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Who knew the London elite were so numerous? – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,703
edited April 23 in General
imageWho knew the London elite were so numerous? – politicalbetting.com

Liz Truss has said she has "unfinished business" in politics, but 68% of Britons say they would not like it if she returned to frontline politics – only 9% would be pleased to see her returnhttps://t.co/46bk1DLjgr pic.twitter.com/1SKnm3drne

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  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    edited April 23
    First to acknowledge being part of the deep state conspiracy, from deep in provincial England.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,774
    edited April 23
    First [EDIT SECOND] like Liz Truss among verified purchasers
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489
    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,177
    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,774
    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    In an electoral wipeout South West Norfolk might well be one of the last surviving seats. So natural selection might play a role.
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    TimSTimS Posts: 9,774
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    Bloody freezing weather for it.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,787
    For those too young to miss Mrs Slocombe's pussy (started 1972):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-i523Gie9Q
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,424

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    A lot of gravitational potential energy added to any drink you've carried up with you.
  • Options
    WaterfallWaterfall Posts: 96
    Foxy said:

    First to acknowledge being part of the deep state conspiracy, from deep in provincial England.

    Yes you are a dangerous subversive who has infiltrated the medical profession. You can trust anyone these days.
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,058
    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    Very likely, since they’ve already taken one while in Government!
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    HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,405
    "Only somebody with a fetish for sadomasochistic pain, punishment, and humiliation would want to see Liz Truss back as Tory leader/PM”

    A significant number of tory MPs then? ;)
  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,505

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
  • Options
    HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,405

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Gorgeous
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    So, a Rwanda full in one day. Where are they going to send tomorrow's boats?
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,539
    A dangerous market if the next contest takes place after the election. You would need to predict which Conservative MPs remain for the first rounds.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,445
    Foxy said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    So, a Rwanda full in one day. Where are they going to send tomorrow's boats?
    Burundi? :lol:
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,977
    Cookie said:

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
    Up a hill. Obviously. :)
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    Very likely, since they’ve already taken one while in Government!
    True. At this point it's not so much individual loony turns, more of a spiral.
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Is that Jess for scale?
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,990
    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,369
    edited April 23
    FPT
    nico679 said:

    kinabalu said:

    https://twitter.com/RishiSunak/status/1782650713677385963

    "Start the flights. Stop the boats"

    Oh dear.

    I hope it’s a very calm warm summer and the boats flood in . Fxck Sunak !
    It was calm today and lives were lost

    The Sky reporter was on a vessel this morning and said there were 22 merchant ships visible in the narrow straits of the channel and anyone who knows anything about shipping knows the bow waves are extremely dangerous for small boats, and it is not something anyone should be encouraging if we want to safeguard those put at risk by the people smugglers

    I would just add our son said that on his recent course at RNLI Poole parallel sailing was very much part of their exercises which of course is when a boat runs parallel to the waves and is very dangerous even for lifeboats, let alone flimsy rubber dinghies
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,549
    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
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    BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 5,283
    Cookie said:

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
    About twenty miles east of Sarria in Galicia, near a village called Viduedo

    I'm near the top
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
    That isn't the rules. There is no obligation to apply in France.
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    I don't consider Sunak competent.

    (I also wouldn't consider Hunt a good leader, although he might have been among the better choices in a bad field)
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    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,313
    Foxy said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    So, a Rwanda full in one day. Where are they going to send tomorrow's boats?
    From the news on BBC this morning - a boat launched, was turned around by the French, came back to shore, picked up more and then launched again (no French vessel in sight). Clearly if we want to stop desperate people risking their lives crossing the channel we need to beef up the patrols (pay the French more?) but also provide a realistic route that people can claim asylum into the UK from places that these people are from. I don't think Northern France is the right place - we need to have arrangements much closer to the countries people are fleeing.

    But ultimately, the real issue is that in the UK we are extremely lucky. Most of us live a life far beyond what most of the planet can ever hope to. The way to end the migrant issue is to raise the standard of living everywhere else. Much of Africa is stunning, yet also can be desperately poor. The disparity between the life of Turbotubbs in SW Wiltshire and someone from many African states is what is driving the issue.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,549
    I still haven't seen the Liz Truss "unfinished business" quote in context because I haven't watched the Iain Dale interview in full. Till I have, I will continue to think the only ones actually ramping a Liz Truss comeback are her mocking detractors themselves, trying desperately to deflect some of the blame for the Sunak shitshow by intimating that Truss coming back as PM is a feared prospect.
  • Options
    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,313
    Foxy said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
    That isn't the rules. There is no obligation to apply in France.
    Although I suspect many people think there OUGHT to be such an obligation.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    Waterfall said:

    Foxy said:

    First to acknowledge being part of the deep state conspiracy, from deep in provincial England.

    Yes you are a dangerous subversive who has infiltrated the medical profession. You can trust anyone these days.
    It's a fair cop.

    I am the Che Guevara of the East Midlands, only with less hair.
  • Options
    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,313

    Cookie said:

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
    About twenty miles east of Sarria in Galicia, near a village called Viduedo

    I'm near the top
    When I saw the photo I assumed Lake District (UK).
  • Options
    sarissasarissa Posts: 1,800

    Foxy said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    So, a Rwanda full in one day. Where are they going to send tomorrow's boats?
    Burundi? :lol:
    Would we have to buy hats in exchange?
    https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/1d933ff9-e704-4c39-a39e-28f26c7c5ec5
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489
    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
    And that Rwanda is not.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,424

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    It depends what the question is.

    If the question is: "Which political double-act will kickstart a British Renaissance?" then I'd agree that Sunak/Hunt are a hard sell.

    But the question was: "Which political double-act will steady the ship so that Britain can make it to a general election without its economy and public finances collapsing into a heap?" and on that score Sunak/Hunt are nine months away from completing their 27-month tour of duty with a tolerable degree of success.
  • Options
    Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 7,584
    edited April 23
    Huge misjudgment by Sunak. The lure of a free flight to beautiful Rwanda, being put up in a luxurious hotel in Kigali (plus maybe a bit of a financial bribe), is clearly going to lead to a huge increase in the number of people seeking to arrive in small boats, or even swimming across the Channel.
  • Options
    turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 15,313
    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
    I suspect almost all of those crossing the channel are a both economic migrants. And why wouldn't you try to make a better life you yourself? It reminds me a bit of Jacob Ress-Mogg sneering about those who stayed put at Grenfell, and asserting that they would have not done so. How many of us on PB would strive to improve our situation if we started life in South Sudan or Eritrea?
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,539
    Rishi has pledged that his government the next Labour government will increase defence spending to 2.5 per cent of GDP.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/23/britain-boost-defence-spending-2030-rishi-sunak/
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    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,085
    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    If I was cynical I would say the reason why he has used the judge’s first name (which I don’t think is traditional) is to highlight his Hispanic roots. Why his lumpen, knuckle-dragging, drooling followers would regard that as significant I don’t know.
  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,505
    edited April 23

    Cookie said:

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
    About twenty miles east of Sarria in Galicia, near a village called Viduedo

    I'm near the top
    When I saw the photo I assumed Lake District (UK).
    I thought it was England too! I guessed Herefordshire. Though on reflection cows too high up for it to be UK.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,369

    Huge misjudgment by Sunak. The lure of a free flight to beautiful Rwanda (plus maybe a bit of a financial bribe) is clearly going to lead to a huge increase in the number of people seeking to arrive in small boats or even swimming across the Channel.

    Sky reported from a refugee centre in Derby and every refugee there said that had they thought they were going to be sent to Rwanda they would not have come to the UK
  • Options
    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,176
    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    He fought the law. But did the law win?

  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,333

    A dangerous market if the next contest takes place after the election. You would need to predict which Conservative MPs remain for the first rounds.

    Yes, she was about 100/1 last I checked. I'd rather back that than lay it.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,067
    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
    Exactly , not a migrant among them I bet, here to tread the golden streets.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,515
    At least none of you guys has to climb the world’s SIXTEENTH HIGHEST LIGHTHOUSE



    Things I do for my job
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    He doesn't quite understand this prosecution/defending thing that courts do, does he?
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,549
    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    I don't consider Sunak competent.

    (I also wouldn't consider Hunt a good leader, although he might have been among the better choices in a bad field)
    That's because he isn't competent. Nor was Cameron, though obviously he was better than Sunak. You don't have to actually be competent to attract the ardour of the dull competence lovers, you have to be a statist, managerialist, technocrat, fond of 'modernising the party', with a blue rosette and a plummy accent but the sandal-wearing soul of a Lib-Dem. They are the types of people 'one needs to win elections' according to your theory, except of course when they don't.
  • Options
    Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 7,584
    Leon said:

    At least none of you guys has to climb the world’s SIXTEENTH HIGHEST LIGHTHOUSE



    Things I do for my job

    That's a very impressive bit of flint knapping.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,369

    Rishi has pledged that his government the next Labour government will increase defence spending to 2.5 per cent of GDP.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/23/britain-boost-defence-spending-2030-rishi-sunak/

    He made the announcement in Warsaw today and clearly it is a huge commitment

    Starmer will have little choice but to match it and apparently it is 75 billion over 6 years - a huge sum
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,067

    Foxy said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    So, a Rwanda full in one day. Where are they going to send tomorrow's boats?
    From the news on BBC this morning - a boat launched, was turned around by the French, came back to shore, picked up more and then launched again (no French vessel in sight). Clearly if we want to stop desperate people risking their lives crossing the channel we need to beef up the patrols (pay the French more?) but also provide a realistic route that people can claim asylum into the UK from places that these people are from. I don't think Northern France is the right place - we need to have arrangements much closer to the countries people are fleeing.

    But ultimately, the real issue is that in the UK we are extremely lucky. Most of us live a life far beyond what most of the planet can ever hope to. The way to end the migrant issue is to raise the standard of living everywhere else. Much of Africa is stunning, yet also can be desperately poor. The disparity between the life of Turbotubbs in SW Wiltshire and someone from many African states is what is driving the issue.
    Oodles of cash has been sent to Africa as long as I can remember and it makes little difference, the corruption is unbridled and they seem to like shooting , raping and pillaging far too much.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,333

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    Have you spotted some dull competence then?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,515
    Bloody hell


  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,177
    Paging Rishi

    @keithboykin
    Dozens of migrants that Florida Governor Ron DeSantis tricked into flying from Texas to Martha's Vineyard in Massachusetts for a $615,000 taxpayer-funded political stunt have now been granted visas as human trafficking victims of Ron DeSantis's actions.
  • Options
    Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 7,584

    Huge misjudgment by Sunak. The lure of a free flight to beautiful Rwanda (plus maybe a bit of a financial bribe) is clearly going to lead to a huge increase in the number of people seeking to arrive in small boats or even swimming across the Channel.

    Sky reported from a refugee centre in Derby and every refugee there said that had they thought they were going to be sent to Rwanda they would not have come to the UK
    Oh Big G, I need a satire button on here.
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 25,020
    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    The scary bit is that I think she is actually one of the better choices for LoTo....
  • Options
    WaterfallWaterfall Posts: 96

    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    I don't consider Sunak competent.

    (I also wouldn't consider Hunt a good leader, although he might have been among the better choices in a bad field)
    That's because he isn't competent. Nor was Cameron, though obviously he was better than Sunak. You don't have to actually be competent to attract the ardour of the dull competence lovers, you have to be a statist, managerialist, technocrat, fond of 'modernising the party', with a blue rosette and a plummy accent but the sandal-wearing soul of a Lib-Dem. They are the types of people 'one needs to win elections' according to your theory, except of course when they don't.
    James o Brien was pretty scathing of Cameron in his recent book. Lets face it if Cameron hadnt gone to Eton he would likely be working in a provincial estate agents office.
  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,615
    Foxy said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    So, a Rwanda full in one day. Where are they going to send tomorrow's boats?
    Now the act is passed there is a sort of prisoner dilemma going on. Assuming that in reality some asylum seekers going to Rwanda would not in fact stem the flow then the last thing on earth the government want is to be able to put it into practice. Hence the 'it will all take weeks/months and you can't judge success until flights start' line of today from the government.

    From an utterly cynical viewpoint, it would help Labour if the flights occurred soon, and everyone knew that it didn't work because of small numbers, and didn't stop the boats. In this light it would be sane, if immoral, for the lawyers and opposing parties to just say 'get on with it' and not litigate. Call the government bluff. I think it would speed up an election.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,261
    Leon said:

    Bloody hell


    Shouldn’t have dodged leg day.
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    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489

    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    I don't consider Sunak competent.

    (I also wouldn't consider Hunt a good leader, although he might have been among the better choices in a bad field)
    That's because he isn't competent. Nor was Cameron, though obviously he was better than Sunak. You don't have to actually be competent to attract the ardour of the dull competence lovers, you have to be a statist, managerialist, technocrat, fond of 'modernising the party', with a blue rosette and a plummy accent but the sandal-wearing soul of a Lib-Dem. They are the types of people 'one needs to win elections' according to your theory, except of course when they don't.
    I think you mistake me for someone else. I've never been a Sunak supporter. I'm not sure I can be bothered to find the post, but after Boris's autodefenestration I posted something like: 'Sunak will be shit in a dull, boring, slow kind of way, Truss will be shit in interesting, fast ways'. Neither had any good ideas. Sunak has no ideas. Truss had shit ideas. Take your pick.

    I also thought Cameron was something of an empty suit - did I vote for chaos with Ed Miliband? Hell yeah!
  • Options
    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,956

    Rishi has pledged that his government the next Labour government will increase defence spending to 2.5 per cent of GDP.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/23/britain-boost-defence-spending-2030-rishi-sunak/

    He made the announcement in Warsaw today and clearly it is a huge commitment

    Starmer will have little choice but to match it and apparently it is 75 billion over 6 years - a huge sum
    If I were Starmer's advisor, I'd say he needs to top it.

    And he probably will.

    I'd say a good 10-15% of Tory members, the type who are apoplectic at the current government's hosing of the NHS with cash whilst letting the armed forces wither on the vine, will be tempted to vote Labour if so.

    Is 'Lab gain Christchurch' the new 'Con gain Bootle'?
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,369

    Huge misjudgment by Sunak. The lure of a free flight to beautiful Rwanda (plus maybe a bit of a financial bribe) is clearly going to lead to a huge increase in the number of people seeking to arrive in small boats or even swimming across the Channel.

    Sky reported from a refugee centre in Derby and every refugee there said that had they thought they were going to be sent to Rwanda they would not have come to the UK
    Oh Big G, I need a satire button on here.
    Or maybe listen to the report

    https://news.sky.com/story/asylum-seekers-warn-others-against-seeking-refuge-in-the-uk-as-some-face-prospect-of-deportation-to-rwanda-13117315
  • Options
    WaterfallWaterfall Posts: 96

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    Sorting out our housing crisis will require a lot more than dull competence.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,369
    Mortimer said:

    Rishi has pledged that his government the next Labour government will increase defence spending to 2.5 per cent of GDP.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/23/britain-boost-defence-spending-2030-rishi-sunak/

    He made the announcement in Warsaw today and clearly it is a huge commitment

    Starmer will have little choice but to match it and apparently it is 75 billion over 6 years - a huge sum
    If I were Starmer's advisor, I'd say he needs to top it.

    And he probably will.

    I'd say a good 10-15% of Tory members, the type who are apoplectic at the current government's hosing of the NHS with cash whilst letting the armed forces wither on the vine, will be tempted to vote Labour if so.

    Is 'Lab gain Christchurch' the new 'Con gain Bootle'?
    I doubt he can top 75 billion
  • Options
    BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 5,283
    Leon said:

    Bloody hell


    Come on Leon, I want to see the view from up there!
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,387
    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    He doesn't quite understand this prosecution/defending thing that courts do, does he?
    No, I think the idea that he should be held to account for anything that he has ever done is really quite novel to him. It's simply not the way his entire life has been.
  • Options
    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,956

    Mortimer said:

    Rishi has pledged that his government the next Labour government will increase defence spending to 2.5 per cent of GDP.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/23/britain-boost-defence-spending-2030-rishi-sunak/

    He made the announcement in Warsaw today and clearly it is a huge commitment

    Starmer will have little choice but to match it and apparently it is 75 billion over 6 years - a huge sum
    If I were Starmer's advisor, I'd say he needs to top it.

    And he probably will.

    I'd say a good 10-15% of Tory members, the type who are apoplectic at the current government's hosing of the NHS with cash whilst letting the armed forces wither on the vine, will be tempted to vote Labour if so.

    Is 'Lab gain Christchurch' the new 'Con gain Bootle'?
    I doubt he can top 75 billion
    Really?

    I suspect he'll call it investment and the Whitehall brigade will lap it up.

    To be honest the quicker we progress towards IMF bailout the quicker we can start making tough choices again.

    Far too many people are featherbedded by the state. Many of them are already far too comfortable. And many of the rest of us are paying for it in eyewatering tax bills.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,387

    Leon said:

    Bloody hell


    Shouldn’t have dodged leg day.
    Hope you've got your fitbit on.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,549
    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    I don't consider Sunak competent.

    (I also wouldn't consider Hunt a good leader, although he might have been among the better choices in a bad field)
    That's because he isn't competent. Nor was Cameron, though obviously he was better than Sunak. You don't have to actually be competent to attract the ardour of the dull competence lovers, you have to be a statist, managerialist, technocrat, fond of 'modernising the party', with a blue rosette and a plummy accent but the sandal-wearing soul of a Lib-Dem. They are the types of people 'one needs to win elections' according to your theory, except of course when they don't.
    I think you mistake me for someone else. I've never been a Sunak supporter. I'm not sure I can be bothered to find the post, but after Boris's autodefenestration I posted something like: 'Sunak will be shit in a dull, boring, slow kind of way, Truss will be shit in interesting, fast ways'. Neither had any good ideas. Sunak has no ideas. Truss had shit ideas. Take your pick.

    I also thought Cameron was something of an empty suit - did I vote for chaos with Ed Miliband? Hell yeah!
    My argument is a general one; I wasn't specifically having a moan at you. You did outline the general theory of the Tory Party 'going a bit mad' in opposition before embracing a moderate to get back into power, which is one I don't subscribe to.


  • Options
    LennonLennon Posts: 1,736
    edited April 23
    Leon said:

    At least none of you guys has to climb the world’s SIXTEENTH HIGHEST LIGHTHOUSE

    (Remove pic from quote)

    Things I do for my job

    Pah... According to wiki it's a whole 4 steps fewer than the Monument... and my kids have done that. ;)
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,549
    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    Have you spotted some dull competence then?
    They are competent at being dull.
  • Options
    CatManCatMan Posts: 2,809

    Cookie said:

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
    About twenty miles east of Sarria in Galicia, near a village called Viduedo

    I'm near the top
    When I saw the photo I assumed Lake District (UK).
    Reminds me of where I live in very exotic South Wales
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,990
    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects

    If Labour wins the next election, do you think you will be better or worse off than otherwise?

    Better: 27%
    Worse: 32%
    The same: 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1782786827537064263
  • Options
    CatManCatMan Posts: 2,809
    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    He wants to go to jail. His numbers would go up, more fundraising, more attention, more him.
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489

    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    She could be amusing as LoTo, as long as she was nowhere near the levers of power.

    The Cons look like they might take a loony turn in opposition - better that they do it with someone in no danger of getting them elected, learn the hard lessons (maybe, this time) and then choose someone competent.

    That would be a great theory, if the advent of Sunak and Hunt hadn't put the myth of managerial 'dull competence' being the answer to anything to bed for good.
    I don't consider Sunak competent.

    (I also wouldn't consider Hunt a good leader, although he might have been among the better choices in a bad field)
    That's because he isn't competent. Nor was Cameron, though obviously he was better than Sunak. You don't have to actually be competent to attract the ardour of the dull competence lovers, you have to be a statist, managerialist, technocrat, fond of 'modernising the party', with a blue rosette and a plummy accent but the sandal-wearing soul of a Lib-Dem. They are the types of people 'one needs to win elections' according to your theory, except of course when they don't.
    I think you mistake me for someone else. I've never been a Sunak supporter. I'm not sure I can be bothered to find the post, but after Boris's autodefenestration I posted something like: 'Sunak will be shit in a dull, boring, slow kind of way, Truss will be shit in interesting, fast ways'. Neither had any good ideas. Sunak has no ideas. Truss had shit ideas. Take your pick.

    I also thought Cameron was something of an empty suit - did I vote for chaos with Ed Miliband? Hell yeah!
    My argument is a general one; I wasn't specifically having a moan at you. You did outline the general theory of the Tory Party 'going a bit mad' in opposition before embracing a moderate to get back into power, which is one I don't subscribe to.


    No, I said 'competent' not 'moderate'. I don't equate the two. I'm quite happy with someone radical and competent. I might not vote for them, depending on the policies, but wouldn't it be great if we had a choice between two radical and competent leaders/parties?
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    I think you misunderstand: Trump wants to be jailed for contempt of court. What better way to motivate his base, than to pretend that one is being jailed for exercising ones constitutional right to free speech.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,774
    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects

    If Labour wins the next election, do you think you will be better or worse off than otherwise?

    Better: 27%
    Worse: 32%
    The same: 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1782786827537064263

    Interesting. I suppose if Labour can win the election with those sorts of low expectations then they are less likely to disappoint.

    I would have expected the majority to answer "the same".
  • Options
    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,956
    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects

    If Labour wins the next election, do you think you will be better or worse off than otherwise?

    Better: 27%
    Worse: 32%
    The same: 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1782786827537064263

    That is the first interesting poll result I have seen for about a year
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects

    If Labour wins the next election, do you think you will be better or worse off than otherwise?

    Better: 27%
    Worse: 32%
    The same: 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1782786827537064263

    What are the figures for the same question if the Tories win?
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,387
    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    I think you misunderstand: Trump wants to be jailed for contempt of court. What better way to motivate his base, than to pretend that one is being jailed for exercising ones constitutional right to free speech.
    Hmm...I am not sure that Trump and prison are a match made in heaven. He may fancy the idea of being threatened with it but the reality? I think not.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,549
    ...
    Mortimer said:

    Mortimer said:

    Rishi has pledged that his government the next Labour government will increase defence spending to 2.5 per cent of GDP.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/23/britain-boost-defence-spending-2030-rishi-sunak/

    He made the announcement in Warsaw today and clearly it is a huge commitment

    Starmer will have little choice but to match it and apparently it is 75 billion over 6 years - a huge sum
    If I were Starmer's advisor, I'd say he needs to top it.

    And he probably will.

    I'd say a good 10-15% of Tory members, the type who are apoplectic at the current government's hosing of the NHS with cash whilst letting the armed forces wither on the vine, will be tempted to vote Labour if so.

    Is 'Lab gain Christchurch' the new 'Con gain Bootle'?
    I doubt he can top 75 billion
    Really?

    I suspect he'll call it investment and the Whitehall brigade will lap it up.

    To be honest the quicker we progress towards IMF bailout the quicker we can start making tough choices again.

    Far too many people are featherbedded by the state. Many of them are already far too comfortable. And many of the rest of us are paying for it in eyewatering tax bills.
    There are few better ways of making £75 billion disappear than giving it to the MOD. I grant you it's not as effective as giving it to the BOE, but it's the next best thing.

    If Rishi had said 'We are going to have "x" number of frigates, destroyers, amphibious capability, missile defence, transport capability etc., I would have a little more confidence. The fact that all he can suggest is piss money at it is deeply depressing.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,515

    Leon said:

    Bloody hell


    Come on Leon, I want to see the view from up there!
    D’accord


  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    DavidL said:

    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    The wisdom of Trump today:

    "HIGHLY CONFLICTED, TO PUT IT MILDLY, JUDGE JUAN MERCHAM HAS TAKEN AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH. EVERYBODY IS ALLOWED TO TALK AND LIE ABOUT ME, BUT I AM NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND MYSELF THIS IS A KANGAROO COURT, AND THE JUDGE SHOULD RECUSE HIMSELF."

    Top tip from me, if a Judge is ever considering whether you are in breach of a court order and has the power to jail you for up to 30 days, don't do this.

    He doesn't quite understand this prosecution/defending thing that courts do, does he?
    No, I think the idea that he should be held to account for anything that he has ever done is really quite novel to him. It's simply not the way his entire life has been.
    Considering the number of legal cases that he has had in his life, I would have thought he would have some idea of the system by now.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,515
    The whole thing is superbly steampunk


  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,787
    Am being told tonight that Police Scotland and the Crown Office are at war over whether to charge [a person] over a crime. Readers can guess who's on which side.

    https://x.com/WingsScotland/status/1782505694312218913
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,445
    Scott_xP said:

    @ProjectLincoln

    10/10 chyron. No notes.


    Dis TSE write that headline? :lol:
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489
    Foxy said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects

    If Labour wins the next election, do you think you will be better or worse off than otherwise?

    Better: 27%
    Worse: 32%
    The same: 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1782786827537064263

    What are the figures for the same question if the Tories win?
    Unless we have a lot of LD true-believers they should be more or less the reverse! But I suspect they wouldn't be - people answering whether they expect to be better or worse off after the election, rather than compared to the Tories winning the election.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    malcolmg said:

    Foxy said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    So, a Rwanda full in one day. Where are they going to send tomorrow's boats?
    From the news on BBC this morning - a boat launched, was turned around by the French, came back to shore, picked up more and then launched again (no French vessel in sight). Clearly if we want to stop desperate people risking their lives crossing the channel we need to beef up the patrols (pay the French more?) but also provide a realistic route that people can claim asylum into the UK from places that these people are from. I don't think Northern France is the right place - we need to have arrangements much closer to the countries people are fleeing.

    But ultimately, the real issue is that in the UK we are extremely lucky. Most of us live a life far beyond what most of the planet can ever hope to. The way to end the migrant issue is to raise the standard of living everywhere else. Much of Africa is stunning, yet also can be desperately poor. The disparity between the life of Turbotubbs in SW Wiltshire and someone from many African states is what is driving the issue.
    Oodles of cash has been sent to Africa as long as I can remember and it makes little difference, the corruption is unbridled and they seem to like shooting , raping and pillaging far too much.
    There's a wonderful book on economic growth in third world countries, that starts with the awesome line: there's only one thing worse than aid to the people of developing economies, and that's the discovery of oil.

    But that doesn't mean there isn't stuff you can do that can make a real difference, such as free trade and support of democratic systems and the rule of law.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,774
    CatMan said:

    Cookie said:

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
    About twenty miles east of Sarria in Galicia, near a village called Viduedo

    I'm near the top
    When I saw the photo I assumed Lake District (UK).
    Reminds me of where I live in very exotic South Wales
    There's a look isn't there: mild, wet Western coastal hills. Rich green hillsides of grass and bracken, purple-hazed moors, thick hedgerows, well fed cattle. Similar sights to be had in Wicklow or Kerry and parts of Devon too. Makes me quite fancy visiting Northern Galicia. I've only seen Rias Baixas which is a bit drier and more Southerly looking.
  • Options
    MortimerMortimer Posts: 13,956
    On topic, i've just been looking at who is left after a bad Tory GE performance (c.120 seats).

    Wonder if John Redwood might be the fiscal hawk that we'd need after a Labour government reverting to its old tricks.....
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,796
    CatMan said:

    Cookie said:

    Walking up a mountain isn't all hard work..


    Where's that, Blanche?
    About twenty miles east of Sarria in Galicia, near a village called Viduedo

    I'm near the top
    When I saw the photo I assumed Lake District (UK).
    Reminds me of where I live in very exotic South Wales
    The north of Spain has the most amazing rolling green scenery - it's a complete contrast to the other 90%.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,823
    Selebian said:

    Foxy said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects

    If Labour wins the next election, do you think you will be better or worse off than otherwise?

    Better: 27%
    Worse: 32%
    The same: 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1782786827537064263

    What are the figures for the same question if the Tories win?
    Unless we have a lot of LD true-believers they should be more or less the reverse! But I suspect they wouldn't be - people answering whether they expect to be better or worse off after the election, rather than compared to the Tories winning the election.
    Not necessarily, many people might anticipate being worse off whoever wins. They are likely to be correct.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,582
    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
    According to various human rights organisations conditions for the refugees, in France, are intolerable.

    This means that France is a failed state. And they have oil.

    We all know what we do with failed states, with oil, don't we, children?
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,539
    Sir Peter Hordern, backbencher under Heath and Thatcher who brought City wisdom to the House – obituary
    Firmly on the Right (but not over Europe), Hordern was an early champion of monetarism and urged the Thatcher government to be more radical
    ...
    Yet he remained an influential figure, “overlooked for simply being too clever” according to one colleague, and, for another, “the most respected backbencher never to hold office”. That respect survived a period as parliamentary adviser to the House of Fraser and Mohamed Al-Fayed during which – unlike two colleagues whose careers were destroyed – he meticulously declared payments he received.
    ...
    Hordern epitomised the informed City gent who by keeping the day job could bring keen insight to the House: never more so than when in 1965 he arrived in the Chamber to tell James Callaghan that as a result of changes the Chancellor had made to the Finance Bill, the market in gilts had come to a near-standstill for the first time since the crisis of 1931.
    ...
    After the Conservatives’ unexpected return to power in 1970, he applauded the free-market Toryism embraced by Edward Heath, Iain Macleod and Anthony Barber. Within a year he was urging the use of monetary policy to check inflation, and even before the fuel crisis and industrial chaos of late 1973 he termed Heath’s U-turn “not the most scintillating policy on which to win an election”.

    That election lost, Hordern was a focus for dissatisfaction with Heath. But the party leader Margaret Thatcher, over four years in opposition, never brought him into her team. Hordern, however, floated in The Daily Telegraph a number of ideas she later implemented.

    He urged the privatisation of nationalised industries, enunciating the doctrine before there was a word for it. His sole difference with the Tory Right on the economy was that he rejected tax allowances for private health care, reckoning them a signal that the NHS was “second-rate” and opening the door for parents to demand tax breaks for private education
    ....

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/obituaries/2024/04/23/sir-peter-hordern-fina-city-thatcher-commons-horsham/ (£££)
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,796
    Mortimer said:

    On topic, i've just been looking at who is left after a bad Tory GE performance (c.120 seats).

    Wonder if John Redwood might be the fiscal hawk that we'd need after a Labour government reverting to its old tricks.....

    Tories are in no position to lecture anyone on fiscal rectitude.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,445

    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    @christopherhope

    BREAKING 210 migrants have arrived in four small boats today in Dover, reports
    @markwhiteTV for @GBNEWS, with two more small boats on the way right now, containing as many as 100 more migrants.

    The fact remains that France is a safe country, and therefore this counts as economic migration, not asylum seeking.
    According to various human rights organisations conditions for the refugees, in France, are intolerable.

    This means that France is a failed state. And they have oil.

    We all know what we do with failed states, with oil, don't we, children?
    :innocent:
    image
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489
    Foxy said:

    Selebian said:

    Foxy said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects

    If Labour wins the next election, do you think you will be better or worse off than otherwise?

    Better: 27%
    Worse: 32%
    The same: 29%

    via @RedfieldWilton"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1782786827537064263

    What are the figures for the same question if the Tories win?
    Unless we have a lot of LD true-believers they should be more or less the reverse! But I suspect they wouldn't be - people answering whether they expect to be better or worse off after the election, rather than compared to the Tories winning the election.
    Not necessarily, many people might anticipate being worse off whoever wins. They are likely to be correct.
    The 'otherwise' means Labour don't win, which realistically* means the Tories win? If it was better or worse off than 'now' then I'd agree (and I do think that's probably how people are answering the question, but it's not how I read the question)

    *in normal times. this time, who knows - the most plausible otherwise might be a coalition, I guess
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,787
    Patrick Harvie faces a potential vote of no confidence following his comments over the landmark Cass review into gender identity services for young people.

    The Scottish Greens co-leader refused to say whether he accepted the report's conclusions when asked during an interview this week.

    Asked five times if he accepts the report, the minister refused to say, instead claiming it has been "politicised and weaponised" against trans people.


    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/patrick-harvie-faces-vote-no-32649679
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Scott_xP said:

    Paging Rishi

    @keithboykin
    Dozens of migrants that Florida Governor Ron DeSantis tricked into flying from Texas to Martha's Vineyard in Massachusetts for a $615,000 taxpayer-funded political stunt have now been granted visas as human trafficking victims of Ron DeSantis's actions.

    "Rishi"? "RISHI"? Come on Scott don't let us down now of all times.
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