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  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    The cabinet continue to sing with one voice I see! :smile:
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,111

    The cabinet continue to sing with one voice I see! :smile:
    Much like the shadow cabinet.

    Never known such an unpredictable time in British politics.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,690
    Mortimer said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Border Adjustment Tax is dead.

    (Which is probably good news for the world.)

    Indeed.

    It struck me as one of those proposals that would never quite happen. Too complicated, too many vested interests against etc.
    It would also have resulted in tit-for-tat responses. If British firms were disadvantaged selling into the US by the BAT, then there would have been enormous political pressure to do the same for American goods entering the UK.

    While there are good economic reasons for the BAT, the inevitable consequence would have been a trade war. And that would have made everyone poorer.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,188

    The cabinet continue to sing with one voice I see! :smile:
    They are unified on kicking the can, so they don't need to decide about the rest. Just needs the EU to go along with it. They said previously they wouldn't agree.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    rcs1000 said:

    Mortimer said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Border Adjustment Tax is dead.

    (Which is probably good news for the world.)

    Indeed.

    It struck me as one of those proposals that would never quite happen. Too complicated, too many vested interests against etc.
    It would also have resulted in tit-for-tat responses. If British firms were disadvantaged selling into the US by the BAT, then there would have been enormous political pressure to do the same for American goods entering the UK.

    While there are good economic reasons for the BAT, the inevitable consequence would have been a trade war. And that would have made everyone poorer.
    Did I read somewhere that it's introduction was a pre-requisite for lowering the US corporate tax rate from 35% to 20%? Or am I imagining that?
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    rcs1000 said:

    Mortimer said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Border Adjustment Tax is dead.

    (Which is probably good news for the world.)

    Indeed.

    It struck me as one of those proposals that would never quite happen. Too complicated, too many vested interests against etc.
    It would also have resulted in tit-for-tat responses. If British firms were disadvantaged selling into the US by the BAT, then there would have been enormous political pressure to do the same for American goods entering the UK.

    While there are good economic reasons for the BAT, the inevitable consequence would have been a trade war. And that would have made everyone poorer.
    Do you think that at some point, several global economic powers are going to come together and cook up something similar?

    There is an undeniable logic to the idea, but it would surely make more sense if co-ordinated and common rather than solitary and unilateral.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    FF43 said:

    The cabinet continue to sing with one voice I see! :smile:
    They are unified on kicking the can, so they don't need to decide about the rest. Just needs the EU to go along with it. They said previously they wouldn't agree.
    Are they though? Even Fox?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,169
    Cyclefree said:

    Sandpit said:

    Evening all, just catching up.



    Good luck to Ms @Cyclefree on her new endeavour, working for yourself is so much better than a dreary day job chasing dodgy bankers. :)

    I quite like chasing dodgy bankers. Not dreary at all. Rather fun, in fact. It's all the rest of it which has become tiresome. If all goes well I will be able to do more of what I like, when I like and for people I like - or at least respect - and less of the tiresome crap.

    And if it doesn't work out, well, at least I'll have tried. It's always the things one doesn't do that one regrets. In my experience, anyway.

    Thank you to all for your good wishes.

    (If a refreshingly sane voice appears on your screens talking sense about stuff - a sort of anti-Shami - well, that will be me! :) )
    Ha, enjoy your time off and we look forward to your refreshingly sane words here and elsewhere! :+1:
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,690

    rcs1000 said:

    Mortimer said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Border Adjustment Tax is dead.

    (Which is probably good news for the world.)

    Indeed.

    It struck me as one of those proposals that would never quite happen. Too complicated, too many vested interests against etc.
    It would also have resulted in tit-for-tat responses. If British firms were disadvantaged selling into the US by the BAT, then there would have been enormous political pressure to do the same for American goods entering the UK.

    While there are good economic reasons for the BAT, the inevitable consequence would have been a trade war. And that would have made everyone poorer.
    Did I read somewhere that it's introduction was a pre-requisite for lowering the US corporate tax rate from 35% to 20%? Or am I imagining that?
    To avoid blowing a Texas sized hole in the US budget, you needed the revenues from the BAT to pay for the corporate tax cut.
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    3 council by elections today ,
    Manchester Fallowfield safe Labour
    West Lindsey Scotter and Blyton Conservative
    North Dorset Blandford Central Independent

    The Conservative candidate in Dorset has what must be one of the strangest names ever
    Nocturin Bilbo Laffayette Lacey-Clarke so named after a medicine used to treat urinary incontinence , a hobbit and a French revoltionary or Louisiana City .
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,690

    rcs1000 said:

    Mortimer said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Border Adjustment Tax is dead.

    (Which is probably good news for the world.)

    Indeed.

    It struck me as one of those proposals that would never quite happen. Too complicated, too many vested interests against etc.
    It would also have resulted in tit-for-tat responses. If British firms were disadvantaged selling into the US by the BAT, then there would have been enormous political pressure to do the same for American goods entering the UK.

    While there are good economic reasons for the BAT, the inevitable consequence would have been a trade war. And that would have made everyone poorer.
    Do you think that at some point, several global economic powers are going to come together and cook up something similar?

    There is an undeniable logic to the idea, but it would surely make more sense if co-ordinated and common rather than solitary and unilateral.
    In which case it simply becomes a tariff on goods from emerging markets.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @PaulHouseK: @MrHarryCole I genuinely beleive that Labour are trying to paint a picture that they really don't know what they're position on brexit is.

    @MrHarryCole: Or their topspin on the election has not changed a key fact - the incompetence of the leadership runs very deep. twitter.com/paulhousek/sta…
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,690

    3 council by elections today ,
    Manchester Fallowfield safe Labour
    West Lindsey Scotter and Blyton Conservative
    North Dorset Blandford Central Independent

    The Conservative candidate in Dorset has what must be one of the strangest names ever
    Nocturin Bilbo Laffayette Lacey-Clarke so named after a medicine used to treat urinary incontinence , a hobbit and a French revoltionary or Louisiana City .

    His Facebook page is here: https://www.facebook.com/nocturin.clarke
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544

    we could have very easily become State 51 had we so chosen.

    There's that unfounded belief again that all sorts of unlikely outcomes are somehow there for the choosing.

    Our choices in this world are not what you think they are, and this delusion lies at the heart of so many of the problems we've had in accepting our membership of the EU.
    Wilson and LBJ discussed it, though not necessarily seriously. Had there been a deep and sustained appetite among the British electorate for a grand reunion of the English-speaking peoples, even on American terms, it doesn't seem to me that it would have been an inherently more ridiculous proposal than, say, Britain joining a federal Europe. I think the fundamental constraint is that people do not want it.

    Pretty much ditto for the proposals (raised at an official level both during the early stages of WW2 and then again post-Suez) for a merger of Britain and France.
    To me (and yes, I know I'm biased) Britain is culturally much closer to Europe than the US on so many things, e.g. welfare, health care, social attitudes, gun control, education, the arts, sport, the environment etc. etc. Since we can't abide being tied to Europe, we'd never accept becoming the 51st state.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Diane Abbott coming up on NewsNight.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,253

    If both (a) Brexit and (b) the EU, or its successor, manage to last out 20 or 30 or 40 years, I strongly suspect that the number of Brits surveying the scene and deciding it's shame the UK (or its successor) does not form a part of it, will be pretty small. Once the EU is a properly "foreign country", the idea of rejoining will have the same twist of fantasy and otherness about it, as does the concept of Britain becoming the 51st state today.

    In 20 or 30 years it's possible that the EU might look and act like a single country from the perspective of the Chinese, or even the Americans, but it will never look that way to us because we are too close and too intimately bound up with its destiny.

    Imagine the UK news coverage from an EU summit 20 years from now where an event of world significance was being decided. Everything will be tinged with a sense of loss, of what could have been had we not walked out and given up our seat at the table.
    LOL I do love your fantasies. They reveal a deep and fundamental lack of comprehension of the British and our views of the EU.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    edited July 2017
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Mortimer said:

    rcs1000 said:

    The Border Adjustment Tax is dead.

    (Which is probably good news for the world.)

    Indeed.

    It struck me as one of those proposals that would never quite happen. Too complicated, too many vested interests against etc.
    It would also have resulted in tit-for-tat responses. If British firms were disadvantaged selling into the US by the BAT, then there would have been enormous political pressure to do the same for American goods entering the UK.

    While there are good economic reasons for the BAT, the inevitable consequence would have been a trade war. And that would have made everyone poorer.
    Did I read somewhere that it's introduction was a pre-requisite for lowering the US corporate tax rate from 35% to 20%? Or am I imagining that?
    To avoid blowing a Texas sized hole in the US budget, you needed the revenues from the BAT to pay for the corporate tax cut.
    Oh, and there's me thinking that cutting the corporate tax rate would raise total tax take :open_mouth:
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    Scott_P said:
    Alternatively The BBC has "Brexit: UK-EU freedom of movement 'to end in March 2019'"
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40734504

    That clears that up then!
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544

    If both (a) Brexit and (b) the EU, or its successor, manage to last out 20 or 30 or 40 years, I strongly suspect that the number of Brits surveying the scene and deciding it's shame the UK (or its successor) does not form a part of it, will be pretty small. Once the EU is a properly "foreign country", the idea of rejoining will have the same twist of fantasy and otherness about it, as does the concept of Britain becoming the 51st state today.

    In 20 or 30 years it's possible that the EU might look and act like a single country from the perspective of the Chinese, or even the Americans, but it will never look that way to us because we are too close and too intimately bound up with its destiny.

    Imagine the UK news coverage from an EU summit 20 years from now where an event of world significance was being decided. Everything will be tinged with a sense of loss, of what could have been had we not walked out and given up our seat at the table.
    LOL I do love your fantasies. They reveal a deep and fundamental lack of comprehension of the British and our views of the EU.
    Or at least the views of 52% of the British (or in fact the 37% who voted)
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,647
    edited July 2017
    @WilliamGlenn, @Allan.

    The 90's were a time of transition between the 60s and 70s mainframes and midis and the desktop PCs. The public focussed on PCs because that's what they understood by computers, but at the time the majority of the world's code was still on mainframes.

    Most companies with over a thousand employees had one: a room full of tall white cupboards with a Freon dump in case of fire, linked to networks of dumb green screens, 20-odd lines by 80 chars wide. Electricity firms, telecommunications, universities, insurance companies, banks, the high street firms. Between 94 and 98 all had to employ a contractor or two (or three or four) for about six months, at about 50-70K pa each. That was when the average price of a house (not a flat, a house!) in England/Wales was about 70K.

    By 99 the professionals had done the work, leaving amateurs and chancers to sweep up the leavings. From beginning to end the bulge employed thousands of people, with salary costs measured in tens of millions.

    Five-ten tears later, mainframes had devolved into servers, small rooms with blades stacked on black shelves and little blinky lights. Mainframe languages melted away like snow, displaced by C++ and Java on network desktops, displaced in turn ten years later by R and Python on laptops. People look back and disbelieve that such a thing could happen - surely it was a scam? But it wasn't...

    Brexit will be much worse...
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    viewcode said:

    @WilliamGlenn, @Allan.

    Five-ten tears later, mainframes had devolved into servers, small rooms with blades stacked on black shelves and little blinky lights. Mainframe languages melted away like snow, displaced by C++ and Java on network desktops, displaced in turn ten years later by R and Python on laptops.

    Haha dream on! I think you'll find mainframes are alive and kicking, and still running lots of 70s spaghetti code, in a number of retail banks, government departments, utility companies, and others.

    There are usually one or two poor sods from each of our graduate intakes who are bemused to find themeselves learning assembler on their first placement!
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Well that's one off the next Tory leader list, this Home Office minister, Brandon Lewis, is total crap and vacuous.

    On second thoughts that probably means he is nailed on.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,253

    If both (a) Brexit and (b) the EU, or its successor, manage to last out 20 or 30 or 40 years, I strongly suspect that the number of Brits surveying the scene and deciding it's shame the UK (or its successor) does not form a part of it, will be pretty small. Once the EU is a properly "foreign country", the idea of rejoining will have the same twist of fantasy and otherness about it, as does the concept of Britain becoming the 51st state today.

    In 20 or 30 years it's possible that the EU might look and act like a single country from the perspective of the Chinese, or even the Americans, but it will never look that way to us because we are too close and too intimately bound up with its destiny.

    Imagine the UK news coverage from an EU summit 20 years from now where an event of world significance was being decided. Everything will be tinged with a sense of loss, of what could have been had we not walked out and given up our seat at the table.
    LOL I do love your fantasies. They reveal a deep and fundamental lack of comprehension of the British and our views of the EU.
    Or at least the views of 52% of the British (or in fact the 37% who voted)
    Not at all. To equate those who voted to Remain in the EU with the extremist views of Williamglenn is insulting to that 48%. Most of them held no great love for the EU, they were either concerned about the alternative or felt that, for all its faults, it was still worth persevering with as the benefits outweighed the negatives.

    The idea that anything more than maybe 10% of the population will feel a sense of loss in 20 years time because we are not part of a particular political project is laughable.
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651

    we could have very easily become State 51 had we so chosen.

    There's that unfounded belief again that all sorts of unlikely outcomes are somehow there for the choosing.

    Our choices in this world are not what you think they are, and this delusion lies at the heart of so many of the problems we've had in accepting our membership of the EU.
    Wilson and LBJ discussed it, though not necessarily seriously. Had there been a deep and sustained appetite among the British electorate for a grand reunion of the English-speaking peoples, even on American terms, it doesn't seem to me that it would have been an inherently more ridiculous proposal than, say, Britain joining a federal Europe. I think the fundamental constraint is that people do not want it.

    Pretty much ditto for the proposals (raised at an official level both during the early stages of WW2 and then again post-Suez) for a merger of Britain and France.
    To me (and yes, I know I'm biased) Britain is culturally much closer to Europe than the US on so many things, e.g. welfare, health care, social attitudes, gun control, education, the arts, sport, the environment etc. etc. Since we can't abide being tied to Europe, we'd never accept becoming the 51st state.
    I'm not an advocate for Britain becoming State 51, and I think the whole idea is fanciful really (which was my initial point to William: if Europe federalises and Britain goes its own way, to a future generation joining the US of E may be as fanciful as joining the US of A is to us today) but I would point out that America is not monolithic in many of those respects. Nor is Britain really, though I do accept that the UK would be in many ways a massive outlier as State 51. An even more massive outlier than our pretty massive outlyingness within the EU.

    In many respects there is more cultural exchange between the USA and UK, than between the UK and France/Germany/Italy. I think the Brit tendency to be monoglot is a big part of that. But then, how much cultural exchange do the French, Germans and Italians have between one another? Do they, to any really significant extent, watch each other's cinema and TV, read each other's newspapers? Do they share the same set of presenters, pop stars, public intellectuals? Do they all sit up watching the European Parliament, with all those well-known MEPs engaging in high-class debate, and does the French conservative voter watch the Polish conservative MEP haranguing the French liberal MEP and think "ahh she's one of ours"?
  • Y0kelY0kel Posts: 2,307
    Trumpton

    A lot of days ago I said that the cracks in the Congressional GOP were appearing regarding Trump. There is now a move on the part of a substantive portion of them to cut themselves off from the President.

    The information about Trump not only will pin him so firmly to the Russian regime, intelligence services and mob that he might as well be nailed to a fence but even beyond that, worse is now likely to come out about him.

  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @Peston: Very clear from @HackneyAbbott interview on Newsnight that Labour moving towards support for staying in EU single market and customs union
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,253
    Scott_P said:
    I suppose they could always dig a moat.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,690

    Scott_P said:
    I suppose they could always dig a moat.
    My guess is the proposal is for - as happened in the 1939-1952 period - for there to be customs checks between Northern Ireland and the UK, but not between the Republic and the North.

    There are quite a few arguments in favour of this solution (and Alanbrooke likes it). But I don't believe the DUP would go for it, as it would bring Northern Ireland closer to the Republic, and separate it from the UK.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Y0kel said:

    Trumpton

    A lot of days ago I said that the cracks in the Congressional GOP were appearing regarding Trump. There is now a move on the part of a substantive portion of them to cut themselves off from the President.

    The information about Trump not only will pin him so firmly to the Russian regime, intelligence services and mob that he might as well be nailed to a fence but even beyond that, worse is now likely to come out about him.

    Apparently Senators are right now begging House members to defeat any bill they try and pass tonight
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,188

    FF43 said:

    The cabinet continue to sing with one voice I see! :smile:
    They are unified on kicking the can, so they don't need to decide about the rest. Just needs the EU to go along with it. They said previously they wouldn't agree.
    Are they though? Even Fox?
    They are unified on a position of continuing current arrangements for two years or so and then a hard Brexit. But the first isn't a transition to the second. They have only moved the cliff edge out by two years (subject to EU agreement).
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,647

    viewcode said:

    @WilliamGlenn, @Allan.

    Five-ten tears later, mainframes had devolved into servers, small rooms with blades stacked on black shelves and little blinky lights. Mainframe languages melted away like snow, displaced by C++ and Java on network desktops, displaced in turn ten years later by R and Python on laptops.

    Haha dream on! I think you'll find mainframes are alive and kicking, and still running lots of 70s spaghetti code, in a number of retail banks, government departments, utility companies, and others.

    There are usually one or two poor sods from each of our graduate intakes who are bemused to find themeselves learning assembler on their first placement!
    Don't worry: I know they still exist. But they're not as ubiquitous nor as representative as they were.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @Reuters: BREAKING: Senate votes overwhelmingly for new sanctions on Russia, Iran, North Korea, despite Trump administration's concerns pic.twitter.com/F4OsghIsvy
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    edited July 2017

    we could have very easily become State 51 had we so chosen.

    . Had there been a deep and sustained appetite among the British electorate for a grand reunion of the English-speaking peoples, even on American terms, it doesn't seem to me that it would have been an inherently more ridiculous proposal than, say, Britain joining a federal Europe. I think the fundamental constraint is that people do not want it.

    Pretty much ditto for the proposals (raised at an official level both during the early stages of WW2 and then again post-Suez) for a merger of Britain and France.
    To me (and yes, I know I'm biased) Britain is culturally much closer to Europe than the US on so many things, e.g. welfare, health care, social attitudes, gun control, education, the arts, sport, the environment etc. etc. Since we can't abide being tied to Europe, we'd never accept becoming the 51st state.
    I'm not an advocate for Britain becoming State 51, and I think the whole idea is fanciful really (which was my initial point to William: if Europe federalises and Britain goes its own way, to a future generation joining the US of E may be as fanciful as joining the US of A is to us today) but I would point out that America is not monolithic in many of those respects. Nor is Britain really, though I do accept that the UK would be in many ways a massive outlier as State 51. An even more massive outlier than our pretty massive outlyingness within the EU.

    In many respects there is more cultural exchange between the USA and UK, than between the UK and France/Germany/Italy. I think the Brit tendency to be monoglot is a big part of that. But then, how much cultural exchange do the French, Germans and Italians have between one another? Do they, to any really significant extent, watch each other's cinema and TV, read each other's newspapers? Do they share the same set of presenters, pop stars, public intellectuals? Do they all sit up watching the European Parliament, with all those well-known MEPs engaging in high-class debate, and does the French conservative voter watch the Polish conservative MEP haranguing the French liberal MEP and think "ahh she's one of ours"?
    Yes, good response, agree with much of that.

    I cannot let the word 'outlyingness' pass without a plaudit - OED if you're watching, for the record and for the next edition, it was first used by MyBurningEars on PB!
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    @WilliamGlenn, @Allan.

    Five-ten tears later, mainframes had devolved into servers, small rooms with blades stacked on black shelves and little blinky lights. Mainframe languages melted away like snow, displaced by C++ and Java on network desktops, displaced in turn ten years later by R and Python on laptops.

    Haha dream on! I think you'll find mainframes are alive and kicking, and still running lots of 70s spaghetti code, in a number of retail banks, government departments, utility companies, and others.

    There are usually one or two poor sods from each of our graduate intakes who are bemused to find themeselves learning assembler on their first placement!
    Don't worry: I know they still exist. But they're not as ubiquitous nor as representative as they were.
    Fair point - and most active development these days is on digital front-ends which do sit on those blade thingies, increasingly in some far off cloud, no doubt in Uzebekistan or similar (slightly worryingly)
  • trawltrawl Posts: 142
    Scott_P
    @Peston: Very clear from @HackneyAbbott interview on Newsnight that Labour moving towards support for staying in EU single market and customs union

    Sounds like some rare recent good news for May if correct. But given that it's Abbott that's an if.

  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    Scott_P said:

    Y0kel said:

    Trumpton

    A lot of days ago I said that the cracks in the Congressional GOP were appearing regarding Trump. There is now a move on the part of a substantive portion of them to cut themselves off from the President.

    The information about Trump not only will pin him so firmly to the Russian regime, intelligence services and mob that he might as well be nailed to a fence but even beyond that, worse is now likely to come out about him.

    Apparently Senators are right now begging House members to defeat any bill they try and pass tonight
    ?!? Someone wake me up, this dream's becoming too surreal even for a dream!
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,253
    Scott_P said:

    @Reuters: BREAKING: Senate votes overwhelmingly for new sanctions on Russia, Iran, North Korea, despite Trump administration's concerns pic.twitter.com/F4OsghIsvy

    I never thought I would find myself saying this but if that tweet is correct then I think it is the Senate who are wrong in this case rather than the Whitehouse. Further sanctions against Russia and Iran are really dumb and will not help matters at all.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    trawl said:

    Scott_P
    @Peston: Very clear from @HackneyAbbott interview on Newsnight that Labour moving towards support for staying in EU single market and customs union

    Sounds like some rare recent good news for May if correct. But given that it's Abbott that's an if.

    I don't see how; Labour will continue to play to both Leave and Remain camps and mop up the growing 'general dissatisfaction' vote from both.

    Looks increasingly like Corbyn and McDonnell are playing a blinder to me.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,179
    http://uk.reuters.com/article/us-eu-trade-idUKKBN1AC0KK

    Pulling out of the TPP was "the biggest own goal of the new U.S. administration", Lee-Makiyama said. "The United States was the station manager of the international trading system and it has abdicated in a rather flamboyant way."

    A bilateral U.S.-Japan free trade deal was now off the table too because Tokyo could not offer agricultural concessions to Washington after yielding to EU farming demands, he added.

    Even Britain will probably have to agree to rules forged by negotiators in Brussels when it strikes bilateral deals after Brexit, as the EU's main trade partners adopt the bloc's norms. These will include systems to govern legal disputes among investors and food safety rules.
  • Y0kelY0kel Posts: 2,307
    The Congressional GOP has no real appetite for the talked about substantive changes in health insurance legislation.

    Its a poison chalice and they know it.
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    Manchester Fallowfield result

    Lab 861
    Green 105
    LDem 82
    Con 72

    West Lindsey Scotter and Blyton

    Con 694
    LDem 555
    Lab 230
    UKIP 100

    Note the vote shares and changes given on Britain Elects are incorrect
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,121
    edited July 2017
    trawl said:

    Scott_P
    @Peston: Very clear from @HackneyAbbott interview on Newsnight that Labour moving towards support for staying in EU single market and customs union



    Remainer Peston putting his own spin on things.

    She didn't say that all. She just said they are "not taking options off the table" over and over again but challenged about Jezza saying on Marr on Sunday that we should leave the single market she didn't have an answer...
  • trawltrawl Posts: 142
    Benpointer
    @Peston: Very clear from @HackneyAbbott interview on Newsnight that Labour moving towards support for staying in EU single market and customs union

    Sounds like some rare recent good news for May if correct. But given that it's Abbott that's an if.

    I don't see how; Labour will continue to play to both Leave and Remain camps and mop up the growing 'general dissatisfaction' vote from both.

    Looks increasingly like Corbyn and McDonnell are playing a blinder to me.


    I agree they have been playing to both camps, but if they do commit to staying in the SM and CU they will no longer be playing to (a lot of) the Leave camp. But as I say it's a big if, it was Abbott apparently, didn't see it myself.

  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,647

    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    @WilliamGlenn, @Allan.

    Five-ten tears later, mainframes had devolved into servers, small rooms with blades stacked on black shelves and little blinky lights. Mainframe languages melted away like snow, displaced by C++ and Java on network desktops, displaced in turn ten years later by R and Python on laptops.

    Haha dream on! I think you'll find mainframes are alive and kicking, and still running lots of 70s spaghetti code, in a number of retail banks, government departments, utility companies, and others.

    There are usually one or two poor sods from each of our graduate intakes who are bemused to find themeselves learning assembler on their first placement!
    Don't worry: I know they still exist. But they're not as ubiquitous nor as representative as they were.
    Fair point - and most active development these days is on digital front-ends which do sit on those blade thingies, increasingly in some far off cloud, no doubt in Uzebekistan or similar (slightly worryingly)
    The bits I like are Google's data centres: covering acres, proper old-school sites, see http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2219188/Inside-Google-pictures-gives-look-8-vast-data-centres.html. But the cloud stuff is a problem: the implications of Brexit and GDPR has forced companies to find out where the cloud servers physically are, and they're frequently not where you think.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,544
    GIN1138 said:

    trawl said:

    Scott_P
    @Peston: Very clear from @HackneyAbbott interview on Newsnight that Labour moving towards support for staying in EU single market and customs union



    Remainer Peston putting his own spin on things.

    She didn't say that all. She just said they are "not taking options off the table" over and over again but challenged about Jezza saying on Marr on Sunday that we should leave the single market she didn't have an answer...
    Ah right - that's how rumours start I guess!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,347
    edited July 2017
    Twitter did not add any new users in Q2

    https://m.slashdot.org/story/329251

    I hope nobody has any twatter stock!
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,690
    Someone mentioned Shia LeBoeuf earlier.

    Which gives me an excuse to post this:

    https://youtu.be/o0u4M6vppCI
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651

    Twitter did not add any new users in Q2

    https://m.slashdot.org/story/329251

    I hope nobody has any twatter stock!

    I wish Twitter and Snapchat, amongst others, were excluded from tracker funds. Though I suppose that defies the point of a tracker.


    Yes, good response, agree with much of that.

    Cheers! The France/Germany/Italy question was not rhetorical, so if anybody actually knows the answer (it wouldn't surprise me if some social scientist or media analyst had attempted to quantify the level of their cultural interchange) I would love to know. One of the things I found interesting (and rather sad) about U.S. national TV ratings is that the statistics are (or were, last time I checked - few years ago now) available split by race. Because it turns out African Americans, Hispanics, and non-Hispanic Whites all watch almost completely different shows. You might have thought that in a country with hardly a national press to speak of, that TV might be one of the cultural forces bringing the country together. Racial self-segregation by TV-zapper is profoundly more depressing than merely geographical trends would be.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,347
    edited July 2017

    Twitter did not add any new users in Q2

    https://m.slashdot.org/story/329251

    I hope nobody has any twatter stock!

    I wish Twitter and Snapchat, amongst others, were excluded from tracker funds. Though I suppose that defies the point of a tracker.


    Yes, good response, agree with much of that.

    Cheers! The France/Germany/Italy question was not rhetorical, so if anybody actually knows the answer (it wouldn't surprise me if some social scientist or media analyst had attempted to quantify the level of their cultural interchange) I would love to know. One of the things I found interesting (and rather sad) about U.S. national TV ratings is that the statistics are (or were, last time I checked - few years ago now) available split by race. Because it turns out African Americans, Hispanics, and non-Hispanic Whites all watch almost completely different shows. You might have thought that in a country with hardly a national press to speak of, that TV might be one of the cultural forces bringing the country together. Racial self-segregation by TV-zapper is profoundly more depressing than merely geographical trends would be.
    Not just twitter or Snapchat. There are a whole load of overpriced tech stock, companies who aren't making any money, appear to have little idea how to and whose tech isn't really anything special.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,347
    Should add facebook is really interesting comparison to Twitter. Not only is there current platform / analyatics way better than twitter, there future machine learning stuff via their FAIR group is up there with the best of the best.
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    edited July 2017

    Twitter did not add any new users in Q2

    https://m.slashdot.org/story/329251

    I hope nobody has any twatter stock!

    I wish Twitter and Snapchat, amongst others, were excluded from tracker funds. Though I suppose that defies the point of a tracker.
    Not just twitter or Snapchat. There are a whole load of overpriced tech stock, companies who aren't making any money, appear to have little idea how to and whose tech isn't really anything special.
    How many smart investors saw the Dot-Com Bubble coming in the late 90s, but could not be sure of when the inevitable crash would strike, then managed to lose money by trying to short it? That one just went up and up and up, til it all came down. I fairly recently read a factoid that my google-fu won't enable me to find, about just how much money a hypothetical wise investor could have lost that way, and all I can remember is that it was massive, and that even once the crash was "clearly inevitable" (in hindsight) they'd have lost. If anyone recalls that factoid (or even recounted it - I may have read it here!) I'd be grateful. My memory is clearly not what it used to be!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,347
    edited July 2017

    Twitter did not add any new users in Q2

    https://m.slashdot.org/story/329251

    I hope nobody has any twatter stock!

    I wish Twitter and Snapchat, amongst others, were excluded from tracker funds. Though I suppose that defies the point of a tracker.
    Not just twitter or Snapchat. There are a whole load of overpriced tech stock, companies who aren't making any money, appear to have little idea how to and whose tech isn't really anything special.
    How many smart investors saw the Dot-Com Bubble coming in the late 90s, but could not be sure of when the inevitable crash would strike, then managed to lose money by trying to short it? That one just went up and up and up, til it all came down. I fairly recently read a factoid that my google-fu won't enable me to find, about just how much money a hypothetical wise investor could have lost that way, and all I can remember is that it was massive, and that even once the crash was "clearly inevitable" (in hindsight) they'd have lost. If anyone recalls that factoid (or even recounted it - I may have read it here!) I'd be grateful. My memory is clearly not what it used to be!
    Another crash will come, there are just too many tech companies who have been funded with mega bucks but have little. Google and Facebook though have really USP. Apple are investing heavily in hiring top people in machine learning and Interestingly Uber are really investing in also pivoting away from the core app strategy.

    On the other hand, I would be seriously worried if I had much money in any of these companies that own gimmicky app related IP.
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    edited July 2017
    Sheffield-based radio station Iman FM loses licence
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-40740944

    A community radio station has had its licence revoked for broadcasting more than 25 hours of lectures by an alleged al-Qaeda leader.

    Sheffield-based Iman FM's licence had already been suspended by Ofcom for playing the lectures by radical American Muslim cleric Anwar al-Awlaki.

    An Ofcom spokesperson said: "We take robust action when broadcasters break the rules."
    Iman FM previously told Ofcom it was not aware of Awlaki's background.


    I missed this one. That's really quite something special. I like the "alleged", which is very generous given the circumstances; are they worried the Awlaki estate's going to sue for posthumous libel?
This discussion has been closed.