Undefined discussion subject.

alex_ said:

Charles said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

God, I hate it when the aristos tell the plebs what to do.

https://twitter.com/labour_history/status/1293263729665159169

I’ve paid both rent and a mortgage. Does that make me a pleb in your eyes?

Pokey one bed apartment in the East Wing?

kinabalu said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Nigelb said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

Nigelb said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

USA Dem VP slot -- Susan Rice now odds-on on Betfair. Many of the rags laid off the boards.

Susan Rice: 1.7
Kamala Harris: 2.92
Val Demings: 19
Gretchen Whitmer: 20
Elizabeth Warren: 26
Michelle Obama: 30
Tammy Duckworth: 30
Hillary Clinton: 65

Leak, or jumping too soon to conclusions ?

(FWIW, I’ve covered both options.)

Rice is bouncing around between odds-on and odds-against the same way Kamala Harris was a few days ago. My guess is people are actively adjusting their positions according to what they think will happen. If it were a leak, if someone thought they knew, they'd just take the lot, and that is not happening.

That’s my gut feel.

But like everyone else, I don’t know anything.

I suppose the rational thing to do might be to look at the other candidates if we assume it is a false market on the front two, but can we assume that? Tbh I am thinking of greening up just so I can stop looking at this market and get some sleep!

Kamala Harris is now odds-on favourite again. The market is changing faster than I can copy-(reformat)-paste.

If it helps about a year ago I had a quite intense vision of "President Harris" landing in the UK on airforce one. It was a windy day and her hair was a problem as she descended. And that was it. The vision ended there. No idea what year it was or the purpose of the visit.

Charles said:

rottenborough said:

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1293238349671604224

From the article...

The truth was far more mundane. A few protesters among the many thousands appear to have burned a single Bible — and possibly a second — for kindling to start a bigger fire. None of the other protesters seemed to notice or care.

So conservatives criticised protestors for burning the Bible because... drum roll... they burned a Bible.

But it's a "Russian Hit!!!!!!" because, presumably, this is seen as a way of drawing the sting from a legitimate criticism.



edit: and in what way is "using a Bible as kindling for a bigger fire" any different to "burning a Bible"?

contrarian said:

kinabalu said:

contrarian said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

contrarian said:

Theuniondivvie said:

contrarian said:

CarlottaVance said:

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Not so different.....

https://twitter.com/martinmccluskey/status/1293218977502703616?s=20

Yeah, we just seem to be reasonably immune from a need to vote for parties that espouse ant-immigrant & anti-refugee rhetoric, eg UKIP, TBP and the Tory party. Still, let's see if the linesman can build up some momentum with the gypsy traveller schtick.

Absolutely! No "othering" in Scottish politics! No "blaming another country" for Scotland's failings. You must be so proud!

No 'othering' after Yousef's law BY law....! - or prison!

Still, you get to keep your hands. For now.

Ah, I see the Muslim thing is one of your many triggers.

Anything rather defend a gagging blasphemy law eh?

Do you still defend coked up racists using the word P*kis?

Absolutely not but I do defend people who might like to criticise and satirize islam and its prophet should they so wish, along with christianity, buddhism, humanism, and the attitudes of the left, right, and every other belief out there.

What about people who spend every waking hour "criticizing and satirizing" Islam?

Personally I can;t stand people who spend their lives picking holes in the Koran or what the prophet did or didn;t do with his time or whatever. What a bunch of useless saddos. Nobody listens to them or gives a toss.

Should they be prosecuted for that? Put in prison? no. They can try to find fault with religions in stupid inconsequential ways if they want. Its their own time they are wasting. Nobody else's.

Pulpstar said:

And a win of 38 pence on the VP market !
Apologies for anyone who followed my steer.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Pulpstar said:

And a win of 38 pence on the VP market !
Apologies for anyone who followed my steer.

Before or after the premium charge?

fox327 said:

ydoethur said:

Carnyx said:

MikeL said:

Next year they'll say it's not fair to have lower grades than this year - especially as those children will also have had their work interrupted by virus.

So you're then in a position of prizes for everyone and a completely meaningless exam system.

That then means employers just set their own tests to determine who really is capable.

Youy're forgetting that the results still rank people, and there are dates on the certificates.

Either the system will revert to the pre-virus procedures and no comparable special treatment, which is rough justice of sorts but a special case (as, it must be said, so much else to do with the virus). Or the system needs to be reviewed in its approach to grading. It will be very interesting to see what the promised review in Scotland does.

Option B.

The point is that this has shown with brutal clarity that the people running our exam systems are morons.

Now those of us who have worked for them - as I have - and seen their incompetence up close knew that already.

But as of this moment, everyone knows are exams are controlled by people who cannot manage simple quality control processes or basic statistics.

How does that affect the credibility of exams going forward? Hint - not positively.

So I do not see how either OFQUAL or the SQA or indeed the direct exam boards survive this fiasco. They already looked shaky enough even before today’s announcement (and given the way England’s results are set up, I am 99% sure Williamson will have to follow suit here).

That might well be a good thing. But it does depend on what replaces them.

There is no good way out of this now. The schools stayed open for key workers's children. They could have stayed open for examinations as well, possibly by hiring extra premises and retired teachers. No attempt was made to do this by the government, and all the consequences for the examination system flow from this fact. Also, students' coursework could have been externally marked instead of being marked by their own teachers. This government put responding to the COVID crisis above everything else, including educational standards, and they are about to reap the consequences.

A new set of qualifications will be probably needed in a few years time as the current school examinations are now likely to become irrevocably degraded by grade inflation.

How was grade inflation avoided for so many years in the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s and the early 1980s? I suspect that exam boards were relatively free of political interference and regulations. Perhaps schools would now be better off with the International Baccalaureate which is run in such a way as to prioritise academic standards. This however will not be allowed as government intervention in schools will only increase. It is funny that the more government interference in education there is, the lower the academic standards become.

Charles said:

Nigelb said:

An important debate (FWIW I’m in favour of a challenge trial):

https://twitter.com/angie_rasmussen/status/1293263923022503936

I don’t see how you can ethically* implement a target species challenge trial though given the severity of the disease. I think you’ve got to go down the route of a placebo controlled trial

* meant in the technical sense rather than a personal comment.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Harris I fear gives the Bernie bros an excuse to sit out the election and let Trump win a second term.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Mexicanpete said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

God, I hate it when the aristos tell the plebs what to do.

https://twitter.com/labour_history/status/1293263729665159169

I think I saw what you did there.

Being poorly educated I am still however debating the following conundrum:

Plain old Neil Kinnock being lectured by Lord Stansgate.

OR

Plain old Tony Benn being lectured by Lord Kinnock.

Well I'm the King of subtlety and nuance.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Harris I fear gives the Bernie bros an excuse to sit out the election and let Trump win a second term.

Nigelb said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Harris I fear gives the Bernie bros an excuse to sit out the election and let Trump win a second term.

As opposed to Rice ?

And I don’t buy that thesis anyway.
Biden will be running on the most progressive Democratic platform ever. Against the biggest asshole to hold the Presidency since Jackson.

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Not so different.....

https://twitter.com/martinmccluskey/status/1293218977502703616?s=20

Yeah, we just seem to be reasonably immune from a need to vote for parties that espouse ant-immigrant & anti-refugee rhetoric, eg UKIP, TBP and the Tory party. Still, let's see if the linesman can build up some momentum with the gypsy traveller schtick.

Absolutely! No "othering" in Scottish politics! No "blaming another country" for Scotland's failings. You must be so proud!

Aye, the 'UKIP, Farage and Brexit were vastly important elements in the nation's history' merchants always seem to fall silent when they're reminded that Scotland didn't vote for any of them. I am quite proud of that as it happens.

Nigelb said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Harris I fear gives the Bernie bros an excuse to sit out the election and let Trump win a second term.

As opposed to Rice ?

And I don’t buy that thesis anyway.
Biden will be running on the most progressive Democratic platform ever. Against the biggest asshole to hold the Presidency since Jackson.

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

another_richard said:

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

malcolmg said:

Carnyx said:

CarlottaVance said:

The Scot Greens caved! Who saw that coming?

https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/1293223482273259529?s=20

Massie is finding it unreasonable that a party focussed heavily on the student demographic should focus also on its concerns. Rather odd of him.

The SNP administration is a minority one, pace those PBers who go berserk about alleged one-party states. So of course the Greens claim the credit. It's not as if the SCUP MSPs would vote to help the SNP at all, still less the SLAB ones (on the Bain Principle), and I'm not sure what the LDs think except SNP bad.

Massie is a unionist lickspittle, he could not be objective if it hit him on the face. Everything SNP or independence is bad to him, the fanny likes cricket, what can I say.

Is it possible, would you say, to support Scottish independence AND like cricket?

I have not in practice come across this particular combination but my circle is not wide these days.

Jimmy Reid, trade unionist and variously Communist, Labour member & supporter of Scottish Independence, was a big cricket fan.

Edit: I note it was the 10th anniversary of his death yesterday. His funeral service was attended by Ed Balls, Ed Miliband, Gordon Brown, Alex Salmond, Sir Alex Ferguson and Sir Billy Connolly, not a bad haul changing reputations notwithstanding.

My dad - even during his working class uncle tom tory phase - was a massive fan of Jimmy Reid.

"If all communists were like that I'd consider it."

Still remember him saying that.

As I remember Jimmy Reid was rather scathing about Arthur.

Which would have endeared him all the more to my dad. He hated - and I mean hated - Scargill. Still does. The miners strike was intense in our house. Got a bit traumatic at times.

Don't think McGahey was that keen on Arthur either though he stayed on board during the battle.

Feisty times, used to go to my gran's for tea and get pummeled by my dad as a pinko enemy within, then go to a hostelry to get pummeled by the ultras for saying Arthur was fucking it up. Happy days..

Ha. Well my dad was management and running picket lines, my brother at 19 was on strike and on those lines, and they lived together. You can imagine.

Can indeed, classic Play for Today if there was still a PFT.
Maybe an R4 afternoon play in these reduced times?

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

another_richard said:

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

malcolmg said:

Carnyx said:

CarlottaVance said:

The Scot Greens caved! Who saw that coming?

https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/1293223482273259529?s=20

Massie is finding it unreasonable that a party focussed heavily on the student demographic should focus also on its concerns. Rather odd of him.

The SNP administration is a minority one, pace those PBers who go berserk about alleged one-party states. So of course the Greens claim the credit. It's not as if the SCUP MSPs would vote to help the SNP at all, still less the SLAB ones (on the Bain Principle), and I'm not sure what the LDs think except SNP bad.

Massie is a unionist lickspittle, he could not be objective if it hit him on the face. Everything SNP or independence is bad to him, the fanny likes cricket, what can I say.

Is it possible, would you say, to support Scottish independence AND like cricket?

I have not in practice come across this particular combination but my circle is not wide these days.

Jimmy Reid, trade unionist and variously Communist, Labour member & supporter of Scottish Independence, was a big cricket fan.

Edit: I note it was the 10th anniversary of his death yesterday. His funeral service was attended by Ed Balls, Ed Miliband, Gordon Brown, Alex Salmond, Sir Alex Ferguson and Sir Billy Connolly, not a bad haul changing reputations notwithstanding.

My dad - even during his working class uncle tom tory phase - was a massive fan of Jimmy Reid.

"If all communists were like that I'd consider it."

Still remember him saying that.

As I remember Jimmy Reid was rather scathing about Arthur.

Which would have endeared him all the more to my dad. He hated - and I mean hated - Scargill. Still does. The miners strike was intense in our house. Got a bit traumatic at times.

Don't think McGahey was that keen on Arthur either though he stayed on board during the battle.

Feisty times, used to go to my gran's for tea and get pummeled by my dad as a pinko enemy within, then go to a hostelry to get pummeled by the ultras for saying Arthur was fucking it up. Happy days..

Ha. Well my dad was management and running picket lines, my brother at 19 was on strike and on those lines, and they lived together. You can imagine.

Can indeed, classic Play for Today if there was still a PFT.
Maybe an R4 afternoon play in these reduced times?

☺ - Ok. I'll get writing!

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Not so different.....

https://twitter.com/martinmccluskey/status/1293218977502703616?s=20

Yeah, we just seem to be reasonably immune from a need to vote for parties that espouse ant-immigrant & anti-refugee rhetoric, eg UKIP, TBP and the Tory party. Still, let's see if the linesman can build up some momentum with the gypsy traveller schtick.

Absolutely! No "othering" in Scottish politics! No "blaming another country" for Scotland's failings. You must be so proud!

Aye, the 'UKIP, Farage and Brexit were vastly important elements in the nation's history' merchants always seem to fall silent when they're reminded that Scotland didn't vote for any of them. I am quite proud of that as it happens.

TimT said:

Charles said:

rottenborough said:

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1293238349671604224

From the article...

The truth was far more mundane. A few protesters among the many thousands appear to have burned a single Bible — and possibly a second — for kindling to start a bigger fire. None of the other protesters seemed to notice or care.

So conservatives criticised protestors for burning the Bible because... drum roll... they burned a Bible.

But it's a "Russian Hit!!!!!!" because, presumably, this is seen as a way of drawing the sting from a legitimate criticism.



edit: and in what way is "using a Bible as kindling for a bigger fire" any different to "burning a Bible"?

You are being disingenuous there, Charles. Clearly, using a Bible as kindling because it is to hand is qualitatively different from burning a Bible specifically in order to make a political or religious point. And one or two people burning a Bible for either reason and others not noticing is qualitatively different from deliberate, political Bible-burning being one of the defining themes of the protest.

Charles said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

God, I hate it when the aristos tell the plebs what to do.

https://twitter.com/labour_history/status/1293263729665159169

I’ve paid both rent and a mortgage. Does that make me a pleb in your eyes?

kle4 said:

CarlottaVance said:

Not so different.....

https://twitter.com/martinmccluskey/status/1293218977502703616?s=20

There's lots of things where it seems to be assumed the Scots are very different to the rest of the UK.

CorrectHorseBattery said:

https://twitter.com/spreadsheetben/status/1293285677577179140

CarlottaVance said:

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Not so different.....

https://twitter.com/martinmccluskey/status/1293218977502703616?s=20

Yeah, we just seem to be reasonably immune from a need to vote for parties that espouse ant-immigrant & anti-refugee rhetoric, eg UKIP, TBP and the Tory party. Still, let's see if the linesman can build up some momentum with the gypsy traveller schtick.

Absolutely! No "othering" in Scottish politics! No "blaming another country" for Scotland's failings. You must be so proud!

Aye, the 'UKIP, Farage and Brexit were vastly important elements in the nation's history' merchants always seem to fall silent when they're reminded that Scotland didn't vote for any of them. I am quite proud of that as it happens.

At least in the UK its a fringe, not a government.

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Stats for Lefties, AKA Propaganda for Lefties

https://twitter.com/LeftieStats/status/1293287031804747778

https://twitter.com/CorrectHorseB/status/1293287518692089856

kinabalu said:

contrarian said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

contrarian said:

Theuniondivvie said:

contrarian said:

CarlottaVance said:

Theuniondivvie said:

CarlottaVance said:

Not so different.....

https://twitter.com/martinmccluskey/status/1293218977502703616?s=20

Yeah, we just seem to be reasonably immune from a need to vote for parties that espouse ant-immigrant & anti-refugee rhetoric, eg UKIP, TBP and the Tory party. Still, let's see if the linesman can build up some momentum with the gypsy traveller schtick.

Absolutely! No "othering" in Scottish politics! No "blaming another country" for Scotland's failings. You must be so proud!

No 'othering' after Yousef's law BY law....! - or prison!

Still, you get to keep your hands. For now.

Ah, I see the Muslim thing is one of your many triggers.

Anything rather defend a gagging blasphemy law eh?

Do you still defend coked up racists using the word P*kis?

Absolutely not but I do defend people who might like to criticise and satirize islam and its prophet should they so wish, along with christianity, buddhism, humanism, and the attitudes of the left, right, and every other belief out there.

What about people who spend every waking hour "criticizing and satirizing" Islam?

rkrkrk said:

Nigelb said:

Charles said:

Nigelb said:

An important debate (FWIW I’m in favour of a challenge trial):

https://twitter.com/angie_rasmussen/status/1293263923022503936

I don’t see how you can ethically* implement a target species challenge trial though given the severity of the disease. I think you’ve got to go down the route of a placebo controlled trial

* meant in the technical sense rather than a personal comment.

Understood.
It’s not an easy decision, but IMO, if you have a cohort of young, properly informed volunteers, and the challenge dose is strictly limited, there is a very good case for it.

Is it really needed given the resurgence of COVID? Seems like should be possible to get enough infected anyway given resurgence in US and rapidly rising cases in much of developed world.

I'd argue that deliberately infecting with a disease we have little treatment for when there are exposed populations anyway is unethical, unless you can show that this really would speed things up dramatically.

EPG said:

Andy_JS said:

How come you can still make 1% profit on backing Harris, after Biden's announcement?

https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.168954647

Actuarial doesn't explain it.

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

Poor Wolves.

Especially as VAR missed the encroachment on the penalty.

CorrectHorseBattery said:

tlg86 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Stats for Lefties, AKA Propaganda for Lefties

https://twitter.com/LeftieStats/status/1293287031804747778

https://twitter.com/CorrectHorseB/status/1293287518692089856

Nigel Farage says hello...

I'm sure if we just argue for long enough eventually the Tories will agree with public ownership and ending austerity for good

Charles said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Charles said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Charles said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

God, I hate it when the aristos tell the plebs what to do.

https://twitter.com/labour_history/status/1293263729665159169

I’ve paid both rent and a mortgage. Does that make me a pleb in your eyes?

I too have paid both rent and a mortgage and I'm no pleb.

But the second Viscount Stansgate is definitely an aristo.

It’s a post Lloyd George peerage. No way he qualifies.

By the definition in my OED Benn was an aristo.

What’s your definition?

Benn had a hereditary peerage, sure, but the massive expansion of that class by Lloyd George and his successors substantially devalued their worth.

There are currently 814 hereditary peers in the U.K., of which about 700 are “post Lloyd George”

isam said:

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

another_richard said:

kinabalu said:

Theuniondivvie said:

kinabalu said:

malcolmg said:

Carnyx said:

CarlottaVance said:

The Scot Greens caved! Who saw that coming?

https://twitter.com/alexmassie/status/1293223482273259529?s=20

Massie is finding it unreasonable that a party focussed heavily on the student demographic should focus also on its concerns. Rather odd of him.

The SNP administration is a minority one, pace those PBers who go berserk about alleged one-party states. So of course the Greens claim the credit. It's not as if the SCUP MSPs would vote to help the SNP at all, still less the SLAB ones (on the Bain Principle), and I'm not sure what the LDs think except SNP bad.

Massie is a unionist lickspittle, he could not be objective if it hit him on the face. Everything SNP or independence is bad to him, the fanny likes cricket, what can I say.

Is it possible, would you say, to support Scottish independence AND like cricket?

I have not in practice come across this particular combination but my circle is not wide these days.

Jimmy Reid, trade unionist and variously Communist, Labour member & supporter of Scottish Independence, was a big cricket fan.

Edit: I note it was the 10th anniversary of his death yesterday. His funeral service was attended by Ed Balls, Ed Miliband, Gordon Brown, Alex Salmond, Sir Alex Ferguson and Sir Billy Connolly, not a bad haul changing reputations notwithstanding.

My dad - even during his working class uncle tom tory phase - was a massive fan of Jimmy Reid.

"If all communists were like that I'd consider it."

Still remember him saying that.

As I remember Jimmy Reid was rather scathing about Arthur.

Which would have endeared him all the more to my dad. He hated - and I mean hated - Scargill. Still does. The miners strike was intense in our house. Got a bit traumatic at times.

Don't think McGahey was that keen on Arthur either though he stayed on board during the battle.

Feisty times, used to go to my gran's for tea and get pummeled by my dad as a pinko enemy within, then go to a hostelry to get pummeled by the ultras for saying Arthur was fucking it up. Happy days..

Ha. Well my dad was management and running picket lines, my brother at 19 was on strike and on those lines, and they lived together. You can imagine.

Can indeed, classic Play for Today if there was still a PFT.
Maybe an R4 afternoon play in these reduced times?

☺ - Ok. I'll get writing!

Some inspiration

https://musicaficionado.blog/2016/06/22/shipbuilding-by-elvis-costello/

CarlottaVance said:

https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1293275855704199168?s=20

kle4 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Stats for Lefties, AKA Propaganda for Lefties

https://twitter.com/LeftieStats/status/1293287031804747778

https://twitter.com/CorrectHorseB/status/1293287518692089856

What these cretins pretend not to realise is that making slight compromises in the interests of winning does not mean you have to abandon all of your principles and objectives. It's not an either/or equation.

Andy_JS said:

kle4 said:

CorrectHorseBattery said:

Stats for Lefties, AKA Propaganda for Lefties

https://twitter.com/LeftieStats/status/1293287031804747778

https://twitter.com/CorrectHorseB/status/1293287518692089856

What these cretins pretend not to realise is that making slight compromises in the interests of winning does not mean you have to abandon all of your principles and objectives. It's not an either/or equation.

The Tories have to abandon principles to win elections too.