Paloma Faith – Singer/Songwriter and Actor
    Ruth Codd – Actor
    Stephen Fry – Actor, Writer, Presenter
    Tameka Empson – Actor and Comedian
    Tom Daley – Olympian, Author, Broadcaster and Entrepreneur"

    https://dvd-fever.co.uk/the-celebrity-traitors-announced-for-2025-on-bbc1/

    Omilana came 5th in the 2021 London mayoral election.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,595

    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting — the next series of The Traitors UK will be a celebrity show with these contestants:

    "Alan Carr – Comedian
    Cat Burns – Singer/Songwriter
    Celia Imrie – Actor
    Charlotte Church – Singer/Activist
    Clare Balding – Broadcaster and Author
    David Olusoga – Historian and Filmmaker
    Joe Marler – Former England Rugby Player and Podcaster
    Joe Wilkinson – Comedian
    Jonathan Ross – Presenter
    Kate Garraway – Broadcaster
    Lucy Beaumont – Comedian
    Mark Bonnar – Actor
    Nick Mohammed – Actor and Comedian
    Niko Omilana – Content Creator
    Paloma Faith – Singer/Songwriter and Actor
    Ruth Codd – Actor
    Stephen Fry – Actor, Writer, Presenter
    Tameka Empson – Actor and Comedian
    Tom Daley – Olympian, Author, Broadcaster and Entrepreneur"

    https://dvd-fever.co.uk/the-celebrity-traitors-announced-for-2025-on-bbc1/

    Why is that interesting?
    If you'd asked me to name the celeb line-up, I reckon I'd have named quite a few of those.

    It will be rubbish. These sorts of things only work well with people you don't know.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    vik said:

    What could possibly go wrong.....
    The anonymous administration official quoted in the article has furiously denied it: "These reports are untrue ... Such a plan was not discussed and makes no sense".

    I think the plan was being worked on by the administration before Trump received the $400 million plane from Qatar.

    The plan will only go ahead now if Qatar approves it & I doubt that the Qataris will approve it.

    In fact, the latest statements from Trump, after his Gulf trip, are quite pro-Palestinian:

    President Trump said on Friday that “a lot of people are starving” in the Gaza Strip under an Israeli blockade preventing aid deliveries, adding that the U.S. wanted to help alleviate the suffering.

    “We’re going to handle a couple of situations that you have here,” Mr. Trump said, speaking in the United Arab Emirates on the last leg of his visit to three Persian Gulf nations this week. “We’re looking at Gaza, and we got to get that taken care of. A lot of people are starving. A lot of people. There’s a lot of bad things going on.”

    ... ...

    Gulf Arab leaders, aware of the symbolic potency to their own people of the Palestinian plight, sought to change Mr. Trump’s rhetoric and thinking on Gaza. Sheikh Tamim bin Hamad al-Thani, the emir of Qatar, asked Mr. Trump to use American leverage to bring about peace in Gaza and end the killing.


    https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/16/world/europe/trump-gaza-starvation-famine-us-israel-aid.html?unlocked_article_code=1.Hk8.YmuM.yexxWAl-U3Fd&smid=url-share
    I think that's just another piece of the whirlwind Trump is going to reap, just like the one he is starting to reap from the Supreme Court.

    Once you have proved that you are a congenital liar, and have a set of officials and Secretaries of State who will happily lie on oath to the Courts, and to the media, and then try and deal with questions by obfuscation and bullying, you have no credibility.

    Trump has torched his credibility some time ago, and does not like the consequences. He's blaming the lamp post for his headache.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,949
    MattW said:

    vik said:

    vik said:

    "Reform is much more of a threat to Labour in Scotland compared to the rest of the UK, according to pollster Professor Sir John Curtice.
    In an exclusive interview with The Steamie, The Scotsman’s politics podcast, Sir John said the newly-acquired support for Labour in Scotland in last year’s general election is “vulnerable”.
    He says this means Labour are more in danger of losing votes to Nigel Farage’s Reform UK in Scotland, whereas in the rest of the UK most of Reform’s vote is coming from the Conservatives."


    https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nigel-farages-reform-is-more-of-a-threat-to-labour-in-scotland-says-professor-sir-john-curtice-5131742

    That (your?) 10/1 bet you made is looking better by the day.
    I'll probably lose my money on the Hamilton Larkhall bet, but it'll be great to get a happy surprise. :)

    I think Reform will definitely give the SNP a shock & cause more despair to Labour & Conservatives, and will come in second. Actually winning the seat might be tough for them, unless the swing against the SNP is really bad. I don't know the extent to which Scots are tired of 18 years of SNP governance and want a change.

    Realistically, I think the result will be something like SNP 31%, Reform 27%, Labour 20%, Cons 11%. Optimistically, maybe it'll be SNP 29% & Reform 29%, and Reform might edge ahead by a handful of votes.
    It was a great tip.

    Reform should probably be a 4/1 shot, not 10/1.
    I see that Reform are still available at 8-1.
    Still a buy, IMHO
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,949
    tlg86 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting — the next series of The Traitors UK will be a celebrity show with these contestants:

    "Alan Carr – Comedian
    Cat Burns – Singer/Songwriter
    Celia Imrie – Actor
    Charlotte Church – Singer/Activist
    Clare Balding – Broadcaster and Author
    David Olusoga – Historian and Filmmaker
    Joe Marler – Former England Rugby Player and Podcaster
    Joe Wilkinson – Comedian
    Jonathan Ross – Presenter
    Kate Garraway – Broadcaster
    Lucy Beaumont – Comedian
    Mark Bonnar – Actor
    Nick Mohammed – Actor and Comedian
    Niko Omilana – Content Creator
    Paloma Faith – Singer/Songwriter and Actor
    Ruth Codd – Actor
    Stephen Fry – Actor, Writer, Presenter
    Tameka Empson – Actor and Comedian
    Tom Daley – Olympian, Author, Broadcaster and Entrepreneur"

    https://dvd-fever.co.uk/the-celebrity-traitors-announced-for-2025-on-bbc1/

    Why is that interesting?
    If you'd asked me to name the celeb line-up, I reckon I'd have named quite a few of those.

    It will be rubbish. These sorts of things only work well with people you don't know.
    I might be in a minority but I have no interest in watching TV celebrities at the best of times, yet alone in "reality" gameshows.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 27,149
    edited 6:27AM
    A very interesting short 2 minute segment in the Washington Week.

    "The Ukrainians have learnt to speak Trump".
    'They have realised they are now part of Europe ... This war is about whether Ukraine is part of Europe.'

    https://youtu.be/F8zXwVziexc?t=1082
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,236

    pm215 said:

    nico67 said:

    MattW said:

    viewcode said:

    @kitty_donaldson

    EXC: Sir Keir Starmer is poised to reverse changes to the controversial winter fuel payment cut possibly as soon as next month

    Talks in No 10 about abandoning the policy have accelerated this week

    https://x.com/kitty_donaldson/status/1923403409190748301

    It'll be like when Clegg apologised for student fees. Too little, too late.
    There's a big difference between apologising and reversing the action.
    I think that's a mistake.

    He should adjust the threshold to a more reasonable level, not reverse it.

    Most of the population do not need it, and he should stand with the courage of his convictions on this one. This is not one of the things that will win the next election.
    Yes changing the threshold would help and doesn’t look like such a screeching u-turn.
    It might practically help most of the pensioners worst affected by the change, but would changing the threshold help fix the political problem? It feels to me like most voters won't really notice or remember a technical tweak like that, especially so long after the original action, so the government will still be in their minds the one that "took away the winter fuel payments".
    The big problem with a change in threshold is that it'll mean proper, expensive means testing. The current plan to hook it pension credits is pretty much cost-free to calculate. Actual means testing will swallow much of the cash raised
    Issue is that those with very small personal pensions get zip and those who pissed all their money up the wall get pension credits and all the other myriad of benefits that go with it.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,468
    MattW said:

    A very interesting short 2 minute segment in the Washington Week.

    "The Ukrainians have learnt to speak Trump".
    'They have realised they are now part of Europe ... This war is about whether Ukraine is part of Europe.'

    https://youtu.be/F8zXwVziexc?t=1082

    One other thing that is driving a growing sense of Ukrainian confidence is that the drone technology they have developed both alone and in tandem with, for example, Latvia has been astonishingly effective. The kill rates in recent weeks have been close to 1000 to 1. Russian supply and logistics have been absolutely hammered.

    We just had an exercise in Southern Estonia- Siil/Hedgehog- and the Ukrainian Delta team made absolute mincemeat of the NATO teams.

    https://news.err.ee/1609696302/ukrainians-demonstrate-inefficiency-of-yesterday-s-war-at-siil-exercise

    The Russians are losing the equivalent of a brigade every 10 days, and the Russian casualties are approaching a million men. The Russians may keep saying that they will fight on, do whatever it takes to achieve victory, but this resolve is being seriously tested by the Ukrainians.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 77,370
    carnforth said:

    Former FBI Director James Comey to be interviewed by the US Secret Service over social media post aimed at Trump

    https://edition.cnn.com/2025/05/16/politics/comey-interviewed-secret-service

    Arguing "86" means vote out is an interesting one. Originally 86 meant kill. But is has a wider meaning "to get rid of". So fine, right? But Trump can't be voted out, because of the term limits. So...
    He can be impeached, obviously.
    The 25th Amendment is also an option.

    Comey is a longstanding prat, who has done far more damage to the Democrats, but this is the very definition of protected political speech.

    The excitement of the right (and apparently william) is both pathetic and a little sinister.
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