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The real winner of tonight’s debate was Starmer & Labour – politicalbetting.com

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  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,650
    Morning anyway. I see the Beeb have rolled out the evergreen "no knockout blow" for the debate. This is such a trope that I reckon the only thing that would prevent its use is if there was quite literally a punch delivered on stage flattening one of the participants. And Sunak did seem to fancy it at times, didn't he?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,326
    eek said:

    As @ydoethur points out - KS3 runs from Y7 to Y10 - ages 11 to 14. Woe betide you shrink that.
    Hate to be picky, but it's years 7-9 inclusive. Years 10 and 11 are GCSE.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,138
    Pulpstar said:

    Does Lord Cruddas have any idea how dangerous this sort of thing is to the fabric of democracy ?

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1645515/Boris-Johnson-coup-legal-challenge-Tory-membership-high-court-bid-Lord-Cruddas-update

    The High Court will throw it out.

    Cruddas is wasting his time and his money.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,326
    kjh said:

    In fairness Bart has been given a good reason to boil over, particularly if the system is set up to encourage schools to hold back kids. I hope it isn't true, but ....
    Oh, it's true all right.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,138
    kinabalu said:

    Morning anyway. I see the Beeb have rolled out the evergreen "no knockout blow" for the debate. This is such a trope that I reckon the only thing that would prevent its use is if there was quite literally a punch delivered on stage flattening one of the participants. And Sunak did seem to fancy it at times, didn't he?

    Also, this "turns toxic" and "deeply bitter and personal" stuff.

    I didn't see either Truss or Sunak go the full MalcolmG on stage.

    They were having a leadership debate, and challenging each other accordingly on their policy, priorities and leadership style.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 12,481

    You appear to have escaped from the 1950s.
    Not far wrong. See my other post. Born in 1954, A level maths 1971 - 1973. Took one of them early in 1972.

    Not saying I disagree with the change, but struggling to see the logic in it and what was wrong with the original system, which seems sound and rational.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,560

    NEW THREAD

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 30,038
    ydoethur said:

    Sacking the whole DfE and not replacing them would be the most essential step. Most of the problems in education stem form their efforts to micromanage things, very incompetently.

    Getting rid of Academy chains would also be important. They were essentially a power grab by the DfE and a very costly (in all senses) mistake.

    For good or ill we are stuck with the exam system we have. It is enormously disruptive and expensive to change it and would probably jam the whole system solid if anyone even tried. The reason this is my first actual summer holiday in six years is because all the others have involved enormous amounts of work rewriting the curriculum to match the changes. (It wouldn't even be that if I hadn't quit, although 2023 might be easier.)

    I would however look to have loose federations of local schools and universities working on curriculums and possibly qualifications as well. That would, however, require fairly dramatic reforms of the university QA system.
    There might be a case for abolishing GCSEs as they are no longer gateways to sixth form study.

    And take a leaf out of the posh schools book and have non-examined courses of more "relevant" or just interesting subjects, from local history of wherever the school is, to how to set up a web site or make a Youtube video; simple DIY, car maintenance or cookery for one.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,203

    The High Court will throw it out.

    Cruddas is wasting his time and his money.
    It's starting to head down the US route of challenging democracy in court.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 30,038
    edited July 2022

    You appear to have escaped from the 1950s.
    Did they have GCEs in the 1950s or was it still school certificate and matriculation? Or for most pupils, escape and a job at 15.

    iirc in my day you could do double A-level maths either as maths and further maths, or as pure maths and applied maths, where the same content would be examined in a different order.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,650
    kjh said:

    In fairness Bart has been given a good reason to boil over, particularly if the system is set up to encourage schools to hold back kids. I hope it isn't true, but ....
    Ah ok! Fair play then.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,326

    Did they have GCEs in the 1950s or was it still school certificate and matriculation? Or for most pupils, escape and a job at 15.

    iirc in my day you could do double A-level maths either as maths and further maths, or as pure maths and applied maths, where the same content would be examined in a different order.
    GCEs came in in the late 1940s (I think 1947) under the terms of the Education Act 1944.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,542

    Tbf 500-600 miles would be plenty for most people, meaning you could travel through Europe and only have to charge overnight.
    If I was driving from home to Dover, I would probably run out of battery just at the entrance to Dover. However, the ensuing hold ups wouldn’t be my fault, as I’m not French.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,650
    ydoethur said:

    Oh, it's true all right.
    I take it back. Carry on Bart!
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,542
    kjh said:

    I'm interested to know why the format of A level maths has changed from the past. In my day we had Pure maths A level and Applied maths A level. As an alternative there was a Combined Maths A level that consisted of the first two (easier) papers of the other two A level. Ideal for those needing a good maths grounding at University but not doing maths. Seems sensible to me. Like to know the argument for the change.
    To keep DoE staff in employment.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 30,038
    New thread.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 29,783

    The High Court will throw it out.

    Cruddas is wasting his time and his money.
    A legal challenge. Against rules in the Tory Party constitution. "Yes of course we can challenge it" says the "top QC" mentioned in the article. Kerching!
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 31,166

    The rest are left on the scrapheap though, like Mrs P.

    As a July baby who'd lost a year's education through illness she was at a disadvantage and narrowly failed her 11-plus. Consigned the the local secondary modern, she had to fight hard to get the Maths and English 'O' levels she needed to train as a nurse (since the school didn't usually bother). After a successful nursing career she later did a degree and masters in History.

    Plenty of others in her position have been similarly failed not lucky enough to overcome it.
    I agree, I believe selection at 11 is fundamentally evil. My point was if secondary education except for selective Grammar Schools is to be criminally underfunded by the Conservatives at least one or two smart poor people out of a nation of 67m getting a good education is better than none.
This discussion has been closed.