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This conclusion from Opinium’s Curtis must be right – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,004
edited June 2022 in General
This conclusion from Opinium’s Curtis must be right – politicalbetting.com

Obviously the margins around this are massive. But I think the central estimate, if Johnson remains as leader, must now be that the Tories lose their majority at the next election.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,378
    first
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Gray solves nothing
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140
    Don't know why Tory MPs are yelling 'more' at top of their voices, that was a fecking terrible performance from Johnson.
  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Drinking and debauchery - blackford
  • Options
    RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 2,976

    Don't know why Tory MPs are yelling 'more' at top of their voices, that was a fecking terrible performance from Johnson.

    The Tory party bubble. They think we love this stuff
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,703
    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



  • Options
    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Gullis

    Eeurgh
  • Options
    edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,141
    edited May 2022
    What do we reckon the central estimate is if the Tories change their leader? I reckon about the same?

    Like they could get someone better but the rules say the maddest third of the parliamentary party can get their guy in front of the membership, and the membership are liable to pick that guy.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,578
    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    The official photographer captures the moment the PM and Chancellor broke the law.

  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,835
    Not exactly the Ministry of Sound on a Saturday night, is it?
  • Options
    londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,174
    There are three key issues for the general public now:

    Cost of living
    Cost of living and ...

    Cost of living.

    This is what the government wil be judged on now as we move to the GE.

    But do LAB really have any answers?
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,901
    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    Boris still attacking Labour on putting up our taxes to the highest since the fifties. Incredible. 🫣
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,835

    There are three key issues for the general public now:

    Cost of living
    Cost of living and ...

    Cost of living.

    This is what the government wil be judged on now as we move to the GE.

    But do LAB really have any answers?

    Inflation at 9%, over a year, is a cost of around £200bn to the economy.

    There’s very little that government can do, which isn’t simply tinkering around the margins.

    Serious relief - such as cutting income tax 10pp, raising all benefit payments by the same, reductions in fuel duty or VAT - each involve borrowing tens of billions of pounds which need to be repaid in the future.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,703

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    The official photographer captures the moment the PM and Chancellor broke the law.

    Another thing: it actually looks like they are Social Distancing. At work

    These photos are so dismally pathetic there is a possibility they will backfire. They actually make me feel sorry for the Downing Street staff, and the PM. The pitiful cheap sandwiches. The nasty Lidl orange juice

    Starmer is wise to go on the Cost of Living
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140

    There are three key issues for the general public now:

    Cost of living
    Cost of living and ...

    Cost of living.

    This is what the government wil be judged on now as we move to the GE.

    But do LAB really have any answers?

    Public sector strikes will also be an issue soon. RMT are kicking the ball off this June.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,068
    Leon said:

    I can't believe the Prime Minister has the sheer effrontery to remain in office when there is now a photo, in the public domain, of him standing eating a sad meal 2 metres from the Chancellor, and all of this right next to a table, during the working day! - a table, no less, on which you can clearly see a plastic jug three-quarters-filled with cheap orange juice

    There is no end to the squalor and the lies. AND THE DEBAUCHERY

    They had a social gathering when they'd made it illegal for anyone else to do so. And then they lied about it.

    You've got no self-respect for yourself if you tolerate that.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,703

    Leon said:

    I can't believe the Prime Minister has the sheer effrontery to remain in office when there is now a photo, in the public domain, of him standing eating a sad meal 2 metres from the Chancellor, and all of this right next to a table, during the working day! - a table, no less, on which you can clearly see a plastic jug three-quarters-filled with cheap orange juice

    There is no end to the squalor and the lies. AND THE DEBAUCHERY

    They had a social gathering when they'd made it illegal for anyone else to do so. And then they lied about it.

    You've got no self-respect for yourself if you tolerate that.
    lol. We can all see the photos
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    William Wragg wields the knife.

    There’s a far better government to be cut from this Conservative parliamentary party than they are currently giving the country.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,835

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,580

    There are three key issues for the general public now:

    Cost of living
    Cost of living and ...

    Cost of living.

    This is what the government wil be judged on now as we move to the GE.

    But do LAB really have any answers?

    That link I posted earlier before the report came out - it is highly germane: Martin Lewis of moneysavingexpert.com has shifted from (as I recall) advice on such things as savings and avoiding being ripped off to emergency first aid for the poor's finances - and losing.

    https://www.theguardian.com/money/2022/may/25/im-begging-the-government-to-listen-martin-lewis-on-getting-political-mental-health-and-the-cost-of-living-crisis
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140
    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



  • Options
    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,287
    Just caught a snatch of PMQs. Did I really hear Boris booming about 'Vladimir Corbyn'?
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,901
    edited May 2022

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    Lol, he's salaried, he takes photos of everything. They didn't bring him in especially.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,580
    Leon said:

    I can't believe the Prime Minister has the sheer effrontery to remain in office when there is now a photo, in the public domain, of him standing eating a sad meal 2 metres from the Chancellor, and all of this right next to a table, during the working day! - a table, no less, on which you can clearly see a plastic jug three-quarters-filled with cheap orange juice

    There is no end to the squalor and the lies. AND THE DEBAUCHERY

    I don't recall the students who were fined thousands of pounds being convicted for providing Nyetimber.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,897
    Just heard from my fiancee that our daughter has delivered her verdict on Boris.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,427
    Most speakers wouldn't have allowed that question from the Tory MP for Hartlepool because the PM doesn't have responsibility for Labour policy.
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I can't believe the Prime Minister has the sheer effrontery to remain in office when there is now a photo, in the public domain, of him standing eating a sad meal 2 metres from the Chancellor, and all of this right next to a table, during the working day! - a table, no less, on which you can clearly see a plastic jug three-quarters-filled with cheap orange juice

    There is no end to the squalor and the lies. AND THE DEBAUCHERY

    They had a social gathering when they'd made it illegal for anyone else to do so. And then they lied about it.

    You've got no self-respect for yourself if you tolerate that.
    lol. We can all see the photos
    No. I don’t think we have seen all 500 yet as Boris promised us.

    And there may also be more than the documented 500 in the pipeline. Boris in the wig at the ABBA nite is going to be a hoot - far funnier than his swastika style toastings every night through lockdown.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,580
    Pulpstar said:

    Just heard from my fiancee that our daughter has delivered her verdict on Boris.

    In a disposable or washable nappy?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,703

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,901

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    Yes, agreed. 100%. And absolutely hold every MP who voted in favour to account. Thats the crime here, not a packet of plastic sarnies
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,901
    edited May 2022
    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Its very odd. Almost like the reporting ans the police investigation aren't compatible.
    Who do you trust more is the question
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,935
    edited May 2022
    After 10 years in power most parties lose power, the only party which didn't in the last 100 years was Major's Tories in 1992. However the Tories only switched from Thatcher to Major when there was clear polling evidence a Major or Heseltine led Tory Party leading Kinnock Labour while a Thatcher led Tories trailed Labour. There is no polling evidence yet any alternative Tory leader would lead Starmer Labour and until there is then Boris stays
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2022

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    That isn't really true. the sitting on the park bench was an absurb abuse of power by the plod and widely condemned at the time, but in general the plod policy was to only target organised large scale events and normally repeat offenders e.g. businesses like gyms who just refused to close, organised raves etc. Most minor breaches were told to that's a breach move on. Even Piers Corbyn didn't get done everytime he broke the rules.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140
    Andy_JS said:

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    That's exactly what I think. All the fines and convictions should be cancelled.
    As one of the Telegraph columnists is saying today, it is all very well saying that these events were very minor with people who worked with each other and very little risk etc etc, but at the very same time he was banned from playing golf - which is a stroll around in the open air.

  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,703
    Andy_JS said:

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    That's exactly what I think. All the fines and convictions should be cancelled.
    Yes, me too

    Cancel ALL the fines. This is laughable

    The government should be apologising for the stupid, complex, irrational, and unenforceable lockdown laws - and Labour should be apologising for wanting even more of them.

    The state of those sandwiches. Pff
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    I agree with you there Leon, in fact the whole of the country and all the MET apart from the investigation team don’t understand how they got the VPN for that one and not the nights of revelry and debouchery Boris arranged and attended.

    Sunak merely so unlucky… unless you believe in conspiracy theory
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,901
    On topic.
    Not the bravest prediction ever.
  • Options
    RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 2,976
    Downing Street WAS TOO BIG
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    edited May 2022

    Andy_JS said:

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    That's exactly what I think. All the fines and convictions should be cancelled.
    As one of the Telegraph columnists is saying today, it is all very well saying that these events were very minor with people who worked with each other and very little risk etc etc, but at the very same time he was banned from playing golf - which is a stroll around in the open air.

    The rules were totally illogical, but also politics involved. Remember the outcry that game shooting was allowed at one point. Golf should clearly have been allowed (clubhouse closed), but it would have been portrayed as middle class people getting a free pass.
  • Options
    MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    edited May 2022

    There are three key issues for the general public now:

    Cost of living
    Cost of living and ...

    Cost of living.

    This is what the government wil be judged on now as we move to the GE.

    But do LAB really have any answers?

    All parties are committed to Net Zero.

    In the short term (10-years?) that only means more impoverishment and more sacrifices until renewables actually deliver plentiful cheap energy or someone comes up with a new technology. The price of energy now tells us renewables are woefully, woefully short of that target.

    The field's wide open to someone that wants to lift the hard target of 2050. For someone who wants to take their time. Wide open.


  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    1m
    Classic Boris. Accepts full responsibility. Then begins to explain why he wasn’t responsible…
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,625
    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Martin Reynolds subsequently sent an email at 09.34 to a number of No10 staff,
    including the No 10 Permanent Secretary for Covid and the Pandemic Response,
    Simon Case, and the No 10 Private Secretaries, saying "For the PM's birthday
    today we are having sandwiches and cake in the Cabinet room so do come along
    and wish the PM happy birthday."

    Looks like the written organisation in advance was the problem for this one. From plods point of view easy evidence outweighs the varying severity.

    Despite the organisation I think fines unnecessary on this one, but should have been given for others.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,068
    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Read the report. People were invited and specifically gathered, solely for the purpose of celebrating the PMs birthday.

    No-one else in the country was allowed to do that.

    It's the planning and the discussion around the planning that is most damming. They knew what they are doing beyond the regulations and they were only concerned with getting away with it.
  • Options
    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,987
    edited May 2022
    FPT

    Applicant said:

    dixiedean said:

    Wragg throws a curveball.

    William Wragg. Jesus!!!!!!

    And for the benefit of those of us who can't watch/listen?
    Complains that the Cabinet Secretary and Government Director of Propriety and Ethics were suddenly banned from attending his Public Administration committee. Wonders which of the subjects the committee wanted to raise were a concern for the Prime Minister:
    "Undeclared loans and donations in kind, security insights into appointments to the House of Lords, or indeed the consultation of the propriety and ethics unit into ministerial appointments"
    And the PM responds that Wragg is an idealist!

    It's better to be a pragmatic liar.
  • Options
    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    The Police have shown themselves to sometimes be contemptible for many years sometimes, and far too trigger happy when given authoritah to abuse.

    Thankfully in this nation its bollocks like FPNs over sitting at a park bench, or walking for more than an hour, or having carton sandwiches and a beer for your lunch rather than US style trigger happy with guns instead.

    If this is the threshold for getting fined it reinforces the view already pre-existing both generally (Hillsborough, Sarah Everard vigil etc) and politically (Plebgate) that the Police are not fit for purpose.

    We should be removing the right of the Police to issue FPNs in the first place. Not specifically for politicians but for everyone. If a crime has been committed, let that be proven in a court of law following due process, not having Police acting as judge, jury and executioner.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Martin Reynolds subsequently sent an email at 09.34 to a number of No10 staff,
    including the No 10 Permanent Secretary for Covid and the Pandemic Response,
    Simon Case, and the No 10 Private Secretaries, saying "For the PM's birthday
    today we are having sandwiches and cake in the Cabinet room so do come along
    and wish the PM happy birthday."

    Looks like the written organisation in advance was the problem for this one. From plods point of view easy evidence outweighs the varying severity.

    Despite the organisation I think fines unnecessary on this one, but should have been given for others.
    Also clearly "not necessary for work".

    At a stretch of PC plod's mind one might see how they could say that the "leaving do" parties were actually part of essential work.
  • Options
    RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 2,976
    This isn’t really a sincere apology, is it? Doesn’t the PM set the tone and culture? Does he not appoint some of his key staff or advisors?
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,068
    MISTY said:

    There are three key issues for the general public now:

    Cost of living
    Cost of living and ...

    Cost of living.

    This is what the government wil be judged on now as we move to the GE.

    But do LAB really have any answers?

    All parties are committed to Net Zero.

    In the short term (10-years?) that only means more impoverishment and more sacrifices until renewables actually deliver plentiful cheap energy or someone comes up with a new technology. The price of energy now tells us renewables are woefully, woefully short of that target.

    The field's wide open to someone that wants to lift the hard target of 2050. For someone who wants to take their time. Wide open.
    Renewables are our best hope of escaping high fossil fuel prices.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,897
    It was the ban on angling that I thought the most bizarre. That and the fact my parents couldn't play golf with errm.. each other..
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140

    This isn’t really a sincere apology, is it? Doesn’t the PM set the tone and culture? Does he not appoint some of his key staff or advisors?

    Of course he wont apologise.

    He never, ever does.

    Up to Tory MPs now and I expect them to be all over TV news tonight saying that we should "wait for the Standards Committee"
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,160
    Hang on. Bonzo is "correcting the record" about "how I addressed this house".

    So a confession that he *did* mislead. But its a whoops I had no idea I was misleading.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,835

    Andy_JS said:

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    That's exactly what I think. All the fines and convictions should be cancelled.
    As one of the Telegraph columnists is saying today, it is all very well saying that these events were very minor with people who worked with each other and very little risk etc etc, but at the very same time he was banned from playing golf - which is a stroll around in the open air.

    I wonder what the offices of Fleet St looked like at the time…?
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140
    "I am humbled" says Johnson in the most insincere manner he can muster.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,901

    Hang on. Bonzo is "correcting the record" about "how I addressed this house".

    So a confession that he *did* mislead. But its a whoops I had no idea I was misleading.

    Lol, emergency reverse ferret handbrake turn
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,703

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Read the report. People were invited and specifically gathered, solely for the purpose of celebrating the PMs birthday.

    No-one else in the country was allowed to do that.

    It's the planning and the discussion around the planning that is most damming. They knew what they are doing beyond the regulations and they were only concerned with getting away with it.

    “It's the planning and the discussion around the planning that is most damming. They knew what they are doing beyond the regulations and they were only concerned with getting away with it.”

    You’re right. It must have been years in the planning. The odious, devious swine. And I can just hear their evil cackles, like hyenas on crack, as they realised that, unlike the pathetic proles locked in their homes, they had almost certainly gotten away with THIS:





  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,242

    This isn’t really a sincere apology, is it? Doesn’t the PM set the tone and culture? Does he not appoint some of his key staff or advisors?

    It is difficult to listen to and I suspect his mps will be underwhelmed
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140

    Hang on. Bonzo is "correcting the record" about "how I addressed this house".

    So a confession that he *did* mislead. But its a whoops I had no idea I was misleading.

    He can only be done for misleading if he did it with "intent" iirc.

  • Options

    Hang on. Bonzo is "correcting the record" about "how I addressed this house".

    So a confession that he *did* mislead. But its a whoops I had no idea I was misleading.

    It has always been acceptable for politicians to correct the record to the house, Keir Starmer had to the other day after he "accidentally misled" the House; it is deliberately misleading that is against the rules.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929
    edited May 2022
    Barnesian said:

    FPT

    Applicant said:

    dixiedean said:

    Wragg throws a curveball.

    William Wragg. Jesus!!!!!!

    And for the benefit of those of us who can't watch/listen?
    Complains that the Cabinet Secretary and Government Director of Propriety and Ethics were suddenly banned from attending his Public Administration committee. Wonders which of the subjects the committee wanted to raise were a concern for the Prime Minister:
    "Undeclared loans and donations in kind, security insights into appointments to the House of Lords, or indeed the consultation of the propriety and ethics unit into ministerial appointments"
    And the PM responds that Wragg is an idealist!

    It's better to be a pragmatic liar.
    In a tone soaked in the utmost contempt for him and his kind.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,707
    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 24,932

    Hang on. Bonzo is "correcting the record" about "how I addressed this house".

    So a confession that he *did* mislead. But its a whoops I had no idea I was misleading.

    It has always been acceptable for politicians to correct the record to the house, Keir Starmer had to the other day after he "accidentally misled" the House; it is deliberately misleading that is against the rules.
    Which Bozo did but is now trying to hide by pretending to "correct the record"
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,274
    I wonder if Sunak is regretting not taking his chance to knife Boris?
  • Options
    BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Read the report. People were invited and specifically gathered, solely for the purpose of celebrating the PMs birthday.

    No-one else in the country was allowed to do that.

    It's the planning and the discussion around the planning that is most damming. They knew what they are doing beyond the regulations and they were only concerned with getting away with it.

    “It's the planning and the discussion around the planning that is most damming. They knew what they are doing beyond the regulations and they were only concerned with getting away with it.”

    You’re right. It must have been years in the planning. The odious, devious swine. And I can just hear their evil cackles, like hyenas on crack, as they realised that, unlike the pathetic proles locked in their homes, they had almost certainly gotten away with THIS:





    I'm glad we let twitter and the media be judge, jury and executioner on this one.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,955
    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    It’s a nice thought, but the police should be operationally independent from politicians. They can change the law, however.
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415

    This isn’t really a sincere apology, is it? Doesn’t the PM set the tone and culture? Does he not appoint some of his key staff or advisors?

    It is difficult to listen to and I suspect his mps will be underwhelmed
    I’m going to chat to my dad for his opinion. After todays live look into the commons I think they are going to go for a vonc wether they can win it or not. Boris is just not improving, the government is just not improving, the record they will all need to fight defend their seats on us just not improving. It’s not necessarily partygate, it’s the PM and his government look like losers now, that’s why the VONC is happening.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,707
    The Smarkets market that Mike mentioned in previous header has now flip-flopped.
  • Options
    ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    I wouldn't necessarily argue with that.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,095

    "I am humbled" says Johnson in the most insincere manner he can muster.

    He needs to be humbled out of Downing Street by the Tory MPs.
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,160

    Hang on. Bonzo is "correcting the record" about "how I addressed this house".

    So a confession that he *did* mislead. But its a whoops I had no idea I was misleading.

    It has always been acceptable for politicians to correct the record to the house, Keir Starmer had to the other day after he "accidentally misled" the House; it is deliberately misleading that is against the rules.
    Yes it is acceptable. What the house will now investigate is whether it was inadvertent or not.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,707
    Johnson 2022 exit date now out to 3.7. Was 2.9 earlier today.
  • Options
    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    Right attitude in general, but wrong course of action, the PM should never be putting pressure on the Police either way.

    The law should be amended though to remove these powers from the Police. Let the Courts act as judges, no the Police.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,140

    "I am humbled" says Johnson in the most insincere manner he can muster.

    He needs to be humbled out of Downing Street by the Tory MPs.
    Pretty silent on tory backbench during Starmer's speech.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,964
    Predicting he'll go is like Vince Cable predicting seven of the last two recessions.
  • Options
    ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379
    Andy_JS said:

    Most speakers wouldn't have allowed that question from the Tory MP for Hartlepool because the PM doesn't have responsibility for Labour policy.

    Since there is no LOTO Questions, when is the Opposition's policy supposed to be scrutinised?
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,707
    RobD said:

    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    It’s a nice thought, but the police should be operationally independent from politicians. They can change the law, however.
    Yes but it would be an astute political move and would get Johnson on the front foot again.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,211

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Read the report. People were invited and specifically gathered, solely for the purpose of celebrating the PMs birthday.

    No-one else in the country was allowed to do that.

    It's the planning and the discussion around the planning that is most damming. They knew what they are doing beyond the regulations and they were only concerned with getting away with it.

    “It's the planning and the discussion around the planning that is most damming. They knew what they are doing beyond the regulations and they were only concerned with getting away with it.”

    You’re right. It must have been years in the planning. The odious, devious swine. And I can just hear their evil cackles, like hyenas on crack, as they realised that, unlike the pathetic proles locked in their homes, they had almost certainly gotten away with THIS:





    I'm glad we let twitter and the media be judge, jury and executioner on this one.
    It's "Judge Judy and Executioner" - please get it right.

    For The Greater Good.
  • Options
    I'm watching about 20 minutes behind, so Boris is still speaking, but how often has Boris used the word "humble" or "humbled" in this statement?

    Every other word at some points seems to be humble or humbled.
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,160
    Stocky said:

    RobD said:

    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    It’s a nice thought, but the police should be operationally independent from politicians. They can change the law, however.
    Yes but it would be an astute political move and would get Johnson on the front foot again.
    Astute? It would be an appalling piece of government corruption of the rule of law and independence of the judicial process.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,200
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    If your logic is that these photos show nothing much went on and it all looks harmless and risk free, then you should also support all covid FPNs and fines being cancelled immediately and the money handed back.

    Because the vast majority were for similarly ridiculous transgressions of stupid rules and science-free nonsense.

    Sitting on a park bench for starters.



    That's exactly what I think. All the fines and convictions should be cancelled.
    Yes, me too

    Cancel ALL the fines. This is laughable

    The government should be apologising for the stupid, complex, irrational, and unenforceable lockdown laws - and Labour should be apologising for wanting even more of them.

    The state of those sandwiches. Pff
    It gets worse. I can confirm that chicken and avocado sandwiches have gone up by 20p in both Pret and M&S Food.
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    Sue Gray has punctured the gaseous sanctimonious pomposity of Zepplin Starmer, according to Boris.
  • Options
    ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Drinking and debauchery - blackford

    How dare they have these insane booze-soaked, coke and Ecstasy fuelled, pet-play hookers-on-trampolines midget sex Korean dwarf ice skating free love dope-on-motorbike orgies when the rest of us were….

    Oh.



    Fpt
    And not even a cheeky korma or Mary Foy doing high kicks
    They hired a photographer on tax payer expense to take that photo.

    Great VFM 🤭
    There’s a formal photographer on staff at No.10, as well as a couple of social media people who take photos and videos. They document the work of the PM and 10DS team.
    Yes.

    What a service to the nation providing police with the evidence needed, proving PM and his chancellor are law breakers.
    What law is being broken in those photos? I can't see it

    I am honestly attempting - perhaps failing - to look at these latest photos with neutral eyes. And to me it looks very much like a boring workplace lunch, at a stressful time: everyone has their tablets out and the rest. They are in the middle of work

    Then someone remembered it was the PM's birthday and they got a six pack of warm beer from Aldi along with the shite orange juice, and during the lunch he raised his can of beer and said Thanks and Carry on. Then went glumly back to his takeaway plastic carton of salad

    It does not look illegal. It does not look unreasonable. I don't think, purely on the basis of the photos, that he broke the law in this instance.

    Did Sunak actually get fined for this? Absurd
    Read the report. People were invited and specifically gathered, solely for the purpose of celebrating the PMs birthday.

    No-one else in the country was allowed to do that.

    People who already worked together. It's insane that this was illegal.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,929

    I'm watching about 20 minutes behind, so Boris is still speaking, but how often has Boris used the word "humble" or "humbled" in this statement?

    Every other word at some points seems to be humble or humbled.

    Just as I read that he said it again live.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,707
    edited May 2022

    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    Right attitude in general, but wrong course of action, the PM should never be putting pressure on the Police either way.

    The law should be amended though to remove these powers from the Police. Let the Courts act as judges, no the Police.
    Not put pressure - just make the suggestion. If Durham police don't issue Starmer with a FPN (which I think is extremely likely) then there will be a hint out there that leniency has won the day thanks to Johnson. If the police do issue Starmer with a FPN then Starmer has resigned needlessly, absurdly even.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,897
    Applicant said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Most speakers wouldn't have allowed that question from the Tory MP for Hartlepool because the PM doesn't have responsibility for Labour policy.

    Since there is no LOTO Questions, when is the Opposition's policy supposed to be scrutinised?
    Well, not at PMQs. Clue is in the name.
  • Options
    RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 27,160
    Wowsers. This response by Bonzo to Starmer. "Sir Beer Korma".

    He really is the victim here.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,200
    Jesus fucking H&M Christ when I think of all the stick from PB posters that was handed out to people who railed against lockdowns AT THE TIME not afterwards when able more sensibly to contemplate these things, all the curtain twitchers, all the better to be safe than sorry lines, I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 46,703
    I'm calling it. These photos will save Boris

    Like 90% of the country, when I heard they had a "birthday party" for Boris, I was quite hacked off. Fucking wankers. And there I was walking around Richmond Park in the sleet wondering if I was allowed to sit on a bench with my single friend

    But these photos do not, to put it mildly, reveal what I envisaged when I heard the phrase "birthday party". Especially one that had been "carefully planned and arranged". I expected music and party poppers and loads of booze and some champagne corks and the rest.

    Instead, a glum PM munches his Tesco Value cous-cous, standing up. 2 metres away the Chancellor smiles as he LEANS ON A CHAIR. Tuna sandwiches wilt. The cheap orange juice goes undrunk. Risible

  • Options
    RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 2,976
    Beer Korma. Christ
  • Options
    FarooqFarooq Posts: 10,775
    Applicant said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Most speakers wouldn't have allowed that question from the Tory MP for Hartlepool because the PM doesn't have responsibility for Labour policy.

    Since there is no LOTO Questions, when is the Opposition's policy supposed to be scrutinised?
    It's called an election.
  • Options
    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,287
    RobD said:

    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    It’s a nice thought, but the police should be operationally independent from politicians. They can change the law, however.
    Perhaps Boris can declare that all the Covid laws were a heinous blunder, and then pass a new law giving himself a pardon and a retrospective innocence. That would completely take the wind out of his critics' sails!
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,625

    I'm watching about 20 minutes behind, so Boris is still speaking, but how often has Boris used the word "humble" or "humbled" in this statement?

    Every other word at some points seems to be humble or humbled.

    And what he actually means is not he is humble but he is annoyed he has to deal with this and does not give a damn what anyone thinks about it as long we let him continue to be PM.
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    Stocky said:

    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    Right attitude in general, but wrong course of action, the PM should never be putting pressure on the Police either way.

    The law should be amended though to remove these powers from the Police. Let the Courts act as judges, no the Police.
    Not put pressure - just make the suggestion. If Durham police don't issue Starmer with a FPN (which I think is extremely likely) then there will be a hint out there that leniency has won the day thanks to Johnson. If the police do issue Starmer with a FPN then Starmer has resigned needlessly, absurdly even.
    Which is why it'd be immoral and wrong for the PM to get involved. The PM has no right or responsibility to be exerting lenience or pressure on criminal investigations and to do so either way in political ones is even worse. That is the action of banana republics, not free democracies.

    If there's an issue with the law (there is) fix the law, don't interfere in Police operations.
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,707

    Stocky said:

    RobD said:

    Stocky said:

    It's about time Johnson put an end to this absurdity. He has an opportunity to do so now.

    He should say: "I have contacted Durham police and suggested that they cease the investigation into Kier Starmer potentially breaking Covid laws. We need to move on from the pandemic now; in a positive and optimistic way and stop blaming each other and trying to score political points. No leader of a political party should feel obliged to resign from office due to the issuing of a fixed penalty notice".

    It’s a nice thought, but the police should be operationally independent from politicians. They can change the law, however.
    Yes but it would be an astute political move and would get Johnson on the front foot again.
    Astute? It would be an appalling piece of government corruption of the rule of law and independence of the judicial process.
    And Starmer's insistence that the Met should investigate Johnson is OK?
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,044
    Might these photos help Boris? Taking attention away from where the serious breaches were?
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