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Boris is clearly super smart. He won a scholarship to Eton, got a decent degree at Oxford, was president of the Oxford Union, was a highly successful journalist, possibly the best Spectator editor in the last 100 years, and then became a two time Tory mayor of London (a Labour city).Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
Disputing this is ridiculous. He is definitely very clever, by any normal standards.
The question is whether he has the right kind of smartness, and can develop the necessary seriousness, to be a decent PM, especially in such trying times. That is a totally different issue. The jury is OUT.0 -
The sooner the betterBig_G_NorthWales said:
D day celebrations with TM in Portsmouth tomorrow then he leaves our shores_Anazina_ said:Is Trumpton still here?
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You holding Big G's feet to the fire?IanB2 said:
When Boris gets elected you were supposed to be leaving.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I have too but I wont vote for him but rather look like Boris is well on the way to being PMCasino_Royale said:
I've made peace with Boris.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Nicky Morgan has just said on Sky that Boris was much more serious in his presentation to tonight's hustings. She went on to say that candidates are having to explain their positions in detail.DecrepitJohnL said:
Boris is odds-on now.Andrew said:Market seems to really like Jezza the Hunt after today's changes.
Boris 10/11 or evens in a couple of places
Gove 4/1
Hunt 8/1
I'm green on Hunt, break even on Gove and am red on Boris.
Maybe we will see a more mature Boris but I am not holding my breath
If it started with him then maybe it's poetic that it ends with him, whatever that end is.
One benefit is he will give Corbyn a run for his money
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Trump now rowing back on his NHS statements .
Too late everyone knows he’s a liar.0 -
Scrap is not for turning. I will not vote for Boris.
If it's 2 purists, I will write in Ken Clarke.0 -
kle4 said:
Without unicorns? How are they to win a members vote without that?!algarkirk said:A comment for simplicity's sake: For each candidate there is, realistically, only one question which they need to answer convincingly, unambiguously and without unicorns: What is your plan which is (a) not TM's deal (b) will be agreed by the EU (c) delivers Brexit and (d) convinces us that it will pass through the Commons and the Lords, and how are you to persuade us that you are right?
Just a comment on political discourse rather than any specific remark but I hate the term "unicorn". It is so political class orientated. I have never heard anyone mention Unicorns apart from MPs and people who post on here. I actually think Unicorn is an inferior description to fantasy...
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Andrea Leadsom's 'field of wheat moment', was when she hitched a lift to Cornwall on the back of a motorbike, having told her mother she was catching a bike0
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Well it does look like from the polling Boris should provide a boost to the Tories. Honeymoon till October 31st I guess.0
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rcs1000 said:
I want us to leave on October 31st, but achieving that via No Deal via proroguing the House would be a constitutional abomination.TheScreamingEagles said:So this is what taking back control and giving it to a sovereign Parliament looks like.
https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1135999351820623880
Some Tories behave as if no-one is watching.0 -
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I like your thinking.Scrapheap_as_was said:Scrap is not for turning. I will not vote for Boris.
If it's 2 purists, I will write in Ken Clarke.0 -
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We have to go for Boris. We will survive an election under his leadership fighting for Brexit, even if we lose.
If not Boris, the Brexit Party will overwhelm us, and Corbyn will be PM with a majority.0 -
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Perhaps. I find it fun myself, but admittedly while I have heard it used in real life, it is from other political wonks, and most normal people would probably have their eyes glaze over if I used it, as with references to science fiction and Terry Pratchett books.The_Taxman said:kle4 said:
Without unicorns? How are they to win a members vote without that?!algarkirk said:A comment for simplicity's sake: For each candidate there is, realistically, only one question which they need to answer convincingly, unambiguously and without unicorns: What is your plan which is (a) not TM's deal (b) will be agreed by the EU (c) delivers Brexit and (d) convinces us that it will pass through the Commons and the Lords, and how are you to persuade us that you are right?
Just a comment on political discourse rather than any specific remark but I hate the term "unicorn". It is so political class orientated. I have never heard anyone mention Unicorns apart from MPs and people who post on here. I actually think Unicorn is an inferior description to fantasy...0 -
The thing about Boris is he is all talk and no vision. I know the Brexit supporting media like him but actually he is pretty hopeless as a politician. He has done nothing of substance as Mayor of London or Foreign Secretary. Boris has poor judgement and a complete lack of political antenna. I would not confuse support in the Brexit supporting media for political vitality. He is a figurehead and a pretty ridiculous one at that, if he becomes PM I will enjoy watching him being destroyed by the very media that promote his candidacy as he fails abysmally in the job as PM.Byronic said:
Boris is clearly super smart. He won a scholarship to Eton, got a decent degree at Oxford, was president of the Oxford Union, was a highly successful journalist, possibly the best Spectator editor in the last 100 years, and then became a two time Tory mayor of London (a Labour city).Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
Disputing this is ridiculous. He is definitely very clever, by any normal standards.
The question is whether he has the right kind of smartness, and can develop the necessary seriousness, to be a decent PM, especially in such trying times. That is a totally different issue. The jury is OUT.0 -
Except you didn't even know whether he was still here, so why does it make a difference?_Anazina_ said:
The sooner the betterBig_G_NorthWales said:
D day celebrations with TM in Portsmouth tomorrow then he leaves our shores_Anazina_ said:Is Trumpton still here?
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https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1136018356711153665?s=21RoyalBlue said:We have to go for Boris. We will survive an election under his leadership fighting for Brexit, even if we lose.
If not Boris, the Brexit Party will overwhelm us, and Corbyn will be PM with a majority.0 -
The benefit of Boris is that lots of Brexit Party supporters trust him, so will return to the Tories and give him a chance to get Brexit done.
The problem of Boris is that unless he fulfills those expectations (which realistically means either No Deal or a new very favourable deal out of nowhere) then those same voters will leave again - and having had their faith let down they'll be even harder to get back.0 -
That YouGov poll is a shocker for Labour .
Labour Remain voters still deserting them in their droves towards the Lib Dems and Greens.
The current fence sitting could be terminal .0 -
HYUFD said:
Andrea Leadsom's 'field of wheat moment', was when she hitched a lift to Cornwall on the back of a motorbike, having told her mother she was catching a bike
Was the rider of the motorbike a young, bearded Socialist firebrand?
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It would be a recipe for civil war. I mean actual civil war, not just people being mean to each other on Twitter.Scott_P said:0 -
I just don't get it. Are the moderates really bending over backwards for Boris on the strength of accomplishments from 7 years ago now? And as for uniting the country what evidence is there for that? No deal won't unite it. Even a new deal would not unite it, even if he could get one.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1136018356711153665?s=21RoyalBlue said:We have to go for Boris. We will survive an election under his leadership fighting for Brexit, even if we lose.
If not Boris, the Brexit Party will overwhelm us, and Corbyn will be PM with a majority.
Believe me I hope he does do better than I think, but it is dispiriting to see a bunch of so called moderates lap at the feet of a man who spent a year saying everything May did was crap then voted for her deal because it was indeed better than the alternatives, and now will take us over the cliff hoping blind belief will see us through.0 -
That poll is fascinating, gives a Bories led Tories a 7% lead over Labour who are tied with the LDs for second on 22% each. The Brexit Party meanwhile falls back to UKIP 2015 levels on 13%MarqueeMark said:What the hell kind of Parliament would PM Boris getting 29%, Labour 22%, LibDems 22%, Brexit Party 13% gives us? (Guido obtained private YouGov polling with the "Boris bounce")
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf
Despite reports to the contrary against Boris the SNP fall even further than they got in 2017 to just 35% in Scotland with the Tories second on 20%, the LDs third on 16% and Labour only 4th on 15%.
Boris does particularly well in the Midlands and Wales with the Tories having a 12% lead, 32% to 20%, more even than the South where the Tories lead on 32% with the LDs second on 29%.
Boris also cuts the Labour lead to 6% in the North and 8% in London
A Boris led Tories are classless too, they lead the LDs 28% to 27% with ABC1s and they lead Labour 29% to 24% with C2DEs
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
That just sounds rather like a rant, to me, sorry. He was a good Mayor of London, better than Khan (e.g. crime fell, the city felt at ease, he did the figurehead stuff rather well), he was a rather poor Foreign Secretary (silly gaffes, etc)The_Taxman said:
The thing about Boris is he is all talk and no vision. I know the Brexit supporting media like him but actually he is pretty hopeless as a politician. He has done nothing of substance as Mayor of London or Foreign Secretary. Boris has poor judgement and a complete lack of political antenna. I would not confuse support in the Brexit supporting media for political vitality. He is a figurehead and a pretty ridiculous one at that, if he becomes PM I will enjoy watching him being destroyed by the very media that promote his candidacy as he fails abysmally in the job as PM.Byronic said:
Boris is OUT.Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
He is a bit Churchillian, in good and bad ways. Churchill was an imperialist buffoon, responsible for Gallipoli, amongst other horrors. Yet that same Churchill caught the right rhetorical mood for Britain in 1940, when more sober, capable and sensible politicians had been found very wanting.
Boris has that air about him. He's a big gamble, but right now we are in a casino and we are £100k down on the night, facing bankruptcy.
What the hell, roll the dice?
I can see the logic. More importantly, I cannot see any obvious alternative candidate who is likely to do better.
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Byronic said:
Boris is clearly super smart. He won a scholarship to Eton, got a decent degree at Oxford, was president of the Oxford Union, was a highly successful journalist, possibly the best Spectator editor in the last 100 years, and then became a two time Tory mayor of London (a Labour city).Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
Disputing this is ridiculous. He is definitely very clever, by any normal standards.
The question is whether he has the right kind of smartness, and can develop the necessary seriousness, to be a decent PM, especially in such trying times. That is a totally different issue. The jury is OUT.
As long as he doesn't turn out to be a gaylord ponceyboots, that's the main thing.0 -
So, next election - Cons under Johnson offering Hard Brexit and Small State versus Lab under Corbyn offering Remain and Socialism.
No hiding place.0 -
The trouble is that the other candidates don't have accomplishments, so 7 years ago will do.kle4 said:
I just don't get it. Are the moderates really bending over backwards for Boris on the strength of accomplishments from 7 years ago now? And as for uniting the country what evidence is there for that? No deal won't unite it. Even a new deal would not unite it, even if he could get one.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1136018356711153665?s=21RoyalBlue said:We have to go for Boris. We will survive an election under his leadership fighting for Brexit, even if we lose.
If not Boris, the Brexit Party will overwhelm us, and Corbyn will be PM with a majority.
Believe me I hope he does do better than I think, but it is dispiriting to see a bunch of so called moderates lap at the feet of a man who spent a year saying everything May did was crap then voted for her deal because it was indeed better than the alternatives, and now will take us over the cliff hoping blind belief will see us through.0 -
Way too little private gun ownership in the UK for that. Maybe a few riots though.OnlyLivingBoy said:
It would be a recipe for civil war. I mean actual civil war, not just people being mean to each other on Twitter.Scott_P said:0 -
Other leaders though do less well.
Raab does best with the Tories on 24% under his leadership, ahead of the LDs on 22% with Labour third on 21%. The Brexit Party falls to 17%.
A Javid led Tories though can only tie the LDs 22% each with Labour on 21% and the Brexit Party still high on 20%.
A Gove led Tories would be third on 20% behind Labour and the LDs tied for the lead on 22% each with the Brexit Party again on 20%.
A Hunt led Tories sees the LDs lead on 22% with the Tories tied with Labour on 21% each and the Brexit Party getting its highest score of 21%
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
Good lord. On God's green earth, what is a "gaylord ponceyboots"????Theuniondivvie said:Byronic said:
Boris is clearly super smart. He won a scholarship to Eton, got a decent degree at Oxford, was president of the Oxford Union, was a highly successful journalist, possibly the best Spectator editor in the last 100 years, and then became a two time Tory mayor of London (a Labour city).Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
Disputing this is ridiculous. He is definitely very clever, by any normal standards.
The question is whether he has the right kind of smartness, and can develop the necessary seriousness, to be a decent PM, especially in such trying times. That is a totally different issue. The jury is OUT.
As long as he doesn't turn out to be a gaylord ponceyboots, that's the main thing.0 -
Perhaps, although the way they over emphasise that he is a proven winner purely on that basis does not acknowledge how much he is still a gamble, and therefore gambling on others is less risky than they imagine.TudorRose said:
The trouble is that the other candidates don't have accomplishments, so 7 years ago will do.kle4 said:
I just don't get it. Are the moderates really bending over backwards for Boris on the strength of accomplishments from 7 years ago now? And as for uniting the country what evidence is there for that? No deal won't unite it. Even a new deal would not unite it, even if he could get one.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1136018356711153665?s=21RoyalBlue said:We have to go for Boris. We will survive an election under his leadership fighting for Brexit, even if we lose.
If not Boris, the Brexit Party will overwhelm us, and Corbyn will be PM with a majority.
Believe me I hope he does do better than I think, but it is dispiriting to see a bunch of so called moderates lap at the feet of a man who spent a year saying everything May did was crap then voted for her deal because it was indeed better than the alternatives, and now will take us over the cliff hoping blind belief will see us through.0 -
I think the myth that Johnson is some sort of political vote machine relies on the 2008 and 2012 elections in London. I don't think people understand that the voting coalition that got him elected as Mayor in those two years has been catastrophically destroyed by his actions with regard to Brexit especially in London. I suppose it depends on the geographical distribution of the voters his personality and record repelled and those who are attracted. It may well be the case the voters he picks up are in safe Labour seats and the ones that will not vote for him are in Conservative marginals...Quincel said:The benefit of Boris is that lots of Brexit Party supporters trust him, so will return to the Tories and give him a chance to get Brexit done.
The problem of Boris is that unless he fulfills those expectations (which realistically means either No Deal or a new very favourable deal out of nowhere) then those same voters will leave again - and having had their faith let down they'll be even harder to get back.0 -
This is all predicated on what happens with Brexit. If no deal happens under his watch and turns out to be a disaster then the Tories are toast .HYUFD said:
That poll is fascinating, gives a Bories led Tories a 7% lead over Labour who are tied with the LDs for second on 22% each. The Brexit Party meanwhile falls back to UKIP 2015 levels on 13%MarqueeMark said:What the hell kind of Parliament would PM Boris getting 29%, Labour 22%, LibDems 22%, Brexit Party 13% gives us? (Guido obtained private YouGov polling with the "Boris bounce")
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf
Despite reports to the contrary against Boris the SNP fall even further than they got in 2017 to just 35% in Scotland with the Tories second on 20%, the LDs third on 16% and Labour only 4th on 15%.
Boris does particularly well in the Midlands and Wales with the Tories having a 12% lead, 32% to 20%, more even than the South where the Tories lead on 32% with the LDs second on 29%.
Boris also cuts the Labour lead to 6% in the North and 8% in London
A Boris led Tories are classless too, they lead the LDs 28% to 27% with ABC1s and they lead Labour 29% to 24% with C2DEs
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
"Boris led Tories are classless"...never a truer word spoken.HYUFD said:
That poll is fascinating, gives a Bories led Tories a 7% lead over Labour who are tied with the LDs for second on 22% each. The Brexit Party meanwhile falls back to UKIP 2015 levels on 13%MarqueeMark said:What the hell kind of Parliament would PM Boris getting 29%, Labour 22%, LibDems 22%, Brexit Party 13% gives us? (Guido obtained private YouGov polling with the "Boris bounce")
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf
Despite reports to the contrary against Boris the SNP fall even further than they got in 2017 to just 35% in Scotland with the Tories second on 20%, the LDs third on 16% and Labour only 4th on 15%.
Boris does particularly well in the Midlands and Wales with the Tories having a 12% lead, 32% to 20%, more even than the South where the Tories lead on 32% with the LDs second on 29%.
Boris also cuts the Labour lead to 6% in the North and 8% in London
A Boris led Tories are classless too, they lead the LDs 28% to 27% with ABC1s and they lead Labour 29% to 24% with C2DEs
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
Well, there we are. Boris is the next PM, and pretty much everyone on the site is going to finish the whole damn year red as a result.0
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I would take any poll published now about a hypothetical Tory leader and PM with a giant pinch of salt. People change their mind once someone has got into the position of leadership.HYUFD said:Other leaders though do less well.
Raab does best with the Tories on 24% under his leadership, ahead of the LDs on 22% with Labour third on 21%. The Brexit Party falls to 17%.
A Javid led Tories though can only tie the LDs 22% each with Labour on 21% and the Brexit Party still high on 20%.
A Gove led Tories would be third on 20% behind Labour and the LDs tied for the lead on 22% each with the Brexit Party again on 20%.
A Hunt led Tories sees the LDs lead on 22% with the Tories tied with Labour on 21% each and the Brexit Party getting its highest score of 21%
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
He was a Foreign Secretary who got a co-ordinated, wide-ranging international response to the Novichok poisoning by Russia. No small feat that.Byronic said:
That just sounds rather like a rant, to me, sorry. He was a good Mayor of London, better than Khan (e.g. crime fell, the city felt at ease, he did the figurehead stuff rather well), he was a rather poor Foreign Secretary (silly gaffes, etc)The_Taxman said:
The thing about Boris is he is all talk and no vision. I know the Brexit supporting media like him but actually he is pretty hopeless as a politician. He has done nothing of substance as Mayor of London or Foreign Secretary. Boris has poor judgement and a complete lack of political antenna. I would not confuse support in the Brexit supporting media for political vitality. He is a figurehead and a pretty ridiculous one at that, if he becomes PM I will enjoy watching him being destroyed by the very media that promote his candidacy as he fails abysmally in the job as PM.Byronic said:
Boris is OUT.Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
He is a bit Churchillian, in good and bad ways. Churchill was an imperialist buffoon, responsible for Gallipoli, amongst other horrors. Yet that same Churchill caught the right rhetorical mood for Britain in 1940, when more sober, capable and sensible politicians had been found very wanting.
Boris has that air about him. He's a big gamble, but right now we are in a casino and we are £100k down on the night, facing bankruptcy.
What the hell, roll the dice?
I can see the logic. More importantly, I cannot see any obvious alternative candidate who is likely to do better.0 -
This is beginning to smell very whiffy indeed. Are we moving to yet another PM by acclamation cos MPs neither trust their membership, nor are interested in any kind of detailed discussion of policy, for fear of what that might reveal?
Tory Unity. It got us where we are today.0 -
Minor point: The LDs will be pleased with that YouGov poll. Pollsters seem to be split on whether they are in the mid-teens of low-20s, whereas TBP is low 20s with most polls atm.
Everything is hella volatile though, so who knows if this is continuing a trend of the start of a new one.0 -
Isn’t it a bit inappropriate for a supposedly impartial Sky News correspondent to be tweeting that a politician is ‘deluded’. He isn’t writing a comment piece for the Indy or Guardian?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
Report the news and keep your personal views private?0 -
Buffoon pretending to be a serious politician pretending to be a buffoon.
It's a double bluff. He knows that most people will only see through the 1st one.
Reason he knows that is because he is smart. He is VERY smart. Albeit a buffoon.
The 2 things do often go together. Think of Arthur Mullard.0 -
I suspect you are too young to know, Mr Byronic!Byronic said:
Good lord. On God's green earth, what is a "gaylord ponceyboots"????Theuniondivvie said:Byronic said:
Boris is clearly super smart. He won a scholarship to Eton, got a decent degree at Oxford, was president of the Oxford Union, was a highly successful journalist, possibly the best Spectator editor in the last 100 years, and then became a two time Tory mayor of London (a Labour city).Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
Disputing this is ridiculous. He is definitely very clever, by any normal standards.
The question is whether he has the right kind of smartness, and can develop the necessary seriousness, to be a decent PM, especially in such trying times. That is a totally different issue. The jury is OUT.
As long as he doesn't turn out to be a gaylord ponceyboots, that's the main thing.0 -
The trouble with much of the polling on this is that very few of the other candidates (other than Boris) are well-known enough to have the sort of recognition that makes the polls meaningful. Cameron was a good example of that; the better known he was (as Leader of the Opposition) the better his ratings got.kle4 said:
Perhaps, although the way they over emphasise that he is a proven winner purely on that basis does not acknowledge how much he is still a gamble, and therefore gambling on others is less risky than they imagine.TudorRose said:
The trouble is that the other candidates don't have accomplishments, so 7 years ago will do.kle4 said:
I just don't get it. Are the moderates really bending over backwards for Boris on the strength of accomplishments from 7 years ago now? And as for uniting the country what evidence is there for that? No deal won't unite it. Even a new deal would not unite it, even if he could get one.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1136018356711153665?s=21RoyalBlue said:We have to go for Boris. We will survive an election under his leadership fighting for Brexit, even if we lose.
If not Boris, the Brexit Party will overwhelm us, and Corbyn will be PM with a majority.
Believe me I hope he does do better than I think, but it is dispiriting to see a bunch of so called moderates lap at the feet of a man who spent a year saying everything May did was crap then voted for her deal because it was indeed better than the alternatives, and now will take us over the cliff hoping blind belief will see us through.
And, of course, there will be a new LibDem leader to throw into the mix (which might make a difference in both directions).0 -
Jo Swinson is pretty plausible. I think the LDs might prosper under her.TudorRose said:
The trouble with much of the polling on this is that very few of the other candidates (other than Boris) are well-known enough to have the sort of recognition that makes the polls meaningful. Cameron was a good example of that; the better known he was (as Leader of the Opposition) the better his ratings got.kle4 said:
Perhaps, although the way they over emphasise that he is a proven winner purely on that basis does not acknowledge how much he is still a gamble, and therefore gambling on others is less risky than they imagine.TudorRose said:
The trouble is that the other candidates don't have accomplishments, so 7 years ago will do.kle4 said:
I just don't get it. Are the moderates really bending over backwards for Boris on the strength of accomplishments from 7 years ago now? And as for uniting the country what evidence is there for that? No deal won't unite it. Even a new deal would not unite it, even if he could get one.williamglenn said:
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1136018356711153665?s=21RoyalBlue said:We have to go for Boris. We will survive an election under his leadership fighting for Brexit, even if we lose.
If not Boris, the Brexit Party will overwhelm us, and Corbyn will be PM with a majority.
Believe me I hope he does do better than I think, but it is dispiriting to see a bunch of so called moderates lap at the feet of a man who spent a year saying everything May did was crap then voted for her deal because it was indeed better than the alternatives, and now will take us over the cliff hoping blind belief will see us through.
And, of course, there will be a new LibDem leader to throw into the mix (which might make a difference in both directions).0 -
Not that much, Cameron led in hypothetical polls in 2005 for example, Ed Miliband did not in 2010. Major led in such polls in 1990 as did Blair in 1994, Howard did not pre 2005 etcThe_Taxman said:
I would take any poll published now about a hypothetical Tory leader and PM with a giant pinch of salt. People change their mind once someone has got into the position of leadership.HYUFD said:Other leaders though do less well.
Raab does best with the Tories on 24% under his leadership, ahead of the LDs on 22% with Labour third on 21%. The Brexit Party falls to 17%.
A Javid led Tories though can only tie the LDs 22% each with Labour on 21% and the Brexit Party still high on 20%.
A Gove led Tories would be third on 20% behind Labour and the LDs tied for the lead on 22% each with the Brexit Party again on 20%.
A Hunt led Tories sees the LDs lead on 22% with the Tories tied with Labour on 21% each and the Brexit Party getting its highest score of 21%
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
You will recall the usual suspects saying we wouldn't get any international response because of Brexit.MarqueeMark said:
He was a Foreign Secretary who got a co-ordinated, wide-ranging international response to the Novichok poisoning by Russia. No small feat that.Byronic said:
That just sounds rather like a rant, to me, sorry. He was a good Mayor of London, better than Khan (e.g. crime fell, the city felt at ease, he did the figurehead stuff rather well), he was a rather poor Foreign Secretary (silly gaffes, etc)The_Taxman said:
The thing about Boris is he is all talk and no vision. I know the Brexit supporting media like him but actually he is pretty hopeless as a politician. He has done nothing ofSNIPdestroyed by the very media that promote his candidacy as he fails abysmally in the job as PM.Byronic said:
Boris is OUT.Ishmael_Z said:
"People always ask me the same question, they say, 'Is Boris a very very clever man pretending to be an idiot?' And I always say, 'No.'" Ian Hislop.dodrade said:
Could Boris upon coming to power "turn away his former self" as Prince Hal did?kle4 said:
He's just annoying me. All this nonsense about how all you have to do is 'put it to bed' and the like, they all know that, they just don't have the numbers to do so and still would not under the Boris premiership.Scott_P said:
Why is 'we must do something' winning over so many Tory MPs? Even May knew that was true, it didn't help.
Yes I know I am not the target audience for the contest, but I did vote Leave and Tory in 2017, and he's pissing me off royally by pretending a perky attitude gets you past Baker, Grieve, the DUP and the rest of the shits.
I have always found that damning as Hislop has no political axe to grind, and tries to present a nice friendly persona (which is why the Eye is so gutless under him).
He is a bit Churchillian, in good and bad ways. Churchill was an imperialist buffoon, responsible for Gallipoli, amongst other horrors. Yet that same Churchill caught the right rhetorical mood for Britain in 1940, when more sober, capable and sensible politicians had been found very wanting.
Boris has that air about him. He's a big gamble, but right now we are in a casino and we are £100k down on the night, facing bankruptcy.
What the hell, roll the dice?
I can see the logic. More importantly, I cannot see any obvious alternative candidate who is likely to do better.
Wrong yet again0 -
Raab is the candidate of Ultras-who-don’t-like-Boris. Not clear he’s a natural transfer to BoJokle4 said:
Really? Boris seems to be difficult to keep out of the top 2 based on known declarations and where followers of ones like Raab will likely fall.DecrepitJohnL said:0 -
Nope, No Deal will only likely happen given the current Parliament will continue to block it if Boris calls a general election and wins a majority with it in his manifestonico67 said:
This is all predicated on what happens with Brexit. If no deal happens under his watch and turns out to be a disaster then the Tories are toast .HYUFD said:
That poll is fascinating, gives a Bories led Tories a 7% lead over Labour who are tied with the LDs for second on 22% each. The Brexit Party meanwhile falls back to UKIP 2015 levels on 13%MarqueeMark said:What the hell kind of Parliament would PM Boris getting 29%, Labour 22%, LibDems 22%, Brexit Party 13% gives us? (Guido obtained private YouGov polling with the "Boris bounce")
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf
Despite reports to the contrary against Boris the SNP fall even further than they got in 2017 to just 35% in Scotland with the Tories second on 20%, the LDs third on 16% and Labour only 4th on 15%.
Boris does particularly well in the Midlands and Wales with the Tories having a 12% lead, 32% to 20%, more even than the South where the Tories lead on 32% with the LDs second on 29%.
Boris also cuts the Labour lead to 6% in the North and 8% in London
A Boris led Tories are classless too, they lead the LDs 28% to 27% with ABC1s and they lead Labour 29% to 24% with C2DEs
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
The_Taxman said:
I think the myth that Johnson is some sort of political vote machine relies on the 2008 and 2012 elections in London. I don't think people understand that the voting coalition that got him elected as Mayor in those two years has been catastrophically destroyed by his actions with regard to Brexit especially in London. I suppose it depends on the geographical distribution of the voters his personality and record repelled and those who are attracted. It may well be the case the voters he picks up are in safe Labour seats and the ones that will not vote for him are in Conservative marginals...Quincel said:The benefit of Boris is that lots of Brexit Party supporters trust him, so will return to the Tories and give him a chance to get Brexit done.
The problem of Boris is that unless he fulfills those expectations (which realistically means either No Deal or a new very favourable deal out of nowhere) then those same voters will leave again - and having had their faith let down they'll be even harder to get back.
Actually Boris led Tories lead most in the Midlands which is full of marginals
0 -
If the alternatives are Gove or Hunt? Come on, we know which way they would transfer.Charles said:
Raab is the candidate of Ultras-who-don’t-like-Boris. Not clear he’s a natural transfer to BoJokle4 said:
Really? Boris seems to be difficult to keep out of the top 2 based on known declarations and where followers of ones like Raab will likely fall.DecrepitJohnL said:0 -
I thought it was leavers who made threats?OnlyLivingBoy said:
It would be a recipe for civil war. I mean actual civil war, not just people being mean to each other on Twitter.Scott_P said:0 -
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Weren’t there rumours that a grand jury had issued an arrest warrant... would be so f*****g funny if he turned up to “negotiate” a trade deal and...Cyclefree said:
Is Farage now a country or something? What the fuck does he think he is doing?another_richard said:
Doesn't Farage know that DD and OwenPatz have already negotiated a trade deal with Oklahoma ?Scott_P said:
More than a touch of hubris going on, I feel.
I hope we don't have to wait long for nemesis.0 -
I am green on Boris.0
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Absolutely right. Another Tory coronation would be a disaster. This time they have to thrash out the arguments, hopefully have a TV debate, and then it must proceed to the membership. See how the candidates perform under pressure.dixiedean said:This is beginning to smell very whiffy indeed. Are we moving to yet another PM by acclamation cos MPs neither trust their membership, nor are interested in any kind of detailed discussion of policy, for fear of what that might reveal?
Tory Unity. It got us where we are today.
If the same had happened last time, T May would have been exposed as the useless politician she really is.
Lessons surely must be drawn: they have to be stress tested.0 -
Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
Labour have missed the boat, cannot swing to Remain now.kinabalu said:
Of course. Apologies.Foxy said:Other parties are availible...
You might get squeezed out again though when Labour pivot to Ref and Remain.
Ditto the BP on the right if leavers buy BoJo.
And then we have the Union angle.
Absolutely fascinating period ahead in British politics.
0 -
The absolute state of that garden tax idea - makes the Tories Dementia tax look a good idea.GIN1138 said:
In the end Rich Remainers will go with Boris to protect their houses and gardens from being "grabbed" by Jezza!kinabalu said:So, next election - Cons under Johnson offering Hard Brexit and Small State versus Lab under Corbyn offering Remain and Socialism.
No hiding place.0 -
Raab and Javid are the small state candidates and McVey and Baker offer the hardest Brexit of all on the Tory side, the LDs are still taking Labour voteshare as Corbyn only offers socialism not yet Remain.kinabalu said:So, next election - Cons under Johnson offering Hard Brexit and Small State versus Lab under Corbyn offering Remain and Socialism.
No hiding place.
Indeed against Boris the LDs are first and lead Labour 37% to 30% with Remainers as their Euro elections momentum continues while with Leavers Boris led Tories have a big lead 52% to 26% for the Brexit Party in second
https://order-order.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/LordBell_190529_VotingIntentions_w1.pdf0 -
In a thread yesterday with @Cyclefree yesterday discussing PM Boris, I pointed out that "...The indecent Conservatives need somebody charismatic to "fail and blame" the EU, and the decent Conservatives will place unity and loyalty to the tribe above good governance. Unfortunately, Boris ticks a lot of boxes and has the Bannonite imprimatur, so is well funded...".Big_G_NorthWales said:
I have too but I wont vote for him but rather look like Boris is well on the way to being PMCasino_Royale said:
I've made peace with Boris.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Nicky Morgan has just said on Sky that Boris was much more serious in his presentation to tonight's hustings. She went on to say that candidates are having to explain their positions in detail.DecrepitJohnL said:
Boris is odds-on now.Andrew said:Market seems to really like Jezza the Hunt after today's changes.
Boris 10/11 or evens in a couple of places
Gove 4/1
Hunt 8/1
I'm green on Hunt, break even on Gove and am red on Boris.
Maybe we will see a more mature Boris but I am not holding my breath
If it started with him then maybe it's poetic that it ends with him, whatever that end is.
One benefit is he will give Corbyn a run for his money
I am frequently disappointed by people, but rarely surprised...
[edit: remove duplicate]0 -
0
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I don't know why Labour just doesn't let the WA pass now - there is plenty to be thrashed out in the next stage (we might as well go Norway++++++++++++ essentially just dropping our MEPs) but it just deals with the issue. Labour's strategy of saying they want Brexit, but not a no deal and not the only Brexit actually on offer is too clever by half.Foxy said:
Labour have missed the boat, cannot swing to Remain now.kinabalu said:
Of course. Apologies.Foxy said:Other parties are availible...
You might get squeezed out again though when Labour pivot to Ref and Remain.
Ditto the BP on the right if leavers buy BoJo.
And then we have the Union angle.
Absolutely fascinating period ahead in British politics.0 -
Granny's garden tax as it will be known by once Tory strategists get stuck in.Pulpstar said:
The absolute state of that garden tax idea - makes the Tories Dementia tax look a good idea.GIN1138 said:
In the end Rich Remainers will go with Boris to protect their houses and gardens from being "grabbed" by Jezza!kinabalu said:So, next election - Cons under Johnson offering Hard Brexit and Small State versus Lab under Corbyn offering Remain and Socialism.
No hiding place.0 -
I suppose it depends given that it is a hung parliament whether opinion poll ratings can be converted into net gains for a political party. It is no good decreasing majorities in Labour safe seats and increasing majorities in Tory held seats if the Tories don't gain much more on the ground! This applies across the country. At the last election the Tories got about 40% of the vote in Bolsover for instance, whereas Labour got over 50%. Political strategy has to be realistic not bordering on delusional.HYUFD said:The_Taxman said:
I think the myth that Johnson is some sort of political vote machine relies on the 2008 and 2012 elections in London. I don't think people understand that the voting coalition that got him elected as Mayor in those two years has been catastrophically destroyed by his actions with regard to Brexit especially in London. I suppose it depends on the geographical distribution of the voters his personality and record repelled and those who are attracted. It may well be the case the voters he picks up are in safe Labour seats and the ones that will not vote for him are in Conservative marginals...Quincel said:The benefit of Boris is that lots of Brexit Party supporters trust him, so will return to the Tories and give him a chance to get Brexit done.
The problem of Boris is that unless he fulfills those expectations (which realistically means either No Deal or a new very favourable deal out of nowhere) then those same voters will leave again - and having had their faith let down they'll be even harder to get back.
Actually Boris led Tories lead most in the Midlands which is full of marginals0 -
Err Corbyn remain. Not a chance - he is as hard a brexiteer as any conservativekinabalu said:So, next election - Cons under Johnson offering Hard Brexit and Small State versus Lab under Corbyn offering Remain and Socialism.
No hiding place.0 -
We will have a new PM; May will have resigned.rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
What's the garden tax idea ?Pulpstar said:
The absolute state of that garden tax idea - makes the Tories Dementia tax look a good idea.GIN1138 said:
In the end Rich Remainers will go with Boris to protect their houses and gardens from being "grabbed" by Jezza!kinabalu said:So, next election - Cons under Johnson offering Hard Brexit and Small State versus Lab under Corbyn offering Remain and Socialism.
No hiding place.0 -
Not necessarily. She resigns leadership not PM. Only resigns as PM at the moment she goes to the Palace. That would not happen imho if the winner was not likely to be able to command a majority.TudorRose said:
We will have a new PM; May will have resigned.rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
The entirely convincing answer which Boris can give is that there is a leaked poll stating that if he is elected the Conservatives will be ahead in the polls. No further questions will be asked of him nor answers required.algarkirk said:A comment for simplicity's sake: For each candidate there is, realistically, only one question which they need to answer convincingly, unambiguously and without unicorns: What is your plan which is (a) not TM's deal (b) will be agreed by the EU (c) delivers Brexit and (d) convinces us that it will pass through the Commons and the Lords, and how are you to persuade us that you are right?
0 -
Not if she can't recommend a successor whom she believes commands the confidence of the House.TudorRose said:
We will have a new PM; May will have resigned.rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
Surely the Queen will send for them before any confidence vote?rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
Make Brexit great again.viewcode said:
The entirely convincing answer which Boris can give is that there is a leaked poll stating that if he is elected the Conservatives will be ahead in the polls. No further questions will be asked of him nor answers required.algarkirk said:A comment for simplicity's sake: For each candidate there is, realistically, only one question which they need to answer convincingly, unambiguously and without unicorns: What is your plan which is (a) not TM's deal (b) will be agreed by the EU (c) delivers Brexit and (d) convinces us that it will pass through the Commons and the Lords, and how are you to persuade us that you are right?
0 -
The Jezza plan was that we leave, but it is a) totally Tory fault b) it is as chaotic as possible.Pulpstar said:
I don't know why Labour just doesn't let the WA pass now - there is plenty to be thrashed out in the next stage (we might as well go Norway++++++++++++ essentially just dropping our MEPs) but it just deals with the issue. Labour's strategy of saying they want Brexit, but not a no deal and not the only Brexit actually on offer is too clever by half.Foxy said:
Labour have missed the boat, cannot swing to Remain now.kinabalu said:
Of course. Apologies.Foxy said:Other parties are availible...
You might get squeezed out again though when Labour pivot to Ref and Remain.
Ditto the BP on the right if leavers buy BoJo.
And then we have the Union angle.
Absolutely fascinating period ahead in British politics.0 -
Remainers don't care about the NHS!rottenborough said:2nd vote starting to shape up nicely:
https://twitter.com/johnmcternan/status/1135983115040673798
"Instead of spending billions on the NHS every year, let's give it to the EU instead"
How's that for the side of a bus?0 -
If she couldn't recommend her elected successor then she wouldn't be able to command a majority (the Tories would never support her in such circumstances) and she would be required to resign anyway.Tissue_Price said:
Not if she can't recommend a successor whom she believes commands the confidence of the House.TudorRose said:
We will have a new PM; May will have resigned.rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
He believes that he can win power in Westminster, either by winning an election or by being appointed by a Conservative government as a Coalition minister (or as a Minister From Outside Government, or GOAT as they are unofficially known). To that end he is setting up the bureaucracy so he can liaise with his US colleagues.Cyclefree said:
Is Farage now a country or something? What the fuck does he think he is doing?another_richard said:
Doesn't Farage know that DD and OwenPatz have already negotiated a trade deal with Oklahoma ?Scott_P said:
More than a touch of hubris going on, I feel.
I hope we don't have to wait long for nemesis.0 -
Her Government might be. But where's the new PM coming from?TudorRose said:
If she couldn't recommend her elected successor then she wouldn't be able to command a majority (the Tories would never support her in such circumstances) and she would be required to resign anyway.Tissue_Price said:
Not if she can't recommend a successor whom she believes commands the confidence of the House.TudorRose said:
We will have a new PM; May will have resigned.rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
If the election is before Brexit Labour will fight it on an offer of Ref2 with Remain as an option.Big_G_NorthWales said:Err Corbyn remain. Not a chance - he is as hard a brexiteer as any conservative
You can take that to the bank.
I stake all the kudos I have built up on here for so long and so diligently on me being proved right on this particular point.0 -
Some useful discussion on this in the replies here:
https://twitter.com/LadPolitics/status/11358479124313948160 -
Tories ran close in Ashfield though, always a more realistic target than Bolsover - the 2017 strategy of targetting leave seats was fine, just the execution blew.The_Taxman said:
I suppose it depends given that it is a hung parliament whether opinion poll ratings can be converted into net gains for a political party. It is no good decreasing majorities in Labour safe seats and increasing majorities in Tory held seats if the Tories don't gain much more on the ground! This applies across the country. At the last election the Tories got about 40% of the vote in Bolsover for instance, whereas Labour got over 50%. Political strategy has to be realistic not bordering on delusional.
The Tories probably shouldn't bother too much in Bolsover next time round, leave it for BXP to try and gain off Labour. Clowne should be a giant construction site come next GE anyway - locals really aren't happy about that.0 -
This is where the constitutional arguments seem to be raging. Resigning PM usually advises Queen on who to send, even if this has been signalled well beforehand through the usual channels etc etc.dodrade said:
Surely the Queen will send for them before any confidence vote?rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1135967150341013504
May might not be able to say that Boris (to take a random example) commands the majority.
Queen will already know from soundings and civil service etc etc.
All very tricky.
Depends whether the Tory Remain crew are rock solid in any plans not to give Boris any kind of Confidence Vote. In the end I doubt they will do this. But who knows.0 -
+1, same herekinabalu said:
If the election is before Brexit Labour will fight it on an offer of Ref2 with Remain as an option.Big_G_NorthWales said:Err Corbyn remain. Not a chance - he is as hard a brexiteer as any conservative
You can take that to the bank.
I stake all the kudos I have built up on here for so long and so diligently on me being proved right on this particular point.0 -
Replaces council tax. I'll need to ask my Dad for some inheritance upfront like @Charles if its as bad as being made out lol.another_richard said:
What's the garden tax idea ?Pulpstar said:
The absolute state of that garden tax idea - makes the Tories Dementia tax look a good idea.GIN1138 said:
In the end Rich Remainers will go with Boris to protect their houses and gardens from being "grabbed" by Jezza!kinabalu said:So, next election - Cons under Johnson offering Hard Brexit and Small State versus Lab under Corbyn offering Remain and Socialism.
No hiding place.0 -
The election will be during Brexit. A long campaign with Parliament devolved conveniently in the run up to 31 Oct.0
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Lidington temporarily I imagine. Either way May couldn't stay in office.Tissue_Price said:
Her Government might be. But where's the new PM coming from?TudorRose said:
If she couldn't recommend her elected successor then she wouldn't be able to command a majority (the Tories would never support her in such circumstances) and she would be required to resign anyway.Tissue_Price said:
Not if she can't recommend a successor whom she believes commands the confidence of the House.TudorRose said:
We will have a new PM; May will have resigned.rottenborough said:Actually, no Laura, we may not. The winner will need to be able to command the majority to become PM. No small feat in these times:
https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/11359671503410135040 -
What does the invited bit mean?Tissue_Price said:Some useful discussion on this in the replies here:
https://twitter.com/LadPolitics/status/1135847912431394816
If the PM to be has been to Palace and kissed the Queen's hand then iirc yes they are PM.0 -
Sunil, your support for the NHS is admirable. It is somewhat lessened by the point that your preferred option (leaving the EU) seems to have increased the possibility that it will be damaged.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Remainers don't care about the NHS!rottenborough said:2nd vote starting to shape up nicely:
https://twitter.com/johnmcternan/status/1135983115040673798
"Instead of spending billions on the NHS every year, let's give it to the EU instead"
How's that for the side of a bus?0
This discussion has been closed.