politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Kamala Harris – my WH2020 66/1 pick from two years ago – set t
Comments
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On previous topic, I'm sorry I missed the discussion on what was a really stimulating thread from @Alanbrooke.0
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SEN HARRIS, to you.Theuniondivvie said:Bet only gets tasty when Kamala becomes KAMALA.
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The Irish manage well with it.Benpointer said:
The lesson is: government by referendums would be totally shite.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yep. MPs are not there for the people, only for themselves.kinabalu said:
Looks like it.grabcocque said:Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamentary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit with a Deal.
And as we know, MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit without a Deal.
Put that together, bit of simple algebra, and what do we get?
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit!
That poor old 2016 referendum. So high and mighty, back in the day, so loud and proud, and now with as much status and influence as a eunuch at an orgy.
Lesson there somewhere.
Infrequent (But massive) referenda + FPTP is a recipe for failure though.
Frequent referendums + STV =
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We discussed it a while back when he wrote to the PM. It was a completely incoherent whinge; he seemed to be complaining simultaneously that Theresa May was wanting to cooperate too closely with the EU, and that she was not wanting to cooperate closely enough.Richard_Tyndall said:
Rather too easy a dismissal I would think. Writing to the Constituency Chairmen to get them to put pressure on their MPs can't exactly help May.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
And how many people would even know when he was head of MI6? All they will see will be head of MI6 and Chief of Defence staff and assume they know what they are talking about.0 -
If there is another referendum and Remain won. Who would want to be PM for that sh1t show ?williamglenn said:
If you can narrow it down to two defined outcomes that parliament cannot decide between, either you have a referendum or get a new parliament. A referendum seems like the better option if the reason parliament can’t decide is that it’s inhibited by the result of another referendum.david_herdson said:
As I keep saying, 'new GE' and 'EURef2' are not Brexit outcomes, they're processes (though they are related possible consequences).SeanT said:grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
The Deal cannot return after that, not in any form, not even if she gets meaningless promises from Brussels cast in Welsh gold and deposited at the centre of the earth.
That leaves No Deal, new GE, 2nd referendum. No?
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There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
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Corbyn wouldTGOHF said:
If there is another referendum and Remain won. Who would want to be PM for that sh1t show ?williamglenn said:
If you can narrow it down to two defined outcomes that parliament cannot decide between, either you have a referendum or get a new parliament. A referendum seems like the better option if the reason parliament can’t decide is that it’s inhibited by the result of another referendum.david_herdson said:
As I keep saying, 'new GE' and 'EURef2' are not Brexit outcomes, they're processes (though they are related possible consequences).SeanT said:grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
The Deal cannot return after that, not in any form, not even if she gets meaningless promises from Brussels cast in Welsh gold and deposited at the centre of the earth.
That leaves No Deal, new GE, 2nd referendum. No?0 -
William Glenn your time is now!TGOHF said:
If there is another referendum and Remain won. Who would want to be PM for that sh1t show ?williamglenn said:
If you can narrow it down to two defined outcomes that parliament cannot decide between, either you have a referendum or get a new parliament. A referendum seems like the better option if the reason parliament can’t decide is that it’s inhibited by the result of another referendum.david_herdson said:
As I keep saying, 'new GE' and 'EURef2' are not Brexit outcomes, they're processes (though they are related possible consequences).SeanT said:grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
The Deal cannot return after that, not in any form, not even if she gets meaningless promises from Brussels cast in Welsh gold and deposited at the centre of the earth.
That leaves No Deal, new GE, 2nd referendum. No?
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Not an unfair representation.Nemtynakht said:Yes it’s fantastic for democracy that 17 plus million people who were told that their decision would be enacted will see it disregarded by 400 people.
Still, Brexit cancelled - believe it when I see it and not before.0 -
Boris.TGOHF said:
If there is another referendum and Remain won. Who would want to be PM for that sh1t show ?williamglenn said:
If you can narrow it down to two defined outcomes that parliament cannot decide between, either you have a referendum or get a new parliament. A referendum seems like the better option if the reason parliament can’t decide is that it’s inhibited by the result of another referendum.david_herdson said:
As I keep saying, 'new GE' and 'EURef2' are not Brexit outcomes, they're processes (though they are related possible consequences).SeanT said:grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
The Deal cannot return after that, not in any form, not even if she gets meaningless promises from Brussels cast in Welsh gold and deposited at the centre of the earth.
That leaves No Deal, new GE, 2nd referendum. No?0 -
Benpointer said:
Corbyn wouldTGOHF said:
If there is another referendum and Remain won. Who would want to be PM for that sh1t show ?williamglenn said:
If you can narrow it down to two defined outcomes that parliament cannot decide between, either you have a referendum or get a new parliament. A referendum seems like the better option if the reason parliament can’t decide is that it’s inhibited by the result of another referendum.david_herdson said:
As I keep saying, 'new GE' and 'EURef2' are not Brexit outcomes, they're processes (though they are related possible consequences).SeanT said:grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
The Deal cannot return after that, not in any form, not even if she gets meaningless promises from Brussels cast in Welsh gold and deposited at the centre of the earth.
That leaves No Deal, new GE, 2nd referendum. No?
He'd be even happier to be PM after No Deal though... Jeremy Corbyn has been Leave for 40 years doncha know! 0 -
"I never said this... and when I did say it, I never meant...."williamglenn said:Trump sounds weak here.
https://twitter.com/scottmcgrew/status/1083378976465121280?s=21
One of the many bits The Apprentice would have edited out...0 -
Completely party free no. But the power of the whips has increased massively over the last century and that has been much to the detriment of our politics. My answer, which is always scorned, would be to make the party bribing (via promotion promises etc) or blackmailing (through deselection threats) an MP a criminal offence just as it is if anyone outside does it.Polruan said:
Was there a time where we had party-free representative democracy? I thought if anything the party system came before there was a broad franchise.Richard_Tyndall said:
Ah now you are talking. I get a lot of stick on here (and will again) for railing against the parties and the whips. I feel strongly that the party system is a corruption of our political system and should be massively reformed. It will never happen of course because there are too many vested interests opposing change.Anazina said:
The nation would be a better place – and better governed – if members of political parties were barred from voting at all.Richard_Tyndall said:
Oh yes. I am not saying I agree with their choice but to claim somehow it is undemocratic for an association to choose who they want as their candidate under the system as it stands seems rather perverse.grabcocque said:
Boles, of course, merely has to let it be known he will happily stand as an Independent and split the Tory vote, if that is the outcome they desire.Richard_Tyndall said:
They want him deselected as their candidate. It does not affect his current status as an MP until the next election. And according to the most recent YouGov poll in the constituency support for Brexit has actually gone up rather than down since the referendum.TheScreamingEagles said:
Personally I am on the same page as Boles when it comes to the preferred form of Brexit but that is apparently not a view shared by his constituents.
MPs would declare their party affiliation (which would be confirmed by the party) at the time of selection but once they had been elected all votes in Parliament would be free votes with perhaps the exception of the finance bills.
MPs would be representing their constituents rather than their party.
As I say it will never happen but it would be great if it did.0 -
AIDS. AIDS is worse than RemainingRichard_Tyndall said:
Nah. Nothing is worse than remaining.SeanT said:
As someone said, the more you look into TMay’s deal, the worse it gets. It is dreadful, and we cannot escape it - we will end up simply abrogating, with all the damage that does to our standing.FrancisUrquhart said:
Apparently though the spooks are hopping mad due to some of the bollocks May deal would have the UK sign up to e.g. Basically paying for access to shared intell, which the UK provides the vast majority of the info to.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
As a Leaver, I would far rather Remain, than sign this disgraceful suicide note.0 -
Nope. As long as the referendums were proper binary choices and MPs could not refuse to enact them. It is the way forward and far more democratic than the current system.Benpointer said:
The lesson is: government by referendums would be totally shite.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yep. MPs are not there for the people, only for themselves.kinabalu said:
Looks like it.grabcocque said:Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamentary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit with a Deal.
And as we know, MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit without a Deal.
Put that together, bit of simple algebra, and what do we get?
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit!
That poor old 2016 referendum. So high and mighty, back in the day, so loud and proud, and now with as much status and influence as a eunuch at an orgy.
Lesson there somewhere.0 -
Who gets to dictate the questions?Richard_Tyndall said:
Nope. As long as the referendums were proper binary choices and MPs could not refuse to enact them. It is the way forward and far more democratic than the current system.Benpointer said:
The lesson is: government by referendums would be totally shite.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yep. MPs are not there for the people, only for themselves.kinabalu said:
Looks like it.grabcocque said:Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamentary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit with a Deal.
And as we know, MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit without a Deal.
Put that together, bit of simple algebra, and what do we get?
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit!
That poor old 2016 referendum. So high and mighty, back in the day, so loud and proud, and now with as much status and influence as a eunuch at an orgy.
Lesson there somewhere.0 -
Specifically the Hard Brexit opponents of the deal voted with the government in the recent votes as they are quite happy to see no deal happen.Benpointer said:
Don't ever worry about asking questions you fear may be dumb on PB - I do it all the time!AndyJS said:
I know this question makes me sound a bit thick (as usual), but can anyone explain why the figures are expected to be different in the key vote compared to the two that the government lost in the last few days?grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
I think the difference is the 120+ Tories who have stated they are agin the Deal. Most of those voted for the Govt in the recent votes.0 -
Though I have money on her, Sen. Harris must hope Trump is unacquainted with the works of Henry Fielding...0
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The last few days' votes were driven by pro-remain Conservatives voting against the government.AndyJS said:
I know this question makes me sound a bit thick (as usual), but can anyone explain why the figures are expected to be different in the key vote compared to the two that the government lost in the last few days?grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
The key vote will also have all the pro-no-deal Conservatives and the DUP voting against it.0 -
AIDS is treatable.rcs1000 said:
AIDS. AIDS is worse than RemainingRichard_Tyndall said:
Nah. Nothing is worse than remaining.SeanT said:
As someone said, the more you look into TMay’s deal, the worse it gets. It is dreadful, and we cannot escape it - we will end up simply abrogating, with all the damage that does to our standing.FrancisUrquhart said:
Apparently though the spooks are hopping mad due to some of the bollocks May deal would have the UK sign up to e.g. Basically paying for access to shared intell, which the UK provides the vast majority of the info to.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
As a Leaver, I would far rather Remain, than sign this disgraceful suicide note.0 -
The Irish have also started having citizens assemblies to find a sensible compromise to bring forward to a referendum vote. If we had done something like that before the referendum (or even after) we would be in a much better place. Unfortunately these assemblies seem to involve "experts" and so are anathema to the British political class.Pulpstar said:
The Irish manage well with it.Benpointer said:
The lesson is: government by referendums would be totally shite.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yep. MPs are not there for the people, only for themselves.kinabalu said:
Looks like it.grabcocque said:Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamentary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit with a Deal.
And as we know, MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit without a Deal.
Put that together, bit of simple algebra, and what do we get?
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit!
That poor old 2016 referendum. So high and mighty, back in the day, so loud and proud, and now with as much status and influence as a eunuch at an orgy.
Lesson there somewhere.
Infrequent (But massive) referenda + FPTP is a recipe for failure though.
Frequent referendums + STV =0 -
We need a referendum we can all unite around and I've got the perfect question:Richard_Tyndall said:
Nope. As long as the referendums were proper binary choices and MPs could not refuse to enact them. It is the way forward and far more democratic than the current system.Benpointer said:
The lesson is: government by referendums would be totally shite.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yep. MPs are not there for the people, only for themselves.kinabalu said:
Looks like it.grabcocque said:Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamentary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit with a Deal.
And as we know, MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit without a Deal.
Put that together, bit of simple algebra, and what do we get?
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit!
That poor old 2016 referendum. So high and mighty, back in the day, so loud and proud, and now with as much status and influence as a eunuch at an orgy.
Lesson there somewhere.
Would You Like To See The Current House Of Lords Abolished?
YES
NO
YES wins by 90%? 0 -
538's pretty graphs suggest Kamala should be favourite, based on appeal to the five classes Nate Silver identifies.AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-5-key-constituencies-of-the-2020-democratic-primary/0 -
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
But what on earth does that leave?
Brian, has that Deal thing already gone in the shredder? It has? Ah.0 -
Doesn’t seem to deserve scorn, I guess it would be very difficult to police the ‘bribing’ offence though. And I’m not sure how you could deal with the threat of deselection, given that is driven by local party members. What would be the point of party affiliation under this system?Richard_Tyndall said:
Completely party free no. But the power of the whips has increased massively over the last century and that has been much to the detriment of our politics. My answer, which is always scorned, would be to make the party bribing (via promotion promises etc) or blackmailing (through deselection threats) an MP a criminal offence just as it is if anyone outside does it.Polruan said:
Was there a time where we had party-free representative democracy? I thought if anything the party system came before there was a broad franchise.Richard_Tyndall said:
Ah now you are talking. I get a lot of stick on here (and will again) for railing against the parties and the whips. I feel strongly that the party system is a corruption of our political system and should be massively reformed. It will never happen of course because there are too many vested interests opposing change.Anazina said:
The nation would be a better place – and better governed – if members of political parties were barred from voting at all.Richard_Tyndall said:
Oh yes. I am not saying I agree with their choice but to claim somehow it is undemocratic for an association to choose who they want as their candidate under the system as it stands seems rather perverse.grabcocque said:
Boles, of course, merely has to let it be known he will happily stand as an Independent and split the Tory vote, if that is the outcome they desire.Richard_Tyndall said:
They want him deselected as their candidate. It does not affect his current status as an MP until the next election. And according to the most recent YouGov poll inTheScreamingEagles said:
Personally I am on the same page as Boles when it comes to the preferred form of Brexit but that is apparently not a view shared by his constituents.
MPs would declare their party affiliation (which would be confirmed by the party) at the time of selection but once they had been elected all votes in Parliament would be free votes with perhaps the exception of the finance bills.
MPs would be representing their constituents rather than their party.
As I say it will never happen but it would be great if it did.
It’s not too dissimilar to the revolutionary system called ‘democracy’ that Jim Hacker briefly flirted with in Yes Prime Minister.0 -
Trump needs to Make America Grate Again:
https://www.theguardian.com/food/2019/jan/10/america-cheese-surplus-production-dairy-farmers0 -
What Ireland does is:
1) The government comes to a decision it wishes to amend the constitution.
2) Government convenes a constitutional committee to draft a constitutional amendment.
3) Amendment is ratified by both houses.
4) The amendment is put to the people in a referendum.
5) The President signs the amendment as soon as possible after the referendum result has been certified and it becomes effective forthwith.
Do you see how very different that is from what Call Me Dave did?0 -
Harris expected to declare on the 21st:
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/424674-kamala-harris-to-enter-presidential-race-on-or-around-mlk-day-report0 -
pitiful.Richard_Tyndall said:
Nah. Nothing is worse than remaining.SeanT said:
As someone said, the more you look into TMay’s deal, the worse it gets. It is dreadful, and we cannot escape it - we will end up simply abrogating, with all the damage that does to our standing.FrancisUrquhart said:
Apparently though the spooks are hopping mad due to some of the bollocks May deal would have the UK sign up to e.g. Basically paying for access to shared intell, which the UK provides the vast majority of the info to.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
As a Leaver, I would far rather Remain, than sign this disgraceful suicide note.0 -
It's actually pretty close to the system that China uses, with lower level assemblies electing members for the next level up.Polruan said:
It’s not too dissimilar to the revolutionary system called ‘democracy’ that Jim Hacker briefly flirted with in Yes Prime Minister.
Far from being democratic, that gives the local party machine at each level almost complete control of who moves up the chain of command, and ensures that there's always an opposition-proof majority of party members at every level.
That's not democracy, that's hierarchical oligarchy.0 -
Additionally impossible to separate their personal views on Brexit from their professional opinions. They might have had more credibility if they had said that either No Deal or Remain was preferable rather than promoting No Deal.Richard_Nabavi said:
We discussed it a while back when he wrote to the PM. It was a completely incoherent whinge; he seemed to be complaining simultaneously that Theresa May was wanting to cooperate too closely with the EU, and that she was not wanting to cooperate closely enough.Richard_Tyndall said:
Rather too easy a dismissal I would think. Writing to the Constituency Chairmen to get them to put pressure on their MPs can't exactly help May.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
And how many people would even know when he was head of MI6? All they will see will be head of MI6 and Chief of Defence staff and assume they know what they are talking about.0 -
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.0 -
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
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Legislators in the border states don't support Trump's wall:
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/01/10/border-lawmakers-spurn-trump-wall-proposal-1071707
(And it's notable that states on the Mexico border have lower crime rates than the national average.)0 -
Heels, both of you.Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
And he talks of others being fanatics...IanB2 said:
pitiful.Richard_Tyndall said:
Nah. Nothing is worse than remaining.SeanT said:
As someone said, the more you look into TMay’s deal, the worse it gets. It is dreadful, and we cannot escape it - we will end up simply abrogating, with all the damage that does to our standing.FrancisUrquhart said:
Apparently though the spooks are hopping mad due to some of the bollocks May deal would have the UK sign up to e.g. Basically paying for access to shared intell, which the UK provides the vast majority of the info to.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
As a Leaver, I would far rather Remain, than sign this disgraceful suicide note.0 -
Tell that to my thighs.Benpointer said:
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
Give it timegrabcocque said:
Tell that to my thighs.Benpointer said:
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
If May tries to arrange an extension or another referendum she is utter toast.MarqueeMark said:
No Deal is the Vampire Option. The Undead, unless and until Parliament can decide whether to use crosses, holy water or a stake through the heart and beheading.Richard_Tyndall said:
Again. Not possible. It is the only option that is actually assured if all other options fail.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
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Bercow was 6'5" when he became Speaker.Benpointer said:
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
Is that his hat size?david_herdson said:
Bercow was 6'5" when he became Speaker.Benpointer said:
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
That's the length of Bercow's ego when fully erect.FrancisUrquhart said:
Is that his hat size?david_herdson said:
Bercow was 6'5" when he became Speaker.Benpointer said:
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
LOL. Indeed. Mind you the arguments about difficulty of policing were all touted way back when they were tightening up on bribery at the beginning of the last century. Apparently the HoC and MPs were specifically excluded from the Prevention of Corruption Acts as being an MP did not constitute a public office.Polruan said:Doesn’t seem to deserve scorn, I guess it would be very difficult to police the ‘bribing’ offence though. And I’m not sure how you could deal with the threat of deselection, given that is driven by local party members. What would be the point of party affiliation under this system?
It’s not too dissimilar to the revolutionary system called ‘democracy’ that Jim Hacker briefly flirted with in Yes Prime Minister.
I am pretty sure that it wold become possible to police eventually after a few high profile cases were pursued.0 -
The last time I estimated his stature it was precisely 9" .grabcocque said:
That's the length of Bercow's ego when fully erect.FrancisUrquhart said:
Is that his hat size?david_herdson said:
Bercow was 6'5" when he became Speaker.Benpointer said:
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
It depends on how this evolves. If an amendment to that effect passes she will have little choiceTGOHF said:
If May tries to arrange an extension or another referendum she is utter toast.MarqueeMark said:
No Deal is the Vampire Option. The Undead, unless and until Parliament can decide whether to use crosses, holy water or a stake through the heart and beheading.Richard_Tyndall said:
Again. Not possible. It is the only option that is actually assured if all other options fail.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
0 -
An independent body. Look at the way it is done in other countries with a long record of referendums.Benpointer said:
Who gets to dictate the questions?Richard_Tyndall said:
Nope. As long as the referendums were proper binary choices and MPs could not refuse to enact them. It is the way forward and far more democratic than the current system.Benpointer said:
The lesson is: government by referendums would be totally shite.Richard_Tyndall said:
Yep. MPs are not there for the people, only for themselves.kinabalu said:
Looks like it.grabcocque said:Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamentary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit with a Deal.
And as we know, MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit without a Deal.
Put that together, bit of simple algebra, and what do we get?
MASSIVE Commons rejection of Brexit!
That poor old 2016 referendum. So high and mighty, back in the day, so loud and proud, and now with as much status and influence as a eunuch at an orgy.
Lesson there somewhere.
Also look at the great enjoyment we would all get from being able to educate people about why the word is referendums not referenda. 0 -
We could have spent years coming up with our ideal leave outcome and then have the EU say no the moment A50 is triggered.grabcocque said:What Ireland does is:
1) The government comes to a decision it wishes to amend the constitution.
2) Government convenes a constitutional committee to draft a constitutional amendment.
3) Amendment is ratified by both houses.
4) The amendment is put to the people in a referendum.
5) The President signs the amendment as soon as possible after the referendum result has been certified and it becomes effective forthwith.
Do you see how very different that is from what Call Me Dave did?0 -
Something caught in your throat there Ian? Have a good cough mate.IanB2 said:
pitiful.Richard_Tyndall said:
Nah. Nothing is worse than remaining.SeanT said:
As someone said, the more you look into TMay’s deal, the worse it gets. It is dreadful, and we cannot escape it - we will end up simply abrogating, with all the damage that does to our standing.FrancisUrquhart said:
Apparently though the spooks are hopping mad due to some of the bollocks May deal would have the UK sign up to e.g. Basically paying for access to shared intell, which the UK provides the vast majority of the info to.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
As a Leaver, I would far rather Remain, than sign this disgraceful suicide note.0 -
Richard_Tyndall said:
The standard way in mature constitutional democracies is to convene a constitutional convention.Benpointer said:
An independent body. Look at the way it is done in other countries with a long record of referendums.0 -
The EU will not extend A50 other than for a general election or second referendum.GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.0 -
Nope it is nothing like the Chinese system because the elections themselves would still be as they are now based on normal constituencies. Or on PR or whatever other system was preferred. But the only difference is the parties would be unable to put undue pressure on the MPs.grabcocque said:
It's actually pretty close to the system that China uses, with lower level assemblies electing members for the next level up.Polruan said:
It’s not too dissimilar to the revolutionary system called ‘democracy’ that Jim Hacker briefly flirted with in Yes Prime Minister.
Far from being democratic, that gives the local party machine at each level almost complete control of who moves up the chain of command, and ensures that there's always an opposition-proof majority of party members at every level.
That's not democracy, that's hierarchical oligarchy.0 -
Is he the first to have done so? Noteworthy if so, though a mass conversion would be needed to save it.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
They are both ultra brexiteers wanting WTO so it is the ultras speaking to the ultrasRichard_Tyndall said:
Something caught in your throat there Ian? Have a good cough mate.IanB2 said:
pitiful.Richard_Tyndall said:
Nah. Nothing is worse than remaining.SeanT said:
As someone said, the more you look into TMay’s deal, the worse it gets. It is dreadful, and we cannot escape it - we will end up simply abrogating, with all the damage that does to our standing.FrancisUrquhart said:
Apparently though the spooks are hopping mad due to some of the bollocks May deal would have the UK sign up to e.g. Basically paying for access to shared intell, which the UK provides the vast majority of the info to.TheScreamingEagles said:
From the head of MI6 during the Iraq war.Richard_Tyndall said:Has anyone yet raised the intervention by the former head of MI6 and former Chief of Defence staff claiming that May's deal will threaten national security and urging a No Deal Brexit?
https://news.sky.com/story/theresa-mays-brexit-deal-threatens-national-security-ex-mi6-chief-sir-richard-dearlove-warns-11603738
Any thoughts on its impact, if any?
He’s damaged goods.
As a Leaver, I would far rather Remain, than sign this disgraceful suicide note.0 -
He is.kle4 said:
Is he the first to have done so? Noteworthy if so, though a mass conversion would be needed to save it.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Seems reasonable to me if rather slow.grabcocque said:
The standard way in mature constitutional democracies is to convene a constitutional convention.0 -
Impressive, in a bizarre way. I find the idea of can be salvaged to be one of the most bizarre theories sticking around.grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.0 -
Michael Gove on top form in the Commons, talking about Labour's six Brexit 'tests':
"[Barry Gardiner] summed them up, pithily, in a word which in Spanish translates as ‘cojones’ and in English rhymes with ‘rollocks’. I know, Mr Speaker, there are some distinguished citizens in this country who have put on their cars a poster or sticker saying ‘bollocks to Brexit’ - but we now know from Labour’s own frontbench that their official Brexit position is bollocks.
I have to say that the shadow international trade secretary is a jewel and an ornament to the Labour front bench. He speaks the truth with perfect clarity, and in his description of Labour’s own policy can I say across the House we’re grateful to him, grateful to the constant Gardiner for the way in which he has cast light on the testicular nature of Labour’s position."0 -
0
-
The confidence of his assertions are astonishing.OblitusSumMe said:
Huh. I think I'm reaching my limit on what I will accept as being too stupid for Trump to say. Did he really say that, or is someone using that new video technology to put words into his mouth?williamglenn said:Trump sounds weak here.
https://twitter.com/scottmcgrew/status/1083378976465121280?s=210 -
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.0 -
Bad news for those (no names, no pack drill) seeking respite from Brexit in concupiscence.
"Super gonorrhea ‘has reached the UK’, doctors warn
‘Super gonorrhea’ hit the headlines after a British tourist contracted a case described as ‘the world’s worst’ in Thailand last year – but the infection has now reached Britain."
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/super-gonorrhea-reached-uk-doctors-warn-111238930.html0 -
Well, once you have eliminated the impossible whatever remains, however improbable, must come to pass. It looks like there is a Parliamentary majority determined to avoid no deal. The PM is determined to avoid no Brexit. Unless the former are prepared to replace the latter then the only outcome is the deal.kle4 said:
Impressive, in a bizarre way. I find the idea of can be salvaged to be one of the most bizarre theories sticking around.grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.0 -
Whichever side of the Brexit debate you're on as a Tory MP there is value in pivoting to the deal to "have done all you could" to make it law and thereafter repivot back to No Brexit or No deal.0
-
100 to go, I was a fool to doubt May. Strong and Stable!!!!RobD said:Make that two..
https://twitter.com/JasonGroves1/status/10833948676010024970 -
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
You holding that ruler the right way round?MattW said:
The last time I estimated his stature it was precisely 9" .grabcocque said:
That's the length of Bercow's ego when fully erect.FrancisUrquhart said:
Is that his hat size?david_herdson said:
Bercow was 6'5" when he became Speaker.Benpointer said:
We all get smaller as we get older (after our early 20s at any rate)Endillion said:
You consider that less interesting than her having apparently shrunk in the intervening time frame?Benpointer said:
There's a minimum height requirement for POTUS?!AlastairMeeks said:Kamala Harris is a serious contender and OGH's tip was a great one. But she's now too short.
0 -
Can anyone other than the Gov't create primary legislation ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
He was also quite clear that the chair can change the rules if the chair wants to.TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
Yup.TGOHF said:
If May tries to arrange an extension or another referendum she is utter toast.MarqueeMark said:
No Deal is the Vampire Option. The Undead, unless and until Parliament can decide whether to use crosses, holy water or a stake through the heart and beheading.Richard_Tyndall said:
Again. Not possible. It is the only option that is actually assured if all other options fail.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
1211 months security of tenure my arse.0 -
That would be quite a change. Perhaps he'd also like to change the rule that Parliament has to vote on laws, and he can instead decide what passes and what doesn't?TrèsDifficile said:
He was also quite clear that the chair can change the rules if the chair wants to.TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
It is possible via a backbench bill, however all the slots for the backbench bills are allocated for this session and cannot be changed.Pulpstar said:
Can anyone other than the Gov't create primary legislation ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
The chair can only do so much, perhaps you should go on a refresher on how laws are created.TrèsDifficile said:
He was also quite clear that the chair can change the rules if the chair wants to.TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
As I have commented, if the HOC votes an amendment for either of the above, the government will have little choiceMarqueeMark said:
Yup.TGOHF said:
If May tries to arrange an extension or another referendum she is utter toast.MarqueeMark said:
No Deal is the Vampire Option. The Undead, unless and until Parliament can decide whether to use crosses, holy water or a stake through the heart and beheading.Richard_Tyndall said:
Again. Not possible. It is the only option that is actually assured if all other options fail.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
1211 months security of tenure my arse.0 -
Is that set by legislation or could the speaker create some new precedent?TheScreamingEagles said:
It is possible via a backbench bill, however all the slots for the backbench bills are allocated for this session and cannot be changed.Pulpstar said:
Can anyone other than the Gov't create primary legislation ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.
0 -
Thanks for header. Good to think about something other than Brexit.0
-
Unless the non-arbitrary chair wants them changed.TheScreamingEagles said:
It is possible via a backbench bill, however all the slots for the backbench bills are allocated for this session and cannot be changed.Pulpstar said:
Can anyone other than the Gov't create primary legislation ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
Debbie Abrahams speaking in the debate.
She just said "gangplank", which I misheard as "gang-f@ck".
What more can I say?0 -
I hope you enjoyed it. Now, back to Brexit.rottenborough said:Thanks for header. Good to think about something other than Brexit.
0 -
Bercow may be a fan of l'etat c'est moiTheScreamingEagles said:
The chair can only do so much, perhaps you should go on a refresher on how laws are created.TrèsDifficile said:
He was also quite clear that the chair can change the rules if the chair wants to.TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.
Edit damn autocorrect.0 -
Get a hearing aid.SandyRentool said:Debbie Abrahams speaking in the debate.
She just said "gangplank", which I misheard as "gang-f@ck".
What more can I say?
She actually said gang-bang....0 -
His entire career has been based on talking bollocks and ripping people off, so it's not as though his present skills have been won lightly.kle4 said:
The confidence of his assertions are astonishing.OblitusSumMe said:
Huh. I think I'm reaching my limit on what I will accept as being too stupid for Trump to say. Did he really say that, or is someone using that new video technology to put words into his mouth?williamglenn said:Trump sounds weak here.
https://twitter.com/scottmcgrew/status/1083378976465121280?s=210 -
Almost tempted to flag that as off topic.RobD said:
I hope you enjoyed it. Now, back to Brexit.rottenborough said:Thanks for header. Good to think about something other than Brexit.
0 -
She just called for a citizens' assembly, which could be a euphemism for the above.MarqueeMark said:
Get a hearing aid.SandyRentool said:Debbie Abrahams speaking in the debate.
She just said "gangplank", which I misheard as "gang-f@ck".
What more can I say?
She actually said gang-bang....0 -
Sir George to you.kle4 said:
Is he the first to have done so? Noteworthy if so, though a mass conversion would be needed to save it.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
I really disliked Speaker Martin, but my loathing of Bercow knows few bounds. Just seeing his picture irritates me. Perfect example of LMS.kle4 said:
Bercow may be a fan of l'etat c,ear moiTheScreamingEagles said:
The chair can only do so much, perhaps you should go on a refresher on how laws are created.TrèsDifficile said:
He was also quite clear that the chair can change the rules if the chair wants to.TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
No, there's a vote at the start of each Parliamentary session right after the Queen's speech.kle4 said:
Is that set by legislation or could the speaker create some new precedent?TheScreamingEagles said:
It is possible via a backbench bill, however all the slots for the backbench bills are allocated for this session and cannot be changed.Pulpstar said:
Can anyone other than the Gov't create primary legislation ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.
The government has to allocate time for these bills, so stop them being talked out like a 10 minute rule bill.
You cannot also change a backbench bill midway through it has to be on same original substance.
You cannot change the 'Ban cyclists who don't wear helmets' bill into the 'Ban pineapple on pizza' bill from when it is was originally selected.0 -
He could in any event only take such extreme action with the backing of a majority of parliament - and if you could really find sufficient MPs who are that determined, you could form a new government for the purpose.TheScreamingEagles said:
The chair can only do so much, perhaps you should go on a refresher on how laws are created.TrèsDifficile said:
He was also quite clear that the chair can change the rules if the chair wants to.TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
Isn't that old news? It was reported some time ago that they were bringing forward their usual planned summer maintenance shutdown from August to April this year in case of any logistics issues. Sensible approach.williamglenn said:0 -
I would not normally agree with that sentiment but, in this case, harsh but fair. The actions of each faction make sense according to their own beliefs and objectives, on the whole they do anyway, but taken together as a collective the effect is malign.Richard_Tyndall said:Yep. MPs are not there for the people, only for themselves.
Then again we are being premature. I am still confident that we will be leaving the EU under the Withdrawal Treaty at some point in the first half of this year. Perhaps all this late stage brinkmanship and grandstanding was inevitable and, in an odd way, necessary.0 -
That is a splendid new euphemism.SandyRentool said:
She just called for a citizens' assembly, which could be a euphemism for the above.MarqueeMark said:
Get a hearing aid.SandyRentool said:Debbie Abrahams speaking in the debate.
She just said "gangplank", which I misheard as "gang-f@ck".
What more can I say?
She actually said gang-bang....0 -
Thankfully no PBers have ever gone on shagging sprees in Thailand..Theuniondivvie said:Bad news for those (no names, no pack drill) seeking respite from Brexit in concupiscence.
"Super gonorrhea ‘has reached the UK’, doctors warn
‘Super gonorrhea’ hit the headlines after a British tourist contracted a case described as ‘the world’s worst’ in Thailand last year – but the infection has now reached Britain."
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/super-gonorrhea-reached-uk-doctors-warn-111238930.html0 -
You don't need the Speaker to form a new government without an election.Nigelb said:
He could in any event only take such extreme action with the backing of a majority of parliament - and if you could really find sufficient MPs who are that determined, you could form a new government for the purpose.TheScreamingEagles said:
The chair can only do so much, perhaps you should go on a refresher on how laws are created.TrèsDifficile said:
He was also quite clear that the chair can change the rules if the chair wants to.TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.0 -
In terms of the future prospects of the Conservative Party, the sight of the Government trying but being unable to deliver any sort of Brexit could amount to an expedient damage limitation exercise, provided that the Government's fallback position is not to try to extend A50 or seek a second referendum. If the vote for a second referendum was instead forced on the HoC by a solid mass of Labour, LD and SNP MPs with a few Conservatives tacked on, it might be an expedient way out politically for the Conservatives. I don't think that that being defeated by parliamentary arithmetic would cause that many Leavers to give up on the Conservatives, nor would it provide any reason for Conservative Remainers to jump ship, since they would have achieved the outcome they always wanted.grabcocque said:BBC Politics estimate for the meaningful vote:
Ayes: 206
Noes: 433
Majority for noes of 228.
She is on course for the biggest Commons defeat in Parliamenary history - beating the minority Labour government's losing tally of 166 in 1924.0 -
Seconded. I really hope they do. If they don't, I mean, call themselves a spread betting firm?Sandpit said:Ripe market for a spread bet, come on Sporting Index and put one up!
They are noticeably less adventurous on politics these days. I remember when you could get markets such as how many days would so & so survive as such & such.0 -
Personally, I've backed Amy Klobuchar to win POTUS 2020 at odds of 33/1 (currently best-priced at around 25/1). For my money she's the feistiest of all the Democratic front runners, a characteristic which should hold her in good stead against Trump.0
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What's wrong with white supremacy, asks Republican congressman:
https://thehill.com/homenews/house/424688-steve-king-asks-how-terms-white-nationalist-and-white-supremacist-became
Rep. Steve King (R-Iowa) is questioning how terms such as "white nationalist" and "white supremacist" became offensive in the U.S.
“White nationalist, white supremacist, Western civilization — how did that language become offensive?” King asked...0 -
If a bill already on the agenda is amended does that count as primary legislation?TheScreamingEagles said:
No, there's a vote at the start of each Parliamentary session right after the Queen's speech.kle4 said:
Is that set by legislation or could the speaker create some new precedent?TheScreamingEagles said:
It is possible via a backbench bill, however all the slots for the backbench bills are allocated for this session and cannot be changed.Pulpstar said:
Can anyone other than the Gov't create primary legislation ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.TrèsDifficile said:
Hasn't Bercow proved that he could do it (or enable the remain majority of MPs to) if he wanted to?GIN1138 said:
Again, "No Deal" can't "go" unless and until A50 is extended or revoked as it's the default option at the end of A50.kinabalu said:
Yes, definitely. No Deal has to go. And remove the 2nd referendum too, since with Labour opposed that has precious little support in the House.grabcocque said:Parliament needs to come to a settled view. That means May needs to remove some of the options from the table, to make things easier. The easiest option to remove from the table is No Deal.
And Parliament can't extend or revoke A50 on its own only the government can do that.
He was quite clear yesterday. Primary legislation is needed to replace primary legislation.
The government has to allocate time for these bills, so stop them being talked out like a 10 minute rule bill.
You cannot also change a backbench bill midway through it has to be on same original substance.
You cannot change the 'Ban cyclists who don't wear helmets' bill into the 'Ban pineapple on pizza' bill from when it is was originally selected.
IE if the "Ban cyclists who don't wear helmets' bill is amended into a 'ban cyclists who don't wear helmets and pineapple on pizza' does that count?0
