politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The CON leadership line-up is worryingly thin
Comments
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The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
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It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
Good to see you're keeping a calm head in these Last Days.rottenborough said:
Leaving the EU seems a total mess already and we only at about day 9 of this. What a disaster.Scott_P said:
Only Hammond and May standing up for the rights of UK citizens abroadanotherDave said:All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
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Juts because you are desperately hoping it will go wrong doesn't mean that it is or will.rottenborough said:
Leaving the EU seems a total mess already and we only at about day 9 of this. What a disaster.Scott_P said:
Only Hammond and May standing up for the rights of UK citizens abroadanotherDave said:All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.0 -
Morris_Dancer said:
I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
If your lot hadn't acted in a deranged manner and voted Leave we wouldn't need to have this debate.
Little Englanders was about right.0 -
PlatoSaid said:
Ashley Baker
Everyone's quitting at the moment
Chris Evans – Ginger
David Cameron – Posh
Roy Hodgson – Sporty
Boris Johnson – Baby
Nigel Farage – Scary
groan
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LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.0 -
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A few second too slow. Referring to my comment below:
Edited extra bit: perhaps 'stupid' is a bit harsh, but it is putting sentimentality ahead of reason.0 -
Oh god - they might form a band!SimonStClare said:PlatoSaid said:Ashley Baker
Everyone's quitting at the moment
Chris Evans – Ginger
David Cameron – Posh
Roy Hodgson – Sporty
Boris Johnson – Baby
Nigel Farage – Scary
groan0 -
Labour Leave are the nasty wing of Corbyn's Nasty Party.SandyRentool said:
I thought everyone on all sides agreed that existing residents' rights were protected by some convention or other. It isn't Labour Leave that is trying to backslide now, just the Nasty Party.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.0 -
Is it just me or does he look a little like Portillo in that photo?Scott_P said:0 -
Quite.Morris_Dancer said:
A holding statement (nothing's changed for now and we hope a reciprocal arrangement can be negotiated) is fine. Guaranteeing rights for foreign citizens when ours have no corresponding guarantee is just stupid.
Instead we've had a parade of MPs seeking to undermine our negotiating position.
There were consequences of the LEAVE vote - get used to it......0 -
The irony of a British immigrant to Italy posting this is deeply satisfying. Where's Felix?tyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
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No. And not going to happen.anotherDave said:
The 130,000 Conservative Party members who are shortly going to vote for her in the Con leadership election?Jobabob said:
No.anotherDave said:
The 36,600 who voted for her in 2015?Jobabob said:
No.anotherDave said:
Who are Leadsom's followers? The 17 million who voted Leave?Jobabob said:
Leadsom and Corbyn would be better off starting their own party together, taking their deranged followers with themMaxPB said:Hmm, just been reading more about Leadsom, doesn't deny she is trying to win over UKIP supporters but also claims she can win over Labour ones too. Sounds like she is trying to build a "movement" much the same as our much derided leader of the opposition.
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Mr. Jim, SOTBO?
Sort out the bloody... origami?0 -
They are a right ragtag collection of misfits like Hoey, and Gisela Stuart, and Dennis Skinner.Jobabob said:
Labour Leave are the nasty wing of Corbyn's Nasty Party.SandyRentool said:
I thought everyone on all sides agreed that existing residents' rights were protected by some convention or other. It isn't Labour Leave that is trying to backslide now, just the Nasty Party.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
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I guess you could call the Tory leadership election vapid bilge.0
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He's just grieving over the construction PMIs. Give him time.anotherDave said:
Good to see you're keeping a calm head in these Last Days.rottenborough said:
Leaving the EU seems a total mess already and we only at about day 9 of this. What a disaster.Scott_P said:
Only Hammond and May standing up for the rights of UK citizens abroadanotherDave said:All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.0 -
Getting a bit bored now, can someone resign or stand please?0
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"Understand that we should get the Tory leadership first round result at roughly 7pm on Tuesday & the second round result on Thursday at 5pm"
twitter.com/JGForsyth/status/7499698287027404800 -
RealBritain said:
Stuart seems to be suffering some kind of 'buyer's remorse". Suddenly the welfare of EU migrants is all of her biggest concern. I did say her demeanour seemed very bizarre throughout the campaign, as someone in a clear conflict or crisis ; simultaneously highly emotional and very disconnected.
The collective intelligence of the Leave campaign is roughly similar to that of a small school of rainbow trout.0 -
Stephen Crabb made a mistake with being first out of the blocks because nobody can remember a single word he said. Too inexperienced in my view.Omnium said:Crabb is by far the weakest candidate for the Tories. Ludicrous presumption on his part. I suspect he puts the ability to tie his shoelaces on his CV - I can't see anything else of merit there.
Labour's candidates are all quite poor - and the best of them seem to be totally sidelined.
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Thanks.rottenborough said:
John Smith was one I believe. Took up Munros after his first heart attack IIRC.JosiasJessop said:
Damn! Why are the Conservatives even having an election? It's clear Mrs May is the ideal candidate and should become PM immediately!Jobabob said:So to summarise... A leader for hard times:
(Snip)
May – a teetotal 60-year-old lady with bags of experience who spends her holidays hill walking with her husband
I wonder what her favourite Munro is? Or is she more of a downs-style lass?
Seriously though, I remember Robin Cook was a serious walker (and I think he died on a hill). What other serious walking MPs are there?
I wonder if any current or former MP has done Inn Pinn? For those not in the know, it's the hardest of the Munros to climb, involving rock climbing and/or an abseil. And it's the one reason I'll never do the Munros, and quite admire those who do manage the full round.
http://skyeguides.co.uk/information/the-inaccessible-pinnacle-the-in-pinn-1/0 -
Yes, I do need to up my medication I think!anotherDave said:
Good to see you're keeping a calm head in these Last Days.rottenborough said:
Leaving the EU seems a total mess already and we only at about day 9 of this. What a disaster.Scott_P said:
Only Hammond and May standing up for the rights of UK citizens abroadanotherDave said:All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.0 -
And yet you lost. Isn't that so humiliating?Jobabob said:RealBritain said:Stuart seems to be suffering some kind of 'buyer's remorse". Suddenly the welfare of EU migrants is all of her biggest concern. I did say her demeanour seemed very bizarre throughout the campaign, as someone in a clear conflict or crisis ; simultaneously highly emotional and very disconnected.
The collective intelligence of the Leave campaign is roughly similar to that of a small school of rainbow trout.0 -
The 17 million who voted Leave won't all be allowed to vote in the Con leadership race, so I really don't think you can expect Ms Leadsom to get more than 130,000.Jobabob said:
No. And not going to happen.anotherDave said:
The 130,000 Conservative Party members who are shortly going to vote for her in the Con leadership election?Jobabob said:
No.anotherDave said:
The 36,600 who voted for her in 2015?Jobabob said:
No.anotherDave said:
Who are Leadsom's followers? The 17 million who voted Leave?Jobabob said:
Leadsom and Corbyn would be better off starting their own party together, taking their deranged followers with themMaxPB said:Hmm, just been reading more about Leadsom, doesn't deny she is trying to win over UKIP supporters but also claims she can win over Labour ones too. Sounds like she is trying to build a "movement" much the same as our much derided leader of the opposition.
I hope you're not advocating cheating!
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Clearly has a coterie around him (including Ruth Davidson) who have made him believe he will be Leader one day. And maybe he will one day. He's established himself as the leader of his generation (for now).LadyBucket said:
Stephen Crabb made a mistake with being first out of the blocks because nobody can remember a single word he said. Too inexperienced in my view.Omnium said:Crabb is by far the weakest candidate for the Tories. Ludicrous presumption on his part. I suspect he puts the ability to tie his shoelaces on his CV - I can't see anything else of merit there.
Labour's candidates are all quite poor - and the best of them seem to be totally sidelined.
But he needs to choose with regards to the beard - either commit or shave it off.0 -
No. Dumb invective beats intelligent nuance when dealing with the Great British Public – one of the great many problems with referendums.John_M said:
And yet you lost. Isn't that so humiliating?Jobabob said:RealBritain said:Stuart seems to be suffering some kind of 'buyer's remorse". Suddenly the welfare of EU migrants is all of her biggest concern. I did say her demeanour seemed very bizarre throughout the campaign, as someone in a clear conflict or crisis ; simultaneously highly emotional and very disconnected.
The collective intelligence of the Leave campaign is roughly similar to that of a small school of rainbow trout.0 -
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
He has a short fuse.DearPB said:
By scratchy you mean?LadyBucket said:
Owen Smith is a very scratchy character and very, very tribal.AndyJS said:
His biggest claim to fame is coming uncomfortably close to losing the ultra-safe Labour seat of Pontypridd to the Lib Dems in 2010:DearPB said:I'd genuinely never heard of Owen Smith until a week ago - is he any good? Why is he getting support?
http://bit.ly/29r6oii
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rottenborough said:
Getting a bit bored now, can someone resign or stand please?
Falconer will surely oblige.0 -
DearPB said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
May's position is an absolutely nonsense. I don't think know of any EU citizen who has come to England to retire. Clacton on Sea doesn't quite cut it. They all come to the UK to work mostly.
Our lot abroad are predominantly oldies, tight fisted- as old people invariably are- and sponging off the local health system.0 -
May up to 120 according to Crick.0
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Nah, they'd only last a week before Evens left to go solo.DearPB said:
Oh god - they might form a band!SimonStClare said:PlatoSaid said:Ashley Baker
Everyone's quitting at the moment
Chris Evans – Ginger
David Cameron – Posh
Roy Hodgson – Sporty
Boris Johnson – Baby
Nigel Farage – Scary
groan0 -
One of my nephews voted for Remain because he doesn't like visa stamps in his passport.rottenborough said:
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
Didn't do Cameron any harm.LadyBucket said:
He has a short fuse.DearPB said:
By scratchy you mean?LadyBucket said:
Owen Smith is a very scratchy character and very, very tribal.AndyJS said:
His biggest claim to fame is coming uncomfortably close to losing the ultra-safe Labour seat of Pontypridd to the Lib Dems in 2010:DearPB said:I'd genuinely never heard of Owen Smith until a week ago - is he any good? Why is he getting support?
http://bit.ly/29r6oii
Poor Cameron...he's been plunged into obscurity faster than a rat up a sack.
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Can't we round up these idiots and let them live in their own isolationist xenophobic non-EU homeland on the Isle of Wight? No immigrants allowed to the island. Meanwhile the rest of us can get on with our lives without having to waste our time explaining primary school logic to them.rottenborough said:
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
Indeed. She'll make the best PM of those standing but is unlikely to lead a very good GE campaign. So she is the preferred candidate of any non-ToryRichard_Nabavi said:
TBH she's not a memorable speaker now.JohnO said:She was also there in my time. Conservative but her energies were more directed at the Oxford Union. To be a bit bitchy (oh, why not) she was not a memorable speaker!
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The argument goes that those EU nationals that are vibrant, professional etc. would still be allowed in with the fabled "Australian style points system" - my concern is that many of them come in to the UK to do low paid casual work (and wouldn't get in), but then go on to become enterprising, innovative, creative contributors - largely because their own economies wouldn't give them that opportunity.tyson said:DearPB said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
May's position is an absolutely nonsense. I don't think know of any EU citizen who has come to England to retire. Clacton on Sea doesn't quite cut it. They all come to the UK to work mostly.
Our lot abroad are predominantly oldies, tight fisted- as old people invariably are- and sponging off the local health system.0 -
In a list of her attributes, appealing and likeable wouldn't be high up.IanB2 said:
Indeed. She'll make the best PM of those standing but is unlikely to lead a very good GE campaign. So she is the preferred candidate of any non-ToryRichard_Nabavi said:
TBH she's not a memorable speaker now.JohnO said:She was also there in my time. Conservative but her energies were more directed at the Oxford Union. To be a bit bitchy (oh, why not) she was not a memorable speaker!
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Quite so, Mr. JS. Farage, for all his faults, took on the establishment and beat them. Not only that but in doing so he has managed to shake up politics in the UK to an extent that I have not seen in my lifetime.AndyJS said:Regarding Farage, when was the last time someone achieved something so momentous in British politics without being a member of Parliament? Maybe you could cite Shirley Williams and Roy Jenkins helping to set up the SDP in 1981 while out of the Commons, although the other two members of the Gang of Four were MPs.
It is no wonder he is hated by so many on here but really he deserves our thanks. I wish him a long and well deserved retirement.0 -
On Crick's figures, May needs 45 out of the 106 not declared to get 50%.rottenborough said:May up to 120 according to Crick.
Looks like she has an excellent chance of doing that - she may well be able to even if she "loses" a few due to tacticals.
When Crabb drops out she should easily be able to get Gove ahead of Leadsom if she wants to (or her supporters want to).0 -
@JohnRentoul: Corbyn now explaining that his tendency to meet a lot of anti-Semitic people the result of media distortion.0
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A bit hard on the Island, which was only just over 60/40 leave. There are plenty of places with a higher leave vote than that.Jobabob said:
Can't we round up these idiots and let them live in their own isolationist xenophobic non-EU homeland on the Isle of Wight? No immigrants allowed to the island. Meanwhile the rest of us can get on with our lives without having to waste our time explaining primary school logic to them.rottenborough said:
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
What about those that currently live on the Isle of Wight? I'm sure that Jeremy Corbyn could say something sensitive about a situation like that...Jobabob said:
Can't we round up these idiots and let them live in their own isolationist xenophobic non-EU homeland on the Isle of Wight? No immigrants allowed to the island. Meanwhile the rest of us can get on with our lives without having to waste our time explaining primary school logic to them.rottenborough said:
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
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Come on, the Isle of Wight is much too close to me. Maybe the Isle of Man?Jobabob said:
Can't we round up these idiots and let them live in their own isolationist xenophobic non-EU homeland on the Isle of Wight? No immigrants allowed to the island. Meanwhile the rest of us can get on with our lives without having to waste our time explaining primary school logic to them.rottenborough said:
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
And with most of Crabb's votes she must be nearly half of MP'srottenborough said:May up to 120 according to Crick.
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Mr Dancer - nearly SOTBO= statement of the bleedin' obviousMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Jim, SOTBO?
Sort out the bloody... origami?
0 -
Sorry Mr Llama, but I see Farage in a very different light. To avoid getting into the old arguments, I won't give my thoughts on here.HurstLlama said:
Quite so, Mr. JS. Farage, for all his faults, took on the establishment and beat them. Not only that but in doing so he has managed to shake up politics in the UK to an extent that I have not seen in my lifetime.AndyJS said:Regarding Farage, when was the last time someone achieved something so momentous in British politics without being a member of Parliament? Maybe you could cite Shirley Williams and Roy Jenkins helping to set up the SDP in 1981 while out of the Commons, although the other two members of the Gang of Four were MPs.
It is no wonder he is hated by so many on here but really he deserves our thanks. I wish him a long and well deserved retirement.
But despite that, I wish him well.0 -
The fact that she's not a particularly inspiring speaker doesn't mean she won't lead a good GE campaign. We'll have to see, but my hunch is that she will. She's very down-to-earth and systematic. In any case, the message is going to be stability vs chaos, and she's in a good position to embody that message.IanB2 said:
Indeed. She'll make the best PM of those standing but is unlikely to lead a very good GE campaign. So she is the preferred candidate of any non-ToryRichard_Nabavi said:
TBH she's not a memorable speaker now.JohnO said:She was also there in my time. Conservative but her energies were more directed at the Oxford Union. To be a bit bitchy (oh, why not) she was not a memorable speaker!
0 -
Idiot - who doesn't love getting their passport stamped? :->John_M said:
One of my nephews voted for Remain because he doesn't like visa stamps in his passport.rottenborough said:
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
All the more reason to make sure they stay abroad and aren't returned by a victorious EU. May's negotiating position is the logical result of the Leave vote - as much as we regret it.tyson said:DearPB said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
May's position is an absolutely nonsense. I don't think know of any EU citizen who has come to England to retire. Clacton on Sea doesn't quite cut it. They all come to the UK to work mostly.
Our lot abroad are predominantly oldies, tight fisted- as old people invariably are- and sponging off the local health system.
Also I think we do pay towards UK citizens medical treatment abroad although I'm not sure of exact figures.0 -
Absolutely - but I think I would drop "potentially". You give one negotiating point away for nothing then you're a soft touch. I wouldn't want anyone who thought otherwise, regardless of motivation, negotiating on my behalf.eek said:
It's a negotiation. Every assumption made is a potential weakness that can be exploited laterMaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.0 -
Remain doesn't have a monopoly on intelligence and Leave doesn't have a monopoly on idiots, much as it might suit people to suppose otherwise.DearPB said:
Idiot - who doesn't love getting their passport stamped? :->John_M said:
One of my nephews voted for Remain because he doesn't like visa stamps in his passport.rottenborough said:
Is there an emoticon for 'despair'?DearPB said:
It's like the friend of mine who delighted in voting to Leave to "send the foreigners home"; I mentioned that her long term boyfriend is German - "oh I don't mean him".JonathanD said:John_M said:
Fuck the European leaders. What about the people? Are we seriously prepared to deport people? It's complete bollocks, and, as a second order effect, a gift for all the whiny, grieving remainers to get their knickers in a twist over.JonathanD said:
lol, the wrong tone was set by Farage at the European Parliament last week.John_M said:
Really don't think it's necessary. There are ~1.2 million Brits in the EU and ~3.2 million EU citizens here. As we want an amicable divorce, I think it sets the wrong tone from the outset.MaxPB said:
Yes because they want to ensure the EU gives UK citizens in the EU the same rights before confirming.anotherDave said:
All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.Jobabob said:SandyRentool said:
Conservatives become "Send the buggers back" party.MarkHopkins said:
A government minister has said it would be unwise to provide EU nationals with guaranteed UK status without a deal for UK citizens.
http://news.sky.com/story/1721530/guaranteed-uk-status-for-eu-nationals-unwise
You voted to Leave. Bit rich to hear you moralising now.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.
The European leaders are grown ups, they will see a negotiating tactic and not take it personally.
We're at breaking point don't you know? The decent hard working people of this country are at danger of being raped and assaulted by pillaging bands of immigrants. The government can't stand idly by and do nothing - no backsliding please.0 -
Gosh- that is where I know Angela Leadsom from. Oxfordshire County Council- she was a councillor. It was bugging me where I knew her from.CarlottaVance said:
That said, she hardly made any kind of impression on me.
0 -
It occurs to me to wonder whether Mr Cameron would be able to perform one particular 'last service' by reversing Mr Brown's apparently rather spiteful cut in the PM's pay.DearPB said:
Experience is a hard thing to judge and measure - and increasingly not rated highly in other walks of life.kle4 said:I think some people are being very flippant in comparisons of inexperience that are being thrown around. I would feel more comfortable, in a weird way, if people just felt experience was unnecessary than some of the equating going on.
What this does show is that politics doesn't really attract the best and the brightest anymore. And why would it - we treat politicians like dirt, pay them nothing, and assume they're all in it for themselves. We get what we deserve.
If there genuinely wasn't a good reason to cut the PM's pay, it should be restored to the former level.
(Good evening, everyone)
edited for spelling0 -
Mr. Jim, oh.
I prefer my acronym.0 -
Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?0 -
Yes Day 9 of disasterxit and we are still in the EU with Article 50 still hidden in Area 51. I have an idea: let's call the whole thing off.rottenborough said:
Leaving the EU seems a total mess already and we only at about day 9 of this. What a disaster.Scott_P said:
Only Hammond and May standing up for the rights of UK citizens abroadanotherDave said:All the Leave spokespeople have said current EU migrants should be able to stay here.
The only voices against have been Mr Hammond, and Ms May.0 -
It's complicated. There were longstanding reciprocal arrangements for healthcare costs. The 2008 crash has made it much more complex, particularly in places like Spain. The UK has also tightened up the conditions for ex-pats hopping back to the UK for NHS treatment.JonathanD said:
All the more reason to make sure they stay abroad and aren't returned by a victorious EU. May's negotiating position is the logical result of the Leave vote - as much as we regret it.tyson said:DearPB said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
May's position is an absolutely nonsense. I don't think know of any EU citizen who has come to England to retire. Clacton on Sea doesn't quite cut it. They all come to the UK to work mostly.
Our lot abroad are predominantly oldies, tight fisted- as old people invariably are- and sponging off the local health system.
Also I think we do pay towards UK citizens medical treatment abroad although I'm not sure of exact figures.
Over a 100k Brits have left Spain since 2014. Wonder where they've gone?0 -
Are you a) the Chief Exec of Oxfordshire County Council b) the Leader of the Conservative Group c) a member of the electorate - just so I can put appropriate weight to your lack of recollection!tyson said:
Gosh- that is where I know Angela Leadsom from. Oxfordshire County Council- she was a councillor. It was bugging me where I knew her from.CarlottaVance said:
That said, she hardly made any kind of impression on me.0 -
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.0 -
Miss JGP, good afternoon. That's a good point, which I'd forgotten about. Brown was a vindictive sod.0
-
2001:Paul_Bedfordshire said:Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?
Are the Tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has been a member of Thatcher's Cabinet, Home Secretary and Chancellor of the Exchequer and someone who has only been heard of because of their disloyalty....0 -
God - Jobatwobob in superior being mode - not prettyJobabob said:
No. Dumb invective beats intelligent nuance when dealing with the Great British Public – one of the great many problems with referendums.John_M said:
And yet you lost. Isn't that so humiliating?Jobabob said:RealBritain said:Stuart seems to be suffering some kind of 'buyer's remorse". Suddenly the welfare of EU migrants is all of her biggest concern. I did say her demeanour seemed very bizarre throughout the campaign, as someone in a clear conflict or crisis ; simultaneously highly emotional and very disconnected.
The collective intelligence of the Leave campaign is roughly similar to that of a small school of rainbow trout.0 -
Something about when you describe your beloved continentals as 'young and vibrant' turns my stomach a little. It's faintly redolent of some dirty mac pervert.tyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.0 -
I was a Regional Director in the Health Service.....so had quite alot to do with Oxfordshire County Council. I always found the Tory County Council really quite easy to deal with, as too Kent when I worked in the Local Authority. Tory Shire Councillors are a rather pleasant lot.DearPB said:
Are you a) the Chief Exec of Oxfordshire County Council b) the Leader of the Conservative Group c) a member of the electorate - just so I can put appropriate weight to your lack of recollection!tyson said:
Gosh- that is where I know Angela Leadsom from. Oxfordshire County Council- she was a councillor. It was bugging me where I knew her from.CarlottaVance said:
That said, she hardly made any kind of impression on me.
Oxford City was a different kettle of fish. Larry Sanders (Bernie's brother) was very prominent, and there were some very outspoken, lefty firebrands that were really quite difficult.
0 -
Incidentally, I recently begun the second volume (there's four but I only have the first two) of Dodge's biography of Bonaparte. Must admit I prefer ancient warfare. Boney's just been retracing Hannibal's steps, albeit in rather easier circumstance.0
-
Rather hypocritical since the entire left wing edifice relies on precisely the dumb invective he's now wingeing about.ReggieCide said:
God - Jobatwobob in superior being mode - not prettyJobabob said:
No. Dumb invective beats intelligent nuance when dealing with the Great British Public – one of the great many problems with referendums.John_M said:
And yet you lost. Isn't that so humiliating?Jobabob said:RealBritain said:Stuart seems to be suffering some kind of 'buyer's remorse". Suddenly the welfare of EU migrants is all of her biggest concern. I did say her demeanour seemed very bizarre throughout the campaign, as someone in a clear conflict or crisis ; simultaneously highly emotional and very disconnected.
The collective intelligence of the Leave campaign is roughly similar to that of a small school of rainbow trout.0 -
Could be important for the undeclared MPs (Huw Merriman I'm looking at you).
Our special Next Party Leader survey result coming within the hour.
— ConservativeHome (@ConHome) July 4, 20160 -
i'm rrrriiigggghhhttt hhheeerrre - the tablets don't kick in till after 6pm but don't worry I buy them and pay the full cost - no burden on the British taxpayer despite 35 years of continous work in the UK to who I still pay taxes. To be serious the Telegraph article refeered to guaranteeing the status of Brit immigrants in the UK is a load of bollocks. Only the UK govt negotiating with Spain, France , etc can do that. The Vienna convention cannot be relied on to help individuals. However, Tyson is correct - if the UK did deny rights to the relatively fit, young and healthy EU nationals currently propping up the UK economy - returning 'expats' might not be the most reliable group to plug the gap and the British NHS might find itself unusually busyJohn_M said:
The irony of a British immigrant to Italy posting this is deeply satisfying. Where's Felix?tyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
However, I can guarantee that it will not be necessary for yours truly to be among the 'returners. 0 -
Bloody hell mate, you must have something of a sordid mind.Luckyguy1983 said:
Something about when you describe your beloved continentals as 'young and vibrant' turns my stomach a little. It's faintly redolent of some dirty mac pervert.tyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
0 -
County Councillor's are generally (in my Tory experience) fairly sensible, moderate and importantly, without further ambition. Day time meetings mean they're all retired.tyson said:
I was a Regional Director in the Health Service.....so had quite alot to do with Oxfordshire County Council. I always found the Tory County Council really quite easy to deal with, as too Kent when I worked in the Local Authority. Tory Shire Councillors are a rather pleasant lot.DearPB said:
Are you a) the Chief Exec of Oxfordshire County Council b) the Leader of the Conservative Group c) a member of the electorate - just so I can put appropriate weight to your lack of recollection!tyson said:
Gosh- that is where I know Angela Leadsom from. Oxfordshire County Council- she was a councillor. It was bugging me where I knew her from.CarlottaVance said:
That said, she hardly made any kind of impression on me.
Oxford City was a different kettle of fish. Larry Sanders (Bernie's brother) was very prominent, and there were some very outspoken, lefty firebrands that were really quite difficult.0 -
Well the parallels with Labour and Corbyn are obvious.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?
Of course one would expect the members to choose May over Leadsom. But it's not a certainty - if enough think the PM must have voted Leave then Leadsom just might do it.
This puts huge responsibility on Con MPs - if they don't think Leadsom is acceptable or credible then enough May supporters have to vote Gove to put Gove in the Final.
Based on the members straw poll posted on here this morning, May would beat Gove even more easily than she would beat Leadsom - so this looks like the optimal course of action for them to take.0 -
Agreed; made me think of the old joke with the punchline - well you're the one drawing dirty pictures.tyson said:
Bloody hell mate, you must have something of a sordid mind.Luckyguy1983 said:
Something about when you describe your beloved continentals as 'young and vibrant' turns my stomach a little. It's faintly redolent of some dirty mac pervert.tyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.0 -
Sadly Mr Tyson, you are broadly correct - indeed I have one neighbour here in southern Spain who came here to escape the 'immigrants' in the UK and uses the Spanish NHS constantly without fluttering an eyelid at the irony. However, we're not all the same.tyson said:DearPB said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
May's position is an absolutely nonsense. I don't think know of any EU citizen who has come to England to retire. Clacton on Sea doesn't quite cut it. They all come to the UK to work mostly.
Our lot abroad are predominantly oldies, tight fisted- as old people invariably are- and sponging off the local health system.0 -
Well they turned down Ken Clarke, one of the best leaders they've never had and an MP since 1970 in favour of IDS.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_Clarke0 -
Simba has confirmed he'll run btw - just got out the meeting with Falconer.Jobabob said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.0 -
Correct - and if the UK stops paying a lot of em will be forced back - I hope the NHS is readyJonathanD said:
All the more reason to make sure they stay abroad and aren't returned by a victorious EU. May's negotiating position is the logical result of the Leave vote - as much as we regret it.tyson said:DearPB said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
May's position is an absolutely nonsense. I don't think know of any EU citizen who has come to England to retire. Clacton on Sea doesn't quite cut it. They all come to the UK to work mostly.
Our lot abroad are predominantly oldies, tight fisted- as old people invariably are- and sponging off the local health system.
Also I think we do pay towards UK citizens medical treatment abroad although I'm not sure of exact figures. 0 -
Sometimes people want a fresh start.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?0 -
The Crabb, the Fox and the cat.Pulpstar said:
Simba has confirmed he'll run btw - just got out the meeting with Falconer.Jobabob said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.0 -
Mostly they have returned to the UK after the property crash. Of course large numbers were happily milking both UK and Spanish systems while simultaneously raging about immigrants and scroungers. Tis the way of the world.John_M said:
It's complicated. There were longstanding reciprocal arrangements for healthcare costs. The 2008 crash has made it much more complex, particularly in places like Spain. The UK has also tightened up the conditions for ex-pats hopping back to the UK for NHS treatment.JonathanD said:
All the more reason to make sure they stay abroad and aren't returned by a victorious EU. May's negotiating position is the logical result of the Leave vote - as much as we regret it.tyson said:DearPB said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
May's position is an absolutely nonsense. I don't think know of any EU citizen who has come to England to retire. Clacton on Sea doesn't quite cut it. They all come to the UK to work mostly.
Our lot abroad are predominantly oldies, tight fisted- as old people invariably are- and sponging off the local health system.
Also I think we do pay towards UK citizens medical treatment abroad although I'm not sure of exact figures.
Over a 100k Brits have left Spain since 2014. Wonder where they've gone?0 -
A point I made earlier - and I bloody voted for him. I was young what can I say...rural_voter said:
Well they turned down Ken Clarke, one of the best leaders they've never had and an MP since 1970 in favour of IDS.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_Clarke0 -
One of the bizarre elements of the referendum is the role of the free market Thatcherites championing the WWC. I wonder if after all this time, is this simply guilt kicking in since they destroyed these very communities through their neo liberal ideology and have shown no remorse since.ReggieCide said:
God - Jobatwobob in superior being mode - not prettyJobabob said:
No. Dumb invective beats intelligent nuance when dealing with the Great British Public – one of the great many problems with referendums.John_M said:
And yet you lost. Isn't that so humiliating?Jobabob said:RealBritain said:Stuart seems to be suffering some kind of 'buyer's remorse". Suddenly the welfare of EU migrants is all of her biggest concern. I did say her demeanour seemed very bizarre throughout the campaign, as someone in a clear conflict or crisis ; simultaneously highly emotional and very disconnected.
The collective intelligence of the Leave campaign is roughly similar to that of a small school of rainbow trout.
Or have they stoked up the WWC by playing the race card and making promises about all this money that will come back to them in pursuit of another nihilistic cause.
0 -
Is it more complex than that? The holder of Home Office may or may not be a good potential PM. There is no way of knowing how good or bad a candidate will be at the top job. Past performance in different roles is in fact a distraction.rural_voter said:
Well they turned down Ken Clarke, one of the best leaders they've never had and an MP since 1970 in favour of IDS.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_Clarke
I hate to admit this, but I expected Gordon to be competent as PM. I was way off target there!
I guess this contest illustrates why most companies appoint a new MD, CEO or Chairman from outside the existing staff. The pool is deeper and more diverse.By limiting candidature to MPs we automatically rule out most of the best option.0 -
This is brutal re Corbyn.
And he's still going nowhere.0 -
Whereas by allowing anyone to run for the top job, America has it sorted. Oh, wait...philiph said:
Is it more complex than that? The holder of Home Office may or may not be a good potential PM. There is no way of knowing how good or bad a candidate will be at the top job. Past performance in different roles is in fact a distraction.rural_voter said:
Well they turned down Ken Clarke, one of the best leaders they've never had and an MP since 1970 in favour of IDS.Paul_Bedfordshire said:Assuming it is Leadsom v May
Are the tories crazy enough when given the choice of someone who has held down the post of home Sectretary (normally the graveyard of political careers) for over six years and someone no one heard of until a couple of recent TV debates....
At a time when it is vital to have a calm experienced hand on the tiller...
Vote for the complete unknown?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_Clarke
I hate to admit this, but I expected Gordon to be competent as PM. I was way off target there!
I guess this contest illustrates why most companies appoint a new MD, CEO or Chairman from outside the existing staff. The pool is deeper and more diverse.By limiting candidature to MPs we automatically rule out most of the best option.0 -
LG83 is a fan of Putin. He prefers bare torsos to dirty macs.tyson said:
Bloody hell mate, you must have something of a sordid mind.Luckyguy1983 said:
Something about when you describe your beloved continentals as 'young and vibrant' turns my stomach a little. It's faintly redolent of some dirty mac pervert.tyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/image/1120562-3x2-940x627.jpg0 -
Simba?Jobabob said:
The Crabb, the Fox and the cat.Pulpstar said:
Simba has confirmed he'll run btw - just got out the meeting with Falconer.Jobabob said:
LOLtyson said:
The vast majority of EU citizens in Britain are vibrant, professional, young and contributing massively to the economy. Our lot abroad, are mostly a bunch of inactive, elderly expats with a range of chronic health complaints.Morris_Dancer said:I am perplexed by the view EU citizens here should have rights guaranteed unilaterally, without a corresponding guarantee in place for UK citizens in the EU.
I don't think May has quite thought through her bargaining position through since we would hope that the EU citizens stay, and none of the lumpen, idle, and mostly old expats return.0 -
Number of Peers has today fallen below 800 (due to Lord Hardie's leave of absence - Crossbench).
I think the number peaked at well over 830 after the last large batch of appointments - so lots of scope for Cameron to appoint a large chunk in his Resignation Honours List.0 -
I can confirm I was offered a post in the shadow cabinet two hours ago, and resigned an hour ago to set a good example.0
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And you still stayed in post longer than Pat GlassPaul_Bedfordshire said:I can confirm I was offered a post in the shadow cabinet two hours ago, and resigned an hour ago to set a good example.
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What do we know about the format etc of tonight's (I think) leadership hustings? And if we get Gove drunk will he gossip about them later?0
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Regardless of other consideration, Corbyn handling the Committee hearings extraordinarily well IMO. I've been on four SCs and they operate on a basis of politely but searchingly catching people out, and he's giving a good example of patient and intelligent responses under fire.0
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Mr. H, there's only one MD at pb.com 0
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Not watching it, but all the political journalists on Twitter seem to disagree with you...NickPalmer said:Regardless of other consideration, Corbyn handling the Committee hearings extraordinarily well IMO. I've been on four SCs and they operate on a basis of politely but searchingly catching people out, and he's giving a good example of patient and intelligent responses under fire.
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