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TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

megalomaniacs4u said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

viewcode said:

kyf_100 said:

...Babylon 5 fans - a lost tribe of ultras slowly sinking into obscurity?...

Damn, you just made me feel a thousand years old...

Babylon 5's problem is that a lot of the cast have died, most of them far far too young.

The other problem is there's huge issues about re-releasing the original show and TV movies.

Hurrah for Pick TV for showing it.

Watching it on

(NB: Not a major Trek fan, but I massively preferred DS9 and is my favourite Trek series after TOS)

It was also expected that the show would be cancelled at season 4, so they brought forward the season 5 plotline into season 4, and that's why season 5 seemed so empty.

Sigh, what could have been. I loved the 'get out of our galaxy' stuff, but with another season to build to that climax, ooh boy.

The original* plan was for most of season 4 to deal with The Shadow War, Season 5 would have dealt with the Earth Civil War.

He almost had to invent the Telepath War to fill Season 5.

*The original plan if Sinclair hadn't left was for Season 4 to conclude with The Shadow War, Season 5 would have dealt with the civil war and Sinclair realising he was Valen, and that he had Delenn had to go back in time to fight the last Shadow War.

Sounds about right - could have built an entire season up to what is my favourite single moment, rather than truncate it into less than half of one.

I cannot say I was said to see Sheridan replace Sinclair.

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

Why would you assume if something was state acted, even one good at such things, that it would go off without a hitch?

It might well be rogue elements, or even not the Russians at all despite the target and the method, but that it has not yet succeeded doesn't seem to speak to it one way or the other. Especially if the BBC report is right about 'implausible deniability' being acceptable.

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

What a terribly disappointing show that turned out to be. The last episode was utterly ridiculous.

Agreed - was hoping for a "Night Manager" but it was not to be.

What annoyed me most is when a show could be really good and this was one...but the last two episodes just got more and more stupid.

Taboo (the other big BBC series of the past year or so) on the other hand I quite enjoyed...

Missed that one. Just watched Colateral which we enjoyed - Carey Mulligan's a great actress.

Benpointer said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

As for boycotting the World Cup - that would be a seriously bad and pointless move. I don't think England should pull out and I certainly can't see other countries joining us if we did! ( Although I think Italy have decided not to participate)

I disagree. I think it would be quite a big statement. Would I expect others to follow? Probably not, but that doesn't mean we should be part of another event that is all about allowing Putin to show of his Russia.

I very much doubt Russia will come out shining from the WC - I'd be surprised if we don't see some serious hooliganism and racist chanting.

I don't think there were any problems at the Confederations Cup. And even that stuff does happen, it will be FIFA and everyone else who looks poor for giving them the World Cup in the first place.

IIRC The Season 5 renewal of Babylon 5 came at the very last minute.

I think JMS had less than 3 weeks before from the renewal confirmation to filming beginning on season 5.

kle4 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Talking of tv, not long until two of the best shows are back, Silicon Valley and Westworld....

Westworld, gods. A beautifully shot, beautifully acted, atrociously written mess. I enjoyed the heck out of it as something so wonderfully produced it fooled me into thinking its characterization,setting and plotting made even a lick of sense.

I'm definitely watching S2 though.

I rewatched it recently, it does make sense.

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

megalomaniacs4u said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

viewcode said:

kyf_100 said:

...Babylon 5 fans - a lost tribe of ultras slowly sinking into obscurity?...

Damn, you just made me feel a thousand years old...

Babylon 5's problem is that a lot of the cast have died, most of them far far too young.

The other problem is there's huge issues about re-releasing the original show and TV movies.

Hurrah for Pick TV for showing it.

Watching it on

(NB: Not a major Trek fan, but I massively preferred DS9 and is my favourite Trek series after TOS)

It was also expected that the show would be cancelled at season 4, so they brought forward the season 5 plotline into season 4, and that's why season 5 seemed so empty.

Sigh, what could have been. I loved the 'get out of our galaxy' stuff, but with another season to build to that climax, ooh boy.

The original* plan was for most of season 4 to deal with The Shadow War, Season 5 would have dealt with the Earth Civil War.

He almost had to invent the Telepath War to fill Season 5.

*The original plan if Sinclair hadn't left was for Season 4 to conclude with The Shadow War, Season 5 would have dealt with the civil war and Sinclair realising he was Valen, and that he had Delenn had to go back in time to fight the last Shadow War.

Sounds about right - could have built an entire season up to what is my favourite single moment, rather than truncate it into less than half of one.

I cannot say I was said to see Sheridan replace Sinclair.

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

Why would you assume if something was state acted, even one good at such things, that it would go off without a hitch?

It might well be rogue elements, or even not the Russians at all despite the target and the method, but that it has not yet succeeded doesn't seem to speak to it one way or the other. Especially if the BBC report is right about 'implausible deniability' being acceptable.

If they wanted the publicity, I presume a bullet in the back would have been very easy for the FBS to arrange; if they wanted it kept quiet, I am sure they could have faked a suidice or 'natural causes' death.

Benpointer said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

As for boycotting the World Cup - that would be a seriously bad and pointless move. I don't think England should pull out and I certainly can't see other countries joining us if we did! ( Although I think Italy have decided not to participate)

I disagree. I think it would be quite a big statement. Would I expect others to follow? Probably not, but that doesn't mean we should be part of another event that is all about allowing Putin to show of his Russia.

I very much doubt Russia will come out shining from the WC - I'd be surprised if we don't see some serious hooliganism and racist chanting.

Nah, Fox jr and I will be on our best behaviour!

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/03/10/two-three-people-believe-eu-trying-bully-uk-brexit/

Quite

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

As for boycotting the World Cup - that would be a seriously bad and pointless move. I don't think England should pull out and I certainly can't see other countries joining us if we did! ( Although I think Italy have decided not to participate)

I disagree. I think it would be quite a big statement. Would I expect others to follow? Probably not, but that doesn't mean we should be part of another event that is all about allowing Putin to show of his Russia.

I very much doubt Russia will come out shining from the WC - I'd be surprised if we don't see some serious hooliganism and racist chanting.

I don't think there were any problems at the Confederations Cup. And even that stuff does happen, it will be FIFA and everyone else who looks poor for giving them the World Cup in the first place.

At least the host for the 2022 world cup will repair FIFA's reputation.

Good point - what could possibly go wrong?

Benpointer said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

What a terribly disappointing show that turned out to be. The last episode was utterly ridiculous.

Agreed - was hoping for a "Night Manager" but it was not to be.

What annoyed me most is when a show could be really good and this was one...but the last two episodes just got more and more stupid.

Taboo (the other big BBC series of the past year or so) on the other hand I quite enjoyed...

Missed that one. Just watched Colateral which we enjoyed - Carey Mulligan's a great actress.

Always hoped that Carey Mulligan was going to return as the Dr's assistant - after playing Sally Sparrow in the Weeping Angels, where she basically carried the episode. But then she became too big a star.

Thought Collateral was underwhelming though.

TheScreamingEagles said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

As for boycotting the World Cup - that would be a seriously bad and pointless move. I don't think England should pull out and I certainly can't see other countries joining us if we did! ( Although I think Italy have decided not to participate)

I disagree. I think it would be quite a big statement. Would I expect others to follow? Probably not, but that doesn't mean we should be part of another event that is all about allowing Putin to show of his Russia.

I very much doubt Russia will come out shining from the WC - I'd be surprised if we don't see some serious hooliganism and racist chanting.

I don't think there were any problems at the Confederations Cup. And even that stuff does happen, it will be FIFA and everyone else who looks poor for giving them the World Cup in the first place.

At least the host for the 2022 world cup will repair FIFA's reputation.

It would be brilliant if Israel qualify for that.

If there is trouble putin will probably blame it all on those not proper russians like the Jews.

kle4 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Talking of tv, not long until two of the best shows are back, Silicon Valley and Westworld....

Westworld, gods. A beautifully shot, beautifully acted, atrociously written mess. I enjoyed the heck out of it as something so wonderfully produced it fooled me into thinking its characterization,setting and plotting made even a lick of sense.

I'm definitely watching S2 though.

You could not be more wrong! Brilliantly written and delivered on to the screen. And there is a HUGE amount of subtle stuff that if it was pointed out to you, might just make you realise that you have entirely missed the point! Like the time shifts being in clear view - if only you spotted the subtle change in the Westworld logos!

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

megalomaniacs4u said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

viewcode said:

kyf_100 said:

...Babylon 5 fans - a lost tribe of ultras slowly sinking into obscurity?...

Babylon 5's problem is that a lot of the cast have died, most of them far far too young.

The other problem is there's huge issues about re-releasing the original show and TV movies.

Hurrah for Pick TV for showing it.

Watching it on

(NB: Not a major Trek fan, but I massively preferred DS9 and is my favourite Trek series after TOS)

It was also expected that the show would be cancelled at season 4, so they brought forward the season 5 plotline into season 4, and that's why season 5 seemed so empty.

Sigh, what could have been. I loved the 'get out of our galaxy' stuff, but with another season to build to that climax, ooh boy.

The or War.

Sounds about right - could have built an entire season up to what is my favourite single moment, rather than truncate it into less than half of one.

I cannot say I was said to see Sheridan replace Sinclair.

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

Why would you aher. Especially if the BBC report is right about 'implausible deniability' being acceptable.

If they wanted the publicity, I presume a bullet in the back would have been very easy for the FBS to arrange; if they wanted it kept quiet, I am sure they could have faked a suidice or 'natural causes' death.

I presume then you do not believe that Litvenenko's murder was at Russian behest, given it was similarly sloppy?

Fair point - but you'd think they'd have learned their lesson from that one!

The lesson being without a signed confession from Putin himself, it's not like we can prove anything beyond a reasonable doubt!

Is it true do people know that Russia claimed all the soldiers it had fighting in Ukraine, and annexing Crimea, were just on holiday, or is that an urban legend? If true it says something about being brazen.

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

megalomaniacs4u said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

viewcode said:

kyf_100 said:

...Babylon 5 fans - a lost tribe of ultras slowly sinking into obscurity?...

Babylon 5's problem is that a lot of the cast have died, most of them far far too young.

The other problem is there's huge issues about re-releasing the original show and TV movies.

Hurrah for Pick TV for showing it.

Watching it on

(NB: Not a major Trek fan, but I massively preferred DS9 and is my favourite Trek series after TOS)

It was also expected that the show would be cancelled at season 4, so they brought forward the season 5 plotline into season 4, and that's why season 5 seemed so empty.

Sigh, what could have been. I loved the 'get out of our galaxy' stuff, but with another season to build to that climax, ooh boy.

War.

ir.

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

Why would you aher. Especially if the BBC report is right about 'implausible deniability' being acceptable.

If they wanted the publicity, I presume a bullet in the back would have been very easy for the FBS to arrange; if they wanted it kept quiet, I am sure they could have faked a suidice or 'natural causes' death.

I presume then you do not believe that Litvenenko's murder was at Russian behest, given it was similarly sloppy?

Fair point - but you'd think they'd have learned their lesson from that one!

It wasn't sloppy. See the veiled threats on Russian state TV. The Russians want people to know they are behind both incidents as a threat to other dissidents not to work with the British. They judge that the British are too cowardly to take a stand on "implausible deniability".

Rudd and May's credibility is on the line here. If they can't stand up to Russia after a second case of this on Britain's streets, during a period when Russia has been the most aggressive since the Soviet days, they don't deserve to be in charge of keeping us safe.

MarqueeMark said:

kle4 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Talking of tv, not long until two of the best shows are back, Silicon Valley and Westworld....

Westworld, gods. A beautifully shot, beautifully acted, atrociously written mess. I enjoyed the heck out of it as something so wonderfully produced it fooled me into thinking its characterization,setting and plotting made even a lick of sense.

I'm definitely watching S2 though.

You could not be more wrong! Brilliantly written and delivered on to the screen. And there is a HUGE amount of subtle stuff that if it was pointed out to you, might just make you realise that you have entirely missed the point! Like the time shifts being in clear view - if only you spotted the subtle change in the Westworld logos!

I felt like Westworld was a mix of top rate sophisticated TV in some storylines to cheesy hamming it up in others. Almost felt like two shows.

MarqueeMark said:

kle4 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Talking of tv, not long until two of the best shows are back, Silicon Valley and Westworld....

Westworld, gods. A beautifully shot, beautifully acted, atrociously written mess. I enjoyed the heck out of it as something so wonderfully produced it fooled me into thinking its characterization,setting and plotting made even a lick of sense.

I'm definitely watching S2 though.

You could not be more wrong! Brilliantly written and delivered on to the screen. And there is a HUGE amount of subtle stuff that if it was pointed out to you, might just make you realise that you have entirely missed the point! Like the time shifts being in clear view - if only you spotted the subtle change in the Westworld logos!

I followed the time shifts just fine, particularly on the binge watch, with help from recappers and the like on first watch. I still think it was terribly written. The narrative was a nonsense, and the setting even more so.

I loved it though - high quality trash is pretty rare, it's like seeing great actors and great cinematographers elevate something ordinary at best but seeing the critics rave about it anyway because of the nature of the talent involved and talk of Oscars and the like, even as actual moviegovers hate it.

Because of its flaws none of its attempts at emotion really resonated for me like stuff I love, even the flawed stuff I love, but it needs to be seen.

Elliot said:

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

megalomaniacs4u said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

viewcode said:

kyf_100 said:

...Babylon 5 fans - a lost tribe of ultras slowly sinking into obscurity?...

Watching it on

(NB: Not a major Trek fan, but I massively preferred DS9 and is my favourite Trek series after TOS)

It was also expected that the show would be cancelled at season 4, so they brought forward the season 5 plotline into season 4, and that's why season 5 seemed so empty.

Sigh, what could have been. I loved the 'get out of our galaxy' stuff, but with another season to build to that climax, ooh boy.

War.

ir.

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

Why would you aher. Especially if the BBC report is right about 'implausible deniability' being acceptable.

If they wanted the publicity, I presume a bullet in the back would have been very easy for the FBS to arrange; if they wanted it kept quiet, I am sure they could have faked a suidice or 'natural causes' death.

I presume then you do not believe that Litvenenko's murder was at Russian behest, given it was similarly sloppy?

Fair point - but you'd think they'd have learned their lesson from that one!

It wasn't sloppy. See the veiled threats on Russian state TV. The Russians want people to know they are behind both incidents as a threat to other dissidents not to work with the British. They judge that the British are too cowardly to take a stand on "implausible deniability".

Rudd and May's credibility is on the line here. If they can't stand up to Russia after a second case of this on Britain's streets, during a period when Russia has been the most aggressive since the Soviet days, they don't deserve to be in charge of keeping us safe.

I hope your expectations are low on this one, otherwise I fear May and Rudd are going to seriously disappoint you.

kle4 said:

Is it true do people know that Russia claimed all the soldiers it had fighting in Ukraine, and annexing Crimea, were just on holiday, or is that an urban legend? If true it says something about being brazen.

Those guys speaking Russian, who say they are from Russia, who wear Russian uniforms and carry Russian weapons? Nothing to do with us.

Benpointer said:

Elliot said:

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

Benpointer said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

megalomaniacs4u said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

viewcode said:

kyf_100 said:

...Babylon 5 fans - a lost tribe of ultras slowly sinking into obscurity?...

Watching it on

(NB: Not a major Trek fan, but I massively preferred DS9 and is my favourite Trek series after TOS)

It was also expected that the show would be cancelled at season 4, so they brought forward the season 5 plotline into season 4, and that's why season 5 seemed so empty.

Sigh, what could have been. I loved the 'get out of our galaxy' stuff, but with another season to build to that climax, ooh boy.

War.

ir.

Benpointer said:

Off topic. If the Russian state was behind the Salisbury incident, why did they make such a feck-up of it? It's got to be one of the messiest assassination attempts ever, and it hasn't even succeeded (we hope).

I just wonder whther it was a rogue element behind it, rather than the Russian state per se. (Then again, I have just finished watching McMafia back-to-back, so maybe my reasoning is a bit swayed.)

Why would you aher. Especially if the BBC report is right about 'implausible deniability' being acceptable.

If they wanted the publicity, I presume a bullet in the back would have been very easy for the FBS to arrange; if they wanted it kept quiet, I am sure they could have faked a suidice or 'natural causes' death.

I presume then you do not believe that Litvenenko's murder was at Russian behest, given it was similarly sloppy?

Fair point - but you'd think they'd have learned their lesson from that one!

It wasn't sloppy. See the veiled threats on Russian state TV. The Russians want people to know they are behind both incidents as a threat to other dissidents not to work with the British. They judge that the British are too cowardly to take a stand on "implausible deniability".

Rudd and May's credibility is on the line here. If they can't stand up to Russia after a second case of this on Britain's streets, during a period when Russia has been the most aggressive since the Soviet days, they don't deserve to be in charge of keeping us safe.

I hope your expectations are low on this one, otherwise I fear May and Rudd are going to seriously disappoint you.

Perhaps you are right, but it will be the point I turn against May.

MarqueeMark said:

Elliot said:

MarqueeMark said:

kle4 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Talking of tv, not long until two of the best shows are back, Silicon Valley and Westworld....

Westworld, gods. A beautifully shot, beautifully acted, atrociously written mess. I enjoyed the heck out of it as something so wonderfully produced it fooled me into thinking its characterization,setting and plotting made even a lick of sense.

I'm definitely watching S2 though.

You could not be more wrong! Brilliantly written and delivered on to the screen. And there is a HUGE amount of subtle stuff that if it was pointed out to you, might just make you realise that you have entirely missed the point! Like the time shifts being in clear view - if only you spotted the subtle change in the Westworld logos!

I felt like Westworld was a mix of top rate sophisticated TV in some storylines to cheesy hamming it up in others. Almost felt like two shows.

I have to admit, when I first heard they were making a series, I thought "Really? Have they completely run out of ideas to go with?" But hats off to the team. One of the few series I am really looking forward to coming back. But then, my fav series of recent years, True Detective, was shite in Season 2 (albeit with an entirely different cast.)

A show that should have been only one season...you can’t just sub in somebody for the likes of woody harrelson.

MaxPB said:

Elliot said:

It wasn't sloppy. See the veiled threats on Russian state TV. The Russians want people to know they are behind both incidents as a threat to other dissidents not to work with the British. They judge that the British are too cowardly to take a stand on "implausible deniability".

Rudd and May's credibility is on the line here. If they can't stand up to Russia after a second case of this on Britain's streets, during a period when Russia has been the most aggressive since the Soviet days, they don't deserve to be in charge of keeping us safe.

The solution is fairly simple, kick all the Russian money out of London. Make them do their laundry somewhere else. That is something that will hurt Putin a lot, and directly rather than sanctions which just serve to irritate ordinary Russians and help Putin drive his anti-Western agenda.

Restrictions on Russian property ownership in the UK might also be something to look at.

Freeze Russian money in London, start highlighting Russian human rights abuses on a regular basis, pull England out the world cup, sanctions on gas exports (which don't hurt regular Russians as it is a low employment industry).

Politicians are so short termist but we need to realise liberal democracy is under its greatest attack in 40 years. We can't surf by like we did in the 1990s any more, just assuming free societies would naturally win out.

Elliot said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

As for boycotting the World Cup - that would be a seriously bad and pointless move. I don't think England should pull out and I certainly can't see other countries joining us if we did! ( Although I think Italy have decided not to participate)

I disagree. I think it would be quite a big statement. Would I expect others to follow? Probably not, but that doesn't mean we should be part of another event that is all about allowing Putin to show of his Russia.

I very much doubt Russia will come out shining from the WC - I'd be surprised if we don't see some serious hooliganism and racist chanting.

I don't think there were any problems at the Confederations Cup. And even that stuff does happen, it will be FIFA and everyone else who looks poor for giving them the World Cup in the first place.

That's a bit like saying how come the Millwall mob didn't turn out in force for their August friendly against an Icelandic 3rd division side.

It is almost certain that there will be cases of Russian hooligans beating the crap out of English supporters. And what will our government do about it if they're not even prepared to take a hard line against state orchestrated murder attempts in our own country?

What do you think they should do / can do? We are not a world power any more nor, as a small island, do we have any right to be.

Benpointer said:

Elliot said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

As for boycotting the World Cup - that would be a seriously bad and pointless move. I don't think England should pull out and I certainly can't see other countries joining us if we did! ( Although I think Italy have decided not to participate)

I disagree. I think it would be quite a big statement. Would I expect others to follow? Probably not, but that doesn't mean we should be part of another event that is all about allowing Putin to show of his Russia.

I very much doubt Russia will come out shining from the WC - I'd be surprised if we don't see some serious hooliganism and racist chanting.

I don't think there were any problems at the Confederations Cup. And even that stuff does happen, it will be FIFA and everyone else who looks poor for giving them the World Cup in the first place.

That's a bit like saying how come the Millwall mob didn't turn out in force for their August friendly against an Icelandic 3rd division side.

It is almost certain that there will be cases of Russian hooligans beating the crap out of English supporters. And what will our government do about it if they're not even prepared to take a hard line against state orchestrated murder attempts in our own country?

What do you think they should do / can do? We are not a world power any more nor, as a small island, do we have any right to be.

EDIT: just seen your answer below

kle4 said:

The lesson being without a signed confession from Putin himself, it's not like we can prove anything beyond a reasonable doubt!

Is it true do people know that Russia claimed all the soldiers it had fighting in Ukraine, and annexing Crimea, were just on holiday, or is that an urban legend? If true it says something about being brazen.

Theoretically the soldiers were acting on their own behalf in the Ukraine and were no longer in the Russian Army. But a lot of the units were identical to those that had been in the Army just prior (same commanding officer and complement) and soldiers got service medals for the time they were in the Ukraine.

Elliot said:

Benpointer said:

Elliot said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

tlg86 said:

Benpointer said:

As for boycotting the World Cup - that would be a seriously bad and pointless move. I don't think England should pull out and I certainly can't see other countries joining us if we did! ( Although I think Italy have decided not to participate)

I disagree. I think it would be quite a big statement. Would I expect others to follow? Probably not, but that doesn't mean we should be part of another event that is all about allowing Putin to show of his Russia.

I very much doubt Russia will come out shining from the WC - I'd be surprised if we don't see some serious hooliganism and racist chanting.

I don't think there were any problems at the Confederations Cup. And even that stuff does happen, it will be FIFA and everyone else who looks poor for giving them the World Cup in the first place.

That's a bit like saying how come the Millwall mob didn't turn out in force for their August friendly against an Icelandic 3rd division side.

It is almost certain that there will be cases of Russian hooligans beating the crap out of English supporters. And what will our government do about it if they're not even prepared to take a hard line against state orchestrated murder attempts in our own country?

What do you think they should do / can do? We are not a world power any more nor, as a small island, do we have any right to be.

Mentioned below. We are not a super power but we are a second tier power and have considerably more economic resources than Russia does, plus far more allies.

I think you overestimate the number of allies we have. That's not related to Brexit either, it wasn't easy for Dave to force sanctions on Russia last time and that was related to Russia's incursion into Ukraine and annexation of Crimea. Russian gas keeps all 9d Northern and Eastern Europe warm. It's easy for us to say cut it off, but we have our own gas supply, a long term supply deal with Norway and US shale LNG importation into south Wales.

No, the key is shutting down Putin's money laundering in London. We should never have turned a blind eye in the first place, but a certain J G Brown wanted the Russian money.

Ishmael_Z said:

MarqueeMark said:

kle4 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Talking of tv, not long until two of the best shows are back, Silicon Valley and Westworld....

Westworld, gods. A beautifully shot, beautifully acted, atrociously written mess. I enjoyed the heck out of it as something so wonderfully produced it fooled me into thinking its characterization,setting and plotting made even a lick of sense.

I'm definitely watching S2 though.

You could not be more wrong! Brilliantly written and delivered on to the screen. And there is a HUGE amount of subtle stuff that if it was pointed out to you, might just make you realise that you have entirely missed the point! Like the time shifts being in clear view - if only you spotted the subtle change in the Westworld logos!

So why don't the staff cotton on to the unshootability of the punters, and routinely beat them to death or throw them off cliffs? Are the staff not pretty much fully human, given that surgical procedure s are apparently carried out on them by surgeons, and is there any more annoying sight in the universe than Anthony Hopkins being paid for just being Anthony Hopkins?

You are dead to me....

Christ on a fucking bike.

Tory whips believe the Russians have tried to corrupt MPs with money problems. One “vulnerable” Tory recently sought election to a select committee. Tory MPs were privately urged not to support him because they feared he was too close to foreign governments, including Russia. The MP was not elected.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/boris-johnson-gavin-williamson-and-philip-hammond-among-rebels-telling-theresa-may-to-hurt-russia-dc55psrnw

kyf_100 said:

Ishmael_Z said:

MarqueeMark said:

kle4 said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Talking of tv, not long until two of the best shows are back, Silicon Valley and Westworld....

Westworld, gods. A beautifully shot, beautifully acted, atrociously written mess. I enjoyed the heck out of it as something so wonderfully produced it fooled me into thinking its characterization,setting and plotting made even a lick of sense.

I'm definitely watching S2 though.

You could not be more wrong! Brilliantly written and delivered on to the screen. And there is a HUGE amount of subtle stuff that if it was pointed out to you, might just make you realise that you have entirely missed the point! Like the time shifts being in clear view - if only you spotted the subtle change in the Westworld logos!

So why don't the staff cotton on to the unshootability of the punters, and routinely beat them to death or throw them off cliffs? Are the staff not pretty much fully human, given that surgical procedure s are apparently carried out on them by surgeons, and is there any more annoying sight in the universe than Anthony Hopkins being paid for just being Anthony Hopkins?

Doesn't look like anything to me.

Lol...

FrancisUrquhart said:

Floater said:

FrankBooth said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

One of the orchestrators of last week’s protests against the Saudi crown prince’s visit to Britain has spread anti-Semitic conspiracy theories on social media and recently described a notorious Lebanese terrorist as a “hero”, the Telegraph can disclose.

Ahmed Almoaiad, whose human rights group was listed as an organiser of the demonstrations, said the doctrine behind Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (Isil) was created by Jews.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/03/10/protester-pictured-corbyn-made-anti-semitic-posts-online/

I wonder sometimes if most anti-semites actually think the Jews are some kind of master race capable of controlling everything.

Someone needs to do some reading.....

just don’t go joining any Facebook groups on the matter...

Look, if they are good enough for Comrade Corbyn......

Benpointer said:

What do you think they should do / can do? We are not a world power any more nor, as a small island, do we have any right to be.

AAAARGH!

Great Britain is NOT a small island.
Of all the the of tens, maybe hundreds of thousands of populated islands in the world, it ranks in the top 10 for size and the top 5 for population. Probably only Honshu is economically more important.
You might say we are a small COUNTRY, if you are talking by area, and you were prepared to describe over half of the countries of the world as 'small', but that would be a particularly obtuse way of making your argument. But land area is the only way in which the UK might conceivably be described as 'small'. We're in the top 25, I think, for population, and the top ten for economy.
But that is all by the by. Never, ever describe Great Britain as a small island again. It as geographically insane as describing the Ganges as a small river, or the Great Salt Lake as a small lake.

On a separate note, a fun quiz question - what is the third most populous island in the British Isles? I'm going to bed now, so no hanging round answering guesses - here is the link - make a guess and then look it up (you will need to order by population, obviously) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_islands_of_the_British_Isles

Elliot said:

Rudd and May's credibility is on the line here. If they can't stand up to Russia after a second case of this on Britain's streets, during a period when Russia has been the most aggressive since the Soviet days, they don't deserve to be in charge of keeping us safe.

It's not exactly a precipitous time in our nation's great history for a spat with the double headed eagle so we know what May and Rudd will do: SFA.

What do you want them do?

viewcode said:

kyf_100 said:

...Babylon 5 fans - a lost tribe of ultras slowly sinking into obscurity?...

Damn, you just made me feel a thousand years old...

Hmmm. Now for those of us partial to our Blake's 7...

Possibly more in irony than nostalgia, yet still more in nostalgia than as a matter of good taste. But if you could take the theme tune, the first episode, the antepenultimate episode where Avon realises he needs to throw Vila to his death from the overweight shuttle, and the super-final very final episode, then there was undeniably something there. And if nothing else you could always laugh at the FX, though at least they'd sorted out a decent title sequence by Series 4. Lots of sci-fi shows have tried to replicate the Kirk-Spock dynamic in some way, but the Avon-Vila relationship is, ahem, a fascinating counterpoint to that. Also Vila is well up there in my list of favourite fictional characters of all time - below Becky Sharp in Vanity Fair but tucked in slightly above I-330 in Yevgeny Zamyatin's We.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ypt3xM-cxew

bigjohnowls said:

bigjohnowls said:

RobD said:

MikeSmithson said:

Floater said:

brendan16 said:

Love the spin on this poll.

You could equally argue 86 per cent of those asked didn't think we should stop Brexit.

Thread after thread of spin it seems

If you do not like it you do not have to come here. Cheers

I come for the AV threads, and I stay for the pineapple pizza debates.

I like the more want a softer BREXIT ones best

Actually I only come on here so I can get advice when I am locked in a Tunisian hotel bedroom with a mad terrorist firing gunshots outside the window.

We have a winner!

Remember that day well on here, to say PB at its best would be an understatement.

williamglenn said:

Mortimer said:

Benpointer said:

rcs1000 said:

stodge said:

HYUFD said:

You cannot begin to deal with those already here unless you gain control of who wants to come

Indeed but it's an immigration AND a migration policy we need. I don't believe the one exists without the other.

IF you are going to have a system where residency is dependent on having a work permit or visa how is that to be policed ? I don't believe the Government or its supporters have the slightest notion of the number of EU migrants living and working in the black economy.

Or, indeed, the number of NON-EU migrants (like Albanians) living and working here illegally.

I think we could learn a lot from the Swiss here. (I also think this is one of these areas where EU membership has been bad for us. The EU swamps the debate, rather than allowing us to discuss sensible things like the detection and deportation of those working illegally; a group who pays no taxes, but still gets treated when they turn up at A&E.)

We should require everyone to have ID cards.

No, we shouldn't, 'Ihre papiers, Bitte' won't wash in Britain; and we can enforce rules without them.

Having ID cards wouldn’t mean obliging people to carry them at all times.

Er! I think you will find that it does. If you are challenged by Laura N'Order and you don't have your card with you, then you will find yourself regarded with suspicion and you will have to provide other confirmation that you are actually you. It will be easier just to carry your ID card at all times. ...