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For the first time in a few days I think Reform are a sell on the spreads – politicalbetting.com

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  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,043
    IanB2 said:

    That seems to be the Meloni play script, as she tacks back toward respectability. Insofar as I could tell, she remains pretty popular in Italy.
    Meloni is in a coalition government with the main centre right party Forza Italia though
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,814

    According to this, no he isn't;

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/05/23/rishi-sunaks-1000-rwanda-flights-bet-with-piers-morgan-off/

    Unless it's been overtaken by events. (Was it really a test flight, though? Flying people to a different country isn't a concept that needs testing- even Wizz! manage that. The bit that needed testing was forcing people onto one way flights.)

    I'm sure a disreputable troublemaker would be able to link this to the more recent gambling fiasco.

    When the fun stops and all that.
    What? Why would 'Downing Street' honour the bet? Rishi Sunak expects US to pay for his stupidity? HE should pay up!
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,787
    Nigelb said:

    .

    While that’s true of Stalin, they continued paying lip service to communism - and backing revolutionary communist abroad - until the dissolution of the USSR.
    Russian imperialism has pretty well entirely replaced that as a governing ideology.
    Mr b I am saying however it is packaged Russian Imperialism is a constant. That they hit on communism as a way of deluding idiots in the West was simply playing a blinder. The West only got its act together in the 80s.

    Looking forward however I do wonder how Russia will play its cards. With a collapsing population it can no longer push others around so easily. Our problem will be how to deal with a nuclear armed mafia state . A change of government would be a logical start.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,241
    Nunu5 said:

    Imagine the Far right won the parliamentary elections in France and then govern really well......eek!

    That looks pretty unlikely from their manifesto.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/marine-le-pen-jordan-bardella-national-rally-french-far-right-postpone-costly-measures-markets-tumble/

    Though who gets the blame in the chaos of cohabitation is one of the big unknowns. Probably both RN and Macron.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,302
    johnt said:

    It was precisely the question I asked. So now you are comparing joining the EU with acquiring nuclear weapons? Wow the delusion levels seem to be reaching new heights. The apologists for Putin and his poodle Farage seem to be on some kind of parallel planet.

    But I will not stoop to their level and will answer the question. It is fine to have a policy of opposing the proliferation of nuclear weapons and attempt to stop any country building more. But it is not fine to kill innocent civilians in pursuit of that policy. The problem with your absolutely absurd comparison is that the EU has no army, no military aspirations and no history of any military activity. To use countries joining a peaceful trade arrangement as a justification for war is the act of a political appeaser.
    So the question remains why should the countries of Eastern Europe not be allowed to join the EU to appease a dictator and his poodle Farage?,
    Out of interest, if it's not fine to kill innocent civilians to stop nuclear proliferation, does that mean you're cool with the Iranians getting the bomb, even if we had the option of destroying their production facilities, as we might well kill some unfortunate civilians (say the cleaning team) in the process?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 43,334
    Farooq said:

    When I said she's nearly there, I think you misinterpreted that as meaning her opinions are close to fascism. That's not what I meant. What I meant was that she's reaching an angle of repose that will result in an avalanche into utter madness. Think of Spiked. The cracks are there. She's on the brink of madness. It's the sort of thing you see every so often. Hippies that wake up one day wanting to exterminate Gypsies. She's mixing in the right crowds. In a few years time it'll be leather boots and barbed-wire fantasies.

    Come back in 2028 and tell me I was wrong.
    Platonic..
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    Good morning everyone. I missed the post about the leaders cars. So here is my list. Farage. A V12 XJS. It does not work and is riddled with electrical faults. He also has a BMW M5 in black with tinted windows as he needs to get to meetings with the Supe Rich billonaires fast who are about to place a short on oil and gas or a long on copper as there is no more left in the world. Private Jet is also used if our road network is gridlocked. He did have fun working at the London metal exchange. I still think he is there. Starmer. Nissan Leaf for todays driving. Nostagia car. Austin Allegro Vaden Plas Automatic for driving around the lanes in Oxted and Reigate,his old stomping ground. The restoration work is yet to be carried out and it is fully costed. Sunak. G Wagon Brabus. Great for a quick get away. Ed Davey. Kia EV6. It is a wolf in sheeps clothing. However his prefered method of travel is the Helter Skelter.Looking forward how all of you will bet on this election, seats per party etc. I am still not convinced Labour will get 442 seats etc. I would say 380 for them.

    Quite wrong, Farage is one of those Morgan things with leather straps on the bonnet. Hand crafted in Britain the way they used to be. String back gloves. Twatty cap. Barbour.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,815

    You've spoken to all of them have you?

    Oh. I see. No you haven't. So you base your fuckwitted stupidity on occasional journeys in a taxi.

    "British culture" means what, exactly? That we all become like you? Nasty little shits who spend their lives off their tits on heroin and other illegal substances and brag about shagging around, including of girls the age of your daughter.

    You're too stupid to have learned about the history of these islands and the cultural matrix interwoven into our DNA. There is NO white supremacist version of "British Culture" and "worship" but an ever-changing melting pot.

    You really are an utter moron FAKE @Leon . As stupid as your hero Trump.
    Is this anothet of Seant's sockpuppets?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,296
    edited June 2024
    DeclanF said:

    Once again, whenever women's rights come up as a topic, the misogynists on here find it impossible to talk about it as matter in its own right without either dismissing or insulting the women who raise it or making it about men who claim to be women.

    If you cannot be clear about what sex is, you cannot protect sex based rights or fight against sex-based oppression and discrimination. That discrimination and oppression is overwhelmingly endured by women. Here and in virtually every country in the world. Nor can you protect rights based on sexual orientation which is based on sex. That too is felt by many gay men and women around the world and, increasingly, by lesbians here who are often targeted by a very unpleasant category of men.

    The Lib Dems and the Greens have made it clear in their manifestos that they will remove sex-based rights from the Equality Act. Labour have cobbled together some sort of fudge but Starmer has been all over the place on this and his arrogantly sexist response this week - where he needed a man to say something women had been saying for ages before he could agree to it - did him no favours at all.

    As for girls with dysphoria they need proper treatment and help not as Khan has done the glorification of self-mutilation. If a bikini-ready body is not fit to be displayed, why is a self-harmed one? The fact that dysphoria in women tends to happen in teenage girls (rather than in middle-aged women, unlike the case with men) raises issues about how we treat girls, our expectations of them, the stereotypes imposed and the pressures they are under. The answer to those is not mutilation and drugs.

    Treat what the GLP says with care. They have made unevidenced assertions in order to raise money. They have not always been accurate in their statements. They brought a legal action claiming the NHS discriminated against trans people. They lost and the evidence was that the NHS had increased its funding but could not find sufficient doctors and nurses to work in this area of medicine. Given the abuse doctors like Dr Cass have faced, is this any surprise? As for the legal issues, the Supreme Court will be ruling on the FWS appeal and this will determine what sex in the Equality Act means and its interaction with what the GRA says. Though it may make the position even more complicated and confused. That's the trouble with creating legal fictions at odds with reality.

    The Tories should have learnt that lesson over Rwanda and indeed Brexit.

    It would be helpful if you quoted at lease one of the posts you are referring to with 'the misogynists on here find it impossible to talk about it as matter in its own right without either dismissing or insulting the women who raise it'.
  • Mrgan. Yes! V8 model though. Red. 1975 year of reg.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,787

    So let me get this right. Putin is a Communist despite growing up in a non-socialist regime. Presumably he will be rolling out collectivisation and the communes any time soon.

    Next you'll be suggesting that Hitler was far-left because he led the National Socialist German Workers' Party.
    Putin was born in 1952. He was 37 when Communism collapsed by which time he was an officer in the KGB. So he grew up and was committed to Communism

    And as you rightly point out the only difference between communism and Nazism is one was international socialism and the other was national socialism. Pretend socialists hiding authoritarian regimes.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,814

    I'm pretty sure that there isn't enough oil and gas easily exploitable to be self-sufficient in oil and gas, especially at reasonable cost. I might be wrong - Richard would know more.

    There was a Russian terrorist attack on London. There was one on Salisbury.

    The problem is, you'd see the 'From Russia xxx' calling card and claim it's all a false flag, and that Russia is innocent. That's what you've done before, perhaps because your brain has rotted from reading too many 'alternative' news sites...
    I don't view any alternative news sites at the moment actually. This *is* my alternative news site. But yes, I do have the view that atrocities can sometimes be brought about in order to manufacture public consent for wars or other unpalatable policy changes. I would not want there to be a 'red line' for fear that a bad actor would attempt to cross it.

    I would also look to introduce more tariffs on Chinese products - China is bankrolling Russia and we are bankrolling China. That's daft.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 19,161
    I am sorry to have to contradict a fellow weather geek, but it is my regrettable duty to have to inform people that there is an awful lot of low pressure in today's ECMWF forecast, and the hoped-for transition to warm and sunny weather as the election approaches now looks a lot less likely.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,814
    Cookie said:

    Is this anothet of Seant's sockpuppets?
    I believe so.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,296

    Putin was born in 1952. He was 37 when Communism collapsed by which time he was an officer in the KGB. So he grew up and was committed to Communism

    And as you rightly point out the only difference between communism and Nazism is one was international socialism and the other was national socialism. Pretend socialists hiding authoritarian regimes.
    I certainly agree with your last sentence.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 10,148
    Nigelb said:

    This is indeed a great chart.

    Contender for favorite chart of all time:

    Predictions vs. Reality for solar energy.

    https://x.com/AlecStapp/status/1803810075909161296

    F*** yeah
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,550

    Quite wrong, Farage is one of those Morgan things with leather straps on the bonnet. Hand crafted in Britain the way they used to be. String back gloves. Twatty cap. Barbour.
    And a fucking uncomfortable ride.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,094

    America stayed out of the war until the end of 1941, with the British Empire liquidated to pay for their help in the war. They joined only when attacked directly, yet still their record in World War II is a pillar of their nation's story. So clearly you can be pretty neutral against it.
    Also make lots of money at the same time
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,354
    IanB2 said:

    You could say that about a lot of western states.

    As observed above, it’s well known that there are similarities between dictatorships of right and left. Nevertheless there are significant differences, particularly in the way that the economy is managed. Putin’s reliance on his billionaire oligarchs managing major privately owned enterprises mirrors Hitler and his oligarchic capitalists, not Stalin’s state controlled state planned economy.
    It's an understandable blind spot mainstream politicians have- to deny that an extreme version of their ideology exists and is bad.

    See Thatcher's odd intonation on talking about the evils of National Socialism.

    (Whereas the first fight to win and keep winning is democracy vs. undemocracy. Only once that is in the bag do battles between different shades of democracy make sense )
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 38,113

    Quite wrong, Farage is one of those Morgan things with leather straps on the bonnet. Hand crafted in Britain the way they used to be. String back gloves. Twatty cap. Barbour.

    TVR

    Incredibly loud and brash. Spectacularly unreliable.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,400

    Like Putin in Russia maybe?
    Putin's rule in Russia is best characterised as a serious of catastrophic economic decisions which has left the Russian economy disastrously under invested and undervthe control of brutal mafia cliques. This then followed by the deaths of half a million men at a time when Russian demographics were already close to collapse.
    Putin has launched a serious of wars against peaceful neighbours- Georgia in 2008 and Ukraine since 2014. He has also used bribery, blackmail, propaganda and cyber war directly against the West. He has openly paid money to disruptive parties, such as the RN in France and the AfD. In the UK Farage and Salmond were both employed by Russia Today. I note the strong Russian links of Aaron Banks, Dominic Cummings and Jacob Rees Mogg amongst others.

    Putin is the enemy of freedom and democracy. His supporters likewise.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,296

    I believe so.
    Probably not then.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 38,113

    Sunak has no battle to fight after the election. He's gone.

    If he wants to leave a positive legacy for the Conservative Party, he will do it now - by standing up to the Reform-appeaser wing. And by going full Tonto on Farage.

    Hard to imagine what that would look like

    "I disagree. Strongly!"
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,094
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting, thanks for writing.
    Even if it was a load of bollox
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,241
    edited June 2024

    Sunak has no battle to fight after the election. He's gone.

    If he wants to leave a positive legacy for the Conservative Party, he will do it now - by standing up to the Reform-appeaser wing. And by going full Tonto on Farage.
    Considering how cackhanded his campaign has been at every stage so far , that strategy isn't likely to go well for him.

  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    And a fucking uncomfortable ride.
    It is a key plot point in the novel The Odessa File that English sports cars have stiffer suspension than wallowy foreign sedans
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,723
    .

    Mr b I am saying however it is packaged Russian Imperialism is a constant. That they hit on communism as a way of deluding idiots in the West was simply playing a blinder. The West only got its act together in the 80s.

    Looking forward however I do wonder how Russia will play its cards. With a collapsing population it can no longer push others around so easily. Our problem will be how to deal with a nuclear armed mafia state . A change of government would be a logical start.
    I agree with you - though until Stalin, there was something else going on too.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 31,298
    ...

    Putin is a signed up Communist which puts him on the far left.
    There is nothing "Little Red Book" about Putin.

    As usual, you are wrong.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,241
    It's the penultimate election weekend and a really strange atmosphere politically.

    The Tories seem to have given up and thrown in the towel. It's just weird.

  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,636

    This is why I'm bemused by people such as Kim Philby stating that he was spying for Russia for anti-imperialist reasons. You could, at a stretch, argue that before WW2 (though I'd argue you were wrong); after WW2 it was very clear that Russia itself was far more imperialist than Britain. Philby spied *for* imperialism, not against.
    Philby was just doing it for fun. He was a posh kid,enjoying himself at the expense of others.
  • Sunak on his way to the states. Silicon Valley or Wall Street bank. The nimble British sports car. The Lotus Elan Sprint.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 38,113
    Foxy said:

    It's the penultimate election weekend and a really strange atmosphere politically.

    The Tories seem to have given up and thrown in the towel. It's just weird.

    Given that every cunning plan they have tried has blown up in their faces, doing nothing at all for the next 2 weeks is probably their best hope of salvaging something from the wreckage
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,400
    Cicero said:

    Putin's rule in Russia is best characterised as a serious of catastrophic economic decisions which has left the Russian economy disastrously under invested and undervthe control of brutal mafia cliques. This then followed by the deaths of half a million men at a time when Russian demographics were already close to collapse.
    Putin has launched a serious of wars against peaceful neighbours- Georgia in 2008 and Ukraine since 2014. He has also used bribery, blackmail, propaganda and cyber war directly against the West. He has openly paid money to disruptive parties, such as the RN in France and the AfD. In the UK Farage and Salmond were both employed by Russia Today. I note the strong Russian links of Aaron Banks, Dominic Cummings and Jacob Rees Mogg amongst others.

    Putin is the enemy of freedom and democracy. His supporters likewise.
    Dominic Cummings lived in Russia for four years, and you maybrecall was denied full security clearance. Aaron Banks has close links with the Russian Embassy and was a regular guest of the Ambassador, where Brexit was a major discussion topic. Jacob Rees Mogg invested many millions in Russia, and it is strongly suggested, these investments were made on behalf of ultimately Russian beneficiaries.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 24,260
    Foxy said:

    It's the penultimate election weekend and a really strange atmosphere politically.

    The Tories seem to have given up and thrown in the towel. It's just weird.

    Maybe they've realised that everytime they say something they go down a point in the polls?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,094
    Heathener said:

    The only people you hear describing Putin as a communist are old. I’m guessing you grew up through the 1950’s and 1960’s and don’t understand the realpolitik of post-Cold War Russia.
    You really are an arsehole of the first order, no redeeming features.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,787

    ...

    There is nothing "Little Red Book" about Putin.

    As usual, you are wrong.
    Yes, but being wrong all the time is such fun.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,815

    Platonic..
    I suspect, given JKR's background, much of her leftiness was informed by feminism. If she finds the party has moved away from feminism, it's no surprise she no longer feels she can support it.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,094

    I take it that you're of the view that trans people don't exist?
    you obviously did not read it, just applied your well documented bias that women have penises
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 14,012
    Sorry if this has been discussed before, but Farage on Ukraine etc raises more than one question.

    Let's assume Farage acts and speaks for reasons. And accept this: although he utters some criticisms of Russia/Putin/Trump etc, he notably never does so in an unqualified way, and always utters some amelioration of the criticism. Hence yesterday on Ukraine etc

    In election time there can only be two reasons for this. It could be this is because his supporters base are with him on all this and it is all said to get votes.

    The only other possibility is that he is under obligations within a network of international relationships to maintain a particular line - just like Labour can't full frontally attack unions, or the Tories can't go heavy on wealthy oligarchs.

    Is this about right?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,309

    Pretty stupid from Verhofstadt, the correct thing to do is let Farage float adrift in a mess of his own making not to give him easy distractions to get out of it.
    I wish Vertwatstadht would keep his mouth shut.

    It's the one thing that might generate sympathy for Farage.
  • TVR is a good one for Nige. Powerful with bad handling.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 31,298
    Cicero said:

    Dominic Cummings lived in Russia for four years, and you maybrecall was denied full security clearance. Aaron Banks has close links with the Russian Embassy and was a regular guest of the Ambassador, where Brexit was a major discussion topic. Jacob Rees Mogg invested many millions in Russia, and it is strongly suggested, these investments were made on behalf of ultimately Russian beneficiaries.
    ...and Boris Johnson attended Lebedev parties whilst Foreign Secretary sans his security detail.

    How so little has been made of that breach by the authorities and the media is beyond me. Boris will be Boris.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,255
    Cicero said:

    Dominic Cummings lived in Russia for four years, and you maybrecall was denied full security clearance. Aaron Banks has close links with the Russian Embassy and was a regular guest of the Ambassador, where Brexit was a major discussion topic. Jacob Rees Mogg invested many millions in Russia, and it is strongly suggested, these investments were made on behalf of ultimately Russian beneficiaries.
    This is conspiracy theory on a par with the rubbish about Remain postal votes a few days ago. Brexit Derangement Syndrome writ large.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,309
    Scott_xP said:

    Hard to imagine what that would look like

    "I disagree. Strongly!"
    He's working on his spreadsheet right now.

    Expect a really uncutting line to be delivered very badly at 20dB about lunchtime Monday.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 40,017

    Sunak has no battle to fight after the election. He's gone.

    If he wants to leave a positive legacy for the Conservative Party, he will do it now - by standing up to the Reform-appeaser wing. And by going full Tonto on Farage.
    He should have done it a long time ago. But he didn’t, so I can’t see him doing it now. It would nice to be wrong, though.

  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,309

    Sunak has no battle to fight after the election.
    He's not got battle to fight before the election either, tbf.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,094
    Cicero said:

    Putin's rule in Russia is best characterised as a serious of catastrophic economic decisions which has left the Russian economy disastrously under invested and undervthe control of brutal mafia cliques. This then followed by the deaths of half a million men at a time when Russian demographics were already close to collapse.
    Putin has launched a serious of wars against peaceful neighbours- Georgia in 2008 and Ukraine since 2014. He has also used bribery, blackmail, propaganda and cyber war directly against the West. He has openly paid money to disruptive parties, such as the RN in France and the AfD. In the UK Farage and Salmond were both employed by Russia Today. I note the strong Russian links of Aaron Banks, Dominic Cummings and Jacob Rees Mogg amongst others.

    Putin is the enemy of freedom and democracy. His supporters likewise.
    I note you do not mention any of the Tories in Putin's pockets , Johnson's giving out baubles , tennis matches for huge sums and many others, you need to curb that bias.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,362
    malcolmg said:

    you obviously did not read it, just applied your well documented bias that women have penises
    I did read it. And I suggest you read my comments on this; it is far more complex than stupid comments like 'women have penises'.

    The complexity is why this is such a difficult issue. The stupid thing is to assume that sex is utterly binary. It isn't, either physically or mentally.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,665

    NEW THREAD

  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,255

    It does sound terrible, because it is. It's the American strategy to try to bleed a geopolitical rival dry over the long term, and Ukraine is sacrifice. I don't subscribe to that strategy for many reasons, both moral and practical.
    Because you either don't believe or don't understand the threat Putin poses. That is why you are wrong. Everything else stems from that.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,241

    Maybe they've realised that everytime they say something they go down a point in the polls?
    The contrast with the rather centralised dictatorial Labour machine is quite stunning.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jun/21/labour-candidates-penalised-for-not-campaigning-enough-in-battleground-seats

    It could be very complacent of Labour to take its own safe seats for granted, and leave them vulnerable to a hodgepodge of other parties. Or it could turn into an extinction event with no Tory seat untargetred.

    It certainly shows that Starmer can be bold.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,354

    Sunak has no battle to fight after the election. He's gone.

    If he wants to leave a positive legacy for the Conservative Party, he will do it now - by standing up to the Reform-appeaser wing. And by going full Tonto on Farage.
    Though that's been true for pretty much his entire premiership. He could have spent eighteen months acting out the "I've only got a few months to live so you can't kill me" hero trope. He couldn't have ended up more unpopular than he has.

    But he hasn't. When you look at where he has expended the little time and political capital he had- Rwanda, maths, cigarettes, anything else?- it's pitiful.

    But responding to last night's interview isn't difficult. Childish glove puppet of Farage. Putin's hand right up its jacksie. No need for words. No party logo. Just make sure it gets onto social media.
  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,865

    Quite wrong, Farage is one of those Morgan things with leather straps on the bonnet. Hand crafted in Britain the way they used to be. String back gloves. Twatty cap. Barbour.
    Too classy for him.

    Nigel is obviously a Frog Eyed Sprite
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,362

    ...and Boris Johnson attended Lebedev parties whilst Foreign Secretary sans his security detail.

    How so little has been made of that breach by the authorities and the media is beyond me. Boris will be Boris.
    ISTR OGH attended a party at the Russian embassy a few years back. Does that mean that OGH, and by extension this site, is a Russian mouthpiece?

    And I'm also amused by the way Mandelson is not mentioned whenever Russia and British politicians are mentioned...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,309

    I did read it. And I suggest you read my comments on this; it is far more complex than stupid comments like 'women have penises'.

    The complexity is why this is such a difficult issue. The stupid thing is to assume that sex is utterly binary. It isn't, either physically or mentally.
    99.99% of the time it is, though.
  • Dom Cummings the lockdown Artful Dodger. Why does he not team up with Nige? Good combination. Boris can be leader of the new Rebels party.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,815
    algarkirk said:

    Sorry if this has been discussed before, but Farage on Ukraine etc raises more than one question.

    Let's assume Farage acts and speaks for reasons. And accept this: although he utters some criticisms of Russia/Putin/Trump etc, he notably never does so in an unqualified way, and always utters some amelioration of the criticism. Hence yesterday on Ukraine etc

    In election time there can only be two reasons for this. It could be this is because his supporters base are with him on all this and it is all said to get votes.

    The only other possibility is that he is under obligations within a network of international relationships to maintain a particular line - just like Labour can't full frontally attack unions, or the Tories can't go heavy on wealthy oligarchs.

    Is this about right?

    I don't understand your second point.
    But there is also the possibility he is trying to steer a line between what he believes and what hia supporters want him to believe (cf Corbyn on EU membership). This is what I think most likely, and is reason #1 I will not be voting Reform.
    There is also the possibility his views on Putin have changed over time. Ifind it quite conceivable he vaguely saw Putin as an antiwoke hero, right up until the invasion of Ukraine, and he is now going through the mental gymnastics of convincing himself and others that he was more ambivalent than he appeared. He wouldn't be the first person to do this on this or any other subject.
  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,865

    Putin was born in 1952. He was 37 when Communism collapsed by which time he was an officer in the KGB. So he grew up and was committed to Communism

    And as you rightly point out the only difference between communism and Nazism is one was international socialism and the other was national socialism. Pretend socialists hiding authoritarian regimes.
    He grew up serving the regime, but more than that serving Russia. He is a nationalist imperialist.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 44,094

    99.99% of the time it is, though.
    @JosiasJessop As I said you are one of these headcases who deny biology and try to promote that there are anything other than TWO sexes.Being Mental does not trump biology.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,400
    malcolmg said:

    I note you do not mention any of the Tories in Putin's pockets , Johnson's giving out baubles , tennis matches for huge sums and many others, you need to curb that bias.
    Not enough space... and I'm hardly biased in favour of the Tories am I, Malc?
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 19,161
    Foxy said:

    It's the penultimate election weekend and a really strange atmosphere politically.

    The Tories seem to have given up and thrown in the towel. It's just weird.

    We've discussed on here how the difference between 50 or a 100 seats could be vital for the Tories. A lot more consequential than the difference between 150 and 200.

    If things are as bad as the polls suggest then these are the most important two weeks in the history of the Conservative party.

    There's a football chant that's appropriate, I think. "You only sing when you're winning."
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,362

    99.99% of the time it is, though.
    Exact figures are hard to come by and vary wildly, especially according to definition, but I think you're an order of magnitude or two out on that.

    Intersex alone is much more common, again depending on definition:
    " Approximately 1.7% of the global population is intersex, and up to 1.1 million people in the UK alone. Being intersex is as common as being a twin."
    https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/magazine/features/rights-of-intersex-children

    And I think the following is a good basic review:
    https://ihra.org.au/16601/intersex-numbers/

    I know intersex and trans are not the same; but the above certainly shows that *physical* sex is far from binary.
  • 150 seats Tories. I do not buy the rest of the numbers. We will wait and see.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 43,334
    Cookie said:

    I suspect, given JKR's background, much of her leftiness was informed by feminism. If she finds the party has moved away from feminism, it's no surprise she no longer feels she can support it.
    As @viewcode has succinctly recorded, Labour in the days of Blair was pushing a trans sympathetic line that would now turn Rowling (and others) into monomaniacal bores on the subject.

    The ‘I haven’t left X, X has left me’ has become a cliché. Sometimes it’s accurate, other times it’s a sign of a huge ego that doesn’t recognise its own radicalisation.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 43,334

    Too classy for him.

    Nigel is obviously a Frog Eyed Sprite
    Triumph Stag for Nige.
    Which coincidentally is a car owned by a noisy right winger in Holyrood.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,354

    99.99% of the time it is, though.
    Yup. We might quibble about how many nines, but in broad terms, yup.

    But even 0.01% is thousands of people who currently have a pretty awful life. And that insight ought to feature in our collective thinking of how to balance the rights of cispeople and transpeople. And too often, right now it doesn't.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,241

    99.99% of the time it is, though.
    More common than that, at least according to the Cass report.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 19,161
    edited June 2024
    algarkirk said:

    Sorry if this has been discussed before, but Farage on Ukraine etc raises more than one question.

    Let's assume Farage acts and speaks for reasons. And accept this: although he utters some criticisms of Russia/Putin/Trump etc, he notably never does so in an unqualified way, and always utters some amelioration of the criticism. Hence yesterday on Ukraine etc

    In election time there can only be two reasons for this. It could be this is because his supporters base are with him on all this and it is all said to get votes.

    The only other possibility is that he is under obligations within a network of international relationships to maintain a particular line - just like Labour can't full frontally attack unions, or the Tories can't go heavy on wealthy oligarchs.

    Is this about right?

    It could be, or it could be a simpler psychological failing.

    PB was discussing Chomsky recently, at the time of his phantom death. He opposed the US war in Vietnam, which you can see as a principled opposition to an imperialist war. But then he began to see US imperialism in everything, and felt that, in order to oppose the US, he had to support the opponents of the US.

    Farage could be on a similar journey. He's come to prominence by opposing the British establishment on EU membership. But now he's extending that top opposed the British establishment on everything. So if the establishment supports Ukraine, he must not. If the establishment wants to avoid a debt crisis, he does not.

    He's lost his independent judgement and replaced it with a reflex to oppose everything that the British establishment does. And that brings him to a place of echoing the propaganda of the Russian dictator.
  • MuesliMuesli Posts: 202
    This thread has provoked Putin and been annexed.
  • Ah yes The Stag for Nige. With a modified exhaust. Hear him coming!
  • The Sprite. Good car for Starmer.
  • The thing is We may believe Farage has connections with Putin, Trump etc. Not anymore. I doubt that. He would love to be their mates. Is he still in Trumps good books?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,814

    Probably not then.
    You're welcome to have deep and meaningful chats to these posters whilst Leon is having a whale of a time, dropping massive hints that they are his creations, and having a huge laugh at your expense if you wish.
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,625
    UNITE workers at TATA steel,to,go out on an indefinite strike over the closure of part of the Port Talbot site

    I’m sure this is a wise move and will simply bring the company to heel.

    https://news.sky.com/story/port-talbot-steelworkers-to-hold-all-out-indefinite-strike-13156646
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,625

    You're welcome to have deep and meaningful chats to these posters whilst Leon is having a whale of a time, dropping massive hints that they are his creations, and having a huge laugh at your expense if you wish.
    Wait, what, is Tampon ad man actually Leon ?
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,362
    malcolmg said:

    @JosiasJessop As I said you are one of these headcases who deny biology and try to promote that there are anything other than TWO sexes.Being Mental does not trump biology.
    Coming back to this late: but how do intersex people fit into your worldview?
This discussion has been closed.