politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » TMay caves in to the Brexit Taliban over Chequers plan
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11ZkH2pWwK4Beverley_C said:
Clowns on the left, Jokers on the right?Roger said:So the hard right Ultras have now taken over the Tory Party.......
Long Live Corbyn! (and Abbott and McDonnell and Long Bailey and Rayner and Watson)
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Mr. Observer, indeed.
There's a real possibility Corbyn will get into Number Ten. Curious as to your own position, regarding the Labour Party.
Edited extra bit: bugger. Got to leave at once, apologies for raising a point and then sodding off before the answer comes.0 -
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
"You gonna pay for an army for that united, confident and sovereign Europe then?" asks Trump. "If so, my work is done here. Losers...."rottenborough said:0 -
As was explained in the Jewish Chronicle, all the internationally recognised definitions allow for criticism of Israel, Labour decided in their wisdom to hack those paragraphs out and replace them with their own...its like they don't take this antisemitism stuff seriously or something.Morris_Dancer said:Meanwhile, in the Socialist Party:
https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/10189045726712217620 -
Not you, luv.....rottenborough said:Soubry: "who is actually running Britain?"
Wow!0 -
Do you think it is anti-Semitic to believe that the denial of self determination to the Palestinians was racist? Or to say that the mass ethnic cleansing of Palestinians was racist?Morris_Dancer said:Meanwhile, in the Socialist Party:
https://twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/10189045726712217620 -
So the US takes all its military out of Germany and the EU and applies tariffs on their cars.MarqueeMark said:
"You gonna pay for an army for that united, confident and sovereign Europe then?" asks Trump. "If so, my work is done here. Losers...."rottenborough said:
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LOLBeverley_C said:
I doubt it. An erg is the energy required to accelerate 1 gram at 1 cms^2 or about the same energy as a housefly uses to stretch its legs.volcanopete said:The ERG will set you free.
It is also the same amount of energy expended by certain "Leave" politicians to examine the feasibility of their preferred Brexit, thus the name of the group0 -
I agree. I think that Chequers was perhaps a signal from TM that she was prepared to go the extra mile to compromise. She must know we are heading for NO DEAL but did not want to make herself into an enthusiastic cheerleader for it.Big_G_NorthWales said:
She seems to have got off the fence and moved to ERGrottenborough said:
I doubt she is serene. More like on the edge of a nervous breakdown with all this madness around her.GIN1138 said:
As I keep saying The Good Ship May sails on serenely...CarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely (Brexit - she owns GE17) not of her making.....
I believe she knows Chequers would run into trouble with the EU and is preparing to walk out when they do, blaming them for the failure, and announcing hard Brexit contingency planning.
In these circumstances I believe remain becomes impossible0 -
68 rabbis say Labour chooses to ignore UK Jewish community
Letter to Guardian criticises party for ‘rewriting’ accepted definition of antisemitism
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/16/68-rabbis-labour-chooses-ignore-uk-jewish-community0 -
And what did you do for the Remain campaign in the Referendum Wiliam Glenn?williamglenn said:
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
Labour Remainers were never going to go Tory anyway but some may still go LD given Corbyn's opposition to staying in the single market. A few Labour Leavers might possibly go UKIP if their revival continuesSouthamObserver said:Today feels like a big day:
1. Brexit has hit a brick wall which means we stay in the EU or crash out; there's no middle way now.
2. Trump has backed Putin over his own intelligence services.
In peace time it doesn't get much bigger really.
On the domestic front, what May has done today has ensured that however ambivalent Corbyn is over Brexit, the 2017 Labour voting alliance will hold together. He must be loving this.0 -
There are suspicions of minimum wage, environmental, planning, and health and safety violations, tax evasion – as well as labour exploitation and modern slavery.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/jul/16/true-human-cost-5-pound-hand-car-wash-modern-slavery
Guardian missing the elephant in the room with their list of "suspicions"....0 -
If that is the decision she has taken, she will need to have squared it with the Cabinet Remainers, and she will need to carry her party and the country with her. Not just in the short-term, but in the longer term, too. That would be an immense gamble with the future of the Conservative party, not to mention the living standards of millions and millions of people. For me, a stronger likelihood is that she really doesn't know what she is doing anymore.Big_G_NorthWales said:
She seems to have got off the fence and moved to ERGrottenborough said:
I doubt she is serene. More like on the edge of a nervous breakdown with all this madness around her.GIN1138 said:
As I keep saying The Good Ship May sails on serenely...CarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely (Brexit - she owns GE17) not of her making.....
I believe she knows Chequers would run into trouble with the EU and is preparing to walk out when they do, blaming them for the failure, and announcing hard Brexit contingency planning.
In these circumstances I believe remain becomes impossible
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At least she had a plan for Brexit eventually, Cameron called a referendum to head off UKIP without putting any real effort to get the concessions from the EU on FOM needed to win it then buggered off the day after it was lostTheScreamingEagles said:To think of the abuse I used to get when I said Mrs May wasn’t very good back in 2016/early 2017.
#IAmAVisionary0 -
Who's stuck in the middle with you?Beverley_C said:
Clowns on the left, Jokers on the right?Roger said:So the hard right Ultras have now taken over the Tory Party.......
Long Live Corbyn! (and Abbott and McDonnell and Long Bailey and Rayner and Watson)0 -
https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/en/aussenpolitik/internationale-organisationen/uebersicht-node-nato/nato-contributions/2117838MarqueeMark said:
"You gonna pay for an army for that united, confident and sovereign Europe then?" asks Trump. "If so, my work is done here. Losers...."rottenborough said:
This is the German foreign office's official response to those "Germans are not investing enough in defence" allegations. They freely admit they are not satisfying the spending criteria, but argue that "expenditure alone is an inadequate indicator of fair burden-sharing", ridicule the idea that "more money equals more security" and instead of cash, point out that "Germany invests in solidarity" instead.
Not the world's most convincing argument.
From what I have gathered about NATO defence bods, there is a fear that a minimally funded European defence project will simply take those resources which actually are functioning and ready to respond to a crisis, and switch them from NATO's ambit to "Europe"'s.
Incidentally that tweet is one of the reasons I think Brexit is irrevocable (at least until or unless there is a generational shift in the perceived identity of inhabitants of these isles). It's all very well wanting to trade and be nice to one another. These are Good Things. But if the institutions you are using to achieve these goals are devoted to a goal that the majority of British voters - even Remain voters - simply do not share, then that is not the right club to be in.0 -
The far left has developed a definition of anti-Semitism which allows it to be as anti-Semitic as it likes.FrancisUrquhart said:68 rabbis say Labour chooses to ignore UK Jewish community
Letter to Guardian criticises party for ‘rewriting’ accepted definition of antisemitism
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/16/68-rabbis-labour-chooses-ignore-uk-jewish-community
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Meh - the Kabuki play churns on - lots of drama but we head for the exit with a deal of sorts.SouthamObserver said:Today feels like a big day:
1. Brexit has hit a brick wall which means we stay in the EU or crash out; there's no middle way now.
2. Trump has backed Putin over his own intelligence services.
In peace time it doesn't get much bigger really.
On the domestic front, what May has done today has ensured that however ambivalent Corbyn is over Brexit, the 2017 Labour voting alliance will hold together. He must be loving this.
The great collapse never happens.0 -
Putin didn't deny having compromising material on Trump. Wow.0
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He exerted 0.004 of an ERG.HYUFD said:
And what did you do for the Remain campaign in the Referendum Wiliam Glenn?williamglenn said:
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
On a good dayMarqueeMark said:
He exerted 0.004 of an ERG.HYUFD said:
And what did you do for the Remain campaign in the Referendum Wiliam Glenn?williamglenn said:
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
You have to wonder what May and The Donald cooked up in their London meetings.....Big_G_NorthWales said:
So the US takes all its military out of Germany and the EU and applies tariffs on their cars.MarqueeMark said:
"You gonna pay for an army for that united, confident and sovereign Europe then?" asks Trump. "If so, my work is done here. Losers...."rottenborough said:0 -
The irony I suppose is that people always assumed no deal would be the result of the UK and EU not being able to come to agreement. I doubt anyone ever thought we'd be unable to agree amongst ourselves.SouthamObserver said:Today feels like a big day:
1. Brexit has hit a brick wall which means we stay in the EU or crash out; there's no middle way now.
2. Trump has backed Putin over his own intelligence services.
In peace time it doesn't get much bigger really.
On the domestic front, what May has done today has ensured that however ambivalent Corbyn is over Brexit, the 2017 Labour voting alliance will hold together. He must be loving this.0 -
I don't watch that much Sky News, but do they regularly have Novara Media people on?
These were one of the fake news lot that were spreading all the conspiracy theories about government D-notices after Grenfall to allegedly hide the true number of deaths.
I was quite frankly shocked that they would have them on.0 -
That is a big accusation , which is hard to believe.SouthamObserver said:
If that is the decision she has taken, she will need to have squared it with the Cabinet Remainers, and she will need to carry her party and the country with her. Not just in the short-term, but in the longer term, too. That would be an immense gamble with the future of the Conservative party, not to mention the living standards of millions and millions of people. For me, a stronger likelihood is that she really doesn't know what she is doing anymore.Big_G_NorthWales said:
She seems to have got off the fence and moved to ERGrottenborough said:
I doubt she is serene. More like on the edge of a nervous breakdown with all this madness around her.GIN1138 said:
As I keep saying The Good Ship May sails on serenely...CarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely (Brexit - she owns GE17) not of her making.....
I believe she knows Chequers would run into trouble with the EU and is preparing to walk out when they do, blaming them for the failure, and announcing hard Brexit contingency planning.
In these circumstances I believe remain becomes impossible
Surely the current PM knows what she is doing.
She has civil service and legal advice.0 -
Yes Ash Sarkar is on regularly.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't watch that much Sky News, but do they regularly have Novara Media people on?
These were one of the fake news lot that were spreading all the conspiracy theories about government D-notices after Grenfall to allegedly hide the true number of deaths.
I was quite frankly shocked that they would have them on.0 -
Can't wait for "travels in Trumpland" with Ed Balls.
Just saw him in a wrestling ring on the advert, doing an elbow drop.0 -
Its a bit like giving Alex Jones a regular guest slot on CNN....ralphmalph said:
Yes Ash Sarkar is on regularly.FrancisUrquhart said:I don't watch that much Sky News, but do they regularly have Novara Media people on?
These were one of the fake news lot that were spreading all the conspiracy theories about government D-notices after Grenfall to allegedly hide the true number of deaths.
I was quite frankly shocked that they would have them on.0 -
.
That is a disappointingly personal and snide attack from you, HYUFD.HYUFD said:
On a good dayMarqueeMark said:
He exerted 0.004 of an ERG.HYUFD said:
And what did you do for the Remain campaign in the Referendum Wiliam Glenn?williamglenn said:
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
Though she seems (A bit like Trump) to be too often saying whatever the last person to speak to her wants.Yorkcity said:
That is a big accusation , which is hard to believe.SouthamObserver said:
If that is the decision she has taken, she will need to have squared it with the Cabinet Remainers, and she will need to carry her party and the country with her. Not just in the short-term, but in the longer term, too. That would be an immense gamble with the future of the Conservative party, not to mention the living standards of millions and millions of people. For me, a stronger likelihood is that she really doesn't know what she is doing anymore.Big_G_NorthWales said:
She seems to have got off the fence and moved to ERGrottenborough said:
I doubt she is serene. More like on the edge of a nervous breakdown with all this madness around her.GIN1138 said:
As I keep saying The Good Ship May sails on serenely...CarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely (Brexit - she owns GE17) not of her making.....
I believe she knows Chequers would run into trouble with the EU and is preparing to walk out when they do, blaming them for the failure, and announcing hard Brexit contingency planning.
In these circumstances I believe remain becomes impossible
Surely the current PM knows what she is doing.
She has civil service and legal advice.0 -
What was personal about it? Did William Glenn deliver one pro Remain leaflet, knock on one door, man one street stall or make one phone call in the Referendum campaign the result of which he has been dismissing virtually 24/7 ever since? I at least have some respect for Remoaners if they put in the work for Britain Stronger in Europe beforehand and tried their hardest for a Remain winTOPPING said:.
That is a disappointingly personal and snide attack from you, HYUFD.HYUFD said:
On a good dayMarqueeMark said:
He exerted 0.004 of an ERG.HYUFD said:
And what did you do for the Remain campaign in the Referendum Wiliam Glenn?williamglenn said:
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
The can is just that bit further down the road0
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Do Boris and Co get to unresign now?0
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I said exactly that pre-referendum: the divide between different strands of Brexiteers, yet alone between them and remainers, meant that in a close-run result, it would be exceptionally difficult to get an agreement on a way forward.FrankBooth said:
The irony I suppose is that people always assumed no deal would be the result of the UK and EU not being able to come to agreement. I doubt anyone ever thought we'd be unable to agree amongst ourselves.SouthamObserver said:Today feels like a big day:
1. Brexit has hit a brick wall which means we stay in the EU or crash out; there's no middle way now.
2. Trump has backed Putin over his own intelligence services.
In peace time it doesn't get much bigger really.
On the domestic front, what May has done today has ensured that however ambivalent Corbyn is over Brexit, the 2017 Labour voting alliance will hold together. He must be loving this.
The only thing that could have saved it was a big win for one side or the other, e.g. 70-30.0 -
How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal-1
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Resign as PM? It's plausible. Difficult to see her wanting to preside over an EEA or No Deal outcome.Big_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
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Basically it's pass the parcel. The public voted for the parcel to be delivered, but no politician wants to be holding it when the music stops.PeterC said:
I agree. I think that Chequers was perhaps a signal from TM that she was prepared to go the extra mile to compromise. She must know we are heading for NO DEAL but did not want to make herself into an enthusiastic cheerleader for it.Big_G_NorthWales said:
She seems to have got off the fence and moved to ERGrottenborough said:
I doubt she is serene. More like on the edge of a nervous breakdown with all this madness around her.GIN1138 said:
As I keep saying The Good Ship May sails on serenely...CarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely (Brexit - she owns GE17) not of her making.....
I believe she knows Chequers would run into trouble with the EU and is preparing to walk out when they do, blaming them for the failure, and announcing hard Brexit contingency planning.
In these circumstances I believe remain becomes impossible0 -
I don’t think she now has any alternative. Any further concessions during the ‘negotiation’ with Barnier et al would surely bring her down - that’s a bit of a paradox in strengthening her hand.Big_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
I did some informal soundings locally here in Remainsville Esher and Walton (where we very comfortably held a by-election on Thursday) and a lot of the troops are distinctly underwhelmed by the plan...0 -
It'd be a big moment, uuuuge.Big_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
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Most likely she has included the Mogg amendments as she knows the EU will reject them to show it is her way or the high way, then she goes back to the original Chequers Deal unamended to get the transition period. She will only resign if that is rejectedBig_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
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This is a Priti good contribution to the debate
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I think she’ll try to keep talking - and getting the EU27 to fudge the EU’s red lines....Big_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
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So she's not serious about adopting the amendments ?HYUFD said:
Most likely she has included the Mogg amendments as she knows the EU will reject them to show it is her way or the high way, then she goes back to the original Chequers Deal unamended to get the transition period. She will only resign if that is rejectedBig_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
She should argue her case against the amendments in the first place then, not adopt them then welch on them. It'd bring the letters against her pdq.0 -
As an aside, the customs amendment is totally toothless. The EU would love to collect customs duties for us at Rotterdam for UK bound containers. They already do this for the Swiss (and the deal works efficiently for both parties).0
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Can we have a competent government please?0
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She will let either Parliament or the EU reject them for her, they are Moggites amendments she is just allowing to go forward, they were not part of her original Chequers Deal so it is not her job to promote them but MoggitesPulpstar said:
So she's not serious about adopting the amendments ?HYUFD said:
Most likely she has included the Mogg amendments as she knows the EU will reject them to show it is her way or the high way, then she goes back to the original Chequers Deal unamended to get the transition period. She will only resign if that is rejectedBig_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
She should argue her case against the amendments in the first place then, not adopt them then welch on them. It'd bring the letters against her pdq.0 -
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
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I may not have worded my question as well as I should. I was talking of her walking out on Barnier, not resigningHYUFD said:
Most likely she has included the Mogg amendments as she knows the EU will reject them to show it is her way or the high way, then she goes back to the original Chequers Deal unamended to get the transition period. She will only resign if that is rejectedBig_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
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Russian, sports, drugs, surely not...
https://www.boxrox.com/andrey-ganin-banned-2018-crossfit-games/0 -
You miss all those "Nick does not agree with that" one week after the Govt has floated it.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
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Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Taliban. Sigh.0
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The quad worked surprisingly well when it came to their core job of agreeing a budget. And the likes of Danny the Park Ranger, Norman Lamb, and Steve Webb were far from incompetent.ralphmalph said:
You miss all those "Nick does not agree with that" one week after the Govt has floated it.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
And the reports post government from those part of the machine said that Call Me Dave was actually pretty decent for doing his red box, making decisions and generally making sure the machinery of government was allowed to work etc..unlike Big Gord.0 -
Beveridge reckoned full employment was 3%, which would be a million or so.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
The employment rate is almost 76% which is almost as good as it can get.0 -
Nick Cohen acknowledges the BBC "follows the highest journalistic standards". Were he to apply those standards to his own essay, he would find he has ignored a number of inconvenient facts. (How the BBC lost the plot on Brexit, 12 July)......
.....For Panorama to make a programme, it needed to be confident of the underlying evidence behind the whistleblowers’ claims. Panorama asked for access to all the evidence, but that was not forthcoming. Limitations were placed on the BBC’s own investigation of the allegations and constraints on who we could approach. In short, we did not have the scope to make a programme which met our standards of robust independent investigation in the time available.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/statements/james-stephenson-nyr-daily0 -
They’d be better than this lot.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
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You and your facts! Begone - what we need is more hysteria.....rcs1000 said:As an aside, the customs amendment is totally toothless. The EU would love to collect customs duties for us at Rotterdam for UK bound containers. They already do this for the Swiss (and the deal works efficiently for both parties).
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I think you would be hard pushed to find somebody who disagrees with that.Jonathan said:
They’d be better than this lot.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
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I read the Rawnsley account of Gordo's time in office, he really should have been charged with some form of crime for abuse of staff.FrancisUrquhart said:
The quad worked surprisingly well when it came to their core job of agreeing a budget. And the likes of Danny the Park Ranger, Norman Lamb, and Steve Webb were far from incompetent.ralphmalph said:
You miss all those "Nick does not agree with that" one week after the Govt has floated it.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
And the reports post government from those part of the machine said that Call Me Dave was actually pretty decent for doing his red box, making decisions and generally making sure the machinery of government was allowed to work etc..unlike Big Gord.0 -
Wanted Virgins....need not still be a virgin...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5959277/Brides-Christ-dont-need-virgins-Vatican-announces-stating-chastity-not-essential.html0 -
There is a train of thought that for some, for some time government policy has been about winning the blame game. Party before country.Big_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
I don’t put May in that camp, but others are playing that dangerous game of brinkmanship.
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Kept Nokia in business for an extra year or so though....ralphmalph said:
I read the Rawnsley account of Gordo's time in office, he really should have been charged with some form of crime for abuse of staff.FrancisUrquhart said:
The quad worked surprisingly well when it came to their core job of agreeing a budget. And the likes of Danny the Park Ranger, Norman Lamb, and Steve Webb were far from incompetent.ralphmalph said:
You miss all those "Nick does not agree with that" one week after the Govt has floated it.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
And the reports post government from those part of the machine said that Call Me Dave was actually pretty decent for doing his red box, making decisions and generally making sure the machinery of government was allowed to work etc..unlike Big Gord.0 -
She won't do that, she clearly wants a deal or at least a transition period confirmed.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I may not have worded my question as well as I should. I was talking of her walking out on Barnier, not resigningHYUFD said:
Most likely she has included the Mogg amendments as she knows the EU will reject them to show it is her way or the high way, then she goes back to the original Chequers Deal unamended to get the transition period. She will only resign if that is rejectedBig_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
If it ends up hard Brexit she will let Boris or Mogg or Davis deal with it as they are so enthusiastic for it, I doubt she now has any interest leading a Britain on WTO terms0 -
Not so much “walk out” as “run away” seems to be the big strategic plan https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/theresa-may-accused-of-running-scared-of-her-brexiteers-amid-plans-to-let-mps-take-early-summer-break_uk_5b4cbd9ee4b022fdcc5bf073Big_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
Good thing that there’s not much important going on that could necessitate MPs sitting, I guess.0 -
+1Jonathan said:
They’d be better than this lot.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
'Twas when the Tories lost the common sense brake that the LibDems provided, that they went off the rails0 -
I think that's very unlikelyBig_G_NorthWales said:
I may not have worded my question as well as I should. I was talking of her walking out on Barnier, not resigningHYUFD said:
Most likely she has included the Mogg amendments as she knows the EU will reject them to show it is her way or the high way, then she goes back to the original Chequers Deal unamended to get the transition period. She will only resign if that is rejectedBig_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
0 -
I don't think many of the Lib Dems in leading roles were politically that different to the leading Tories...they were just decent at their jobs.IanB2 said:
+1Jonathan said:
They’d be better than this lot.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
'Twas when the Tories lost the common sense brake that the LibDems provided, that they went off the rails-1 -
Far fewer women sought work back then. In 1971 the employment rate for men was 90%, compared to 50% for women. The figures are now 78% to 71%.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Unemployment was well below 2% for most of the 1945 - 1970 period despite the fact that benefit entitlements were much less restricted.Sean_F said:
Beveridge reckoned full employment was 3%, which would be a million or so.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
The employment rate is almost 76% which is almost as good as it can get.0 -
Looks like Strawberry supplies are safe for the foreseeable future....
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/07/16/brexodusis-not-happenning-ons-suggests-despite-eu-net-migration/0 -
Well to be a bit clearer, I think it's possible she'll be bounced into doing that by leavers, but it seems very unlikely that it's her strategy at the moment. I can't think of anything she's said or done which would indicate that, nor does it seem consistent with the way she's behaved as PMStereotomy said:
I think that's very unlikelyBig_G_NorthWales said:
I may not have worded my question as well as I should. I was talking of her walking out on Barnier, not resigningHYUFD said:
Most likely she has included the Mogg amendments as she knows the EU will reject them to show it is her way or the high way, then she goes back to the original Chequers Deal unamended to get the transition period. She will only resign if that is rejectedBig_G_NorthWales said:How many of my fellow posters believe TM is lining herself up to walk out if the EU try to reject her deal
0 -
Trump taking some stick at last from Senior Republicans for his entertaining as ever, but jaw-droppingly suspicious performance today.0
-
Which given their collective lack of experience is significantly to their credit.FrancisUrquhart said:
I don't think many of the Lib Dems in leading roles were politically that different to the leading Tories...they were just decent at their jobs.IanB2 said:
+1Jonathan said:
They’d be better than this lot.FrancisUrquhart said:
Bring back Dave, George, Nick and Danny?Jonathan said:Can we have a competent government please?
'Twas when the Tories lost the common sense brake that the LibDems provided, that they went off the rails
Compare and contrast, as the exam question goes...0 -
Think you might be missing the point about how democracy works ?HYUFD said:
What was personal about it? Did William Glenn deliver one pro Remain leaflet, knock on one door, man one street stall or make one phone call in the Referendum campaign the result of which he has been dismissing virtually 24/7 ever since? I at least have some respect for Remoaners if they put in the work for Britain Stronger in Europe beforehand and tried their hardest for a Remain winTOPPING said:.
That is a disappointingly personal and snide attack from you, HYUFD.HYUFD said:
On a good dayMarqueeMark said:
He exerted 0.004 of an ERG.HYUFD said:
And what did you do for the Remain campaign in the Referendum Wiliam Glenn?williamglenn said:
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
Many of those in work are in reality only partly employed - working barely in excess of the 16 hours per week required to keep them off the registers and earning very little. Little wonder that there is so little upward pressure on wages given the significant real pool of unemployed who would like much longer hours.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:0 -
The position that there was no interference is much harder to defend than no collusiondixiedean said:Trump taking some stick at last from Senior Republicans for his entertaining as ever, but jaw-droppingly suspicious performance today.
0 -
The position that he chooses to believe Putin over his entire National Security apparatus is the one they seemingly can't get behind.Stereotomy said:
The position that there was no interference is much harder to defend than no collusiondixiedean said:Trump taking some stick at last from Senior Republicans for his entertaining as ever, but jaw-droppingly suspicious performance today.
0 -
According to C4 news, reports are coming in that May is trying to force the recess to start on this Thursday instead of Tuesday next week....0
-
If I were feeling malicious I could make such a brutal comment about civil servants at the Department for Education...justin124 said:
Many of those in work are in reality only partly employed - working barely in excess of the 16 hours per week required to keep them off the registers and earning very little.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
0 -
Time for a repeat of that very informative chart that shows that most new employment since 2010 is FTE PAYE positions.ydoethur said:
If I were feeling malicious I could make such a brutal comment about civil servants at the Department for Education...justin124 said:
Many of those in work are in reality only partly employed - working barely in excess of the 16 hours per week required to keep them off the registers and earning very little.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
Was it Mr Eagles who found it?
0 -
More on that here.OchEye said:According to C4 news, reports are coming in that May is trying to force the recess to start on this Thursday instead of Tuesday next week....
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/theresa-may-accused-of-running-scared-of-her-brexiteers-amid-plans-to-let-mps-take-early-summer-break_uk_5b4cbd9ee4b022fdcc5bf0730 -
This one?Mortimer said:
Time for a repeat of that very informative chart that shows that most new employment since 2010 is FTE PAYE positions.ydoethur said:
If I were feeling malicious I could make such a brutal comment about civil servants at the Department for Education...justin124 said:
Many of those in work are in reality only partly employed - working barely in excess of the 16 hours per week required to keep them off the registers and earning very little.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
Was it Mr Eagles who found it?
The one that shows George’s golden economic legacy.
https://twitter.com/frasernelson/status/1013497661121589248?s=210 -
She has gone all Adonis and is having a collective breakdownwilliamglenn said:
The ups and downs this weekend have almost certainly increased a hard Brexit by some margin and made a second vote very unlikely
I suspect Justine Greening intervention this morning infuriated no 10, especially as they said yesterday that there will not be a second vote0 -
Pretty desperate stuff. Like Cricket, could the opposition ask the umpire for a few more days/overs to get a wicket.dixiedean said:
More on that here.OchEye said:According to C4 news, reports are coming in that May is trying to force the recess to start on this Thursday instead of Tuesday next week....
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/theresa-may-accused-of-running-scared-of-her-brexiteers-amid-plans-to-let-mps-take-early-summer-break_uk_5b4cbd9ee4b022fdcc5bf0730 -
No, you are. Canvassing for votes is no less part of the democratic process than voting is, and there comes a point at which it is legitimate to ask those who bemoan the outcome what they actually did in the war, daddy?Nigelb said:
Think you might be missing the point about how democracy works ?HYUFD said:
What was personal about it? Did William Glenn deliver one pro Remain leaflet, knock on one door, man one street stall or make one phone call in the Referendum campaign the result of which he has been dismissing virtually 24/7 ever since? I at least have some respect for Remoaners if they put in the work for Britain Stronger in Europe beforehand and tried their hardest for a Remain winTOPPING said:.
That is a disappointingly personal and snide attack from you, HYUFD.HYUFD said:
On a good dayMarqueeMark said:
He exerted 0.004 of an ERG.HYUFD said:
And what did you do for the Remain campaign in the Referendum Wiliam Glenn?williamglenn said:
Yes, as she said last year: "History will condemn this period. It will condemn those who’ve sat back and kept their view to themselves, who haven’t stood up and tried to stop all this nonsense.”MJW said:
Alternatively, politics has been made mad by Brexit and she's one of the few sane ones on either side of the house prepared to stand up and point out that both parties are living in a fantasyland dreamt up by their own hardliners.Fenster said:
She's an excellent communicator. She's been driven a bit mad by Brexit though.rottenborough said:Soubry in action in House. 3 people in prison for death threats to her alone.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/26/anna-soubry-interview-brexit-history-will-condemn-this-period0 -
But that does not contradict the fact of there being hundreds of thousands of people forced to work part time in a way that was not true back in the 1970s. Similarly many have been 'encouraged' to declare themselves self employed and earn peanuts - the Government is not bothered because it gets them off the unemployment register.Mortimer said:
Time for a repeat of that very informative chart that shows that most new employment since 2010 is FTE PAYE positions.ydoethur said:
If I were feeling malicious I could make such a brutal comment about civil servants at the Department for Education...justin124 said:
Many of those in work are in reality only partly employed - working barely in excess of the 16 hours per week required to keep them off the registers and earning very little.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
Was it Mr Eagles who found it?0 -
+1.JosiasJessop said:Goes onto PB
Sees the Brexit loons are trying to wreck the country.
Goes back to reading about asteroid mining.
Only in my case I'm going back to my garden.0 -
Or that there are 5,000 people who are in full-time employment but do no work and appear intellectually incapable of doing any.justin124 said:
But that does not contradict the fact of there being hundreds of thousands of people forced to work part time in a way that was not true back in the 1970s. Similarly many have been 'encouraged' to declare themselves self employed and earn peanuts - the Government is not bothered because it gets them off the unemployment register.Mortimer said:
Time for a repeat of that very informative chart that shows that most new employment since 2010 is FTE PAYE positions.ydoethur said:
If I were feeling malicious I could make such a brutal comment about civil servants at the Department for Education...justin124 said:
Many of those in work are in reality only partly employed - working barely in excess of the 16 hours per week required to keep them off the registers and earning very little.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
Was it Mr Eagles who found it?0 -
Just received an e mail from the Telegraph with Boris's column even though I cancelled my subscription months ago
Wonder if anyone else has received the same e mail0 -
Wise, but frustrating. Enjoy the last of sunshine.Cyclefree said:
+1.JosiasJessop said:Goes onto PB
Sees the Brexit loons are trying to wreck the country.
Goes back to reading about asteroid mining.
Only in my case I'm going back to my garden.
0 -
I think what's changed is that there are far more women in the workforce now than 50 years ago, and they find that part time jobs suit them.justin124 said:
But that does not contradict the fact of there being hundreds of thousands of people forced to work part time in a way that was not true back in the 1970s. Similarly many have been 'encouraged' to declare themselves self employed and earn peanuts - the Government is not bothered because it gets them off the unemployment register.Mortimer said:
Time for a repeat of that very informative chart that shows that most new employment since 2010 is FTE PAYE positions.ydoethur said:
If I were feeling malicious I could make such a brutal comment about civil servants at the Department for Education...justin124 said:
Many of those in work are in reality only partly employed - working barely in excess of the 16 hours per week required to keep them off the registers and earning very little.rcs1000 said:
Are we? Our employment ratio (15+) on World Bank numbers is 60%, and I suspect it wasn't that high in the 1970s.justin124 said:
Full employment is what we had from 1945 - late 1960s when the jobless figures were well under 500,000 in most years.Moreover , when account is taken of the many 'adjustments' to the figures ,unemployment today remains well above mid-1970s levels - indeed on a like for like basis we are probably still looking at circa 2 million unemployed.currystar said:
So completely useless we have full employment in this Country for this first time in my 50 yearsCarlottaVance said:
I have lost track of the number of times May has been written off as completely useless...yet here she still is, wading grimly on through a mess largely not of her making.....Sean_F said:
One should not underestimate the value of optimism.CarlottaVance said:
Was it Mr Eagles who found it?0 -
Worry not Candide, all is for the best in this best of possible worlds.Cyclefree said:
+1.JosiasJessop said:Goes onto PB
Sees the Brexit loons are trying to wreck the country.
Goes back to reading about asteroid mining.
Only in my case I'm going back to my garden.0 -
The immediate issue is getting a Withdrawal Agreement in place so there is a somewhat orderly Brexit. This in turn depends on the UK signing a NI backstop for customs, which today's amendments formally exclude. So we will hit full-scale crisis this autumn. Either the EU backs down on the backstop (unlikely), or we will have a chaotic Brexit, or we cave into EU demands in the most humiliating circumstances, or Brexit will be delayed indefinitely.
I suspect Mrs May carries on because she knows all the realistic outcomes are disastrous for her and the conservative party and she is sticking her finger into the dyke to keep the flood waters bursting for as long as possible, while hoping someone or something will come along to make the problem go away.
Replacing May by someone competent won't work. It isn't an issue of competence. The problem is Brexit itself.0 -
Fred Karno’s Brexit. Roll up, roll up!TheScreamingEagles said:0
This discussion has been closed.