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This is developing into a big problem for the Tories – politicalbetting.com

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Comments

  • Rishi should just give up.

    He's clearly got no actual policies or ideas and no substance or ideology. Just make it up as you go along.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,953

    Anyone find the idea of Liz Truss telling a private university what to do, quite chilling?

    I answered that last night, partly. If they are in receipt of any government funds, then government should have a say.
    The Government should be able to tell a private university who to give interviews to?

    I find it incredibly chilling.
    Are they private? Or do they in fact recieve money from the state?
    If we're in the position of the state telling private institutions what to do that seems not only fundamentally un-Conservative but also something undemocratic states do. Chilling.
    They are not private ffs, they recieve money from the state.
    They are private by any definition.
    Do you understand how higher education is funded?
    Quite. Universities are regulated by the state. It's not inappropriate for government to have input into what universities do.

    It is inappropriate that Truss is just randomly announcing nonsense, but that's a bigger problem. If one was wishing to give her the benefit of the doubt, there is a long-standing question around whether you determine university entrance places before or after people have done their A'levels.
  • 🚨BREAKING🚨

    Rishi Sunak has promised to slash the basic rate of income tax from 20% to **16%** if he becomes PM

    Would be done by the end of next parliament. Costs £18bn, paid by extra revenues from growth.

    Big moment in the campaign. Truss camp accuses him of a tax “u-turn”
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,384

    🚨BREAKING🚨

    Rishi Sunak has promised to slash the basic rate of income tax from 20% to **16%** if he becomes PM

    Would be done by the end of next parliament. Costs £18bn, paid by extra revenues from growth.

    Big moment in the campaign. Truss camp accuses him of a tax “u-turn”

    "Paid by from growth".
    LMAO.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,953

    Anyone find the idea of Liz Truss telling a private university what to do, quite chilling?

    I answered that last night, partly. If they are in receipt of any government funds, then government should have a say.
    The Government should be able to tell a private university who to give interviews to?

    I find it incredibly chilling.
    Are they private? Or do they in fact recieve money from the state?
    If we're in the position of the state telling private institutions what to do that seems not only fundamentally un-Conservative but also something undemocratic states do. Chilling.
    They are not private ffs, they recieve money from the state.
    They are private by any definition.
    Do you understand how higher education is funded?
    Yes - the govt hands out "loans" that will never be paid back, So, in effect, they are just printing money and trying to sell the debt to recoup costs. It is yet another financial crisis in the making.
    Unis are in receipt of other money than just student loans.
    Indeed. I'm at UCL. This is UCL's income in 2020: https://www.ucl.ac.uk/students/file/18765
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cookie said:

    Commonwealth Games is back on.
    While I'm in old fogey mode, there are far too many swimming events. Just swim as fast as you can. Butterfly, Breast Stroke and Backstroke: superfluous. Medleys of these: taking the piss. Mixed medley: just stop it now.

    Just to reassure you I'm not totally negative about everything, perfectly happy to enjoy rugby sevens, netball or beach volleyball, which seem the other options right now.

    Bang on. There are no running events for running in a different style. A to B, fast as you can.
    I’d also argue that there are too many distances, but I’m less bothered by that. However there is little difference in a 50m swimmer vs a 400m one, whereas there is a big difference between 100 m runners and middle distance and then again to long distance.
    Yes but running has hurdles. There are no hurdle races in swimming. A pity since it would be quite a spectacle.
    Swimming should just be binned completely. Its only an excuse for wanky Australia to get some pity medals for their flipper footed freaks.
    Replace it with multiple darts and snooker events. Snooker wearing racey knickers, snooker with a kettle in the D, darts with a really heavy duty fan blowing, a symmetric bars darts. Mixed martial darts. Fat bird snooker.
    Done.
    That might tempt me back into training for a shot at late life Olympic glory. Like that clay pigeon shooter a few years ago. He had a name like - although it wasn't - Dave Braithwaite. Talk about your great names for a mature clay pigeon shooter.
    Lawn Bowls.
    You're never too old to shoot for Commonwealth gold.
    I'm pleased to see the crown green nonsense isn't at the games. 'Stick a hump in the green' 'why?' 'Cos we are northerners and flat greens are poncey and southern' 'solid. Fancy a walnut whippet?'
    Crown green is great. Particularly the ability to bowl the jack anywhere you want. Anarchic. Go corner to corner. Don't like how they lie? Smash the bastard end up. Much more skilful.
    It's 3D revolutionary punk bowls.
    Its filth. Bowls with a bag of roofers nails and 3 naked grandmas halfway up the green. Its impure, a violation of God's design. It insists upon itself. It must be eradicated and its participants past and present held in camps for reeducation.
    Im not overreacting. Im honestly not.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    dixiedean said:

    🚨BREAKING🚨

    Rishi Sunak has promised to slash the basic rate of income tax from 20% to **16%** if he becomes PM

    Would be done by the end of next parliament. Costs £18bn, paid by extra revenues from growth.

    Big moment in the campaign. Truss camp accuses him of a tax “u-turn”

    "Paid by from growth".
    LMAO.
    I'm disappointed its not at least partially funded by efficiency savings
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    Sunak is two announcements away from a free owl for everyone.
  • How does Truss intend to grow the economy, we've had 10 years of stagnation
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,384

    dixiedean said:

    🚨BREAKING🚨

    Rishi Sunak has promised to slash the basic rate of income tax from 20% to **16%** if he becomes PM

    Would be done by the end of next parliament. Costs £18bn, paid by extra revenues from growth.

    Big moment in the campaign. Truss camp accuses him of a tax “u-turn”

    "Paid by from growth".
    LMAO.
    I'm disappointed its not at least partially funded by efficiency savings
    I would have laid good money it would have been done by a bonfire of red tape, cutting superfluous back office staff and focussing on the front line.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited July 2022

    How does Truss intend to grow the economy, we've had 10 years of stagnation

    By cutting tax, durr!

    These people are just as insane as those on the far left who think nationalising everything will make the country richer.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    Rishi is pushing 'phroar look at these knockers!' Davis for worst campaign ever
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,056

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cookie said:

    Commonwealth Games is back on.
    While I'm in old fogey mode, there are far too many swimming events. Just swim as fast as you can. Butterfly, Breast Stroke and Backstroke: superfluous. Medleys of these: taking the piss. Mixed medley: just stop it now.

    Just to reassure you I'm not totally negative about everything, perfectly happy to enjoy rugby sevens, netball or beach volleyball, which seem the other options right now.

    Bang on. There are no running events for running in a different style. A to B, fast as you can.
    I’d also argue that there are too many distances, but I’m less bothered by that. However there is little difference in a 50m swimmer vs a 400m one, whereas there is a big difference between 100 m runners and middle distance and then again to long distance.
    Yes but running has hurdles. There are no hurdle races in swimming. A pity since it would be quite a spectacle.
    Swimming should just be binned completely. Its only an excuse for wanky Australia to get some pity medals for their flipper footed freaks.
    Replace it with multiple darts and snooker events. Snooker wearing racey knickers, snooker with a kettle in the D, darts with a really heavy duty fan blowing, a symmetric bars darts. Mixed martial darts. Fat bird snooker.
    Done.
    That might tempt me back into training for a shot at late life Olympic glory. Like that clay pigeon shooter a few years ago. He had a name like - although it wasn't - Dave Braithwaite. Talk about your great names for a mature clay pigeon shooter.
    Lawn Bowls.
    You're never too old to shoot for Commonwealth gold.
    I'm pleased to see the crown green nonsense isn't at the games. 'Stick a hump in the green' 'why?' 'Cos we are northerners and flat greens are poncey and southern' 'solid. Fancy a walnut whippet?'
    Crown green is great. Particularly the ability to bowl the jack anywhere you want. Anarchic. Go corner to corner. Don't like how they lie? Smash the bastard end up. Much more skilful.
    It's 3D revolutionary punk bowls.
    It insists upon itself.
    You are Peter Griffin and I claim my five cartoon dollars
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061

    Rishi should just give up.

    He's clearly got no actual policies or ideas and no substance or ideology. Just make it up as you go along.

    A wise horse
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,728

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cookie said:

    Commonwealth Games is back on.
    While I'm in old fogey mode, there are far too many swimming events. Just swim as fast as you can. Butterfly, Breast Stroke and Backstroke: superfluous. Medleys of these: taking the piss. Mixed medley: just stop it now.

    Just to reassure you I'm not totally negative about everything, perfectly happy to enjoy rugby sevens, netball or beach volleyball, which seem the other options right now.

    Bang on. There are no running events for running in a different style. A to B, fast as you can.
    I’d also argue that there are too many distances, but I’m less bothered by that. However there is little difference in a 50m swimmer vs a 400m one, whereas there is a big difference between 100 m runners and middle distance and then again to long distance.
    Yes but running has hurdles. There are no hurdle races in swimming. A pity since it would be quite a spectacle.
    Swimming should just be binned completely. Its only an excuse for wanky Australia to get some pity medals for their flipper footed freaks.
    Replace it with multiple darts and snooker events. Snooker wearing racey knickers, snooker with a kettle in the D, darts with a really heavy duty fan blowing, a symmetric bars darts. Mixed martial darts. Fat bird snooker.
    Done.
    That might tempt me back into training for a shot at late life Olympic glory. Like that clay pigeon shooter a few years ago. He had a name like - although it wasn't - Dave Braithwaite. Talk about your great names for a mature clay pigeon shooter.
    Lawn Bowls.
    You're never too old to shoot for Commonwealth gold.
    I'm pleased to see the crown green nonsense isn't at the games. 'Stick a hump in the green' 'why?' 'Cos we are northerners and flat greens are poncey and southern' 'solid. Fancy a walnut whippet?'
    Crown green is great. Particularly the ability to bowl the jack anywhere you want. Anarchic. Go corner to corner. Don't like how they lie? Smash the bastard end up. Much more skilful.
    It's 3D revolutionary punk bowls.
    Its filth. Bowls with a bag of roofers nails and 3 naked grandmas halfway up the green. Its impure, a violation of God's design. It insists upon itself. It must be eradicated and its participants past and present held in camps for reeducation.
    Im not overreacting. Im honestly not.
    I love that this North vs South battle is being played out between men from towns with, what, about 50 miles latitude between them? (Wigan and Norwich, I think?) Admittedly, rather more longitude.
  • Rishi should just give up.

    He's clearly got no actual policies or ideas and no substance or ideology. Just make it up as you go along.

    A wise horse
    Supposedly he rears his head only once a year
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    🚨BREAKING🚨

    Rishi Sunak has promised to slash the basic rate of income tax from 20% to **16%** if he becomes PM

    Would be done by the end of next parliament. Costs £18bn, paid by extra revenues from growth.

    Big moment in the campaign. Truss camp accuses him of a tax “u-turn”

    "Paid by from growth".
    LMAO.
    I'm disappointed its not at least partially funded by efficiency savings
    I would have laid good money it would have been done by a bonfire of red tape, cutting superfluous back office staff and focussing on the front line.
    'It will pay for itself by driving growth'
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    edited July 2022
    Cookie said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cookie said:

    Commonwealth Games is back on.
    While I'm in old fogey mode, there are far too many swimming events. Just swim as fast as you can. Butterfly, Breast Stroke and Backstroke: superfluous. Medleys of these: taking the piss. Mixed medley: just stop it now.

    Just to reassure you I'm not totally negative about everything, perfectly happy to enjoy rugby sevens, netball or beach volleyball, which seem the other options right now.

    Bang on. There are no running events for running in a different style. A to B, fast as you can.
    I’d also argue that there are too many distances, but I’m less bothered by that. However there is little difference in a 50m swimmer vs a 400m one, whereas there is a big difference between 100 m runners and middle distance and then again to long distance.
    Yes but running has hurdles. There are no hurdle races in swimming. A pity since it would be quite a spectacle.
    Swimming should just be binned completely. Its only an excuse for wanky Australia to get some pity medals for their flipper footed freaks.
    Replace it with multiple darts and snooker events. Snooker wearing racey knickers, snooker with a kettle in the D, darts with a really heavy duty fan blowing, a symmetric bars darts. Mixed martial darts. Fat bird snooker.
    Done.
    That might tempt me back into training for a shot at late life Olympic glory. Like that clay pigeon shooter a few years ago. He had a name like - although it wasn't - Dave Braithwaite. Talk about your great names for a mature clay pigeon shooter.
    Lawn Bowls.
    You're never too old to shoot for Commonwealth gold.
    I'm pleased to see the crown green nonsense isn't at the games. 'Stick a hump in the green' 'why?' 'Cos we are northerners and flat greens are poncey and southern' 'solid. Fancy a walnut whippet?'
    Crown green is great. Particularly the ability to bowl the jack anywhere you want. Anarchic. Go corner to corner. Don't like how they lie? Smash the bastard end up. Much more skilful.
    It's 3D revolutionary punk bowls.
    Its filth. Bowls with a bag of roofers nails and 3 naked grandmas halfway up the green. Its impure, a violation of God's design. It insists upon itself. It must be eradicated and its participants past and present held in camps for reeducation.
    Im not overreacting. Im honestly not.
    I love that this North vs South battle is being played out between men from towns with, what, about 50 miles latitude between them? (Wigan and Norwich, I think?) Admittedly, rather more longitude.
    Norwich is Eastern. Eastern. We do different here. And we do it Fine.
    And we are a city! By every possible metric. THE city of Anglia.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,187
    Cookie said:

    Anyone find the idea of Liz Truss telling a private university what to do, quite chilling?

    I answered that last night, partly. If they are in receipt of any government funds, then government should have a say.
    The Government should be able to tell a private university who to give interviews to?

    I find it incredibly chilling.
    Are they private? Or do they in fact recieve money from the state?
    If we're in the position of the state telling private institutions what to do that seems not only fundamentally un-Conservative but also something undemocratic states do. Chilling.
    But almost all universities are not private institutions.
    Buckingham University, I think, can do what it likes. The others are answerable to those who fund them i.e. the state.
    Though all Universities have a mixture of funding streams-UK government, other research funders, charitable donations and (if they're lucky) historic endowment.

    Taking government funding buys HMG a say if they want it, but not a complete say.

    And a policy like the Truss plan (which will be tricky to implement at best) might be seen as a lot of detailed tune-calling for the payment provided.

    The wider issue is that sometimes, the best thing for a government to do is to fund fingertip-length bodies to do desirable things and broadly let them get on with it. Think BBC, Channel 4, some strands of science, local government. Micromanagement might prevent some specific waste and abuse, but it's not obvious that it leads to better outcomes overall.

    Sometimes, the best thing to do with power is to give it away.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,907

    2/ Strikes + public ownership

    - Public say right to strike should be protected vs restricted by a margin of 39% to 26%

    - Public prefer public ownership of utilities over privatisation by 46% to 16%

    Labour is on the side of the public, shocking

    How may of the ‘Singapore on Thames’ enthusiasts in the Conservative party realise that government owns 90% of the land in Singapore ?
  • Nigelb said:

    2/ Strikes + public ownership

    - Public say right to strike should be protected vs restricted by a margin of 39% to 26%

    - Public prefer public ownership of utilities over privatisation by 46% to 16%

    Labour is on the side of the public, shocking

    How may of the ‘Singapore on Thames’ enthusiasts in the Conservative party realise that government owns 90% of the land in Singapore ?
    And they paid for their FTTP programme
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    kinabalu said:

    https://twitter.com/AllieHBNews/status/1553852665926455296

    Is Rishi okay?

    What on Earth is going on.

    Also: Zahawi backs Truss.
    It's just sucking up to the winner isn't it.
    It's so one sided now that I kind of hope Rishi pulls off a surprise win purely for the hilarity of the reaction it would cause. If there is a shy Rishi effect you can put money on Dorries freaking out and suggesting skullduggery afoot.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,384
    edited July 2022
    Cookie said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cookie said:

    Commonwealth Games is back on.
    While I'm in old fogey mode, there are far too many swimming events. Just swim as fast as you can. Butterfly, Breast Stroke and Backstroke: superfluous. Medleys of these: taking the piss. Mixed medley: just stop it now.

    Just to reassure you I'm not totally negative about everything, perfectly happy to enjoy rugby sevens, netball or beach volleyball, which seem the other options right now.

    Bang on. There are no running events for running in a different style. A to B, fast as you can.
    I’d also argue that there are too many distances, but I’m less bothered by that. However there is little difference in a 50m swimmer vs a 400m one, whereas there is a big difference between 100 m runners and middle distance and then again to long distance.
    Yes but running has hurdles. There are no hurdle races in swimming. A pity since it would be quite a spectacle.
    Swimming should just be binned completely. Its only an excuse for wanky Australia to get some pity medals for their flipper footed freaks.
    Replace it with multiple darts and snooker events. Snooker wearing racey knickers, snooker with a kettle in the D, darts with a really heavy duty fan blowing, a symmetric bars darts. Mixed martial darts. Fat bird snooker.
    Done.
    That might tempt me back into training for a shot at late life Olympic glory. Like that clay pigeon shooter a few years ago. He had a name like - although it wasn't - Dave Braithwaite. Talk about your great names for a mature clay pigeon shooter.
    Lawn Bowls.
    You're never too old to shoot for Commonwealth gold.
    I'm pleased to see the crown green nonsense isn't at the games. 'Stick a hump in the green' 'why?' 'Cos we are northerners and flat greens are poncey and southern' 'solid. Fancy a walnut whippet?'
    Crown green is great. Particularly the ability to bowl the jack anywhere you want. Anarchic. Go corner to corner. Don't like how they lie? Smash the bastard end up. Much more skilful.
    It's 3D revolutionary punk bowls.
    Its filth. Bowls with a bag of roofers nails and 3 naked grandmas halfway up the green. Its impure, a violation of God's design. It insists upon itself. It must be eradicated and its participants past and present held in camps for reeducation.
    Im not overreacting. Im honestly not.
    I love that this North vs South battle is being played out between men from towns with, what, about 50 miles latitude between them? (Wigan and Norwich, I think?) Admittedly, rather more longitude.
    In all seriousness. I've played Crown and Flat bowls. They are both highly skilful but far more different than the casual observer may appreciate.
    Like League and Union tbh. You will be decent at either, but not necessarily great at both.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,907

    Nadine hates the BBC because it has been successful in public hands.

    Just as Channel 4.

    Ideological nuttery, Channel 4 doesn't need privatising. Makes no sense for anyone sane.

    Nadine is someone no sane party would take seriously, let alone appoint a minister.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    edited July 2022

    🚨BREAKING🚨

    Rishi Sunak has promised to slash the basic rate of income tax from 20% to **16%** if he becomes PM

    Would be done by the end of next parliament. Costs £18bn, paid by extra revenues from growth.

    Big moment in the campaign. Truss camp accuses him of a tax “u-turn”

    It's great promising things be funded by extra growth revenues, as it will cover absolutely anything you propose so long as you are optimistic enough in your estimates.

    If it was that simple and obvious why was it not already done?
    dixiedean said:

    I would have laid good money it would have been done by a bonfire of red tape, cutting superfluous back office staff and focussing on the front line.

    Nah, they've already used that one like a dozen times.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    edited July 2022
    The bigger EU problem for Truss in my view is the Northern Ireland Protocol. Having marched the troops up to the top of the hill, she will have to march them down again if she wants to avoid a trade war with almost all the UK's main partners. Also not clear how she will extract us out of the trade war of it does go ahead.

    Previously when Truss screwed up she could be moved on and someone else sort out the mess she created. Not possible if she's the top bod
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,597
    ping said:

    How does Truss intend to grow the economy, we've had 10 years of stagnation

    By cutting tax, durr!

    These people are just as insane as those on the far left who think nationalising everything will make the country richer.
    S Times claims she has had to turn away the massive levels of donations to her campaign from business people delighted at her corporate tax cut "promise" as her campaign has no idea how to spend any more money than it already is.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,495
    FF43 said:

    The bigger EU problem for Truss in my view is the Northern Ireland Protocol. Having marched the troops up to the top of the hill, she will have to march them down again if she wants to avoid a trade war with almost all the UK's main partners. Also not clear how she will extract us out of the trade war of it does go ahead.

    Previously when Truss screwed up she could be moved on and someone else sort out the Mrs she created. Not possible if she's the top box

    What makes you sure that the EU is committed to a trade war and what form do you think it will take?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,907
    Russia’s train with over 40 cars loaded with military equipment & ammunition from Crimea destroyed by HIMARS in Kherson Oblast…
    https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1553842947241771008
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    kinabalu said:

    The problem imo with the Truss uni thing is it's yet more focus on the exceptionally clever and "getting into Oxbridge" and all that atomised "ladder for the few" business, when our big educational challenge is raising general standards and in particular doing better by kids who are not unusually bright, ie most kids.

    Only when everyone is above average will there be success.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited July 2022
    Off topic.

    I think the unions are missing a trick in the way they seem to accept the media/governments framing of pay rise %ages. They should stick rigidly to talking about the government/employers offering a “real terms pay cut” of x%”

    “The government/employers etc are using inflation as an excuse to cut our pay in real terms and, to all reasonable people, that is unacceptable.”

    “We’re not asking for a real terms pay rise, only for our pay to keep up with inflation”

    And keep hammering that point home.

    That framing, imo, would resonate better than the current lines they’re taking.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,970
    I had no idea that women’s football was already so big in Germany. 12m Germans watched the semi final with France. Possibly 15-20m watched that final

    Heh
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,605
    Is this the same Sunak who said lowering taxes wasn’t compatible with sound money and therefore struck at the heart of the Conservative party purpose? I’m confused.
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163

    Anyone find the idea of Liz Truss telling a private university what to do, quite chilling?

    I answered that last night, partly. If they are in receipt of any government funds, then government should have a say.
    The Government should be able to tell a private university who to give interviews to?

    I find it incredibly chilling.
    Are they private? Or do they in fact recieve money from the state?
    If we're in the position of the state telling private institutions what to do that seems not only fundamentally un-Conservative but also something undemocratic states do. Chilling.
    They are not private ffs, they recieve money from the state.
    They are private by any definition.
    Do you understand how higher education is funded?
    Yes - the govt hands out "loans" that will never be paid back, So, in effect, they are just printing money and trying to sell the debt to recoup costs. It is yet another financial crisis in the making.
    Unis are in receipt of other money than just student loans.
    There is still a student loans crisis and the student fees are a significant proportion of the Uni income
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994

    Rishi is pushing 'phroar look at these knockers!' Davis for worst campaign ever

    Feels like a spoof of a campaign announcement.

    "Alright you idiots, you want tax cuts, fine, here's your tax cuts, happy now?"
  • ping said:

    Off topic.

    I think the unions are missing a trick in the way they seem to accept the media/governments framing of pay rise %ages. They should stick rigidly to talking about the government/employers offering a “real terms pay cut” of x%”

    “The government/employers etc are using inflation as an excuse to cut our pay in real terms and, to all reasonable people, that is unacceptable.”

    “We’re not asking for a real terms pay rise, only for our pay to keep up with inflation”

    And keep hammering that point home.

    That framing, imo, would resonate better than the current lines they’re taking.

    The Government keep saying these people are well compensated.

    A station staff member earns like £25K a year, hardly great compensation
  • Does Liz have any actual ideas for higher education and the debts we've all got into or what
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    Jonathan said:

    Is this the same Sunak who said lowering taxes wasn’t compatible with sound money and therefore struck at the heart of the Conservative party purpose? I’m confused.

    As Theresa May found out to her cost (not that it was the only factor), you can try being more 'realistic' in your promises when you thought you were going to win easily.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    Jonathan said:

    Is this the same Sunak who said lowering taxes wasn’t compatible with sound money and therefore struck at the heart of the Conservative party purpose? I’m confused.

    He did seem sure. I guess extensive and convincing new economic data has been presented to him. That must be it
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    Nigelb said:

    Nadine hates the BBC because it has been successful in public hands.

    Just as Channel 4.

    Ideological nuttery, Channel 4 doesn't need privatising. Makes no sense for anyone sane.

    Nadine is someone no sane party would take seriously, let alone appoint a minister.
    She's probably going to get a promotion, so prepare yourself.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,597

    Sunak is two announcements away from a free owl for everyone.

    I think he has already gone beyond free owls if Telegraph is correct.

    Income tax to be 16%

    He seems to have basically promised to bankrupt the British state so that millions can keep extra £1000 year.

    I mean, yeh, feck it, why not?

    Frankly, I think he should just reverse William Pitt entirely and scrap income tax altogether.

    Just like Margaret would have done.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,295
    edited July 2022

    Jonathan said:

    Is this the same Sunak who said lowering taxes wasn’t compatible with sound money and therefore struck at the heart of the Conservative party purpose? I’m confused.

    He did seem sure. I guess extensive and convincing new economic data has been presented to him. That must be it
    Brexit dividend, obvs.
  • Personally I think we should have a GE when the PM changes and I thought we should have had the same after Brown took over for what it is worth
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    Jonathan said:

    Is this the same Sunak who said lowering taxes wasn’t compatible with sound money and therefore struck at the heart of the Conservative party purpose? I’m confused.

    Yes, but clearly not lowering taxes is incompatible with his ability to become Prime Minister and therefore strikes at the heart of his purpose within the Conservative party.

    Either that or there's a good Rishi and an evil Rishi and they never appear at the same event.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,058
    kle4 said:

    kinabalu said:

    https://twitter.com/AllieHBNews/status/1553852665926455296

    Is Rishi okay?

    What on Earth is going on.

    Also: Zahawi backs Truss.
    It's just sucking up to the winner isn't it.
    It's so one sided now that I kind of hope Rishi pulls off a surprise win purely for the hilarity of the reaction it would cause. If there is a shy Rishi effect you can put money on Dorries freaking out and suggesting skullduggery afoot.
    Oh I more than kind of hope that. I'd luv it! But it looks forlorn.

    Although tbh Sunak is making a dick of himself now with what he's coming out with. Fighting for his career, ok, but have some dignity ffs.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,655

    Rishi is pushing 'phroar look at these knockers!' Davis for worst campaign ever

    Davis has endorsed Sunak now and introduced him at the Leeds hustings
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,597

    Personally I think we should have a GE when the PM changes and I thought we should have had the same after Brown took over for what it is worth

    Nope.

    We have a parliamentary system so there is no need to "check" with the electorate if there is a change in the Cabinet.

  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163

    Does Liz have any actual ideas for higher education and the debts we've all got into or what

    FTFY :wink:
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    edited July 2022
    If they are going to go nuts with economics I suggest being more creative.

    Have everyone declared a knight under the law, then raise scutage, money paid in lieu of feudal military service, from all citizens.

    We'd raise huge amounts, and those who don't want to pay will see our armed forces numbers increase.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,597

    Does Liz have any actual ideas for higher education and the debts we've all got into or what

    Take a wild guess.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    kle4 said:

    Rishi is pushing 'phroar look at these knockers!' Davis for worst campaign ever

    Feels like a spoof of a campaign announcement.

    "Alright you idiots, you want tax cuts, fine, here's your tax cuts, happy now?"
    Hes just a guy, cutting 4p off income tax, hoping you can love him.

    He'll be getting an 'aiming for 10p basic rate' tat next to make his damascene conversion inked for life
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    edited July 2022
    The funny thing about being seen to be losing is that you can announce something that might well have won over the selectorate in the beginning, and it won't help at all as the same group will just see it as a desperate attempt to win them over (even though that is true of all the policies from both to date).

    Surprised they've not annouced rules to make your grandkids call more often.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    HYUFD said:

    Rishi is pushing 'phroar look at these knockers!' Davis for worst campaign ever

    Davis has endorsed Sunak now and introduced him at the Leeds hustings
    Death knell for Rishi, the flouncer in chief is on board
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    dixiedean said:

    I commit to satisfying my future sex partners in a way I haven't over the past 12 years.
    How?

    You're going to cut their income tax bills?
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,698
    The thing is that despite all the rhetotic, Nadine has actually been very soft on the BBC.

    Osborne froze the Licence Fee for six years, and made the BBC take on the cost of World Service. That was a significant tightening.

    In contrast, Nadine did a two year Licence Fee freeze. And allowed the BBC to start charging over 75s even though the 2017 LF settlement was made on full expectation the BBC would not do that (ie BBC got to pocket the £150m per year previously spent on broadband and extension of LF to iPlayer as part of the deal).

    We've had 10 years of whining about BBC cuts yet mysteriously almost no BBC services have shut and BBC output all looks remarkably similar to 10 years ago.

    And now just a few weeks ago the BBC was so short of money it's just bought the rights to Champions League highlights for the first time.

    And of course the BBC Final Salary Pension Scheme still hasn't been closed to future accrual for anyone in it prior to when it was closed to new entrants. So all the long serving employees are still rolling up more years of Final Salary pension.

    It's all completely laughable. Nadine could have been far, far tougher - but she backed off - presumably the BBC ran rings round her - scared her into thinking they really would have to make big cuts when of course they knew they had enough slack in the system.
  • IanB2 said:

    Naughty Nadine, an actual UK cabinet minister, retweeting a mock-up image of Sunak dressed as Brutus stabbing Johnson in the Forum…

    They’re a happy lot, these Tories

    Let's have the picture then:

    image
    Is it Cummings between them?

    Presumably the bespectacled man was also photoshopped into the picture of people being Romans..
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,058
    edited July 2022
    kle4 said:

    The funny thing about being seen to be losing is that you can announce something that might well have won over the selectorate in the beginning, and it won't help at all as the same group will just see it as a desperate attempt to win them over (even though that is true of all the policies from both to date).

    Surprised they've not annouced rules to make your grandkids call more often.

    Shades of Corbyn 2019.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    dixiedean said:

    I commit to satisfying my future sex partners in a way I haven't over the past 12 years.
    How?
    Growth of course.

    Satisfying a lady is a lot like running an early millenium economy. Youve got to have a lot of stiff growth, and bed her according to the fiscal Golden Rule
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163

    dixiedean said:

    I commit to satisfying my future sex partners in a way I haven't over the past 12 years.
    How?
    Growth of course.

    Satisfying a lady is a lot like running an early millenium economy. Youve got to have a lot of stiff growth, and bed her according to the fiscal Golden Rule
    Do either of you have a woman in your life?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,384
    See. Now Liz Truss is the sane candidate for the instinctive non-Tory.
    That's where we are.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061

    dixiedean said:

    I commit to satisfying my future sex partners in a way I haven't over the past 12 years.
    How?
    Growth of course.

    Satisfying a lady is a lot like running an early millenium economy. Youve got to have a lot of stiff growth, and bed her according to the fiscal Golden Rule
    Do either of you have a woman in your life?
    Absolutely not!
  • kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Nadine hates the BBC because it has been successful in public hands.

    Just as Channel 4.

    Ideological nuttery, Channel 4 doesn't need privatising. Makes no sense for anyone sane.

    Nadine is someone no sane party would take seriously, let alone appoint a
    minister.

    She's probably going to get a promotion,
    so prepare yourself.
    Part of me would almost like to see the moron exposed as, say, Chancellor

    Thickest cabinet minister since Williamson or Grayling or Bob the Labour Defence Sec?

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,597
    Clare McDonnell
    @claremcdonnell1
    Not your regular post-match press conference.
    Wait for it.
    #lionesses
    #ItsComingHome

    https://twitter.com/claremcdonnell1/status/1553838251315810305
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,384
    edited July 2022
    ...
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163
    edited July 2022
    kle4 said:

    The funny thing about being seen to be losing is that you can announce something that might well have won over the selectorate in the beginning, and it won't help at all as the same group will just see it as a desperate attempt to win them over (even though that is true of all the policies from both to date).

    Surprised they've not annouced rules to make your grandkids call more often.

    The grandkids lack the time to call. They are too busy working to pay Grandpa and Grandma's medical bills, pensions and IHT dodging...
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    I was starting to feel sorry for Sunak until he came out with ludicrous nonsense about tax cuts in seven years, when we all know a week is a long time in politics.

    The UK Treasury knows that no tax cuts before the next election will create a huge schism in the tory ranks and with tory voters and usher in a labour government much more friendly to their Brownite groupthink. They can then safely wave goodbye to those tax cuts for ever.

    Either Sunak know he is being played by a UK treasury desperate to see off this conservative government and is OK with it, or he really is the dumbest candidate who ever ran for PM.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,907
    kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Nadine hates the BBC because it has been successful in public hands.

    Just as Channel 4.

    Ideological nuttery, Channel 4 doesn't need privatising. Makes no sense for anyone sane.

    Nadine is someone no sane party would take seriously, let alone appoint a minister.
    She's probably going to get a promotion, so prepare yourself.
    It’s not a surprise, since the Conservatives took collective leave of their senses a while back.
    I don’t think they’ll regain them without a long spell in opposition.
  • Where’s Digby Jones to tell the Commonwealth ‘experts’ that medal isn’t a verb?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,907

    Personally I think we should have a GE when the PM changes and I thought we should have had the same after Brown took over for what it is worth

    Nope.

    We have a parliamentary system so there is no need to "check" with the electorate if there is a change in the Cabinet.

    Why then is there a need to check with the wildly unrepresentative Conservative membership, if democracy is satisfied my consulting our parliamentary representatives ?
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited July 2022
    MISTY said:

    I was starting to feel sorry for Sunak until he came out with ludicrous nonsense about tax cuts in seven years, when we all know a week is a long time in politics.

    The UK Treasury knows that no tax cuts before the next election will create a huge schism in the tory ranks and with tory voters and usher in a labour government much more friendly to their Brownite groupthink. They can then safely wave goodbye to those tax cuts for ever.

    Either Sunak know he is being played by a UK treasury desperate to see off this conservative government and is OK with it, or he really is the dumbest candidate who ever ran for PM.

    Pft. I dunno where you picked up that bollocks, but it has no basis in fact.

    If the treasury suffers “groupthink” it’s an obsession with the debt/deficit.

    Rightly so.

    Tories used to care about that, too. Seems a long time ago. They’ll go back to caring about it when Truss’s “growth” never materialises and labour is back in government.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,556
    FF43 said:

    The bigger EU problem for Truss in my view is the Northern Ireland Protocol. Having marched the troops up to the top of the hill, she will have to march them down again if she wants to avoid a trade war with almost all the UK's main partners. Also not clear how she will extract us out of the trade war of it does go ahead.

    Previously when Truss screwed up she could be moved on and someone else sort out the mess she created. Not possible if she's the top bod

    How many Conservative voters give a toss about the Northern Ireland Protocol ?

    Or Northern Ireland itself for that matter.

    All Truss needs to do is say that given the economic and international situation this is not the time to have a needless trade war with friends and allies but instead give the Protocol more time to see how it develops.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,970
    edited July 2022
    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163

    FF43 said:

    The bigger EU problem for Truss in my view is the Northern Ireland Protocol. Having marched the troops up to the top of the hill, she will have to march them down again if she wants to avoid a trade war with almost all the UK's main partners. Also not clear how she will extract us out of the trade war of it does go ahead.

    Previously when Truss screwed up she could be moved on and someone else sort out the mess she created. Not possible if she's the top bod

    How many Conservative voters give a toss about the Northern Ireland Protocol ?

    Or Northern Ireland itself for that matter.

    All Truss needs to do is say that given the economic and international situation this is not the time to have a needless trade war with friends and allies but instead give the Protocol more time to see how it develops.
    That would require her to show some wit and knowledge.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    Nigelb said:

    Personally I think we should have a GE when the PM changes and I thought we should have had the same after Brown took over for what it is worth

    Nope.

    We have a parliamentary system so there is no need to "check" with the electorate if there is a change in the Cabinet.

    Why then is there a need to check with the wildly unrepresentative Conservative membership, if democracy is satisfied my consulting our parliamentary representatives ?
    There isn't a need to check with them. That's just a choice the party has made this time (and did not make the last time it happened).
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    It's caused some difficult problems which we are now having to grapple with, but the industrial revolution truly has led to an amazing amount of good in a remarkably short space of time. I think people get a bit caught up in the dark satanic mills bit thesedays - not that life was literally nasty, brutish and short for everyone for all history, but it generally wasn't this good.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994

    FF43 said:

    The bigger EU problem for Truss in my view is the Northern Ireland Protocol. Having marched the troops up to the top of the hill, she will have to march them down again if she wants to avoid a trade war with almost all the UK's main partners. Also not clear how she will extract us out of the trade war of it does go ahead.

    Previously when Truss screwed up she could be moved on and someone else sort out the mess she created. Not possible if she's the top bod

    How many Conservative voters give a toss about the Northern Ireland Protocol ?

    Or Northern Ireland itself for that matter.

    All Truss needs to do is say that given the economic and international situation this is not the time to have a needless trade war with friends and allies but instead give the Protocol more time to see how it develops.
    She should do that. But I think that at a point you have to believe what people say, even politicians - the rhetoric about the NI protocol has been so persistent and intense, I think she and the party really do think they need to go this route, even if the voters do not care so much.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,970
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    It's caused some difficult problems which we are now having to grapple with, but the industrial revolution truly has led to an amazing amount of good in a remarkably short space of time. I think people get a bit caught up in the dark satanic mills bit thesedays - not that life was literally nasty, brutish and short for everyone for all history, but it generally wasn't this good.

    Every other nation in the world should give us 10% of their GDP per annum, in perpetuity, simply as an act of gratitude
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    It's caused some difficult problems which we are now having to grapple with, but the industrial revolution truly has led to an amazing amount of good in a remarkably short space of time. I think people get a bit caught up in the dark satanic mills bit thesedays - not that life was literally nasty, brutish and short for everyone for all history, but it generally wasn't this good.

    Every other nation in the world should give us 10% of their GDP per annum, in perpetuity, simply as an act of gratitude
    I think that's Rishi's next announcement.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,556
    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    The valleys in Derbyshire, Lancashire and Shropshire where the industrial revolution took place should be viewed on the level of importance of Ionian Greece and Renaissance Tuscany.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,994
    kle4 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Personally I think we should have a GE when the PM changes and I thought we should have had the same after Brown took over for what it is worth

    Nope.

    We have a parliamentary system so there is no need to "check" with the electorate if there is a change in the Cabinet.

    Why then is there a need to check with the wildly unrepresentative Conservative membership, if democracy is satisfied my consulting our parliamentary representatives ?
    There isn't a need to check with them. That's just a choice the party has made this time (and did not make the last time it happened).
    2nd to last.
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,650
    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    It's caused some difficult problems which we are now having to grapple with, but the industrial revolution truly has led to an amazing amount of good in a remarkably short space of time. I think people get a bit caught up in the dark satanic mills bit thesedays - not that life was literally nasty, brutish and short for everyone for all history, but it generally wasn't this good.

    Every other nation in the world should give us 10% of their GDP per annum, in perpetuity, simply as an act of gratitude
    You did kill more than 10% of some nations :)
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,970

    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    The valleys in Derbyshire, Lancashire and Shropshire where the industrial revolution took place should be viewed on the level of importance of Ionian Greece and Renaissance Tuscany.

    They REALLY should. I have actually had that same feeling when touring Coalbrookdale etc


    HERE is a place where the world changed

    I’d say it’s maybe bigger than Greece and Tuscany (amazing as they were). Maybe bigger even than Jerusalem (the cradle of monotheism)

    Perhaps the only parallel is Gobekli Tepe: the birthplace of the Neolithic Revolution. The first farmers (which was also a complex blessing for humanity)
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,475
    Interesting statistic.

    "Today, in real terms, average household disposable income is double that of 1980, says Jon Boys, economist at the Chartered Institute of Personnel and Development." (£)

    https://www.ft.com/content/b2b6507c-c58d-4003-920a-6aa72632a3cf
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,035
    Cookie said:

    ping said:

    Congrats to the lionesses.

    With all the talk about womens football, how great it is for women - and inspiring for girls - one angle I haven’t seen mentioned, but for me is quite important.

    Class.

    The gender debate is focussed very heavily on upper and middle class women. They are the main beneficiaries - and shout the loudest about equality initiatives and media representation etc. it can all get a bit tiring, watching professional women on high-five, or six figure salaries complain about the gender pay gap, female empowerment etc.

    These lioness lasses are proper working class and have achieved greatness entirely off their own back. It’s awesome.

    The very best of British.

    I was wondering abouty that. Is women's football any more or less working class/middle class than men's football? Inasmuch as you can guess from accent and/or birthplace, the answer is 'I can't tell'. Anyone have any insight?

    My daughter plays football, and my limited observations are that it seems a more working class pastime than some of her other hobbies. But I don't know how representative this is.
    "The play-offs were on back home – the fuckin’ play-offs – and not one fuckin’ channel here was showing them. Click: soccer. Click: soccer. Nothing but fuckin’ soccer. It was a disappointment if not a surprise. As far as Harry was concerned, it just proved a long-held belief that the further you got from civilisation, the less American sport was on the goddamn TV. If the immigration department wanted to smoke out the illegals in East LA, they just had to look in a few windows and the wetbacks would be the ones watching soccer. You want to blend in properly in your new, adopted home, you watch fuckin’ football or baseball or basketball or hockey. The only way you’d blend in watching soccer is if you’re an eleven-year-old, middleclass white girl in La Jolla."

    Christopher Brookmyre, The Sacred Art of Stealing
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,035
    Cookie said:

    Anyone find the idea of Liz Truss telling a private university what to do, quite chilling?

    I answered that last night, partly. If they are in receipt of any government funds, then government should have a say.
    The Government should be able to tell a private university who to give interviews to?

    I find it incredibly chilling.
    Are they private? Or do they in fact recieve money from the state?
    If we're in the position of the state telling private institutions what to do that seems not only fundamentally un-Conservative but also something undemocratic states do. Chilling.
    But almost all universities are not private institutions.
    Buckingham University, I think, can do what it likes. The others are answerable to those who fund them i.e. the state.
    There are a couple of genuinely private universities: Buckingham is one, the New University of the Arts is another.

    Although I suspect even they both receive some public money.

    Even Buckingham takes some
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,597
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better




    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    It's caused some difficult problems which we are now having to grapple with, but the industrial revolution truly has led to an amazing amount of good in a remarkably short space of time. I think people get a bit caught up in the dark satanic mills bit thesedays - not that life was literally nasty, brutish and short for everyone for all history, but it generally wasn't this good.

    Every other nation in the world should give us 10% of their GDP per annum, in perpetuity, simply as an act of gratitude
    I think that's Rishi's next announcement.
    I'm losing track - I thought we had to bow our heads in shame as the nation that basically invented the technology that has caused climate change?

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,597
    Nigelb said:

    Personally I think we should have a GE when the PM changes and I thought we should have had the same after Brown took over for what it is worth

    Nope.

    We have a parliamentary system so there is no need to "check" with the electorate if there is a change in the Cabinet.

    Why then is there a need to check with the wildly unrepresentative Conservative membership, if democracy is satisfied my consulting our parliamentary representatives ?
    No idea. But that is nothing to do with our constitution. If a particular party chooses to try and decide who should attempt to next have the command of the House by having their own internal election that is besides the point.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,035

    Cookie said:

    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cookie said:

    Commonwealth Games is back on.
    While I'm in old fogey mode, there are far too many swimming events. Just swim as fast as you can. Butterfly, Breast Stroke and Backstroke: superfluous. Medleys of these: taking the piss. Mixed medley: just stop it now.

    Just to reassure you I'm not totally negative about everything, perfectly happy to enjoy rugby sevens, netball or beach volleyball, which seem the other options right now.

    Bang on. There are no running events for running in a different style. A to B, fast as you can.
    I’d also argue that there are too many distances, but I’m less bothered by that. However there is little difference in a 50m swimmer vs a 400m one, whereas there is a big difference between 100 m runners and middle distance and then again to long distance.
    Yes but running has hurdles. There are no hurdle races in swimming. A pity since it would be quite a spectacle.
    Swimming should just be binned completely. Its only an excuse for wanky Australia to get some pity medals for their flipper footed freaks.
    Replace it with multiple darts and snooker events. Snooker wearing racey knickers, snooker with a kettle in the D, darts with a really heavy duty fan blowing, a symmetric bars darts. Mixed martial darts. Fat bird snooker.
    Done.
    That might tempt me back into training for a shot at late life Olympic glory. Like that clay pigeon shooter a few years ago. He had a name like - although it wasn't - Dave Braithwaite. Talk about your great names for a mature clay pigeon shooter.
    Lawn Bowls.
    You're never too old to shoot for Commonwealth gold.
    I'm pleased to see the crown green nonsense isn't at the games. 'Stick a hump in the green' 'why?' 'Cos we are northerners and flat greens are poncey and southern' 'solid. Fancy a walnut whippet?'
    Crown green is great. Particularly the ability to bowl the jack anywhere you want. Anarchic. Go corner to corner. Don't like how they lie? Smash the bastard end up. Much more skilful.
    It's 3D revolutionary punk bowls.
    Its filth. Bowls with a bag of roofers nails and 3 naked grandmas halfway up the green. Its impure, a violation of God's design. It insists upon itself. It must be eradicated and its participants past and present held in camps for reeducation.
    Im not overreacting. Im honestly not.
    I love that this North vs South battle is being played out between men from towns with, what, about 50 miles latitude between them? (Wigan and Norwich, I think?) Admittedly, rather more longitude.
    Norwich is Eastern. Eastern. We do different here. And we do it Fine.
    And we are a city! By every possible metric. THE city of Anglia.
    I can confirm that Norwich successfully passes the rcs1000 tests for being a city.
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    edited July 2022
    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better



    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    Did anyone else look at what's being measured here?

    * GDP/capita - a stupid measure for most of this period; a misleading one for the rest of it (clue: it's an amount of monetary value divided by population);

    * war-making capacity - should be plotted in the other direction, unless you think you and your neighbour storing up big piles of guns is a good thing; and what's the unit - mass of TNT equivalent? number of deaths causable in an hour if all the world's weapons were used right away?

    * % not living in extreme poverty - meaning what?

    * energy capture per day - another stupid measure

    * % "living in a democacy" - oh give us a break

    * life expectancy - ah, quantity!

    What about hours worked?
    What about alienation?
    What about the current position where so many spend so many hours picking at little personal electronic devices like complete and utter zombies?
    But hail the national flag, eh?

    image
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,035
    kle4 said:

    If they are going to go nuts with economics I suggest being more creative.

    Have everyone declared a knight under the law, then raise scutage, money paid in lieu of feudal military service, from all citizens.

    We'd raise huge amounts, and those who don't want to pay will see our armed forces numbers increase.

    This can also be used to solve the trans issue, as there will be no he or she or they, only sire.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,742

    Nadine hates the BBC because it has been successful in public hands.

    Just as Channel 4.

    Ideological nuttery, Channel 4 doesn't need privatising. Makes no sense for anyone sane.

    Nadine hates the BBC because that is her job. She was given the BBC and Channel 4 policies when she was appointed.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,655

    Nigelb said:

    Personally I think we should have a GE when the PM changes and I thought we should have had the same after Brown took over for what it is worth

    Nope.

    We have a parliamentary system so there is no need to "check" with the electorate if there is a change in the Cabinet.

    Why then is there a need to check with the wildly unrepresentative Conservative membership, if democracy is satisfied my consulting our parliamentary representatives ?
    No idea. But that is nothing to do with our constitution. If a particular party chooses to try and decide who should attempt to next have the command of the House by having their own internal election that is besides the point.
    Indeed, the party with a majority in the Commons selects its leader and hence the PM by its normal party rules until the next general election.

    Labour could also have had a membership vote in 2007 had John McConnell got enough MPs to be nominated alongside Gordon Brown
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    edited July 2022
    Dynamo said:

    Leon said:

    We did this. Us, the British. We changed the world more than any other nation on earth by a vast distance

    And we changed it, enormously, for the better



    https://twitter.com/peterwildeford/status/1553181284184330242?s=21&t=GWb9sJshFzAdjkdUxs18Ng

    So when you get socialist snakes like @kinabalu telling you that “pride in Britain” is “sentimental nonsense” or worse, show them that, then push their heads down the toilet

    Did anyone else look at what's being measured here?

    * GDP/capita - a stupid measure for most of this period; a misleading one for the rest of it (clue: it's an amount of monetary value divided by population);

    * war-making capacity - should be plotted in the other direction, unless you think you and your neighbour storing up big piles of guns is a good thing; and what's the unit - mass of TNT equivalent? number of deaths causable in an hour if all the world's weapons were used right away?

    * % not living in extreme poverty - meaning what?

    * energy capture per day - another stupid measure

    * % "living in a democacy" - oh give us a break

    * life expectancy - ah, quantity!

    What about hours worked?
    What about alienation?
    What about the current position where so many spend so many hours picking at little personal electronic devices like complete and utter zombies?
    But hail the national flag, eh?

    image
    How about a graph for the suicide rate?
    Or the proportion of people who enjoy their dreams?
    How about what a Stone Age person might think? Or what existing Stone Age people might think?

    Or are such considerations a bunch of codswallop compared to USD of output per "capita" and the combined size of all the weapons piles?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,742
    Jonathan said:

    Is this the same Sunak who said lowering taxes wasn’t compatible with sound money and therefore struck at the heart of the Conservative party purpose? I’m confused.

    Rishi's budget last March already announced a 1p cut in income tax from 2024.
This discussion has been closed.