The Labour leadership are mad if they think this is good news for them. Just imagine the extent of Ian Austin's despair if he feels that he does not agree with TIG but he still feels compelled to resign the party whip over anti-Semitism.
Now think how many other Labour MPs will be pondering their options.
Huge story breaking in Italy. Putin agreed to a request from Lega Nord leader Matteo Salvini to covertly finance his Euro election campaign. The plan was to conceal the payment behind an apparently normal business deal.
Huge story breaking in Italy. Putin agreed to a request from Lega Nord leader Matteo Salvini to covertly finance his Euro election campaign. The plan was to conceal the payment behind an apparently normal business deal.
Whether this is Osborne having a pop at Javid I'm not certain but it's always good for Conservative Home Secretaries (at least within the constituency of the Conservative Party) to talk tough even if they don't act tough.
I confess to being conflicted on this and especially because of the newborn. I can't get past the notion the baby boy deserves a chance at life and I don't see why depriving him of either his nationality or his mother is a good idea.
There's absolutely no guarantee he'll end up a radicalised Islamist - indeed, he may not but he deserves an opportunity at life for all his mother supports those who callously deny others the opportunity of living.
One of the many lessons worth learning in politics is the popular answer isn't always the right answer, indeed, very often it isn't. Doing the right thing in the face of opposition from the majority is what the principled politician should be about, not courting cheap and easy headlines.
I couldn't give tuppence about this silly bint from Stratford, but I do care about due process and I want it followed.
In NC#9 news the GOP candidate, just after taking the stand and then conferring with council, claimed he had recently had two minor strokes, couldn't remeber anything and asked for an election re-run.
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
The Labour leadership are mad if they think this is good news for them. Just imagine the extent of Ian Austin's despair if he feels that he does not agree with TIG but he still feels compelled to resign the party whip over anti-Semitism.
Now think how many other Labour MPs will be pondering their options.
I've worked out one that won't be ... Kate Hoey, checking back through her history/positions she must be happier than a pig in shit being lead by Corbyn !
In NC#9 news the GOP candidate, just after taking the stand and then conferring with council, claimed he had recently had two minor strokes, couldn't remeber anything and asked for an election re-run.
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
I'd sign up for Libertarian Pirate Island
Don't give up on the other boxes! Except 4, of course.
In NC#9 news the GOP candidate, just after taking the stand and then conferring with council, claimed he had recently had two minor strokes, couldn't remeber anything and asked for an election re-run.
The Ads are going to be amazing.
That whole saga has been amazing to watch unfold.
And the seat is fascinating. Part Appalachian, part suburban part Native American reservations.
'The Life of Brian' has always been one of my favourite films. Looking back, it was almost prophetic. We've had lots Stans wanting to be Loretta, and now we've had the splitters. What else?
"You're got to really hate the Jezza to join us." "What has the EU ever done for us?" "Romani go home." The only thing missing in the film is 'MPs rule OK'.
Politics has become indistinguishable from farce. The only thing to do is enjoy it.
Anecdote alert: this was being talked about spontaneously on my train home last night by a group of three behind me. They were very tuned into all the facts.
Meanwhile those who aided and abetted their murderers, rapists and torturers should be put on trial over there.
Except that we don't really have any say in whether they face trial over there.
I don't advocate any heroic (if any at all) efforts on behalf of this woman - a stance which has the perhaps dubious merit of being consistent with the way the Foreign Office deals with many (most ?) UK citizens in trouble in 'difficult' states - but it is the removal of citizenship I object to.
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
I'd sign up for Libertarian Pirate Island
Don't give up on the other boxes! Except 4, of course.
2-5 I have no truck with, but Libertarian Pirate Island sounds fun. That and I am a Libertarian.
I think Caroline Flint should lead the Ian Austin party.
Austin-Power! National Man of Mystery.
Anyone know if he voted for May's Deal before? Presumably now free to do so if he wants....
yes he did vote for the deal and will do so again - he takes the sensible view that the UK needs to leave and this is the best and only deal that is there to be taken - if only more MPs were capable of such level headedness
In NC#9 news the GOP candidate, just after taking the stand and then conferring with council, claimed he had recently had two minor strokes, couldn't remeber anything and asked for an election re-run.
The Ads are going to be amazing.
That whole saga has been amazing to watch unfold.
And the seat is fascinating. Part Appalachian, part suburban part Native American reservations.
Still talking about Ilford?
That’s so yesterday, we’ve got a defection to talk about
I think Caroline Flint should lead the Ian Austin party.
Austin-Power! National Man of Mystery.
Anyone know if he voted for May's Deal before? Presumably now free to do so if he wants....
yes he did vote for the deal and will do so again - he takes the sensible view that the UK needs to leave and this is the best and only deal that is there to be taken - if only more MPs were capable of such level headedness
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
I'd sign up for Libertarian Pirate Island
Don't give up on the other boxes! Except 4, of course.
2-5 I have no truck with, but Libertarian Pirate Island sounds fun. That and I am a Libertarian.
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
I'd sign up for Libertarian Pirate Island
Don't give up on the other boxes! Except 4, of course.
2-5 I have no truck with, but Libertarian Pirate Island sounds fun. That and I am a Libertarian.
Sod bothering with international trade. We should just plunder what we from want from the high seas...
I can't get past the notion the baby boy deserves a chance at life and I don't see why depriving him of either his nationality or his mother is a good idea.
Javid has said in the HoC that he is not deprived of his nationality.
I suspect his life chances might be better with different parents, since his (evidently fat) (so shoot me, it had to be said) mother has already lost two children to malnutrition. Most emaciated children have emaciated mothers. Those two didn't.
Anecdote alert: this was being talked about spontaneously on my train home last night by a group of three behind me. They were very tuned into all the facts.
Where did their sympathies lie?
They were more discussing the case than expressing views. They were most interested in the baby.
I can't get past the notion the baby boy deserves a chance at life and I don't see why depriving him of either his nationality or his mother is a good idea.
Javid has said in the HoC that he is not deprived of his nationality.
I suspect his life chances might be better with different parents, since his (evidently fat) (so shoot me, it had to be said) mother has already lost two children to malnutrition. Most emaciated children have emaciated mothers. Those two didn't.
He’s born in a foreign country to parents without british citizenship, what law makes the baby more british than them?
Trying to recall an article I read back at the start of the shitshow that has been Corbyn's 'leadership' that predicted we'd end up with a Lab split, and a court battle for the name/assets from the hard left rump.
I can't get past the notion the baby boy deserves a chance at life and I don't see why depriving him of either his nationality or his mother is a good idea.
Javid has said in the HoC that he is not deprived of his nationality.
I suspect his life chances might be better with different parents, since his (evidently fat) (so shoot me, it had to be said) mother has already lost two children to malnutrition. Most emaciated children have emaciated mothers. Those two didn't.
He’s born in a foreign country to parents without british citizenship, what law makes the baby more british than them?
He was born before his mother lost (subject to appeal) her citizenship, so he's British.
I can't get past the notion the baby boy deserves a chance at life and I don't see why depriving him of either his nationality or his mother is a good idea.
Javid has said in the HoC that he is not deprived of his nationality.
I suspect his life chances might be better with different parents, since his (evidently fat) (so shoot me, it had to be said) mother has already lost two children to malnutrition. Most emaciated children have emaciated mothers. Those two didn't.
He’s born in a foreign country to parents without british citizenship, what law makes the baby more british than them?
Was he not born before Shameema lost her citizenship?
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
I'd sign up for Libertarian Pirate Island
Don't give up on the other boxes! Except 4, of course.
2-5 I have no truck with, but Libertarian Pirate Island sounds fun. That and I am a Libertarian.
And a Pirate?
Of course, no man is an Island...
No not a pirate but pirates are cool. And we are an island.
An island in the persona of a swashbuckling, libertarian Jonny Depp? I can live with that.
For the gamers here, we'd probably end up more like Guybrush Threepwood.
Now that Austin has gone, I wonder how long this holds...
Birmingham's nine Labour MPs have vowed to stay in the party.
They said: "We will continue to fight for the better future we know is possible, standing together as part of the Labour family, with our trade unions, socialist societies and in Parliament as Labour MP's."
The city's Labour MPs are Liam Byrne (Lab Hodge Hill), Shabana Mahmood (Lab Ladywood), Preet Kaur Gill (Lab Edgbaston), Jack Dromey (Lab Erdington), Khalid Mahmood (Lab Perry Barr), Roger Godsiff (Lab Hall Green), Steve McCabe (Lab Selly Oak), Jess Phillips (Lab Yardley) and Richard Burden (Lab Northfield).
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
I'd sign up for Libertarian Pirate Island
Don't give up on the other boxes! Except 4, of course.
2-5 I have no truck with, but Libertarian Pirate Island sounds fun. That and I am a Libertarian.
Sod bothering with international trade. We should just plunder what we from want from the high seas...
Like we used to!
Another one of those interesting charts which charts the collapse of UK exports from 1970 to today. All the way from third in the world to.....well, you'll have to watch it yourself!
Anecdote alert: this was being talked about spontaneously on my train home last night by a group of three behind me. They were very tuned into all the facts.
Where did their sympathies lie?
They were more discussing the case than expressing views. They were most interested in the baby.
The baby will probably have more rights than most British people, including me
Anecdote alert: this was being talked about spontaneously on my train home last night by a group of three behind me. They were very tuned into all the facts.
Where did their sympathies lie?
I understand all the positions on this. Before finding out she had alternative claims to citizenship elsewhere, I was all for bringing her back to face justice. Now not so much.
Surprised to find many supposedly more ‘liberal’ and ‘centrist’ friends have been against her coming back, from the start.
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
The last time the Liberals won over 100 seats in any election was 1923 (156) - so a bit longer ago than 'before the Second World War!' Even in 1931 they only got 73, and that was split three ways.
Anecdote alert: this was being talked about spontaneously on my train home last night by a group of three behind me. They were very tuned into all the facts.
Where did their sympathies lie?
I understand all the positions on this. Before finding out she had alternative claims to citizenship elsewhere, I was all for bringing her back to face justice. Now not so much.
Surprised to find many supposedly more ‘liberal’ and ‘centrist’ friends have been against her coming back, from the start.
I have a Corbynista facebook friend -whp is actually half-Iranian - who is of the opinion that she has got exactly what she deserved and is vociferously opposed to her returning.
I can't get past the notion the baby boy deserves a chance at life and I don't see why depriving him of either his nationality or his mother is a good idea.
Javid has said in the HoC that he is not deprived of his nationality.
I suspect his life chances might be better with different parents, since his (evidently fat) (so shoot me, it had to be said) mother has already lost two children to malnutrition. Most emaciated children have emaciated mothers. Those two didn't.
If we're now suggesting she ate them, does that mean she gets to join the Tory party?
The reactions of the far left to the news of MPs resigning from Labour provide the most compelling evidence as to why those MPs were right to do so.
As unlikely as it is, can you imagine if Corbyn is left reenacting Downfall, with MPs shedding on all sides and Corbyn leading an increasingly delusional group of fanatics?
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
The 1923GE was the last election when more than 100 non-Tory/Labour MPs were elected, and the 1924GE saw that number drop. So it's been about 95 years since we've had this many MPs from outside the duopoly.
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
The last time the Liberals won over 100 seats in any election was 1923 (156) - so a bit longer ago than 'before the Second World War!' Even in 1931 they only got 73, and that was split three ways.
1931 had 84 non-Tory National MPs (including Liberals), 8 non-Labour Labour Opposition MPs and 12 others. So that is a total of 102 not from (official) Labour or Conservatives.
On topic, the most interesting fact in the podcast is the early indication that the potential support for a new centre force is drawn widely in terms of age, class etc. and isn't coming predominantly from the middle class-remainer constituency you might expect.
The podcast cuts off suddenly after that, so I don't think the audio file has been fully uploaded?
Can May call a GE and then deselect everyone in the ERG (plus Grieve) ?
If Brexit does get stopped, their monkey antics will be a large part of the reason why.
I separate the ERG gang into five groups:
1) Those who want Libertarian Pirate Island and thought Brexit could achieve it as few people actually want unlimited immigration and no welfare state
2) The death culters who refuse to have any deals with the EU
3) Those who don't really want to leave the EU as it would mean having to take responsibility and no longer being able to blame Brussels for everything
4) Those who think opposition to any deal will improve their chances of becoming Conservative leader
5) Useful idiots of one or more of the above
Brilliant post, Richard. Made my morning. :-)
Cheers Peter.
I have to give thanks to PB in general for ideas and in particular EiT for 'Libertarian Pirate Island' and AM for 'Death Cult'.
I'd sign up for Libertarian Pirate Island
Don't give up on the other boxes! Except 4, of course.
2-5 I have no truck with, but Libertarian Pirate Island sounds fun. That and I am a Libertarian.
And a Pirate?
Of course, no man is an Island...
No not a pirate but pirates are cool. And we are an island.
An island in the persona of a swashbuckling, libertarian Jonny Depp? I can live with that.
For the gamers here, we'd probably end up more like Guybrush Threepwood.
I'm reminded of the South Park episode where the boys go off to become pirates, and wind up in Somalia.
Big numbers would need a big beast to lead them out the wilderness.
Cooper. Or Starmer.
Cooper and Starmer are only really big beasts by the standards of this board. Fairly sure few of the school-gate parents would be able to accurateky place Cooper and almost none Starmer. They need Miliband, Miliband or Balls.
I foresee a speedy, but also probably sustained and terminal decline in Corbyn's popularity (and Labour while he's leader) after this week.
Although the splitters are so far few in number, I suspect they (a) have hit home with a new group of voters over Brexit and anti-semitism (which if it doesn't resonate on its own, will in terms of "being mates with that dodgy Palestinian lot") and (b) given them a new home for centrist protest votes which isn't tainted with Coalition betrayal nonsense.
Labour's support has held up so far on grounds of being "the only anti-Tory show in town" (and, bizarrely, held many Remainers as a result). Although in practical terms that hasn't yet changed, the perception probably has.
TIG may well be a flash in the pan.. but even if no-one else joined and it withered in a GE in three months' time, I suspect enough damage has already been done.
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
The last time the Liberals won over 100 seats in any election was 1923 (156) - so a bit longer ago than 'before the Second World War!' Even in 1931 they only got 73, and that was split three ways.
1931 had 84 non-Tory National MPs (including Liberals), 8 non-Labour Labour Opposition MPs and 12 others. So that is a total of 102 not from (official) Labour or Conservatives.
Thanks, so we'd have to do a bit of research to see how long that number stayed above 100 before 1935.
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
The last time the Liberals won over 100 seats in any election was 1923 (156) - so a bit longer ago than 'before the Second World War!' Even in 1931 they only got 73, and that was split three ways.
1931 had 84 non-Tory National MPs (including Liberals), 8 non-Labour Labour Opposition MPs and 12 others. So that is a total of 102 not from (official) Labour or Conservatives.
A very large number of those 'non-Tory national' seats would have been won by the Tories had they contested them. You cannot include National MPs as 'outside' the governing party. That on its own makes it a very unusual election and not one for valid comparisons.
Edit - to reinforce that, from memory I quote Trevor Wilson noting over half the Liberals' seats were won in the absence of Tory candidates - 'In 1929, the party won seats in its own strength. In 1931, it held them by the grace of their traditional enemies.'
MaybeIan Austin, Frank Field and John Woodcockcould form a party? There might be a few on the Labiyr benches keen to join the non-Chuka block. In fact, I'd be tempted to vote for that overlooked corner of the Labour party.
Anecdote alert: this was being talked about spontaneously on my train home last night by a group of three behind me. They were very tuned into all the facts.
Where did their sympathies lie?
I understand all the positions on this. Before finding out she had alternative claims to citizenship elsewhere, I was all for bringing her back to face justice. Now not so much.
Surprised to find many supposedly more ‘liberal’ and ‘centrist’ friends have been against her coming back, from the start.
I have a Corbynista facebook friend -whp is actually half-Iranian - who is of the opinion that she has got exactly what she deserved and is vociferously opposed to her returning.
The Iranians have been imprisoning and shooting Isis "brides".
I’m not sure how widely commented upon this has been but the real reason MPs are jumping ship from Labour now, and not before, is because magic grandpa has gone off the boil.
That’s due in no small part to both Brexit and the anti-semitism but, if he was still polling very strongly with both members and Labour voters, then I doubt this split would have come about.
The TIGers and independents now have hope there’s both a constituency for them and that others have a chance of regaining their party.
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
The last time the Liberals won over 100 seats in any election was 1923 (156) - so a bit longer ago than 'before the Second World War!' Even in 1931 they only got 73, and that was split three ways.
1931 had 84 non-Tory National MPs (including Liberals), 8 non-Labour Labour Opposition MPs and 12 others. So that is a total of 102 not from (official) Labour or Conservatives.
Thanks, so we'd have to do a bit of research to see how long that number stayed above 100 before 1935.
I can't get past the notion the baby boy deserves a chance at life and I don't see why depriving him of either his nationality or his mother is a good idea.
Javid has said in the HoC that he is not deprived of his nationality.
I suspect his life chances might be better with different parents, since his (evidently fat) (so shoot me, it had to be said) mother has already lost two children to malnutrition. Most emaciated children have emaciated mothers. Those two didn't.
If we're now suggesting she ate them, does that mean she gets to join the Tory party?
Shush! Jeremy will retract his support for her return!
I think we are very close to having 100 MPs not from Labour or the Conservatives in the Commons for the first time since before WWII when the Liberals were still winning lots of seats. I'm not sure whether Ian Austin is the 100th or the 99th.
The last time the Liberals won over 100 seats in any election was 1923 (156) - so a bit longer ago than 'before the Second World War!' Even in 1931 they only got 73, and that was split three ways.
1931 had 84 non-Tory National MPs (including Liberals), 8 non-Labour Labour Opposition MPs and 12 others. So that is a total of 102 not from (official) Labour or Conservatives.
Thanks, so we'd have to do a bit of research to see how long that number stayed above 100 before 1935.
1929 wasn't so good
59, I believe? Enough to deprive both parties of a majority, not enough to make a decisive difference to the overall political landscape.
Possibly true - but sounds rogue, if true, given the response from the PM down to the Tory resigners, compared to many Labour responses to their losses.
I foresee a speedy, but also probably sustained and terminal decline in Corbyn's popularity (and Labour while he's leader) after this week.
Although the splitters are so far few in number, I suspect they (a) have hit home with a new group of voters over Brexit and anti-semitism (which if it doesn't resonate on its own, will in terms of "being mates with that dodgy Palestinian lot") and (b) given them a new home for centrist protest votes which isn't tainted with Coalition betrayal nonsense.
Labour's support has held up so far on grounds of being "the only anti-Tory show in town" (and, bizarrely, held many Remainers as a result). Although in practical terms that hasn't yet changed, the perception probably has.
TIG may well be a flash in the pan.. but even if no-one else joined and it withered in a GE in three months' time, I suspect enough damage has already been done.
It depends, a number of people keep saying this increases the odds of an early election - an early election though would kill this split and shore up Corbyn.
Until Tiggers are an actual party and until they are in a position to contest ~600+ seats there is no actual alternative even if people poll differently.
If people are polled and say TIG or equivalent but then there's an early election and the options are Tory, Labour or Lib Dem then (if the Lib Dems are still viewed as toxic) there's every possibility the Labour vote would be shored up. And an early election would purge Parliament of all the Tiggers, Austin etc.
There needs to be a couple of years to allow TIG to mature.
Big numbers would need a big beast to lead them out the wilderness.
Cooper. Or Starmer.
Cooper and Starmer are only really big beasts by the standards of this board. Fairly sure few of the school-gate parents would be able to accurateky place Cooper and almost none Starmer. They need Miliband, Miliband or Balls.
Has anything been heard from the Prince over the Water?
Despite the rumours of lots more to come is it really likely. Austin was seen as probable for days now, how many others have been seen as likely and not denied it yet?
Comments
Now think how many other Labour MPs will be pondering their options.
http://espresso.repubblica.it/inchieste/2019/02/20/news/esclusivo-lega-milioni-russia-1.331835
Javid is grandstanding, pure and simple.
https://twitter.com/SkySportsNews/status/1098880966553202689
I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you.
(Edit - incidentally, I had a quick scroll through the document at the bottom and although I am not a lawyer I agree with you.)
The Ads are going to be amazing.
Anyone know if he voted for May's Deal before? Presumably now free to do so if he wants....
"You're got to really hate the Jezza to join us." "What has the EU ever done for us?" "Romani go home." The only thing missing in the film is 'MPs rule OK'.
Politics has become indistinguishable from farce. The only thing to do is enjoy it.
I don't advocate any heroic (if any at all) efforts on behalf of this woman - a stance which has the perhaps dubious merit of being consistent with the way the Foreign Office deals with many (most ?) UK citizens in trouble in 'difficult' states - but it is the removal of citizenship I object to.
That’s so yesterday, we’ve got a defection to talk about
Big numbers rumours!
It's the way to go.....
Of course, no man is an Island...
Like we used to!
I suspect his life chances might be better with different parents, since his (evidently fat) (so shoot me, it had to be said) mother has already lost two children to malnutrition. Most emaciated children have emaciated mothers. Those two didn't.
Cooper. Or Starmer.
Trying to recall an article I read back at the start of the shitshow that has been Corbyn's 'leadership' that predicted we'd end up with a Lab split, and a court battle for the name/assets from the hard left rump.
"I think Caroline Flint should lead the Ian Austin party."
A man after my own heart. You've chosen one who's reasonably good-looking. Welcome to the Shallow Party.
https://twitter.com/TomMcTague/status/1098879884519268353
An island in the persona of a swashbuckling, libertarian Jonny Depp? I can live with that.
For the gamers here, we'd probably end up more like Guybrush Threepwood.
Birmingham's nine Labour MPs have vowed to stay in the party.
They said: "We will continue to fight for the better future we know is possible, standing together as part of the Labour family, with our trade unions, socialist societies and in Parliament as Labour MP's."
The city's Labour MPs are Liam Byrne (Lab Hodge Hill), Shabana Mahmood (Lab Ladywood), Preet Kaur Gill (Lab Edgbaston), Jack Dromey (Lab Erdington), Khalid Mahmood (Lab Perry Barr), Roger Godsiff (Lab Hall Green), Steve McCabe (Lab Selly Oak), Jess Phillips (Lab Yardley) and Richard Burden (Lab Northfield).
https://www.birminghampost.co.uk/news/regional-affairs/labour-split-birminghams-nine-labour-15852530
https://twitter.com/nickyebrennan/status/1098875251767808000
https://youtu.be/PusEVOeVZUs
life imitates art
Surprised to find many supposedly more ‘liberal’ and ‘centrist’ friends have been against her coming back, from the start.
What a shocking attitude. For every MP that goes there's a lot of voters who think like that MP - same in any potential split for the Tories too.
The reactions of the far left to the news of MPs resigning from Labour provide the most compelling evidence as to why those MPs were right to do so.
The podcast cuts off suddenly after that, so I don't think the audio file has been fully uploaded?
They need Miliband, Miliband or Balls.
Although the splitters are so far few in number, I suspect they (a) have hit home with a new group of voters over Brexit and anti-semitism (which if it doesn't resonate on its own, will in terms of "being mates with that dodgy Palestinian lot") and (b) given them a new home for centrist protest votes which isn't tainted with Coalition betrayal nonsense.
Labour's support has held up so far on grounds of being "the only anti-Tory show in town" (and, bizarrely, held many Remainers as a result). Although in practical terms that hasn't yet changed, the perception probably has.
TIG may well be a flash in the pan.. but even if no-one else joined and it withered in a GE in three months' time, I suspect enough damage has already been done.
Edit - to reinforce that, from memory I quote Trevor Wilson noting over half the Liberals' seats were won in the absence of Tory candidates - 'In 1929, the party won seats in its own strength. In 1931, it held them by the grace of their traditional enemies.'
That’s due in no small part to both Brexit and the anti-semitism but, if he was still polling very strongly with both members and Labour voters, then I doubt this split would have come about.
The TIGers and independents now have hope there’s both a constituency for them and that others have a chance of regaining their party.
We need more polling.
"Tens of thousands of Americans die each year from opioid overdoses
The federal response remains sluggish and inadequate"
https://www.economist.com/briefing/2019/02/23/tens-of-thousands-of-americans-die-each-year-from-opioid-overdoses
Possibly true - but sounds rogue, if true, given the response from the PM down to the Tory resigners, compared to many Labour responses to their losses.
https://twitter.com/JournoStephen/status/1098617996816330757
Until Tiggers are an actual party and until they are in a position to contest ~600+ seats there is no actual alternative even if people poll differently.
If people are polled and say TIG or equivalent but then there's an early election and the options are Tory, Labour or Lib Dem then (if the Lib Dems are still viewed as toxic) there's every possibility the Labour vote would be shored up. And an early election would purge Parliament of all the Tiggers, Austin etc.
There needs to be a couple of years to allow TIG to mature.