Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
I see Guido has a copy of a 2015 election leaflet from Jonathan Reynolds that states ...'Before that I was a solicitor in Manchester'. It's now the fifth time he has claimed to be a solicitor.
I think that this has now done for him and he will be gone very shortly. Possibly as an MP too.
I didn't really see him as a fantasist. Had him as one of the more boring, workmanlike members of the cabinet.
Becoming a bit of thing now for Labour ministers - Haigh, Siddiq, Gwynne, Reynolds, Reeves.
Interesting more coming out of the Trigger Me Timbers over Reynolds:
FPT: My local pub doesn't sell bacon. My local butcher doesn't sell beer. It's an absolute disgrace. Woke madness.
Does your local pub and local butcher only sell halal meat?
As a small state free marketeer (I presume) surely you should be delighted that firms respond to market forces in their choice of products and services to provide.
They can include halal meat in areas with significant Muslims they shouldn't stop selling non halal meat, especially if they are a national chain and not a Muslim shop. I am not a pure free marketeer either, just more so than socialist
I sometimes go to a butcher in Golders Green. Guess what they sell and don’t sell.
It's completely legal to sell horsemeat in England, but an awful lot of butchers just don't for some reason. I wouldn't describe that as a ban.
Had some lovely horsemeat in Italy. Would love to be able to get some in London.
There are problems with racehorses and others being given medicinal drugs that render them unsuitable for human consumption.
Unfortunately, the Liberal Democrats have no penis, and oppose both decent spending on defence and the nuclear deterrent, so their limp-wristed interventions will be heard by no-one except their Focus leaflet authors.
Shame.
Has their policy on defence spending changed in the last week or so? As prior to that at least they had the exact same policy as Labour on the % and timescale at least.
They are now arguing for spending 3% of GDP. Which is likely what is needed, if the US has de facto left NATO.
She's far less clever than she thinks and she's far more clever than we think.
If I was in her place I'd never have the strength of character to come back from her disasters. I hope she does.
It’s not that she’s stupid. It’s that she’s batshit.
There’s a decent case to be made that she ought to be sectioned.
As discussed with kle4 - I know you're a tough Kiwi, but could you have come back from what she's been through? (Obviously self-inflicted, but still)
Absolutely not. And I genuinely believe that her response to events is manifesting as unhingedness.
By accounts, she was always odd, now she’s totally cracked.
It's one possibility. She does seem to have really escalated in the past year, and that might be for career prospects, but if it is genuine it seems to have surprised many.
What's happened now?
I think she's just continuing her MAGA-esq journey, not really that newsworthy - she's a Trump fan, that's baked in now, and there is some support for that in this country, if not as much as she may believe.
I see Guido has a copy of a 2015 election leaflet from Jonathan Reynolds that states ...'Before that I was a solicitor in Manchester'. It's now the fifth time he has claimed to be a solicitor.
I think that this has now done for him and he will be gone very shortly. Possibly as an MP too.
I didn't really see him as a fantasist. Had him as one of the more boring, workmanlike members of the cabinet.
Becoming a bit of thing now for Labour ministers - Haigh, Siddiq, Gwynne, Reynolds, Reeves.
It all seems a bit silly, but politicians have been brought down by even pettier things than CV inflation.
"The Post-Ipsos poll tested about a dozen different Trump policies and efforts, ranging from mass-deportation to banning transgender people from the military to shuttering the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID) to pardoning Jan. 6 defendants. All but two were unpopular, by an average of 25 points."
Thank you and maybe my knowledge of US politics is not as much as many of you on here
Cheer up @Big_G_NorthWales - sense and US politics departed a few weeks ago.
Hang on, isn’t the answer here that our Empire in full pomp was the blip? We were always small and nimble in Europe vs. the likes of France and Spain, and there is a lot to the “accidental empire” idea post civil war. Even at the height of empire we harkened back to Boudicca “regions Caesar never knew, thy posterity will conquer”.
We accidentally stumbled into a global empire and feel a bit self conscious about it?
Yes. It’s all a bit embarrassing. It’s like we got a bit too drunk one night at a party, ruined the carpet by spilling wine and asked the hosts’ daughter out.
"Recoup the costs" The sadism of American policy to war-torn Ukraine
https://snyder.substack.com/p/recoup-the-costs The premise of American foreign policy to Ukraine, today, is one of grievance. As the American president, vice-president, and national security advisor constantly repeat, Ukraine, the victim of a large-scale and criminal Russian invasion, must "recoup the costs" to the US taxpayer for aid received under the Biden administration.
It is worth patiently considering this proposition. It reveals little about Ukraine, but much about America in February 2025.
1. The American demand is of an extraordinary scale. In Kyiv and again in Munich, the Americans proposed that Ukraine concede half of the profits from its mineral rights in perpetuity and from other national resources and from its ports in perpetuity with a lien on everything important -- in exchange for essentially nothing. This is not really a monetary proposition, let alone a "deal," but rather the demand that Ukraine become a permanent American colony. It amounts to blackmail enabled by ongoing Russian invasion. In effect, the United States is telling Ukraine to concede its resources to the United States, under the threat that American aid will be otherwise withdrawn, and those resources will be taken by Russia.
2. Ukraine is currently under attack by the Russian Federation, which invaded its south and southeast in 2014 and then began a full-scale invasion in 2022. For three years, Ukraine has resisted the largest offensive in contemporary history. The American demands amount to extremely severe war reparations upon Ukraine, far more severe than was demanded (for example) of Germany after either world war. But this demand is directed against Ukraine, and Ukraine is not the aggressor. Russia is the aggressor. Ukraine is the victim. Until now, the discussion in the United States and elsewhere was the reparations that Russia, as the aggressor state, should pay. That would be the historically normal discussion. It would also be the strategically normal discussion, in that it raises the costs of war to the current aggressor and to future aggressors.
3. The demand that Ukraine pay a huge sum to the United States is contrary to any logic* of ending the war...
*Not quite any. It's quite logical, if the means of ending the war is predicated on dividing the spoils of conquest between Russia and the US.
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
Though being the "underdog" doesn't necessarily make you right. I support Ukraine and Israel in their current conflicts, because they are more liberal and democratic than their opponents.
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
Well, we got to know so many of them, plucky little devils.
If you don’t show a touch of magnanimity to the defeated, your empire looks like Shark Island.
Which is wasteful, and a bit “not done” socially.
I do think the British outrage at Trump’s behaviour is being supercharged by the “not done” way he and his people are going about it. They are uncouth, impolite and lacking any diplomatic manners.
In this case of course there is bad stuff happening in substance as well as bad rhetoric, but the total lack of manners really rubs it in. The Russians have been equally childishly rude for years. Conversely it’s why China (usually) gets away with doing bad stuff - they remain polite 90% of the time, save for the occasional shouty tantrum.
Yes, it is hard to separate how rude and crude Trump is, as a general rule, from then trying to analyse individual ideas or policies. Some people who like him are clearly less comfortable with how offensive he can be and either ignore it or excuse it, whilst some numbers (plenty of his supporters) absolutely love it.
Used to be only the North Koreans who were that rude and petty in diplomatic statements.
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
Given most current polls have the Tories closer to Labour and Reform than the LDs are to the Tories very unlikely.
Indeed the Greens are now closer to the LDs than the LDs are to the Tories polling wise
The Lib Dem national vote percentage is irrelevant- 2024 showed us that. It's all about doing another 30 hyper local campaigns saying "Vote for us, because we're nice people in your community. Even Kemi says so."
Thirty gains from the Conservatives takes the Lib Dems down to Wiltshire East on the target list. Right now, the scores there are: Con 17k Labour 12k LD 8k Ref 8k
Stretchy, but definitely doable by the yellows.
The LDs won lots of seats in 2024 because the Tory voteshare was barely more than half what it was in 2019, little to do with 'hyper local campaigns' except in seats they won narrowly.
Now it is the Labour voteshare down significantly with the Tory voteshare little changed, so the Tories will gain many more seats from Labour than they lose to the LDs on current polls, indeed they will probably lose more seats to Reform than the Liberals
In my seat Hamble Valley, the Labour vote ensured the Tories won.
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
Hang on, isn’t the answer here that our Empire in full pomp was the blip? We were always small and nimble in Europe vs. the likes of France and Spain, and there is a lot to the “accidental empire” idea post civil war. Even at the height of empire we harkened back to Boudicca “regions Caesar never knew, thy posterity will conquer”.
We accidentally stumbled into a global empire and feel a bit self conscious about it?
Yes. It’s all a bit embarrassing. It’s like we got a bit too drunk one night at a party, ruined the carpet by spilling wine and asked the hosts’ daughter out.
Oddly, since we clobbered them once and for all, it has been all about some concern for the French.
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
But it's weird. We were the bullies, the colonisers, the oppressors, and now all of a sudden we love the plucky underdog. Guilt, perhaps.
Pinpointing the moment things tipped more towards underdogs would be an interesting one. Despite occasional rhetoric about the values of the UK (or any other place) they are obviously not timeless and can shift dramatically - going from slaving to free slaves being one example - but it would be interesting if there was still an 'underdog' appreciation even when our actions were a long way from it.
In modern times it might be as simple as we think of ourselves as underdogs, the small nation which punched well above its weight in international matters for good and ill, so see ourselves in any underdog situation. Even though the UK has been pretty powerful for a long time, compared to many other places.
Yes. There was immense public sympathy for Spain and Portugal, in 1808-14.
Crucially, Irish Catholics were for once entirely on the same side as English Protestants. Irish Catholics made up 25% of the army.
Anyone who has read Sharpe knows that all the best soliders in the army were Irish, Welsh, or Scottish.
Christ, notwithstanding Sharpe himself being English I think even the French opponents get fewer villainous mooments than post English officers.
Don’t forget the Essex Men and cockneys (which Sharpe was).
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
Given most current polls have the Tories closer to Labour and Reform than the LDs are to the Tories very unlikely.
Indeed the Greens are now closer to the LDs than the LDs are to the Tories polling wise
The Lib Dem national vote percentage is irrelevant- 2024 showed us that. It's all about doing another 30 hyper local campaigns saying "Vote for us, because we're nice people in your community. Even Kemi says so."
Thirty gains from the Conservatives takes the Lib Dems down to Wiltshire East on the target list. Right now, the scores there are: Con 17k Labour 12k LD 8k Ref 8k
Stretchy, but definitely doable by the yellows.
The LDs won lots of seats in 2024 because the Tory voteshare was barely more than half what it was in 2019, little to do with 'hyper local campaigns' except in seats they won narrowly.
Now it is the Labour voteshare down significantly with the Tory voteshare little changed, so the Tories will gain many more seats from Labour than they lose to the LDs on current polls, indeed they will probably lose more seats to Reform than the Liberals
In my seat Hamble Valley, the Labour vote ensured the Tories won.
There was also a 15% Reform vote there and Labour votes going LD would mean Tory gains in Tory v Labour marginals
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
But it's weird. We were the bullies, the colonisers, the oppressors, and now all of a sudden we love the plucky underdog. Guilt, perhaps.
Pinpointing the moment things tipped more towards underdogs would be an interesting one. Despite occasional rhetoric about the values of the UK (or any other place) they are obviously not timeless and can shift dramatically - going from slaving to free slaves being one example - but it would be interesting if there was still an 'underdog' appreciation even when our actions were a long way from it.
In modern times it might be as simple as we think of ourselves as underdogs, the small nation which punched well above its weight in international matters for good and ill, so see ourselves in any underdog situation. Even though the UK has been pretty powerful for a long time, compared to many other places.
Yes. There was immense public sympathy for Spain and Portugal, in 1808-14.
Crucially, Irish Catholics were for once entirely on the same side as English Protestants. Irish Catholics made up 25% of the army.
Anyone who has read Sharpe knows that all the best soliders in the army were Irish, Welsh, or Scottish.
Christ, notwithstanding Sharpe himself being English I think even the French opponents get fewer villainous mooments than post English officers.
Don’t forget the Essex Men and cockneys (which Sharpe was).
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
The Navy was drawing heavily on the Southern coastal areas.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu in many restaurants
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
It's getting them noticed and they are articulating what the majority of voters think. It's a good move for Davey and shows a more serious side than people saw in the election.
Prediction: by the end of next year there will be crowds of Trump supporters in major cities of the US marching around Sieg Heiling.... and Trump will be applauding it.
Need to consider the potential for a by-election in Staylbridge and Hyde.
Another safe Labour seat, been Labour since 1945. Conservatives have got close on a few occasions, <3000 off in 2019, but Reform second in 2024, 8,500 off.
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
But it's weird. We were the bullies, the colonisers, the oppressors, and now all of a sudden we love the plucky underdog. Guilt, perhaps.
Pinpointing the moment things tipped more towards underdogs would be an interesting one. Despite occasional rhetoric about the values of the UK (or any other place) they are obviously not timeless and can shift dramatically - going from slaving to free slaves being one example - but it would be interesting if there was still an 'underdog' appreciation even when our actions were a long way from it.
In modern times it might be as simple as we think of ourselves as underdogs, the small nation which punched well above its weight in international matters for good and ill, so see ourselves in any underdog situation. Even though the UK has been pretty powerful for a long time, compared to many other places.
Yes. There was immense public sympathy for Spain and Portugal, in 1808-14.
Crucially, Irish Catholics were for once entirely on the same side as English Protestants. Irish Catholics made up 25% of the army.
Anyone who has read Sharpe knows that all the best soliders in the army were Irish, Welsh, or Scottish.
Christ, notwithstanding Sharpe himself being English I think even the French opponents get fewer villainous mooments than post English officers.
Don’t forget the Essex Men and cockneys (which Sharpe was).
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
Normally army or clergy for younger sons of farmers and gentry with a few lawyers and merchants
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
I see Guido has a copy of a 2015 election leaflet from Jonathan Reynolds that states ...'Before that I was a solicitor in Manchester'. It's now the fifth time he has claimed to be a solicitor.
I think that this has now done for him and he will be gone very shortly. Possibly as an MP too.
I didn't really see him as a fantasist. Had him as one of the more boring, workmanlike members of the cabinet.
Becoming a bit of thing now for Labour ministers - Haigh, Siddiq, Gwynne, Reynolds, Reeves.
Interesting more coming out of the Trigger Me Timbers over Reynolds:
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
Before that we ate it regularly and I am sure it is a very tasty dish today
I see Tim Montgomerie is - very dimly - starting to realise he has accidentally joined the Putin Party.
Funny old game politics. Only a couple of weeks ago I felt (as an opponent of Reform) that all they had to do was to plough on with being economic fantasy social democrats circa 1955 + decent but clear low migration nationalists + NATO and sound defence and they were in with a real shout of keeping their lead.
If they do (I suppose they might) then we are in trouble.
Do you really think this is an issue that will do them great damage. Will people care greatly when their own lives are poor, or at least not getting better ?
Good question and I am going to wait and see. It seemed to me that Reform had got their positioning exactly right: charismatic leader, hidden agendas fairly well hidden, social democrat, NATO, 1955 era, free money for the respectable poor and pensioners but not for the wrong sort, abolish this and that, NHS free at point of delivery, low migration, only lightly attached to conspiracy theory, economics of Toyland. What could possibly go wrong? I think that formula, given the uselessness of the Tories and the realities facing Labour, could get them to 35-37% in the polls.
But all this is built on a continuation of the post war settlement, in which security is key. At heart I don't think most potential Reform voters want any of: USA supporting Russia; Russia free to trample on Europe, hatred of the underdog; USA telling Reform voters what a bunch of losers Brits are.
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
I’ve got homemade gyros with Greek salad and homemade flatbread tonight and it smells amazing but that sounds another level. Awesome.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu in many restaurants
The milkshakes are good but not worth the money. being able to customise the burgers is good in theory, but they are nothing special and well overpriced.
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
Given most current polls have the Tories closer to Labour and Reform than the LDs are to the Tories very unlikely.
Indeed the Greens are now closer to the LDs than the LDs are to the Tories polling wise
The Lib Dem national vote percentage is irrelevant- 2024 showed us that. It's all about doing another 30 hyper local campaigns saying "Vote for us, because we're nice people in your community. Even Kemi says so."
Thirty gains from the Conservatives takes the Lib Dems down to Wiltshire East on the target list. Right now, the scores there are: Con 17k Labour 12k LD 8k Ref 8k
Stretchy, but definitely doable by the yellows.
The LDs won lots of seats in 2024 because the Tory voteshare was barely more than half what it was in 2019, little to do with 'hyper local campaigns' except in seats they won narrowly.
Now it is the Labour voteshare down significantly with the Tory voteshare little changed, so the Tories will gain many more seats from Labour than they lose to the LDs on current polls, indeed they will probably lose more seats to Reform than the Liberals
In my seat Hamble Valley, the Labour vote ensured the Tories won.
There was also a 15% Reform vote there and Labour votes going LD would mean Tory gains in Tory v Labour marginals
TBF Hamble Valley was a new seat and Labour put a lot of effort telling people they, not the LibDems, were the main challenger. In the end Labour barely beat Reform.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Is this not as simple as: Five Guys is a chain with an almost entirely consistent menu, and if you go to one that varies from that by not including certain items it's quite reasonable to be disappointed?
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
But it's weird. We were the bullies, the colonisers, the oppressors, and now all of a sudden we love the plucky underdog. Guilt, perhaps.
Pinpointing the moment things tipped more towards underdogs would be an interesting one. Despite occasional rhetoric about the values of the UK (or any other place) they are obviously not timeless and can shift dramatically - going from slaving to free slaves being one example - but it would be interesting if there was still an 'underdog' appreciation even when our actions were a long way from it.
In modern times it might be as simple as we think of ourselves as underdogs, the small nation which punched well above its weight in international matters for good and ill, so see ourselves in any underdog situation. Even though the UK has been pretty powerful for a long time, compared to many other places.
Yes. There was immense public sympathy for Spain and Portugal, in 1808-14.
Crucially, Irish Catholics were for once entirely on the same side as English Protestants. Irish Catholics made up 25% of the army.
Anyone who has read Sharpe knows that all the best soliders in the army were Irish, Welsh, or Scottish.
Christ, notwithstanding Sharpe himself being English I think even the French opponents get fewer villainous mooments than post English officers.
Don’t forget the Essex Men and cockneys (which Sharpe was).
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
The Navy was drawing heavily on the Southern coastal areas.
Very much so, but it was quite cosmopolitan (about 10% of sailors at Trafalgar were from overseas). There were also lots of Irish sailors. The Royal Navy was actually a pretty good option for the lower classes.
Need to consider the potential for a by-election in Staylbridge and Hyde.
Another safe Labour seat, been Labour since 1945. Conservatives have got close on a few occasions, < 3000 off in 2019, but Reform second in 2024, 8,500 off.
Could be interesting.
The Electoral Calculus MRP from last month was predicting a 51% turnout and a Ref gain at the next GE.
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
My dad was the same.
He had myxomatosis?
It was awful, and we would deliberately drive over the poor stricken rabbits to put them out of their misery
There were lots of them on the country roads and it was very unpleasant but necessary
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
They're shit, but it doesn't mean the Lib Dems are going anywhere.
The LDs are the school snitches of the kids playground, the type that "tells Sir", changes their tune depending on what they think will ingratiate themselves with the teachers the most, and couldn't lead a dog.
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
But it's weird. We were the bullies, the colonisers, the oppressors, and now all of a sudden we love the plucky underdog. Guilt, perhaps.
Pinpointing the moment things tipped more towards underdogs would be an interesting one. Despite occasional rhetoric about the values of the UK (or any other place) they are obviously not timeless and can shift dramatically - going from slaving to free slaves being one example - but it would be interesting if there was still an 'underdog' appreciation even when our actions were a long way from it.
In modern times it might be as simple as we think of ourselves as underdogs, the small nation which punched well above its weight in international matters for good and ill, so see ourselves in any underdog situation. Even though the UK has been pretty powerful for a long time, compared to many other places.
Yes. There was immense public sympathy for Spain and Portugal, in 1808-14.
Crucially, Irish Catholics were for once entirely on the same side as English Protestants. Irish Catholics made up 25% of the army.
Anyone who has read Sharpe knows that all the best soliders in the army were Irish, Welsh, or Scottish.
Christ, notwithstanding Sharpe himself being English I think even the French opponents get fewer villainous mooments than post English officers.
Don’t forget the Essex Men and cockneys (which Sharpe was).
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
The Navy was drawing heavily on the Southern coastal areas.
Very much so, but it was quite cosmopolitan (about 10% of sailors at Trafalgar were from overseas). There were also lots of Irish sailors. The Royal Navy was actually a pretty good option for the lower classes.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Is this not as simple as: Five Guys is a chain with an almost entirely consistent menu, and if you go to one that varies from that by not including certain items it's quite reasonable to be disappointed?
Not necessarily. It depends on demand - and the meny doesn't have to be identical, does it?
Plus no point in having stuff hanging around till it goes off - it's a fast food place after all.
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
Surrey was more Remain than the national average, to be fair the Tories could get into power with Reform now with both making big gains from Labour even if half the Surrey seats stayed LD.
Though if the next general election saw a Labour minority government with LD confidence and supply that would likely send some of those LD Surrey seats back to the Tories
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
No, the point stands absolutely. Five Guys have deliberately removed bacon from its burgers so it just sells halal meat now in many areas.
There are thousands of pig farms in the UK selling British produced pork and bacon and Five Guys used that in all its restaurants before very happily until now
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
But it's weird. We were the bullies, the colonisers, the oppressors, and now all of a sudden we love the plucky underdog. Guilt, perhaps.
Pinpointing the moment things tipped more towards underdogs would be an interesting one. Despite occasional rhetoric about the values of the UK (or any other place) they are obviously not timeless and can shift dramatically - going from slaving to free slaves being one example - but it would be interesting if there was still an 'underdog' appreciation even when our actions were a long way from it.
In modern times it might be as simple as we think of ourselves as underdogs, the small nation which punched well above its weight in international matters for good and ill, so see ourselves in any underdog situation. Even though the UK has been pretty powerful for a long time, compared to many other places.
Yes. There was immense public sympathy for Spain and Portugal, in 1808-14.
Crucially, Irish Catholics were for once entirely on the same side as English Protestants. Irish Catholics made up 25% of the army.
Anyone who has read Sharpe knows that all the best soliders in the army were Irish, Welsh, or Scottish.
Christ, notwithstanding Sharpe himself being English I think even the French opponents get fewer villainous mooments than post English officers.
Don’t forget the Essex Men and cockneys (which Sharpe was).
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
The Navy was drawing heavily on the Southern coastal areas.
Very much so, but it was quite cosmopolitan (about 10% of sailors at Trafalgar were from overseas). There were also lots of Irish sailors. The Royal Navy was actually a pretty good option for the lower classes.
Plenty of exotic foreign travel too and some battles (provided you survived)
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Is this not as simple as: Five Guys is a chain with an almost entirely consistent menu, and if you go to one that varies from that by not including certain items it's quite reasonable to be disappointed?
Not necessarily. It depends on demand - and the meny doesn't have to be identical, does it?
Plus no point in having stuff hanging around till it goes off - it's a fast food place after all.
Fair enough, they are certainly free to optimise this way, but equally I think it's fine for people not to be thrilled about that, and that this doesn't mark them out as having extreme or unpleasant views.
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
They're shit, but it doesn't mean the Lib Dems are going anywhere.
The LDs are the school snitches of the kids playground, the type that "tells Sir", changes their tune depending on what they think will ingratiate themselves with the teachers the most, and couldn't lead a dog.
No-one looks to them as an alternative.
I mean quite clearly they are looking to them in parts of the country that were once true blue Tory. The kind of places that should be ripe for an upbeat, optimistic Conservative message.
I have some sympathy with your view of the negatives about the Lib Dems - their willingness to go full NIMBY is frustrating. But again, what does it say about the Tories that they've been getting their clock cleaned by a party whose main message is, "You may not agree with us on everything but at least we're not that horrible rabble"?
The public support for each measure is higher than democratic support
So? The public support for all those measures is also significantly lower than among Republican supporters. It's just how polarised our American friends are. What's also interesting is how unpopular most of those measures are overall.
You're lovely, Big G, but your habit of projecting despair onto lefties isn't becoming of a distinguished gentleman.
I am sorry as I do not want to project despair on anyone, but the poll does indicate higher approval from the public
Of course that could change and the one creating despair is Trump and I cannot see that changing unfortunately
The poll doesn’t show that. Also, many of the propositions on there are not fundamentally problematic.
Yes, a good percentage of the population want immigration controlled. So what, it doesn’t follow that they want to invade Canada.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Is this not as simple as: Five Guys is a chain with an almost entirely consistent menu, and if you go to one that varies from that by not including certain items it's quite reasonable to be disappointed?
Not necessarily. It depends on demand - and the meny doesn't have to be identical, does it?
Plus no point in having stuff hanging around till it goes off - it's a fast food place after all.
Fair enough, they are certainly free to optimise this way, but equally I think it's fine for people not to be thrilled about that, and that this doesn't mark them out as having extreme or unpleasant views.
(Not sure why I have weighed in on this, actually. I have no skin in the game because I think Five Guys is absolute crap either way.)
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu in many restaurants
So what? what's it to you? unless a restaurant that you go to all the time has stopped serving your favourite dish, in which case I can understand. But your silly references to imposing sharia law suggest you have another agenda.
unless you have some evidence of people being too scared to sell bacon because of intimidation - like the cow vigilantes in India? AFAIK it's a commercial decision by a few branches of Five Guys
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
But you're a core LD supporter and activist.
For which perennial delusion is a central requirement.
I think there's a lot to be said for TSE's analysis here. There is simply mo doubt that over the last few years British public opinion has swung strongly behind Ukraine. Whatever the reasons (plucky underdog, dislike of Russian aggression, or whatever) voters from all political parties and none have been raising money, sheltering refugees and generally supporting Ukraine. it's going to take a lot of reverse-ferretting to persuade churchgoers, charities, blokes in pubs etc that Zelensky is now the bad guy. Add in to this a general distaste (at best) for Trump, Trumpism, Musk-etry and general US belligerence, then it looks like Ed Davey & Co could be in exactly the same position as the vast majority of British voters.
I for one would have no hesitation in lending my protest vote to a party that is openly and transparently pro-Ukraine, anti-Trump and pro-Europe. I expect that many Conservatives and Labour voters would feel the same way, as neither Starmer nor Badenoch can say what the majority of their members would like them to say. And as for Farage, he's going to have to be very nimble on his feet to avoid being tarred by Trump's rapidly evolving but still bizarre foreign policy.
Agree. Countries don't have to be perfect for us in the UK to object to an invader bully creating refugees, widows and orphans in a country on our continent. Apart from anything else, the simple question: Who Next? applies.
Also, Farage's slippery comments, SFAICS, focussed on the narrow issues of: Is the Ukraine leader a dictator, and what about elections soon. The key Trumpian issue of 'Ukraine started it' was carefully evaded.
I love the fact that having subjugated over 20% of the planet, created colonies, and imposed governments on indigenous peoples around the world we now love an underdog.
British appreciation for the underdog is a deep cultural touchstone.
I think it’s one thing, for example, that divides British culture from American.
But it's weird. We were the bullies, the colonisers, the oppressors, and now all of a sudden we love the plucky underdog. Guilt, perhaps.
Pinpointing the moment things tipped more towards underdogs would be an interesting one. Despite occasional rhetoric about the values of the UK (or any other place) they are obviously not timeless and can shift dramatically - going from slaving to free slaves being one example - but it would be interesting if there was still an 'underdog' appreciation even when our actions were a long way from it.
In modern times it might be as simple as we think of ourselves as underdogs, the small nation which punched well above its weight in international matters for good and ill, so see ourselves in any underdog situation. Even though the UK has been pretty powerful for a long time, compared to many other places.
Yes. There was immense public sympathy for Spain and Portugal, in 1808-14.
Crucially, Irish Catholics were for once entirely on the same side as English Protestants. Irish Catholics made up 25% of the army.
Anyone who has read Sharpe knows that all the best soliders in the army were Irish, Welsh, or Scottish.
Christ, notwithstanding Sharpe himself being English I think even the French opponents get fewer villainous mooments than post English officers.
Don’t forget the Essex Men and cockneys (which Sharpe was).
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
The Navy was drawing heavily on the Southern coastal areas.
Very much so, but it was quite cosmopolitan (about 10% of sailors at Trafalgar were from overseas). There were also lots of Irish sailors. The Royal Navy was actually a pretty good option for the lower classes.
I'm reading NAM Roger's extensive three volume history at the moment. Not easy reads, but outstanding books.
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
My dad was the same.
He had myxomatosis?
It was awful, and we would deliberately drive over the poor stricken rabbits to put them out of their misery
There were lots of them on the country roads and it was very unpleasant but necessary
I know many people don't like shooting, but shooting mixyed rabbits was a mercy. A wild rabbit that lets a dog go up to it without running is a rabbit that is both seriously ill and seriously frightened.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Is this not as simple as: Five Guys is a chain with an almost entirely consistent menu, and if you go to one that varies from that by not including certain items it's quite reasonable to be disappointed?
yes totally reasonable, but has HYUFD had that experience? and if even if you do have that experience, is it reasonable to start going on about people imposing sharia law
Vance now arguing on X with the defence editor of the Economist about who knows more about Russian military strength in Ukr.
Putin can give him the true deets.
Except we know that won’t be the case as every level of Russian management lies to the one above exaggerating what they’ve been told
Presumably after that caught them out at the start of the 2022 invasion they are at least a bit more honest now, even if not totally so. The lying culture caused an entire repivot (and pretending the goal had not been to take over it all if they could).
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
They're shit, but it doesn't mean the Lib Dems are going anywhere.
The LDs are the school snitches of the kids playground, the type that "tells Sir", changes their tune depending on what they think will ingratiate themselves with the teachers the most, and couldn't lead a dog.
No-one looks to them as an alternative.
I'll mark your card as a potential LD voter! Mine too. Just need a different leader.
I see Guido has a copy of a 2015 election leaflet from Jonathan Reynolds that states ...'Before that I was a solicitor in Manchester'. It's now the fifth time he has claimed to be a solicitor.
I think that this has now done for him and he will be gone very shortly. Possibly as an MP too.
I didn't really see him as a fantasist. Had him as one of the more boring, workmanlike members of the cabinet.
Becoming a bit of thing now for Labour ministers - Haigh, Siddiq, Gwynne, Reynolds, Reeves.
Interesting more coming out of the Trigger Me Timbers over Reynolds:
You might be missing the point. No-one cares about a no-name minister. If he goes, he goes.
The significance might be greater for the Conservative Party because, first, Robert Jenrick will have played a part in bringing down Reynolds, which will strengthen his claim to the leadership. Second, the Tories are not nailed on to win a by-election and might even finish third behind Labour and Reform or Reform and Labour.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Is this not as simple as: Five Guys is a chain with an almost entirely consistent menu, and if you go to one that varies from that by not including certain items it's quite reasonable to be disappointed?
yes totally reasonable, but has HYUFD had that experience? and if even if you do have that experience, is it reasonable to start going on about people imposing sharia law
If restaurants in Muslim majority areas of the UK are only allowed to sell halal meat, in time some Muslim majority areas of the UK could try and impose Sharia law too, indeed there are now 85 Islamic councils and Sharia courts in the UK even if not recognised under national law
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
But you're a core LD supporter and activist.
For which perennial delusion is a central requirement.
To be fair, Tories really to figure out how they lost seats they held for over 100 years. My sincere hope is that they do not ally with Farage and remember what conservatism is all about. You’ll do well if you do.
Vance now arguing on X with the defence editor of the Economist about who knows more about Russian military strength in Ukr.
Putin can give him the true deets.
Except we know that won’t be the case as every level of Russian management lies to the one above exaggerating what they’ve been told
IF the Russians have only been using 20% of what they could, then surely numbskulls Trump and Vance should be pissed off with them for needlessly prolonging a pointless war. They could have finished it 3 years ago by just winning.
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
But you're a core LD supporter and activist.
For which perennial delusion is a central requirement.
To be fair, Tories really to figure out how they lost seats they held for over 100 years. My sincere hope is that they do not ally with Farage and remember what conservatism is all about. You’ll do well if you do.
Boris won and Farage on some polls is winning seats Labour held for 100 years, it is just the realignment post Brexit.
White working class areas have moved right and upper middle class areas have moved liberal left
She's far less clever than she thinks and she's far more clever than we think.
If I was in her place I'd never have the strength of character to come back from her disasters. I hope she does.
It’s not that she’s stupid. It’s that she’s batshit.
There’s a decent case to be made that she ought to be sectioned.
As discussed with @kle4 - I know you're a tough Kiwi, but could you have come back from what she's been through? (Obviously self-inflicted, but still)
Absolutely not. And I genuinely believe that her response to events is manifesting as unhingedness.
By accounts, she was always odd, now she’s totally cracked.
By observation, she was always odd, and continues to be odd. Odd can be good though, and there has to be a small comfy corner in the world where odd gets to put it feet up.
It's a psychological firewall she's put around herself to protect her self-esteem.
The alternative - confronting that she might actually be wrong- is too painful to contemplate.
I see Guido has a copy of a 2015 election leaflet from Jonathan Reynolds that states ...'Before that I was a solicitor in Manchester'. It's now the fifth time he has claimed to be a solicitor.
I think that this has now done for him and he will be gone very shortly. Possibly as an MP too.
I didn't really see him as a fantasist. Had him as one of the more boring, workmanlike members of the cabinet.
Becoming a bit of thing now for Labour ministers - Haigh, Siddiq, Gwynne, Reynolds, Reeves.
Interesting more coming out of the Trigger Me Timbers over Reynolds:
He's already had a slap on the wrist from SRA for calling himself a solicitor once. It's now 5 times and they are investigating him again. Clear offences. Once is a mistake, five times in a habit.
He's just committed an offence on an election leaflet, that falls under RPA.
Combine the two and he is toast.
In addition, it seems that his expenses are about to become under some scrutiny with additional revelations in TMT posts.
If he wont go willingly, Starmer is best to get rid.
The public support for each measure is higher than democratic support
So? The public support for all those measures is also significantly lower than among Republican supporters. It's just how polarised our American friends are. What's also interesting is how unpopular most of those measures are overall.
You're lovely, Big G, but your habit of projecting despair onto lefties isn't becoming of a distinguished gentleman.
I am sorry as I do not want to project despair on anyone, but the poll does indicate higher approval from the public
Of course that could change and the one creating despair is Trump and I cannot see that changing unfortunately
The poll doesn’t show that. Also, many of the propositions on there are not fundamentally problematic.
Yes, a good percentage of the population want immigration controlled. So what, it doesn’t follow that they want to invade Canada.
You clearly haven't read my comment at 6.25 tonight
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
But you're a core LD supporter and activist.
For which perennial delusion is a central requirement.
To be fair, Tories really to figure out how they lost seats they held for over 100 years. My sincere hope is that they do not ally with Farage and remember what conservatism is all about. You’ll do well if you do.
Boris won and Farage on some polls is winning seats Labour held for 100 years, it is just the realignment post Brexit.
White working class areas have moved right and upper middle class areas have moved liberal left
Revolutionary right wing maga style nationalism does not equal British conservatism, it’s almost as far away from it at revolutionary socialism.
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
My dad was the same.
He had myxomatosis?
It was awful, and we would deliberately drive over the poor stricken rabbits to put them out of their misery
There were lots of them on the country roads and it was very unpleasant but necessary
I know many people don't like shooting, but shooting mixyed rabbits was a mercy. A wild rabbit that lets a dog go up to it without running is a rabbit that is both seriously ill and seriously frightened.
They were widely shot by farmers across Northumberland at the time
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
But you're a core LD supporter and activist.
For which perennial delusion is a central requirement.
To be fair, Tories really to figure out how they lost seats they held for over 100 years. My sincere hope is that they do not ally with Farage and remember what conservatism is all about. You’ll do well if you do.
Boris won and Farage on some polls is winning seats Labour held for 100 years, it is just the realignment post Brexit.
White working class areas have moved right and upper middle class areas have moved liberal left
Revolutionary right wing maga style nationalism does not equal British conservatism, it’s almost as far away from it at revolutionary socialism.
It didn't use to equal american conservatism either, but it does now.
I don't think the LDs will gain much, Starmer and Badenoch have equally confirmed support for Zelensky and Ukraine (as to be fair did Truss as PM). Starmer is also very pro EDI unlike Trump and both Starmer and Badenoch as well as Davey oppose Trump's tariffs and Starmer has reiterated support for a 2 state solution between Israel and Palestine. The most pro Trump party is Reform whose voters would never consider the pro EU, pro immigration LDs anyway
Only the LibDems are going after Trump. I suspect this will be popular with the current LibDem voter base and those the party is targeting for next time.
I’ve noticed several of them deliberately tagging JD Vance and Musk in their tweets, to provoke a reaction.
Davey already had an online attack from Musk a few weeks ago. They must have seen the engagement numbers from that and thought “hmm, let’s get a bit more”.
The Lib Dems are political prostitutes with few punters.
Pretty weak attack line.
29 gains more from the Tories and Sir Ed is His Majesty´s leader Leader of the Loyal Opposition.
The next locals could demonstrate that this is more than possible.
I am more than sure that there will be increasingly vicious attacks on the Lib Dems, I am increasingly sure that they won´t work.
But you're a core LD supporter and activist.
For which perennial delusion is a central requirement.
To be fair, Tories really to figure out how they lost seats they held for over 100 years. My sincere hope is that they do not ally with Farage and remember what conservatism is all about. You’ll do well if you do.
Votes leached to Farage and Reform is a far bigger reason for why the LDs "did well" than the innate appeal of LDs.
They couldn't beat 12% of the vote.
But, if you were a realist, you wouldn't be a LD; you have to permanently believe the breakthrough is tomorrow to pound those streets.
I'm a big fan of rabbit. I like it done the Catalan way - grilled and served with a mound of alioli, roasted peppers and chips. Add a bottle of filthy strong red wine from the Priorat and you're in paradise
That sounds amazing.
We haven't eaten rabbit since witnessing the effects of myxomatosis in the rabbit population in Northumberland in the 1950s
My dad was the same.
He had myxomatosis?
It was awful, and we would deliberately drive over the poor stricken rabbits to put them out of their misery
There were lots of them on the country roads and it was very unpleasant but necessary
I'm surprised I can't find anything contemporaneous on the disease in the UK.
She's far less clever than she thinks and she's far more clever than we think.
If I was in her place I'd never have the strength of character to come back from her disasters. I hope she does.
It’s not that she’s stupid. It’s that she’s batshit.
There’s a decent case to be made that she ought to be sectioned.
As discussed with @kle4 - I know you're a tough Kiwi, but could you have come back from what she's been through? (Obviously self-inflicted, but still)
Absolutely not. And I genuinely believe that her response to events is manifesting as unhingedness.
By accounts, she was always odd, now she’s totally cracked.
By observation, she was always odd, and continues to be odd. Odd can be good though, and there has to be a small comfy corner in the world where odd gets to put it feet up.
It's a psychological firewall she's put around herself to protect her self-esteem.
The alternative - confronting that she might actually be wrong- is too painful to contemplate.
Maybe, and (in my view) that's probably true. I see little merit, and some cruelty in hounding her.
I see Guido has a copy of a 2015 election leaflet from Jonathan Reynolds that states ...'Before that I was a solicitor in Manchester'. It's now the fifth time he has claimed to be a solicitor.
I think that this has now done for him and he will be gone very shortly. Possibly as an MP too.
I didn't really see him as a fantasist. Had him as one of the more boring, workmanlike members of the cabinet.
Becoming a bit of thing now for Labour ministers - Haigh, Siddiq, Gwynne, Reynolds, Reeves.
Interesting more coming out of the Trigger Me Timbers over Reynolds:
He's already had a slap on the wrist from SRA for calling himself a solicitor once. It's now 5 times and they are investigating him again. Clear offences. Once is a mistake, five times in a habit.
He's just committed an offence on an election leaflet, that falls under RPA.
Combine the two and he is toast.
In addition, it seems that his expenses are about to become under some scrutiny with additional revelations in TMT posts.
If he wont go willingly, Starmer is best to get rid.
Starmer throws Haigh under the bus but will stand by Reynolds.
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
They're shit, but it doesn't mean the Lib Dems are going anywhere.
The LDs are the school snitches of the kids playground, the type that "tells Sir", changes their tune depending on what they think will ingratiate themselves with the teachers the most, and couldn't lead a dog.
No-one looks to them as an alternative.
I mean quite clearly they are looking to them in parts of the country that were once true blue Tory. The kind of places that should be ripe for an upbeat, optimistic Conservative message.
I have some sympathy with your view of the negatives about the Lib Dems - their willingness to go full NIMBY is frustrating. But again, what does it say about the Tories that they've been getting their clock cleaned by a party whose main message is, "You may not agree with us on everything but at least we're not that horrible rabble"?
You need to do much better for the LDs than to just answer every challenge with, 'What does this say about the Tories?'
I see Guido has a copy of a 2015 election leaflet from Jonathan Reynolds that states ...'Before that I was a solicitor in Manchester'. It's now the fifth time he has claimed to be a solicitor.
I think that this has now done for him and he will be gone very shortly. Possibly as an MP too.
I didn't really see him as a fantasist. Had him as one of the more boring, workmanlike members of the cabinet.
Becoming a bit of thing now for Labour ministers - Haigh, Siddiq, Gwynne, Reynolds, Reeves.
Interesting more coming out of the Trigger Me Timbers over Reynolds:
He's already had a slap on the wrist from SRA for calling himself a solicitor once. It's now 5 times and they are investigating him again. Clear offences. Once is a mistake, five times in a habit.
He's just committed an offence on an election leaflet, that falls under RPA.
Combine the two and he is toast.
In addition, it seems that his expenses are about to become under some scrutiny with additional revelations in TMT posts.
If he wont go willingly, Starmer is best to get rid.
Look, if the SRA let Womble Bond Dickinson get away with repeatedly falsifying court paperwork to secure verdicts they know to be wrong, and then getting caught lying about it to a judge, are they actually going to care about an MP slightly exaggerating his status?
Vance now arguing on X with the defence editor of the Economist about who knows more about Russian military strength in Ukr.
Putin can give him the true deets.
Except we know that won’t be the case as every level of Russian management lies to the one above exaggerating what they’ve been told
IF the Russians have only been using 20% of what they could, then surely numbskulls Trump and Vance should be pissed off with them for needlessly prolonging a pointless war. They could have finished it 3 years ago by just winning.
Had Russia not been advancing in the East in the past year as they unfortunately have done, I wonder if Trump's mission to turn everyone in the GOP against Ukraine would have been as easy as it has been, as he would have had more work to portray Russia as the inevitable victor.
Quotes getting messed up. But re bans, HYUFD isn;t protesting against mouflon meat or zebra meat not being available, sorry I meant, banned, in his local Tesco. Look here.
We have a significant pork production industry in the UK, zebra or mouflon meat is almost entirely imported, neither are native British animals like pigs
Er ... most farming pig breeds are in large part non-native non-British, albeit heavily hybridised ...
And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
There are large numbers of pig farms across Britain, very few zebra or mouflon farms.
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu
Changing the goalposts yet again, complete no doubt with squirrel meat.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Is this not as simple as: Five Guys is a chain with an almost entirely consistent menu, and if you go to one that varies from that by not including certain items it's quite reasonable to be disappointed?
yes totally reasonable, but has HYUFD had that experience? and if even if you do have that experience, is it reasonable to start going on about people imposing sharia law
If restaurants in Muslim majority areas of the UK are only allowed to sell halal meat, in time some Muslim majority areas of the UK could try and impose Sharia law too, indeed there are now 85 Islamic councils and Sharia courts in the UK even if not recognised under national law
The Tories are running down an ideological cul-de-sac. The social post about being defenders of Western Civilidation is utterly bonkers. These are serious times, and Badenoch is simply not serious. Total irrelevance beckons.
The Lib Dems smell weakness, hopefully. There’s an opportunity to position themselves as the mainstream opposition to Labour, with Reform as the supposedly “populist” opposition.
I agree with your first paragraph, but you lose it on the second.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Given the Lib Dems now hold almost half the seats in Surrey - what does that say about the modern Tory Party?
They're shit, but it doesn't mean the Lib Dems are going anywhere.
The LDs are the school snitches of the kids playground, the type that "tells Sir", changes their tune depending on what they think will ingratiate themselves with the teachers the most, and couldn't lead a dog.
No-one looks to them as an alternative.
I mean quite clearly they are looking to them in parts of the country that were once true blue Tory. The kind of places that should be ripe for an upbeat, optimistic Conservative message.
I have some sympathy with your view of the negatives about the Lib Dems - their willingness to go full NIMBY is frustrating. But again, what does it say about the Tories that they've been getting their clock cleaned by a party whose main message is, "You may not agree with us on everything but at least we're not that horrible rabble"?
You need to do much better for the LDs than to just answer every challenge with, 'What does this say about the Tories?'
You need to much better for the Tories than worry about the weakest of utterances of (for every fault of their own) a completely inconsequential LD party.
AFAICT, outside London, it requires quite some effort in this country to find hot food at a moment's notice that isn't cooked breakfast (morning only) pizza, pasta, burgers, (average) steak or fish and chips. And options for side salad, vegetables or fresh fruit for dessert are usually rather limited. In the evenings, you can add a curry, Chinese and a kebab.
Clearly, that's what the market is demanding, but it's not exactly innovative cuisine or a healthy one.
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And if it's British to eat that on your logic, surely it's even more British not to?
https://x.com/liambillington/status/1892994721234182348
So, if you ask "about deporting illegal immigrants who have not been convicted of a criminal offence", then support drops to 39%. (https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-admin-deporting-illegal-immigrants-convicted-crime-wildly-popular-among-new-york-voters-poll)
Which is likely what is needed, if the US has de facto left NATO.
At least it's a warmer night.
The sadism of American policy to war-torn Ukraine
https://snyder.substack.com/p/recoup-the-costs
The premise of American foreign policy to Ukraine, today, is one of grievance. As the American president, vice-president, and national security advisor constantly repeat, Ukraine, the victim of a large-scale and criminal Russian invasion, must "recoup the costs" to the US taxpayer for aid received under the Biden administration.
It is worth patiently considering this proposition. It reveals little about Ukraine, but much about America in February 2025.
1. The American demand is of an extraordinary scale. In Kyiv and again in Munich, the Americans proposed that Ukraine concede half of the profits from its mineral rights in perpetuity and from other national resources and from its ports in perpetuity with a lien on everything important -- in exchange for essentially nothing. This is not really a monetary proposition, let alone a "deal," but rather the demand that Ukraine become a permanent American colony. It amounts to blackmail enabled by ongoing Russian invasion. In effect, the United States is telling Ukraine to concede its resources to the United States, under the threat that American aid will be otherwise withdrawn, and those resources will be taken by Russia.
2. Ukraine is currently under attack by the Russian Federation, which invaded its south and southeast in 2014 and then began a full-scale invasion in 2022. For three years, Ukraine has resisted the largest offensive in contemporary history. The American demands amount to extremely severe war reparations upon Ukraine, far more severe than was demanded (for example) of Germany after either world war. But this demand is directed against Ukraine, and Ukraine is not the aggressor. Russia is the aggressor. Ukraine is the victim. Until now, the discussion in the United States and elsewhere was the reparations that Russia, as the aggressor state, should pay. That would be the historically normal discussion. It would also be the strategically normal discussion, in that it raises the costs of war to the current aggressor and to future aggressors.
3. The demand that Ukraine pay a huge sum to the United States is contrary to any logic* of ending the war...
*Not quite any.
It's quite logical, if the means of ending the war is predicated on dividing the spoils of conquest between Russia and the US.
I support Ukraine and Israel in their current conflicts, because they are more liberal and democratic than their opponents.
Here's an evergreen comment for you: whatever the question, the Liberal Democrats are never the answer.
Used to be only the North Koreans who were that rude and petty in diplomatic statements.
The big recruiting grounds were Ireland, and the Highlands (where the army was almost the only career option, both for younger sons of farmers and minor gentry); and places like Essex (which incorporated East London), where poverty was rife, Staffordshire, South Lancs., South Yorks., which were hit by periodic mass unemployment, during industrialisation.
'Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive' [Sir Walter Scott's poem 'Marmion]
In any case Five Guys is a burger chain which has always put bacon on many of its burgers, it never sold zebra or mouflon meat, so it has taken a decision to deliberately remove non halal meat like bacon from its menu in many restaurants
Is there a betting market for this?
Another safe Labour seat, been Labour since 1945. Conservatives have got close on a few occasions, <3000 off in 2019, but Reform second in 2024, 8,500 off.
Could be interesting.
You claimed that it was outrageous to ban pork because it is NATIVE BRITISH. Native is the word used for breeds, not for individuals, when it is used of farm animals [edit]. And when I point out the breeds aren't very British you suddenly decide it's not relevant.
You'll need to do better than this on the doorstep.
Before that we ate it regularly and I am sure it is a very tasty dish today
But all this is built on a continuation of the post war settlement, in which security is key. At heart I don't think most potential Reform voters want any of: USA supporting Russia; Russia free to trample on Europe, hatred of the underdog; USA telling Reform voters what a bunch of losers Brits are.
(about 10% of sailors at Trafalgar were from overseas). There were also lots of Irish sailors. The Royal Navy was actually a pretty good option for the lower classes.
There were lots of them on the country roads and it was very unpleasant but necessary
The LDs are the school snitches of the kids playground, the type that "tells Sir", changes their tune depending on what they think will ingratiate themselves with the teachers the most, and couldn't lead a dog.
No-one looks to them as an alternative.
Plus no point in having stuff hanging around till it goes off - it's a fast food place after all.
Though if the next general election saw a Labour minority government with LD confidence and supply that would likely send some of those LD Surrey seats back to the Tories
There are thousands of pig farms in the UK selling British produced pork and bacon and Five Guys used that in all its restaurants before very happily until now
I have some sympathy with your view of the negatives about the Lib Dems - their willingness to go full NIMBY is frustrating. But again, what does it say about the Tories that they've been getting their clock cleaned by a party whose main message is, "You may not agree with us on everything but at least we're not that horrible rabble"?
Also, many of the propositions on there are not fundamentally problematic.
Yes, a good percentage of the population want immigration controlled. So what, it doesn’t follow that they want to invade Canada.
unless you have some evidence of people being too scared to sell bacon because of intimidation - like the cow vigilantes in India? AFAIK it's a commercial decision by a few branches of Five Guys
For which perennial delusion is a central requirement.
The significance might be greater for the Conservative Party because, first, Robert Jenrick will have played a part in bringing down Reynolds, which will strengthen his claim to the leadership. Second, the Tories are not nailed on to win a by-election and might even finish third behind Labour and Reform or Reform and Labour.
NEW - Trump Job approval
🟢 Approve 53% (+9)
🟤 Disapprove 44%
RMG #B - 3000 RV - 2/21
https://www.gbnews.com/news/britain-sharia-law-courts-western-capital
White working class areas have moved right and upper middle class areas have moved liberal left
The alternative - confronting that she might actually be wrong- is too painful to contemplate.
He's just committed an offence on an election leaflet, that falls under RPA.
Combine the two and he is toast.
In addition, it seems that his expenses are about to become under some scrutiny with additional revelations in TMT posts.
If he wont go willingly, Starmer is best to get rid.
They couldn't beat 12% of the vote.
But, if you were a realist, you wouldn't be a LD; you have to permanently believe the breakthrough is tomorrow to pound those streets.
Here is a 20 minute documentary about it's use in Australia:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT0d990lauE
(A few distressing scenes.)
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French newspaper Le Point says that Trump is set to meet Putin in Moscow on May 9th to commemorate the end of WW2
Oh god. LOL
Here's the trend, albeit not yet including RMG: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/approval/donald-trump/
Clearly, that's what the market is demanding, but it's not exactly innovative cuisine or a healthy one.
As a new one opens in the toon.
https://x.com/exec_sum/status/1892954539348959356?s=61