politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Guest slot: The impact of leaving the EU on London’s techno
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At times like this I'm always impressed at the self-control of people with Betfair accounts not to make a Twitter account called Bob ICM and post a bunch of numbers.TheScreamingEagles said:Hah.
The ICM website has crashed at 12.30pm.0 -
The Spanish and Portuguese are too busy destroying the fish stocks off West Africa.OldKingCole said:
When we have these discussions here, I often wonder what would be posted on a comparable Spanish or Portuguese (both of wehich have substantial fishing industries) site. Does anyone know. My Spanish isn’t good enough to find out!MattW said:
You are still missing the point, though the fish stock of Red Herrings seems to be in rude health.MattW said:
If you bother reading the paper I quoted, you'll see that fishing stocks around the UK had been almost completely decimated before the introduction of the CFP. The CFP has considerably slowed that decline. It has, however, not yet managed to arrest the decline due, primarily, to the refusal of national governments to properly implement the proposals of the scientists involved. What we need is a CFP with more teeth; leaving the CFP can only lead to disaster.OldKingCole said:
This is mainly missing the point, which is the destruction of the industry largely as a result of a failed regulatory system, and the impossibility of reformation of that failed regulatory system.Richard_Tyndall said:
I’m grateful for the information, which, from a fairly uneducated viewpooint co-incides with what I ‘felt” ..... fish stocks were in trouble before, but the CFP didn’t help as much as it could have. However, as regards bottom feeders, IIRC Icelandic fishermen don’t normally fish for them, do they? Thought the seabed was unsuitable.FeersumEnjineeya said:
Which would be why the two countries outside of the CFP have been able to maintain and restore fishing stocks whilst those inside have not or have done it far more slowly?Richard_Tyndall said:OldKingCole said:
I’m prepared to be told I’m wrong, but weren’t fish stocks running low BEFORE the CFP took effect? Compare the cod stocks (or lack of them) on the Grand Banks.
The CFP have mandated that a large proportion - probably half or more - of caught fish has had to be thrown back into the sea, dead, because of a failed regulatory regime. That discard alone shows that it failed.
Perhaps fish stocks wouldn't have declined (or stayed at endangered levels) if we had been able to keep what we caught, rather than catching twice as much as we keep, and throwing half back, dead.
Then it has taken 30+ years to even begin to sort the discard problem, and that because of the intervention of a TV Celebrity Chef, and the issue has proven to be beyond the ability of a sclerotic, failed, EU to resolve.
Then the industry has been forcibly decimated repearedly as a result of that failure.
How does a policy which forces half of the fish catch to be thrown back dead help fish stocks to recover?
If the EU had a chance of working then the CFP would have been fixed by 1990, and we would have recovered stocks by now.
It didn't work. It doesn't work. It prevented recovery (just as is the Euro for teh Eurozone btw). And it is a disaster.
And it caused repeated decimation of the fishing industry.
And the nature of the EU prevented that policy being fixed, because it is simply disfunctional.
Ergo .. Better Off Out.
Do they complain about the CFP as (some) British fishermen do?
And there’s an area where comparison can be made with other industries. Coal and steel for example.
Secondly, does anyone know what, if anything, is being done to revive the cod stocks off Newfoundland?
Edit ..... just found this https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn27867-cod-make-a-comeback-thanks-to-strict-cuts-in-fishing/0 -
The attack in Paris was TWICE as deadly as the one in Orlando -wasn't it?TheScreamingEagles said:
Yup, there is that. won't stop some Leavers trying to weaponise Orlando.AlastairMeeks said:@TSE I hadn't realised that Florida was in the EU.
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I think Bernstein was the most bearish at a 25 point drop vs EUR and 33 point drop vs USD, but most came into the ranges I mentioned. Some even think that there will be a medium term rise in the value of sterling vs EUR based on a forced correction to our huge current account (and trade) deficit post-brexit.felix said:
I'm afraid I don't keep links but I have seen these reports in the Guardian and the Telegraph. Believe me, i have very good reasons for hoping they're wrong!MaxPB said:
Care to link to these forecasts?felix said:
I agree - but it will go a lot lower than 1:1.25 - most forecasters expect at least another 20% fall -and we don't know how long that might last.Pulpstar said:
1:1 would be too low Mr Felix ! But 1:1.4 is too high ;pfelix said:
Not for those of us paid in £s and living in Europe. tghere are many in my part of the world who could be forced to return if the £ fell to 1:1 against the euro or worse. They are invariably old and relatively poor. I hope the NHS is ready.Pulpstar said:1.42 / 1.26 are perfectly "normal" mid bank rates...
1.4 to the € was painful, very painful.
1.26 seems "about right" to me, a happy place for both exporters and holidaymakers.
I had the overview a couple of weeks ago and it was a 10-12 point fall vs USD and a 7-9 point fall vs EUR.0 -
It will be owned by the Tory Remainers. Just as Leave will be owned by the Tory Leavers. It'll be fun and games, that's for sure. As ever, Corbyn is the Tory get out of jail free card.MaxPB said:
Possibly, however, if we remain and the same happens a year from now it will be owned by the the in camp who have basically promised perpetual economic growth on the back of our EU membership. Completely ignoring how badly the EMU crisis blew our economy off course just a few years ago.SouthamObserver said:
Whatever happens in the markets and the wider economy after 23rd June and our vote to Brexit will be owned by Leave; good and bad.MaxPB said:
Whatever comes economically after Brexit is going to happen anyway. Brexit may just bring it forwards. We can't have long term economic policy built on consumer borrowing and importation of goods. It hurts domestic investment, productivity and overall economic growth. Balancing the current account is more important than balancing the fiscal budget IMO.FrankBooth said:
The thing is would Brexit be bringing forward a necessary correction or would it overwhelm us given our current precarious state? As the previous article that I linked by AEP pointed out we have a record current account deficit and are keeping our head above water thanks to flightly incoming capital - which could just as quickly fly away.volcanopete said:The pound is plunging,a prelude to a up to 33% correction on Brexit.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36515816
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Your sympathy is very moving - I made the choice knowing we were in the EU, factoring that in at a time when there was no meaningful prospect of that status changing - as did many hundreds of thousands of others, far less well buffered than I am.GeoffM said:
You made that choice.felix said:
It's good to see you people having such fun with an issue that affects the daily lives of thousands of people, mainly pensioners, living abroad. Very tasteful.PlatoSaid said:
Ha - so true. And lots of graphs with questionable Y axis.chestnut said:I see that sterling is playing the role of the NHS in winter as people try to talk up a crisis.
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I don't remember this level of frothing during the Scottish referendum, even though a Yes vote would have caused far more disruption and uncertainty. Perhaps this is a reflection of the fact the markets are taking Brexit seriously unlike Scottish Independence which always looked a long shot.TheScreamingEagles said:I could cause carnage on the betting markets, sterling and FTSE 100 right now.
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Got to chuckle at that tweet.TheScreamingEagles said:Looks like we're getting a Guardian ICM phone poll today
https://twitter.com/martinboon/status/742321342817669120
I can't help but like Martin Boon.0 -
Lolz
Michael Savage
Wow: Andrew Tyrie says Vote Leave's '£350m for NHS' claim as damaging to trust as "Blair’s false prospectus on Iraq" https://t.co/OufZbBams40 -
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
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Without wanting to upset the Scots, Scottish Independence won't have much impact on the world, Brexit would.tlg86 said:
I don't remember this level of frothing during the Scottish referendum, even though a Yes vote would have caused far more disruption and uncertainty. Perhaps this is a reflection of the fact the markets are taking Brexit seriously unlike Scottish Independence which always looked a long shot.TheScreamingEagles said:I could cause carnage on the betting markets, sterling and FTSE 100 right now.
Scottish Independence would have meant rump UK would still be in the single market0 -
I don't think that a homegrown terrorist plays into the hands of either group. Free movement of people across the EU has nothing to do with terrorism in the US commited by a US citizen.Estobar said:
They don't have to do anything.TheScreamingEagles said:
Yup, there is that. won't stop some Leavers trying to weaponise Orlando.AlastairMeeks said:@TSE I hadn't realised that Florida was in the EU.
The fact is that a Muslim nutter murdered innocent people who believe in western values. If you think that helps play into Remain's position, you're welcome.0 -
Thanks Edmund. Interesting view. If the commentators are right, you would think the corollary of Yen up -> Nikkei drops & companies worth less would be £ down -> FTSE rises & UK companies worth more, which sounds good for pensioners and UK business to me... Guess we'll see on the 24th!edmundintokyo said:
I don't understand the world of finance (although recently I've been doing technology-related consulting in it, and it seems to consist of the smartest people I've ever met doing the stupidest shit you can imagine) but I can confirm that the Japanese press are also blaming the drop on fear of Brexit. Apparently this is making the yen go up, which in turn makes Japanese companies worth less in real terms, and worth even more less in yen.Anna said:From the BBC website -
"Worries about the economic impact of leaving the EU were also blamed for a big fall in Asian stock markets. Japan's Nikkei index closed 3.5% down, while Hong Kong's main index slid 2.5%.
However, the reaction on London's FTSE 100 was muted, with the index down 0.3% in morning trading."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36515816
Seriously? >3.5% of the value of Japanese assets is dependent on whether an island the other side of the world is part of a free trading zone that Japan doesn't even have a free trade agreement with?0 -
The implications of Brexit go way beyond the UK. I imagine that's the big difference.tlg86 said:
I don't remember this level of frothing during the Scottish referendum, even though a Yes vote would have caused far more disruption and uncertainty. Perhaps this is a reflection of the fact the markets are taking Brexit seriously unlike Scottish Independence which always looked a long shot.TheScreamingEagles said:I could cause carnage on the betting markets, sterling and FTSE 100 right now.
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Maybe the EU should have been nicer to us.....SouthamObserver said:
The implications of Brexit go way beyond the UK. I imagine that's the big difference.tlg86 said:
I don't remember this level of frothing during the Scottish referendum, even though a Yes vote would have caused far more disruption and uncertainty. Perhaps this is a reflection of the fact the markets are taking Brexit seriously unlike Scottish Independence which always looked a long shot.TheScreamingEagles said:I could cause carnage on the betting markets, sterling and FTSE 100 right now.
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So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks0 -
I see little Owen had a mega melt down on the Sky paper review and stormed off set. Whether he be right or wrong why can't the left ever accept someone else may have an opinion other than their own.0
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If you're going to streak down Threadneedle Street, please at least keep you pants on, that way the markets may recover by August.TheScreamingEagles said:I could cause carnage on the betting markets, sterling and FTSE 100 right now.
https://twitter.com/Donnie_Eagle/status/7423209269733990400 -
Time to go an bug @guardian_clark, clearly.Casino_Royale said:
Got to chuckle at that tweet.TheScreamingEagles said:Looks like we're getting a Guardian ICM phone poll today
https://twitter.com/martinboon/status/742321342817669120
I can't help but like Martin Boon.0 -
Miss Plato, that was my reaction to Tyrie's comment. Not to mention raising Blair gives Leave the rather easy opportunity to point out he supports Remain.0
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Bit of a technical question, but will the POTUS markets get trimmed on Betfair after the conventions ?0
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And a little bit more of that fading respect we had for you drips away.TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks0 -
I think you are right but as a Tory I'm not convinced the party will win either way. If Labour edge back to the centre the Leavers on here are going to look very silly very quickly.SouthamObserver said:
It will be owned by the Tory Remainers. Just as Leave will be owned by the Tory Leavers. It'll be fun and games, that's for sure. As ever, Corbyn is the Tory get out of jail free card.MaxPB said:
Possibly, however, if we remain and the same happens a year from now it will be owned by the the in camp who have basically promised perpetual economic growth on the back of our EU membership. Completely ignoring how badly the EMU crisis blew our economy off course just a few years ago.SouthamObserver said:
Whatever happens in the markets and the wider economy after 23rd June and our vote to Brexit will be owned by Leave; good and bad.MaxPB said:
Whatever comes economically after Brexit is going to happen anyway. Brexit may just bring it forwards. We can't have long term economic policy built on consumer borrowing and importation of goods. It hurts domestic investment, productivity and overall economic growth. Balancing the current account is more important than balancing the fiscal budget IMO.FrankBooth said:
The thing is would Brexit be bringing forward a necessary correction or would it overwhelm us given our current precarious state? As the previous article that I linked by AEP pointed out we have a record current account deficit and are keeping our head above water thanks to flightly incoming capital - which could just as quickly fly away.volcanopete said:The pound is plunging,a prelude to a up to 33% correction on Brexit.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-365158160 -
Tig86
Or perhaps because Scottish Government had.a plan for aftermath - in sterling one way or another in Europe one way or another.. The Brexiteers are plan less hence market panic.0 -
Given how concerned they now appear to be, would it not have been wise for the EU leaders to actually take seriously the concerns that British voters have about the direction of travel within the organisation?
A stitch in time saves nine and all that.0 -
http://www.mayorwatch.co.uk/tfl-announces-clamp-down-on-body-shaming-adverts/
So Sadiq Khan won't be following through with his plan to freeze fares, but he will be banning 'immodest' pictures of women from the tube.0 -
Maybe. But damaging the global economy because the EU has not been as kind as we would have liked seems a touch foolish to me.Slackbladder said:
Maybe the EU should have been nicer to us.....SouthamObserver said:
The implications of Brexit go way beyond the UK. I imagine that's the big difference.tlg86 said:
I don't remember this level of frothing during the Scottish referendum, even though a Yes vote would have caused far more disruption and uncertainty. Perhaps this is a reflection of the fact the markets are taking Brexit seriously unlike Scottish Independence which always looked a long shot.TheScreamingEagles said:I could cause carnage on the betting markets, sterling and FTSE 100 right now.
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So......where the fcuk was Obama and Co when Cameron was doing his renegotiation? Why wasn't he at the table trying to hammer out a deal that would keep the British people happy?SouthamObserver said:
The implications of Brexit go way beyond the UK. I imagine that's the big difference.tlg86 said:
I don't remember this level of frothing during the Scottish referendum, even though a Yes vote would have caused far more disruption and uncertainty. Perhaps this is a reflection of the fact the markets are taking Brexit seriously unlike Scottish Independence which always looked a long shot.TheScreamingEagles said:I could cause carnage on the betting markets, sterling and FTSE 100 right now.
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Leave steady at 3 on BF.MaxPB said:
Time to go an bug @guardian_clark, clearly.Casino_Royale said:
Got to chuckle at that tweet.TheScreamingEagles said:Looks like we're getting a Guardian ICM phone poll today
https://twitter.com/martinboon/status/742321342817669120
I can't help but like Martin Boon.0 -
OT Is PB part of the problem?...
“So long as they (the Proles) continued to work and breed, their other activities were without importance. Left to themselves, like cattle turned loose upon the plains of Argentina, they had reverted to a style of life that appeared to be natural to them, a sort of ancestral pattern...Heavy physical work, the care of home and children, petty quarrels with neighbours, films, football, beer and above all, gambling filled up the horizon of their minds. To keep them in control was not difficult.”
1984
George Orwell
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Got to admire Tyrie's skill at passing himself off as 'neutral' up until now.PlatoSaid said:Lolz
Michael Savage
Wow: Andrew Tyrie says Vote Leave's '£350m for NHS' claim as damaging to trust as "Blair’s false prospectus on Iraq" https://t.co/OufZbBams4
He's about as neutral as Sir Ian Gilmour would have been, had he still been alive, and kept silent until now with his views prior to 'declaring' today.0 -
Surely you would welcome the massive boost that a more competitive exchange rate provides for our exporters, domestic producers competing with foreign imports and the tourist, entertainment and hospitality industries in the UK?felix said:
It's good to see you people having such fun with an issue that affects the daily lives of thousands of people, mainly pensioners, living abroad. Very tasteful.PlatoSaid said:
Ha - so true. And lots of graphs with questionable Y axis.chestnut said:I see that sterling is playing the role of the NHS in winter as people try to talk up a crisis.
Michael Heseltine, no less, argued vociferously in favour of this when he was campaigning to join the Euro.0 -
I've emailed Tom Clark for an advanced copy.MaxPB said:
Time to go an bug @guardian_clark, clearly.Casino_Royale said:
Got to chuckle at that tweet.TheScreamingEagles said:Looks like we're getting a Guardian ICM phone poll today
https://twitter.com/martinboon/status/742321342817669120
I can't help but like Martin Boon.
*Turning on all the charm I possess at the moment*0 -
Ok come off it.MaxPB said:
I don't think that a homegrown terrorist plays into the hands of either group. Free movement of people across the EU has nothing to do with terrorism in the US commited by a US citizen.Estobar said:
They don't have to do anything.TheScreamingEagles said:
Yup, there is that. won't stop some Leavers trying to weaponise Orlando.AlastairMeeks said:@TSE I hadn't realised that Florida was in the EU.
The fact is that a Muslim nutter murdered innocent people who believe in western values. If you think that helps play into Remain's position, you're welcome.
The fear of terrorism from these loons is one of the biggest memes around right now. Surely I don't have to spell out the obvious?
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@nunu - Cameron did not use the terms WW3 or global recession. You are either ignorant purposely telling fibs.nunu said:
We are the most sceptical peoples in the world so when Cameron says "WW3 and global recession if we leave." People just laugh.Casino_Royale said:
Makes me proud to be British.PlatoSaid said:
If Leave wins or loses - we've shown how truculent we are.Casino_Royale said:The sad thing about this vote is that the most likely reaction of the EU won't be to concede the need for democratic reform but to confirm that referendums are dangerous, and should be avoided like the plague in future.
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Richard_Tyndall said:
OT Is PB part of the problem?...
“So long as they (the Proles) continued to work and breed, their other activities were without importance. Left to themselves, like cattle turned loose upon the plains of Argentina, they had reverted to a style of life that appeared to be natural to them, a sort of ancestral pattern...Heavy physical work, the care of home and children, petty quarrels with neighbours, films, football, beer and above all, gambling filled up the horizon of their minds. To keep them in control was not difficult.”
1984
George Orwell
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I know - I have obviously met hundreds of people who are here/Spain for exactly those reasons. Many are concerned about the result and some not so much.felix said:
Your sympathy is very moving - I made the choice knowing we were in the EU, factoring that in at a time when there was no meaningful prospect of that status changing - as did many hundreds of thousands of others, far less well buffered than I am.GeoffM said:
You made that choice.felix said:
It's good to see you people having such fun with an issue that affects the daily lives of thousands of people, mainly pensioners, living abroad. Very tasteful.PlatoSaid said:
Ha - so true. And lots of graphs with questionable Y axis.chestnut said:I see that sterling is playing the role of the NHS in winter as people try to talk up a crisis.
But we are all the product of our own choices in life. People generally split between those who whine and those who adapt when circumstances change. Which category do you see yourself in?0 -
I remember years ago Jackie Ashley slagged off Mike and Shadsy for the influence they were having on British politics.Richard_Tyndall said:OT Is PB part of the problem?...
“So long as they (the Proles) continued to work and breed, their other activities were without importance. Left to themselves, like cattle turned loose upon the plains of Argentina, they had reverted to a style of life that appeared to be natural to them, a sort of ancestral pattern...Heavy physical work, the care of home and children, petty quarrels with neighbours, films, football, beer and above all, gambling filled up the horizon of their minds. To keep them in control was not difficult.”
1984
George Orwell
She wasn't impressed that people were looking to the betting markets for analysis instead of her.0 -
If Labour members somehow came to their senses and turned against Corbyn a Remain or Leave vote would probably make little difference. Labour would - at the very least - deny the Tories a majority next time round.felix said:
I think you are right but as a Tory I'm not convinced the party will win either way. If Labour edge back to the centre the Leavers on here are going to look very silly very quickly.SouthamObserver said:
It will be owned by the Tory Remainers. Just as Leave will be owned by the Tory Leavers. It'll be fun and games, that's for sure. As ever, Corbyn is the Tory get out of jail free card.MaxPB said:
Possibly, however, if we remain and the same happens a year from now it will be owned by the the in camp who have basically promised perpetual economic growth on the back of our EU membership. Completely ignoring how badly the EMU crisis blew our economy off course just a few years ago.SouthamObserver said:
Whatever happens in the markets and the wider economy after 23rd June and our vote to Brexit will be owned by Leave; good and bad.MaxPB said:
Whatever comes economically after Brexit is going to happen anyway. Brexit may just bring it forwards. We can't have long term economic policy built on consumer borrowing and importation of goods. It hurts domestic investment, productivity and overall economic growth. Balancing the current account is more important than balancing the fiscal budget IMO.FrankBooth said:
The thing is would Brexit be bringing forward a necessary correction or would it overwhelm us given our current precarious state? As the previous article that I linked by AEP pointed out we have a record current account deficit and are keeping our head above water thanks to flightly incoming capital - which could just as quickly fly away.volcanopete said:The pound is plunging,a prelude to a up to 33% correction on Brexit.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36515816
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Like Cameron, they probably thought some cosmetic concessions and rhetoric would be enough.Sean_F said:
Given how concerned they now appear to be, would it not have been wise for the EU leaders to actually take seriously the concerns that British voters have about the direction of travel within the organisation?
A stitch in time saves nine and all that.0 -
On the scientific correlation between TSE's mood over the last 30 minutes and this poll I'd say it may favour Leave ...
(Now don't take umbrage fella: that's only a leg pull)0 -
I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?0
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Gold standard though n' all that?AlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
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In my view the most successful economies tend to come with a stable exchange rate. Volatility is no friend of business. I also think devaluation is too easy a route for inefficient businesses - and we have historically always paid the price with higher inflation down the road. That i think is the classic Tory view on these matters.chestnut said:
Surely, you would welcome the massive boost that a more competitive exchange rate provides for our exporters, domestic producers competing with foreign imports and the tourist, entertainement and hospitality industries in the UK?felix said:
It's good to see you people having such fun with an issue that affects the daily lives of thousands of people, mainly pensioners, living abroad. Very tasteful.PlatoSaid said:
Ha - so true. And lots of graphs with questionable Y axis.chestnut said:I see that sterling is playing the role of the NHS in winter as people try to talk up a crisis.
Michael Heseltine, no less, argued vociferously in favour of this when he was campaigning to join the Euro.0 -
Please do because as someone who is pretty sceptical of the EU, has voted leave already and is highly critical of radical Islam I don't see it.Estobar said:
Ok come off it.MaxPB said:
I don't think that a homegrown terrorist plays into the hands of either group. Free movement of people across the EU has nothing to do with terrorism in the US commited by a US citizen.Estobar said:
They don't have to do anything.TheScreamingEagles said:
Yup, there is that. won't stop some Leavers trying to weaponise Orlando.AlastairMeeks said:@TSE I hadn't realised that Florida was in the EU.
The fact is that a Muslim nutter murdered innocent people who believe in western values. If you think that helps play into Remain's position, you're welcome.
The fear of terrorism from these loons is one of the biggest memes around right now. Surely I don't have to spell out the obvious?0 -
Like many things, successful hubs are difficult to create and maintain and the factors are elusive - if there was an algorithm, we'd all be doing it. In the US, despite many attempts to diversify, San Jose-San Fransisco still dominates, with New York, Boston, Seattle trailing far behind, though still significant.williamglenn said:
+1SouthamObserver said:Being a European IP and tech hub may mean that a few companies are bought up by Google, but that will only encourage other companies to start up and more investors to come in looking for the next big thing. We will all benefit from that. Thanks to free movement, low start-up costs, relatively little bureaucracy and a ready supply of capital London currently has something that most other countries can only dream about, in a sector that will only get more important. This most definitely is not the fishing industry.
There are studies showing that one of the key factors in creating a sustainable hub is a pool of entrepreneurs who have made 9 figure exits and can therefore afford to take bigger risks when they invest in the next wave.
It's some permutation of a critical mass of talent, an attractive location, good infrastructure and access to both finance (seed, vc, and equity) and business acumen (decent vcs are as much about helping with managing growth as providing money).
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Mr. Royale, they might yet be right.
Mr. Eagles, the problem with turning to punters instead of political commentators is that the former rely on being right, rather than provoking a response.
Anyway, I'm off for a bit. Hopefully the ICM figures will be up by the time I return.0 -
The obvious being that it has nothing to do with the EU, but that some people will use terrorism and murder to pretend that it does.Estobar said:
Ok come off it.MaxPB said:
I don't think that a homegrown terrorist plays into the hands of either group. Free movement of people across the EU has nothing to do with terrorism in the US commited by a US citizen.Estobar said:
They don't have to do anything.TheScreamingEagles said:
Yup, there is that. won't stop some Leavers trying to weaponise Orlando.AlastairMeeks said:@TSE I hadn't realised that Florida was in the EU.
The fact is that a Muslim nutter murdered innocent people who believe in western values. If you think that helps play into Remain's position, you're welcome.
The fear of terrorism from these loons is one of the biggest memes around right now. Surely I don't have to spell out the obvious?
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It's the start of maybe five phone polls in the next 3 days. Can't blame us for getting overexcitedAlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
0 -
Did you stop to read what Cameron said?TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/pm-draws-on-history-to-bolster-eu-remain-campaign
0 -
Never! If it's a leave lead them remain traitors will all die and if it's a remain lead then leave fruitcakes will all die. Isn't that how it goes on here?AlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
0 -
What was it Mark Twain said? 'A lie can go halfway round the world before the truth has got its boots on.'
Leave 58
Remain 42
only kidding.0 -
maybe, but thats the situation which we're in, if the trend for leave continues, then how many swallows make a summer?AlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
0 -
I'd be very surprised if it doesn't show Leave ahead frankly, given the mood music from Labour canvassing.AlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
0 -
Did he say 'Brexit will lead to World War III'?DecrepitJohnL said:
Did you stop to read what Cameron said?TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/pm-draws-on-history-to-bolster-eu-remain-campaign0 -
I think both Cameron and the EU completely underestimated the open hostility the public has towards the EU. Even in remain circles the EU is not very popular and most I know are campaigning on a "this far and no further" basis.Casino_Royale said:
Like Cameron, they probably thought some cosmetic concessions and rhetoric would be enough.Sean_F said:
Given how concerned they now appear to be, would it not have been wise for the EU leaders to actually take seriously the concerns that British voters have about the direction of travel within the organisation?
A stitch in time saves nine and all that.0 -
Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.0 -
It's quite obviously playing on fears.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
Matbe Osborne shouldn't have set the trend0 -
That's seriously messed up.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
The bodies aren't even cold.-1 -
Good article - more about the merits of the case than is usual for PB, but I guess we've been discussing this for months so useful. If we do vote to Leave, it'll be enthralling to see how the simple clarity of the Leave arguments impacts on the messy reality of actually leaving.
I was wondering what a 'vow' might look like? It couldn't be from the EU - no time as much as anything else - but it would have to be things purely within the UK remit that Cameron / Corbyn / SNP could announce. Assuming (wrongly?) that winning the EU referendum trumps all, I wonder if the three pledges below would be top of the list?
1 - UK Government to oppose Turkish membership, and to legislate to promise referendum on any new member with population greater than x.
2 - Cameron to step down in 2016 whatever the outcome of the referendum.
3 - UK to oppose Investor State Dispute procedures in TTIP and to veto while included.
It strikes me that wouldn't lose too many votes (the suggestions I saw in another thread the other day would lose my vote straight away) but might be significant enough to hit the doubts of the undecided. All going onto Leave's turf, but Remain are pretty much there anyway.0 -
all this about what people are seeing in the postal vote openings is a load of hogwash. Postal votes are being opened every day now as they come in in order to be able to check that they are valid, which is a time-consuming process. But they are all done upside down and there are only two ways to see how someone has voted* - mirrored tables or laying on the floor.
Postal ballots are mixed into the rest of the ballots after the completion of the verification process, i.e. at the point where ballot papers are sorted into the piles depending on how people have voted. At that stage you can get an idea of how postal voting went by comparison to on the day voting - because you have an idea how the on the day voting went from the verification which is done face up.
*It is possible that there is a rogue Returning Officer somewhere who is doing postal votes face up.0 -
Trump: "It's a war. There are thousands of shooters like him already out there, with even worse intentions, with thousands more on the way. The Muslims have to turn them in. If they don't, we'll never get along. Hillary Clinton is almost... a maniac."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gd3KR5xcfck0 -
Yes - but we're all anticipating it more now because it is late.AlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
0 -
I'm very cautious when it comes to money and have more than a sufficient hedge in Euro savings to ride out a cut in my pension so in this case my concern is more for others not in the same position as myself. My understanding was that Leave's overriding concern was to protect and enhance the position of UK citizens - that includes the vast majority of expats who therefore have a perfect right to state their concerns. I don't call that 'whining' - the fact that you do says it all I'm afraid.GeoffM said:
I know - I have obviously met hundreds of people who are here/Spain for exactly those reasons. Many are concerned about the result and some not so much.felix said:
Your sympathy is very moving - I made the choice knowing we were in the EU, factoring that in at a time when there was no meaningful prospect of that status changing - as did many hundreds of thousands of others, far less well buffered than I am.GeoffM said:
You made that choice.felix said:
It's good to see you people having such fun with an issue that affects the daily lives of thousands of people, mainly pensioners, living abroad. Very tasteful.PlatoSaid said:
Ha - so true. And lots of graphs with questionable Y axis.chestnut said:I see that sterling is playing the role of the NHS in winter as people try to talk up a crisis.
But we are all the product of our own choices in life. People generally split between those who whine and those who adapt when circumstances change. Which category do you see yourself in?0 -
I've got some feedback for you on Dewsbury. Looking grim in some parts for Remain, very positive in other parts.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
Is one of those areas, LabourIN are working hard am told.0 -
Going back to the Gold Standard didn't work out for Churchill.Estobar said:
Gold standard though n' all that?AlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
Seriously though, some of us were overly faithful to ICM and got badly burnt at the general election. They were quite good with the phone polls they did for Oakeshott though!0 -
Cameron did say “serried rows of white headstones in lovingly-tended Commonwealth war cemeteries” as evidence of the “price this country has paid” to ensure peace and order in the continent.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/david-cameron-to-invoke-war-dead-as-he-makes-case-for-eu-as-guardian-of-peace-a7019701.html
That Number 10 rowed back from its spin doesn't change the intentional message.0 -
Betfair quiet - the deep breath before the plunge.0
-
Oh Jeez.TheScreamingEagles said:
It's the start of maybe five phone polls in the next 3 days. Can't blame us for getting overexcitedAlastairMeeks said:I don't wish to be heretical, but isn't there a danger of taking a single poll just a little bit too seriously? Even if it is ICM?
Time to log off and do some work.0 -
Is there anything untruthful about that?PlatoSaid said:
Cameron did say “serried rows of white headstones in lovingly-tended Commonwealth war cemeteries” as evidence of the “price this country has paid” to ensure peace and order in the continent.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/david-cameron-to-invoke-war-dead-as-he-makes-case-for-eu-as-guardian-of-peace-a7019701.html0 -
I've decided to be an entrepreneur. My vote is for sale. Give me money or Western civilization gets it.0
-
The last time I was in Dewsbury town centre, about 2-3 years ago, it seemed to be about 60% Asian, possibly more.TheScreamingEagles said:
I've got some feedback for you on Dewsbury. Looking grim in some parts for Remain, very positive in other parts.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
Is one of those areas, LabourIN are working hard am told.0 -
Anecdotally (I've never been to postal vote opening) I've been told that as the ballot papers are upside down, it depends on the thickness of the paper, and the firmness of the X as to whether you can see it from underneath. If the Leavers are as resolute as they claim, perhaps it's 50:50 but it's the Leaver ballots that are so firm and thick they can be seen from underneath, skewing the sample? #hangingchadsterritoryMrsB said:all this about what people are seeing in the postal vote openings is a load of hogwash. Postal votes are being opened every day now as they come in in order to be able to check that they are valid, which is a time-consuming process. But they are all done upside down and there are only two ways to see how someone has voted* - mirrored tables or laying on the floor.
Postal ballots are mixed into the rest of the ballots after the completion of the verification process, i.e. at the point where ballot papers are sorted into the piles depending on how people have voted. At that stage you can get an idea of how postal voting went by comparison to on the day voting - because you have an idea how the on the day voting went from the verification which is done face up.
*It is possible that there is a rogue Returning Officer somewhere who is doing postal votes face up.0 -
I don't understand why Asians would be any more in favour of the EU than the average person.TheScreamingEagles said:The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
If anything, it's especially detrimental to someone with family based outside the EU, or who has a business that is supplied from outside.
Immigration from places like Pakistan and Bangladesh has been slashed as a repercussion of EU migration.0 -
Well that much was obvious. As someone of Asian descent you should know how badly the EU migration policy plays among Asians. It's discriminatory towards Asian countries where highly skilled family members regularly get rejected for work visas and then they are served coffee in Starbucks by an unskilled EU migrant.TheScreamingEagles said:
I've got some feedback for you on Dewsbury. Looking grim in some parts for Remain, very positive in other parts.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
Is one of those areas, LabourIN are working hard am told.
Also, just to add that my cousin just got rejected for a work visa and he's an honours graduate from Pune university in pharmacology. He would walk into any major pharmaceutical company in the and had a highly paid job lined up, but his application was recently rejected.0 -
Just a thought.. Market reaction this morning could be a private poll for a hedge fund or some such?0
-
They aren't. They never talk about it. But they do love London.chestnut said:
I don't understand why Asians would be any more in favour of the EU than the average person.TheScreamingEagles said:The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
.0 -
Yes. He said every time Britain withdraws from Europe there is a war and we have to go back in to sort it out. After naming several wars including WW2, simple arithmetic gets us to 3.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did he say 'Brexit will lead to World War III'?DecrepitJohnL said:
Did you stop to read what Cameron said?TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/pm-draws-on-history-to-bolster-eu-remain-campaign
0 -
Mr Eagles,
Re Dewsbury: Thanks for the info. Interesting. So the main division is between the posh and the plebs, as in the rest of country.
Unfortunately, that's the sort of division that's worst. Hope post-referendum, it doesn't get even worse.0 -
Actually, Royal Ascot starts tomorrow so shrewdies will be looking for coups today and especially tonight.weejonnie said:Betfair quiet - the deep breath before the plunge.
0 -
Looking at the demographics, Dewsbury is 77% White British and less than 20% Asian.peter_from_putney said:
The last time I was in Dewsbury town centre, about 2-3 years ago, it seemed to be about 60% Asian, possibly more.TheScreamingEagles said:
I've got some feedback for you on Dewsbury. Looking grim in some parts for Remain, very positive in other parts.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
Is one of those areas, LabourIN are working hard am told.0 -
Or to somebody getting hold of the ICM data.Casino_Royale said:Just a thought.. Market reaction this morning could be a private poll for a hedge fund or some such?
0 -
sod itDecrepitJohnL said:
Yes. He said every time Britain withdraws from Europe there is a war and we have to go back in to sort it out. After naming several wars including WW2, simple arithmetic gets us to 3.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did he say 'Brexit will lead to World War III'?DecrepitJohnL said:
Did you stop to read what Cameron said?TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/pm-draws-on-history-to-bolster-eu-remain-campaign
if the Germans invade Belgium again they can keep it. The Belgians will be happier that way too.0 -
I would expect immigrants generally to favour Remain, because many of them will have come from politically unstable places (or places that were politically unstable in recent times) and they would fear that political instability would result from a Leave vote. Also, some may fear that they'll be deported in the event of a Leave vote.chestnut said:
I don't understand why Asians would be any more in favour of the EU than the average person.TheScreamingEagles said:The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
If anything, it's especially detrimental to someone with family based outside the EU, or who has a business that is supplied from outside.
Immigration from places like Pakistan and Bangladesh has been slashed as a repercussion of EU migration.0 -
-
My wife is a non-EU immigrant. I was a bit surprised when she said the other day she was thinking of voting Leave on the grounds that the EU was "too much". But fair enough, she isn't European. She doesn't have anything invested in the relationships and squabbles within this continent.0
-
That's what I'm finding too. I think project fear has worked with the middle classes. I think Leave have helped on that front. 'There'll be a hit, but only short term, so what, FREEDOM'CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
Re Dewsbury: Thanks for the info. Interesting. So the main division is between the posh and the plebs, as in the rest of country.
Unfortunately, that's the sort of division that's worst. Hope post-referendum, it doesn't get even worse.
Dave as the greatest One Nation PM ever will reunite the country after the referendum0 -
That's the obvious one, yes. But correlation might not equal causation.edmundintokyo said:
Or to somebody getting hold of the ICM data.Casino_Royale said:Just a thought.. Market reaction this morning could be a private poll for a hedge fund or some such?
0 -
That's the UK government's immigration policy, isn't it?MaxPB said:
Well that much was obvious. As someone of Asian descent you should know how badly the EU migration policy plays among Asians. It's discriminatory towards Asian countries where highly skilled family members regularly get rejected for work visas and then they are served coffee in Starbucks by an unskilled EU migrant.TheScreamingEagles said:
I've got some feedback for you on Dewsbury. Looking grim in some parts for Remain, very positive in other parts.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
Is one of those areas, LabourIN are working hard am told.
Also, just to add that my cousin just got rejected for a work visa and he's an honours graduate from Pune university in pharmacology. He would walk into any major pharmaceutical company in the and had a highly paid job lined up, but his application was recently rejected.
0 -
Interesting Remain/Leave canvass reports from Toryhome:
http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2016/06/eu-referendum-campaign-diaries-week-3-shy-leavers-emerge-as-do-remain-councillors-as-the-big-decision-approaches.html0 -
I think it is a fair comment that Cameron implied Brexit leads to WW3.perdix said:
@nunu - Cameron did not use the terms WW3 or global recession. You are either ignorant purposely telling fibs.nunu said:
We are the most sceptical peoples in the world so when Cameron says "WW3 and global recession if we leave." People just laugh.Casino_Royale said:
Makes me proud to be British.PlatoSaid said:
If Leave wins or loses - we've shown how truculent we are.Casino_Royale said:The sad thing about this vote is that the most likely reaction of the EU won't be to concede the need for democratic reform but to confirm that referendums are dangerous, and should be avoided like the plague in future.
Circa 14:20 in the link below from David Cameron's speech on 9th May at the British Museum:
"...Whenever we turn our back on Europe, we've always had to go back in and always at a much high cost. The seried rows of white headstones in lovingly tended Commonwealth war cemeteries stand as silent testament to the price that this country has paid to restore peace in Europe. Can we be so sure that peace and security are assured on our continent beyond any shadow of doubt? Is that a risk worth taking? I would never be so rash as to make that assumption."
(Speech continues mentioning "genocide in Sbrenica", "tanks rolling into Georgia and Ukraine" and stating "Britain has purpose in Europe to avoid future conflict between European countries") https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9ONWGQ-mG4
The word "WWW3" doesn't get explicitly mentioned, but especially with the mentions of the Battle of Britain before this excerpt and the Balkans genocide thereafter, it is implicit that the "go back in always at a much higher cost" = next time will be at a much higher cost than WW2.0 -
More serious is the potential repercussions in Northern Ireland. Would British voters support sending in the troops again if there was serious unrest? I'm not sure.Alanbrooke said:
sod itDecrepitJohnL said:
Yes. He said every time Britain withdraws from Europe there is a war and we have to go back in to sort it out. After naming several wars including WW2, simple arithmetic gets us to 3.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did he say 'Brexit will lead to World War III'?DecrepitJohnL said:
Did you stop to read what Cameron said?TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/pm-draws-on-history-to-bolster-eu-remain-campaign
if the Germans invade Belgium again they can keep it. The Belgians will be happier that way too.0 -
O/T
Brazil have failed to qualify from their group for even the quarter- finals of the Copa America.
How are the mighty fallen!0 -
That is awful!TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
I suspect we can expect a lot more of this over the next ten days as Farage does everything he can to sabotage LEAVE and save his own bacon...
0 -
It seems almost every time I watch the BBC news they cover the Remain campaign first and the Leave campaign second in their token daily how the campaign is going report. (It may have been every time, but I can't be certain.)0
-
It's very notable canvassing that middle class people are much readier to be rude to you on the doorstep than WWC. I guess that's because middle class liberals just know that they are right about everything, so why treat an opponent with any respect at all?0
-
Dictated by the inability to block unskilled migration from the EU. As I said earlier I would favour free movement of highly skilled labour to the UK globally rather than free movement unskilled, semi-skilled and highly skilled workers from Europe.SouthamObserver said:
That's the UK government's immigration policy, isn't it?MaxPB said:
Well that much was obvious. As someone of Asian descent you should know how badly the EU migration policy plays among Asians. It's discriminatory towards Asian countries where highly skilled family members regularly get rejected for work visas and then they are served coffee in Starbucks by an unskilled EU migrant.TheScreamingEagles said:
I've got some feedback for you on Dewsbury. Looking grim in some parts for Remain, very positive in other parts.CD13 said:Mr Eagles,
"Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III."
Callaghan never said "Crisis? What crisis?" Fat lot of good that did him - it's what he meant. I can give you some other examples too, but you will know them already.
That's Dave's petard, so he may as well give us a wave from the top.
The Asian community aren't as enthusiastic for Remain as you would think.
Is one of those areas, LabourIN are working hard am told.
Also, just to add that my cousin just got rejected for a work visa and he's an honours graduate from Pune university in pharmacology. He would walk into any major pharmaceutical company in the and had a highly paid job lined up, but his application was recently rejected.0 -
I'd give them a referendum with consequences. Everyone votes in public (i.e. we know how everyone votes) and in the case of the North voting to unify with the Republic, those who voted to join the Republic lose their British citizenship and rights to benefits and all the rest of it. Those who opted to stay with us will have the option to relocate to Britain.FrankBooth said:
More serious is the potential repercussions in Northern Ireland. Would British voters support sending in the troops again if there was serious unrest? I'm not sure.Alanbrooke said:
sod itDecrepitJohnL said:
Yes. He said every time Britain withdraws from Europe there is a war and we have to go back in to sort it out. After naming several wars including WW2, simple arithmetic gets us to 3.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did he say 'Brexit will lead to World War III'?DecrepitJohnL said:
Did you stop to read what Cameron said?TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/pm-draws-on-history-to-bolster-eu-remain-campaign
if the Germans invade Belgium again they can keep it. The Belgians will be happier that way too.0 -
Don't ask @Alanbrooke he lives in the West Midlands. Not West Belfast.FrankBooth said:
More serious is the potential repercussions in Northern Ireland. Would British voters support sending in the troops again if there was serious unrest? I'm not sure.Alanbrooke said:
sod itDecrepitJohnL said:
Yes. He said every time Britain withdraws from Europe there is a war and we have to go back in to sort it out. After naming several wars including WW2, simple arithmetic gets us to 3.TheScreamingEagles said:
Did he say 'Brexit will lead to World War III'?DecrepitJohnL said:
Did you stop to read what Cameron said?TheScreamingEagles said:
So no actual quote from Cameron then. Superb, thanks for backing me up.DecrepitJohnL said:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3580060/Now-Cameron-warns-Brexit-lead-war-genocide-PM-s-extraordinary-intervention-leads-campaigners-accuse-Downing-Street-desperation.htmlTheScreamingEagles said:
Find me a quote by David Cameron saying Brexit leads to World War III.MTimT said:
Stay successful Leavers, stay successful.TheScreamingEagles said:Stay classy Leavers, stay classy. How is this not Project Fear?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/742317894978174976
We all know and love TSE for his balls, but the Remain campaign criticizing anything after deploying World War III is beyond chutzpah
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/david-cameron-rejects-claims-of-hyperbole-over-brexit-risks
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/09/pm-draws-on-history-to-bolster-eu-remain-campaign
if the Germans invade Belgium again they can keep it. The Belgians will be happier that way too. 0
