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https://twitter.com/Steven_Swinford/status/1079492203553148928
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Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Les Misérables without any songs?

That's like having an orgy on your own.

SO WRONG.

I am not sure Victor Hugo would agree with you.

Well what would he know?

He knew how to write a good novel.

So does Sean T, doesn't make him an expert on musicals.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Michael van baldy currently showing why he is the best darter ever...

Pub game.

Dura_Ace said:

Javid just needs to wait for some strong westerleys to build a swell in the channel big enough to make the passage suicidal then he can declare MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.

https://twitter.com/taxbod/status/1079400646472806403?s=21

viewcode said:

Nigelb said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Richard_Tyndall said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Obligatory best Chrimbo movie watching completed...i.e. Die Hard, Die Hard 2, Home Alone....The question is do I inflict the disasters that are Die Hard 3+ and / or same with Home Alone on Chez Urquhart?

There's more snow in The Empire Strikes Back than in Die Hard, just saying.

I assume you were eating pizzas with pineapples on them whilst watching those films?

Just saying...

The neatest summary I can provide is to say that there are many Christmas elements in the movie. Although the studio did not intend it to be a Christmas movie, some of the film’s key creators did. Either way, it’s certainly fair to say that Die Hard is regarded as a Christmas movie in popular culture.

Like it or not, the association between Die Hard and Christmas is fast increasing and in years to come its Christmassyness will be beyon... believe it might have even been an 18 at time of release.

It was released in July 1988, definitely not a Christmas film.

Plus the people have spoken,

https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/937731219743264768

Well the experts disagree with you.

Voted the Number 1 Christmas Movie by Empire Magazine readers.
Described as unquestionably a Christmas Movie by Mark Kermode (with a long explanation about how it is set at Christmas, has a Christmas party as its main setting, includes a Christmas story of redemption and has the lead female character called Holly).
Included as one of the great Christmas movies by the Sky Arts movie team.

Face it, as with your attitude to the French, denying Solo as great Star wars film and pineapple on pizza, this is just another example of how wrong you can be.

The Empire poll is a voodoo poll, the YouGov poll is a properly weighted poll.

Mark Kermode, we're in the age of sick and tired of experts.

Bruce himself has spoken: it is not a Christmas movie, but a “god damn Bruce Willis movie”.
https://www.radiox.co.uk/news/tv-film/is-die-hard-a-christmas-film/

Granted, the accompanying poll is of the easily deluded US public, but still...

The intention of the auteur is not necessarily the best reading of the text.

[Oh yeah. I can speak fluent bullshit... ]

The great Willis was, of course, the protagonist rather than auteur.

And after all he went through, I think he’s earned the right to make the declaration. Are you some kind of Euro-terrorist sympathiser ... ?

TheScreamingEagles said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Les Misérables without any songs?

That's like having an orgy on your own.

SO WRONG.

I am not sure Victor Hugo would agree with you.

Well what would he know?

He knew how to write a good novel.

So does Sean T, doesn't make him an expert on musicals.

Adding music to Les Misérables was like adding pineapple to a pizza.

While we're at it: bucks fizz! Wtf is that about?
Take two perfectly acceptable drinks, mix them together to make... imitation Tango. Yuurch!

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

I thought about leaving the ground at 1-0 and claiming I had seen Arsenal win at Anfield.

Last night included the worst defending I have ever seen and I saw Djimi Traore score an own goal when he did a Cruyff turn on his own goal line.

How many Arsenal players were on their arses for Bobby's second goal?

I've seen some bad defending by Arsenal over the years, but that probably was as bad as it gets.

JosiasJessop said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did their job and enforced the law.

I look forward to you saying the same about people who fish ...

My first wife insisted that I send my Dad home, who was staying with us for the weekend, when he tried that whataboutery argument on her.

Even after I divorced he still does not trust me to stay the night again.

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Wingnut in chief refused to alter his MP twitter profile even when he lost... The people only speak when he chooses to notice them.

How was your excursion to Wembley yesterday?

Sub optimal. Thank you for asking.

It is the hope that kills you.

Is why I'm not expecting to win the title.

City win on Thursday and our lead is down to four points and City win the title.

Nigelb said:

viewcode said:

The intention of the auteur is not necessarily the best reading of the text.

[Oh yeah. I can speak fluent bullshit... ]

The great Willis was, of course, the protagonist rather than auteur.

And after all he went through, I think he’s earned the right to make the declaration. Are you some kind of Euro-terrorist sympathiser ... ?

...I am an exceptional Euro-terrorist sympathiser, Mr. McNigelb. And since I'm moving up to quoting, you should be more polite...

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Wingnut in chief refused to alter his MP twitter profile even when he lost... The people only speak when he chooses to notice them.

How was your excursion to Wembley yesterday?

Sub optimal. Thank you for asking.

It is the hope that kills you.

Is why I'm not expecting to win the title.

City win on Thursday and our lead is down to four points and City win the title.

I wish you every success in seeing your predictions come true

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

I had assumed TSE only mixed with plebs via the medium of PB to avoid just such contact.

OblitusSumMe said:

JosiasJessop said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did their job and enforced the law.

I look forward to you saying the same about people who fish ...

My first wife insisted that I send my Dad home, who was staying with us for the weekend, when he tried that whataboutery argument on her.

Even after I divorced he still does not trust me to stay the night again.

Do you care to actually address the argument instead of a pointless anecdote of the personal intrigues and hatreds within your family?

viewcode said:

Nigelb said:

viewcode said:

The intention of the auteur is not necessarily the best reading of the text.

[Oh yeah. I can speak fluent bullshit... ]

The great Willis was, of course, the protagonist rather than auteur.

And after all he went through, I think he’s earned the right to make the declaration. Are you some kind of Euro-terrorist sympathiser ... ?

...I am an exceptional Euro-terrorist sympathiser, Mr. McNigelb. And since I'm moving up to quoting, you should be more polite...

Ah, the late, great Alan Rickman.
Now had he claimed it a Christmas movie, I might just have been persuaded.

Corbyn really does hate success doesn't he?

https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1079448599229067264

TheScreamingEagles said:

Corbyn really does hate success cheating doesn't he?

https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1079448599229067264

Corrected your typo above.

JosiasJessop said:

OblitusSumMe said:

JosiasJessop said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did their job and enforced the law.

I look forward to you saying the same about people who fish ...

My first wife insisted that I send my Dad home, who was staying with us for the weekend, when he tried that whataboutery argument on her.

Even after I divorced he still does not trust me to stay the night again.

Do you care to actually address the argument instead of a pointless anecdote of the personal intrigues and hatreds within your family?

The point of the anecdote was that the argument is pointlessly divisive and tends to be used by people - like my Dad - more interested in winning an argument than having an interesting debate that might lead them to change their mind. Such people are more interested in talking than listening. (As indeed am I on occasion).

A lot of sound and fury signifying nothing.

Sometimes JosiasJessop you have something to say that it's worth listening to. That argument is not a promising starting point.

Good night.

IanB2 said:

Ladbrokes given up on the boundary changes..

Hasn't everybody? I feel sorry for the staff at the Boundary Commission. Some connection between effort and outcome is useful in feeling satisfaction in a job, and their time seems to be a total waste.

Benpointer said:

Ishmael_Z said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did their job and enforced the law.

The law does not provide for locking anyone up, even if they were illegally hunting foxes which in my very extensive first hand experience they simply aren't. Three cheers for ill informed chippiness.

I doubt the pack that romped through our village were officially hunting a fox. I suspect, as it was Christmas Eve and I only saw a few horses, they were exercising the hounds in prep for their traditional Boxing Day hunt. But why bring them through the village and various private gardens?

Because they are a bunch of arrogant twats who think they can do as they please.

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

SandyRentool said:

Benpointer said:

Ishmael_Z said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did their job and enforced the law.

The law does not provide for locking anyone up, even if they were illegally hunting foxes which in my very extensive first hand experience they simply aren't. Three cheers for ill informed chippiness.

I doubt the pack that romped through our village were officially hunting a fox. I suspect, as it was Christmas Eve and I only saw a few horses, they were exercising the hounds in prep for their traditional Boxing Day hunt. But why bring them through the village and various private gardens?

Because they are a bunch of arrogant twats who think they can do as they please.

Yes, I think you have probably nailed it.

Ishmael_Z said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Corbyn really does hate success cheating doesn't he?

https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1079448599229067264

Corrected your typo above.

Html can be a bitch. Edit - bugger, you corrected your correction.

I know, a typo in my typo joke. Who'd a thunked it eh?

OblitusSumMe said:

JosiasJessop said:

OblitusSumMe said:

JosiasJessop said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did their job and enforced the law.

I look forward to you saying the same about people who fish ...

My first wife insisted that I send my Dad home, who was staying with us for the weekend, when he tried that whataboutery argument on her.

Even after I divorced he still does not trust me to stay the night again.

Do you care to actually address the argument instead of a pointless anecdote of the personal intrigues and hatreds within your family?

The point of the anecdote was that the argument is pointlessly divisive and tends to be used by people - like my Dad - more interested in winning an argument than having an interesting debate that might lead them to change their mind. Such people are more interested in talking than listening. (As indeed am I on occasion).

A lot of sound and fury signifying nothing.

Sometimes JosiasJessop you have something to say that it's worth listening to. That argument is not a promising starting point.

Good night.

I disagree. I said it half-jokingly, but that argument can lead in several interesting directions:
*) Do fish feel pain? If so, to what degree?
*) How more important are the rights of individuals over those of animals?
*) Do animals even have rights?
*) How much is the hunting ban a political ban against people others do not like? And if so, does it matter?
*) How much should protecting one species (e.g. sheep, grouse, cattle) impinge on other species (foxes, birds of prey, badgers)
etc,etc.

That argument is a useful shorthand for many of the above, and can serve as a good introduction. At the least the response to it shows people who have f'all idea about the topic.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Surely TSE will be spotted well before then...unless he is going to dig out the old shell suit, shoulder man bag and fake burberry cap.

And trainers, don't forget the trainers!

Fake white Lacoste ones naturally...

Yep. Lacost will do.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Nigelb said:

viewcode said:

Nigelb said:

viewcode said:

The intention of the auteur is not necessarily the best reading of the text.

[Oh yeah. I can speak fluent bullshit... ]

The great Willis was, of course, the protagonist rather than auteur.

And after all he went through, I think he’s earned the right to make the declaration. Are you some kind of Euro-terrorist sympathiser ... ?

...I am an exceptional Euro-terrorist sympathiser, Mr. McNigelb. And since I'm moving up to quoting, you should be more polite...

Ah, the late, great Alan Rickman.
Now had he claimed it a Christmas movie, I might just have been persuaded.

[last lines]

John McClane: Merry Christmas, Argyle.

Argyle: Merry Christmas.

Richard Thornburg: [to the camera] Did ya get that?

Argyle: [Argyle shuts the limo door] If this is their idea of Christmas, I *gotta* be here for New Year's.

If that’s your idea of a Christmas movie, TSE’s earlier comment wasn’t quite as harsh as I thought...

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Surely TSE will be spotted well before then...unless he is going to dig out the old tracksuit, shoulder man bag and fake burberry cap.

It is fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton these days in Manchester.

Which is galling when I have the genuine stuff.

viewcode said:

Nigelb said:

viewcode said:

Nigelb said:

viewcode said:

The intention of the auteur is not necessarily the best reading of the text.

[Oh yeah. I can speak fluent bullshit... ]

The great Willis was, of course, the protagonist rather than auteur.

And after all he went through, I think he’s earned the right to make the declaration. Are you some kind of Euro-terrorist sympathiser ... ?

...I am an exceptional Euro-terrorist sympathiser, Mr. McNigelb. And since I'm moving up to quoting, you should be more polite...

Ah, the late, great Alan Rickman.
Now had he claimed it a Christmas movie, I might just have been persuaded.

Ohhhhhhhhhh....

... the weather outside is frightful,
But the fire is so delightful,
And since we've no place to go,
Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLyJDKOpBg

Someone doesn’t understand (the admittedly rare) American irony.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Normally I can contain my emotions, it isn't an issue in the posh seats.

Last season, I was in the posh seats for the Champions League QF second leg at the Etihad, City scored their second goal to make the tie 3-2 and I let out a very loud 'Oh ferfuxsake' fortunately it coincided with the Ref ruling out the goal for offside, so I got away with it.

Given the capacity of the "Emptyhad" and that it's never sold out I can imagine there'll be a fair few Liverpool fans in City's seats on Thursday.

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Surely TSE will be spotted well before then...unless he is going to dig out the old tracksuit, shoulder man bag and fake burberry cap.

It is fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton these days in Manchester.

Which is galling when I have the genuine stuff.

The idea that snobbery is possible in the context of football is amusing.

JosiasJessop said:

OblitusSumMe said:

JosiasJessop said:

OblitusSumMe said:

JosiasJessop said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did theienforced the law.

I look forward to you saying the same about people who fish ...

My first wife insisted that I send my Dad home, who was staying with us for the weekend, when he tried that whataboutery argument on her.

Even after I divorced he still does not trust me to stay the night again.

Do you care to actually address the argument instead of a pointless anecdote of the personal intrigues and hatreds within your family?

The point of the anecdote w
Good night.

I disagree. I said it half-jokingly, but that argument can lead in several interesting directions:
*) Do fish feel pain? If so, to what degree?
*) How more important are the rights of individuals over those of animals?
*) Do animals even have rights?
*) How much is the hunting ban a political ban against people others do not like? And if so, does it matter?
*) How much should protecting one species (e.g. sheep, grouse, cattle) impinge on other species (foxes, birds of prey, badgers)
etc,etc.

That argument is a useful shorthand for many of the above, and can serve as a good introduction. At the least the response to it shows people who have f'all idea about the topic.

Some brief responses:

1. I don't know, but painless abuse and killing is still abuse and killing.
2. The rights of individual humans are no more important than those of other animals.
3. Yes. Extend Rawls' 'veil of ignorance' so you don't know what species you belong to and it makes sense to agree. I would also extend rights to the inanimate, such as mountains, rivers, and asteroids.
4. Sticking one to the twats who hunt is a secondary benefit. The primary purpose is animal protection.
5. If humans put a load of prey in one place then they shouldn't be surprised if predators take advantage. By all means take means to protect the farm animals by building fences, etc., but do not attack the predators.

I'm sure that NickPalmer could give very interesting answers to your questions.

Nigelb said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Surely TSE will be spotted well before then...unless he is going to dig out the old tracksuit, shoulder man bag and fake burberry cap.

It is fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton these days in Manchester.

Which is galling when I have the genuine stuff.

The idea that snobbery is possible in the context of football is amusing.

It really is, when I spend £700 on a pair of trainers and there's some chav boasting he's picked up the same trainers (but fake) for £90 in Rusholme I'm tempted to called in the Rozzers.

JosiasJessop said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Corbyn really does hate success doesn't he?

https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1079448599229067264

What this story says to me, and I'm very much a non-expert, is how messy all of this has become - and I was in the year of changeover between O-levels and GCSE's.

Or perhaps it's always been messy, and I'm just unfamiliar with the current system ...

Of course in the O level days there were CSEs, which my wife (now BA, MA) endured having just missed out on her 11-plus.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Normally I can contain my emotions, it isn't an issue in the posh seats.

Last season, I was in the posh seats for the Champions League QF second leg at the Etihad, City scored their second goal to make the tie 3-2 and I let out a very loud 'Oh ferfuxsake' fortunately it coincided with the Ref ruling out the goal for offside, so I got away with it.

Given the capacity of the "Emptyhad" and that it's never sold out I can imagine there'll be a fair few Liverpool fans in City's seats on Thursday.

City still are selling seats for the match.

If this match was at Anfield it would have sold out weeks ago.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/man-city-ticket-woe-ahead-15611414

I have actually seen the Etihad in person - from the comfort of the train coming in to Piccadilly station - but also from the Metrolink tram near Etihad Campus station

Ishmael_Z said:

JosiasJessop said:

SandyRentool said:

FrankBooth said:

A couple of unrelated points.

Firstly there appears to be a lot of pontificating on the consequences of a no deal Brexit from people who don't seem overly well-informed one way or the other. I'm amazed how many claim it will be just fine/total disaster (delete as appropriate) without appearing to need any expert knowledge.

Secondly what is the pb view on hunting - specifically of foxes? Part of my social media feed seems to think civil war is about to break out in the countryside. Maybe that just says something about my friends!

Hunting - lock the feckers up, evil cnuts.

About time the police did their job and enforced the law.

I look forward to you saying the same about people who fish ...

Oddly what would be killing fox hunting if people still did it, which they don't, is not the law but large scale commercial pheasant shooting which entails the genuine extermination of the entire fox population by gamekeepers with rifles and night sights, in support of a sport which positively aspires to kill 100s of proposed breed animals per day where hunting was always satisfied with just a couple.

So the rifle is mightier than the hound? I always thought the utilitarian argument for fox hunting was that it was more efficient?

AndyJS said:

I've been in Boston, MA for a couple of weeks and haven't heard anyone swearing in the street so far. Makes a nice change from England.

I'd choose swearing over concealed firearms any day!

SandyRentool said:

I disagree. I said it half-jokingly, but that argument can lead in several interesting directions:
*) Do fish feel pain? If so, to what degree?
*) How more important are the rights of individuals over those of animals?
*) Do animals even have rights?
*) How much is the hunting ban a political ban against people others do not like? And if so, does it matter?
*) How much should protecting one species (e.g. sheep, grouse, cattle) impinge on other species (foxes, birds of prey, badgers)
etc,etc.

That argument is a useful shorthand for many of the above, and can serve as a good introduction. At the least the response to it shows people who have f'all idea about the topic.

Some brief responses:

1. I don't know, but painless abuse and killing is still abuse and killing.
2. The rights of individual humans are no more important than those of other animals.
3. Yes. Extend Rawls' 'veil of ignorance' so you don't know what species you belong to and it makes sense to agree. I would also extend rights to the inanimate, such as mountains, rivers, and asteroids.
4. Sticking one to the twats who hunt is a secondary benefit. The primary purpose is animal protection.
5. If humans put a load of prey in one place then they shouldn't be surprised if predators take advantage. By all means take means to protect the farm animals by building fences, etc., but do not attack the predators.

I'm sure that NickPalmer could give very interesting answers to your questions.

Thanks, that's interesting - although as you might guess, I personally disagree with much of it. For one thing, I'd put one person's life above that of any number of animals. In other words, if I had to kill five cute bunnies to save my son, I would do so. Or even to save the life of someone I dislike. I put people above animals - and yes, I'm aware there's deep issues with doing that.

Then there are other issues: Mrs J hates causing animals pain, but feels no problem in my killing ants on the odd occasion they find their way into the kitchen (although we always try to stop them from getting in again). And many people have no problem killing rats, but love cats and dogs. I do detect a certain fondness for higher-order animals over the lower-order ones in many people.

And as well as inanimate objects, you get bacteria and viruses: and our bodies routinely kill millions of them a day.

As you might expect, I disagree about asteroids. And that's timely, as a probe will be flying past Ultima Thule in a day or so,

Again, thanks for your response.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Nigelb said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Surely TSE will be spotted well before then...unless he is going to dig out the old tracksuit, shoulder man bag and fake burberry cap.

It is fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton these days in Manchester.

Which is galling when I have the genuine stuff.

The idea that snobbery is possible in the context of football is amusing.

It really is, when I spend £700 on a pair of trainers and there's some chav boasting he's picked up the same trainers (but fake) for £90 in Rusholme I'm tempted to called in the Rozzers.

Presumably to prosecute the manufacturers for ripping you off?

Quiet! All of you!

They're showing The Farce Awakens on ITV* right now!

(* well Channel 33, ITV+1)

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Nigelb said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Surely TSE will be spotted well before then...unless he is going to dig out the old tracksuit, shoulder man bag and fake burberry cap.

It is fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton these days in Manchester.

Which is galling when I have the genuine stuff.

The idea that snobbery is possible in the context of football is amusing.

It really is, when I spend £700 on a pair of trainers and there's some chav boasting he's picked up the same trainers (but fake) for £90 in Rusholme I'm tempted to called in the Rozzers.

Presumably to prosecute the manufacturers for ripping you off?

Hopefully that price means those who made them were well paid and not basically slave children at least.

https://www.gucci.com/uk/en_gb/pr/men/mens-shoes/mens-sneakers/flashtrek-sneaker-with-removable-crystals-p-536532GGZ301261?&audience=pla-375166211976&gclid=CjwKCAiA9qHhBRB2EiwA7poaeIQ4AfI7E7XFE7sbh_nJdCYGKqX1YsencuYORhAmxD_y9OGlN6WJPhoC7MUQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Trendy Gucci trainers, the height of fashion in the North of England.

JosiasJessop said:

I disagree. I said it half-jokingly, but that argument can lead in several interesting directions:
*) Do fish feel pain? If so, to what degree?
*) How more important are the rights of individuals over those of animals?
*) Do animals even have rights?
*) How much is the hunting ban a political ban against people others do not like? And if so, does it matter?
*) How much should protecting one species (e.g. sheep, grouse, cattle) impinge on other species (foxes, birds of prey, badgers)

I'm not keen to dive into a long debate on this well-worn topic, but in case you do want serious replies:

Fish: almost certainly feel pain and frustration. See an in-depth analysis here:
https://www.ciwf.org.uk/farm-animals/fish/ Broadly speaking, fish farming is often nasty, whereas wild-caught fish presumably live normal lives until caught (though their death is often particularly nasty - asphixiation etc.). An individual fish caught by an angler, immediately killed and then eaten is very different from a migratory fish trapped in a crowded marine cage for life.

Rights of individuals (presumably you mean individual people) vs animals: obviously a matter of opinion. Broadly speaking, I'd say that the more the sentience and the more extreme the difference in pleasure/pain, the easier to answer. I'm relaxed about killing a mosquito in Africa as I doubt if it will feel pain and it might do me serious harm. I wouldn't do bear-baiting even if I enjoyed it because the pleasure it would give me is minor compared to the suffering for the bear.

The hunting ban was IMO primarily motivated by concern for the animals, and I was in the "core group" that got it through. I come from a hunting family - my father tried it and gave it up as too cruel; my uncle hunted for many years, conceded it was a bit cruel but said it was so glorious that it was worth it. The ban affected the mostly working-class sport of coursing equally - in fact rather more effectively. I do think we spent too much time on that topic compared with all the other animal issues, but the Tory/Lords filibuster was frankly difficult to accept.

My personal view is that the priority is not to cause disproportionate suffering, and usually there are more and less nasty ways (e.g. good fencing) to protect one species from another.

If an animal has a good life and a swift, humane death then I personally think that's not a bad deal - it's about what I want for myself. But I wouldn't cause any suffering at all for the sake of having fun, and the killer fact for me on fox-hunting was that it's so ineffective as a means of control (by far the most foxes die from other causes), and it's clearly mostly about having a colourful, exciting time. There are other ways of doing that, no?

kle4 said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Nigelb said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

By the way I have a new favourite word in the English language.

https://twitter.com/RomeshRanga/status/1079067097047711744

It will make an appearance in a future PB thread header, fuckwangled has replaced schadenfreude as my favourite word in the English language.

Cheered me up a bit... Was expecting more than 5 though.

We were conserving energy for Thursday.

Wish me luck, I've got tickets and I have to pretend to be a Citeh supporter for the evening.

Worst of all I'm in the cheap seats.

With the plebs, i presume you will be showing in dettol afterwards!

Have a booked a delousing for straight after the match.

How are you going to pass as a City fan? First goal (or chance even) at either end will give you away.

Surely TSE will be spotted well before then...unless he is going to dig out the old tracksuit, shoulder man bag and fake burberry cap.

It is fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton these days in Manchester.

Which is galling when I have the genuine stuff.

The idea that snobbery is possible in the context of football is amusing.

It really is, when I spend £700 on a pair of trainers and there's some chav boasting he's picked up the same trainers (but fake) for £90 in Rusholme I'm tempted to called in the Rozzers.

Presumably to prosecute the manufacturers for ripping you off?

Hopefully that price means those who made them were well paid and not basically slave children at least.

I somehow doubt it.

NickPalmer said:

I'm not keen to dive into a long debate on this well-worn topic, but in case you do want serious replies:

Fish: almost certainly feel pain and frustration. See an in-depth analysis here:
https://www.ciwf.org.uk/farm-animals/fish/ Broadly speaking, fish farming is often nasty, whereas wild-caught fish presumably live normal lives until caught (though their death is often particularly nasty - asphixiation etc.). An individual fish caught by an angler, immediately killed and then eaten is very different from a migratory fish trapped in a crowded marine cage for life.

Rights of individuals (presumably you mean individual people) vs animals: obviously a matter of opinion. Broadly speaking, I'd say that the more the sentience and the more extreme the difference in pleasure/pain, the easier to answer. I'm relaxed about killing a mosquito in Africa as I doubt if it will feel pain and it might do me serious harm. I wouldn't do bear-baiting even if I enjoyed it because the pleasure it would give me is minor compared to the suffering for the bear.

The hunting ban was IMO primarily motivated by concern for the animals, and I was in the "core group" that got it through. I come from a hunting family - my father tried it and gave it up as too cruel; my uncle hunted for many years, conceded it was a bit cruel but said it was so glorious that it was worth it. The ban affected the mostly working-class sport of coursing equally - in fact rather more effectively. I do think we spent too much time on that topic compared with all the other animal issues, but the Tory/Lords filibuster was frankly difficult to accept.

My personal view is that the priority is not to cause disproportionate suffering, and usually there are more and less nasty ways (e.g. good fencing) to protect one species from another.

If an animal has a good life and a swift, humane death then I personally think that's not a bad deal - it's about what I want for myself. But I wouldn't cause any suffering at all for the sake of having fun, and the killer fact for me on fox-hunting was that it's so ineffective as a means of control (by far the most foxes die from other causes), and it's clearly mostly about having a colourful, exciting time. There are other ways of doing that, no?

Thanks for your reply. I can't respond fully at the moment (been up since 4, and need to go to bed), but I did want serious replies, particularly as IANAE on these issues, although have looked into them. Agree about the 'disproportionate suffering' bit.

The government wanted more control over the school exams and in January 2015 Nick Gibb, the schools minister, announced that iGCSEs would not be recognised by OFQUAL. Subsequently they have also not been included in the official school league tables.

As has been already noted, iGCSEs were designed to be more like the old O levels, which the international English speaking schools preferred.

As the GCSEs became easier, and the gap up to A levels bigger, the private schools adopted them mainly so that their pupils were better prepared for A levels.

I am not aware of any proper comparison between GCSEs and iGCSEs as to which are actual easier.

Indeed, as they are no longer regulated by OFQUAL there may be differences between the exam boards. But, unlike state schools, the main focus for private schools will be to teach their students towards A levels and good universities. As such iGCSEs are only a stepping stone, not an end in itself. Thus there little motive to drive down standards (unlike the historic GCSEs).